Can you tell me why the idea of an open world pokémon game doesn't

>>32776079
The idea appeals to me a little. But I won't go out of my way to hope and wish for something that will never happen.

>>32776079
open world has no place in pokemon, exploration was never the core of the series

>>32776079
>We all know GF is so incompetent that wouldn't be able to pull off a great game for a new console like the nintendo switch, so they began hiring 3D artists some months ago.
Are you retarded ?

>>32776094
I wouldn't see it as a core feature, I'm not even hoping toward a straight full open world game like Elder Scrolls/The Witcher/Etc.
Also, I'm not even much of a hardcore gamer, I'd be okay with the standardized Game Freak yearly game, I'd just love to see a more lively and vibrant and "walkable" world.
I liked Alola, I just want them to do better, way better.
Primarly I'd love to see the overworld fauna actually do something in the background, or take a stroll and find a place I wouldn't have found if I went straight to the main quest objective, or find some people needing help with their pokémon, scared, stuck on a tree, handing me a cool battle item as a reworkd.
Wouldn't you like that?

>>32776112
What's wrong? Can you argue?

>>32776121
as a reward* excuse my non-native illiterateness

>>32776079
I'd be down for it, sun and moon were far too restrictive. I don't have any hope that gamefreak can pull it off though.

>>32776079
I don't trust gamefreak to do it.

>>32776209
>>32776224
Yeah that's exactly the point, either they decide to collaborate with other developers, or games are never gonna hit any of these standards, ever.

>>32776079
Here's the thing: you need to have a driving force of some sort behind map exploration. Sometimes it's okay to let you stumble across things to do, like Meridia and Azura's missions in Skyrim, but even then you have to have a REASON to want to do them and that's where they often fall flat. I helped those two because they're Daedra Princes who aren't irredeemable douchebags (and there's an achievement for getting all their related artifacts), but in the same game I didn't get all the dragon shouts because you only need one word from each shout for the achievement and most of the shouts are useless. And as always, fetchquests to make progress are the most annoying option.

I just don't know that GF has it in them to make us WANT to explore a big map.

99% of open world games are shit

>>32776755
OP here, and I agree
That's why I told time and time again I'm not hoping for a full generic open world game, just your usual pokémon game with a "widely connected region", and lively details.
And subquest, little stupid subquests that make that region feel alive.

No thanks. Really don't want a long development time.

>>32776079
The idea is appealing. But I have no faith in game freak. For them to include every region, in a massive open world, they would have to basically completely redo the leveling system and a lot of already well structured game balance. I don't trust modern GF to not completely fuck that up.

>>32776863
You've got a point

Open world is a cool idea but at the same time it can easily get boring and feel so slow. Like take the new mario for example or zelda breath of the wild See how huge it and awesome it looks!? Now take that and think about what it's gonna be like to find stuff and to get around. Gonna take a while.
Again im not saying it's a bad idea or anything. Just the downside of it is taking forever getting around and locating things. Even with maps it's still possible to get lost and then it starts to feel a bit boring. But that's my thoughts on the travelling portion. I have no idea how they would implement wild encounters and battling cinematics. Would it be like XD and colosseum maybe?

>>32776869
>For them to include every region, in a massive open world

That's specifically not what I was talking about though
Also I took for granted GF wouldn't work on such game ALONE

Why don't you fuckers read the thread before posting

>>32776871
Yeah, it would be very very risky going from Pokémon Sun and Moon: handholding edition to "Walk on your own in this giant world and try not to die"

I just want them to put the minimum effort in making the most alive region they've ever done, subquests would help.
And I'm not talking about infinite quests where you have to catch that pokémon and bring it back.
No, every quest would be focused on a different aspect of the game, approaching in a different way, so even casuals would get to, I don't know, make ONE egg instead of just skipping the daycare, capture box legend, finish league and drop the console till next year.

putting all the regions into one game is a terrible idea.

>>32776902
no one's talking about that bullshit

>>32776079
This is what I want.
The Linear, mind numbing style pokemons had for 20 years is awful. I don't know how much longer i can play like that.

>>32776094
Neither did Trails and No Gyms. Change is needed.

