http://www.smogon.com/forums/thread s/initial-gen-7-uu-banli

>>31227990
Nigga are you for real? My bromon for gen 7 made it big time?

>>31227990
>Greninja-Ash
>7

>Charizard-Mega-X
>28

JUSTICE

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>b-but muk is going to be unviable!!!

Please, kill Landorous. I hate the fucking Genies.

>Tapu Fini has more usage than Tapu Koko

What is life?

>>31227990
>Zard Y dropped from OU again
Oh come on

>>31227990
so all muk needed was an extra type and different abilities to make it.good for you guys

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Heey Guys~

>landorus and keldeo are still UU

I'm still not used to seeing Pelipper in OU.

>>31228024
HEALTHY
E
A
L
T
H
Y

>>31227990
How do I build him? The one I used through the game has poison touch. Should I breed for power of alchemy?

>>31228036
Landorus is Ubers nigga
Also good to see Mandibuzz dropping so quickly
Also Tangrowth made it and Amoongus didn't

>>31228058
Power of Alchemy is a pretty gimmicky thing to run, so I'd say pick between Poison touch and Gluttony

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>that top ten
>Bulu is the only Tapu not in it

Poor Bulu.

Huh. Thought Toxapex and Celesteela would have been higher than that.

>>31228066
Lando has two forms

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>>31228076
bulu still OHKOS over half of the pokemon that exist

>Alakazam at 152

Life is rough

>>31228090
Yes. Regular is Ubers and Therian is OU

>>31227990
i dont see muk lasting
especially if lele leaves

>>31228116
did you even look at the fucking chart nigger

>>31228008
Go back to your contaminated thread.

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>Clefable

>>31228138
Landorus was banned at the start of December, what you see is leftover usage.

>>31228012
It's Suicune 2.0. And a great check to Ash-Greninja.

>>31228156
>Aether take years and years to painstakingly invent Type: Null to defeat and tame the Ultra beasts.
>A-Marowak does the job better

| 136 | Talonflame | 0.466% |

>>31228024
Welcome to Genie Games.

>>31228183
JUST FEATHER MY SHIT UP

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>>31228183
I never thought I'd see the day staraptor reclaimed its title as the bravest bird

>>31228024
hes slowly becoming like Aegislash or Primal groudon where there is no point in not using him

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>Shiinotic, Vivillion and Togedemaru have seen OU usage

OU: The meta, now with more cancer than ever
1 | Landorus-Therian | 36.141% |
| 2 | Tapu Lele | 25.332% |
| 3 | Tapu Fini | 19.984% |
| 4 | Genesect | 18.404% |
| 5 | Tapu Koko | 18.145% |
| 6 | Metagross-Mega | 17.621% |
| 7 | Greninja-Ash | 15.285% |
| 8 | Marowak-Alola | 14.762% |
| 9 | Pheromosa | 14.315% |
| 10 | Garchomp | 13.956% |
| 11 | Toxapex | 11.848% |
| 12 | Magearna | 11.783% |
| 13 | Ferrothorn | 11.491% |
| 14 | Heatran | 11.378% |
| 15 | Magnezone | 10.769% |
| 16 | Celesteela | 10.226% |
| 17 | Scizor-Mega | 9.967% |
| 18 | Tapu Bulu | 9.041% |
| 19 | Dugtrio | 8.622% |
| 20 | Latios | 8.432% |
| 21 | Excadrill | 8.291% |
| 22 | Skarmory | 8.211% |
| 23 | Chansey | 7.364% |
| 24 | Kartana | 7.315% |
| 25 | Zygarde | 7.117% |
| 26 | Mimikyu | 7.064% |
| 27 | Rotom-Wash | 6.962% |
| 28 | Charizard-Mega-X | 6.559% |
| 29 | Venusaur-Mega | 6.463% |
| 30 | Buzzwole | 6.343% |
| 31 | Sableye-Mega | 6.313% |
| 32 | Greninja | 5.975% |
| 33 | Hoopa-Unbound | 5.966% |
| 34 | Alakazam-Mega | 5.302% |
| 35 | Pinsir-Mega | 5.281% |
| 36 | Gyarados-Mega | 5.138% |
| 37 | Manaphy | 5.122% |
| 38 | Pelipper | 5.104% |
| 39 | Nihilego | 5.033% |
| 40 | Mantine | 4.233% |
| 41 | Xurkitree | 4.170% |
| 42 | Zapdos | 4.168% |
| 43 | Tyranitar | 4.126% |
| 44 | Mamoswine | 4.020% |
| 45 | Kingdra | 4.002% |
| 46 | Jirachi | 3.827% |
| 47 | Muk-Alola | 3.638% |
| 48 | Clefable | 3.568% |
| 49 | Tangrowth

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>| 216 | Sableye | 0.104% |
what the fuck happened?! was the prankster nerf that bad? does everyone seriously carry a dark type?!

Do I have to carry the mega now? I dont like stall and there's like no better way to use it. Fuck.

>>31228206
Shiiotics not too bad in rain
togedemaru has its gimicks
i can answer for gen 6 only bug pokemon

>>31228213
Meme pic when?

>>31228174
I remember when the Meta had just started I decided to use Tapu Fini just because no one else used it. I played at least 100 matches on OU (not Pokebank) and I never saw a Tapu Fini. I ran a support defog set with screens and it wasn't bad at all.

I'm glad my girl is becoming popular again, I remember tapu koko leads couldn't dent it once it had light screens up and its terrain, and my physical attackers loved not being burned, and Toxapex got fucked up against it as it couldn't toxic anything.

>>31228213
>OU: The meta, now with more cancer than ever
>when the top 10 are wallbreakers/sweepers/anti-stall
OU might be rotting with legends now, but at least stall is dying, so I'm good.

