Sun and Moon are objectively the worst games in the series but

>>33118128
I think Sun and Moon are fine

>>33118135
Good for you.

>>33118128
Those skull grunts can boost their ego and self esteem by unloading their insecurities on me

>>33118141
thanks i guess

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>shitty chibi models
>absolutely hideous, flat environment
>rollerblades?
>shittiest team in the series
>shittiest plot in the series
>shittiest rivals in the series
>clunky and awkward grid based movement
>even worse slowdown than Sun and Moon
>worst music

Nah man, still think X and Y are by far the worst.

>>33118128
I think they were fun. My only complaint is the cutscenes .

>>33118177
>>33118128
Guys, guys, you're BOTH correct. All the 3ds games are simultaneously the worst games in the franchise. The DS era was the golden age.

Lets hope the Switch era returns to top tier quality.

>>33118177
>>even worse slowdown than Sun and Moon
I agree with everything else but this is simply not true.

>>33118177
>absolutely hideous, flat environment
XY looks the worst, although all the 3DS games look like shit
>rollerblades?
At least you can still use the d-pad to move
>shittiest team in the series
That's Team Aether
>shittiest plot in the series
Agreed, although SM's plot is also pretty shit and it forces it on the player a lot harder than XY or any other game in the series forced its story.
>worst music
Probably, although I wouldn't say it's that bad. And aside from the battle music, SM has a pretty weak soundtrack too.

Combine that with the fact that SM has worse online features and worse Pokemon diversity than XY and I'd say that SM are the worst in the series.

>>33118239
>Probably, although I wouldn't say it's that bad. And aside from the battle music, SM has a pretty weak soundtrack too.
I think synth midi is starting to get too old. They need real instruments and techno music

>>33118177
>complains about rollerblades
>complains about grid-based movement same post

>>33118293
Roller blades were shit you fucking autist. They were too slippery and slowed you down in grass.

>>33118185
>The DS era was the golden age
you need to be over 18 to use this site

BW is still the worst

>>33118128
But that's not RBGY

>>33118128
Team skull was pretty great, but I still love how incredibly overly French team flare were

But yes, Sun and Moon are the first time the games became mechanically worse between generations, nothing they added is as good as what they took away from ORAS

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>objectively the worst games in the series
>worse than X and Y
>worse than D&P (excluding Platinum which is actually good)

Um, no sweetie.

>>33118384
>Sweetie

Fuck off back to Tumblr you sjw

>SM are the worst Pokemon games

Did I somehow enter a timeline where GSC don't exist?

>>33118388
>Triggered over mean words
Both of you fuck off

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>>33118391
(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)(You)

>>33118396
No. Literally only SJW's and feminists say "sweetie"

>>33118388
>criticize sjw's for being easily offended
>throw a literal shitfit because someone used a word that triggers you

Aww sorry sweetie, did I hurt your little fee fee's?

>>33118128
>objectively
Fuck off.

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>>33118376
>took away from ORAS
>implying ORAS had anything to begin with

>>33118410
Well, sad to see that no woman in your family ever loved you

>>33118420
Why are you still here? Seriously, go back to tumblr

>>33118432
People in the UK dont say sweetie you faggot.

Team Skull felt like a terrible "kids these days!" joke from the fucking 90's.

Nobody talks like "Yo yo yo" and throws around gang signs in the last 20 years.

I was really surprised people actually liked them, I was fucking cringing every time I saw them.

>>33118388
>>33118396
"Um, no sweetie" is a fucking copypasta you newfag retard. Leave now.

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>>33118128
Everything that SM did wrong, XY did it worse
Everything that SM did rigth, XY didn't do it

The only thing good about XY is PSS

>>33118384
They're not worse than XY (though XY's distribution is far superior) but definitely worse than DP. At least Sinnoh had some thought put into its level design. Alola routed are mostly straight lines with very little exploration involved.

Honestly I'd say Alola is even worse than Kalos.

>>33118410
Well, and nice old people. But regardless, you're little special snowflake feelings are hurt because a meanie on the internet said a word you don't like. So you pretty much embody tumblr to a t
>>33118447
Gotta admit I've never seen it but why did you reply to me?

>>33118448
>Everything that SM did rigth
So nothing?

>>33118183
cutscenes made it better.

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>>33118442
Of course no one actually acts like that

Its supposed to be over the top and goofy, not intimidating

Are you stupid?

>>33118430
it had a zone in which you could hold one direction and keep moving forever, perfect for egg hatching with the iv checker was very close by, it had super training and horde battles which were perfect for ev training, it let you move with the d-pad, it had an easy to use and always accessible online mode that allowed you to do other stuff in-game while you were using it, it had the pokeradar which was a marvelous way to hunt hidden abilities, it had O-powers for egg hatching and experience gain, your means of fast movement didn't quadruple your size preventing you from fitting through small gaps and it had blissey bases

By comparison, the only things SM did better was having ivs visible on pokemon stat screens and hyper training, but hyper training requires your pokemon to be level 100 in a game where maxing out pokemon level was made much harder

>>33118448
What did XY even do worse than SM? Difficulty? Giveaways? Kanto pandering? Because the stories are both shit.

