I want my dungeons back. They were established as a staple since

>>33180476
>pictures from gen V in both

>>33180496
Unova has nice dungeons.

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>>33180496
It has my favorite Victory Road

>Pokemon games
>good dungeons
Can't have both.

>>33180612
I'd rather take bad or basic dungeons over a bad and intrusive plot anytime.

>>33180612
Nah Pokemon had good dungeons, not the best but they did the job.

>>33180476
I want more complex sea routes.
>t-too much water h-haha!!
Fuck you stupid faggots. We get a Hawaiian region with absolutely garbage sea routes and no dive because of that.

>>33180674
They just need to drop the random encounter system and make DexNav the only way to find wild Pokemon (with some tweaks) and people wouldn't cry so much about water routes.

>>33180687
no the random encounter system is fine, more variety in the Pokemon found in the water routes as well as more points of interest/distinct geography to avoid getting lost

eh I agree
a narrative is nice but a good journey is better

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>>33180476
It's almost as if people can think outside of retarded generalizations

>>33180741
meant to reply to >>33180496

>>33180496
Gen V was the transition between the golden age and dark age of Pokemon.

>>33180757
not really, B2/W2 are top 3

it was an abrupt shift with gen 6, there was no transition period

>>33180757
It's true. It had a lot of polarizing ideas and could have taken the franchise in any number of directions. Unfortunately, they picked most of the bad ones to build future games on.

>>33180772
BW2 is overrated as fuck, the maingame is garbage, and a lot of the new features are either poorly implemented or flat-out bad. Of course, people will excuse this for having a bloated dex (conveniently a con for XY and SM) and muh postgame, a tower with nostalgiafagging and Mt. Battle from Colosseum if Mt. Battle showed up too late to be of any use.
If anything, BW1 were better games than their sequels, wven if they suffer from linearity issues and other stuff, they were overall much more ambitious.

>>33180838
All I see in this post are buzzwords and no argumentation

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This is why we need the Battle Pyramid back, and to a lesser extent the Battle Pike

It's like Mystery Dungeon built into the main game itself
I'd be ok as long long as we get atleast one area like it, a huge randomly generated dungeon that can keep the exploration factor going forever

Pyamid King Brandon and Pike Queen Lucy got mentioned by name in ORAS so hopefully that was a hint that they'll atleast be back like Anabel was

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>>33180838
You're right, but prepare for a shitstorm of gen v fanboys.

>>33180496
She's talking about aspects of a game. Not everything is a binary
>HURR THIS GEN IS SHIT/GOAT

>>33180869
>buzzwords
Fine then, faggot, I guess I have to explain things for you. The PWT is literally just the Battle Tower/Factory with sprites of old trainers yet this place considers it the holy grail of postgame content. The dex bloat comes from expanding BW's all new dex to a dex that has 300 Pokemon, and route encounters are messy as hell now. By garbage maingame, I mean that it's about the same as the games /vp/ likes to shit on. Neo-Plasma's as uninspired as ever, the old locations of Unova aren't all that special, outside of the desert route which got a redesign in appearance but is overall mostly a straight line, and there's not enough of new, good locations to make up for it. Plenty of multi-battle spots and doctor/nurse NPCs (also in BW1) where you get healed instantaneously, but people always seem to ignore this, too. Rival Hugh is a one-note character, only fueled by his sister's stolen Pokemon. He shows up as much as Blue does but is as bland as Shauna.
Memory Link is just cutscenes for the most part, battling Bianca/Cheren/N is something that's normally a standard, like HGSS rematches and SM's one-time rematches.

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>>33180838
>BW 2 are overrated
Stopped reading right there
BW2 are the definition of perfection

>>33180954
We're talking about B2/W2 here, if I take B/W out of the equation you barely have anything left

>>33180988
>PWT
>BW2 Dex
>Unova region was hardly improved in 2
>multi-battle spots acting as free heals throughout the whole location
>doctors and nurses (the only thing that also applies to 1)
>Hugh
>Memory Link
Where the fuck did you get BW1 from?

>>33180476
OP is a faggot.