>>31228219
Everyone uses Lele too so they can shut down Priority in general without using their Dark Type, Sableye never stood a chance.

>| 9 | Pheromosa | 14.315% |
>| 16 | Celesteela | 10.226% |
>| 24 | Kartana | 7.315% |
>| 30 | Buzzwole | 6.343% |
>| 39 | Nihilego | 5.033% |
>| 41 | Xurkitree | 4.170% |
>>>>>| 163 | Guzzlord | 0.276% |
>All the UBs except for Hungry Hombre made it to OU
How could this happen to me?

>>31228219
regular sableye was BL2 Klefki was a much better prankster user

Fuk yes.

>>31228213
Everyone uses Metagross-Mega because if fucks up all the Tapus except Fini.

>>31228219
Cute Tapu of healthy meta happened

>>31228012
sure, lets kill lando-T, and then see how every relatively Ok sweeper gets quickbanned to Ubers as nothing can prevent them from completely fucking up stall, and OU becomes more cancerous than ever.

Face it, the genies' very presence helps the meta

>>31228239
I thought it was like mid UU in terms of usage last gen, this is unfair. Klefki doesn't get access to recovery or will-o-wisp.

Mega charizard Y is UU but pelipper is OU. Fuck game freak needs to buff sun teams already if this isn't telling enough Idk what is.

>>31228268
the problem is that the best users of sun are weakened by it even further. They need better abilities on fire pokemon to make use of sun, and then its better.

>>31228206
if only Shiinotic had +20 HP it would god tier

>>31228256
Klefki has a much better typing and bulk, which gives it mores switch-in opportunities for screens and T-Waves.

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>tfw | 40 | Mantine | 4.233% |
only took him 17 years but he finally made it
thanks game freak
now give me my manecite

>>31228279
you could say that for a lot of mons.

>>31227990
>Slowpoke used Confusion

>>31228294
ikr, if only Guzzlord had a little more HP...

>>31228279
i still wish he was poison/fairy
but i still love him

>>31228245
Thunder Punch.
MM/EQ/TP/IP is one of the best sets in this meta

>>31228183
Good night sweet prince

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>>31227990
>lando still on top
HE CAN'T KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH IT

>>31228310
Ah, in OU Megagross does not have Ice Punch and Thunder Punch unfortunately.

I want to run MM / ZH / IP / TP later, I know EQ is a great coverage move, but I'd prefer to have STAB.

>>31228301
>reading comprehension

>>31228268
What sun teams need is to not kill themselves from Solar Power recoil e better Chlorophyll users; as well as another strong move to take advantage of sun, rain teams have both Thunder and Hurricane to cover their shit, but sun only gets Solarmeme.

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| 74 | Gengar | 1.698% |

welcome to UU gengar
also
| 78 | Decidueye | 1.527% |

>>31228351
watch him get into BL

>>31228301
>confusion against a dark-type

you fags are the dumbest fuckers, lel.

>>31228233
>>31228246
wtf I hate lele now

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FLYGON STILL OUTCLASSED IN THE LOWER TIERS EVEN WITH DD.
I CAN'T STOP LAUGHING
147 | Garchomp-Mega | 0.385% |
| 148 | Drampa | 0.377% |
| 149 | Flygon | 0.369% |

>>31228360
that's even worse honestly BL is like a Purgatory of tiers.

>>31228364
>Muk used Thief!
>Muk obtained a Ring Target!
>Slowpoke used Confusion!

>>31227990
whats a good set of muk ?

>>31228380
More like
>Muk used crunch
>Slowpoke fainted!

>>31228301
Confusion on a dark mon, huh

>>31228375
at least it's still OU by technicality, 7 gens of surviving.

>>31228392
no

>>31228380
>Has to move goalposts and add contrived details to make his shitty meme work

consider suicide.

>>31227990
GILRUGAMESH!!!

>>31228402
>consider suicide.
You have to be 18+ to post on 4Chan

>Incineroar

>>31228227
Ive been running the bold calm mind set since day one

Its just so tanky, and thanks to its ability and taunt it gets to set up on alot of pivots that come in

>>31228412
What meme did I miss now?

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>>31228213
>Tangrowth
Wat

>>31228457
wow welcome to 2015 retard

>>31228457
the thing has been in OU since last gen, where the fuck have you been?

>>31228458
>>31228470
It was? That explains why I stopped seeing it around UU.

>>31228486
people finally realized it had good stats with the exception of sp.def, which is what assvest is for, and speed, which didn't matter too much when your main foe will hit first no matter what.

>>31227990
Did people not think muk was gonna be ou? Its assualt vest set fucks top lel in the ass, adamant nature with like 200 attack evs or something makes pursuit a whko without hazards and has a 20% chance to poison while scarfe lele cant do shit

Then he has gunk shit, a strong as fuck stab poison move with 50% chance to poison

Knock off with a chance to poison

Hes fucking great

>>31228457
>>31228458
>>31228470
I wasn't aware of this happening either. I'm glad, Tangrowth is cool.

>>31228268
Charizard y is only uu because of usage shit, it will be out soon

Also torkaol was a pretty big buff to sun teams as well since its the slowest weather setter now i think

Bellosome gets quiver dance now as well so im looking forward to fucking up shit with a dancing waifu plant

>>31228500
252+ Atk Muk-Alola Pursuit vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Lele: 157-186 (55.8 - 66.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

lol. and yes that's the doubled power

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Fug, Porygon-Z right above the cutoff. Ah well, if UU can't handle it it's heading straight for BL which might as well be OU

>>31228539
Oh man, I remember this dumbass moment I had the other day.