>>33118177
>worst music
Pretending to be retard?
The gym battle is the only one
The worst music was always gen 5 with a few exceptions

>>33118128
>Sun and Moon are objectively the worst games
>Prove me wrong
Easily. DPPt and HGSS exist. There can never be worse Pokemon games than those because there will never be another engine as terrible as gen 4's, nor will there be a region as poorly designed now that HMs are gone the way of the dodo.

>>33118499
Worst music is gen 6. Every other gen is pretty good.

>>33118430
Aside from being the best game in the franchise, you mean? By all means, keep proving you're underage by trying to throw shade on ORAS.

>>33118474
The fuck is wrong with you?

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>>33118499

>>33118512
*gen 5

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>>33118480
>it had a zone in which you could hold one direction and keep moving forever
Honestly, not much different then just mindlessly spinning the analog. Especially with how fast eggs hatch.

>iv checker was very close by
Moot point when you have a better IV checker on the pc

>it had super training and horde battles which were perfect for ev training
Super training was super inefficient, nobody actually used it. Horde battles were nice, but in terms of EV training SOS battles are just as fast if not faster

>it let you move with the d-pad
Actually pointless without a grid system, which was already an obsolete mechanic. This isn't fire emblem

it had an easy to use and always accessible online mode that allowed you to do other stuff in-game while you were using it
Actually this is a fair point, probably the worst thing about Sun and Moon

>it had the pokeradar which was a marvelous way to hunt hidden abilities
Useful, yes, but again SOS battle help alleviate that

>it had O-powers for egg hatching and experience gain
Not too much of an issue with how fast eggs hatch now, although the experience was nice. They were pains to level up tho.

>your means of fast movement didn't quadruple your size preventing you from fitting through small gaps
Have you tried using the bike in ORAS and getting through a door? Shit's unweildy

>it had blissey bases
Again, fair point, but the use of Blissey's was less a planned mechanic of the game and more of work-around found by players


Admittedly, 6th gen had better online, but imo that's about it.

>>33118512
(You)

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>>33118518
>Best games

Does it have the berry spin minigame? No? Literally worse than the origanal Ruby and Sapphire

>>33118384
Head like a FUCKING Bounsweet

>>33118549
>Useful, yes, but again SOS battle help alleviate that
The big draw for the DexNav from a casual standpoint is that it lets you see when you've caught everything on a route.
Source: I'm a casual and I got four people to play ORAS last summer, and they all loved DexNav for that reason.

DexNav is something that should be in every single game by default - imagine playing X/Y but being able to actually see that there are more Pokemon on each route. So they'll never bring it back.

Team Skull are completely irrelevant, have shit teams and their shtick isn't even funny.

Not being hyperbolic when I say only Team Flare is worse.

>>33118518
>best game
Best remakes, at least. The sales don't lie.

>>33118549
Weird, you keep bringing up SOS battles, those horrible unreliable pieces of shit that can ruin you just as easily as they can help you as if they're somehow a good thing, which also don't tell you whether a pokemon you've just found has it's hidden ability or not, what it's nature is, or if it's ivs are any good

And funny how you complain about getting into doors on a bike, which is made infinitely easier by letting you move with the d-pad

Also, I fail to see why the grid system is "obsolete" seeing as it would have been better than what we got

>>33118583
Yes, because everyone knows Resident Evil 6 is the best of the franchise.

Sales don't lie

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>>33118576
That's more a GameFreak being a bunch of hacks and shills more than anything tho

They've done that to every good feature in every game.

Can we burn this company to the ground and give the franchise to someone else yet?

>>33118185
>Lets hope the Switch era returns to top tier quality.
>Switch
>top tier quality.

Got my laugh for the day.

>>33118604
Except 6 sold worse than 1, 2, 4, and 5. 4 is the best-selling Resident Evil game.

Hey, would you look at that! Sales don't lie!

>>33118128
>objectively

>>33118570
Care to explain how?
Skipping a tedious as shit minigame to make blocks was a 10/10 quality of life thing in my opinion.

Cut content is bad, I get that, but I find it less jarring when the cut content was shit.

>Sun and Moon are objectively the worst games in the series

Why do people continually forget that XY exist

>>33118128

Whenever this comes up I bring up the same thing. It's not the worst gen in the series because XY exists

How people keep forgetting about that disaster of a gen is beyond me

>SM ditch gyms
>don't ditch the completely pointless and stupid Teams

Team Rocket actually served a specific enemy niche. They used Poison types and leeching moves, which you don't find on most other trainer classes.

Teams Magma, Aqua, Plasma and Flare (I can't even remember the team from Sinnoh) just use types you see all over the place anyway, they don't have any special strategies, and they're incredibly boring to fight because they all use the same four or five Pokémon.

Skull I can't even really figure out the theme, yet they still all use the same handful of Pokémon making them even more boring than any previous team.

This is symbolic of how the franchise has completely forgotten about its JRPG roots, and now just mindlessly shoves in the same elements purely out of tradition rather than understanding what they were put in Red and Green for in the first place.

>>33118665
>conflating games with gen
ORAS were good games, you leave them out of this.