>>33180838
>muh postgame

bet you're the same cocksucker who was ok with battle frontier being removed in OR/AS

>>33181010
Okay...
>PWT
It's perfectly fine
>BW2 Dex
What's the issue?
>Unova region was hardly improved in 2
What's wrong with it?
>multi-battle spots acting as free heals throughout the whole location
What's the problem?
>doctors and nurses (the only thing that also applies to 1)
What's the problem?
>Hugh
I can understand that some people didn't like it, fair enough
>Memory Link
It's just a bonus, there's nothing wrong with it

>>33181035
I'm not, and ORAS sucks for not including any of the obvious advantages to the general game that Emerald included. Postgamefags are pathetic though, for disregarding every other flaw in their game just to fight a mindless AI

>>33181062
I listed almost everything wrong/overrated about them in the last post >>33180954
Can you not read? But to elaborate on the problem with multibattle areas and doctors, people complain about the newer games for including NPCs that constantly heal you, whether it be faceless NPCs or major characters. However, this sort of shit happens in BW2 too.

>>33181080
>people complain about the newer games for including NPCs that constantly heal you
Doctors in B/W/B2/W2 only appear in the middle of huge sections to balance the game
>PWT
Again, the PWT is perfectly fine
>BW2 Dex
You did not explain how it was bad thing
>Unova region was hardly improved in 2
Again, you did not explain how it was bad thing

>>33181127
>Doctors in B/W/B2/W2 only appear in the middle of huge sections to balance the game
So just like the NPCs in XY and SM that show up in the ice cave and Vast Poni?
I've already explained how the PWT is overrated, as it is essentially just the Tower and Factory with past characters, and little more. I've also explained why the BW2 dex is worse than BW1's, it's bloated and turns every single area into a clusterfuck and a checklist rather than actually making them work out as wildlife. This problem also exists in XY and SM, but people conveniently ignore how this is also an issue in BW2.
Unova was not improved in 2, and this is also a flaw of BW1 Unova being poor. The region layout is extremely bland for the most part, outside of the few locations BW2 did add, the route after Skyla's gym, and the route after Brycen's (inaccessible before the postgame this time around).
Keep saying I haven't explained shit, because I have been.

>>33181160
>doctors
Haven't played XYSM so I can't tell. I still don't see how it's an issue
>PWT
PWT is good. It's not supposed to be a battle tower/factory, it's supposed to be a tournament.
>BW2 Dex
>More pokémons is bad
how?
>people conveniently ignore how this is also an issue in BW2
Maybe because they aren't the same people?
>Region
While I agree that Unova didn't have a whole lot of exploration, it's not like it was a shining point with other Gens.

>>33181160
Lillie, Hau, and Kukui show up on every island as random healbots, not just Poni. It's not even after long dungeons either (because there are none in Alola). They just show up constantly to give you meaningless regurgitated dialogue with an "hey your Pokemon did great! Let's heal em up" tacked on somewhere. Just about every story battle you get healed before and/or after. They show up so much there's almost no reason for Pokemon Centers or potions. It's a total joke that trivializes an already piss easy game.

>>33181160
More Pokemon would be a good thing, had it been handled better. Platinum has a Pokedex of 200+, and Johto has almost all Pokemon from Gens 1 and 2, and all of the Pokemon in those regions are distributed in such a way where it doesn't become a mess. BW2 added 150 more Pokemon onto BW's 150 dex, essentially doubling the size on a region that already has every mon there placed, along with some non-natives in BW1's postgame. Because of this, you have all sorts of old mons and new mons dighting for encounter slots, and the bland mons that get shoved into every other gen, like Marill, Zubat, and Psyduck also show their faces a lot here too, more than BW1 did.
PWT has a different skin, but overall, the entire gameplay is the same. Level 50s fight against each other in a limited battle. It's functionally identical to Subway, but that at least has the bonus of having a streak and teams that constantly change and act unique. In the case of PWT, it's nothing but a nostalgiawank, and you'll always end up fighting the same teams in this Level 50 environment. It's also a piss-poor way to handle rematches due to the luck-based nature and being forced to only do 3v3s for singles; Emerald, Platinum, and HGSS all have proper rematch mechanics and teams.

>>33181263
You say this like the BW2 cast didn't heal you up

>>33181301
I'm not saying NPCs healing you is a new or even bad thing. The issue in SM is how frequent and obnoxious it is.

>>33180496
Because top is cutscenes, bottom is dungeons

>>33181160
>>33180954
I've been posting these points on here for years, but gen 5 fanboys always deflected or replied with b8 meme images.
They're so blind.
Gen 5 starting the 3 pokemon max gym leader teams and 4 for elite 4 teams always got a pass, but gens 6 and 7 are the devil for some reason.

all gens have their pros and cons. Some prefer gern x over gen y and some call garbage on gen z, but the fact is all of you enjoyed, in one way or another, all gens.