>be me, on ladder
>opponent has one poke left, I have two
>opponent sends out scarf tapu lele
>shadow ball knocks out my Megagross
>I sent out Porygon-Z
>I laugh as my opponent since he can't do anything
>use Z-Conversion
>type becomes Electric
>get knocked out immediately from Crit
>mfw

>>31228232
Apologies I meant to type character not cancer lel xD

>>31228450
A 7 years old one, newfriend.

WHY IS GLISCOR UU REEEEEEE
But seriously Gliscor is good in OU

>>31228012
>People shit on the genie's designs all the time
>They're good so they aren't going anywhere

Poetic.

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>>31228614
it gone anon, the tier has no need for another stallbreaker anymore, its time to look for greener pastures

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Number 78. Teehee.

>>31228457
Regenerator is one hell of a drug.

What's a good set for regular Zygarde?

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>>31228546
>Implying BL isn't worse than being UU
H-he's gone... A-at least he had a good run in OU, r-right?

>>31228539
>whko
It's clearly a phonefag that forgot to long press "w" so it becomes "2".

>>31228601
Ironic shitposting is still shitposting.

>CURSED
>BODY
What the fuck are they thinking.

>>31228268
Charizard has two megas. It doesn't need any more buffs and shilling.

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>>31228678
at least it absorbs toxic spikes right guys?

>>31228678
If you played pokemon mystery dungeon blue rescue team it makes perfect sense

>>31228631
Gligar has UU usage my dude, Gliscor is going to BL hell.

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>only fighting types that made the cut are Pheromosa and Buzzwole

>>31228678
That's not gonna keep it UU
It's at least getting BL'd

>>31228688
The anon was talking about buffing sun teams, you retard. Not Zard.
And fuck you, Zard deserves a Super Duper Hyper Giga Mega Evolution.

>>31228402
>no fun allowed
You took the b8 twice.

>>31228268
>Zardfags being this assblasted

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>volcarona still UU after talonflame's death

WHAT HAPPENED?

How did Buzzwole make the cut? What sets are people running?

>>31228705
No, NO, ANYTHING BUT THAT. BL is fucking atrocious, I'd rather have something in PU than in that shithole.

>>31228157
>Landorus was banned at the start of December
>>31228066
>Landorus is Ubers nigga
Why is it uber What can it do that makes it so bad?

Phew, glad someone finally told me what Pokemon to use! Now I can be a Pokemon Master!!!! :^^^^^^^)

>>31228339
>>31228364
>>31228393
not knowing the slowpoke is slow meme, get out underage

>>31228779
Stealth rocks,Alola marowak ,volcanion, Azumarill, tapu fini and Heatran

>>31228219
>prankster nerf
It's simply because nobody has used non-mega sableye since ORAS. When they started counting usage for pokemon with megas differently, sableye fell out of OU.

>>31228814
Special Landorus set it's very good

>>31228248
>stall
>ever using lando
>what is quagsire,clefable and haze
Please never post again

>>31227990
>Only one weakness
>Super tanky with Ass Vest
>Shits on the Tapus
>Access to STAB Knock Off
>Priority move to boot

Who is surprised about this? A-Muk is really good. It doesn't even need a reliable recovery move to function.

>>31228876
I never implied that you fucking idiot, I mean that the things that lando keeps in check fuck up stall, so without him smogon would ban them, learn to read.

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Should I go with Stockpile or Minimize for tanky stalling A-Muk?

>>31228865
more specifically sheer force + life orb special landorus is good

>>31228859

But there's still hidden power ground and energy ball!

>>31228892
You forgot

>Absorbs Toxic Spikes
>Poison Touch is a really good ability to passively fuck over mons who try to stall you out

I'm not surprised it's OU. It's what Skuntank wishes it was.

>>31228905
Lando doesn't check anything that fucks up stall you retard, tapu lele is the one completely fucking up stall

>>31228906
minimize is the obvious better choice, your defenses are already golden.

>>31228892
>running AssVest when Muk has nothing to fear from Special Attackers anyways

explain

>>31228924
>>Absorbs Toxic Spikes

literally no one uses this shit

>>31228936
Hardly surprising with muk and sea urchine being so popular, ironically sea urchine usually has toxic spikes

>>31228936
I've run into quite a few Nihilego leads that run Stealth Rock and T-Spikes.

>>31228400
That's not what BL means.

>>31228936
If no one is using something then its the perfect time to start using it (within reason) since no one will be able to counter it if they are just a meta sheep.

>>31228351
>| 78 | Decidueye | 1.527% |
New toy syndrome at its finest.

>>31229035
There's really no point in running Toxic Spikes since every team either runs A-Muk or Toxapex; two tanky as fuck poison types that absorb it whenever they appear.

>>31229052
Yes this is unfortunate. On another note why doesn't stealth get absorbed by rock types?

>>31229039
>Unsuccessful and desperate new toy syndrome

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>Kyurem B, Keldeo, Gliscor, Azumaril, Weavile both Thunderus and Tornadus forms are now UU
UU confirmed for last gen OU

>>31228076
That sucks, considering he's my personal fav of the Tapus

>>31228213
so really all this gen has to offer are UB's, more high powered legendaries and alola forms? Only like 3 actually new non legendary pokes are able to compete with the best of them?

Bring back Mega Mawile.

>>31229076
Wouldn't be healthy

>>31229052

Even if poison types didn't absorb TS, it's still a waste of a turn. If it were up to me, I'd gladly start every battle with all of my pokemon poisoned so I couldn't get burned by fucking scald, or paralyzed or put to sleep. Spikes are way better

>>31228706
Fairys killed fighting types

I dont even run much fighting moves anymore

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Smogon!!!! Release me!

