/x/, what is your opinion on buddhism? If you know anything

Watch this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbuCLLrW7Ko

>>18366495
>rebirth
Not necessarily supernatural. The way in which it's commonly thought of is a simplification. There are definitely parts of it where it implies a literal rebirth, but those parts seem to contradict more core aspects of Buddhism.

>jhanas
Not really supernatural as far as I know.

>remembering past lives
Interesting, but I take the approach of skepticism. You shouldn't need to be remembering your past lives or to believe that it's possible if you want to get rid of desire, so I put that to the side and if I remember some past lives then I'll start thinking about it then.

>floating in air and teleportation, etc
Embellishments. After countless years I think people felt like attracting people to Buddhism would be cool, so they added some parts involving supernatural powers. He also said that miracles were a shitty reason to be a Buddhist, so it seems odd that there are accounts of them when I'd say that trying to free yourself of desire is actually hindered by undertaking the path in pursuit of supernatural abilities. If Buddha really could perform miracles then I'd expect he would never do so, and if he was unable to prevent himself from performing miracles then he wasn't very miraculous.

>>18366530
I am aware that most of these things are "embellishments" and are not very important for attaining enlightenment (save probably for jhanas). Ive studied buddhism for two years. I am just curious about these specific aspects. Like if a buddhist on 4chan has ever remembered a past life or something, they would more likely be browsing /x/ than /his/.

I'd certainly like to learn more about it

t. clueless cumskin

>>18366539
Fair enough, I kind of figured you wanted an explanation of Buddhism like a lot of people do, /x/ has sort become the board for anything religion related outside of pure historical fact. Personally I've come to understand rebirth in a more abstract philosophical sense, i's pretty tough to put into words, but it does make sense to me. From my point of view remembering past lives should be impossible, but I wouldn't write it out entirely. the trouble is that a lot of people who might say they remember past lives are insane or just mistaken, and if there would be very little way to tell them from someone who actually was remembering a real past life (especially on an anonymous image board).

>>18366675
>From my point of view remembering past lives should be impossible

It is impossible if you posit that rebirth is nothing more than an abstract philosophy. But if rebirth is real in the buddhist sense of the word, it makes sense to me why one could remember a past life. Your karma is literally being carried from one body to the next, so in that karma memories should exist, thats the way I see it.

The buddhist rebirth system is very specifically designed and for a reason, because (imo) it binds together the entire religion. The point of buddhism is to get off the wheel of suffering, so even dying isnt enough because you will just be reborn some place. So I can see what you mean when you say it's an "abstract philosophy" because it is a way of viewing the world.

Or, it's not a philosophy but actually reality...

>>18366495
I always thought Siddhartha was a huge asshole for abandoning his wife, child, and family for the duration of his meditation.

>Right Resolve: the giving up home and adopting the life of a religious mendicant in order to follow the path

Just all seems like a selfish way of life and I don't understand how this helps the suffering of other people who don't have food and medicine.

I'd appreciate someone proving me wrong or changing my mind. I don't get why Daoism isn't more popular than Buddhism (especially considering the popularity of Buddhism among hipsters and the like).

Or even Hinduism - same concept of samsara and goodness. It feels like people prefer ways of life/religion that take the least amount of effort.

>>18366495
Reincarnation, rebirth, past lives...

We die and are reborn every time we let our thoughts define us as a new egoic being, every time we identify as any thing. To escape the wheel and enjoy nirvana we stop thinking of ourselves as anything we can see (including thoughts, emotions, etc.).

It is all a metaphor for living in the moment and not being a slave to our mind, which creates all suffering.

Its similar to the Christian notion of original sin. The default is to be identified with thoughts. The liberation is death of the individual, symbolised by Jesus on the cross.

>>18366495
Siddhartha Gautama Buddha the founder of Buddhism is definately a historical figure so I believe in him. I also know that Buddhism is based on hinduism so maybe Krishna existed as well, and he was known to be a supernatural character he was an incarnation of Vishnu.

>>18366823
Even if your karma is carried over, it doesn't mean that you could necessarily remember it. There is an idea that there is no "self", and that leads me to believe that memories might not be recoverable after rebirth. I don't think a literal rebirth (as in your consciousness going into another body) is compatible with Buddhism given the non-self thing.

