Hey, /vr/. Legend of Mana is one of my favorite games ever,

well dude you're asking /vr/, this boards only call in life is bragging about their 1cc in some obscure japanese arcade board no one heard about. of course they will shit on your thread

>>2799503
The game's still piss easy even at the highest difficulty setting, mostly because as per the tradition of the series the combat system is a goddamn clunky mess and whoever designed it and thought it was good should seriously reconsider his whole life.

Everything else is top tier though, immortal graphics that could only be rivalled by SaGa Frontier 2, great score, good writing, it is even non linear.

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>>2799527
It's not so much that it's just really easy. The programming is messed so that even on Nightmare mode where everything is level 99 and extra buffed, it doesn't apply to bosses.

The combat does kind of suck because you're stuck to just facing left and right, but it doesn't ruin the game and pic related is a good example that a game doesn't have to be hard to be fun.

>>2799537
The problem with Legend is that you're given tons of stuff on your side between different techs, forging and strenghtening that having such non existent difficulty really kills it.

I do agree that a game doesn't necessarily needs to be difficult to be good, but Legend of Mana, and all the other Mana games really, is obnoxiously easy, why even bother giving us that great Golem creation system and pet monsters if there's no reason to use any of that?
If they bothered making a good combat system they wouldn't even need to have difficulty settings.

>>2799546
I agree completely. And I think Legend is definitely the weakest of the retro era SD games because of it's even clunkier combat and screwed up difficulty. But despite all that I quite liked it and would recommend it.

I really liked Secret of Mana and SD3 as well though. They are easy, but more akin to Kirby for me where that's not why I play them. Secret of Mana especially I the the weapon charging system is a lot of fun.

Difficulty settings was a good idea for the game though as it would theoretically have given an easier experience for people who wanted that and a good challenge for others. It just doesn't work very well.

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>visit junkyard
>it's full of traumatized toys

>>2799503
>flawed story
maybe you're just retarded? the story is perfect.

>>2799718
This game had some of the most touching little stories of almost anything I've played. Really surprised me.

am I the only one that leaves the kids at home and brings my little crab pet on the road with me?
they are so cute

>>2799739
99 luck maxed out defense polter box actually

>>2799742
Whoa.. I didnt know you could get one of those as a pet!

>>2799503
Awful game. Just awful. Why they had little icons to place I'll never know. There's a story? No one cares. WHERES THANATOS

>>2799761
>Why they had little icons to place I'll never know.

It must not feel great to be that stupid.

I was wonderinh if i should play this after finishing SD 2 and 3
Now I know I should go for the GBA one instead

>>2799786
GBA game sucks shit, if you're going to play SD1 play the GB original. Despite it's problems, every Mana game after Legend is far worse.

>>2799503
Absolutely loved the story presentation.
The battle system was boring because of the magic and skill invincible wind up bullshit.

>>2799503
>US gets a tiny instruction booklet
>Japan gets one far bigger that actually talks about mechanics more.

God damn. There's still things we don't know about crafting in this game.

>>2799786
No, play this one. GBA is a shitty remake of the first.

>>2799818
What in crafting hasn't been figured out? I played it around when it was released and even way back then crafting seemed pretty figured out. It is quite complex and I'm sure people have found ways of exploiting it even more and still doing multiple playthroughs just to collect forging items.

But even still, the bigger problem is that the game can't throw anything at you that can match up to even moderately forged items.

I made a flail that didn't even get any crazy forging done on it, but still killed every boss in Nightmare mode in 1-2 hits.

The problem with LoM is that is uses 4-directional combat like a beatem up but doesn't really handle it well. All the nuance is in your stats, and those are piss easy to grind up.

>>2799836
The control scheme in the first three games worked so much better. I have no idea why they stuck you only facing left and right, it's one of the worst things about it.

This is the last good Mana title. I don't know why, but the thunder simply never struck again after LoM.

>>2799546
I think it's sort of a side activity so that those who didn't want to do it doesn't have to.
For me making golems was fun, but I don't care much about the pets or seeds. And I didn't do it out of necessity for the game or to make it trivial, just having simple fun making golems.

I want to have sex with that unicorn wolf chick

Also the music in this game is out of this world.

Square had just un-fucking-believably good music during the SNES/PSX years.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBKqX3txZt4

>>2799748
They're one of the most useful pets since their synchro increases the chance of dropping rare items (i.e. super rare materials that are near impossible to get on purpose otherwise)

I think the other pets I used were the Chobin Hood, Succubus, and the first Rabite

>24 posts
>15 replies
Pretty sure most of these posts is the same guy always complaining about the battle system being 4-directional instead of 8-directional, the difficultly and how much more he just loves the other Mana games.

