Now that we played Gen 7, how does Guzma compare to the

Kind of there/10
Grunts were the showstealers, and probably the best grunts of the series 2bqhwu

Boi/10

Probably the best but that's mainly because he's like the only one with any character depth

>Giovanni is literally just generic bad mafioso man
>Archie and Maxie are literally retards who become good when they stop being retarded
>Cyrus is just a high functioning autist
>Ghestis is evil, that's it
>Lysandre might as well not exist and is dead now anyways

Guzma is pretty much the only evil team leaders whos actions and personality are attempted to be justified through his backstory and gets some character development

>>30899106
He's a bit more sympathetic and it helps that he himself doesn't directly do anything wrong, save for battling anyone who tries to stop Lusamine's plans.

That being said, even though I do like him, he is a little over-hyped due to the memes.

>>30899139
This, Skull grunts were very entertaining but Guzma doesn't really do much. Lusamine is definitely the better team leader in SM to me.

>>30899157
Cyrus, Archie, and Maxie have developed personalities. And Cyrus has backstory. Archie has a little too, though not as much as Guzma and Cyrus.

>>30899106
I hope he is a returning character in some way. It kind of feels like they're setting him up to be

>>30899202
Cyrus makes no fucking sense though

>Have a good backstory building up for him
>Then he suddenly decides that emotions and spirit are the source of all strife in the world and that he should literally eliminate all of them somehow

He went from troubled child to autistic kefka in an instant

>>30899106
Literally the only leader that is not about world domination or mass destruction. Just a thug.
So, the best.

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The only one who wasn't a grimdark cringelord besides Archie. And for that, he should be celebrated.

>>30899254
I'm going to need fanart of Cyrus as Kefka right now.

Team Skull didn't really have a plan, and the Aether Foundation you only fought once. Guzma and Plumeria had no screen time together. Gladion's involvement with Team Skull lead to nowhere.

>>30899197
>sympathetic
Fucking how? He's just a straight up asshole to you and everybody else the entire game, he beats the shit out of his grunts and probably his Pokemon, the only time he regrets his actions even a little bit is when he follows Lusamine to jellyfish hell and then only because he can't catch a jellyfish.

>>30899494
You feel bad for him because of his backstory of being rivals with Kukui and students under Hala, and Kukui going on to do all of this great shit despite not becoming a trial captain, while Guzma goes nowhere, so he resorts to the thug life and intimidates his way to the top, but constantly gets his ass handed to him by a child.

>>30899494
child abuse

>>30899494
>Grew up a loser, always getting 2nd/3rd place
>Couldn't become a captain
>Probably got beat by his dad
>Massive self esteem issues like the rest of Team Skull
>All around fucked psychologically
>Literally willing to help Lusamine because she's the only adult who sees him as strong then gets dumped into Ultra Space by her once shes able to fuck her jellyfish
>Just wants to be good with his wimpod

>>30899551
>you feel bad for him
No

>>30899494
>he beats the shit out of his grunts and probably his Pokemon

This is never implied

>>30899580
As bad as you can feel for someone in his situation, anyway. It helps a good deal that his personality is so likable, meanwhile every time you beat him, he thrashes around in anger while clutching his head, wondering what the fuck is wrong with himself. For him to have such a violent reaction to losing says something about how strongly he feels about being strong.

>>30899603
One of the grunts says he beats them up all the time, and he punches one grunt in the manga. No implication of hitting his Pokémon though.

Guzma is basically a meme. He may as well be regarded as Lusamine's admin instead of an evil team leader himself, especially since he basically does jack shit. However he does have one of the coolest battle themes ever and imo was one of the funnest trainers to fight every time in SM

also this>>30899480

>>30899106
He is very overrated.

>>30899751
Besides:
>He is a gangster. He must be cool ...right?
>Doing jack shit in the story.
>Muh, backstory. Even Lysandre has backstory.
>Being completeley an asshole
>No interaction with Plumeria or Gladion
>Just being Lusamine's pet, because she is the "only one understanding him" (What is Team Skull, Plumeria and grunts)
>His theme is too repetitive. (I mean it serious)
>Why did he even mention Kukui?
>"I'll beat the shit out of you!" And loses three times in a row.
>Try to catch a freakin UB by doing Leeroy Jenkins.

Is his popularity a meme? What's with his fanbase?

>>30899579
>2nd/3rd place
>Grew up as a loser

>>30899580
this

Ma Boi/10

Though not a lot of Team Leaders have developed personalities. Cyrus is still the best IMO.

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>>30899106
My favorite, personally.

>>30899480
The purpose of Gladion being in league with Team Skull was just to show that it's how he had been supporting his lone lifestyle ever since stealing Null and running away from Aether. And it's also clear that nobody in Team Skull actually likes him even though they recognize his strength, so it makes sense for him to fuck off from Skull once the threat of Lusamine and UBs requires his and your help.

>>30899967
B-But he's funny, though. Ya boy, right? Y'all are stupid, r-right?

>Muh, backstory. Even Lysandre has backstory.
Are you implying that one character with shitty backstory makes any character with a backstory invalid? Guzma's different from most leaders because he comes from way more humble roots.

>Just being Lusamine's pet, because she is the "only one understanding him" (What is Team Skull, Plumeria and grunts)
It's pretty clear that they really don't understand him, they only fear him. There's a difference.

>Why did he even mention Kukui?
More light is shed on that after his postgame fight.

>"I'll beat the shit out of you!" And loses three times in a row.
This is literally every Pokemon antagonist ever.

>Try to catch a freakin UB by doing Leeroy Jenkins.
That just makes him cooler. Imagine coming across a powerful species and Pokeballs are doing jack shit against it. Guzma's prideful enough to think that he can fucking pounce the thing and grab it that way. It adds a splash of color to his character, even if it doesn't mean too much in the long run.

