What's the appeal of 80s PC games? I've always saw

It was a time of creation, during which new game mechanics and even genres kept emerging.

The vast majority of games from the 90's which are praised for their innovation, you can find those "innovations" in 80's computer games.

Random example, NPCs with a schedule, which do different things depending on which day it is or the time of the day. Everyone says it was revolutionnary when Zelda did it on N64, but you can find in La Abadía del Crimen in 1987.

Also, before Alone In The Dark, before even Sweet Home, there was Zombi, the first true survival horror (just not named like that at the time obviously), inspired by the movie Dawn Of The Dead. But noone cares and claims "Sweet Home was the first survival horror" even then it isn't even one, because Sweet Home was on NES, and Zombi on PC.
Worst even, Ubisoft rebooted Zombi, came out at the launch of the WiiU, but even that didn't help get the original known better. It was on computers, nobody cares.

>>3990127
You're talking about pretty simple games none of which are genre defining. That why they're forgotten.

>>3990149
Console and arcade games are what was really simple. You couldn't do any complex games due to lack of storage, saving or controls that required more than a handful buttons.
Many classic games were made for computers first and later ported to consoles or even arcades like Choplifter. Everyone with a computer could make and distribute games for them and many classic developers started with computer games in the 80s.

>>3990083
I could play a level or two of alley cat or diggers during my coffee break, without spending a dime or having a TV set up in our office. Would be nice if they could get one of those spiffy arcade machines for our break room but nah.

>>3990083
Back when I got started, which sounds like ancient history, back then the demographics of people who were into computer games, was totally different, in my opinion, than they are today. Back then, computers were more expensive, which made them more exclusive to people who were maybe at a certain income level, or education level. So the people that played computer games 30 years ago were that type of person. They probably didn't watch television as much, and the instant gratification era hadn't quite grown the way it has lately. I think in the last 15 or 16 years, the demographics have really changed, now this is my opinion, because computers are less expensive so more people can afford them. More "average" people now feel they should own one.

>>3990083

During the 80s the appeal was getting to play games on your computer. During the now the appeal is to prove to other people that you're cool and retro.

There is no appeal. When we talk about 80s computer games we're actually referring to home computers, not personal computers. Think C64, Spectrum, and the like. The C64 was far better than any console when it came out in 1982. Same is true of the Amiga in 1985.

>>3990305

>home computers, not personal computers

Why would those two labels refer to different things? They sound like they're describing the same thing. Personal is home is personal.

PC gaming in the 80s set the groundwork for complex games entirely. Wizardry gave birth to the entire JRPG genre. Ultima and Elite gave birth to basically every openworld game ever made. Infocom and Sierra and LucasArts helped define the concept of shorter-form storytelling in games.

>>3990317
Personal computers had the connotation of being used for work and database shit. They were powerful and complicated.

Home computers were marketed to technical idiots to play video games on and do their homework and were considerably easier to use.

>>3990331
More like personnel computer.
The C128 was advertised as a personal computer and it's little more than a beefier C64.

The PC refers to an IBM computer... ie. x80- series processors. Would you call a Mac a PC? I don't think so.

>>3990326
Mainframe games set the groundwork, sorry. dungeon birthed adventure and RPG games of a certain type and rogue birthed action and RPG games of another type.

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>>3990340
What about NEC's PC-98? They've got a x86 processor.
Macs have had x86 processors for quite a while now, longer than they supported m68k or PPC. Apple didn't have problems calling the Lisa a PC and the Mac wasn't that different.

>>3990340

>Would you call a Mac a PC?

I've never seen one in real life, but I probably would call any computer being used by a person a PC.

>>3990350
>What about NEC's PC-98? They've got a x86 processor.
>Macs have had x86 processors for quite a while now

Good point, an IBM-compatible computer then. If you can install windows etc. on an iMac clearly it's just a PC with different software.

>Apple didn't have problems calling the Lisa a PC and the Mac wasn't that different.

They also didn't have a problem with calling the mac different from PC in their https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Get_a_Mac advertisement.

>>3990357
>If you can install windows etc. on an iMac clearly it's just a PC with different software.
Apple themselves released Bootcamp for that purpose. Running other OS like BSD or GNU+Linux was always an option.

God I can't stop pooping I've been on the toilet for like an hour now it just keeps coming out.