Every time.

>>2799761
You fight Thanatos in the Bone Dragon's lair when you have a SaGa Frontier II data on your memory card.

>>2799825
Crafting has been cracked actually.

Actually it was pretty much finished when I accidentally figured out how to reach the 15th essence level. Everyone was pretty disappointed that some random showed up and lucked out on the method.

>>2799841
Because the Killer Moves only have one animation that's flipped for left and right. Facing vertically would necessitate another animation for each KM

>>2800660
Any SaGa Frontier II data, or endgame? I only ask because the answer determines which game I play first.

>>2800878
any iirc

>>2800891
Nice. Thank you.

>>2800671
So what? It's not like that couldn't have been designed differently from the start. It feels so jarring in that game when it switches to combat and all the sudden you're stuck playing a weird little mini brawler. In the other games combat is so smoothly integrated into everything, it just worked a lot better.

>>2800664
That's pretty cool. Remembering the crazy shit you could do with crafting back when I was playing, I imagine it's even more so now.

>>2801330
Literally no one cares about the 4-direction thing but you, autist-san.

More dope music:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BMKovBcgr1o

>>2801557
Maybe not in this thread, but when the game came out that was one of the biggest flaws people were talking about because it's just such a strange and bad decision.

The only other major problem with the game is the difficulty settings not working, but as I understand it that's a glitch.

>>2801661
>but when the game came out that was one of the biggest flaws people were talking about because it's just such a strange and bad decision.

>things that never happened

>>2801667
It's not like I'm trying to tell you not to enjoy the game. But pretending the combat system in LoM wasn't a huge disappointment to fans of the series when it came out is laughable.

>>2799503
>Does difficulty matter?

Only in games where it matters. Platformers or RPGs can get away with being easy as fuck.

>>2801672
actually most of the complaining was about the non-linearity and people not understanding the scenario system

people loved the graphics, gameplay, and music

>>2801672
>I'm going to keep making up things that never happened

>>2801724
I don't know why you keep saying that, if LoM was one of your first games or you were just too young when it came out but that was the reaction. It just was. Clamping your hands over your ears and yelling "never happened" doesn't change that.

>>2801719
Only stupid people and those who had just gotten into RPGs with the PS1 wave of them got turned off by the non-linear aspect.

Legend of Mana wasn't super popular and didn't become a real classic. And yet, story, graphics and music are all absolutely stellar.

The one issue the game has is that it's combat is clunky and kind of sucks. If it controlled as well as Seiken 2 and 3 it would most certainly have been better received and remembered. As is it's still a good game, just a flawed one.

>>2801741
>I'm going to assert this opinion of mine as a fact that happened when this game was released
>but I won't provide any proof to actually back up my extremely vague and unrealistic claim
Btw the battle systems in SD2/3 blow.

>>2801749
You're the one that is starting to sound autistic t.b.h

not even him btw

>>2801750
Classic response to being called out on unsubstantiated claims being asserted as fact.

>>2801749
Okay.

Both OPM and EGM criticized the combat system in their reviews of the game. You can also go to here to gamefaqs and read a host of mixed reviews for it both new and old.

>In before OPM, EGM, Gamefaqs all shitty sources.

Sorry dude, but as much as you love the game it's praise was nowhere near as universal as you seem to think it was. I even really like LoM, but the combat is by far the worst part of it and there's no good reason that it's so bad.

>>2801753
classic autist that doesn't know when to shut up

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This thread has too much autism and not enough catgrills with nunchucks.

>>2801757
Forgot the gamefaqs link, not like you're going to click on it anyways.
http://www.gamefaqs.com/ps/256525-legend-of-mana/reviews

>>2801760
I believe those were called flails in game so the game didn't have to be altered for Britain.

>>2801770

Okay, what the fuck is with Britain and martial arts weapons? This isn't the first time I've heard bullshit like this having to be done.

>>2801780
It's specifically ninchucks. They got weirdly popular with street punks in the 70's and it became such a problem that they didn't just ban the weapons themselves, they banned movies and games that even had them in it. It's pretty fucked up, but Britain in the 70's was a pretty fucked up place.

>>2801757
>>2801764
>Both OPM and EGM criticized the combat system in their reviews of the game
>post link to literal who gamefaq forum members reviews

>>2801787

But Shadow Warrior had to replace the throwing stars with darts and then offer a patch for the Brits to reverse that change, if I recall correctly. So it doesn't seem to just be nunchuks.

