we all know now that based Ohmori is a fucking genius and made

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Masuda attempts to sabotage Ohmori from behind the scenes while acting polite in the public eye.

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>>30385606
>and made the best games in the series

>>30385708
when I said that, I was specifically referring to Sun/Moon.

I know he directed ORAS too, but that's an exception considering how little time and resources he had to work on it.

>>30385784
Also ORAS is a remake, judging him on that is stupid. It's like judging George Lucas on the Prequels and not the original trilogy

>>30385784
SM is only better than gen6 and maybe RS and DP

>>30385852
lulwut, explain that parallel pls

>>30385708
sun and moon are the best Pokemon games though, anon...

>30385906
you can get a (you) when you come up with some actually decent bait

>>30385606
>>X/Y gets "eh." reviews

This revisionist history is hilarious. It got about equal reviews compared to SM.

IGN - 9/10 for both
Gamespot - 8/10 for both
Famitsu - 39/40 for XY, 38/40 for SM
Metacritic - 87 for both

>X/Y gets "eh." reviews
No. Even if you hate XY you can't ignore the fact that they've gotten amazing reviews and Y is currently the highest rated pokemon game on metacritic

>>30385967
look at the fan reviews. those sites are fucking dipshits when it comes to reviewing and most of it is probably just being paid off

>>30385906
and BW

>>30386042
>fan reviews

>>30386114
>reviews

>>30386035
Y literally has 1 more point above Sun

>>30386042
Fan reviews still rate XY higher than SM

http://www.metacritic.com/game/3ds/pokemon-x
http://www.metacritic.com/game/3ds/pokemon-sun

>>30386058
of course, gen 5 isn't even worth mentioning it was so bad

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masuda is a hack and ohmori arguably saved the series but let's be honest, this guy is still the king of pokemon directors

>>30386282
>caring about metacritic past 2014

console warrior faggots just use that site as a battleground now, disregard it

games rarely even get to 8.0+ fan scores anymore

>>30385852
That's a horrible analogy. Lucas just took credit for the original movies, the prequels are what happen when you leave him the power he thinks he deserves.

>>30386282
first off, you're comparing 300 reviews vs. fucking 800, that's not a fair comparison

second, can you read some of the pro-xy reviews and the anti-sm reviews? They're all for stupid fucking reasons. I know that doesnt change the fact that the fan reviews in general were about even, but it's just something to note.

>>30386391
Fan reviews doesnt matter, professional reviews doesnt matter so what does?

>>30386391
>>30386414
Is it it really so hard to accept that Pokemon XY was success?

>>30385606
Masuda might direct certain gameplay functions.

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>>30386282

Metacritic userscores are now targetted by console warriors and retards who are overly sensitive to any change in a series even if it's a good change.

>>30386436
>>30386468
Yeah I'm not him, I just saw that post about metacritic and wanted to point out how cancerous that site is now.

Critic reviews are mostly paid and user reviews are a console war battleground.

I stopped caring about reviews years ago. I just pirate to try or watch let's plays.

>>30386468
I never said it wasn't a success, but I am saying that it pales in comparison to how fucking huge SM is. Look at the sales figures for both games and talk to me then.

>>30385606
You're opinion is stupid and retarded.
Just because something sells a lot doesn't mean it's inherently good or better. It just means it's popular.

Sure, S&M are good fun games but they're objectively a big fat shitty step back from the previous iterations. Also it didn't fix the major complaint about its predecessor which were lack of content, lack of a DECENT battle facility (tree sucks ass) or even the fucking framedrops.

If you look at the hard facts, the games are pretty much a failure.

They just sell lots because it's Christmas season and GameFreak played their cards right with the advertising.

>>30386391
>>30386414
>>30386474
>"b-but just look at the fan reviews!"
>posts fan reviews
>"d-doesn't count! Metacritic is j-just cancer!"

Hilarious.

>>30386525
XY first two weeks 5.3 million, S first two weeks 7.1 milion.

Its more but SM had GO as a support.
Worst case scenario XY will be the second best selling 3ds game of all time.

>>30386529
>they're objectively a big fat shitty step back from the previous iterations

explain.

and also, the biggest problem of XY was how brain-dead easy it was, not the postgame. and even if that was the niggest complaint, what the fuck are yoi talking about comparing it to SM? the battle tree is awesome, the NPCs are difficult and fun to play against, and the whole UB questline was probably longer than the Delta Episode.

>If you look at the hard facts, the games are pretty much a failure.

ebin.

>>30386590
see >>30386499

read next time you fucking retard

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>>30385606
what are you smoking, sun and moon are so casualized they didn't even bother adding dex entries for pokemon not in the alolan dex. Sun and moon are literally the laziest game freak has ever been.

ORAS is a better game than SM and XY combined. A lot more content than those.

Sure, SM has the best plot and graphics, but what matters is the content, and ORAS kicks their asses content wise.