>>33118592
I never said SOS battles weren't a shit mechanic, fuck me I'd so much prefer horde battles back.

BUT, SOS battles are by and large the most time efficient method of EV training we've ever had outside of vitamins.

Yeah, Dexnav would be nice, it was a great addition to ORAS, but if HA are what you want, you can still get them with the shitty SOS battles. Honeslty Dexnav falls into the same category as PWT or the battle frontier or any other nice mechanic. Doesn't make the games good on that merit alone.

The issue I had with Bikes was BECAUSE of the grid based movement. I'm glad that shit's gone. I honestly don't see any fucking reason we should ever go back to the grid.

>>33118255
>They need real instruments and techno music
As someone who likes electronic music, techno can get old too after a time, though I am surprised we haven't seen more of it since Masuda himself likes it.

Oh, right... I forgot for a moment that they made him directer and then producer instead of leaving him where he's best suited.

>>33118486

XY has the dubious honor of being the blandest and most uninspired game in the series.

>>33118674
The real problem with removing d-pad movement is that what they replaced it with is essentially useless

If they put the pokemon calls in the main menu instead of their own special menu, and just had you press Y and do a d-pad input like you did with registered items in ORAS while still letting you move with the d-pad normally, then you could have nearly the same efficiency while still letting you move with the d-pad

Also, this is a very personal and subjective thing, but I hate that the Pokemon I ride around on aren't mine, and that Rotom is in my pokedex but has no pokedex entry

>>33118128
I want to join Team Skull.
Why won't Game Freak let me have fun.

>>33118674
>I honestly don't see any fucking reason we should ever go back to the grid.
I'm surprised they left it. In one interview last Gen Masuda I believe it was said it was easier to program events for and that's why they hadn't left it out of Gen 6.

If only they hadn't gone full retard and also removed the Dpad functionality since it's much more accurate than the stick. The number of times I've tried to grab an egg and got healed over and over by that stupid fucking Miltank that shouldn't be that close to her is way too motherfucking high.

Dpad works just fine without a grid, although retards keep trying to tell me it doesn't despite my having played dozens of PC games with no grid with them just fine. Perfectly even since there were no misclicks based on the control pad being shit.

>>33118674
>BUT, SOS battles are by and large the most time efficient method of EV training we've ever had outside of vitamins.

How the fuck are SOS battles more time efficient than hordes?

>>33118128
SM are the best games yet. Several people agreed last year, but thanks to jaded autists the sensible people left this cesspool of pity and projection. I'm sad that I fell to the temptation and replied to your pathetic thread, but it's about time someone breaks into your enabling echochamber and calls you out on your bullshit. I urge anyone reading this to leave this place and stop letting autists shape your opinions.
>inb4 those ARE my opinions
No, they are not. t. Someone who let himself be affected and there is no chance in hell I'm the only one of my kind.

Life is much better when enjoyed you fucks.

I hate autistic kids throwing around the word "objective" just to project that their subjective opinion is actually anywhere near true

>>33118745
Not him, but don't you end up getting more EVs the longer the chain goes, that results in it being faster?

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>>33118732
>Tried to grab an egg and got healed by that stupid fucking Miltank
FUCKING REEE THIS
I want the fucking dpad back

>>33118718
Mostly entirely agree with this except two things.

The Ride Pager is accessed by pressing Y, no need to have registration when the menu is there for them at the press of a button already.

As for the Ride Pokémon I would like to be able to use my own but at the same time I see the logic behind this system story wise.

Pokémon trainers are basically taking part in a sport, so having the league, essentially, provide you with the Pokémon as you go on makes some sense.

Most Nascar drivers these days don't own their cars either, for example. It could use some reworking in the story to support that, but that's how I think of it. Wouldn't complain if they gave you the ability to ride your own of course (in fact, I'd say it should be a thing just to have the choice), but it's okay as is.

>>33118755

I wouldn't necessarily say they're the best games, but they did a lot of things right/better than previous games. My real complaint with the games is that they feel a little content light, but if they add enough content in USM it could easily join the top tier

>>33118685
Like SM?

>>33118777
>Wouldn't complain if they gave you the ability to ride your own of course (in fact, I'd say it should be a thing just to have the choice)

If they did this, I'd hope it'd be like this:
>You get an item, the "ride saddle" or something to that effect and can give it to most mons
>Whichever mon you have it equipped to will show up in the ride pager, as a clone of one of the existing rides, with different properties
>Riding Raikou lets you move much faster, riding Suicune lets you run across water, you can try riding Snorlax for a laugh
It'll never happen.

>>33118755
Is this autism?

>>33118177
Fuck off. XY was the best.

>>33118780
Thank you

>>33118812
Explain?

>>33118795

...no? SM at least had some interesting bits like totem battles, team skull, and at least tried to shake up the formula a little

XY was a bland and uninspired cash in on gen 1 nostalgia

>>33118805
Indeed it is.

>>33118812

Im sorry to tell you this but it really, really wasn't.

>>33118718
>Room I my Pokedex but have no Pokedex entry
The autism on this board, holy shit

>>33118824
>like totem battles
>at least tried to shake up the formula a little
Which is just the old formularic Gym Leader fight with less puzzle and trainers?
>team skull
Doing absolutely nothing.

