so these two were billed as the greatest games ever back in the

>>3886402
Neither.

oot is competently made and doesn't really have any major flaws. FF7 is a solid game with fun combat, a good customization system and great story moments.

A game being the greatest ever is a culmination of everything up to that point. It's important to understand as more games get released that potential pool gets expanded drastically.

Both are plagued by shortcomings but OOT has more. n64 games age better in general but hearing those audio samples used over and over again with link is fucking cringe-inducing. FF7 is an classic rpg with lots and lots of fluff so most of the flaws are in the numbers. Materia system is kinda shit and phsyical moves and limit breaks are the best moves in the game not counting the ridiculous summons.

>>3886402
Who cares, both are japanese crap.

>>3886403
fpbp

Piss easy action JRPG vs boring, easy turn based JRPG. *yawn*

>>3886402
How did most of us get hoodwinked into thinking low difficulty interactive animes were the greatest thing ever back in the late 90s/early 2000s? I wouldn't play a jrpg these days if you put a gun to my head but damned if I didn't think they were the absolute, untouchable pinnacle of gaming back in 1999

>>3886438
having no friends in real life

>>3886423
>OOT
>RPG

>>3886447
It is. You don't know what RPG means.

>>3886449
If you can't even follow basic genre definitions you have serious issues.

>>3886450
Define them, then.

>>3886454
That's terrible bait. In the off chance that you honestly don't know what constitutes an RPG and think Zelda fits into it, then you're not worth wasting the time explaining it.

Don't bother with another snitty response, teach yourself or wallow in stupidity. Makes no difference to me.

>>3886464

Dude, we're not /v/, don't be like that to the poor guy. If you want to get technical, you are assuming the role of Link, and it is a game!

But yes, there's no do pls or leveling up, stats, typical dog elements.

>>3886450
>>3886454
Every game is an RPG if you define RPG broadly enough.
Sonic 3 has you playing the role of a fast hedgehog, role-playing if you will, in a game. A roll-playing game.

>>3886402
They both held up well but I don't replay them often. OoT because it's got a slow pacing in the beginning and FF VII because the pacing became worse after Midgar. Their popularity is mostly because of hype and a lot of people on this board prefer other installments, even if it's just because they're "niche". Quality wise they aren't really different compared to older and later games in their franchises. I prefer FF VIII and Oracle of Seasons myself but that's just because the gameplay of those games are more to my liking.

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>>3886479
>Dude, we're not /v/

You don't belong on 4chan if you think /v and /vr are different.

>>3886402
VII is my favorite FF, but OOT was more revolutionary for its time so OOT I guess.

>>3886502
it wasnt, if anything mystical ninja starring goemon was revolutionary since it came before oot

vii was ever considered the greatest game ever made?
I remember people praising the FMVs, but that's about it.

>>3886407
This.

>>3886464
I get it, you're some kid who thinks RPG = turn based SNES style JRPG.

>>3886402
>"You're not allowed to like different games simultaneously."

It's not like I'm entering into a monogamous relationship with a video game. Fuck off. I'll whore myself out to as many video games as I want.

>>3886481
>Every game is an RPG if you define RPG broadly enough.

Tetris?

>>3886479
Stats and levelling aren't fundamental to an RPG.

>>3886402
Keep in mind, I played Ocarina of Time when it came out, and only just played FFVII for the first time this year. (I didn't like RPGs or "mature" looking stuff when I was a kid. FFVII seemed too edgy for me)

I love Ocarina. It was my favorite game. It blew my fucking 12-year-old mind. Replaying it over the years, it never really lost its luster, but I didn't truly being appreciating it until a few years ago when I marathoned the game in one sitting. Not speed-running, but just making a fucking beeline to Ganon. The fact that the game allowed this was wonderful. The main quest is engaging and never tedious. Very little bullshit. The game is packed with sidequests and optional stuff that you can do if you want, and will enhance the experience, but if you choose, you can blow right by it all and the game never slows you down. Music and graphics are excellent for their time, still highly memorable. Apart from some slight clunkiness in the lock-on and camera at times, it's near flawless.

FFVII is weird. I grew up hearing about how awesome it was from all my pals, but didn't really care. Finally worked up the interest to play it, and I have to say it's incredibly impressive. The materia system is one of the best of square's "gimmicks". It flawlessly integrates with the core gameplay, and the customization it offers is endlessly fun. The game drags a few places. At times it's basically an interactive movie, but I can't come down on it too hard for that. Music and atmosphere are top notch. The graphics are charming, I'm a sucker for pre-rendered backgrounds. It doesn't blow my mind now, but I can see how this game blew minds 20 years ago. Pretty impressive.

