>Decidnumales thought their owl was going to be the "next

>>30956366
Decidueye is the new Jellicent
Toxapex is the new Ferrothorn
Marowak is the new Rotom-W / Heatran
Tapu Lele is the new Clefable / Latios
Celesteela is the new Landorus-T (kinda)
Pheromosa / Tapu Koko are the new Mega Lopunny
OP is the new faggot

Anything else?

>>30956366
Ash-greninja

>>30956366
Not sure what your definition of "next Greninja" is, but non of the starters are strikingly great for singles meta.

Not sure what you mean desu

>>30956480
/thread

>>30956366
They SEEM to be shilling Incineroar slightly more than the other two? We'll have to wait and see desu. There might not even be one.

It's Lillie.

>>30956480
This.
Be ready for it in smash.

One thing everyone should know is if a starter is competitively viable, it's most likely by accident. We're talking about the same people that tought everyone would use physical Aegislash and still insist on keeping move tutors for the second pair of game in every new gen even do this always results in doing nothing but crippling the pokemon (see Pangoro and Komo-o). I doubt GF even knew the effects Protean or Speed Boost would've had on Geninja and Blaziken respectively.

That being said, as for who's the better competitive starter this gen I have to say Incineroar ? But only when its HA gets released. For now Primarina, I guess.

>>30956566
pangoro is dogshit even after oras tutors you dumbass barafag fuck off with this pretending you know more about balance than the devs shit

>>30956504
Considering Incineroar has the strongest VGC potential after Intimidate, the shilling makes sense

>>30956566
this anon gets it

>>30956577
>thinking GF knows shit about balancing
Sure.

>>30956577
and it was even worse before move tutors you fuck

>>30956566

> GameFreak have no idea what they're doing

I'm really not sure what to think about this. There are so many questionable decisions that support it, but then there's the stuff that's so deliberately good / well-designed (i.e. Toxapex) that can't have been an accident.

Maybe the team that allocates stats and movepools is shit, but there's one guy that tweaks stuff and fixes some shitty mons?

I mean, look at the Mantine buff. It got Roost. This means that:

A. They know that reliable recovery can make or break a mon, so they're stingy with them to prevent some mons from being good or too good

B. They have a VERY rudimentary grasp of how the meta works, and they buff Pokemon by just throwing whatever looks good on it. This can result in something good (Azumarill), something stupidly gambreaking (Mence), or a flop (Flygon).

For every one 'nobody to nightmare' buff, there are ten buffs that didn't do a damn thing for the mon's viability.

>>30956742
This is why I'm saying "they don't know how to balance", there are some buffs that can really help a pokemon like Mantine and some pokemon that clearly were done with competive in mind like Toxa or Oranguru and turned out amazing, but for every good buff there are 10 more terrible one, either they don't do anything to the pokemon itself or just outright break the game even further like Lele. There's very to almost no balance sense. But then again, Pokemon was never a balanced game to begin with, see Gen 1.

It's Mimikyu.
He's the most popular Gen 7 Pokemon for the normies while he's one of the most viable non-legendaries in battling.

>>30956742
I'll never call Toxapex well designed, Merciless was robbed. Regenerator is such an obnoxious ability, and it's frustrating that they would give a Pokemon a unique quality only to invalidate it in the exact same game. Especially when the ability that overshadowed it is so much more braindead.

>>30956742
Up to gen 6, Game Freak had absolutely no idea what the fuck they were doing. This isn't because they were dumb, it's because they literally did not give a fuck about competitive. The first sign of a pulse was HAs, which were the first time GF gave a major buff to anything.
Gen 6, GF wakes up, and decides they are going to balance this "meta" the kids are going on about. They take one look at the big 6 of gen 5 (Weather Wars and MagDrag ), nerf weather, and introduce fairy. The Dragon nerf kinda failed, because GF didn't understand that the Dragon type wasn't particularly good, but many of the best pokemon were dragons.
Gen 6, GF becomes aware of the meta, and tries to interact with it. They don't know what the fuck is going on, so they screw the pooch with "meta" mons like Smogonbird and Aegislash. They don't understand the consequences of these actions either, they don't forsee what widespread priority to a 120bp stab move, or that a pokemon they intended to be physical, but that they gave equivalent special attack, and a good special movepool will indeed be used mixed.
ORAS, they tried to hotfix things the only way they could. They tried to create competition for OP roles with new megas, resulting in some of the most cancerous introductions to the meta at all levels of play.
S&M comes around, Pokemon still doesn't know what the fuck it is doing, but it knows more than it did when it first woke up for gen 6. They outright nerf the most problematic shit, then de-power creep new offerings, and make meta-styled min-maxed ultra beasts. Unfortunately, they forgot backwards compatibility was a thing, so all the old, just-beneath-the-surface OP shit that avoided nerf is still around, then they made the tapus of healthy meta. They are getting better, but still don't know what the fuck they're doing.