>>33180476
Me too. I love pokemon caves/dungeons/icy paths etc

Lots of fun puzzles and secret areas

>>33181301
Real talk.

You will never convince autistic unova babies tho.

I personally think bw2 and bw are both trash aesthetically. I don't play them at all and like to forget they exist.

>>33181392
Maybe because b/w2 had not only replay value, but also endgame content that was more than "catch 'em all lmao".

S/M are obviously the worst games in the whole series, no need to beat a dead horse here.
X/Y had massive balancing issues and no endgame.

Im not talking about ORAS, because im too biased.

>>33181955
oras is still my favorite remake mainly for nostalgia
So I guess I'm kinda biased in that page as well

>>33181062
You talk about him having no argument and then you can't even refute his points with anything other than shitty little baseless "n-n-no you're wrong" posts.
You are the definition of a gen 5 faggot that is blinded by nostalgia, and you've been blown the fuck out by that other guy.
Be grateful this is an anonymous imageboard because you wouldn't be able to show your face around anywhere else after giving such a pitiful reply.

Don't talk shit about peoples criticism if you don't even know how the fuck to debate somebody you stupid cunt.

>>33180476
The Shady House and Po Town are a dungeon.

The Island Trials are dungeons.

>>33180889
>Brandon got mentioned by name

When? I know you can find a Delinquent that's implied to be an AU Lucy inside the Battle Maison, but who mentions Brandon in ORAS?

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>>33180838
This guy gets it. Get worked, BW2 babbies.

>>33180902
>she

>>33180687
Buy a repel.

>>33180476
> Narrative has no place here.
It does, you can have both. Just because a game for kids who literally just learned to read is too much for you doesn't mean it has no place, it means you have to go back to elementary.

>>33180902
> Not everything is a binary
Its literally what the post and pic impliex.

>>33180969
Did you mean HGSS?

>>33180838
>>33180954
I think a lot of people liked BW2 because of join avenue. It's the only reason I ever bothered booting up the game after completing it. I'm not sure what you were saying about the dex since I don't really have any trouble catching all pokemon in any of the games

>>33180838
A bloated dex isnt a con for SM, it just has poor distribution like HGSS

>>33181982
I wasn't trying to argue that B2/W2 was good, I was trying to cut through anon's (most likely you) bullshit. I can't refute arguments when they have no substance.

Just saying but you seem to take this way too personally. Chill god damnit, we're all here because we like the same thing. Is debating calmly without attacking the other guy more than discussing an opinion such a difficult thing to do nowadays?

>>33180838
>>33180954
THIS

I have seen a lot of things hyped up and praised by fandoms like they are 10/10 masterpieces while they shit on other good things for the same reasons they love the "masterpiece" and will flat out not mention obvious glaring flaws while posting ebin reaction images

It has happened so many times I don't even understand why I am part of a fandom, especially on 4chan.

>>33180969
You misspelt HGSS

>>33180838
You're wrong about PWT, it's worse than simply a Tower with cameos due to the way it tackles the tournament formula. Dome at least had the whole "only go in with some of your Pokemon each round and choose them to counter what you know your individual opponent has" to give it something, but as the PWT is it's pretty garbage, and greatly inferior to if BW2 had got a good new Frontier. None of its special modes add enough to match up to even a single Emerald facility, with Swap coming the closest to being anything decent. One of the two worst examples of "nostalgia pandering" in the series because it actually held gameplay aspects back.

I disagree otherwise, though. Most of its other new features work out and the new and changed areas bring it far above BW1. There's nothing wrong with a big regional dex either, as much as people complain about it in the recent games because how most people who hate them are just caught up in the "popular" opinion instead of thinking for themselves if and why they liked or hated it.

I like BW2 a lot, but its fans are some of the most obnoxious cunts ever. I'm still annoyed at how you can't get Challenge Mode unless you either cheat, or have another copy of Black 2 and transfer the mode over to your game. You can't even theoretically beat the game, transfer hard mode to a friend, reset, and get your hard mode back. The game only lets you send keys you unlocked yourself, so it's near impossible to do a replay run of BW2 in hard mode on the same cart.
It wasn't worth all the trouble, either.