I like Ocarina better, but I fully admit that's because I like the genre more, and I have nostalgia for it. It's not a slight toward FFVII in any way. They're honestly both great.

>The RPG vs. action-adventure debate again

https://duckduckgo.com/lite?q=rpg+action-adventure+difference&kg=g&kp=-1

There. Now you can satisfy your autism by reading the exhaustive levels of e-drama that already exists. There's no reason to resurrect it on /vr/.

>>3886402
I could quite happily say these two are the best games of all time.

>>3886853
You mean like the rest of the world does? Yes.

>>3886901
Only American console babies would think that.

>>3886905
Good thing this is a console baby thread

>>3886871
You're roleplaying as a russian trying to stack boxes of goods and technical components produced by your comrades in to a spaceship as efficiently as possible so that russia might succesfully launch a rocket before the americans. If you fail the kgb throws you in a gulag.

>>3886909
So the definition of RPG suddenly changes to one very small sub-genre of RPGs? Not happening, kid.

>>3886853
No, I am not.

OOT is even less of an RPG if you compare it to CRPGs.

What to you get out of pretending to be stupid?

>>3886901
Not me.

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Considering how now a days turn based combat is seen as the worst thing ever since Hittler, OOT would certainly would take the prize.

>>3886402
Both are the best of their respective genres. Turn Based RPG and Open World Action Adventure.

>>3887138
OoT wasn't open world.

>>3887141
Whatever.
Turn Based RPG and Action Adventure, then.

>>3886438
Because I fucking love anime

Considering how Turn Based games are almost gone and even Final Fantasy got rid of it

OOT is timeless

>>3887129
>>3887173

This will probably get even worse if the FF7 remake does well critically. Remember people were convinced RPGs would never take off in the west until FF7 came along, casuals will play any genre if it's in the right package. I get the feeling we'll see a a turn-based revival after a decade or so of open world schlock.

>>3887173
they killed turn based gameplay because they listened to dumb journos who live in an alternate world. As soon as they ditched turn-based gameplay, sales for the series took a nosedive. Pokemon is still as popular as ever, and it's turn based. Bravely Default was a hit and it was turn-based.

At some point they're going to realize that shitting up KH clones doesn't work, announce a traditional FF with turn based gameplay and people will get really excited, mark my words

>>3887184
The battle system in the remake isn't turn-based.

>>3887184
The remake gets rid of the turn based because FF7 really ain't that great and even Square knows it so they have to change the game.

>>3887184
>casuals
Post disregarded. Speak properly and not in meaningless youtube speak

FF7 is a great game that i ocasionally play every 3 years or so, all the way to the final boss and in less than 30 hours of comfy gameplay and good music. Fun, simple videogame.

Oot on the other hand. WTF. I came from a forest and found some hidden village, a dancing frog, a horse that i can't ride, fell into a river and some asshole owl took me all the way back to the castle. None of that means anything. And fuck those ghosts that hide every time you hit them, you need to do that like 6 times each one.

>>3887184
Yeah... not going to play FF7: Devil May Cry.

>>3886402
Majora's Mask is still my favorite to play today because it has more arcade qualities which is what I look for in games today.

>>3886486
/v/ and /vr/ ARE different. Idiot. Gtfo.

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>>3887241
Video games must be really tough for you.

I have some /VR/ suggestions more along you level of gaming.

>>3886402
FF7.

FF7 just got it all right.

Fun easy minigames. Fun easy combat. A decent world to explore. A fun enjoyable adventure.

OoT is a really shitty 3D game that handholds the fuck out of you and is just a snooze al around./

>>3886402
Panzer Dragoon Saga is better

>>3886403
Yep

>>3887218
>>3887236

Can anyone on this fucking board read? I said it (read: the shift away from turn-based) would get WORSE. As in, there would be even less turn-based games if not a complete death of the genre if FF7Remake is successful. It would be 'proof' that the style was old news, so to speak. I'm not fucking advocating it, it looks like shit.

>>3887238

Oh no, better pack up my computer now this anon has disregarded my post. You're starting to get your shit muddled, pal - FF7 is the most popular game in the series. It's part-nostalgia, it's part-hype, it just is what it is. I'm not talking about the 'casuals' featured in whatever fucking Youtube shit you're talking about, When I say 'casuals' I'm literally talking about the casual gamer as a market. The people that, currently, don't give a shit about the series but may have bought FF7 in the past and enjoyed it. That's their target, right?

>>3886414
>lel, nobody likes muh western tripe
Even people on Ebay won't shell out jack for western games. Stay mad, lel.