I guess it's poetic that they don't anything, considering that Team Skull are just a bunch of floaters who have no life direction.

Basically a glorified Aether admin.


But for an admin he's pretty cool. A lot of people still judge like he was supposed to be the main villain when that's Lusamine.

>>30900218
And I honestly liked that about them. A more down to earth group of bad guys who don't want to conquer the world or fuck up the ecosystem, they're just typical rabblerousers, exactly as they appear to be. And Aether isn't necessarily evil either, they really do want to be a sanctuary for endangered Pokemon, but the more sinister research and shit that they do is ultimately to learn more about the UBs while also learning how to protect our world from them.

It's just so nice to have some "evil" teams who, for once, don't want to cause mass genocide or become ruler of all existence. Some of the most believable villains are those who don't believe their own actions to be evil, or at least are doing it for the greater good (Aether), or who know what they're doing is bad but need to do it in order to barely scrape by (Skull, as evidenced by Po Town).

>>30899580
They're poor misfits who's leader can't afford to pay for their uniforms

You'd expect this guy to be the edgy Poison/Dark trainer

We never expected him to be the bug-master.
Probably the first one who isn't girly in any way.

>>30900412
Damn, that's true. Before Guzma, Aaron was the most masculine bug specialist we've had, and he's a Literally Who to end them all.

>>30900412
> Implying Bugsy isn't manly

>>30900490

>Bugsy has been mistaken for a girl in both the anime and the manga

Being honest, Viola is the manlier of all bug trainers before Guzma and she's a girl.

>>30899106
I kinda had high expectations for him, but he didn't end up awful by any means

I thought they were going to be the lovable misfits

They just turned out to be reformed misfits. Not terrible, but not great

But for Pokémon pretty good

>>30900096
>Are you implying that one character with shitty backstory makes any character with a backstory invalid?
Then what makes his backstory not shitty?
I can say the same thing about Guzma:
"He was a young boy escaped from home and now joins a woman, who tries to fuck up the whole region.

>Guzma's different from most leaders because he comes from way more humble roots.
Humble roots don't mean he's more interesting than the other villains.

>It's pretty clear that they really don't understand him, they only fear him. There's a difference.
Is it even clear if Lusamine understands him in the slightest? Or is he just supporting her, because she says something like :
"OMG, you are so strong."

>More light is shed on that after his postgame fight.
You're right, but it was just my personal complaint since nothing is really mentioned in the main story itself.

>This is literally every Pokemon antagonist ever.
No antagonist in the main series has the same porpuse as Guzma.
He was iterally the first leader with the goal of being a strong trainer. But that's a huge problem, since other villains basically didn't have to care about losing against you, because they had other important goals than winnig and becoming strong.
He souldn't have the same attitude as the other villains.


>That just makes him cooler. Imagine coming across a powerful species and Pokeballs are doing jack shit against it. Guzma's prideful enough to think that he can fucking pounce the thing and grab it that way. It adds a splash of color to his character, even if it doesn't mean too much in the long run.
I agree, it adds somewhat to his charcter, but it
makes him just stupid at the same time (Unless you like his goofiness, but he was just idiotic imo).

He and Giovanni are my favorites.

>>30899106
Entertaining personality/backstory
Pretty awesome battle/encounter theme

Wasn't really much of a threat in the story or in actual gameplay, though

Story-wise he's just Lusamine's bitch and Gameplay-wise the first two battles with him are incredibly easy because he only has two pokemon

He should've had a bit more screentime and should've been a bit harder, but besides that I really liked him in the story

He serves as a distraction from the actual villain/villain group and as little else. He just acts like a generic thug and there's little else to him. Doesn't even seem to have a particular motive or backstory.

>>30899106
Guzma>N(if he counts>Lusamine>Cyrus>Ghetsis>Giovanni>Maxie>Archie>Lysandre

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He got old pretty fast and the grunts were just cringy. Don't even start with the le boi memes.

>>30899631
"GUZMA! What is wrong with you?"
It's probably what his dad yelled before beating him.

>>30899106
Lusamine was the true villain of SM, I'm not sure if Guzma can really be compared to other team bosses since he just plays 2nd fiddle to Lusamine. He has a backstory which is nice, not enough Pokemon villains have that. He also has more personality than Giovanni, Ghetsis, and Lysandre and he can be entertaining. But he's not very threatening and barely does anything.

Team Skull were known as the thieves and hoodlums of this region.
Plumeria shows up and acts like a "big sister", so naturally I assumed she would do something later on since were constantly beating her grunts.
Guzmas introduction was interesting and set him up pretty nicely.
But then Po town happened.
You fight your way to the grunts, and then beat Guzma. He forces his grunt to give the stolen Poke back.

Then they all fuck off to Aether where you fight him again, and he just moves aside.

I get that this is a childs videogame, but this is ridiculous.

Falling off a bridge early in the game and going into Ultra Space seemed like the only times your life was in danger.

>>30899731
>He may as well be regarded as Lusamine's admin instead of an evil team leader himself
I don't hate Guzma, I think he's entertaining, but this is absolutely 100% true. Skull pretty much serves as a subsidiary of Aether. The promotional scheme behind Aether and Skull was just a ruse for the player to fall for. Comparing Skull on their own to other evil Pokemon groups is inappropriate. That said, Guzma is far more entertaining than any other admin.

>>30901014
They need to stop using kids gloves, and make it obvious than in a serious situation, a criminal backs down when they lose a Pokemon battle, because they are at the mercy of the other trainer's Pokemon.

>>30900947
>Hating on ya boi
What are you, gay?