This is literally in the top 5 of best video games of all

>>3807067

def.

Also almost perfect games:

FF7
Witcher 3
Bloodborne

>literally
That word doesn't mean what you think it means.

>>3807070
NOT RETRO

>>3807067
boring as shit desu

>>3807067
>Prove me wrong.
Okay.

>Ocarina of Time
>Metal Gear Solid
>Final Fantasy 7
>Sonic 3 & Knuckles
>GTA San Andreas

Op. You mean top 1.

>>3807106
>Final Fantasy 7
I think VI better but okay

>Ocarina of Time
>Sonic 3 & Knuckles
bullshit

>>3807067
I think it is figuratively in the top 5.

>>3807384
>>Ocarina of Time
>bullshit
Notu disu shittu again.

>>3807067
I think it's metaphorically in the top 5.

>>3807067

I can't prove you wrong senpai.

>>3807067
It might be amongst the top 5 best SNES JRPGs, at least.

let me just input the command to use my magic sword
>JRPGs
>Games
not hardly champ

>>3807439
What a huge faggot.

Top 5 overrated video games of all time, yeah probably.

well let's ignore taste for a second. let's look at it objectively - did it innovate? no, it didn't. certainly not. it took the FF fighting system - more or less - it took toriyama and the story wasn't particularly new either. so it's not innovative.

let's look at another game usually considered one of the best ever. ocarina of time. did it innovate? it had amazing 3D controls, camera, length, cutscenes, top-notch graphics at the time and influenced many games, especially 3D ones, to come close to it control, looks and story-telling wise. regardless of your taste in games, OoT was more innovative and influental, it must've been better then.

let's look at another influental game from that same console. super metroid. it was groundbreaking in storytelling as even though it barely had any dialogue at all it managed to create an atmosphere of mystery and made you feel like an adventurer like no other game before. the game as we all know inspired hundreds of side-scrollers that copied the formula. so this one, regardless of your taste, is objectively more innovative.

is chrono trigger good? yes, its very polished and obviously a great game. but when you want to talk about greatest of all time, you surely have to take into account influence and innovation and in that regard chrono trigger is simply not up there.

>>3807476
>muh innovation
you're probably the cancer that favors turds like FFVIII over CT because it was hella innovative
CT is at least a 9/10 (and a 10 in many aspects) at every department. It's probably the most well rounded RPG ever. It's more than the sum of its parts. It's incredibly fun for a JRPG (which I cannot tolerate these days), pacing is the best ever in the genre, there's not useless padding, the cast of characters is perfect as it is (99% of JRPGs have some character that you don't know why it's there, not the case with CT). It just has no weakness, deal with it. I can play many of the sacred cows of the genre and find a fault in them but not with CT

>>3807491
>>3807476
oh and if you wanna talk about innovation, talk about the huge number of multiple endings and stuff, all of that before Fallout 1 made it trendy

>>3807491
idk if u read my post fully but i do agree chrono trigger is a great and extremely well-polished game my argument was only that if you were gonna talk about "the best ever" i think a game that innovates is better over a game that perfected a formula invented elsewhere

>>3807491
Having no weakness doesn't mean it's a better game. Maybe the strong points aren't as strong as the other games being compared. Also, don't be an idiot, innovation is obviously a VERY important point when discussing whatever media. Every work that comes out is compared to whatever came before it.

>>3807519
>>3807495
Innovashun is an overrated metric to rank GOAT games. Would you put FFI or IV above CT in a list? what about Zelda II? Why is OoT often considered one of the greatest if it's just the Zelda formula in 3D? (and no, Z-targeting isn't a significant enough innovation given that virtually no games other than Zeldas and Metroid Primes used it). And so on. Is Wasteland better than Fallout 1? this shit would be endless

What matters is ultimately quality.

>>3807537
Why don't you just take the latest and most perfected renditions of a particular formula then? Why not consider Rayman Legends the best platformer of all time instead of the usual SMW or SMB3? Why not Ori and the Blind Forest instead of Super Metroid (or SotN)? See where I'm getting at? It just doesn't make sense.
And don't be the humongous faggot who says these contemporary renditions are not atleast as good as the old ones.