>>3887236
>FF7 aint that great
>continues to sell well through digital download
WWwwwwwWwWwwwW

>>3887491
>sales = quality
wwWWwwWwwwWWwwWWWwwwWWwwwWWw

>>3887491

Very flawed logic, but we will let you live another day, we need people who can pick up the trash.

>>3886438
>low difficulty
Games nowadays are 1,000 times easier (and with nine million tutorials, endless cutscenes that require no actual gaming, and dumbed down qtes)

>interactive animes

Uh, neither FF7 or OOT look like anime. Unlike nowadays where most games are LITERALLY anime (sometimes I'll see a video and I'm not sure if it's a game or a tv show).

>>3886485
>I prefer FF VIII

Opinion discarded.

>>3886407
I played Ocarina of time and I just don't get it. That might be the reason as to why.

I feel like I had to have played it back then to really understand it's status.

>>3886894
This is the most respectful post in this thread, even if it's just personal opinion. Thanks anon, you made /vr/ a tiny bit less of a cesspool.

Between the two, I think VII would endure more, just because it has a comparatively more serious story of a very far-reaching scope and world, and the gameplay offers for plenty of variations. How OoT is confined to a rather tiny sandbox is pretty silly to look at today, and there's a lot about OoT that feels constrictive.

>>3886894
Pretty much this, though in terms of being a movie it wasn't anywhere near as bad as later FF games.

>>3887590
>Uh, neither FF7 or OOT look like anime.

Did you want a (You)? I'll give you one, but only because I'm feeling generous today.

>>3886402
OOT wins for having actual gameplay mechanics.

Final Fantasy VII is basically "spam O the video game."

>>3888635
so basically any JRPG ever?
hate when people trivialize games like this. Mario is press A (jump) the game going by that logic

>>3888651
Except you can actually just spam O the entire game and win. Materia is literally optional.

Have fun beating OOT or SM64 without using every button.

>>3888694
>Have fun beating OOT or SM64 without using every button.

Have fun actually trying to play FFVII with a controller that only has a dpad and O button.

>>3888712
I'm not saying you'll never have to use other buttons, or that using the other buttons don't make the game more fun. I'm just saying that the game severely lacks in any gameplay depth.

There are no movement options other than run and walk. No weight or momentum to your character. It literally has no gameplay beyond moving in straight lines and selecting things from menus. And in FF7's case, there's no intellectual or strategic value to make up for it.

>>3888720
>I'm not saying you'll never have to use other buttons
Except you exactly did.

Maybe next time try saying what you actually mean first instead of weak hyperbole.

>>3886438
Being close to a movie experience used to be what everyone dreamed of in vidya.
Now it's commonplace and everyone has realized it's shit.

>>3888723
Exceptions don't disprove the rule. FF7 is an objectively low APM game. You being in denial about this doesn't change reality.

>>3888651
>Mario is press A (jump) the game going by that logic
yeah, but you understand that FF7 requires significantly less motor function than Mario, right? because that's clearly what the dude meant. the game has nothing even remotely resembling movement depth or a physics engine. it's all menus and text.

>>3888712
>>3888694
You could play FF7 equally as well with your feet as you could with your hands. It has extraordinarily simplistic gameplay that doesn't require any fine motor function.

>>3888734
I don't even like the game. I just get tired of people making meaningless statements.

>>3888736
so any action game is inherently better than menu-based games? way to throw almost all of PC gaming under the bus

>>3888751
>FF7 has an extremely low level of gameplay
>meaningless statement
But it's completely true.

>>3888758
>so any action game is inherently better than menu-based games?
If it's as mindless and boring as FF7, then yes.

>>3887608
you need to understand that it did everything right and there was a lot of problems that could potentially go wrong at the time. Look at how tomb raider handled lock on, as an example. The camera wanders around, snapping awkwardly as the target edges to the end of your viewable space. This was what people thought of when lock on was brought up in 3D games like this. The awkward movement, the tank style controls. Mario 64 did it right for the 3D platformer, but the 3D puzzle action oriented adventure game was a troubling task.

Then you have a game which seamlessly keeps both characters in frame, allows for perfect tracking of player and enemy position, targeting, framing, and perfect control that seamlessly transitions.

It's like playing super mario 3d world as your first mario game - it might come off as the most inventive game of all time, but then you find out it's sitting on top of hundreds of games that came before it and all built up to that point and the only unique additions are simultaneous multiplayer in a 3D space.

In order to "get" games from any period of time, you must first play the games that predated it.

>>3888763
OOT and SM64 invented the foundation for all modern action/adventure games.