>>18366876
I am a Buddhist myself and have walked on water using geomancy. Miracles are rare and not to be taken for granted.

>>18366858
His family or children will never be able to alleviate his suffering. Alleviating their suffering would not bring them closer to nirvana, or bring him closer.

>>18366891
I'm gonna call bullshit, unless you have an acute understanding of what you were doing, and how its possible.

>>18366882
>I don't think a literal rebirth (as in your consciousness going into another body) is compatible with Buddhism given the non-self thing.
So much this.

>>18366893
I take it you are not a practitioner of Mahayana Buddhism, then. As Amitabha Buddha demonstrated by example that the point is NOT to achieve enlightenment alone, but to return and help others achieve it as well.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amit%C4%81bha
>By the power of his vows, Amitābha has made it possible for all who call upon him to be reborn into this land, there to undergo instruction by him in the dharma and ultimately become bodhisattvas and buddhas in their turn (the ultimate goal of Mahāyāna Buddhism). From there, these same bodhisattvas and buddhas return to our world to help yet more people.

Which personally never made sense to me, considering the no-self thing. It might be a difference among Buddhist sects that I didn't catch, but I never understood what the point of helping "people" is when an enlightened being would realize that there's no such thing as a person, only temporary manifestations that delude themselves with permanence and distinction.

>>18366895
Plus, I healed this girls sight. afterwards, she admitted I had helped her see!

>>18367089
...wrong thread completely, sorry.

>>18367009
in previous lifes no one was buddha, because whe you become buddha, the cycle ends. So remembering your old lifes is in a way even logical, to see how it was possible to live while being the same soul... Can't explain but it makes sense to me that it's possible to remember your old lifes. in a way at least.

>been practicing meditation for 2 years
>still can't hit the first jhana

I have switched the way I have practiced many times but I still can't find a method that is suitable for me. Plus almost every teacher ever has a different method, and they all denounce each others methods.

I always find myself going back to A. Zen "just sit and breath" method or B. the text from the Theravada suttas. However I find the literature in the original Theravada suttas to be vague and hard to understand

>>18367009

This is a good point anon. The only reason I would see to returning to help others is to eventually help them see through the delusion of permanence so much that they never return to this life. I don't know enough about Buddhism to really understand what that means though. What is the place they return from that is outside of this world? Is it a heaven or just a void? Are there distinct, temporary personalities in this place that is outside of reincarnation? Can we even comprehend it?

>>18366530
>There are definitely parts of it where it implies a literal rebirth, but those parts seem to contradict more core aspects of Buddhism.

how?

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>>18366495
>/x/, what is your opinion on buddhism?
Good self help techniques.
>what is your opinion on the "super natural" aspects
Ehhhhh...

>>18366495
It doesn't stop bhuddists from being violent, so it's a crappie religion

it was invented by the indians to invade and degrade the western world using cultural hinduism. learning to calm your mind and tap into inner resources encourages degeneracy. do not let the poos destroy our fantastic culture of monster trucks, pro wrestling and mcdonalds.

>>18370174
>It doesn't stop bhuddists from being violent
And Christianity doesn't stop Christians from being violent. Or non-judgmental. Or selfish, greedy pricks who won't help the poor and needy. I'm not seeing your point.

If atheists started proclaiming Allah to be the one and only true god, and Mohammed to be his prophet, would you complain that atheism did not lead them to give up their belief in a god? I should hope not, because that's on them. They're clearly not very good at atheism, or even understanding what atheism is.

>>18366495

Better then most religions, could still use some fine tuning though.

>gnostic master race

buddhism is a good ism

>>18366495

7 years into Sōtō Zen Buddhism here, I frequent the local sangha and study under a teacher. I value the scientific mindset so I don't think much of the supernatural claims, although I greatly appreciate the practice. Ask away if you're curious about anything.

The Buddha once said that a person who believes in neither karma or rebirth still benefits from the Dharma because it offers security, peace of mind and virtue here and now.

