What makes a Legendary a Legendary? This question never really

>>31487993
We need research deeeeper

>>31487993
This is a Pokemon that has a role in the way the world works. It is a symbol of something.

A Legendary is whatever GF calls a Legendary.

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>>31487993

>>31487993
They're a pokemon with considerably more inherent power than most other pokemon, a lot more rarity both mechanically and lore-wise, significant information dedicated to them in the same sense, and a pokemon with other qualities that separate them from regular pokemon, such as special designs and such.

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>>31488149

Gen 7 blurred the line a lot with Cosmog and Silvally. At this point they're just whatever GF considers a legendary.

Legendary: Pokemon that cannot breed the SAME pokemon.

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>>31488173
but anon, I'm a legendary too!

>>31488168
>tfw gen 7 blurred the definition of legendaries so much that I can't safely say what is and isn't a legendary
what do

>>31488173
Nidoqueen is a legendary then.

>>31488154
>They're a pokemon with considerably more inherent power than most other pokemon

Does that make Mega-mence a legendary?
Does that make slaking a legendary?

>a lot more rarity both mechanically and lore-wise

I'm willing to bet there are way more lunalas than scizors on the GTS right now

>>31488217
what gts does to do with anything?

>>31487993
according to the rules of the alola friendly only lunala, Solgaleo and necrozma are legendaries in the alola dex. The Tapus are NOT legendary, nor are the UBs,Type:null,Silvally and Cosmog + the first evolution

>>31487993

>high status
>not bredding
>just ONE per game (universe)
>a ugly movie

>>31488217
I implied it needed all of those to be a legendary, you can catch bagons by the dozen in their spawning cave, slakoths are easy to come by and scythers can be mss bred and sold like rocket did back in Kanto. You can only get one lunala, and she/it is better stronger than two of those, while keeping the diferenciating trait of being a fucking transdimensional alien

>>31488168
>Silvally a legendary

No, it isn't.

>>31488242
So Manaphy isn't a legendary then.

>>31488244
oh, and magearna and marshadow

>>31488249
Yes, it is.

>>31488249
genesect and mewtwo are

>>31488257
It can't breed another manaphy

>>31488252
You can get more than one manaphy?

>>31487993
Cannot breed (except Manaphy), does not evolve into anything, cannot evolve from anything (Except Solgaleo/Lunala), have stat totals well above the usual (> 540, usually 580 and up) and cannot be encountered more than once per game; May or may not be exclusive to events.

Cosmog, Cosmoem, and Phione are not Legendaries.
Ultra Beasts are.

>>31488275
>Cosmog, Cosmoem, and Phione are not Legendaries.

but the game literally says Cosmog and Cosmoem are legendaries when they're registered in the Pokedex.

>>31488261
>>31488267
Genesect and Mewtwo also dont evolve from anything and have higher BSTs than Shitfolly. If it was a permanent forme change with higher stats, then Type: Full would be a Legendary but it isn't.

>>31488275
but the UBs (and Tapus) are allowed in the Alola friendly, despite the rules saying, tht no legendaries are allowed (only applies for Magearna,Lunala, Solgaleo and Necrozma)

>>31488284
and why ultrabeast are legendaries if they are just pokemons from another dimension

>>31488290
Whether or not it evolves from something isn't relevant when Solgaleo and Lunala exist.

>>31488275
can't you catch more than one of some of the ultra beasts per game though?

>>31488295
Cant breed them

>>31488249
According to the in game text it is classified as a SubLegendary, same as stuff like Moltres, Thundurus, Buzzwole, Registeel, etc. So yes, by the game's own account, it is a legendary Pokemon.

>>31488300
Like a billion Nihilego exist; that doesnt make them not Legendaries even if Sun/Moon has a distinct classification for UBs.

>>31488293
According to that logic, then Lati twins and the Muskedeers aren't legendaries. Zapdos isnt a Legendary.

>>31488299
Solgaleo is drastically different from Cosmoem in pretty much every single way; Type: Full is literally just Type: Null without a mask. Again, if GF wouldve made it an irreversible forme change, it'd be a Legendary. But it isn't.

>>31488327
>Solgaleo is drastically different from Cosmoem in pretty much every single way

doesn't matter. And Type: Null is also a legendary anyway.