FF7 took the same shit they've been doing for years and slapped FMV's and shitty polygonal models on top.

>>3888759
I was responding to

>Have fun beating OOT or SM64 without using every button.

>>3888769
>FF7 took the same shit they've been doing for years and slapped FMV's and shitty polygonal models on top.
that's nice, it was still really good and may be the best in the franchise

>>3888779
>may be the best in the franchise
that's a low bar lmao

>>3888781
yeah, ff games have never been particularly amazing. I don't see what your point is.

>>3888781
Obviously if you don't like that kind of game you're not going to like it.

>>3888763
>Look at how tomb raider handled lock on
The funny thing is that angry contrarians always point to "Tomb Raider did it!!" When people talk about how revolutionary OoT's mechanics were. Comparing Tomb Raider's targeting to OoT's is laughable.

Fuck, is it even contrarian to hate OoT now? I feel like that's the prevailing sentiment on /v/ and /vr/

>>3888808
I honestly never got the appeal of Tomb Raider or Resident Evil, both of which aged far worse than both OOT and FF7 yet cop far less flak than either.

>>3888832
>>3888808
Combat is very secondary in Tomb Raider. It's mostly a puzzle game.

>>3888832
tomb raider has a cool sort of realistic style of platforming that was both novel at the time and hasn't really been replicated. It's skillful so it's not like say, uncharted, it requires you to plan your movement, and it's a lot of fun pulling off sections of tough navigation.

Never cared much for combat.

>>3888837
People have been saying the same thing about Zelda for years.

>>3888848
That may be fair. I never played OOT and the only Zelda I actually liked much was WW. Just chiming in on Tomb Raider.

TR's lock on isn't good, but I see it as kind of necessary given the rest of the controls aren't set up very well for interesting combat.

>>3888848
Yes, Aonuma ruined Zelda.

>>3888947
How so?

>>3886402
Apples and Oranges
A Link to the Past 3D remake vs Final Fantasy 1 Remastered for the 6th time
Both are great because LttP is amazing, and Final Fantasy is amazing

>>3888763
Let's just ignore the camera angles are god awful in OoT, the puzzle's are ass, and the amount of waiting in the game is infinite

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Ocarina of Time takes advantage of being a 3D adventure and doesn't play like A Link to the Past. It uses multiple perspectives not capable on a SNES and does them well

FF7 features the exact same gameplay as SNES era JRPGs. FF7 has as much 3 dimensional movement as Chrono Trigger for fuck sakes. People are impressed by terrible CG cutscenes that have aged like milk

>>3888984
>Ocarina of Time takes advantage of being a 3D adventure and doesn't play like A Link to the Past.
excuse you?

Link to the past Created the formula that just about every single Zelda game from it to Skyward sword used

3 dungeons -> master sword -> 6-8 dungeons -> gannon
sometimes they added a fake final boss like Zant, but it still followed the same principle

they're all glorified remakes of Link to the past with a shiny new coat of paint.

at least Final Fantasy changes the story from game to game

>>3888982
>the amount of waiting in the game is infinite
This meme is perpetuated by people who objectively suck ass at video games.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGAz1C4D480

>>3889002
You're confusing gameplay mechanics with story structure. Probably because you're an actual retard.

>>3889007
I could cast Deku Nut and spin attack, or cast Dins Fire
Sure, one could do any of those three things, but a person whose on his first or even second play through isn't going to know that shit
care to debunk my other points?

>>3889014
>a person whose on his first or even second play through isn't going to know that shit
Why wouldn't they? The game literally explains how to do all of it.

Maybe try experimenting with utilizing gameplay mechanics instead of mindlessly hacking and slashing like a brainlet.

>>3889012
the gameplay is practically the same either way
Zelda: run around dungeons, use dungeon item to help you through it, use it somehow to beat boss

Final Fantasy: turn based JRPG it's pretty self explanatory

>>3889017
not even remotely, the game tells you that since your normal attacks are ineffective you should just wait, and counter attack when you can. unless using gimmicks such as Dins Fire or some other inane thing.

>>3889020
>the gameplay is practically the same
Imagine being this delusional.

Literally the entire moveset, controls and physics engine are different. The parallels you're drawing are the most shallow aspects of each game. The only similarity in combat between the two games is that you have a sword and a shield, for fuck sakes.

>>3889027
>not even remotely
Go and pick up a deku nut for the first time in a new game right now. Read the message.

It's fucking jawdropping how stupid you are.

>>3889028
explain to me the Swamp palace of Link to the past and the water temple
you get the hookshot in both of these dungeons

how did you fight the bosses in each dungeon?