By the way, the forced pokemon of gen 7 is Tapu Koko. It is literally established as your destiny to fight it in the opening minutes of the game.

>>30956366
Tapu Koko. It dominates the meta, is linked to the player early on, and is the most prolific pokemon in the game after the cover legendary.
As an added jab, it hard counters Greninja. (Remember, Gamefreak doesn't know how to balance, and doesn't think beyond Electric/Fairy>Water/Dark)

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>>30956504
>They SEEM to be shilling Incineroar slightly more than the other two?
I thought Decidueye would be the favourite.

>>30956833
I think they try to change everything with every iteration of the meta. If you're familiar with the concept of a rotating metagame, it seems like that's what they go for.

A good example of this is the Talonflame nerf and introduction of Tapu Lele. Priority was killed this gen, and it took the harshest nerf of Bravest Bird to do it. Lele is the only real source of Psychic Terrain, so they had to make it good.

>>30957180
Post more/explain further please. This is a really interesting read.

>>30956566
Is anyone else triggered by Primarina and Deshitdueye getting shitty unique meme abilities whereas Incinerode gets a common old Ability but one that is always gauranteed to make a mon better? They didn't even try to come up with something unique (and shit) or renamed clone Ability. Fug.

>>30957498
I've heard that perfect symmetry in games like this is bad, so goes the Japanese philosophy. That's why Incineroar's ability isn't new, and why Primarina's singature move is Water-typed instead of Fairy.

They adhere to stuff like this at the detriment of the game.

>>30957716
Yet just last gen all starters got 'unique' abilities and a signature move of their type?

I have never seen any threads or posters proclaiming thst Decidueye is the best thing ever, but I havd seen hundreds of these autistic threads and posts obsessing over how 'BTFO' this invisible fanbase is.
Really makes you think.

>>30956480

It's pretty much a combination of this and Incineroar.

Plus Lillie.

Mimikyu tee bee aich

>>30956366
>Didn't make Top 30 in both Battles of Alola
>Incineroar and Primarina did

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>30957768
But then only one of them got battle bond

>>30957768
Protean was shared by Kecleon

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>>30956742
>flygon is a flop
What? I guess he doesn't have broken stats like 95% of the dragons in the game, but he was pretty good up until BW, and even now he's still decent.

>>30959412
Water Shuriken was also shared by Accelgor

>>30956366
The most popular one is Decidueye, if that's what you meant. If going by strength, Primarina is the strongest of the three.
The ones with the most Smash potential are Decidueye and Incineroar.

>>30956366
>implying I want my bro owl to be a memed faggot like Le Ebin Nardo Froggo

Fuck off, Owl has great design, cool signature move and shitty speed, get over it

>>30959420
It needs a higher speed stat to be relevant again.

Flygon is one of my favourite mons, but Dragon Dance wasn't what it needed. It still sucks.

>>30959444
>The most popular one is Decidueye
On what planet? Because it ain't this one.

>>30956742
I highly doubt every Pokemon is handled by the same group of people or person. I think this is why some turn out really bad while others turn out really good. Remember that Game Freak is a team of people not just one person working on a game.

>>30959444
i thought that post HA incineroar was going to be the most viable, primarina simply lacks too much physical defense despite its good typing.

>>30957498
Intimidate arguably is better than any of Primarina or Decidueye's abilities.