>>2801789
I mentioned two major game reviews magazines as "official" opinions. The gamefaqs link is there to show you that out of a lot of people who played the game, many didn't like the combat system and mark it as one of the game's flaws.

This is all in response to you claiming that reviewers and Seiken fans being disappointed with the combat system "never happened" Here, >>2801724 and here >>2801667

It most certainly did happen, and there's the proof you were whining I didn't provide you with. If you were over the age of 10 when it came out I wouldn't have had to explain any of that since you would just plain remember it, but apparently that's not the case.
Now stop worrying about other people not liking the game as much as you and just go enjoy it.

>>2801804
>make ridiculous claim about how 4-directional combat ruined LoM's reputation when it was released
>get called out
>suddenly change argument to just "combat" in general even though that wasn't even the initial point
>still can't substantiate claims of reviewers panning the game's combat system when it was released despite trying to change argument to cover blunder
>trying to use link to gamefaq's fan board reviews as proof for your claim, despite it not having anything to do with official reviews or even been temporally correct
>still try to assert your bullshit fantasy as fact despite being called out
You've literally got nothing, retard. Don't be surprised when people tell you to back up your claims with proof. It's called logic.

>>2801817
>>2801789

Literally autism

>>2801818

Literally shitposting

The 2D combat in this game is shit, this game is shit.

>>2801817
The lack of directional movement in combat is what made it bad. I didn't think I needed to keep mentioning "4-directional" over and over again. I've been talking about the exact same thing this whole time.

You claimed no one had a problem with it which was ridiculous so I gave you examples. You haven't called anything out. You're flat wrong and now denying that what's right in front of you doesn't exist.

I mentioned why I didn't think it should have been necessary, and I think I was right. You were at absolute most 15 when the game came out. You were not a previous fan of the series and you were not paying attention to game reviews at the time.

I don't know why you're so invested in believing that Legend of Mana had a perfect reception and everyone loved the combat, but it's ridiculous and you are completely wrong. That's all there is to it.

>>2801830

>That's all there is to it.

His autism will keep conjuring arguments out of fucking thin air for the remainder of the thread duration.

You do realize this?

>>2801840
Ohh yeah, but that's what's starting to make it funny.

>>2801830
>You claimed no one had a problem with it
Nope. I told you to actually put forth proof of reviewers panning the game's combat system when it was released. You never did. That's all there is to it.

>>2801840
>>2801843
>hurr autism autism autism autism
Ironically, autists are the ones who repeat meaningless phrases over and over.

>inb4 your next mad reply where you don't back up your claims again
Have fun

>>2801871
You are now attempting to re-write the history of this thread. Let's follow it, shall we?

You say here >>2801557 that no one except me cared about the combat being bad. I point out here >>2801661 that although there may not be many people in this thread who feel that way, it was definitely one of the flaws people talked about when it came out.

Then you respond here >>2801667 and here >>2801724 with no actual information or a real response, but simply repeating that it "never happened"

You then point out here >>2801749 that I hadn't given you proof. I didn't think I needed to give you proof as anyone old enough to have been invested in JRPGs when it came out would have been fully aware.

However, despite that I still went ahead and gave you the proof you asked for. In the form of both formal reviews that were published in gaming magazines where the games lackluster combat was mentioned as being one of it's flaws. I also provided you with links to player reviews on Gamefaqs where you could read the mixed reviews people gave it back when it was released.

Again, none of this should have had to be pointed out to you if you were actually aware of the game's reception. But I have provided you with plenty of evidence detailing exactly what I'm explaining to you.

You can choose to stick your head in the sand if you want, but that doesn't change reality.

>autists raging at other autists with their autism in order to determine who is the most autistic

Shut up and listen to music.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HeLyxYUeGBY

>>2801929
>it was definitely one of the flaws people talked about when it came out.
Which you haven't proven.
>I didn't think I needed to give you proof as anyone old enough to have been invested in JRPGs when it came out would have been fully aware
Wow, that's rich. Way to try and dodge burden of proof.
>However, despite that I still went ahead and gave you the proof you asked for
You didn't. Where's those official reviews from 2000?
>where the games lackluster combat was mentioned as being one of it's flaws
Which still wouldn't even address your claim of the 4-direction aspect being a highly criticized element which is the point of contention in the first place.
>I have provided you with plenty of evidence detailing exactly what I'm explaining to you.
You haven't provided a single thing but shitposts.