How did you maneuver through the dungeons?

how did link function in these two dungeons ?

Oh wait, by using the hookshot in exactly the same way regardless of 2d and 3d

I'm not the one that's delusional here

>>3889014
>a person whose on his first or even second play through isn't going to know that shit
i used those things on my first playthrough. why wouldn't you? it's clear right away that items are ambiguous and can be used in many different contexts.

>>3889034
To be fair, by the time you have the slingshot you've pretty much been conditioned that Deku Nuts are a worthless items.

>>3889034
the can be blocked, and aren't effective against some enemies

>>3889036
>using the hookshot in exactly the same way
holy fuck what am i reading

no wonder modern gaming is so shit. it's populated by brainless people like you.

>>3889041
They're effective on nearly every enemy in the game, even most bosses.

>>3889043
how you dont see that it's a 3d remake I have no clue

>>3886885
Gtfo. Idiot.

>>3889040
>you've pretty much been conditioned that Deku Nuts are a worthless items
only if you're a literal retard who plays games so mindlessly you can't even figure something out that the game blatantly tells you.

>>3889049
Most if not all wolves and Stalfos can block it

>>3889051
Because you're too stupid to understand how the mechanics of each game significantly differs from one another. You probably think SM64 is a remake of Super Mario World because they both have goombas and mushrooms.

>>3889052
>mfw when none of these are actual Role playing games since you're not role playing at all

>>3889058
>Stalfos can block it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xINau9v5Ii0

I swear to god the people who hate on this game haven't even played it once in their lives.

>>3889063
Mario 64 is nothing like Mario World, It has a different formula all together,
Sunshine is a remastered SM64

>>3889067
Never said that they cant get hit by them, I said that they can block it
are you literate?

>>3889068
>Sunshine is a remastered SM64
Jesus Christ, just shut up.

>ITT teenagers who can't figure out the mechanical nuances of a kids game.

>>3889074
they play pretty much the same

>>3889080
You're extremely imperceptive of gameplay mechanics. That's basically what this boils down to.

>>3889078
>ITT: Autists arguing over a children's game

>>3889084
Water Gimmicks and 3d Gimmick
I don't see a difference
and again, the story is literally the same
Change light world and dark world to Young and Adult Link

>>3889036
In ALttP, the Hookshot stuck to skulls and pots, but not chests. There were no hookshot targets on the walls.

In OoT, it's exactly the other way round.

Completely different.

>>3889053
You can only have three items on the C buttons and there is rarely a case where Deku Nuts are among the three best items to keep handy.

>>3889091
In Turtle rock, you have too Hookshot chests to work yourself around

Both games are great.

FFVII was the next big step forward for JRPGs in terms of graphics, plot and character development. I think its narrative approach is what really sets it apart, from the FMV to the playable flashbacks. My biggest complaint is the battle mechanics were only slightly different from the 4th gen FFs, and arguably simpler and more stripped down in comparison.

OoT's plot/structure is heavily drawn from LttP (which its critics love to point out), and that's probably the biggest "criticism" I can think of (everything else is nitpicky). But it really improved upon the LttP form in every way I can think of, the basic plot, the backstory/lore, the characters, the settings. Everything was fleshed out in much better ways. Not to mention the gameplay is completely different, innovative and extremely well-made.

I guess if I had to choose, I'd go with OoT. But that's stupid and so is this thread, and we talk about these games too much.

>>3889089
>I don't see a difference
Because you're an idiot. The movement engine is completely different. You can't even kick or longjump in sunshine and that's only the beginning.

ALTTP and OOT are even more different from one another mechanically.

>>3889094
They're easily in the top 3 most useful items in the game.

>>3887429
this.

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>>3889110
Good post, anon.

>>3888738
>You could play FF7 equally as well with your feet
Shit, that's a good point actually. It's just navigating menus.

>>3886403
This

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so these two were billed as the greatest RPGs ever from back in the day. Obviously it's a lot of marketing talk, but which one lives up more to that title nowadays?

>>3887485
weeb

>>3892405
PDS is overrated because it's "lol so rare and expensive" but it's still better than Xenogears

>>3888738
You could play Chrono Trigger with your feet and everyone would still call it one of the best games ever made, so I don't see your point.

>>3892405
Never played PDS but Xenogears is a lot more polarizing.

>>3892416
>I don't see your point.
That they're boring games. Obviously people would still like them because there's a large demographic who prefer to be dazzled by bullshit than play video games.

>>3886449

OOT is an adventure game.

>>3892405
PDS, is this even a question? It's actually a complete game, for one.