>>30957900
Then you're full of shit.

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>>30956366
CACAW!

>>30957301
>I thought Decidnumale would be the favourite.
Try thinking again baka

>>30959565
It is most certainly this one. Decidueye was by far the most prominent starter choice. Unfortunately it's not the best, but it is the most popular.

>>30956742
Flygon wasn't a flop when it was first introduced, it's just powercreep combined with the lack of substantial buffs got him pretty quickly.

>>30959523

I like you.

I used to not mind Greninja, heck, I'd find him lovable and endearing, but then they started shoving him so much, I've already gotten tired of him and his new form looks absolutely ridiculous and looks too much like it's trying to be cool now.

It's true I once thought Decidueye would be the next Greninja, but I never actually wanted him to be such because having a starter forced on everyone over the rest just seems like a fucking bore. I don't really care about the other two (Incineroar and Primarina), but if all three starters could have the same kind of attention, I wouldn't mind it. And I honestly don't give a shit whether he's good or bad or he's this and that, I still like the owl.

>>30956472
>OP is the new faggot
kek

>>30957253
>Greninja used Gunk Shot!

>>30956366
>who actually IS Gen 7's Greninja?
no one, and thank god for that
i can't stand shillmons

>>30959529
Dragon Dance WAS needed... like 3 generations ago.
If he ever gets an alternate form with better stat distribution DD is certainly going to be a useful asset though.

>>30959696
Solid bulk + good special attack + nice typing.
Compare that to Intimidate, and Fake Out only. It's not much. Even in VGC, there are better options.

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>>30960252
Are you forgetting lncineroar also gets U-Turn,Will-o-Wisp, and Taunt? Its a better Scrafty and niche alternative of Arcanine. Your underselling it's potential allot.

>>30956366
Marshadow. Godly typing, stats, ability, moves. If anything, it's better than Greninja

They're all pretty balanced unlike the gen 6 starters.

Each gen doesn't need a super popular Pokémon like Greninja and Lucario. Remember how Game Freak tried to shill the fuck out of Zoroark back in Gen 5?

>>30961236
>ability

kek

>>30961226
Fair point.
But I still think there are better options. With it's stats and movepool, it can fit a defensive, offensive or support role. But it can't excel at any of those. That's my main reason for doubting it's capabilities. To me, it seems like a jack of all trades, master of none. Only time will tell, I guess.

>>30961319
>Technician STAB Shadow Sneak and Force Palm

>>30961319
That meme died out, anon.

>>30959565
Why are people still trying to deny the Rowlet line is most popular?

>>30956472
>Marowak is the new Rotom-WHeatran
I wish. I love Marowak, but with its shit speed and many weaknesses, and lightning rod boosting its useless SpAttack, it's far less useful than either of those.

>>30961848

Because it's clear that Rowlet is the only popular design in its line.

>>30961848
Because the only thing being shown is outdated data or data from only one website.

>>30956366
Tapu Koko

>>30962184
Marowak is great, what are you talking about? It anti metas all the things

>>30962285
No, people who like Rowlet seem to like Decidueye just fine. It's not divisive like Incineroar was for many Litten fans (not too sure about Primarina though). Dartrix admittedly isn't nearly as well liked, but the middle stage rarely is.

>>30957301
It generally is, but Game Freak has been giving the Litten line a slight push in their marketing.

>>30959565
competitive viability =/= popularity

for the record, a recent poll (as in, less than a week old) on /vp/ had Rowlet as the top pick

>>30962762
>Rowlet

Keyword: Rowlett.

>>30960252
Nigger, people are using it in VGC RIGHT NOW, without Intimidate. Its usage will only get a huge boost when it gets its HA.

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>>30956366
There isn't one.

They actually had to knock Greninja down a peg so it would stop overshadowing everything.

>>30962789
>the first stage of a starter is apparently better than any other stage of the other starters
I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here

>>30962718
i haven't seen any of this

>>30962184
Lightning Rod isn't supposed to be used for boosts. Holy fuck how are so many of you this retarded? It's ability effectively gives it THREE fucking immunities which makes it a perfect check to a majority of UBs and Tapu Koko

>>30962826
The point I'm making is that just because Rowlett might be the most popular first stage of the starters doesn't make Decidueye the most popular final evolution of the starters.