>>32776871
To be honest I think as long as it's filled with interesting locations and quests than it's be okay. It'd make the game much longer, at the moment pokemon games are completed very quickly and then people get bored and wait for the next.

open world doesn't mix well with pokemon, these are games that take 8-12 hours to complete, not 300+ hours like most open world games

>>32776965
If you read the post you'd understand I'm not exactly asking for the generic open world game
I want a pokémon game with an open world to explore, and hidden subquests to fullfill on my own will, I wanna see flying pokés flying, water pokes swimming, bug pokémon buzzing around as I step from one bush to another, I want full HD 3d landscapes and the most connected region to date (even more than god blessed hoenn was)

i want The Pokémon Game, and I know game freak on its own is not gonna do that, they need help

Not open world but something like dark souls or the other zelda games

I didn't ever expecting an open world pokemon because it will be more problems to deal with bugs and level design
but simply non loading overworld moving would be alright

>>32776079
If open world means the same for Pokemon, it would be terribly boring. I literally cannot play any open world games without getting bored 15 minutes later thanks to the fact that it has no music 90% of the time like BotW.

open world are dumbs, a wide semi-open world a lá Zelda BOWT though..I just want to be thrown in a huge region and have my own adventure on my own terms..the game are becoming increasingly linear and plot-heavy and this is hurting replayability (in SM dex also the terrible dex distribution). They need a semi open space, a light plot and lots of pokémon to incentive replayability and long term value. That's what make pokemon so huge in the beginning anyway (that and the possibity to trade and match your friend but man who hasn't played the first 3 generation hundred of times? they're so easy to pick up and the dexes while smaller then the latter games still retain more options for teams). Before putting out Pokémon 8 they need to ensure that the main focus it's having your adventure in a giant pokémon world. Accent on YOURS, making sure you can take different paths and have a huge selection of pokemon to choose from and have a plot light enough that playing again isn't a burden (looking at you BWSM, I loved both during my first playthrough but I can go through them again, the thought of all em cutscenes in SM bores me to no end).

>>32777378
I like your opinion, 100% agree

If all of the Pokémon are roaming around outside of the grass, I think that would be too big a task in terms of the models and the movement and reacting to different situations.

They'd probably have to have a subset of the Pokémon in each region encounterable wandering outside of the grass procedurally generated. If they're all in the grass, the world would look too empty or unalive.

>>32776121
not with retards, no

>>32777641
Nah, I'd say the encounters stay in the tall grass, as they've always been.
Outside pokés would serve just as interactable subquests or merely eye candy, like all the overworld pokes in SM

Maybe some special encounters like wimpod and the likes? I don't know, I don't know

>>32778032
yeah like the way it is now, you see pokemon in the overworld but cant battle with most of them

It does.

Pokemon gameplay is archaic as fuck and only autists on the internet would defend it. 2017 and we will still have to hunt rare Pokemon by walking back and forth in a patch of grass running from encounters until we find what we want in 5-10 minutes with absolutely no engaging challenge, difficulty, or strategy. Catching rare Pokemon should actually be fun.

I also really wouldn't mind scrapping the battle system entirely in place of something new, so long as whatever new system they have is good. Picking an attack and then letting RNG do the work for you is fucking boring.

>>32776079
I just want to catch Pokémon, battle, and train a team of bros.

I don't care, at all, if it's open works or linear.

I imagine the main argument, from a technical standpoint, would be balance. In an open world you could conceivably leave the opening area and make your way to the 8th gym who would have Pokémon way out of your league. You could argue that gym leaders could have multiple teams based on when you battle them but I imagine that would take resources away from other features. Knowing /vp/, the spergies here will always find something to REEEEEEEE about.

As long as combat and overall core mechanics stay intact I'd try whatever.

>>32778092
As >>32778231 said, they can't scrap the basic battle mechanic.
It would literally destroy everything they've built in these 20 years, all the competitive stage and the fanbase trust would crumble.

Though I admit they should get rid of RNG, though I know they won't. I think it's part of the game.
Would you remove RNG from card based game? You can't, you just can't.