>uninspired cash in on gen 1 nostalgia
Like XY or even worse?

Woah I didnt know I woke up in a timeline where RBY didn't exist.

>>33118837

If you're equating the actual gameplay mechanics of the totem mons to a gym leader I don't know what to tell you

What team skull did was "be interesting", it doesn't matter that they were shit at being criminals. In fact, that was largely the point.

>>33118846
RBY get a free pass for being the first

Sure they're mechanically the worst games, but the people making them barely had any idea what they were doing and were on an insane schedule. It's like calling Ocarina of Time a bad 3D Zelda

>>33118128
Team Skull were garbage. They never once felt like an actual threat. I guess I can at least understand why people relate to them being butthurt teenagers/young adults who blame the world for not dropping everything into their lap for no effort. The leader was worst in the franchise. Others were more retarded like Archie and Maxie, but at least they had a plan and the means, ambition, and charisma to achieve it. A stupid plan for sure, but a plan nonetheless. Guzma was just a tool whipped to a bitch who didn't give a fuck about him. Plumeria was okay but she was even less relevant than the Galactic sub-admins.

>>33118852
Yeah that's right. Unlike Gyms, Totem Battles are just fights against boring small Pokemons and then against boring big Pokemons.

You are seriously defending them, because
>They did nothing, because that was their purpose!

>>33118128
They are the worst

NOBODY takes them seriously
The dont achieve ANYTHING in the game
Looker doesnt even bother to arrest a single grunt.

They're pointless laughing stock

>>33118911
You point out what makes them fun and say it's what makes them shit

I bet you thought team Flare was too arrogant and uppity

>>33118931
I dont give a fuck about Team Flare but at least they were doing shit they wanted to do and they were well organized

Being useless is "fun" about Team Skull? Then i guess characters like Hau and Shauna are also your favourites because they're also useless

>>33118953
They're fun because they're failures but think they're hot shit

Note how no one actually gives a fuck about them, they're treated as a nuisance, not a threat, so every interaction they have is layered with this sense of how amusingly pathetic they are

How to tell if someone has not played SM.
>Team Skull is a bad team, they weren't even a threat
>It brought nothing new to the series
>all of the designs are shit
>Lillie, Hau, and Gladion are all such flat characters!
>The Looker sidequests were pointless, Looker didn't even arrest anyone!

>>33118973
...and thats fun to you...? Ok then...

>>33118992
Sure, you haven't played the game?

>>33118992
>>The Looker sidequests were pointless, Looker didn't even arrest anyone!
His quests werent pointless but he did NOTHING about Team Skull or Aether

>>33118812
stop being a contrarian and fishing for (You)s on a chinese clothes-knitting forum

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>>33118185
Pokemon's never had a golden age. It's been mediocre since day one.

>>33118992
>Lillie, Hau, and Gladion are all such flat characters!
But that's true. Lillie doesn't develop through the course of the game, Hau has no depth and his best parts are bantering with Gladion, and Gladion's development is incredibly minor. They're all flat characters like everyone else in the games.

I want to play some pokemon but don't have a 3ds, are these games really that bad? Should I just buy one of the DS games since I already own an old grey DS?

>>33119036
Yep. In all honesty if you're looking for some development then your characters are Wally, Bianca and N because they actually do change through the course of the story and achieve something

The Elite Four music is cool though

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>>33119019
Found the casual baddie

>>33118755
/vp/ is a pit of misery
Have you ever gone on /v/ after taking a few months break only to realise every thread is "WHY IS THERE A NIGGER IN MY GAME REE" or "IT'S SHIT YOUR OPINION IS WRONG WHAT DO YOU MEAN YOU AGREE IT'S SHIT YOU'RE FUCKING RETARDED"
We're THEIR containment board.

>>33119070
That's a poor measure

By the same token, /tg/ is /b/'s containment board for Warhammer Wednesdays, and I don't think anyone would argue that /b/ is a better board than /tg/

>>33118755
There's no way you could possibly think this unless you've never played another Pokemon game. BW2 had better single-player content. ORAS had better multiplayer features. XY had better Pokemon diversity. BW had a better story. RSE/FRLG ran the smoothest. HGSS had the best post-game. Pretty much every other region is better than the Alola region. The only aspect they are arguably the best in is visuals, but many would argue that the DS games' 2D graphics looked better than the Sun/Moon's attempt at 3D graphics.

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>>33119117
>By the same token, /tg/ is /b/'s containment board
Fucking what? That's not even remotely true or similar in any conceivable way.
Even ignoring the fact /vp/ LITERALLY is a containment board, how is a board for talking about one specific game being a containment for a board about video games ANYTHING like a board for tradtional games being a containment board for a board explicitly not about anything?

>>33119131
>BW had a better story.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>33119131
>HGSS had the best post-game.

Kanto isn't post-game.

>>33119144
The only reason /tg/ exists is because /b/ used to get overrun with threads about Warhammer, much in the same way that Pokemon threads overran /v/.

I mean, sure /tg/ covers a lot of stuff now, but at it's creation, it existed solely to contain the Warhammer threads.