>>3807537
>just the Zelda formula in 3D
>just
You serious? Even that same formula in 2d is extremely hard to pull off correctly. Let alone the stupidly difficult stunt of going from 2d to 3d in any formula. OoT manages to pull off those 2 together, ON THE FIRST TRY, without any large flaws (and let's face it, before the sequelitis video no one could even point those flaws out).

>>3807537
>Only OoT and MP have lock ons
I'm not saying OoT invented or innovated anything, but that's a pretty silly thing to say.

>>3807491
>CT is at least a 9/10 (and a 10 in many aspects) at every department.
Not really, the gameplay is shallow and unbalanced, the game is still linear as hell with no agency at all like most light RPG series and the characters or writing are nothing special at all, it's a fine game for kids, but it's not even remotely this giant of a game trigger fanboys makes it out to be.

It's an average big budget console RPG from the time, barely different from its peers, it looks great and there's a few good tracks to listen to, but that's about it, there's much better RPGs on the SNES all around, anyone who isn't a fanboy can see that.

>>3807574
>It's an average big budget console RPG from the time
>there's much better RPGs on the SNES all around
This anon is a bit delusional, but you need a contrarian in every thread to keep it interesting so it's all good.
I still agree that CT is not the GOAT even though it's so "perfect", which it is.

>>3807582
Calling other contrarians means nothing, especially when you don't bring anything to the table in terms of discussion.

CT is outdone in every departement by other games on the SNES alone, unless all you want is the most shallow and derivative experience possible in terms of RPGs, and if that's the case there still better games than CT with those qualities too.

>>3807593
Yeah, cause you brought a lot to the table.

>>3807067
visual novels aren't games

>>3807067

In the top 5? What JRPG is better than this one? Its the best 90's JRPG ever made.

>>3807614
ff6, 7, earthbound

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>>3807106

All those games are inferior to Chrono Trigger.

>>3807617

Earthbound sucks.
FF7 has aged like shit.
FF6 is broken.

>>3807620
ok mr fanboy

>>3807620
>I haven't played Earthbound
>Steam FF7 suxxxx

>>3807626

I have played Earthbound and it does suck. Dragonquest is better than earthbound in every way. Both original FF7 and steam version look like shit.

>>3807620
I finished ffvii for the first time this week and I can only think of 3 complaints regarding its age.
>Needing to switch to a character in order to equip/unequip something.
>Fmvs having clunky animations and low polys.
>Ending cutscenes having lots of dialog but no voice
I did play with shaders, as should you.

>>3807602
What point is there in talking to people who don't want to hear?
Even if I went down to all the bad little things fanboys would always deny the truth.

Fact is CT never was anything more than a game of the year at best, nobody but a few die hard americans on the internet care about it, even in japan the game wasn't even that big of a hit, and to this day few people care about it in there, the Mother series of all things manages to be more relevant than CT, and tons of other old series got more relevance than CT in terms of cameos or general renewed interest, CT is dead, as in dead and almost forgotten by both players and developers.

>>3807631
ff7 still looks amazing on a crt with composite cables. Also the camerawork was really impressive when it came out, something we didn't have much of in 2D

>>3807632
>>3807640

I prefer the old school 2d sprite graphics in most games. They have aged like fine wine and always look good, even 20 years later.

>>3807646
I wouldn't say all of them have. Yoshi's Island could come out today and no one would complain, Earthbound and Mario World same. CT really needs to be played over composite to look as it did, and FF6 even more. FF6 looks kinda bad actually without lossy signals. Older FF's really start to look hideous.

>>3807659

Well at least CT got a proper port on the DS which retains the graphic style of the original. The FF remakes are all quite bad, even on mobile. FF6 world map using mode 7 didn't age well.

>>3807665
>which retains the graphic style of the original
Aside from, you know, aspect ratio, colors, dithering... It could be a lot worse, and definitely couldn't be better on a DS, but still. FF6 on mobile is probably one of the greatest atrocities known to mankind.

MOST OVERRATED GAME ON PLANET EARTH

Final Fantasy VI is way better.

>>3807674

No its not.

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1/10

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2/10

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3/10

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4/10

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5/10

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6/10

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7/10

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8/10

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9/10

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10/10

>>3807682
>>3807685
>>3807687
>>3807690
>>3807692
>>3807697
>>3807701
>>3807703
>>3807704
>>3807706

Chrono Trigger best JRPG.