>>32778370

I'm not asking them to throw out the very core of combat in the game. Moveslots, the type charts, and the current stats can all stay.

That doesn't mean there isn't room for improvement though. There's absolutely ways to make the Pokemon battle system more engaging and less archaic. Abilities and held items were a step in the right direction for making it more strategic, but it's still all very passive. You just pick an attack and whatever happens happens. I'm not a game designer, it isn't my job to figure this out, it's theirs.

Off the top of my head here are some ideas. None of them have been extensively thought out and I'm sure each has some flaw, but surely in this thread alone we could at least brainstorm something cool.

-maybe some method of blocking or dodging attacks that isn't solely dependent on RNG, maybe an evasion stat. Maybe when you pick an attack you can choose to focus on power, accuracy, or secondary effects. Imagine for the sake of argument a move like Scald had only 90% accuracy. You pick the move, then you can choose power blow to increase it's BP by 20%, status blow to increase the burn chance by 20%, or accuracy to make the move have 100% accuracy, or defensive blow which doesn't buff the attack but gives you a 20% chance to dodge an incoming attack that turn?

-maybe sort of skill based minigame each turn using the touch screen or something which determines which player has the advantage that turn. Nothing major. Maybe a four second long little challenge or something.

-assign species based mastery over specific attacks. Make Hypno have 100% accuracy when using Hypnosis, make Shiftry not lose special attack when using Leaf Storm

-Add more nuance to picking movesets by assigning an attack range to each move or something. Maybe increased range could make Magnitude a more viable choice than Earthquake in some situations. Give more effects to moves. Maybe Fire Punch can combo into two hits if you're in close range.

>>32776744
Rare pokemon.

File: 69752b98gy1fezdk6uetaj20ku0ku0u3.jpg (59KB, 750x750px) Image search: [Google]

59KB, 750x750px

>>32776079

I have no problem with open world pokemon. It's a turn based game so I have no worries about the combat design going to shit to enabled open world.

>>32778601

To further explain my last point about certain moves being better in certain situations or having a range function. Maybe Fire Punch could be a double blow after using something like Quick Attack to rocket you right up into close range with an enemy, giving an otherwise useless move a reason to exist other than "this mon can't learn Flare Blitz."

Maybe have a range system where certain moves move you forward or backwards and some moves are stronger or weaker depending on Distance. Like Close Combat can only be used in melee range while Quick Attack might be an instant gap closer. This could give mixed attackers a reason to exist since they can function at all ranged. Maybe my Claydol has an advantage vs a Pokemon like Tyrantrum because he can find ways to stay out of close range by using beam attacks or something. Maybe there's a reason to use Magnitude instead of Earthquake because Magnitude has a better range. So you'd have to pick attacks for a variety of combinations and ranges to prepare for more situations.

It's crazy, it's complicated, but that's what we want. It's boring just slapping on the highest BP move available to us because there's low strategy in picking moves and most of the moves in this game are useless.

Make it Kanto + Johto + Orange Islands. You get to start in either Kanto or Johto, and that determines the starter and local species you see. Make the journey between towns longer than in the handhelds. Once you get through one area, you go to the Orange Islands, then the other area. Add the need to sleep + eat. Massive character customization. Single player or multiplayer campaign = start with 2 other real players, you each get one of the 3 local starters. You can journey together or go separately and be rivals.

>>32778601
>You pick the move, then you can choose power blow to increase it's BP by 20%, status blow to increase the burn chance by 20%, or accuracy to make the move have 100% accuracy, or defensive blow which doesn't buff the attack but gives you a 20% chance to dodge an incoming attack that turn?

Holy shit, please get hired

>>32778639

Really thanks for visiting my thread, that's the discussion I was looking for, you have some really neat ideas.
Though, I wouldn't never ever expect such mechanical changes next gen on switch, but if they do, I think it might be even better than the openworld thing I was thinking about.

>>32778664
Ew, that's pushing the limit in an awful way, I wouldn't like that

It only works if they change how combat works. In zelda you can wander into an area with a lynel with only 3 hearts and still beat it if you're skilled enough. Pokemon is too numbers based; if you went into an area with lv50 pokemon and you only had lv10 pokemon you'd just lose no matter how hard you try.