>>31229168
God i remember when this fuckers defense form was ou that shit was cancer

>>31229126
Rather than trying to reinvent the wheel every gen they should just properly update old mons. And no Not through megas/alola forms just straight up making old mons better in terms of ability, stats and moves. Alola forms suggest they will be gone when we get a game outside of alola uless we get a special alola rock that causes pokes to breed alola forms.

>MamoGOD in OU
>shitvile in UU

The superior Ice mon WON

>>31229162
If you're running stall, Toxic Spikes are better; especially in conjunction with Stealth Rock.

It really just depends on the type of team you're running. I've run T-Spikes successfully in Gen 6 when using a team of mostly stallmons. Haven't been able to effectively use T-Spikes this gen because of all the A-Muks and Toxapexes. I use a Nihilego lead, and I'm seriously thinking about ditching T-Spikes in favor of Hidden Power or something.

I'm new to competitive battling. What makes the genies cancerous?

>>31229216
they r ugly asf

>>31229126
If you are excluding Legendaries, UB and Alola Forms, then you are left with just Toxapex and Mimikyu.

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>>31229216
Nothing. :^)

>>31229178
Kek.

>>31229216
Genies are like Mareanie

GENIES = MEANIES

>>31229216

Lando T is kind of the most controversial one at the moment. Anything that has intimidate+spammable U turn is cancerous, and landorus T had a great typing and stats to boot.

I kind of wish U turn altogether would be deleted from the game

>>31229229
Mimikyu is fucking useless fuck this meme mon

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>>31228012
>>31228024
>>31228248
| 1 | Landorus-Therian | 36.141%
Holy shit...
Ban him already, the difference with the others is soooo big!

>>31229252
I for some reason see patrick star saying this

>>31229261
It actually got worse to deal with this gen because Supersonic Skystrike lets it muscle past things that'd usually check it. What a pain in the ass.

>>31229126
Why are you surprised by this? Everyone knew the majority of non legend/non UB Gen 7 mons were going to be trash. The only surprises are really A-Marroak and Mimikyu, because everyone predicted they would be hot garbage. Competitive players knew Toxapex would be OU as soon as its stats, typing, movepool, and ability was revealed. The consensus was split on A-Muk's OU viability though.

I have no idea what GF was smoking when they designed the "normal" Gen 7 Pokemon, but it's almost like they intentionally screwed them over. Toxapex seems like the only mon they gave a shit about in terms of competitive viability. Mimkyu is really only good because of its ability and typing.

>>31229261
Nah, fucker takes 30% from tank chomp everytime he uturns

Honestly the biggest problem with lando t is just the sheer amount of sets amd spreads he runs, you never know what your gonna get. Only thing keeping him from being on literally every team is that 95 speed

>seismitoad has 6% usage

literally why?

>>31229317
They are all slow as shit.

>>31229317
Mimikyu aint good. Common walls like skarm and toxapex ruin the fucker and his speed just isnt enough

>>31229252
t. corsola

>>31228235
It's shit

>>31229352
Im imagining lando t scuba diving for corsala now

>>31229261
>I kind of wish U turn altogether would be deleted from the game
You and me both. Volt Switch is okay since it has an immunity, and thus it's high risk high reward.
U-turn (and to a lesser extent Parting Shot if not for its shit distribution) has ZERO risk because it's unblockable.

>>31229381
I think it's just distributed too much desu.

>>31229381
Bug is a shitty offensive typing so that kind of keeps things in check.

>>31229396
I think this is the problem, really. I think it's better to exist than not exist because Dugtrio would become even more disgusting without it, but some of this stuff really doesn't need it.

>>31229417
What if dugtrio got uturn

>>31229427
Not that useful. It's frail and fast.

>>31229417
>tfw forretress gets volt switch but still doesnt get u-turn

game freak really are fucking retarded.

>>31229433

How does being frail deter you from using uturn? It being fast is a benefit for uturn, because it's free damage on top of the switch, and if they switch, you can bring in a suitable counter

>>31229427
It be funny
>>31229411
Not that you use it for damage

Would you rather parting shot landorus T or U turn landorus T

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>| 1 | Landorus-Therian | 36.141% |
BOW TO THE KING

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>>31229351
Mimikyu is good, just not OU good. I think it'll drop to UU. It would be terrible if it dropped to borderline hell.

>>31229216
Nothing. It's a solid Pokemon that does well in almost any kind of team.

/vp/'s is just full of children/karenfags who's definition of cancerous is "anything that's high in usage but I don't like the design of".

>>31229479
GENIES IN MY HEAD GET THEM AWAY
MEANIES IN MY MIND IN GOING TO CRY

>>31229450
>Use U-turn
>They don't switch
>You've now lost momentum

>>31229351
Skarm, true story mate. Toxapex on the other hand can literally do nothing to a mimikyu with sub, to the point of struggling to break it. Toxapex is free setup at that point

>>31227990
>Tyranitar: 43
This Pokémon has never abandoned OU, can it be in the group of Pokémon that were always OU like Zapdos? (Starmie and Gengar no longer count)

>>31229518
In fact, they can't switch because of Dugtrio's ability. So U-Turn Dugtrio is stupid unless you want to trap something first and then switch into a counter for the opposing Pokemon. But if that was the case why not just switch in that Pokemon in the first place instead of Dugtrio?!

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>all these sub-1600 shitters thinking they know anything about the ladder

reminder to never take /vp/ seriously when discussing game balance

>>31229538
Zapdos dropped for a while in gen 5. I think Skarmory is more appropriate

>>31229538
Zapdos fell to UU a couple of times before. So really there is no "veteran" OU left.

>>31229563

chomp

>>31229563
I think this is the first time Starmie has dropped from OU

>>31228213
>legendaries and pseudos - the tier
so this.... is the power.............. of power creep........... wow..............