>rebirth, remembering past lives

When you practice a lot of meditation you will see and experience a lot of weird things. Various sensations, visions, hallucinations. In Zen, you are not supposed to pay attention to any of it and just let it pass. Lots of people feel light one session and think they're enlightened masters.

I've gotten impressions that there are more lives. I am still doubtful about that, open to the possibility, but as one teacher said, all our thoughts are just secretions of the brain. Even if it's possible that consciousness or energy moves on, I don't see any reason for a future continuation to have any relation with my personality or self in this life.

>jhanas

Jhanas are a bad way to conceptualize buddhist meditation. You can't gauge it by levels. It's a process that deepens indefinitely. When you ask yourself how you're doing, you're missing the whole point. One day you're glad just to quiet down from being mad at someone, the other you can see the emptiness of space and time. One is not better than the other

>floating in air and teleportation

These are quite extraordinary claims and shouldn't be taken seriously. Some teachers are cryptic on the subject, for reasons I'll never understand. Plenty of us believe in various energy practices, related to visualization and the flow of energy in the body. Some of it can be pretty effective. I don't know what it actually involves.

I will concede that in my opinion, what the practice does for your well-being is nothing short of supernatural.

>>18370694

I would like to add that a strange thing that happens in the practice, and I can assure you that this has happened to every practitioner I've ever talked to, is that eventually you become very intuitive to the needs of others and instinctively react quickly to help people out. Like, if someone needs a hand with anything, even a total stranger, you'll immediately assist them with zero conscious thought about the decision. It's a very strange thing, especially to experience it as a traditionally reserved and cautious person. It feels more like some kind of ESP than anything else.

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edgy nihilist gets a bunch of followers by being 2deep4u . Then a bunch of people in the west latch onto it because of Orientalism.

>>18366495
Buddhism is not incompatible with a life of inner peace. I'm a 100% Christian, but I agree with many Buddhist principles and teachings. And mostly, with the positive, encouraging, and loving demeanor of its adherents.

>>18370694
>Jhanas are a bad way to conceptualize buddhist meditation
That's literally how the Buddha himself conceptualized it. :)

>>18370717
>edgy nihilist gets a bunch of followers by being 2deep4u .

Back to High School with you young man. Keep in mind I'm not saying that because I disagree with you but because you are posting like some 15 year old who just found out about 4chan and are attempting to fit in by using buzzwords.

>>18366495
>>>18371461

>>18370400
>western world is better than eastern world.
materialistically yes.

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>>18366495

The Lord Buddha himself has said that all Dharmas are emtpy and that the Thathagatha never spoke any words about the Dharma.

Thus anyone who thinks "I am a Buddhist, I am a follower of Buddha" is not a Buddhist since there exists no 'being' at all, there can not be any person called a "Buddhist"

Neither do Buddhist teachings, words, texts exist. Since Buddha is neither existing, nor not-existing there is is no Buddha that has ever spoken any words about 'Buddhism' or Dharma.

Because nothing is ever born, nor do phenomena ever come into being it is said from the law of cause and effect that nothing ever dies, nor do phenomena ever dissolve.

There is no Enlightenment to be reached, and no path to follow.

Those who read this without any feeling, without anger or hatred, without excitement or joy, without thinking "I am reading"; are said to be Enlightened beings.

>>18370717
>edgy nihilist
If you think that, I think you misunderstood the point.

>>18366858
>people prefer ways of life/religion that take the least amount of effort
of course they do. religion is only a human construct to try bringing meaning in our lives. no person would ever work more than necessary if they knew a simpler way o

>>18370694
>Ask away if you're curious about anything.

Im the op, who also posted this >>18368510

How do you practice meditation? Since you are a Soto buddhist, do you practice in the "just sitting and breathing" method?

Sometimes after I have practiced fixing my mind in a certain spot or breathing in a certain rhythm, I get burned out of all of the instructions and resort to the just sitting/breathing. And often times when I do that I feel relieved. I started in zen and I always find myself going back to zen after studying theravada for long periods of time, which is kind of funny.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rALVgdoMHk

babies just die...

>>18371490

BIG SCREEN TVS AND IPHONES

>>18371917

Don't be silly.