>>30386788
>S/M
>casualized

do you even know what that word means, anon?

>>30386818
XD

I don't believe all this shitting on XY. They were fantastic games with a great balance of old and new Pokemon, actually good customization and literally the best bottom-screen/menu mechanics in the entire franchise. The only thing that ruined it was the exp share and I severely doubt anyone is THAT bothered by it being less difficult.

This kind of phenomenon where people bitch and moan about how bad stuff is before finally being able to declare that the latest iteration is "the best ever" happens all the time, all over society. Look at politics - people are now happy Trump has won, but will anything really change? No. In a few years people will be angry and irate all over again saying how "things are worse than they've ever been" and when the next games come out they'll be "the best ever". If you're older than twelve, you will have seen this time and time again.

>>30386827
removing features and difficulty to make the game more acesssable for a broader audience. They didn't bother to add anything competitive beyond the alola dex and they added z-moves which makes sun and moon the easiest pokemon games which have ever been made. I honestly hope game freak can stop with this trend next gen.

>odd numbered gens are better than even numbered ones

Really makes you think...

Masuda will likely stick around as the music guy.

>>30386884
>I don't believe all this shitting on XY. They were fantastic games with a great balance of old and new Pokemon, actually good customization and literally the best bottom-screen/menu mechanics in the entire franchise. The only thing that ruined it was the exp share and I severely doubt anyone is THAT bothered by it being less difficult.

Agreed

XY had its problems (with the main thing being no Z) but the way peopleshit on it now is ridiculous

Then again similar thing happened in 2013: people shat on gen 5 and were crazy about gen 6

>>30386884
I felt the same way about XY when it came out as I do today. They're unfinished, boring, and casualized games that didnt do anything to push the series forward other than on graphics.

And yes, the difficulty in XY was a huge problem. Turning off the exp share doesnt help, you're still 2-5 levels over any NPC or gym leader, even without grinding, and no one has any decent mons, or a decent number of mons. It made the game fucking unplayable.

>>30386788
>so casualized they didn't even bother adding dex entries
What kind of a stupid argument is that? How one is connected with another? SM doesn't feature full dex at the moment (and may not feature it ever), but what does it have to do with casualisation? If anything, it's making the game harder by limiting your options and forcing tryhardfags to adapt.

>>30387012
my entire team in sun and moon was 5-10 levels above all the npcs the entire game and I didn't even grind, where does this meme about it fixing xy's difficulty come from

>>30386943
>S/M wasn't difficult

did you play with the exp share on and with all pseudos?

I just used mons I liked, and it was really challenging for me, I blacked out probably half a dozen times.

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>>30385784
Sun and Moon are plagued with blatant signs of cut content and rushed developmental times, just like ORAS and XY were.

Poni Island and everything about it were obviously meant to have more shit in it if you know anything about game design/development, and it's fairly common knowledge that Khalil was meant to be an important character (at the very least a captain) and not just some literally who in the E4. Some of the pokemon reek of untested but published content, and there's blatant attempts at artificially extending the lifespan of the game (shitty encounter rates on a lot of mons, multiple attempts at making entry into breeding more difficult, harder scaling on the Battle Tree, a 100-piece fetch quest when you can't do anything with more than 60% of the pieces, and a plethora of the evolutions being atypical method evos). Not to mention the absolute garbage lag times on Double/Multi Battles and the Battle Royale, both of which got a lot of development focus in this gen.

I dunno what happened behind the scenes, so I'm not gonna jump to blaming anyone in particular, but this game was blatantly rushed out the door before it was ready for market.

>>30387012
>Turning off the exp share doesnt help, you're still 2-5 levels over any NPC or gym leader, even without grinding, and no one has any decent mons, or a decent number of mons. It made the game fucking unplayable

Bullshit

I've played through XY few times without exp share and each time i was mid to late 50s in the league while elite 4 and Diantha were mid to late 60s

>>30385606
>Ignoring all of Masuda's contributions

Have you choked on Ohmori's dick yet or did his semen pierce your eyes and blind the fuck out of you to the many flaws that Sun and Moon have?

Learn how to control your boner and wait until new game hype wears off until you start claiming Sun/Moon as the best Pokemon game.

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>>30387021
do I have to spoonfeed everything here. It's removing the option of completing the national dex and treats competitive battling as if it isn't important enough to get any attention (almost none of the non-alolan pokemon got any new moveset addition whereas in previous gens this always happened). It's casualization because they assume most players won't care about doing "complicated" things like dex completion or competitive battling.

>>30387060
yes I played with the exp share on and no I just used a team of 7 regular pokemon. And I didn't even abuse z-moves as much as I could which almost always one-shot any kind of threat you might face in the game.

>>30386788

SM toned down the casualization from XYORAS though. Enemies use actual stratgies and effort values.