>Status: blown out

>>2799503
>So, the question is:
>Does difficulty matter?

Way to light the fuse of a powder keg.

I think the better question is: Do you like it? If yes, good, if no, whatever. I don't even think it's worth getting in this rhetoric-laden argument that always leads to endless comparisons and superlatives.

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>>2800624
>For me making golems was fun

I thought the game was alright. Where I didn't care for it was the New Game + and the Nightmare Mode.

Part of the problem, for me, is that it's fairly easy to sustain a combo if you only do a couple of hits and space out your timing so those two hits can keep going in a loop. That way you don't blow your stamina all out at once.

Nightmare mode's one big problem for me was the lifebars. It wasn't so much about smarter AI (I can forgive that, since AI is hard), but about jacking the enemy stats. Specifically, health. I wouldn't mind enemies having more health, but it really sucked when it came time for bosses.

So you go to fight this boss and it has maybe...30 bars of health. For about...24 of those, you're going to see alternating colors of blue and green (or something like that, can't quite remember). You've got no clue as to how close or far you are from killing the boss. You're just endlessly peeling layers off of an onion. Over and over. It felt as if Nightmare mode was an addon at the last minute, and not something planned out. Give me a lifebar counter! Tell me how many more! It makes the combat feel endless, instead of challenging.

Some of the stages had a lot of room. The fight with Sierra and her dragon springs to mind. But others, like that super dragon (forgot the name, sorry) were just "here is a line of space".

In Nightmare Mode, special abilities were less about dealing damage, and (to me) more about avoiding insane enemy damage.

Monster AI seemed to be retarded. I flat gave up recruiting monsters because they would just wander around the battlefield with no clue as to what to do.

Nightmare Mode also made regular encounters into an FFT-long slugfest of hitting and hitting.

For a single playthrough the first time? Yeah, it was pretty neat and challenging. Just...don't rely on Nightmare mode.

I just picked this game up again a bit ago and I'm not sure how I feel about it.

I booted it up and the attract mode video started and I was slammed by nostalgia. That feeling lasted for an hour or so through my playing, carried mostly by the art and music, and I kept asking myself why I ever dropped it.

But as I continued, I remembered. The combat isn't very good, and the battle levels are incredibly repetitive. The art looks different, but both levels and enemies are basically the same exact thing with a new coat of paint, and the game never really feels challenging.

That said, there's a ton of rabbit holes you can go down, and the mechanics involved with all the side stuff is insane. It offers a lot of customization and many ways to be stupidly overpowered.

I've heard this game was rushed to completion, and I believe it. It's fun and promising, but it could have been so much more. That said, I'm still playing it.

>>2802609
>>2802635
>pretending this hard

>>2802598
This was the most brilliant thing ever. Why weren't there more games that use this kind of customization system where you can do much more than simply choosing a few things. To be fair the execution in the game is rather meh, but the idea is great.

I'm also fine with the switch to beat-em up combat, though. Never thought either is better but they are different and I like both. But then again I don't hate Zelda II, so eh.

>>2799503
you're in /vr/, liking anything that's not "nintendo difficult" makes you a pleb

>>2802654
Pretending what? Please elaborate.

>>2802149
Whatever, kid. Believe whatever you want, but to me this is like trying to describe to an 11 year old that the Star Wars prequels had a poor reception and him repeatedly just yelling "NEVER HAPPENED!"

I like Legend of Mana more than most people, but even I have to admit it's a deeply flawed game and the combat in it is the worst part.

>>2802609
> I wouldn't mind enemies having more health, but it really sucked when it came time for bosses.

This is really strange to me. I'll admit it's been a long time since I played it, but my memory of the big problem with Nightmare mode was that the bosses were glitched and didn't scale so they all actually had less HP than they should have. There's a chance that was a rumor all along though.

At any rate, I got way into the crafting system in my first play through and made a flail that wasn't even close to being maxed out in power compared to ones other people were making and it absolutely destroyed Nightmare mode. Most enemies died quite quickly and bosses especially the final one, Mana Goddess Nightmare mode died in two hits. Two hits.

But that kind of shows part of how broken the whole thing is. The crafting system is so complex and with so much possibility you can make insane weapons. My flail wasn't even half as powerful as some people's on the forums at the time, but was still magnitudes more powerful than an unforged one and much too strong for anything the game could throw at me.

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>wisdoms
>hurr destroy the world, I'll still pray for you
>hurr it's wrong to deny a rapist his freedom

>>2801770
They could have kept the nunchuks, as the game wasn't released in Europe anyway.