Zen is a horrible way to lead a bad life

You people make buddhism sound like some sort of sociopathy

>>18371496
>buddhism
>not nihilist

>>18371192

The Buddha didn't conceptualize his meditation, but developed a method for the time. He also taught different ways, most importantly the Anapanasati (mindfulness of breathing), which does not involve thinking about jhanas in the sutra it's talked about. Zazen derives from that method.

>>18371909

I practice two different methods. The prominent one is shikantaza or just sitting, like you mentioned. The other is tanden soku, which is a bit of an obscure Rinzai method. It involves a different, more deliberate type of breath that is only taught in person to experienced meditators. It is more of a physiological meditation for tension relief and energy flow and all that jazz, whereas shikantaza is more laid back.

A lot of people seem to underestimate shikantaza, but it's very direct in it's simplicity. It takes years to settle into. When you don't grasp it, it seems lacking. If you grasp it, there is nothing further to grasp. Even Rinzai people take up shikantaza after they're done playing with kōans.

There's lots of good stuff in the Pali canon (and other schools as well), but ultimately you should stick with the methods that work best for you. Many Zennies complement their practice with yoga as well.

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>>18372429
Have you read book related? The author describes a practice where you tense your tanden (lower abdomen) for extended periods when exhaling. I have practiced this method on and off for around a year now. I dont practice it much because I get exhausted from it very easily, maybe from tensing too hard.

>A lot of people seem to underestimate shikantaza, but it's very direct in it's simplicity. It takes years to settle into.

Interesting.

>>18366545
Don't ever call yourself a "cumskin" again.

>>18372421

It's hard to explain it properly.

The paradoxes can sound masochistic if you're used to a life led by desire.

>>18366495
>what is your opinion on buddhism?
Unbelievable! Jesus died for your fucking sins and you show your thanks by embracing pagan nonsense? You are a whore and you will suffer for eternity.

>>18372452

Thousands die every single day.

Not learning wherever you can, wherever your path takes you, is an affront to the history that's preceded you.

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>>18372452

You can be a Buddhist Christian, that's one of the things that makes Buddhism so great.

I'm a Pure Land Buddhist.
Anyone interested?

We're a little different.
We don't meditate.

Westerners don't know us even though we're the most widespread form of buddhism in East Asia.

>>18372466
2 Peter 2:1
But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift anal destruction.

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>>18366495
Heyo.
You've got a lot of questions, hopefully I can give some answers.

A: Rebirth:
When your Flesh passes, The Self returns to the Origin. The Self must be purged of its Human corruptions and of its transgressions. This is Absolution. Once the Self goes through this process and becomes Formless and Ego free Consciousness, it returns to the Great Hub made of All Consciousness for a time. Rebirth is simply either deciding or being forced to leave the Origin and inhabit Flesh once more. Nirvana is the state of staying within Origin and not being reborn into Flesh. It is very hard to do considering that Flesh ultimately corrupts.

B: Remembering of past lives. In Absolution we are purged of these things, however when we return to Origin we kind of become mussed and tangled with other Consciousness. At times we can visualize this, however due to the nature of Flesh Annihilation, Memory linkage to Physical Flesh, and Absolution; Actually remembering a past life is not highly likely. Even so, the cycle is nescessarily "Die a human, reborn as a human 2 years later." The last time "You" had a human form was probably around 1000-2000 years ago. It's a long waiting list. There are some who forgo Absolution as they lived accordingly to the Purism of Origin, however that is extremely rare as well. Those Consciousness often don't go up to bat for Rebirth.

C: Jhanas. It's a state of mental emptiness, free of thought and Self Monologue. It is a mean to achieve Self awareness. Also it is a way to achieve trance like states in meditation. I think modern science calls it "Delta Frequencies"

D: Floating in air/teleportation.
There are those who in practice are in constant trance state (however its been a long time since there actually has been this) In that, strange things occur that aren't meant to occur. Floating in air and teleportation is only really achievable in the visions of our trances. A powerful mind can be seen in trance form, albeit rare as that is.