>>30386943
Fun fact, all SM major trainers' mons have 31 IVs and 4/252/252 stat spreads.
Source: Datamines

>>30386688
Read again. I said it didn't fix the issues of the games before, neither ORAS or XY, meaning it didn't add post game content or fix the framedrops.
What's worse, it fucked up triple battles with the excuse of "b-but you can see trainers in the background now!"

Now, to make matters worse, it fucked up what was perfectly fine before (horde battles to level up, secret bases to train easily, berry farming, finding hidden abilities) AND it keeps being a brain dead easy game FILLED WITH CUTSCENES.

>>30387215
and you the player use z-moves which one-shot everything which undoes all of that

>>30387276

Z-moves are less broken then megas and more in game trainers use Z moves where as only 4 people in XY had megas.

>>30387215
A lot of Pokemon have only three moves and the AI is still shit.

>>30387311

That same issue happened in XY and the A.I is slightly less shit.

>>30387048
see >>30387060

>>30387087
fair point, although i disagree about Poni island. It seemed to me that the whole point of it was to be a very naturey area with not a whole lot of humans.

>>30387090
thats what happened to me.
I did my first playthrough with it on, (it barely even qualified as a "game", it was more of a movie where you pressed A a bunch of times)
I did my second playthrough with it off, it was still braindead easy and borderline unplayable but a lot less than with the share on. (you're right, I guess it wasnt 2-5 levels above every NPC, maybe more like 2-3.)
my third playthrough, I did a whole bunch of shit, no exp share, a limit of 2 mons in my party (unless there was a boss with more than two), no grinding, not allowed to be a higher level than any gym leaders. it was honestly a lot of fun and I enjoyed it.

>>30387114
I didnt love any other Pokemon game this much immediately after it came out. This is genuine, brah.

>>30387127
the national dex doesnt exist anon-kun, they're going to put all the mons Alola missed into the Sinnoh remakes.

>>30387300
they certainly didn't feel less broken to me with how every time when I was in trouble I'd just press the button and the opposing problem pokemon would disappear right in front of my eyes.

SM:
>No Triple and Rotation battles
>No Move Tutors
>No National Poked.
>No Underwater (in freakin Hawaii)
>No DexNav
>No Soaring
>Refresh is Amie without the minigames and decorations
>Funfest Missions are inferior to BW2 Funfest Missions
>Half of the Mega Stones are not in the game
>No Battle Institute (it was in BW, BW2, XY and ORAS)
>No rematching device like ORAS´s Trainer´s Eye
>There is a facility called "Sushi High Roller", which was a battle restaurant in XY. But in SM, it has no battles.
>an entire Golf Course was scrapped late in development
>No D-Pad moving
>Fishing nerfed

And people are calling this the best game ever? Really? ORAS is miles better than this game, and definitely Ohmori´s best game sofar.

>>30386943
literally the first Kahuna has a Z move.

this would be a legitimate argument if it was like in XY, where only two fucking NPCs have megas, but pretty much every major trainer has Z moves.

>>30387311
If you are looking at serebii he has shitload of moves missing on some trainers.
http://pastebin.com/vkaZNTra

>>30387373
>no national pokedex

this is the only feature you listed that people actually care about.

>>30385784
SM are good games, but they are certainly rushed games

>we all know now that based Ohmori is a fucking genius and made the best games in the series
Even if you believe this genuinely, thisis clearly done as a shitpost to get a lot of (OP)s.

>>30387087
I also (generally) agree with this. I think Khalil's mention in the demo was so that she had SOMETHING to her, as she ha practically nothing else. A shame because it made me excited for her.

>>30387373
There's also no inverse battles, no battle institute, the least amount of routes and least amount of towns in the series.

>>30387311
That two things work together.
If you search for a 4moves pokemon trainer, you can easily and even accidentally fool it into a swords dance off or other Boosting Contests.

>>30387378
the kahunas purposely use z-moves with weak base power you scrub

>>30387350

Difference is it would only help you kill one mon as opposed to the entire team.

To clarify, I'm not saying SM aren't casual bullshit, I'm just saying its not as bad as XY.

Junichi Masuda also direct Black/White and Firered/Leafgreen two of the three best games in the series. Ohmori directed the worst remake of a video game since the Silent Hill HD collection, and an entry on par with the Sinnoh and Johto games. Masuda stays winning.

>>30387408
People will take your praise of SM more seriously if you are more willing to accept its flaws.

Saying shit like nobody cares about triple battles, DexNav, trainer rematches or move tutors makes you look like a retard shill

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>>30387423
except not

>>30387350
>"Wah Z moves make the game too easy"
>Uses Z moves constantly just so I can complain on the internet

>>30387470
>power-up punch
>rock throw
you were saying

>>30387456
>nobody cares about triple battles
Nobody did that's why they are gone, they are also laggy as shit. Rotation battles were cool but triple battles were hot garbage and you know it
>DexNav
Literally SOS battles
>trainer rematches
Champion defense title
>move tutors
Only good thing on your list

>>30387456
Sun/Moon has flaws. No national dex, no trainer rematches, a lot of cutscenes, the first island is boring and shitty.

