I know some anons here who think the BW story is bad to the point

you misspelled XY anon

>>32269391
>I don't disagree

I bet you like XY

>>32269391
It's bad because it makes no sense in-universe. It's only value comes from breaking the 4th wall, and even then, it's completely useless because it does nothing to discourage what the nature of the games are. It fails on all counts.

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>>32269391
>Since Plasma never gives you a break it makes the game less fun. It's just mowing down the same 5 or 6 evolution lines over and over again. N is the only thing they have resembling an admin and they couldn't even incorporate his team gimmick with the grunts
>To add to this, in Nacrene City they steal the Dragon Skull thinking it's Reshiram/Zekrom. It's established the Seven Sages were gathered from across the world. How the hell did one of them not take a look at the thing before the operation and go "Hey that's a Dragonite"
>Entire Pokemon world has consistently shown people and Pokemon living in harmony with myths constantly pointing out that they are best together, and now we're supposed to question that because?
>There are little if any examples in Unova of trainers mistreating or neglecting their Pokemon so it feels like Plasma's goals are retarded instead of something to consider
>Soon after you are introduced to Plasma the next thing you see them do is punt a Munna so you already know they're corrupt at the very fucking beginning despite it supposedly being a plot twist
>Bianca is just I'M CLUMSY :DDD until the scene where her dad confronts her and then suddenly she's everyone's bodyguard. Not horrible, but it's not some amazing character development either
>Most gym leader's character can basically summed up as their profession and basic morals. There are exceptions, however like Clay and Drayden
There may be more, but that's what comes to mind right now.

>>32269438
Thanks for your reply but
>Since Plasma never gives you a break it makes the game less fun. It's just mowing down the same 5 or 6 evolution lines over and over again. N is the only thing they have resembling an admin and they couldn't even incorporate his team gimmick with the grunts

This is more of a gameplay thing so not what I'm asking for. I'm talking purely about the narrative and dialogue. Some of your other points were good though.

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>>32269397
>>32269408
>Unova apologists at full force posting nothing but "b-but XY..."
Every single time like a clockwork

I mean it's not like literally any of the other games' stories are any better. BW's story just sucks in a different way.

BW1's plot is shit because it telegraphs everything so hard to the point that there's no impact to any of its story developments, especially when the game acts like something is shocking or in general revelatory but you already figured that shit out ten hours ago; also what >>32269426 said

While I'm at it, SM has some lopsided focus issues and feels like it abruptly drops things at times or abruptly gets them involved in really unnatural feeling ways, and XY has issues with how it doesn't go in-depth enough on just about anything or anyone but AZ's history and the actually pretty cool Looker quest despite having lots of interesting setups or tidbits that just beg to be expanded on

Everything else is too barebones to get in a fuss about, except HGSS and ORAS make some dumb changes that may upset people, with HGSS' Kimono Girls chosen one shit clashing with the more subdued atmosphere of the original Tajiri directed games and ORAS' Zinnia retroactive main story hijack making her feel like a bad fanfic character

>>32269477
They aren't wrong though.

>>32269699
>this other story is crap and i am projecting that you like this story on you
what part of this defends BW story? unovabortions need to stop deflecting criticism to other gens all the time

>>32269391
IDEALS VS TRUTH xd
and that's ignoring the fact that every time you take 3 steps in the game, an ingame cinematic happens

>>32269438
>Soon after you are introduced to Plasma the next thing you see them do is punt a Munna so you already know they're corrupt at the very fucking beginning despite it supposedly being a plot twist
Absolutely this. Plasma are shown to be genuine Bad Guys right from the start & so you automatically assume Ghetsis is too. If there was more exposure to him & we saw him doing things like denouncing the grunts' behaviour as A Few Bad Apples etc, then perhaps we could question it

Also N can fucking talk to Pokemon so either a) some genuinely did not like their trainers & wanted to be freed, or b) he's fucking deluded & could never understand them in the first place. Either way it should have been made clear

Your points about the shitty attempts at questioning the relationship between people & Pokemon were spot-on too. There was no context behind it

Stream of thoughts I've had in the past 5 minutes on how to fix the plot of BW:
>Plasma are no longer literally the only people being cunts to Pokemon. The grunts can still be dicks, but the higher-ups would have to make public statements condemning this
>we are shown a context of systemic mistreatment of Pokemon in Unova. Not just trainers but say things like workhouses etc. This could easily be done without being edgy or supposedly too dark for kids
>throughout the game we see a lot of dicks, which makes Plasma's overall goal seem noble. But we also meet a lot of people who are kind to their Pokemon & as we adventure various gym leaders/rivals/N/etc tell us how much our mons love battling. This brings Plasma's goals into question
>at the end of the game we The Player defeat Plasma & convince N but more importantly all of Unova because it's on regionwide TV (say Ghetsis had been broadcasting the fight because he thought N would win, then forgot to end it in his ragefit) through being a shining example of how a trainer should act
>we actually do more than maintain the status quo holy shit

>>32269438
>>Most gym leader's character can basically summed up as their profession and basic morals. There are exceptions, however like Clay and Drayden
This was WAY worse in past games. BW was the first game that showed gym leaders actually having a life outside of their gyms. I agree with the rest though.