>>31488275
Phione is considered a mythical Pokemon by GF because it is event only (hence the tournament ban). Different from legendary, but the term mythical was only recently used in the english versions of Pokemon despite being used since the beginning in JP.

>>31488307
>Literally saying fucking Registeel and Thundurus are not legendaries

Fucking retard nys

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>>31488275
>cannot be encountered more than once per game
>Ultra Beasts are.

>>31488340
Did you even read my post? I said they ARE legendaries. They are considered sublegendaries as according to the in game terms used, obtained from the datamine. Registeel and Thundurus are classed the same as Silvally, sublegends.

>>31488337
Thats the other thing.
If UBs are not, then Arceus is not a Legendary, neither are Darkrai or Shaymin, or Mew, etc.

Which basically means legendaries are Mewtwo and Box mons and nothing else besides shit like Heatran and Cresselia

>>31488359
Correct, as the terminology is separate and Mythicals were always considered different from legendaries. However when speaking about them, it is common to address both as legendary, so no reason to get technical unless it is this type of conversation.

Someone post the pic of the datamine that lists the sub legends and legendaries.

>>31487993
If they're classified in the games code as Legends or Sublegends.

Do we really need to have this thread again?

>>31488388
>>31488359
Oh and to add to it, the Mythicals are also considered legends in game like>>31488400 said, and are only referred to separately by official Pokemon media such as Pokemon.com and other such things.

I am curious as to what Phione is classed as though in game code

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a pokemon could be a legendary if it possesses great power or control over a force of existence.

>>31488400
blame GF

>>31488481
blame /vp/

>>31488425
iPhone is classified as a legend

>>31488604
Is this a teaser for next gen?

>>31488604
In the in game code? Well I guess that makes it an officially considered mythical.

>>31488212
Just modify it then:
Pokemon that in any form of the entire evolution line, cannot breed the SAME pokemon.

>>31488633
Yes.

>Sublegends
Moltres
Zapdos
Articuno
Raikou
Entei
Suicune
Regirock
Regice
Registeel
Latias
Latios
Uxie
Mesprit
Azelf
Heatran
Regigigas
Cresselia
Cobalion
Terrakion
Virizion
Tornadus
Thundurus
Landorus
Type: Null
Silvally
Tapu Koko
Tapu Lele
Tapu Bulu
Tapu Fini
Nihilego
Buzzwole
Pheromosa
Xurkitree
Celesteela
Kartana
Guzzlord

>Legends
Mewtwo
Mew
Lugia
Ho-oh
Celebi
Kyogre
Groudon
Rayquaza
Jirachi
Deoxys
Dialga
Palkia
Giratina
Phione
Manaphy
Darkrai
Shaymin
Arceus
Victini
Reshiram
Zekrom
Kyurem
Keldeo
Meloetta
Genesect
Xerneas
Yveltal
Zygarde
Diancie
Hoopa
Volcanion
Cosmog
Cosmoem
Solgaleo
Lunala
Necrozma
Magearna
Marshadow

>>31488741
Nice. Thanks for the list anon.

>>31488679
Like Unown and Ditto?

>>31488752
No prob

The tapus, ultra beasts and null are not legendaries according to the alola friendly, it hasn't been confirmed what they're classified as, unless we get confirmation in an interview that they're legendaries don't classify them as such
>>31488275
>exclusive by event
So Notched Ear Pichu, Cosplay Pikachu and Ash-Greninja are legendaries? They can't breed nor evolve, and Pichu and Pikachu can't be traded into another game

>>31488679
unown and ditto are legendaries?

>>31488327
>According to that logic, then Lati twins and the Muskedeers aren't legendaries. Zapdos isnt a Legendary.
i cant remember that there was ever a tournament that disallowed "legendaries" (this is literally writen in the rules) in the first place...
The pokemon you mentioned are not allowed in that tournament anyways, as it only allows Pokemon from the Alola dex

>>31488979
>So Notched Ear Pichu, Cosplay Pikachu and Ash-Greninja are legendaries?
Forms you retard.

Total Stats are above 600 without a gimmick like Slaking

Exactly 600 is Psuedo legends

>>31492648
you know that almost every trio legendary has 580 BST right?