Is there any way we could actually discuss the flaws of 80s PC games instead of only ever trolling?

No, you're a casual who believes the narrative that gaming truly started with the NES or some shit, ignoring the vast amounts of awesome games that existed on both western and Japanese computers (MSX for example). Obviously the transition from simple arcade games to complex systems was as painful as the 3D transition. The lesser amount of popular titles is mainly because not many people bother with 80s computer emulation. There are people on this very board who complain about DOSBox being "too hard to use".

>>3990083
Go play Starflight and realize how foolish you were while making this thread.

>>3990579
Fuck, Starflight was such a great game.

Better than Elite.

>>3990584
Hell yeah it was. Too bad Star Control 2 gets all the recognition these days although that's also a really great game too.

>>3990403
dont stop now, you could be a hero!

>>3990538
dosbox being hard to use is a crazy notion. its just simplified msdos/dos. WHY THE FUCK WOULD IT BE HARD TO USE???!?!?!?!?!?!??!?


is /vr/ retarded or something?

>>3990603
It's even more ridiculous when you consider years ago they made it so all you literally have to do to get most games running is make the game exe open with the dosbox exe and if they're too dumb to know how to right click then they can just drag it on top of the dosbox exe.

>>3990083
You only had limited hardware to work with, the PC in the 80's was never meant to be a gaming platform, still it did have great games like Arkanoid, Alley Cat, Digger, etc.

>>3990603
Nobody learns to enjoy the comforts of a command line, unless they use Gentoo or something. It's sad, but inevitable.

>>3990305
Nothing to do with the thread.
He asked about PC's, not personal/home or micro computers.

PC as in IBM PC Compatible.

>>3990331
>They were powerful and complicated.
No, PC Compatibles in the 80's where uther shit. In that era they literally where typewriters with screens, that's why they where office machines.
Macintosh and Amiga took turns taking dumps on it. Also I think you are mixing up PCs with UNIX Workstations in your post.

>>3990350
>>3990340
There's a difference between PC as in Personal Computer and PC as in IBM PC.
Obviously if we talk about PCs nowadays we mean IBM PC compatibles. In retrospect we know better how to refer to different systems.

>>3990285
What PC games from the 80s would you call genre defining if any? That's still relevant too.
>>3990538
>No, you're a casual who believes the narrative that gaming truly started with the NES
Umm, like I said I prefer arcades in that time period.

>>3990538
Name the games tho. I genuinely want to know the names of genre-defining classics I've missed over the years.

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>>3990734
>What PC games from the 80s would you call genre defining if any?

Nothing so smoothly blended PoC adventures and traditional RPG's as this game did.

>>3990734
Depends how broad you define genres.
RPGs aside from Roguelikes all go back to Wizardry 1 and the Ultima series.
Adventures started on mainframes with games like Adventure or Zork but you had important contributions from Sierra such as Wizard and Princess or Lucasfilm's Maniac Mansion.
Simulations and strategy are obviously rooted in 80s computers but I'm not sure which games had the most impact. Maybe Nobunaga's Ambition from Koei just to add a Japanese title.
Action Adventures stem from Adventure on the 2600 which was an attempt to bring Adventure to consoles but it may be worth considering action RPGs like Hydlide or Dragon Slayer.
Action games seem more like a choice for the 90s with its FPS boom.
Sports games mainly had management games as a subgenre.

>>3990083
80's pc games where ass compared to NES

>>3990781
If you want to talk about defining RPGs it goes back to tabletop games and DnD. The most I see is some 80s RPGs influencing later console RPGs os the 80s.
>>3990797
You're talking about creating a simple structure not a genre defining game.

An example of a PC genre defining game is Simcity2000. Others would be Unreal/Quake series, Civilization II, Doom, etc
>>3990781
>>3990797
>Adventure
The best are from the 90s. The Secret of Monkey Island and King's Quest V to name two notable titles.

>>3990846
Ultima and Wizardry were obviously adaptions of DnD but the way they adapted it stuck. You'll be hard pressed to find a RPG that doesn't borrow something that those two series established.
What makes SC2k or Civ2 more defining than their predecessors? How does Unreal fit at all?
The question was for defining games, not the best. The defining part of MI1 was removing alternate solutions.