>>31229585
He was solid UU when Aegis was wrecking shit in early gen 6

>>31229578
Not gen 1
>>31229585
Pretty sure Starmie was UU in early stages of gen 6 meta thanks to the sword of balance

>>31229578
He left ou in gen 4

>>31229594

boblak pls

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>keldo in UU

what le fug?

The only mons that have stayed OU since their inception are Ttar, Skarmory, Jirachi, and LandoT

>>31229606
>>31229613
It wasn't early stages. It raised when Greninja was banned so early ORAS. Pretty much the entire XY it was UU

>>31229614
and 5 too but he was unbanned later on

>>31229636
I would add Breloom to this list, but it's dropped so hard this gen

>>31229501
No, cancerous is when one fucking third of the players use it and it still doesn't get banned or even suspected.

Smogon likes to preach about meta centralization but they haven't done shit to address Landorus T.

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>>31229636
>Skarmory is the only regular mon on that list
best birb confirmed

1. Does this mean Genesect probably won't be banned this gen?
2. Is extreme speed shiny genesect legal?
3. Is extreme speed physical genesect even preferred, or do most people just go with normal genesect with the special beams and uturn?

>>31229629
muh toxapex

>>31229674
unlikely
yes
classic mixed u-turn is still his most prefered set I believe

>>31229674
> Does this mean Genesect probably won't be banned this gen?
It's without a doubt getting banned. There's overwhelming support for that in the suspect thread
>Is extreme speed shiny genesect legal?
Yes
> Is extreme speed physical genesect even preferred, or do most people just go with normal genesect with the special beams and uturn?
The special beams + uturn, although some are dropping Tbolt for HP Ground to deal with Heatran, or for Iron Head to deal with Tapus

>>31229538
Pretty sure TTar was UU at some point in Gen 3 or 4.

>>31229381
actually parting shot is blocked by sound proof anon, one of the main reasons I run soundproof on kommo-o

>>31229673
Skarmory is muh waifu

>>31229664
The meta is still quite violate, everyone goes for what's proven to work. It will drop once the meta stabilizes.

>>31229629
Forced to Run hp electric now

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>yet another generation of Staraptor being BL

>>31229738

Oh shit. I guess that means it goes through substitute too

I hope pheramosa gets banned. I dint even thinks its op, its just gross as shit and makes it harder for me to justify using my scarf mienshao. I guess mienshao still has knockoff over wife roach

>OU is nothing but Tapus, UBs and legendaries

I'd like to see an alternate ladder that only allows regular pokémon, just to see if it's a little less cancerous without minmaxed high BST pokémon running around everywhere

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>>31229738
>Running Kommo-o at all

>>31229730
You best be joking nigger

Tyranitar was unanonimously considered the single best Pokemon of generation 3.

In Gen 4 Sandstorm received a massive buff so he basically never dropped out of top 10.

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>gengar has completely fallen out of OU
that nerf was too fucking much

>>31229760
Nah, it will be UU for sure this time

>>31229795
have fun with garchomp at 50% usage

>>31227990
I'm mediocre at competitive but hate genies, but why isn't Theran banned when Incarnate is. As seeing by the usage difference

>>31229843
Incarnate was stupidly powerful (as in, raw damage) with Sheer Force.

Therian just sets Rocks and U-Turns around

>>31229862
Oh, but it's been powercreeped to hell

>>31229636
>literally nothing from Gen VI counts besides a few Megas (Aegislash got b&, Greninja was b& in ORAS, Talonflame got group-of-Murkrow-ed
>it's only been one generation
Wow. If only Zygarde had gotten Thousand Arrows to start with in XY.

>>31229843
a Force that is Sheer

>>31229803
I dropped out of competitive in Gen 3 (I hated Gen 3 actually), and I was a Karenfag during the Gen 4 days...so I have no clue what I'm talking about.

>>31229803
>currently struggling to stay OU

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>>31229879
>Talonflame got group-of-Murkrow-ed
That's pretty clever anon. Nice one.

Well, at least one Ice-type is in OU now.

>>31229967
WE DID IT REDDIT

>>31229126
The same thing happened in gen 6, this isn't new. The only gen 6 mon in OU that wasn't a legendary or a mega was Talonflame.

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>>31229894
Next time at least try to google the viability rankings before spreading misinfo
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/adv-viability-ranking-ou.3503019/
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/dpp-ou-viability-rankings-v2.3514029/
Tyranitar is now apperentely considered the best gen 4 Pokemon as well kek

>>31228533
what is Lilligant

>We lived to see the day Pelipper went OU
Anything can happen

>>31230051
>Greninja
>Aegislash
>Klefki
>Sylveon
>Diggersby
>Trevenant (before he was found to be garbage anyways)

Meanwhile gen 7 has literally just Toxapex and Mimikyu.

>>31230156
>Fine
>Fine
>UU
>UU
>BL
>Garbage

So 3 vs 2

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>>31228024
>need sturdy rocker? use landorus
>need wallbreaker? use z-something landorus
>need sweeper? use rock polish landorus
>need scarfer that gives you momentum? use scarf landorus

>>31230148
Is Pelipper the first OU pokemon with a 50% encounter rate for simply walking around?

>>31230069
I genuinely thought it was UU at some point during those two gens. I dropped out of competitive, but I would lurk around GameFAQs and seem to recall users commenting on his fall from grace.

Whatever, though. Good point on your end regardless.

>>31230181
>Need tank pivot? Use lando
>Need to kill other landos? Use lando
Need to kill landos that are looking to kill your lando? Use lando

>>31230176
Both Klefki and Sylveon were OU at some point in the Gen 6 meta. What are you even talking about?