But you and me both know that removing fucking triple and rotation battles isn't a major flaw. There was like, one single trainer who did it in the game it was introduced in.

>>30387532
it's almost like Z-moves add BP to a move instead of multiplying the BP... weird..

>>30387438
ORAS was almost certainly bad because of its low production time forcing it to cut in places it really couldn't afford to cut. I doubt it was a direct heh result of Ohmori. Would it have still had problems if it had a full production time? Probably.

>Comparing train wrecks like ORAS and Silent Hill HD to Sinnoh.
I take it you don't like evolutions, then? That's usually the only solid complaint I hear from diehard Sinnoh haters. Either that, or they secretly never played Platinum and are basing their entire hatred on the inferior Sinnoh games.

I feel like I should defend Johto on principle, so I'll give you a "Fuck you" for that, too.

>>30387529
>sm is difficult guys just don't use the exp share and don't use z-moves and it totally fixed xy's easy difficulty with its broken exp share and broken megas!!!

>>30387532
>Says shit that isn't even on the screen
>Ignores Z-Earthquake
You are literally the worst person in a debate I've ever seen

>>30387574
I used the fucking EXP share and the game was still hard

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wait, people actually care about triple battles getting removed?

I remember doing them about three times in the entirety of BW, BW2, and XY.

>>30387577
oh sorry, was I only supposed to acknowledge your cherrypicked examples that don't prove you wrong? Sorry for ruining your incredible debate strategy.

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>>30387438
>BW better than anything

>>30387574
>XY was easy because of megas!
Other than Mega Lucario (which is admittedly pretty good), you can't get any of the good megas until Postgame, at which point the difficulty of the main story should be irrelevant because you fucking completed it already numbnuts.

I won't try and argue that XY were hard games or anything. No, they were a cakewalk. Some arguments are just retarded, though.

>>30387568
Whether the removal of triple and rotation battles is or isn't a major flaw is an opinion not an objective fact.

>>30387613
Why would people not care when it added a new element of strategy to the series?

>>30387639
you were supposed to acknowledge all of the evidence combined

no shit, the FIRST kahuna has a weak Z-move, but it's still a fucking z-move

>>30387532
Those pokemon can't even use z-moves. Nanu's sig, Alola Persian, can use Z-Dark Pulse.

>>30387373
>No Triple and Rotation battles
Don't care, but valid.
Take the framerate into consideration though.
>No Move Tutors
First game of the gen.
Shit on them if the next don't have any, not now.
>No Underwater (in freakin Hawaii)
Much like Rock Climb, it was a Hoenn gimmick and it was only touched in Unova.
>No DexNav
Understandable.
>No Soaring
Something said multiple times to be something reserved to give a new dimension to remade regions in not on a new region.
Shocking.
>Refresh is Amie without the minigames and decorations
And?
>Half of the Mega Stones are not in the game
Unobtainable, but there.
Either next game in the gen has them and will be able to trade them over or will be given on events.
Valid complaint though.
>No Battle Institute (it was in BW, BW2, XY and ORAS)
Never tried it, can't comment.
>No rematching device like ORAS´s Trainer´s Eye
It would have been nice, wouldn't it.
>There is a facility called "Sushi High Roller", which was a battle restaurant in XY. But in SM, it has no battles.
Isn't there another battle restaurant?
>an entire Golf Course was scrapped late in development
Valid, but I will always wonder why it didn't make it to the final game.
>No D-Pad moving
It's used for something else now.
>Fishing nerfed
Pretty sure this, along the "press A on everything for trivia" is limited by the lack of a grid system.

>And people are calling this the best game ever? Really? ORAS is miles better than this game, and definitely Ohmori´s best game sofar.

Why do you think that?

>>30387613
That's never the point of the battle mechanics.
Hardly any battles are double during the main game as well.

It's dumb and inexcusable that they took it out when there's people that love them, even if it's a small fan base.
Also its not something disposable like a mini game or contest that you know are a one time deal. These are a fucking whole battle system.


I do miss them and hate S&M for removing them JUST when they fucking introduced so many good abilities for them.

What I hate about SM is that it feels as if they were holding back features due to Stars.

>>30387568
I certainly didnt use Triple Battles much, but the value of a feature has nothing to do with whether or not I enjoyed it. Plus, it's simply less content. Before the game released, people where saying they'd never remove a playstyle like this, and here we are with half the Megas and two of the playstyles gone. Since they were in battle facilities, the amount of people who used it in the main game is less important.

>>30387563
They're gone because even double battles run badly. Saying nobody liked it because you didnt makes you look like a retard shill. Also implying SOS Battles are in any way equal to DexNav.