>>32269804
>he's fucking deluded & could never understand them in the first place. Either way it should have been made clear

You live in a world where Tumblr exists, and you find this hard to understand?

>>32269391
Well, just look at the setting. The backstory of N and Team Plasma.

Let's start with him being abandoned part. Somehow, after being left out in the wild, he BEFRIENDED wild animals, the ones that attack you the second you step in grass. That doesn't make sense. Then he learned to TALK WITH FUCKING POKEMON by just living with them for a few years. There are people like Alder and Drayden who has lived with Pokemon for fucking half a century, and they can't talk Pokemon, but N can in just a few years. Someone living in wild wouldn't even understand the concept of language, but he not only understands this, he learned a language no one else can. That makes no sense, and is absolutely retarded. And that's assuming Pokemon have a universal language between themselves, something just as retarded, but I'll overlook this.

Then Ghetsis picking him up. Ghetsis came across N, a kid who can't even understand language, and came up with the plan to rule the region using this kid he knows nothing about. He adopted the kid, built a castle for him with magic money, made a whole organization and hired Ninjas for him, found the most abused Pokemon, the ones who've never SEEN a happy Trainer/Pokemon relationship even once in their entire life and gave those to N, told N that all Pokemon are abused and expected him to believe this, despite being able to TALK to Pokemon, learned about the existence and resting place of Unova's Gods, hoped those Gods would choose N to be their Hero based on NOTHING, and hoped N would become the strongest Trainer, stronger than the Champion, despite hating battles and having no experience with them. This entire setting makes no sense in any way. You cannot justify it in any way.

As you can see, it's all just full of holes and illogical decisions. I will give credit to BW. It at least had a dramatic story. That alone puts it above everything before. But this story was, really, really bad. Worse than shit tier.

>>32269993
>I will give credit to BW. It at least had a dramatic story. That alone puts it above everything before. But this story was, really, really bad. Worse than shit tier.
I don't understand this mindset. No story a la Gen 1 and 2 is better than a shit story if you ask me.

>>32270098
I need some story. Even if it is shit, any story is better than no story. I felt like I had nothing to do in Gen 1 and 2, because I was doing the same thing over and over again. Battle. There was nothing else going on to occupy me. I hated every time I encountered Team Rocket, because there was no story, just more battles that are stopping from getting the next badge.

>>32269578
Wow, I didn't know people in /vp/ could actually explain themselves.

>>32270118
That's the thing. ALL the villains are a distraction from the only thing the game lets you do. Go on your pointless badge quest.

>>32270136
By the way, fuck you, Kukui. You ruined the only thing that was good about Alola. Now everyone will just be obsessed with battling and completely miss the fucking point.

>>32269477
>>32269738
>Kalosperm getting this buttmad

>>32270136
Distraction, but they provide entertainment. The main quest is boring. Collecting badges is boring. It's the rivals and the evil team that make it bearable. Otherwise, all you're doing is one shotting weak Pokemon for no reason. Some pointless and badly written drama is still better than repeating the same boring action over and over again.

>>32270170
That's not what the games are about. You're going to speak against the games? Against your collecting, trading, and being the best? WILL YOU!?

>>32270170
Sorry anon, but I don't particularly give a shit about the evil teams or most rivals, I'm oneshotting those weak Pokemon so I can watch my own Pokemon grow stronger, learn new moves, and change form. And I like seeing the new locations I come across as the games go on, too.

>>32270251
Yeah, everyone who plays Pokemon likes that too. The point was, it gets boring. Fast.

>>32270275
Considering that's over 90% of my hundreds of hours of playtime in XY and SM alone no it really doesn't.

>>32270136
>>32270170
>>32270251
>>32270275
That kinda raises a question.
Why do you guys play Pokemon, and what makes a "good" Pokemon game in your eyes?

>>32270311
Crystal was good in my eyes, BW2 was good in my eyes, i mostly play spinoffs anyway.

>>32270311
MD, the Ranger series, heck, even Pokepark.

>>32270311
Pretty much all of them are good. I enjoy seeing the series change over time and play with new amounts of story and gameplay, even if it makes it slightly worse it's still nice to not have the series stagnate.

>>32270311

No overbearing story and good postgame.

>>32270311
Good Pokemon, challenge, new region to see and explore and good music. That used to be it, for most part. The recent games have made me enjoy a few more things about the games, which have left me a bit spoiled. Interaction with Pokemon like with Refresh and Amie, 3D graphics and a good story and likeable characters to get me invested in the games. Now I find it hard to play Pokemon without these. For example, XY failed horribly in the characters department, which brought my overall opinion of the game down. I only really cared about Calem. There were a few others I liked, like Emma, but many characters I just hated.

As for what is a "good" game in my eyes, almost every game that isn't a first version of any Generation. That means I think all except for RGB, GS, RS and DP. I think BW and XY are just average. My favorites are BW2 and SM.