/d/ is also the same, created originally to hold all the futa threads overrunning /h/, and /jp/ exists because /a/ was swamped with Touhou stuff

The only thing that separates /vp/ is that it's still only about one game series

>>33119030
The first games were fine. They had a creative concept, they had an interesting theme, and they had an appropriately small dev team, and an appropriately small scope for the technology.

It had the same charm as similarly small but creative games like Dragon Quest, EarthBound and Romancing SaGa.

And with Gold and Silver they legitimately tried to expand and improve on the foundation of Red and Blue.

But then from Gen III on it was clear a lot of the staff changed, and the games were just mindlessly rehashing the same aspects out of tradition. They never looked at those elements and thought to figure out WHY they were in the game in the first place, they just put them in because the last games had them.

>Well, you gotta have 3 starters that are Fire, Water and Grass, you gotta have a rival, you gotta have a professor, you gotta have an evil team, you gotta have 8 gyms and an Elite Four, you gotta have rats and birds on the first route...
>Yeah but why?
>I dunno, because they were in the previous games so we're supposed to have them

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You think this man can do it? Will he make Team Skull a legit threat?

>>33118755
Best games yet is an exaggeration, but /vp/ does go way overboard with their hatred of gen 7. As long as DP, ORAS, and XY exist, SM will never be "objectively the worst game".

>>33119473
What's so bad about ORAS?

>>33119516
Lack if something that starts with B and ends with R

>>33119516
The biggest problem is that it was XY's shitty engine, but without the effort put into the locations that XY had. There's a problem when a game looks even worse than XY.

>>33119191
Again, how are the two comparable?

>>33119526
This. This is why Pt/HGSS/B2W2 is the holy trinity and why everything after is such shit. No Battle Frontier.

>>33118128
>>33118384
>>33119473
>objectively

RG - While it is the most bare-bones Pokémon experience, it's also hard to fault it for that since it is the first and the core Pokémon experience is the entire reason people keep coming back. I think it can be enjoyed for its simplicity. You could collect all 150 normal Pokémon at the time between both games. Not to mention that much of the material it introduced is iconic. Actual faults are the shoddy programming and NPC parties not having much thought put into them.
GS - Feels like a sequel in every sense of the word where almost everything was meant to be improved. The time of day, the day of the week, outbreaks, legendary Pokémon with cool stories, a region steeped in culture, the PokéGear, an organized bag, backwards compatibility, the first region, 16 badges, fanservice for veterans and a climactic battle with Red. Faults include both regions being individually smaller than other games (though they're fairly large together) and wonky level scaling throughout the entire game.
RS - Better mechanically than previous iterations, leading to a better multiplayer experience, but is missing many key features that made the previous Generation great, and has questionable region design towards the latter half of the game and a just as questionable story. Less post-game than every other game but RG and the GBA soundchip is notoriously bad.
DP - An improvement on all of RS' main game refinements, while also reintroducing pretty much everything that RS dropped from Gen II. The region is well-designed, there's a good amount of post-game content, the scenario is a retread but it's not as stupid, and there's just a lot of really cool lore and history. Faults include the slow battle speed (particularly HP dropping), slightly slow overworld traversal occasionally exacerbated by the environment (marsh, snow, water), and some debatable changes to Gen III introductions (Secret Bases to Underground Bases, Contests).

>>33119637
They also have a ton of post-game content and their regions aren't extremely linear like BW, XY, and SM. Many areas also get a new lease on life after getting stuff like the PokéRadar or the other PokéGear radio channels.
There are surrounding optional areas to Violet City.
There are two ways to reach Ecrutreak City from Goldenrod City.
Once you get to Ecruteak City, you can go to Olivine City or Mahogany Town through Mt. Mortar, visit the Lake of Rage. Surf is required to progress farther, but the order you can do stuff around that point is fairly open. Not only that, but the entire area south of Blackthorn City is optional. And once you get to Kanto, you can tackle a lot of the region in an open order. You can even save all the Gyms until you're done everything else.

>>33118128
>objectively the worst games in the series
but anon, it ONLY takes 15 minutes to get your starter, even with only mashing A!

That's what I call FUN.

I really like taking two steps and being thrown into a 2 minute cutscene that I have no option to skip.

I really like that cutscene ending, and taking THREE steps, and being thrown into an even longer cutscene that I also can't skip!

IT'S FUN.

>>33118128
SM had the biggest potential for an enemy team in a while, but they totally botched it.
I mean the interplay between skull and aether could have been so good. They could have done literally anything but what they did, but instead aether and skull are just flat parodies of enemy teams. Are there even characters in them aside from Lusamine (who is just "lol im a bad mom i only like pretty things) and Guzma, whose character they just totally dropped in the second half even though he could have been pretty interesting?

>>33118128
>literally undecipherable pixel messes
>more bugs than actual features
>limited pool of pokemon
>limited pool of moves
>Special

Gen 1 was the worst in the series. It literally only ever gets a pass because it started the franchise. It only managed that because it had basically no competition in its category! I love that game to bits but dear god it's so awful to go back to.


You're 100% right about Team Skull though. That moment in particular always gets me.