Seriously buddy, SM doesnt become shit if you admit it did even one thing badly.

>>30387736
>It's dumb and inexcusable that they took it out when there's people that love them, even if it's a small fan base.
Haven't seen anyone complain about it except people on /vp/ who dig hard for things to complain about.

>>30387810
was I the only one who hated Dexnav? I thought it was jusy fucking tedious how it didnt even work 95% of the time.

>>30387569
>ORAS was almost certainly bad because of its low production time forcing it to cut in places it really couldn't afford to cut. I doubt it was a direct heh result of Ohmori. Would it have still had problems if it had a full production time? Probably.

ORAS had the typical development time that all remakes and third versions have: 1 year. That is because a lot of the assets of a remake are reused (Amie, Super Training, Battle Maison, PSS, reused dialogues from RS, etc).

So no, ORAS wasn´t rushed at all. Or, not any more than FRLG or HGSS, at least.

PD: The Battle Frontier was not an R/S feature, before you bring that argument up ;)

>>30387823
Well then I guess it's a good thing things dont exist if you dont see them personally

>>30387836
As someone who hates breeding, I loved how the Dexnav allowed me to get a Harvest Tropius and Magic Bounce Xatu by myself in an our

>>30387901
One year doesn't cut it anymore. 3D modelling and texturing is more hardware intensive and takes longer to create and fine-tune. Sprites are much easier to manage, manipulate, and remake from older games (that also used sprites). There are more pokemon to balance/rebalance, and new features to add to the remakes on top of all of that.

There's reused assets that ease the process, to be sure, but there's also a huge amount of new content that has to be remade from scratch, especially since R/S were sprite games using old sound qualities, not 3D games with completely remade music. Not to mention that due to the nature of the remake, a lot of those new assets have to be designed from scratch in addition to having new models and textures made.

>>30387713
>Don't care, but valid.
>Take the framerate into consideration though.
Less content than XY and ORAS, though.
>Much like Rock Climb, it was a Hoenn gimmick and it was only touched in Unova.
I know, but no diving in Hawaii is a bit surprising.
>Understandable.
Still a point in favor of ORAS.
>Something said multiple times to be something reserved to give a new dimension to remade regions in not on a new region.
>Shocking.
Agreed
>And?
It literally means Refresh has LESS content than the same feature in XY and ORAS.
>Unobtainable, but there.
>Either next game in the gen has them and will be able to trade them over or will be given on events.
>Valid complaint though.
Ok.
>Never tried it, can't comment.
It objectively means less content, regardless of if you tried ot or not, or liked ot or not.
>It would have been nice, wouldn't it.
It was necessary. Because the only alternative is doing the Pokemon League over and over again. And even there, the levels are lower than the levels in ORAS Pokemon League.
>Isn't there another battle restaurant?
Yes, but it is once a day only, whereas the XY restaurants weren´t.
>Valid, but I will always wonder why it didn't make it to the final game.
ok
>It's used for something else now.
It´s just annoying, but ok.
>Why do you think that?
Because ORAS has a lot more content than SM? Because SM removed more content than it added?

>>30388415
there was literally ONE SINGLE FACILITY in oras where you could play Triple Battles. Stop acting like it's some huge feature that got removed.

and the anon you're replying to was right about soaring and underwater. Soaring was speicfically for ORAS, because it was a remake, and going underwater is a fucking gimmick and you know it.

and also
>impying removing the minigames from amie and rrplacing them with a brand new system to get food for your mons is "removing content"

>>30388205
No, no. Of course 3D based games require more development power than sprite based games like HGSS and FRLG. But that ORAS was developed by 100 staff members. HGSS and FRLG were developed by 40 or 50 staff members. So ORASwas definitely not rushed any more than HGSS or FRL>The ORAS was rushed meme needs to end

>>30388415
>It literally means Refresh has LESS content than the same feature in XY and ORAS.

did you even play SM? if you did you would know that they replaced it with a feature that makes the Amie minigames pale in comparison.

>>30388639
Where do you have the information that doubling the staff members cuts the time needed to make ORAS by exactly half?

>>30388630
And in that one facility you could play triples indefinitely. Two of four battle styles is a lot

>>30388630
all of you antiORAS fags shit on ORAS for removing the stupid berry blending minigame, although ORAS has 3 more fun minigames in Amie.

But SM removing those 3 minigames is suddenly fine?

The hypocricy is rising.

>>30388639
A sprite-based game can be made in a studio of 20-40, provided they have a decent art team either as part of that number or on call.

Making the exact same game in 3D modelling can take anywhere from 3x to 5x the manpower, depending on how detailed and/or deep you want the modelling and texturing to be.

Call it a meme all you like, but ORAS clearly has the marks of being a game that was put out before being completely ready. Whether that was because it was never given the time to develop properly or because the staff fucked around for a year isn't something I could tell you, but it definitely wasn't ready for market, and by that definition it was 100% rushed.