>>33183135
I don't even agree with half those points, but how are they substanceless? He explained in numerous posts why certain features are overrated or are conveniently not flaws to BW2 fans when the same people dislike it in other games, and your counterpoints are just "that's not a problem" without anything to back up why you feel that way. If you think he was wrong and are going to call him out on being wrong, then you need to explain why you think those points have no value. Saying "those are fine though" doesn't prove anything.
And don't to take the moral high ground to worm your way out of things. People are clearly annoyed because every single one of your counterpoints has no substance whatsoever, yet you're willing to call everything thrown your way baseless.

>>33182551
Join Avenue was great. Even without Wi-Fi you could still easily level up your personal shopping mall by talking to gym leaders, and it made use of ingame cash in the postgame, where you normally didn't need to buy much.
That's something Festival Plaza did wrong, having currency that's only tied to that place, having the only reasonable way to get said currency be from online missions, which could die off after the next gens, version exclusive shops, and replacing the PSS, which, while not perfect, was a much better online system and the best one the series had so far, makes it feel messy overall.

>the dungeons weren't that good before
>so it's okay that SM made them nonexistent

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
HAHAHAHAHA
HAH

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HA

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHA
HAHA

>>33180757
Gen III was the transition. By then most of the people who made the originals were gone.

They've been of descending quality since then as each game simplifies and removes aspects of the previous. V was no exception. Victory Road was the only thing even close to a dungeon in it.

>>33184323
>Gen IV
>simplified

That was the height of creativity and depth in the series. Don't even try to dispute it.

Gen V has the worst fanbase and this thread proves it

>>33184540
I think Gen IV and V both have the worst fanbase, but for entirely different reasons.

>>33184546
what are the reasons?

>>33184526
Gen IV is the least notable generation. There's just so little to say about it because it brought so few interesting new things to the table, but it's inoffensive too because it didn't really do anything wrong.

>>33184578
It brought the phys/special split and that's about as good of an addition as anyone could have asked for.
>inoffensive too because it didn't really do anything wrong
except DP were two of the most offensively bad pokemon games

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>>33184221
I said they had no substance because he didn't explain the issues in too much detail.
But after re-reading all of this I realized that anon wasn't trying to say that said things were bad but he was referring to people saying that stuff like PWT were groundbreaking features that are way better than they actually are.

Fuck, now all of this looks silly. Sorry for the misunderstanding.
teehee

>>33184601
It didn't add much but the fe things it did were very important to the series like the phys/special split, online play and touch screen menus

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>>33184540
>>33184546
The only worst "fanbase" are the people who shit on entire generations wholesale. The Pokemon games all share enough features between them that a handful of new or expanded ideas pretty much define the gen. Gen V is my favorite for the aesthetic, characters, and new Pokemon, but I feel like Gen IV (Platinum at least,) did the best in terms of features. All of the games are piss-easy, so difficulty is hardly even an issue to be raised unless you're talking about the game's appeal to young children.

Gen VII was the first gen I've ever been abjectly disappointed with. Everything about it felt hollow and rushed, like the game wasn't quite finished yet (and it very well might not have been.)

Why does everything have to be "dogshit" or "masterpiece"?

>>33184669
Because this place is full of retarded children who can't think for themselves and parrot whatever shit they think will give them the most attention. It's the reason this board, and site as a whole, are becoming shittier by the day.

>>33181246
>Haven't played XYSM so I can't tell
>hasnt played the past 2 gens

What are you even doing here then?

>>33180838
>>33180954
this is a really long post that can all be boiled down to "I didnt like it."

Which is perfectly valid, but anons will treat it as objective because it BTFO's /vp/'s favourite game

I think Unova's locations are very good (i'd almost say iut's the closest you are to being objectively worng here) and Hugh is one of the best rivals, changing his mindset over time and becoming more open minded, before actually succeeding at his goal, being a good friend and ensuring you are both good enough to take on the next challenge, which was a good excuse for the regular battles.

But carry on with this thread, you have decent points and it's manna for posters like >>33184540

>>33184744
The point was less that the games are shit or that he disliked it, but rather that the features that most people obsess over are either a standard in the other games, or aren't as great as people make it out to be, and that all the negatives that are used to diss on other gens doesn't get brought up in the case of BW2.

>>33184715
Didn't you know? That's your typical gen 5 shitter. The majority of them grew up with gen 5 being their first pokemon game.

>>33184526
>Gen IV
>creativity and depth
That was the worst and slowest generation. Don't even try to dispute it.

>>33184744
>No new IP
>Upset that you got fucking ruined

>I think Unova's locations are very good
Unova is factually one of the worst regions we've ever had. It's literally a circle. It has no places of interest and as a whole is just bland as fuck compared to most other gens. Even fucking Kalos has Unova beaten for fuck sake.