>>3807067
This is THE best video game of all time.

>>3807708
>>3807856
>really makes me think

>>3807106
>OoT
>not overrated garbage

Meh honestly when I played it I was pretty disappointed after sinking a lot of time into it. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed it for some length of the game but ultimately could not understand for the life of me why some people think it's the greatest.

>>3807945

The legend of Chrono: Trigger of Time.

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>>3807067

Praise Kek.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vUtM9iySqg

>>3807491
>It just has no weakness
It's too easy. It rarely makes you to do anything other than have Frog and Robo fully heal the whole party every now and then while doing your big damage attacks the rest of the time. This makes the majority of encounters uninteresting.

>but why not just not do that?

If you have to impose arbitrary limitations on yourself to make something interesting, it's not interesting.

>>3807476
videogames copying movies isn't innovation and you can't convince me that 3d improved games. I belive 3d ruined gaming. Doom is a 2d game and the best fps ever, 3d faggots can suck my dick

>>3807067
the music is shit

>>3808571
okay, not shit, but not good for 16 bit era

>>3808176
Requesting the Frog (Chrono Trigger) Pepe image.

>>3807067
Short, linear, easy.

It's not even in the top 5 SNES RPGs, let alone the best games of all time.

>>3809009
Stop with this meme response and name the 5 SNES RPGs that are better. I will accept ffvi and earthbound as potentially better but if you're contending the secret of Mana or some shit is better then just fuck off

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>>3807067
Just 5 better games? That doesn't even require reaching very broadly!

It's not even much of a game. Just a soap opera in pseudo-FF format.

you have to hate chrono trigger, otherwise you're not a patrician.

CT is an excellent game for what it is. it's a solid 8/10.

>>3809234
>no saturn games
cancer

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>People hating a game that isn't linear garbage like the average Final Fantasy and also has tons of replay value with its alternate endings and its innovative NG+ feature

People that hate CT but love garbage like FF6 or FF7 have to be the sorriest motherfuckers in the world

CC > CT, though

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>>3808995

>>3809319
Panzer Dragoon Saga

>>3807439
This. I loved JRPG's like anyone else but they aren't games, they're melodramas for 12 year olds that happen to have a shitty game blocking the progression of the story.

>>3809319
it blatantly says it's already dreamcast era then, and who can you reasonably be pissed at that neither sega system got even a half decent fraction of the multi plats there?

>>3809327
Bro, Chrono Trigger is absolutely linear.

>>3809327
>innovative NG+ feature
You know Zelda had it ten years before Chrono Nigger, right?

>>3807067
No.
Tetris
Snake 2
Pokemon red
Solitaire
The Sims

>>3810324
Best games of all time does not mean games most beloved by normies.

Every one of those games is dogshit; CT is merely overrated.

The best game of all time, i feel sorry for the people how can't enjoy it as it.

>>3811131
Sorry that are brains do function.

>>3807067
I agree but at the same time, I think Chrono Trigger starts off pretty weak. It's definitely one of the most technically impressive games on the SNES but outside of the mid/lategame peak, most of the game is a forgettable, almost tedious blur.

The beginning of the game starts off decent enough, I liked the actual paradox story but that's over with quickly and replaced with the future era which is a boring, uninspired setting with nothing interesting to explore. From there, the game dips once again and has you deal with the slogfest that is the middle ages and racism, the only reprieve is getting to Ayla's era which again, just feels like a drag. After finishing up with the middle ages, you go back to help out Ayla and the game only then hits its peak and does a pretty good job of sustaining it and opens up its sidequests which again, are all pretty great.

>>3811695
As opposed to the great early game of FF4? Or 6?

Come on.

I like it because the characters look like DBZ characters

>>3809234
>SA
>Good
Only nostalgia goggles strapped on so tight that blood barely makes it to your brain tight can let you think that. It is, at best, a lovable disaster. But to anyone who wasn't desperate for any new Sonic games post-3&K in the 90s could actually still love it.

>>3811716
Nice strawman. I never once brought up FFIV or FFVI and "these games have slow builds too!" isn't an argument and doesn't negate my issue with Chrono Trigger.

>>3811764
You're not taking into account any of CTs contemporaries of the time

I mean you got the horrible Breath of Fire titles and the outdated Dragon Quest games. Literally nothing was better than CT on the SNES

>>3811842
>Literally nothing was better than CT on the SNES
On what grounds?