>>33118128
>Sun and Moon are objectively the worst games in the series
No. GSC were.

>>33118299
>couldn't control his rollerblades
not the game's fault you're bad at it

>>33118128
Why do /vp/oreons hate them, again?
>It featured an actual story
>Pokemon designs were excellent
>Pacing was good
>Characters were memorable, Lillie, Guzma, Lusamine, Gladion, the island challenge leaders
>Good music

>>33118667
But all those teams served a narrative purpose!
The weakest team in that regard is Aqua/Magma, and the strongest by far is Plasma.

Rocket: Basically the Mafia
Rocket (GSC): Picking up the pieces
Aqua/Magma: Fanatics dedicated to expanding their areas for the sake of pokémon but probably just trying to make money
Galactic: We shall become Gods of our own universe
Plasma: Pokémon liberation! (Except the higher ups were simply using this as a cover to become the most powerful people on the planet)
Plasma 2: Picking up the pieces (I think, never played them all the way through)
Flare: Sure, the boss has his thing, we're just here to become rich (Also known as a reverse-Plasma)
Skull: Criminal operation being funded by the corrupt CEO of a conservation group so as to not sully their good name while still benefiting from breaking the rules

>>33118447
>is a fucking copypasta
is calling memes copypastas a new meme?

>>33121493
>the story is the main point of the game instead of the usual exploration of the region, especially shown in lack of post game content
>designs are subjective, and i think almost all of them are shit
>pacing was not good
>characters were memorable mostly because they were constantly forced on you or just subjectively bad
>music is subjective, and i think its largely mediocre

>>33119006
>Team Skull
Not enough of a threat to warrant international intervention, even at their height. They also disbanded after you defeated them, so nothing to solve.

>Aether
I can't remember the term, but they avoided punishment by agreeing to help the police solve all the issues they caused. Besides, it was only really their CEO who was bad, everyone else followed orders, though some of them enjoyed it a bit too much

>>33118128
>implying X and Y were better games
Are you dumb?

>>33121501
You are really exaggerating with Team Skull.
Delete their existence and we will have the exactl same story.
How can you say Team Aqua and Magma just want to make money? Is that your head canon?
Besides, the Team Flare is just wrong.

File: 1441220470410.png (247KB, 539x500px) Image search: [Google]

247KB, 539x500px

>>33118128
>objectively

>>33121501
Let me fix that Team Skull for you:
>a bunch of losers and failures who aren't taken seriously by anyone with a manchild boss who does things for attention

>>33118128
EVERY 3ds mainline Pokemon game was garbage. GameFreak is rushing the games and shilling them to look good, and people eat it up no matter how good the games are. They aren't putting effort into their games anymore because they don't have to in order to turn a profit.

>>33119637
>muh postgame
Platinum was good because the main game was well-designed. BW shits on BW2 but apparently nostalgia pandering (which you guys conveniently use as a negative for Gen VI and VII) and modes that show up too late to be of any use are enough to be considered the best.

>>33123115
>Delete Team Skull's existence and we will have the exact same story.
The entire purpose of Team Skull was to act as a distraction for the Aether Foundation's evil experiments and shit.

They were a bunch of dummies doing petty crimes on purpose, because it fits the narrative.

>>33119895
You forgot to mention one of the most interesting changes in Gen IV onward: How a type is no longer 100% physical or 100% special. Gameplay-wise, this adds lots more variety to the pokemon and moves you can use.

4th gen is definitely my favorite. Platinum is a great game, and if you love the earlier gens, then HG/SS are amazing.

Here are the problems with Sun and Moon.
1. Linearity
Each island is very straightforward. You can almost never go to a route that's required before you're actually required to go to it. Actually, I'm pretty sure that Memorial Hill, Akala Outskirts, Routes 10, 11 are the ONLY required areas that you can visit before you're required to go there. Can I really not access the rest of Malie City because I have to go to Malie Garden to progress the story? Do the gates in Hau'oli City need to be unusable the first time through so you can only go straight? Does Olivia need to block me off from Diglett Cave? Does Lillie have to block me from going to Hau'oli City or Iki Town near the beginning? What about the Tauros and Stoutland?
2. Uninteresting side areas
Contrary to popular belief, Sun and Moon does have optional side areas. They're just really boring for the most part. Seaward Cave, Kala'e Bay, Hano Beach, Secluded Shore, Melemele Sea, and most other side areas just don't feel that exciting to explore. There's nothing like the Kanto Power Plant, Seafoam Islands, Dark Cave, Bell Tower, Abandoned Ship, Sea Mauville, Solaceon Ruins, or Fuego Ironworks in the game. Haina Desert probably comes closest, but even it is kinda boring.
3. Boring legendary encounters
The ruins for each Tapu are essentially the same with different, yet simple Strength puzzles. Solgaleo and Lunala get the most spectacle being the version mascots, and going to the other world to find Cosmog is kinda neat, but it just joins you and Ultra Beasts + Necrozma appear as wild encounters in locations you've visited. Not to mention Magearna is a QR Code and Marshadow is a random distribution.
4. Cutscenes
There are so many cutscenes, all of them unskippable. Every time you make any sort of progress, even if it's walking into a town, you gotta have a cutscene where Hau or Lillie tell you where to go. Does Hau really need to force me to get the Poké Finder?