Hugh is also a dull rival. I long for rivals like Blue and Silver again.

When you autistic manchildren stop fighting over Pokemon games? This is even more retarded than /v/'s consolewars.

>>33180838
>Of course, people will excuse this for having a bloated dex (conveniently a con for XY and SM)
XY has a considerably larger Pokédex than BW2, and that combined with the fact that the number of new Pokémon introduced didn't even reach double digits is the reason people see it as a mark against XY but not BW2; the tiny amount of new Pokémon get horribly overshadowed by the massive amount of old ones.
SM also suffers from this issue despite having a smaller Pokédex, but it's mainly because old Pokémon are incredibly common whereas new ones are either difficult to obtain or post-game only.

>>33184236
Dungeons were tedious. If GF couldn't be bothered to fix them then thank god they're gone.

>>33184833
That argument would have been clearer but the comment is bloated with a lot of subjective stuff that isnt really related to that argument. Because I agree. I think Gen V started a lot of the things that suck about later games too, I just think it wasnt as bad then. Nothing is really bad in isolation, it's more about execution. Like the pokedex. SM and BW2 have the same number of mons, but the BW2 dex is much, much better. Better distribution, better makeup of each gen too.

>>33185156
But that was the first time I posted in the thread, at least get your meme replies straight. Again, I know threads like these are your energy because you finally feel like you can vent about Gen V without everyone calling you a shitposter. It's cool.

I know you're a shitter because you actually lump Blue and Silver together, when Blue does nothing and is nothing like Silver.

And the whole thing about Unova is also bait. You packed circle memes and calling the wort region better than it too, good job. I know it's bait but it's funny you say it has no places of interest with a train station, movie studio, join avenue, 5 bridges including an underwater tunnel, the world tournament area in a city filled with hotels, the mysterious black tower in black city, striaton restaurant, the dreamyard, the royal unova, etc. Now prepare your response for how these things dont count

>>33185407
>But that was the first time I posted in the thread
No it wasn't, it's easy to see first time posts you fucking newfag since it shows up right next to the posts in question.

>I know you're a shitter because you actually lump Blue and Silver together, when Blue does nothing and is nothing like Silver.
Looks like you're talking about Hugh there, he's the rival that actually does fuck all. He's more irrelevant than your rival in X&Y.

>And the whole thing about Unova is also bait.
Can't refute it? Call it bait. Pottery.
Try again, princess.

>You packed circle memes and calling the wort region better than it too
Learn to string a coherent sentence together you illiterate piece of shit. I shouldn't have to decipher what the fuck you're talking about. Gen 5 autists really are pathetic.

>train station, movie studio, join avenue, 5 bridges including an underwater tunnel, the world tournament area in a city filled with hotels, the mysterious black tower in black city, striaton restaurant, the dreamyard, the royal unova
You literally listed a bunch of trash areas. None of these are remotely memorable. None of these are remotely solid areas at all.
Fucking kekking so hard now that you think train stations, a movie theater and some hotels are at all good. Are you actively trying to besmirch the game you're so desperately trying to defend?

Go ahead and take another shot you crying cunt, I've got some hours to kill.

>>33185541
>No it wasn't
It's amusing that you can talk so boldly about something you're wrong about. And projecting anger on me is a nice touch.

>Fucking kekking so hard now
you slipped up here, this part was too obvious. Be a bit more subtle next time. If you stick around longer you'll learn

>>33185595
It's amusing that you're such a newfag that you don't even realize that there's literally a feature built in which shows exactly which posts are new IP's coming into the thread.

>you slipped up here, this part was too obvious
Kek
>Gets destroyed and pretends he's somebody else
>Gets called out for pretending he's somebody else
>Drops all of his shitty flawed arguments and cries bait
You're truly the most pathetic cunt I've seen on this board yet.
Run along now sweetie or try to refute my points.

Or try your hardest to get the last word in, let's see how long you last you stamina-less fat fuck.

>>33185660
No no, I'm done now. I also know the tactic of saying you have hours when you dont because you know it will dissuade the other person from replying, as well as going more extreme with your responses to try and rile the person up when you arent getting the replies you want.

One tip though, saying stuff like sweetie or princess is more cringey than insulting. I hope you're taking notes.

Now I expect one final response that is super big that does nothing but try to get the person to reply one more time after they say they're done. I assume anyone who talks to you is gonna be me now or something. Have fun with them.