>>31228219
sableye dropped out of uu last gen when sylveon was on 1/3 of the teams and it could come in whenever it wanted and take 1/3 of your fairy check with a specs hyper voice, it was a liability

this gen in UU it's the same thing with specs primarina (specs primarina 4HKOs standard empoleon with moonblast, straight up 3HKO with hydro pump)

>>31229843
Your hate fuels me.

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>>31227990
>Alolan Muk is OU
>Bisharp isn't
It was nice knowing you, Knock Off Rider

>>31230181
How come Gamefreak can't just give Landorus Roost so it can finally do everything instead of just nearly everything and then ban it from all official formats?

>>31230232
The only thing that matters is where they ended in the generation, not the start. If they really were OU-worthy they would have stayed there permanently.

>>31230213
yeah hp ice for other landos or hp fire for scizor and ferros

>>31230245
It's going to drop when Lele gets the boot. Mons and AMuk and Mandibuzz serve only one purpose, and that's to deal with just 1 mon

>>31230303
IIRC, didn't Klefki fall from OU when they banned Swagger? If so, that's kind of a bullshit excuse to say he wasn't OU. They had to ban him from using a certain move just to make him UU.

Remove genie

>>31230314
*Mons like AMuk and Mandibuzz

>>31230181
I fucking hate Z Lando and I think it's probably broken; defensive checks are almost always overpowered by the Z move so you have to resort on Ice Shard or Battle Bond Water Shuriken to have a chance against it. At the same time I'm afraid of the consequences of blanket banning it since its other sets are basically the duct tape holding the meta together, and banning Lando+Z Crystals feels like bullshit since Smogon has never done and will never do this kind of bans.

>>31230362
>Smogon has never done and will never do this kind of bans.
They've never done what kind of bans? Z-Crystal bans? Because they've banned abilities before and they've banned actual moves before as well. At this point, I don't put it past them to ban anything.

>>31230332
Klefki dropped after they started excluding low rank players from the rankings. I remember at the start of XY, shit like Klefki, Smeargle, Donphan, and Forretress were OU at the beginning because of that.

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There is literally no reason to not use Landorus. It does something against every team and has NO counter. So you thought that your Chesnaught could come in and spike up on the Landorus? Supersonic skystrike kills you through spiky shield. Same thing with Tangrowth. Oh, you're using defensive Zapdos to deal with it? Get crushed motherfucker. Using offense? Enjoy every single offensive attacker lacking an ice move being forced out while giving your opponent momentum thanks to u-turn or rocks.

It's absolutely the perfect, flawless Pokemon. Literally always does something, is literally always useful unless it's being killed by a random ice move by a lure.

>>31230394
Oh don't forget how we lost a great Levitate user who could run Icy wind

That's how I always killed it

>>31230410
*HP ice

What was I thinking

Yeah Choice scarf makes it hard to be outspeed by anything too

>>31229332
M-Sableye Stall.

>>31228936

Toxapex and Suicide lead Nihilego are the OU ones that do it.

+ ---- + ------------------ + --------- + ------ + ------- + ------ + ------- +
| Rank | Pokemon | Usage % | Raw | % | Real | % |
+ ---- + ------------------ + --------- + ------ + ------- + ------ + ------- +
| 1 | Landorus-Therian | 35.07004% | 305077 | 13.610% | 258762 | 15.679% |
| 2 | Genesect | 28.56445% | 181112 | 8.080% | 150512 | 9.120% |
| 3 | Tapu Lele | 25.21668% | 318377 | 14.204% | 225204 | 13.645% |
| 4 | Metagross-Mega | 22.70535% | 206039 | 9.192% | 150807 | 9.138% |
| 5 | Tapu Fini | 20.52595% | 223966 | 9.992% | 180418 | 10.932% |
| 6 | Garchomp | 19.18279% | 227475 | 10.148% | 175963 | 10.662% |
| 7 | Greninja-Ash | 16.77226% | 222071 | 9.907% | 165052 | 10.001% |
| 8 | Tapu Koko | 16.47683% | 344377 | 15.364% | 258980 | 15.692% |
| 9 | Zygarde | 13.50228% | 49979 | 2.230% | 36762 | 2.227% |
| 10 | Toxapex | 13.04599% | 280433 | 12.511% | 210493 | 12.754% |
| 11 | Ferrothorn | 12.10426% | 151014 | 6.737% | 128797 | 7.804% |
| 12 | Pheromosa | 11.55022% | 248797 | 11.100% | 179412 | 10.871% |
| 13 | Dugtrio | 11.18188% | 88332 | 3.941% | 64191 | 3.889% |
| 14 | Marowak-Alola | 10.73628% | 364046 | 16.241% | 274766 | 16.648% |
| 15 | Rotom-Wash | 9.64860% | 103559 | 4.620% | 85715 | 5.194% |
| 16 | Heatran | 9.63998% | 144169 | 6.432% | 116845 | 7.080% |
| 17 | Magnezone | 9.44801% | 151895 | 6.777% | 118060 | 7.153% |
| 18 | Scizor-Mega | 9.37846% | 187849 | 8.381% | 140934 | 8.539% |
| 19 | Chansey | 9.28400% | 94503 | 4.216% | 69752 | 4.226% |

1825 and up elo

>>31230195
I dunno gyarados was OU for a long time and you can fish it out everytime

>>31230394
It'll probably be banned along with Genesect desu. Just got to wait it out.

>>31230496
Too bad it's RU trash now.

>>31230478
Chansey with eviolite yeah? Is the defense boost that much better than blissey?

>>31230496
I don't remember Gyarados itself being that common a fishing encounter. Magikarp yeah, but not already evolved Gyarados.