1. BST above 580
2. Being literally *legendary*, as in, most people don't really know if they even exist

That's why UBs, Silvally and Tapus aren't legendary. They do not fulfills these basic factors.

whatever's banned from the battle tower

>>31492703
cosmog and cosmoem have less than 580 BST but are legendaries.

>>31492737
they are related to them by evolution

>>31488741
do you have the source for this?

>>31492786
Its from the datamine, from Kazowar or some of those Twitter guys

>>31488249

It's background in the Pokedex is green, the same background color as the Tapus and UBs. Gold/yellow background = big league legendary.

Green background = sub legendary, same tier as 3 legendary Birds, Dogs, Regis, Healthy Meta Genies, etc.

Unless you're autistic enough to think that those other Pokemon aren't legendaries, then just accept that Type: Null and Silvally are Legendaries. Gamefreak defines them as such, bottom line.

>>31493789
>Gamefreak defines them as such, bottom line.
i'd agree, except you're wrong.
literally every single battle format that bans the legendaries from this gen (read: box legends, nebbys, necromza, zygarde, and necromza) does NOT bad type:null/slivaly.
Read: you're fucking wrong.

>>31493824
He's not wrong you retard. They're classified as legendaries but they're still allowed. See the chart here k>>31488741

It's in the sublegends catagory, next to mons like Moltres and Latios which have always been allowed in tournaments.

>>31493864
that's not what he's arguing you fucking retard.
he's saying that type:null/slivaly are NOT sublegends, that they are full blown legends.
And I'm saying that he's fucking wrong because they're sub legends.

>>31493824
Dude, every format that bans legendaries doesn't usually ban sublegends. Were the genies banned in gen 6? Were the Regis?

>>31493824

Oh, so you are one of the autists I mentioned who thinks that the Legendary Birds, Beasts, Regis, Genies and Musketeers are not legendaries?

Use your fucking brain retard.

Sub Legendaries are almost always allowed in tournament play, it's only the 600+ BST legends that are pretty much always banned.

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>>31493893

>It's background in the Pokedex is green, the same background color as the Tapus and UBs.

>Green background = sub legendary, same tier as 3 legendary Birds, Dogs, Regis, Healthy Meta Genies, etc.

Gee, reading comprehension isn't your strong suit is it?

>>31493789
>then just accept that Type: Null and Silvally are Legendaries. Gamefreak defines them as such, bottom line.

>>31493864
>>31493898
>>31493902
>>31493921
ITT: people who can't read.

>>31493933

Sub Legendaries are a category within the umbrella term of legendary.

The person that I was originally responding to was saying that Silvally is not a legendary in anyway, my point was that it is a legendary, specifically a sub legendary.

It is clearly you who cannot read, or are at least getting way too hung up on the semantics of the one instance in which I didn't add "sub" in front of the legendary.

All sub-legendaries are legendaries.

Not all legendaries are sub-legendaries.

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easy, a legendary is a pokemon that's banned from battle tower/frontier and variations of them

>>31488346
Why are ultra beasts shiny locked if you can find multiple ones in the same game? Why does gamefreak hate fun?

>>31494046

That's not specific enough, as all of the sub-legendary Trios are allowed in the Tree/Tower.

Birds, Beast, Regis, Lake Trio, Genies, 4 Musketeers are all allowed, have a BST of 560-590 and are clearly some degree of legendary. Ultra Beasts and Tapus would fall under this as well now.

>>31494086

Damn, Lando has a BST of 600 apparently. All the more reason it "should" be banned, but isn't despite being a Legendary of some sort.

>>31494105
>lando should be banned
>mew and celebi probably shouldn't
what we need... is our own way of tiering things. Our own community, dedicated to making balanced, fun, competitive metagames based off of community bans and unbans.
wouldn't that be a weird world

>>31494086
GF hasn't given any indication that trios are actually 'legendary' and not just abnormally powerful and rare

>>31494185

That's a genuinely good idea. We should do that, and then we should start taking it way too seriously, and get all up in our own asses with asinine politics and arcane rules that turn what should be a fun game into a soul-sucking exercise in petty arguments and nonsensical inconsistencies.