>>18372434

Breath control can be quite harmful when done incorrectly, if it's prolonged it can harm the central nervous system. The experience of tension or exhaustion is a REALLY strong sign that you're doing it wrong! This is why it's only advised to practice such methods with an experienced teacher.

I find that most books that describe these methods are incomplete. It's difficult for a beginner to understand what's meant by the tanden, or holding tension in the tanden. Furthermore, many books mistranslate the word koshi to mean the hips, which the average westerner might equate to the upper half of their pelvis. So when an instruction says to push the hips forward, they will tilt their Iliac crest. This is really incorrect. The koshi refers to the entire lower body, and the instruction is usually to put tension in pelvic floor muscles as if pushing an object with your body. Sekida is viewed as a bit of an oddball and nobody has even heard of some of the methods he describes, like bamboo breathing.

All tanden breathing involves a slight tension of the pelvic floor muscles that are involved in deep functions such as contraction of the anus. When it is done correctly, abdominal breathing occurs normally but the belly does not distend during exhalation. There should not be any strain. There is a kind of equilibrium that is difficult to settle into without breathing very slowly, which is why I recommend that one should be well-versed enough in regular abdominal breathing that during meditation, the breath slows to 2-4 breaths per minute without discomfort.

When you breathe that slowly, you become more sensitive to the pelvic floor muscles and can more easily settle into the continuous "taut belly". An increase in body heat emanating from the tanden, and overall loosening of peripheral muscles, are some very swift signs, literally within the first minute.

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>>18366495
I'm a practicing Soto Zen Buddhist. I belong to a Sangha and have undergone lay ordination.

I think this may be a function of the lineage that I practice in, but metaphysics doesn't play a very large role in how we practice our religion. Certainly, important metaphysical concepts are discussed such as emptiness or dependent origination or suffering as an innate quality of conscious awareness. However, the acid test seems to be whether or not understanding these philosophical concepts translates into more skillful and wise living. As for more speculative metaphysics like reincarnation, or supernatural beings, these almost never come up. Again this might be a function of the tradition in which I practice. Tibetan Buddhism seems to really luxuriate in the philosophical and supernatural. Zen is a bit more experiential, I think.

Also, this parable might help you understand how the supernatural fits into the religion in more general ways:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parable_of_the_Poisoned_Arrow

>>18372448
>if you're used to a life led by desire.
>not an egotist

>>18372494
Lol. Anal destruction.

Buddhism is very varied like most religions. It seems that meditation can help some people with stress relief. But the many unfounded beliefs. Such as karma, rebirth, the Buddha talking with heavenly beings, sleeping one hour a day, having an all seeing eye ect. As all supernatural claims these claims lack evidence. And is a product of the time and place in which in was created. In addition the idea that people can achieve higher levels of consciousness or enlightenment is completely subjective. And not based in reality.

>>18372625

but that parable makes the metaphysical assertion that those things are uknowable, its not avoiding metaphysics at all just asserting that physiological stabilization is so metaphysically important that anything else will disturb it

like any tradition with an esoteric shadow I'm fairly sure Buddhism pushes denial of curiosity on its neophytes to ensure they stay as bodily anchors for whatever mischief the masters are up to

BORING

>>18372759
You're misinterpreting the parable. The point is not that those things are unknowable. Rather it's that they don't really matter. The one ontological truth that Buddhists care about above all others is that of Dukkha. That's what the poison arrow represents. Treating the nature of that malady doesn't at all require that you inquire into its ultimate origins.

Also, Buddhism isn't like this monolithic thing. The sheer number of sects and denominations makes all the schisms in Christianity look simple. But I'm sure that all of them are just trying to pull one over on their adherents so as to better control them -- the same as all religions, right? Better watch those edges kid.

>>18372547
All of that is pretty fascinating. As you mentioned practicing this method without a teacher guiding you can be harmful, so I may not jump up and practice it. But when I meditate I will be mindful of this area of my body and see if I notice anything, then go with the flow. Otherwise, I will just do strait shikantaza.

I am surprised that you have heard of Sekida. His book basically limits tanden soku to "just tense the tanden when you exhale." Probably not enough information to really establish the practice.