>>3807494
Contra Hard Corps also had many endings and it was not even an RPG

>>3807070
Final Fantasy 6 is better than Final Fantasy 7, and if we're mentioning non-/vr/ games, Skyrim deserves a spot.

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>>3811881

>>3811842
>horrible Breath of Fire
Hey now, Breath of Fire I might be simplistic but it also tries its hardest to be something other than that with wacky humor and unique world and characters. It's by no means horrible, and BoFII's shit translation is hiding another one of the best JRPGs on the SNES and DQ feels outdated no matter the generation it's in.

>Literally nothing was better than CT on the SNES
You're free to think that but I disagree and like >>3811868 I'm curious as to what makes it The Best SNES Game of All Time.

CT is good, but there's great games like Lufia II, Tales of Phantasia, Seiken Densetsu 3, Super Mario RPG, Star Ocean and many others, and I'm only listing "mainstream" JRPGs here. You're really doing the SNES' variety of titles a disservice by dismissing everything like that. It just makes it look like you haven't played anything but the usual titles.

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>>3811868
>>3811893
Chrono Trigger has everything I think a great 16-bit JRPG should have

+Non grid based movement (Hell I prefer Earthbound over the Dragon Quest games for this very reason)
+Features combat sprites that aren't flat drawings (This disqualifies FF6 because CT has characters that react to hits and multiple angles)
+Indepth combat system with party member positioning that allows you to replace the main character (This is usually a big no no for these types of games, that also don't allow you any party customization like Earthbound - but it also disqualifies the great Super Mario RPG because of Mario's locked role)
+Multiple characters to choose from to fill your party (JRPGs would usually write themselves into a corner and only let you have 4-5 characters total in the game, but CT wrote a story that allowed for multiple characters join up)
+Actual replay value from NG+, side quests, to making decisions that alter endings and the game itself like killing Magus
+Great UI and being able to customize it (This might be a simple one, but think about how Phantasy Star 2 didn't tell you whether or not a weapon you were buying at the store was better than the one you had)

On a personal level, Chrono Trigger fulfills its concept of time travel nicely allowing you to see multiple eras - it never felt rushed or incomplete or linear like other JRPGs. A lot of games promise the world, and I feel like CT is one of the few games that delivers

Oh and as for Seiken Densetsu 3, its problem is that if you don't like the characters you chose, you're shit out of luck. CT lets you find which characters you like on the fly.

CT is fun, but it was one of those games where its "greatness" relies on its narrative aspects, along with a lot of JRPGs, and the gameplay is pretty shallow once you get past its novelty. Once you've got your fill of alternate endings, there's really no reason to go back to it -- and replaying is nowhere near as fun when you know all the boss gimmicks.

For me, a great game should have gameplay with a high ceiling that makes you want to keep coming back to it, discover new things, and get better in process. Most JRPGs are terrible at this, unless you sperg out with game-breaking shit.

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>>3811919
>Non grid based movement
Means nothing to me, it also means little on the actual gameplay side, especially since the sprites' frame make it look like you're rollerskating around.
>Features combat sprites that aren't flat drawings
I don't see how this is a good or a bad thing, Rudra no Hihou has way better sprites in any case and there's many other games, like Dark Law, that have sprites like you want, and most importantly, enemy variety, which CT sorely lacks.
>Indepth combat system
Stopped reading there, CT has the same depth as your average FF or DQ, if you want actual depth in SNES RPGs you play SaGa games, not CT.
>Multiple characters to choose from to fill your party
It's literally the same size as an average JRPG from the time, FF6 had more characters, with more development too, and both pale in comparison to any SaGa game from the time or even certain DQ.
>and only let you have 4-5 characters total in the game
I'm going to ask you to provide examples of this because it's total bullshit.
>Actual replay value from NG+
There's no replay value whatsoever aside getting checkpoint endings, you can't customize any of the characters, you don't have any agency over the world either so you can't even choose an alternate route or something, you only can slog through the same exact game and decide to end it at some checkpoint for some endings, most of which are joke endings, the only meaningful decision you can make is to kill magus, not worth playing the same game all over again when I can just save in a separate file and start again from there.
>side quests
There's like, five sidequests in the whole game.
>Great UI
I think the UI is terrible, but to each his own, it's a non issue anyway.
> it never felt rushed or incomplete
Are you seriously telling me Zeal isn't incomplete and rushed?
>or linear
The game is literally linear.
>CT lets you find which characters you like on the fly.
This doesn't make any sense and I hope you realize this.