On a more personal note, I didn't think highly of HGSS or FRLG either, but they didn't have nearly as many standout problems as ORAS did.

>>30388803
triple and rotational battles are gimmicks, just like fucking inverse battles. and you fucking know it, stop acting like you don't.

>>30385906
>there are STILL retards who consider RBY higher than anything else in the series

hmm

>>30388843
The difference is that Inverse battles are fun.

>>30388825
IT REPLACED THE MINIGAMES WITH AN ENTIRE NEW FUCKING SYSTEM WITH YOUR PC BOXES YOU FUCKING RETARD

>>30385702
Rotomdex was Masuda's idea btw. I bet he was the one who fucked up online functionality too.

>>30388639
in my expierience with game development, it could easily take an hour or two to make a barely decent 3d model (that is about 25% of the quality that the Pokemon models are). A decent sprite artist could make a sprite in about 15-30 minutes.

>>30388843
>and you fucking know it, stop acting like you don't
Sweet, we're at the "I dont need to argue because its so OBVIOUS I'm right replies.

No, someone disagreeing with you doesnt mean everyone else in the world is in denial.

Not to mention the "things I like are features, things I dont like are gimmicks" shit.

Your comment has so many layers

>>30388985
Not to mention that he's trying to also make "gimmick" out to be inherently bad.

Gimmicks can be a fun diversion. If you're not here to have fun then stop playing games. Just give it up. You'll never get anywhere.

>>30388985
how many times have you played a rotation battle in-game? I'm curious.

>>30389062
Are you implying that if I never played it much, my points mean nothing? One of my first replies in this thread was that I barely play Triples and Rotations, but I'm not so full of myself to think a feature should live or die based on just how much I played it personally.

Plenty of people played a lot of Triples and Rotation Battles, and now it's gone. If you dont care about it, fine. But it certainly can be counted as a negative as to why one may not like SM as much as other games. Especially since it makes SM the game with the least content in it's battle facilities since Crystal.

It definitely isnt a positive, at least.

This board is Snivy as fuck. Yall shitposted about Gen 6, XY specifically at first and then moved on to shitting on ORAS. Now that SM is out, Gen 6 was suddenly good? Ha.

>>30389062
different anon but rotation was my favourite format to play with friends because it allowed us to use or smogon singles mons without both sides constantly switching the entire time.

>>30389326
>/vp/ is one person

It doesn't matter, because Matsuda will always hold a special place in our heart

Masuda served as producer for ORAS and SM, so it's likely that he'll be in the producer role from here on out. Kind of like how Miyamoto, Tezuka and Aonuma went from directors to producers.

>>30389369
Meme on, friend but it's painfully obvious that the majority of the posters on this board just shift to the next contrarian opinion until most of it stands in stark contrast to the wider fan base.

Many posters here don't think for themselves, just get swayed by the board culture.

>>30388842
>>30388941

>the 3D models of all 720+ Pokemon were already created in XY
>Amie, PSS, ST and Battle Maison were all developed during XY

>almost all the dialogue from ORAS was logically reused from RS
>Masuda stated that it was much easier to create music for the 3DS games, than it was for previous consoles, meaning ORAS´s soundtrack took them less time than creating the tracks of HGSS and FRLG

So all the developers had to do for ORAS, was basically to recreate Hoenn in 3D, and also create Soaring and DexNav.

If you guys honestly thing that those 3 things can´t be achieved in 1 year, by a 100+ development team, than, I think you don´t know what you are talking about... (no offense guys)

File: 1460577094740.gif (341KB, 265x198px) Image search: [Google]

341KB, 265x198px

>>30389475
>people dont like things about Gen 6 compared to the previous game
>this means people cant dislike things about Gen 7 compared to the previous game
>in every case it is the same people
>every opinion here is instantly the opposite of what the wider fanbase thinks
It's lucky you're that single poster here who is above having the wrong opinions, formed entirely of your own mind, compared to all the sheep here. Glad you could make it

>>30389580
I worded it wrong. I was more referring to the overworld itself than the sprites.

But I do also have a background in game development, (although I never really worked on building shit), so what I said is just coming from my own experience. Im sure it's a lot different in a multi-billion dollar games studio

My main criticism of Sun/Moon compared to, especially X/Y, that hasn't been addressed yet is the fact that money in the game is actually pretty damn difficult to come by.

You get one large infusion of cash post-game, and then you have to grind out Comet Shards, Star Pieces and Stardusts by breaking rocks.

I get that X/Y spoiled people with the Chateau, to the point where you can easily max your money in a couple hours, but I shouldn't have to be grinding out post-game just to complete things either.

>>30389580
>Decent Sprite artist can make a sprite in 15-20 minutes.
>Decent modeller can have a working model in 1-3 hours, not even accounting for the time needed to make textures, which can range anywhere from 40 seconds to 3 hours depending on what the texture is for.
>At MINIMUM you're looking at 6x the production time, just in recreating hoenn in 3D.
You can save time by pulling stuff like grass, water textures, and other recurring features from XY, but you still have to model the people, buildings, and land-masses from scratch.