>>31230176
The ones you've listed as UU/BL had a valuable niches in OU. What "UU but usable in OU" gen 7 has?

>>31230546
chansey has swampert tier defenss (yes, defense) with eviolite

>>31230546
Blissey is trash compared to Chansey.

>>31230576
Gyarados was like 7/10 chances when you use a super rod

Wasnt there a game where you can get a wild lvl 100 gyarados?

>>31230546
Chansey has been better than Blissey ever since they introduced the Eviolite. It's the only Pokémon that is undeniably better than its evolution.

at least blissey can run calm mind kee berry

>>31227990
muk is a beast

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>>31230213
What DON'T you use lando for?

>>31228018
Did you expect anything less?

>>31228906
both and put psych up in all your other mons

>>31230635
losing

>CharY still not banned from UU
>Thundurus still not banned from UU
>Azumarill still not banned from UU

>>31230388
In order to do a blanket ban on Flynium Z and/or Rockium Z(or the Z move mechanic as a whole) they would have to prove that they're broken/uncompetitive items on every Pokémon that can use them. Of course everyone knows this isn't true and they're potentially broken only on Landorus.

This leaves blanket banning Landorus, or banning Lando+Z Crystals, and banning Landorus+Z Crystals would be a policy move that has no precedent in Smogon's history, so while it may seem the best choice to preserve a balanced meta it sets a very ugly precedent (things like "ban Mewtwo with every item but Choice Band" can be justified based on precedents now).

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The battlefield just got cute!

>>31228500
>not going gluttony with figy berry no that it's been buffed to heal 50% hp

>>31230694
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/np-sm-uu-beta-good-morning-captain.3591786

They might get quickbans before much longer.

>>31229216
They are the embodiment of no fun allowed.
Landorus has like 8 viable sets and all of them are incredibly punishing not to mention it has a really spammable movepool and can fulfill any role it wants pretty well.

>>31229527
haze

>>31229076
Aerodactyl. Also Rock doesnt resist itself

>>31230591
Trophy Garden, B2W2

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>my go-to Gen 7 triplets are all top 100 (24, 41 and 90)

i'll fucking take it

>>31230546
Eviolite Chansey has 179 defense with a positive nature max investment with 641 minimum HP. Blissey gets a ton more Sp. Def than non-Eviolite Chansey but only gains 10 HP and 11 maximum possible defense. There is literally no way to justify going with 49 less defense and 50 or more less Sp. Defense in exchange for 10 more max HP and a slightly higher (55 compared to 50) base speed. Unless youre using Special attacks for some reason.
Its not like Chansey had 200 HP going up to 255; It was already 250HP and barely moved.

>>31230546
With the same Nature/EV spreads Eviolite Chansey v Blissey:

642 / 41 / 179 / 106 / 463 / 136
652 / 50 / 130 / 186 / 369 / 146

Leftovers will not justify those inferior stats

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>>31228036

Keldeo is staying there as long as Ash-Greninja is allowed to run free in OU. Keldeo is outclassed.

>>31229501
>It's a solid Pokemon that does well in almost any kind of team.

I don't play competive because I suck at multiplayer but that sounds like the definition of something that should either be banned or at least get reasonable hate.

>>31230978
Keldeo does have better bulk and marginally better typing. Fuck, I hate to see stuff like Thundurus, Keldeo, and Azumarill shit up UU. It's already booting stuff like Crobat, Swampert, and Nidoking into RU

>>31228248
>Lando-T
>Stall
>Ice Punch
It's okay, we know (((you))) don't play OU, but at least try to be convincing

Remember when UU had its own unique identity?

Now its just entire past gen OU being
filtered down

>>31228372
The problem is more with Zydoge. It's yet another Drragon/Ground type and not only does it also have DD and 100 atk, it also outspeeds Flygon by a good margin

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>>31228213
>1. Legendary
>2. Legendary
>3. Legendary
>4. Legendary
>5. Legendary
>6. Mega
>7. Pseudo-Mega
>8. Regular
>9. Ultra Beast
>10. Pseudo legendary
>11. Regular
>12. Legendary
>13. Regular
>14. Legendary
>15. Regular
>16. Ultra Beast
>17. Mega
>18. Legendary
>19. Regular
>20. Legendary
>21. Regular
>22. Regular
>23. Regular
>24. Ultra Beast
>25. Legendary
>26. Regular
>27. Regular
>28. Mega
>29. Mega
>30. Ultra Beast
>31.Mega
>32. Regular
>33. Legendary
>34. Mega
>35. Mega
>36. Mega
>37. Legendary
>38. Regular
>39. Ultra Beast
>40. Regular
>41. Ultra Beast
>42. Legendary
>43. Pseudo legendary
>44. Regular
>45. Regular
>46. Legendary
>47. Regular
>48. Regular
>49. Regular

40.8% Regular and Pseudo Legendary
59.2% Legendary (28.6%), UB (12.2%), & Mega(18.4%)

>>31228024
>>31229269
That's the old stats. Without Genesect, on pokebankou-1825, he's at a whopping 52.83818%. A ban is absolutely inevitable.

>>31230538
I see you have intense brain damage.

http://www.smogon.com/dex/sm/pokemon/gyarados/

What makes Genesect so perfect?

>trying to find something to check ground/fire that is also tanky/supporty

This is near impossible pre-bank. Jesus christ.

>>31231231
>Complaining that Legendaries/UBs are stronger than regular Pokémon
Anon plz.

>>31228779
>>31228859
Volc is one of OU's best sweepers, people are just dumb

Also nothing on that list actually beats Volcarona. Mantine, Toxpaex, Chansey, and Tyranitar are the only things that can consistently come in and beat it 1v1.

>>31230978
Keldeo is still better than greninja ubtil greninja becimes ashe greninja

>>31231176
That is literally every gen.