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>>30962910
The poll was about which starters everyone picked, though, not about which first stage was their favorite. If Incineroar was the popular pick Litten presumably would have had the most votes.

>>30962910
The only way Decidueye wouldn't be the most popular of the last stages is if a lot of people hated its design and jumped ship to another starter - like what happened with Fennekin. But there's no reason to think that's the case. Decidueye seems fairly well liked. It was probably intended to be the starter with the most wide ranging, general appeal so this shouldn't be surprising. It's not that big of a deal.

>>30962998
>most wide ranging, general appeal

Boy Decidueye fans love deluding themselves.

We have absolutely no reason to believe that Game Freak intended for Rowlett or any of its evolutions to be the starter with the most wide ranging, general appeal.

>>30963035
If anything, Incineroar probably has the most appeal because it's literally a wrestler, and wrestlers/wrestling has been apart of popular culture throughout hundreds of countries for literal decades

>>30957180
Underrated post

I decided to try and go tryhard just to try and get a glimpse of the meta for singles

So far I have a perfect timid Magnezone - what else should I breed?

>>30963035
Why are you getting offended when I'm trying to offer possible reasons as to why the Rowlet line is most popular? There's a starter family that is more popular than the other two every gen.

>>30963281
Because you're automatically assuming that just because you like Rowlett or because Rowlett is apparently the most popular that Game Freak intended for it to be that way (wide ranging, general appeal) with absolutely no fucking proof.

>>30962998

Even during leak season, Decidueye always had the most lukewarm reception of the designs with the general consensus being that it was an ok, safe concept whereas Primarina and Incineroar were the ones sparking interest and discussion.

>>30963448
incineroarfag here and that's just a blatant lie

decidueye (or "robinhoot") was easily the most popular during pre-release, the other two were incredibly polarizing

>>30962875
Then you haven't been paying attention. There was a Japanese commercial with a FMV Litten, and we've known Ash gets Incineroar while the others stay unevolved since the moment they leaked.

>>30957180
Good post, Especially the dragon part. Dragon type wasn't OP, its just that most pseudos and legendaries were dragons back then, so they had their stats and movepools going on them. Shit like Altaria, Druddigon and Flygon was never OP. Fairy being immune to them has made the type pretty useless, I think making fairy AND ice resist it Would have been enough

I think it's going to be a gen 5 situation, where none of the final stages are shilled particularly hard.

Gen 2 to a lesser extent, too.

>>30963448
I was here during leak season. Decidueye was easily had the most positive reception of the 3. Obviously not everyone liked it, but most people thought it was at least alright. Primarina and Incineroar were a lot more divisive - some liked them, others hated them. Yeah they had more attention but that doesn't necessarily translate to them being more popular - attention isn't always positive.

>>30956566
Yeah I'm sure it had nothing to do with Blaziken and Greninja being pandered as shit.

Idiot.

>>30964254
>MUH PANDERING!

There's only two recorded cases of pandering: Lucario and Zoroark. The others simply were a case of appealing to a large demographic. Don't be a Faggot just because other people like Pokemon that you don't.

>>30963551

Other anon here, I think that's what he meant.

>Whereas Primarina and Incineroar were the ones sparking interest and discussion

erf derf if by interest and discussion, you mean interest over certain design choices regarding final evos and discussion of how polarizingly female Primarina is by throwing different views and opinions towards each other

some are more used to the idea of feminine designs being male than others and vice versa probably while others might be projecting the way they see that thing upon the general audience and thinking it SHOULD be neutral looking for everyone

Incineroar was like a whole lot of "OH GOD WHY DID YOU MAKE IT STAND IT'S RUINED I JUST WANTED A FIRE TIGER " and "oh shit, wrestling tiger".

>>30963448
If by interest and discussion you meant revulsion and ridicule, then yes.

none, owl is the best of the three but is still leagues behind le sm*gon frog

>>30962547
It's not. If your opponent doesn't have UBs or Tapus, Marowak is useless.

Lando smashes it into the ground.