Remember that recreating Hoenn isn't all the development had to do. They also had to design and create a number of new megas (which included both mechanically balancing and visually creating them), rebalance the game, write new content Call it shit but the Delta Episode and any other new dialogue down to the fucking random NPCs in that house you never walked into had to be written and somebody was paid to do it, get it all through marketing, get feedback from marketing telling them half of it was shit and wouldn't sell, and then do it all over again.

Game development is a fucking monster. One year is not enough for a studio of 100, even for a remake of an old game. I'd argue that it being a full remake of an old game might even make it HARDER, since the new staff has to get in tune with the stuff the old staff left behind. The only time completely remaking a game ISN'T harder is if you have primarily the old staff working on it.

And again, you can justify or qualify it however you like, but you can't deny that ORAS was a rushed game by the definition of it being released before it was ready to be released.

For a REMAKE, with a 100+ stafff, 1 year is definitely enough, considering the amount of reused content from XY that ORAS had. Nothing in ORAS felt rushed.

>>30386884
>a great balance of old and new Pokemon
It has a larger regional dex than SM with less new pokemon added, what the fuck are you talking about

>>30389805
I think they were aware of at least some of the game's flaws when they rolled it out which is why they put in some small stopgaps. The 20,000/day pyukumuku job, the pokedex jobs, the Demo's events that give you items you can sell for cash, and the Happy Hour Munchlax distribution seem to point to that. Also the fact that comet shards and other valuable items are way easier to come by.

>>30386884
>They were fantastic games with a great balance of old and new Pokemon
Absolutely not, there are a huge number of old Pokémon compared to a handful of new ones. BW2 struck a good balance, XY completely threw it off.
actually good customization
I've barely noticed any differences between XY and SM customization, and I'm definitely not going to call either of them a good or bad game based on customization options.
>and literally the best bottom-screen/menu mechanics in the entire franchise
This I can't dispute at all, PSS was perfection.
Overall, though, XY were huge disappointments in my opinion. I was so excited to play the games and they just didn't deliver. They added things to the series as a whole that I liked or even loved, but the games as a standalone are probably my least favourites in the series, and them not even getting a third version to fix their issues was salt in the wound. SM probably probably won't add as much to the series as a whole, sure, but as standalone games they're a much more enjoyable experience than XY were.

XY felt rushed.
SM feels rushed (less than XY, but still)
ORAS doesn´t feel rushed, thoigh. The only thing that might feel rushed, is porting the XY battle maison. But considering how HGSS did the same with the Platinum Battle Frontier, ORAS can´t really be called rushed.

Directors (basically the first name listed in the credits) going by the Japanese version

Red/Green - Satoshi Tajiri
Blue - Satoshi Tajiri
Yellow - Satoshi Tajiri
Gold/Silver - Satoshi Tajiri
Crystal - Junichi Masuda (Satoshi Tajiri credited as Executive Director beforehand)
Ruby/Sapphire - Junichi Masuda
FireRed/LeafGreen - Junichi Masuda
Emerald - Shigeki Morimoto
Diamond/Pearl - Junichi Masuda
Platinum - Takeshi Kawachimaru
HeartGold/SoulSilver - Shigeki Morimoto
Black/White - Junichi Masuda
Black 2/White 2 - Takao Unno
X/Y - Junichi Masuda
Omega Ruby/Alpha Sapphire - Shigeru Ohmori
Sun/Moon - Shigeru Ohmori

So in short
>Satoshi Tajiri - Red/Green, Blue, Yellow, Gold/Silver, Crystal (Executive Director)
>Junichi Masuda - Crystal, Ruby/Sapphire, FireRed/LeafGreen, Diamond/Pearl, Black/White, X/Y
>Shigeki Morimoto - Emerald, HeartGold/SoulSilver
>Takeshi Kawachimaru - Platinum
>Takao Unno - Black 2/White 2
>Shigeru Ohmori - Omega Ruby/Alpha Sapphire, Sun/Moon

The three most critically successful directors are Shigeki Morimoto, Takeshi Kawachimaru, and Takao Unno. It should be noted that none of the games they worked on were the "first" games in their generations. They were third versions or remakes using hardware Game Freak already developed for. And of these games, only Black 2/White 2 were actual sequels with their own story (even if it was derivative of Black/White).

Satoshi Tajiri has taken a backseat role on Pokémon since the end of Gen II, handing it off to Masuda to manage. Masuda has since directed the most major releases, with the exception of Sun/Moon.

I think the lesson here is that it typically takes a third version to right the wrongs and perfect the initial paired versions. Game Freak looks for feedback and improves upon the games. Sun and Moon aren't perfect, but they're the best games since B2W2. But they're also Game Freak's third 3DS mainline release, and you can tell that they've learned from XY and ORAS.