>>32776079
I can't really think of how it would benefit pokemon to be honest. As a spinoff that would be okay. Would have to pass if it was literally BotW with pokemon though, shit was boring.

>>32778639
>>32778601

Maybe you could have every species of Pokemon have a "signature move". An extra fifth moveslots depending on species that can't be changed. You could buff shitty Pokemon by doing this and maybe give the stronger Pokemon weaker signature attacks this way.

Blaziken could always have Blaze Kick on as a fifth move.

Hitmonchan can always have Dynamic Punch equipped.

Marowak can always have Bonemerang

Blastoise can always have Hydro Cannon

Meganium can always have Aromatherapy.

This gives you more options without sacrificing moveslots and more reasons to maybe pick a specific Pokemon over others with just better stats. I'm sure Ariados would be improved if it always had access to Toxic Thread without having to give up any moveslots for it. Also you could make Pokemon a bit more lore friendly by nodding to things that should kind of be but aren't.

Golduck always having Psychic on, he isn't a psychic type but always having that psychic coverage should be something he has based on it's lore.

Conkeldurr could always have Smack Down equipped. A move that does actually have a use but it's so niche that nobody would ever actually equip it for any reason. Yet it's something that if you look at Conkeldurr it should pretty much always be able to do this.

Same thing with Braviary having Sky Drop. Useless when you have to actually equip it, but if you always had access to it just by being a Braviary it would actually see use occasionally and make you feel rewarded for choosing Braviary instead of the many other Pokemon who do Braviary job better. That's one thing they won't bring to the table that Braviary will always have.

>>32776871
A good warp and/or fast travel system would do away with all that. It seems you need to play more games.

>>32778693
They could just do it like in Nier: Automata
Until you proceed with your main quest, enemies level are scaled to your general progression of the game

Sure, being a Pokémon game this could be very hard to do; while they could just scale the wild Pokémon levels with an algorythm, for trainers they should code many different teams for as many "sections" of the game

>>32778709
Exploration (overworld sightseeing, rare pokémon encounters) could be a great feature for an ADVENTURING game like pokémon, I don't want botw: pokémon skin, I just want to explore and decide my path, while still playing a pokémon game

>>32778710
Anon you're making me suffer, I want all of this now (they will never put this much effort into every single pokémon, at least they decide to skip the new gen dex and only focus on rebooting the series, but that would take a lot of years in development I suppose.

>>32778675

I'd never, ever, EVER expect game freak to do anything like this either. And nobody else does. I think that's where much of the frustration on this board comes from. We know Pokemon can do better, and be better, but it will never happen. You can jump us several gens in the future. I gaurentee even by gen 10 we would still be doing basically the same thing we do now. Sure there might be some new gimmick like Z moves or Mega Evolution but at the end of the day all that really does is slightly change the numbers on the battle system we already have now. It doesn't really add anything new to battling. All a mega evolution does is change a pokemons stats and ability, maybe typing. It's essentially just a new kind of Pokemon. The only thing separating it from any other Pokemon is that you can only use one per battle but really that's it, it's just a new Pokemon.

>>32778729
That's so depressing.
YGO, a card game, shifts completely the gameplay every god damn season.
Either GF are god damn pussies, or we don't know shit about coding a monster collecting battle videogame where you have to keep balance in a 820+ roster.

Here's what I want in my switch Pokemon game. I want to feel like the six year I was first discovering Pokemon. I wanna relive climbing the hill in my backyard "searching for wild and rare Pokemon". This game needs imagination. Watch the first season of the anime and that's exactly how you should do things.

So hypothetically, lets say we get a Kanto re-imagining. I want Pallet Town to actually feel like a town, and not just have two houses, and a couple of homeless NPCs. I wanna hike on Route One, and find more than just Pidgey and Rattata. I wanna discover side cities when I'm not doing the Gym Challenge. You can include things like the hidden grotto's from Black and White, you can have a mega evolution themed post game. If you have a bunch of side routes, side quests(even if it's "Oh no! It's Team ________ and they stole my _______! Could you please save him!") in addition to the main story, it would be perfect. Again, look at the first season of the show. Had Ash followed the regular path that we all did playing Red and Blue for the first time, It probably would have been 20-25 episodes long instead of 80 episodes.