>>3990892
>What makes SC2k
It's the basically the best SimCity till you get to non retro.
>Civ2
The isometric view point is the big thing.
>How does Unreal fit at all?
How does it not? Unreal vs Quake rivalry is legendary.
>defining games, not the best.
Generally those 2 characteristics almost always go together. Just because a game invented something doesn't mean it defined it. A defining game is the gold standard for how it should be done and developers should aim to do better or at least match.

>>3990989
Doesn't your definition then mean most of the predecessors were also genre defining? SC1 was the gold standard until SC2k came along.

>>3991025
No because most games aren't very noteworthy.

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>>3990579
>>3990584
>>3990587
Does Solar Winds play anything like those?

>>3990298
you're even typing like an old man telling a long boring story

shorten it up

>>3990734
>>3990762
Do these nesbabys really believe everything started with them?

>>3990083
80s PC is basically 1920s silent film for videogames.

>there are ancient dragons on /vr/

>>3990317
>Why
Because 0.0000000001% of /vr/ is old enough to remember when all computers that were designed for personal use were called personal computers. This will no doubt be proven true countless times ITT.

>>3990331
Not in the 80's.

>>3990338
Even the Amiga was marketed as a personal computer in some cases.

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>>3993701
>Because 0.0000000001% of /vr/ is old enough to remember when all computers that were designed for personal use were called personal computers
What do kids call them?
I've always referred to them as PCs. I never new there was a debate between home and personal computer.

>>3992931
>Say I prefer aracade
>LOL U NES BB
K, kid.

>>3993709
*I never knew
Fuck you auto correct and captcha with 50 fucking stop signs.

>>3993709
Kids call them whatever they want. The actual meaning of words mean nothing to underage. Home computer and personal computer really mean the same thing. Except PC means personal computer and there has only ever been PC and Mac in the short lifespan and limited experience of the underage. This causes them to be confuse. And, as we all know, it's just easier to go along with whatever definition a millennial chooses to fit its narrative than it is to listen to it incessantly whine. Or, god forbid, try to learn it something.

>>3993709
>What do kids call them?
>I've always referred to them as PCs. I never new there was a debate between home and personal computer.
We called IBM PCs (and Apple) "computers". Amiga and Commodore systems fell into "game machines", and we also use them for the Atari 2600 and NES. Basically it depends on what you normally use them to, for work or for games. So I guess it really depends on where you live, too.

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>>3990083
Maybe they were inferior. But what made them compelling is that they were developing along a different axis from arcade and console games. It was something new, even if at 10 seconds per frame.

However it holds up now, it was exciting to be able to type in "Eat Werewolf" and get a response, moreso than more bling and twitch arcade style games. It was like a peek at the future.

>>3993709
they call them "ipads"

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>>3994185
>dracula-you-better-be-stocked
shouldn't be a problem, he's a stocker anyway

>>3990615
I'm impressed, I always launched games from VC.

>>3994087
>We called IBM PCs (and Apple) "computers". Amiga and Commodore systems fell into "game machines", and we also use them for the Atari 2600 and NES.
What? Nobody called Amigas or C64's "game machines", the C64 was a home microcomputer and the Amiga was a fully fetched computer.

>>3993709
>I've always referred to them as PCs. I never new there was a debate between home and personal computer.
PC's are generally referred to x86 based IBM PC Compatibles.
Everything else like the mentioned Amiga or Macintosh are just computers.

>>3990293
>I could play a level or two of alley cat or diggers during my coffee break, without spending a dime or having a TV set up in our office
Since office PCs probably had a monochrome card/monitor, you likely were not.

>>3990298
Indeed. Computerfags were nerds, consolefags were blue collar/white trash/normies.

>>3994892
Eh, we had CGA. There were only like 4 machines in my place anyway, not a big business. We were using the PCs for mostly Lotus-123 and Wordstar. and Banner Mania.

>>3994876
The C64 came bundled with joysticks and with flashy colors on the packaging (at exorbitant prices) in the shops and usually placed near the Atari and NES stuff so we just called it what we did. I probably did misremember the Amiga, though, it was probably something else.

>>3994876
My parents called all my computers game machines. When I bought my 99/4A they forced me to buy one educational cart for every game cart I bought. So yeah, stupid poor white trash called them game machines. I think they were just mad one of their 10 food stamp power ups could afford computers worth more than their car.