>>30386042
And yet those are the numbers that actually matter.

>>30386884
I think every gen has it's good points, and I still think X and Y was a failure. It was obviously rushed, the writing was either indecipherable or insufferable at any given time, it was braindead easy, even without the exp Share, it broke competitive, and most megas were a mistake. It had its perks but the flaws were greater. Sun and Moon has its share of flaws and upsides as well, but comes out as one of, if not the best overall experience thus far.

So did someone datamine and find that there literally are no non-Alola dex entries?

That's a shame.

That's really the only complaint from me though besides lacking a good end-leveling area.

>>30392009
>but comes out as one of, if not the best overall experience thus far.
I'd say one of, but definitely not the best.

>>30391845
Unno confirmed best director

So far I'm finding X/Y to be much better than S/M.

S/M has its heart in the right place, but all the practicalities are missing; they're very incomplete games and lack a lot of what X/Y already had. There are good ideas, but very poorly executed.

S/M is the B/W of 2016 - The linearity, extraordinary amount of focus on story, lack of features and minimal postgame will divide opinion for a few months before the novelty wears off and everyone starts to grumble about how there's nothing left to do and how the games are not actually that good.

Just as this starts to become common opinion, S/M2 will be announced and suddenly everyone will focus on that instead. S/M2 will improve on the series greatly like B/W2 did and S/M will be remembered fondly in the future based on the merits of its sequel while people will largely forget about all the problems S/M had.

>>30385906
>RS
overrated trash, only gentwees like to ride that dick.
>>30385906
>DP
same with this piece of overrated shit. God awful and ugly evolutions.

>>30391845
>Sun and Moon aren't perfect, but they're the best games since B2W2

They're not. Better than ORAS, slightly worse than X/Y.

>>30385606
Come back when Ohmori does something half as good as this theme.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Mv8AxBTlJ0

>>30394826
Pokemon ORAS Soundtrack (3DS): https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLr04gtogMLv5oTZFR14G719fQabapBhox

Pokemon Sun and Moon OST: http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLEkW7MtXullj8h3ADLC1WfMmqUupZVHOY

Here's a list of all the Ohmori tracks bettee than that.

>>30394956
Ohmori doesn't compose music, dummy.

>>30394956
Also, ORAS had a garbage OST.

>>30387373
>No Triple and Rotation battles
Hurts, but it's not important
>No Move Tutors
It's the first set of games in the Gen. Most of the times these don't appear until the second.
>No National Poked.
Sucks. Agree.
>No Underwater (in freakin Hawaii)
>No DexNav
>No Soaring
Hoenn gimmicks that stays regional, like a lot of things before this Gen.
>Refresh is Amie without the minigames and decorations
If you miss the minigames I guess it's okay, but if this is just bitching... so what?
>Funfest Missions are inferior to BW2 Funfest Missions
Agree.
>Half of the Mega Stones are not in the game
The general consensus about Mega evolutions was 'get the fuck off my game'. Understandable that it'll remain out of competitive. I predict 2018 will be just full pokedex without megastone and they will save the megaevo in case they have to do some stupid shit like 'nothing left, let's put ubers on' happened in 2016.
>No Battle Institute (it was in BW, BW2, XY and ORAS)
Meh. Kinda agree but it's forgettable.
>No rematching device like ORAS´s Trainer´s Eye
This I agree. Extra easy money is always welcomed.
>There is a facility called "Sushi High Roller", which was a battle restaurant in XY. But in SM, it has no battles.
... really?
>an entire Golf Course was scrapped late in development
Shame. Maybe if Alola gets a third game we will see it.
>No D-Pad moving
Absolutely agree, but you have to admit having free HMs there IS a HUGE improvement.
>Fishing nerfed
Sadly. Agreed.

>And people are calling this the best game ever? Really? ORAS is miles better than this game, and definitely Ohmori´s best game sofar.

Those who regard SM as the best game are biased towards the story, which is really nice and only finds competition from BW. Gamewise as a whole it's another issue.

I have no beefs with xy on meta mechanics or the like.
But replaying it side by side with SuMo, its obvious that xy just doesnt hold up a narrative. Almost all the characters are charmless.
Now, most storylines in pokemon fames are shit. But it was more apparent in xy by what seemed like a failed attempt at a storyline. It tried to have good characters, seemingly by having sooo many. It tried to have a good storylielne, but no part of that tall wondering kind story was compeling or interesting.

Sumo was the first gen in a long time with a story that at least held up to other jrpgs. Characters you liked. An evil team with genuine charm. And plottwists! Where xy only attempted, SuMo actually achieved in narrative.

>>30391845
>Masuda directed both DP and XY
I guess he'll be 'promoted' to share a space with Tajiri.

Morimoto and Ohmori are solid on their records too.