This doesn't have to necessarily be Kanto(I'll admit that I'm partial due to the fact that I'd want my first set of games to get the fix-up that we'd all want our favorite games to get.), and to be honest, it might work more with a brand new region. But the thing that they have to do is make the games not feel as empty as they have in the past. If we're in Celadon City(Or Lumiose City if it were to go to Kalos), it should feel like I'm in the capitol of a country. While they accomplished that with Lumiose, Celadon just feels like just another town.

I'll put it simple, I have never enjoyed open world games.

I love doing shit that I want when I want it and I judge a game by its gameplay rather than by the amount of walking I have to do and the graphics.

I'm OK with railroading as it doesn't take control out of you.

The problem with SM is that it takes control out of the player for long as periods of time during the beginning, and that sucks ass.

Other games have pulled this off awfully, BW first section with the dreamyard is a chore only compared to half life "cutscenes" and Sinnoh as a whole was a mess with railroading done by HM navigation as well as shit to slow you down that translated poorly gameplay wise.

Open world won't solve any of those issues, if anything it will exacerbate them and make us take a pause from the main element of the game, catching and training Pokémon.

The transition is simply put, not worthy.

Take a look at Doom, any installment of the franchise, the daddy of FPS, back in the day called Doom clones until half life appeared and the FPS term was created.

Doom is mostly a corridor shooter with arena elements, the arena part was exacerbated in doom 2016 and the corridor horror was put on Doom 3 but lost during Doom 3 expansions.

Doom at its core is a game we're you shoot demons to advance and shoot bigger demons, yet the maps are huge, filled with secrets and power ups that make killing more demons more awesome.

The game was always divided by missions but they nailed the exploration of the maps, be facilities, cities or hell to a point they got their own identity.

This is an example of a railroad game that took its cake and eat it, huge maps, loads of shit to kill and even more stuff to do, check this franchise if you ever felt that gaming was stale, if anything the nonstop action might make you realize a huge map is a waste of disk space if you aren't doing shit in it.

>>32778800

>keep balance in a 820+ roster.

You know God damn we'll there's probably 0-1 people working at game freak that even give the slightest of fucks about balance and that one person is probably the janitor. They don't care about balance and make no effort to pretend they do.

Reminder that literally every new gen they have the ability to raise the base stats of shitmon and change/make new abilities and they just don't. Reminder that psuedo legendaries get megas while Delcatty is a fully evolved Mon with less than 400 BST and an ability that actually makes it weaker for some reason. Reminder that Wulfric literally aknowledged that ice type sucks and yet they continuously do nothing about it despite showing willingness to change the type charts in gen 6 and do thinks like make electric types immune to paralysis and make Ghosts immune to trapping.

They don't give a fuck.

You want to battle using a system other than Smogon? Well I hope you like Ubers then, because that's what Game freak endorses without fans taking it upon themselves to try and intervene with this broken ass mess of a game.

>>32778816
I get what you're saying, but the real capital is saffron, not celadon
Also I like both of them, I think it's at least way more better executed than Mauville in RSE

>>32778890
Fuck I'm already regretting setting my hopes so high so early.

>>32778904
This is the reason why people actually like smogon.

They are the only ones that actually Karenfag in this franchise.

I try not to get too excited, I try to keep my hopes down, but this thread makes me want to tie the noose of dissapointment I'll need.

what's the gain of open world exactly? wew i can go here now and the levels are way above me, i lost
or you could do scaling bullshit which would never work properly since you could just cheese your way through with 5 level 1 pokemon and 1 level 100 pokemon

>>32778925
I know right?
Luckily there's no room for disappointment in USM, there's a silver lining in leaving 3DS forever

>>32776079
The game will LITERALLY be a slightly more HD looking Sun/Moon. They'll start off the new console by announcing a Red/Blue reboot, which includes:

>a fully remastered Kanto and Sevii Islands, complete with city personalisation (riverside Cerulean setting, port-town Vermillion, giant city Saffron, spooky Lavender, volcano Cinnabar, panoramic Cycling Road etc.)
>the camera will have full 360 degree support
>more pokemon will be added - baby pokemon, some Johto mons, more variety in caves/rivers/seas/Sevii Islands
>you will have mini-quests in most towns, acting like mini Trials of sorts
>same Gyms
>same Gym Leaders
>same E4
>small tweaks to pokemon stats
>small tweaks to pokemon models if you're lucky
>a few additional explorable areas (e.g. Cinnabar volcano)
>Giovanni and Team Rocket get prominent Admins and more personality
>Ride Pager returns with Kanto specific Rides
>Legendary Birds are battled in fierce Totem-esque battles, calling powerful allies (lol jk just trash allies)
>Mewtwo and Mew plot is expanded on, both are catchable in-game

And everyone will lap it up and love it.

Some combo of >>32778664 & >>32779201
is what I want

I would buy the Switch if they released an open world pokemon snap game. Or something similar, where the goal is to find/catch at least 151 Pokemon, some via NPCs, others hidden in the wild and maybe a few with puzzles or something

>>32779427
I don't think we could really go back from ~450 Pokémon per region. Especially when having a bigger region will necessitate variety so it doesn't seem stale or samey.

I can imagine if the map was sectioned off like Kalos, this would be a good method because you have several smaller doable tasks.

>>32776079
>That'd be stupid as fuck, Pokémon has to keep its main features:
>- Turn based battles
>- 6 Pokés team
>- Light main plot involving completing a series of challenges via pokémon battles
I'd be glad if they got rid of any of these.

>>32777678
Ohhh. Spotted the Internet tough guy.

Though I'm not sure how well Pokemon would lend itself to an open world. The tall grass/ not knowing what exactly you're about to catch is part of the thrill. Seeing said Pokemon just waltzing about the wilderness would kill that.

>>32776094
It wasn't at the core. But as exploration has dwindled away over the generations so has the fun of the new games.

>>32776094
Yes it was. Besides the Pokémon themselves, Gen 1 and 2 are all about exploring and moving about the map. Narrative is what doesn't have a place in Pokémon. Exploration is fucking secondary.

>>32776079

To add onto this for the retards struggling to picture what an open worl Pokemon could look like, in a familiar language you can all understand:

Imagine Kanto. Now take away every picket fence around every route, every impassable wall of trees, and fill in the rest of the map space present on the town map with new stuff. Boom, open world Pokemon. And it'd be great.

It won't happen though because GF are utterly incompetent. Nintendo would have to be directly involved for it to not be shit.

>>32782288
They have already replaced the last one with heavy-handed as fuck plot that never gives you a break to explore.

>>32776079
It would cost too much to do well. If they can barely make a tradition RPG well, how do you expect them to make something like an open world RPG well? Not to mention what the budget would have to look like.

And all that aside, I've played plenty of open world games. Sure its fun for awhile, but eventually it gets boring just walking for 10 minutes from town A to town B with nothing but the occasional spider or bandit along the way. Fast Travel eventually becomes your best friend, and there goes half of the open world aspect.

>>32782497
>>32782516
now this is autism

>>32782560
>It would cost too much to do well.
Pokémon is the single highest grossing media franchise of all time, this is no excuse.

>>32782564
Nice buzzword. Can I borrow it?

>>32782578
inability to accept change is a sign of autism, anon, it's no mere buzzword

>>32782596
Not sure if you noticed but the person I replied to said
But exploration was never a part of pokémon, I don't want it to change!

>>32782570
Most other games that do open world release a new entry maybe every 4-6 years. Pokemon releases a new entry every 1-2 years. Thus the budget required to get it done in that time frame would be much higher.

>>32782631
Or they could just use more development time.

>>32776079
Such stubborness.

Go to facebook, you're better off over there.

Furthermore,
>BotW
baby's first open world

Shame that your first game of such type had to be a watered-down, cartoon Skyrim for kids.

>>32782647
>just use
"Time is money," isn't a meme, dumbass, more time entails all kinds of expenses. Expenses they're not willing to do.