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>>3811941
>>and only let you have 4-5 characters total in the game

Earthbound (4 total)
Glory of Heracles 3 (5 total)

The rest of your post is total nonsense with no context for SNES JRPGs and how they evolved from NES JRPGs (or didn't, in the case of FF6)

>>3811943
So two games are supposed to be an outlines for a whole library?
How about:
SMTI/II/IF
Romancing SaGa Trilogy
Mystic Ark
Bahamut Lagoon
BoFII
Just to name a few.
>with no context for SNES JRPGs
What context? I've pointed out simple facts and made examples too.
>and how they evolved from NES JRPGs
What is this even supposed to mean?
>or didn't, in the case of FF6
As much as it is shallow FFVI has much more mechanics and advanced design decisions than the vast majority of NES JRPGs, not that it matters since FF as a whole wasn't meant to be a pioneer series or anything like that, if you want to look at unusual or groundbreaking games you sure as hell don't look at either CT or FF.

NES games already had multiple endings and a lot of other things, and I don't see what that has anything to do with the main point, CT being one of the supposedly the best JRPG for the SNES.

>>3807067
Top 5 16-bit games

>>3811919
>+Features combat sprites that aren't flat drawings (This disqualifies FF6 because CT has characters that react to hits and multiple angles)
You just dismissed the BoF games when BoF2 has gorgeous sprite work and even more dynamic states for battle sprites than CT does.

>+Actual replay value from NG+, side quests, to making decisions that alter endings and the game itself like killing Magus
CT boasts multiple endings that it really doesn't have. The majority of them are gags and your actions are much less impactful than people love to imply. The forest and Lucca's mother are the only points in the game where I felt like I did something.

>+Multiple characters to choose from to fill your party (JRPGs would usually write themselves into a corner and only let you have 4-5 characters total in the game, but CT wrote a story that allowed for multiple characters join up)
Like I said before, you're just making it look like you haven't played anything but the usual titles.

Anyway, the majority of your post is filled with arbitrary points that really don't matter.

>>3807067
Indeed it is but the DS version. retro or not is the definitive experience

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>>3811735
Don't like it? Fine, swap in a normal top Dreamcast games list on top of this here and we're set.

>>3807067
>Prove me wrong.

It's an RPG.

>>3811319
>are brains do function.

>>3807476
>super metroid was groundbreaking in storytelling
>it made you feel like an adventurer

You're a fucking retard

>>3812917
Not him, and I don't believe Metroid was groundbreaking in its story-telling but it's certainly one of the most atmospheric, "adventure on your own" games on the SNES.

>>3807067

I can't disprove what's correct. I'd say top 3.

>>3807476

> muh innovashun.

Replay value is the only thing that should define greatest game.

>>3811941
>Rudra no Hihou has way better sprites in any case

Square was getting fucking scary-good at pixel art at the end of the era.

>>3811881
I agree with 6 but skyrim? Really, nigga?

>>3807067
>This is literally in the top 5 of best video games of all time.
As long as you agree FF6 is better

>>3807067
I found myself lately changing often my personal top 5.
This and S3&K are the only ones still enduring since their first playthrough.

>>3814820
second half of the game isn't very good imo

>>3807476
It's still got higher production values than many other RPGs of its time.

Forget about CT. Those 30 translated snes jrpg won't play themselves.

Can we get some kind of containment board for JRPG shit and the weeaboo youtube children that hype them please?

>>3812882
it was late when I posted that.

Yall are fucking stupid ass faggot mother fuckers just saying so go play ur games u noobs

>>3807476
The greatest game of all time is Tetris hands down. It's fucking timeless.


And suikoden ii

>>3807070
omg use spoilers please. My eyes are hurting.


Top 5 also needs Ocarina of time.

>>3815345

OoT sucks.

>>3807070
FF6 > FF7

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Cross was better tho

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>>3807067
>a 15 hour JRPG with zero player agency and skill required
>one of the best video games of all time