>>18372970

>Treating the nature of that malady doesn't at all require that you inquire into its ultimate origins.

that mindset is why you go to a hospital and not a monastery when you /really/ experience Dukkha

>>18373002
I'm not going to argue with you anymore after this because you strike me as someone who just likes being contrary for the sake of it. I don't know a single Buddhist that would advocate that you go to a monastery for a physical ailment. At least no western Buddhist would do that. And anyway, the parable is not that literal. It's about treating the inherent unsatisfactoriness of life rather than a medical disease.

>>18373053

not trying to be a contrarian, just after reading Buddhist texts and sutras and observing Buddhist institutions in comparison to others around the world I find the philosophy unsatisfactory in comparison

the desire of exoteric Buddhism is to eliminate Dukkha, Aristotelian methodologies have show the best way to do that, for everyone, is to figure out how the universe works and improve upon that process; hence organ transplants, cures of neurological ailments, vaccines etc. Now Western philosophy arrives at consciousness with a similar project of deconstruction armed with physiology, psychology, and various occult traditions related to them.

Now Westerners say "we want a happy pill", "we want to be able to deconstruct the concious experiences as a science", "we want cheap vacations to the Amazon to trip balls on ayahuasca and face our inner demons then get an herbal bath". I don't see anything wrong with that. Non-western Buddhists and traditionalist western ones seem to have issues with this. My words are kind of dancing around describing this because it's not quite set in stone but I can only note observations: Buddhists seem to want to quench the nature of things rather than explore them. And in the quest to eliminate suffering other disciplines such as medicine or science have done better, with regard to this traditional buddhism, with complacent monks and temples, seems like a relic of Vedic religions.

>>18373137
I'm not entirely sure what you're getting at. However, if you're complaint is that Buddhism is contemptuous of science and scientific progress, then I disagree. Buddhism is pretty explicitly empirical in it's approach to the acquisition of knowledge. The authority of the dharma doesn't come from divine revelation; rather it comes from observing one's own subjective experience. That, of course, means that it's not a positivist discipline because it involves subjective appraisal. However, Buddhism is not intended to replace scientific inquiry. I think you're setting up a false dichotomy between relieving suffering via material progress and relieving suffering through Buddhist practice. Both are great ways to improve the world. It just seems like you are not convinced of the first noble truth -- the existence of suffering as an ontological given. What that implies is that no amount of material progress can relieve Dukkha. That's made pretty explicit in the origin story of the religion where Guatama Buddha chooses to leave his palace where he enjoys all the benefits of material progress.

So, to the extent that the first noble truth is wrong and material progress built on science will suffice to bring about human happiness, I think you're right to be skeptical of the religion. Yet, I think a very good case can be made that people today are no closer to being without suffering than they were yesterday, despite all the scientific progress that we've made. I think a lot of the reason for that is people tend to make themselves and those around them miserable through their ignorance. You can't really cure that with just science.

>>18373264

>the existence of suffering as an ontological given. What that implies is that no amount of material progress can relieve Dukkha.

that I'm not convinced of, and the impermanence of all things in exoteric buddhism seems to have an exception on the existence of dukkha

>Yet, I think a very good case can be made that people today are no closer to being without suffering than they were yesterday, despite all the scientific progress that we've made.

the last natural entry in the periodic table was isolated only 80 years ago, quantum computing is barely in its infancy, we've barely even started

>>18373319
You may be right. But, like I said before, I'm not really a Buddhist because I like eastern philosophy. I'm mostly, a Buddhist because I can't afford to wait around until quantum computing or whatever figures out how to stop people from becoming miserable assholes. Even if Buddhism is not right in terms of it's assessment of how to cure suffering, only a fool would wait around for technocrats in some office to figure out how to make everyone happy.

>>18372422
>Doesnt understand non-duality
Buddhism is neither nihilist, nor not nihilist.
Appearences (illusions) do actually exist
But they are still only illusions.
Everything is like a dream. You can experience a dream, but the dream itself is illusionary.
The most basic difference between an unenlightened being and a enlightened one is that the first experiences the dream as reality, while the latter experiences everything as just a dream.