>>31494257
cool.
i'll start a site.
we need a cool name of a well known pokemon in a different language, so that people will be attracted by the pokemon they know and a name they don't...
Glurak is too obvious.
Other suggestions?

>>31494194

How aren't they legendary? Only one of each can be found per-game, and almost all of the Trios are directly related to a big-league legendary, either as protectors/guardians or in some cases it is implied that the big-league legend created them.

Regardless, the Sun/Moon Pokedex has made a distinction that will help unblur the line for us, moreso once Pokebank/National Dex is out.

As of now, the Dex uses a different colored background depending on the category of Pokemon.

Big-league legends that being the Cosmog-line, Zygarde, Magearna and Necrozma have Gold/Yellow radiant backgrounds and a many large sparkling particle effects around their name.

Sub-legendaries, still legendary, but are allowed in post-game battle facilities, such as Type: Null, the Tapus and the Ultra Beasts all have a green background, and a smaller sparkling particle effect around their names.

All other Pokemon have Blue backgrounds and no sparkles.

Thus, we can make the assumption that Tapus/UBs are likely on the same tier of "legendary" as the previous Trios/Quads, and therefore the older Trios/Quads will likely also have the green background/name sparkles in the National Dex.

>>31494194
Yes, they have: http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/File:Phione_Mythical_2011_Style_Guide.png

This a page from a leaked marketing guide that showed the legendaries and mythicals as of early Gen V.

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>>31494194
???

>>31494194

>>31494349
>>31494371

Why are people so particular about this subject. If there's not a glowing neon sign that says "This is a Legendary" or it's not on the boxart of a game then people just refuse to accept that it's legendary.

It is very clear that the Trios/Quads are legendaries, seems like some sort of misguided denial when claiming otherwise. It ruins the "feel" of legendaries because there are too many?

>>31494414

Some people are just desperate to argue about anything.

>>31494443
NUH-UH!

guys theres this super new method for figuring out whats legendary and what isnt

>can you use it in game X facility
>no?
>its legendary

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>>31494479

Read the fuckin thread.

All Trios/Quads, Tapus and UBs are allowed in post-game facilities, and are all considered legendary. They are sub-legendary, a class within legendaries.

Thus, not allowed in post-game battle facilities = legendary is not an accurate way to determine legendary status.

You're also the Nth person to bring up that half baked idea, think for a second would ya.

>>31494509
>half baked idea
kind of like your lucario

>>31494509
>All Trios/Quads ... They are sub-legendary, a class within legendaries.

No, they're straight-up legendaries. See >>31494349 and >>31494371. Gamefreak has literally said "they are legendaries."

The only real question is the Tapus and the UBs. Everything prior to Gen VII is pretty clear-cut.

>>31493824
Weaker legionaries aren't banned.

>>31494371
This is fake as shit.

>>31494530
>not wanting distinctions between legends, sublegends, and mythicals
why live?

>>31494540
Those are the graphics that accompanied the serial codes given in Pokemon trainer club emails.

>>31494530
>The only real question is the Tapus and the UBs
Wait... let me get this straight.
You're saying that there is no distinction between legends / sub-legends... and then you turn around to say that there's a question of tapus/UBs being EITHER?

What the fuck are you smoking, anon?
I want some..

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>>31494523

Dude, what?

>>31494530

Yes, sub-legendary is a class within legendaries. They are indeed "straight up legendary." Game Freak was just marketing shit, they don't bother categorizing the specifics to casuals who probably don't care otherwise.

The whole "sub-legendary" categorization is primarily by the players, pointing out the Legendary pokemon, who despite clearly being legendary, are allowed in post-game battle facilities/online multiplayer under normal rules.

And gen VII does define them quite clearly, >>31494339

It is very likely that all of the previous Trios/Quads will have green backgrounds in the gen VII national Dex, and thus will be in the same category as the UBs/Tapus, which are also obviously legendaries.

So, once again. Sub-legendary are just legendaries that for whatever arbitrary reason Game Freak thinks are balanced enough for post-game facilities/online play.

>>31494547

Gamefreak does formally distinguish between "legendary" and "mythical." That's it. Sorry.

>>31494540
>This is fake as shit.
well you just confirmed you never got the HA birds.
kys.