5. Performance
There is no 3D despite being on the 3DS. Well, there is, but it's exclusively with the Poké Finder, and it absolutely destroys the frame rate, which is already at 30 fps to begin with. Trainers are now included in battles, and have far more complex models than in Gen VI. Triple battles and rotation battles aren't in, and walking Pokémon probably weren't in because Game Freak couldn't get them working properly on the hardware. Original 3DS owners are also required to do a soft reboot every time they exit the game like with Smash 3DS, but Smash 3DS runs in 3D at 60 fps with four player multiplayer.
6. Lillie
If you don't care about Lillie, the story is a drag for the most part. She's not that interesting, and all she does is serve to impede your way. I don't care about her sudden character development after the Aether Foundation. She's so forced as a character and there is nothing "deep", subtle, or worth noting about her as a character. The game is literally all about her and you're more of a backseat character.
7. Cut content
I'm not gonna talk about the golf course or other speculated cut content. I'm gonna talk about the suspicious gaps seen in
https://projectpokemon.org/research/sunmoon/storytext.txt
https://projectpokemon.org/research/sunmoon/gametext.txt
https://pastebin.com/vkaZNTra
along with walking Pokémon. I wouldn't be surprised if they purposely cut mythicals after Marshadow and plan to include them in USUM, along with all these placeholder gaps.
Red
Blue
Looker
[~ 32]
[~ 33]
[~ 34]
[~ 35]
[~ 36]
[~ 37]
Sina
Dexio
Grimsley

8. Little things
Can't battle both Red and Blue outside the Battle Tree. Mina is a tacked-on Trial Captain. No rematches with regular trainers. Everything about fossils. The guy who wants to see a Solrock/Lunatone but neither is available in-game. Charizard is a Ride Pokémon but isn't in the Pokédex. No National Pokédex. Version-exclusive major TRAINERS. The Poké Finder has little thought put into it. Festival Plaza and all online functions. Rotom Pokédex taking up actual useful bottom screen functions since a map can be on quick select anyway. No camera control. The bag needs more pockets, especially for Mega Stones. Complete Forme Zygarde can't be split back into Cores and Cells and then reconstructed as multiple 10%/50% Formes, and being required to make a 50% Zygarde if you have between 50% and 99% of Cores/Cells. Only Dexio uses Mega Evolution outside the Battle Tree, only a handful of Trainers use items other than Z-Crystals/Silvally's Memories outside the Battle Tree (Flame Orb guy, Red Card guy, Focus Sash girl, Red's Pikachu has a Light Ball). Only one of each Apricorn Ball. No Macho Brace, Fluffy Tail, Flutes, Gems, and a bunch of missing Berries. Some QR Codes add all of a Pokémon's forms/shinies instead of doing it individually. Hyper Training requiring the player to be at level 100, but the player plateaus around 70 since that's Red's strongest Pokémon (Pikachu), you only battle him once outside the Battle Tree (and it's optional), and every other trainer is level 65 or under.

I'm probably missing some stuff.

>>33118177
While it probably isn't the greatest entry in the franchise, I feel it served its role pretty well as a stepping stone game. It ushered in a new graphical era for Pokemon, and it can only get better as time rolls on.

>>33123676
>>33123685
>>33123702
Wow. When you put it that way, it's hard to deny how shit it is overall. I like that it tried to deviate from some of the unending traditions like gym battles and HMs, but even that stuff felt poorly executed, and the huge lack features and details from past gens is disappointing

>>33123676
>>33123685
>>33123702
The games have been pretty fucking bland since black and white.
The linearity is probably the biggest gripe I have with these games too.
I understand the need to have somewhat of a set path to follow but when it's a rigid line with no deviation whatsoever it just feels like ass.

>>33123676
>>33123685
>>33123702
Best post on /vp/ right now

Someone screenshot this shit

>>33118325
I'm curious as to what was the "golden age" for you. GBA?

>>33118391
Its the retarded anon again.

Stick to one thread with your autism

>>33118632
>Hey look everyone, genwunners were actually right

neck yourself

>>33118824
>Gen 1 nostalgia.
besides the first forest, I dont see it

SM, on the other hand had plenty.

>>33123702
9. Clothing option has no swimsuits.

>>33119051
And Silver. And the best part is that they do it while letting you breathe

>>33119184
>spoutingmemes.jpeg

stop.

>>33123676
To be fair, RB had all those bullshit "Sorry I'm thirsty so you can't go through here" and the infamous old asshole laying in the way to Viridian Forest.

But an actually good game would merely discourage you from going a certain direction with more difficult enemies.

When you think about it, what the hell even was the point of blocking off progression? What even changes if you go to the next city before you beat the trial? Just make it so you can't trigger the trials out of order and the worst thing that'll happen is a player will encounter trainers that will blow them the fuck out.

>>33118128
>(Current Two Games) are objectively the worst games in the series but they did give us objectively the best team. Prove me wrong. You cant.

Screen cap this for when the next gen/duo of games comes out.