>>31231326
Scizor was popular as hell in early Ppt and they never banned it because of that.

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>>31230677

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>>31228213
>>31230478
Seems Magnezone's been working overtime.

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>>31228024

fuck off

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Why isn't he OU?

>>31228865
>Special Landorus set it's very good
It's Nidokingx3?

>>31228248
>completely fucking up stall
Why is that a bad thing?
You don't HAVE to run stall, there are a bunch of other fun playstyles you can run :^)

>>31231550
As long as there's defensive steels in OU, the magnet police will always be there for you.

>>31231594
Because it sucks.

>>31231231
Nothing odd here to be honest, burst mode and good Pokémon being good the metagame.

Added slamming smogon Tiger for the lulz.

>>31231594
Tons of base stats wasted in a special attack it can't really use. More bulk or more speed would make it good.

http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/np-sm-uu-beta-good-morning-captain-charizardite-y-kyurem-b-baton-pass-banned.3591786/#post-7172283

charizard y and kyurem nigger are now bl

>>31231747
Not really a surprise

>>31231747
>Baton Pass banned

Well, the one thing Decidueye didn't suck at has been removed.
See you in NU/PU.

>>31231550
I dont get it, all celesteelas carry flamethrower, and he has no business with heatran. So is his only purpose dealing with Scizor and non-hammer arm Metagross?

>>31231878
It's not KOed by flamethrower (it's a 3HKO or something, I forgot) and can significantly weaken it in return. It also deals with ferrothorn.

>>31231878
You're understating the amount of Steel-types.
There's also Skarmory, Kartana, Ferrothorn.
With so many Fairy-types, its Steel STAB also gets put to good use.

>>31231747
Mixed feelings on Zard but acceptable, thank god Kyurem-B is gone. I wouldn't be surprised to see it get banned to ubers either after OU gets settled and he starts getting at least one free kill a game with Z-Freeze Shock.

What are the chances of stuff like Keldeo, Azumarill, Thundy, Gengar, and Slowbro rising back to OU?

And stuff like Infernape, Swampert, Lucario, Snorlax, and Nidoking dropping into RU?

>>31232060
>keldeo
High but it'll take awhile for people to realize it's still good. It really struggles with a couple new pokemon, though.
>Azu
Inevitably
>Thundy
Never
>Gengar
Maybe
>slowbro
Would really depend on how OU shapes up.

>>31232060
>Keldeo
I genuinely doubt it will rise back.
>Azumarill
Should be deleted from the game
>Thundy
Depends, right now Koko outclasses it 100% and T-Wave and Prankster got nerfed a lot
>Gengar
Could happen, it's still the best Poison type in the game
>Slowbro
With T-Wave nerfed and status inducing overall being nerfed I don't see it being in OU any time soon.

>>31229636
Wrong. Quit pretending you know anything about competitive. Rachi was UU for a long while there.

>>31230051
Why are you so stupid?

If you never played gen 6 OU, don't fucking talk about it.

>>31231176
Every gen is like this genius, Gen 6 UU is Gen 5 OU minus some pseudos, weather, Heatran and Skarmory.

>>31229636
>what is heatran, ferrothorn, rotom-wash

>>31232220
The fuck are you talking about? It's ended every generation it was a part of in OU. It might have dropped to UU for a bit, but it rose back up. Quit pretending you know anything about competitive

>>31232341
The point is that it has dropped before.


Shut the fuck up, retard.

>>31232305
Ah shit, you're right. 4/7 steels is impressive

>>31232358
>missing the point completely

It rose back up within the SAME generation, and ended said generation as a solid OU mon. I dont understand how you struggle this badly with comprehension.

Yes, it dropped but it ended up back where it was, a staple in OU. You fucking imbecile.

>>31232121
>still the best poison type
I don't know, Toxapex seems to be giving it a run for its money there.

>>31232420
It doesn't matter. It hasn't been OU the entire time it has existed.

Again, shut up.

>>31232459
>>31232420
you are both retarded

>arguing about a childrens video game

>>31232341
>>31232420
Autismo. The only one struggling with comprehension here is you. What led you to think the rule is 'ended every generation after release in OU'? It's 'never left OU'.

Why is Megazard being hit so hard? I know Landorus being everywhere doesn't help, but he's had to deal with that before. Neutral to fairy so Tapus don't seem like a huge deal, and it's not like he was spamming Outrage. What's the deal?

>>31232060
Infernape and Luke may drop but come back later if the DP remakes give them new toys, or they might get stuck in BL2 hell, Ape is too fast for RU and Luke is too versatile. It also depends on Terrakion and Keldeo being sent or not to BL.
Snorlax will drop, there's too many fighting types there.
Swampert still has his mega to keep him relevant.
Nidoking has no business in UU with PZ and Alakazam in the tier

>>31232646
>Nidoking has no business in UU with PZ and Alakazam in the tier
Do you mind telling me more about this? I understand PZ is better as a booster, and Zam has magic guard, but doesn't King have the benefit of hitting hard with Sheer Force and potentially going mixed and setting rocks?

I just noticed that Salamence is now UU.

http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/initial-gen-7-uu-banlists.3591784/#post-7172079

>>31231550
The meta really sucks for me. I like running Mega Scizor with Lele and Magnezone everywhere it's hard to do things with it.

>>31232422
While Toxapex is great it's way more predictable than Gengar.

Lele's going to get the boot soon.

There needs to be a sitting duck category within Ubers, with mons that are busted for OU but are utter trash in Ubers.
>LandoI
>Genesect
>Blaziken
>Greninja
>Deo
>DeoD
>Darkrai

Also can someone tell me why Solgaleo is underwhelming?