>>31487993
I'd say any mon that has enough lore that makes it seem important enough to warrant the title, or if it is unique. Evolution, gender, and breeding are to be disregarded now.

>>31494567

>>31494339

Explain the Sun/Moon Dex background/name sparkles.

That is very clearly Game Freak making distinctions between two classes of legendaries. They must have detected the immeasurable amount of butthurt being generated by angry nerds arguing about legendary classifications over the internet and decided to finally lay it out for us.

>>31494563

I'm smoking this new thing called "reality."

Look, I'm not saying anything particularly complicated or controversial. All I'm saying is that Gamefreak has formally defined "legendaries" and "mythicals." That's it. No "sub-legendaries" or whatever. If you want to define something as such, fine, but it's entirely a fan definition, and not any official designation.

The point about Tapus and UBs is that they may very well be some sort of new classification. But for everything prior to Gen VII, it's just Legendary, Mythical, or neither.

>>31494603
Not him and he's being retarded but sublegend is the in game name they are referred to as according to the datamine.

>>31494603
>there is an official distinction between legends and mythicals, but not one between legends and sub legends.
Nope. Sorry. You're wrong.
Both are made up terms by the fans.
Arcanine was the original legendary pokemon, so don't even begin trying to argue with me that GF knows what the fuck they're doing / has any sort of plan in place.

And you're still trying to say that the Tapus/UBs are something different, entirely?
Fuck, man- where can I score me some of this 'reality' shit? Sounds like a fucking good trip.

Also- this entire fucking thread keeps using the word 'legendaries'.
Protip: that isn't a fucking word.

>>31494630
Is it? That's actual news to me. What Pokemon is it used for? If it's for the Tapus/UBs, that supports my point, but if it's for anything older, that's certainly something interesting that I hadn't expected.

>>31494646
I'm not going to give you a full response, because it's just not worth it to argue with you anymore, but in response to "Both are made up terms by the fans," I'll just direct you again to >>31494349, which shows those terms being used in an official capacity by TPCI.

>>31494677
>2011
because there were no pokemon fans arguing on the internet about legend distinction before 2011, so you must be right anon

>>31494677
It's used for all the old trios plus the new ones as well, afaik.

>>31487993
>This question never really came up until Gen 4
????????????

At this point the REAL Legendaries are the ones that can't be used in Battle Facilities and most Battle Spot Tournaments.

>>31488303
>Alien pokemon from another fucking dimension are unable to breed with low tier shitty regular pokemon
Well, color me shocked

>>31488241
Incorrect. There are some legendary Pokemon that are allowed in VGC. Refer to HGSS, Suicune and the other two were called legendary Pokemon in more than one context. Usually the unusable legends in competitions are box art legends (including the third Pokemon whether it had it's own game or not) and mythical Pokemon which are not necessarily too strong for standard play according to Smogon community.

>>31488252
You missed the ugly movie.

>>31494901
manaphy and heatran came out, wich make people think about an actual definition of legendaries. On gen 7 the line is again crossed with solgaleo/lunala and UBS. On gen 8 the starter is also the legendary pokemon.

Pokemon with god-like powers in the anime. That's it.
Time for headcanons:

The birds are a rare blessed breed of, just that, birds.

The johto beasts were originally rare doglike pokemon that existed 150 years ago. Ho-Oh caused a handful to mutate into the beasts. These bred with the reminding ones and eventually all these dogs were replaced with beasts

Mew is an ancient species of pokemon, the first (non-godlike) in fact. There are multiple, but they are almost extinct

The three Regis are only one of each, unless Regigigas made a few backups. I'm unsure wether only the ones in Hoenn canon or not

Latinos are mysterious dragons from the spirit realm or some shit. There are many. They are always conceived in pairs. Maybe they start out as one and the same pokemon (Their megas are near identical. Coincidence? I think not)

The lake trio is unique. Created by Arceus after all

Manaphy and Shaymin are just natural mutations. Nothing special about them

The justice mons are part of several species of pokemon that went extinct in the old war in Unova. These are the sole survivors. Maybe they only breed during rare circumstances

Tapus were probably sigyliph or something that were mutated by wormholes. Now they live in symbiotic relationships with humans

The big legends are all unique, cept the Alola ones

>>31488741
arent mew and mewtwo mythic?