>>33118177
This. XY really disappointed me and the only fun I had was exploring the world. The characters didn't appeal to me at all and the music was okay at best.

>>33124989
He was drunk, give em a break

>>33118448
>Everything that SM did wrong, XY did it worse
only thing I can think of is SM had worse clothing options

>>33124989
You could do that in MOTHER on the Famicom. It was a pretty big open world game, and there weren't a lot of roadblocks.
http://starmen.net/mother1/miscinfo/maps/eb0map_big.png
I think that Lloyd was the only required additional party member because he needed to blow up a location or two for further progression. There was also a bridge with cops on it early on that prevented you from traveling from the first town Mother's Day to the second town Thanksgiving. But that's really the only story-based blocks I can think of. You can even get Lloyd after Ana since you could do a pretty big sequence break and go from Thanksgiving to Snowman by going through the train tunnel, which is typically the fifth town. In EarthBound Beginnings (the localized NES version of MOTHER) and MOTHER 1+2 on the GBA, the train tunnel was altered to have really powerful enemies so that sequence breaking was discouraged, though you could still technically do it with enough luck.

But comparing a Famicom/NES era JRPG like MOTHER is miles away from even a Super Famicom/SNES JRPG like Chrono Trigger in terms of story focus. Pokémon's biggest problem as it has gotten more focused on the story is that region design suffers for it. The more story events, the more alternate dialogue you have to give to NPCs for before, during, and after those story events, and Pokémon has never been the type of game to give characters in previous locales new dialogue. It's easier to just give them a generic one-liner unrelated to anything currently happening. Sun and Moon goofed by giving one NPC (Hapu's grandmother) dialogue relating to a story event and never updating it following that story event. "My Hapu was heading for the Ruins of Hope, wasn’t she? Go after her. First, you’ll come to Poni Breaker Coast. You’ll know it by the soil—it’s black as pitch. Go through there, and you’ll find the ruins."

>>33125161
And leveling/grinding. XY made it almost too easy compared to SM story wise. But for the sake of competitive and learning moves, XY's cafes were waaaay better than whatever SM has

>>33124989
Also, you can technically break the sequence with the thirsty guards by transferring a drink from Stadium 2 so that you can access Saffron City immediately after getting the Ship Ticket from Bill and heading south of Cerulean City. From there, the world is your oyster for the most part.

Go north to go back to Cerulean City and beat Misty.
Go west to go to Celadon City where you can get an Eevee, do the Game Corner, enter the Rocket Hideout, and challenge Erika (requires beating Misty and getting HM01 first). You won't be able to get far on Route 16 though because of Snorlax.
Go east to go to Lavender Town. Going south from there to Route 12 leads to another Snorlax roadblock, but you can always clear most of Pokémon Tower and even rescue Mr. Fuji and get the Poké Flute if you've cleared Team Rocket in Celadon.
Go south to go to Vermilion City, challenge Lt. Surge (requires Cut or Surf) and do stuff there.

But it's completely reasonable to go
>Cerulean City
>Route 5
>Saffron City
>Route 7
>Celadon City
>Rocket Hideout - Beat Giovanni
>Celadon City
>Route 7
>Saffron City - Beat Giovanni, then Sabrina (anytime from this point on)
>Route 8
>Lavender Town - Save Mr. Fuji
>Route 12 - Snorlax
>Route 13
>Route 14
>Route 15
>Fuchsia City
>Safari Zone
>Fuchsia City - Beat Koga
>Route 19
>Route 20
>Seafoam Islands
>Route 20
>Cinnabar Island
>Pokémon Mansion
>Cinnabar Island - Beat Blaine
>Vermilion City - Beat Lt. Surge and find Cut
>Cerulean City - Beat Misty
>Celadon City - Beat Erika
>Viridian City - Beat Giovanni

While Brock will always be first and Giovanni last, Misty can be as early as 2nd and as late as 6th, Sabrina as early as 2nd and as late as 7th, Koga as early as 2nd and as late as 6th, Blaine as early as 3rd and as late as 7th, Sabrina as early as 3rd and as late as 7th, and Lt. Surge as early as 3rd and as late as 7th.

>>33125333
Meant that second Sabrina to be Erika.
Brock: 1
Misty: 2-3-4-5-6
Lt. Surge: 3-4-5-6-7
Erika: 3-4-5-6-7
Koga: 2-3-4-5-6
Sabrina: 2-3-4-5-6-7
Blaine: 3-4-5-6-7
Giovanni: 8

>>33118128
>objectively the worst games
i think XY were very slightly worse than SM desu but yes team skull were by far the most entertaining evil team so far

>>33123676
>>33123685
>>33123702
This. It's sad but true

>>33123676
>>33123685
>>33123702
damn this pretty much sums up every problem i have with the game. i'd just add, even beyond cutscenes and lillie, the story is just so banal. tons of potential with the interplay between the islanders, aether, team skull, looker, etc., but it just goes nowhere.
the pacing is also horrible, but thats pretty standard for pokemon games. i would run through areas and avoid combat, but still find myself boxing pokemon as they became too high level to make anything i ran into a challenge. but again, thats not really unique.

>>33125683
Stop fishing