VGC General #1 - VGC17 Edition

It's not worth it.
I want to battle with my Bros and they're all subpar. What the fuck man. Who the fuck care about sublegendaries, it's not like you raise em or form any sort of connection with them

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>>30006178
Just because you are an autist who can't like Pokemon if they aren't shitmons doesn't mean everyone else is.

>tfw used to hate things like Heatran and Landorus-T but after using them and having them save my ass I started to like them a lot
In short, stop being such a little bitch.

>>30006223
Legendaries are fucking CANCER, REMOVE THEM, only kids have fun with them

>>30006263
>Tapus
>Ultra Beasts
>Legendaries

The only legendaries this gen are Solgaleo, Lunaala, Necrozma and Marshadow and none of them are allowed friendo :^)

>>30006289
Whatever, they're still special snowflakes that you can't raise or go through the story with. You loose all immersion with them which is basically half of the fun in Pokémon's games.

I want to use my cute doggo, not the alien who tried to kill me

Did they fix the Silvally Memories when they fixed Salamencite?

>>30006381
>You loose all immersion with them
wtf are you talking about?
this is VGC not some hugbox for autists

>>30006121
>VGC General
cool, though I will play the game first before thinking too much VGC stuff.

also
>attending my first ever irl pokemon tournament in London International championships
aaaaaaaaaa can't fucking wait

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>>30006381
>not wanting to submit otherworldly foes that tried to kill you into being your allies

>>30006627
Protip: Pack something that will counter the Tapu Koko + A-Raichu meme teams that will plague the London International. That's the correct meta pick for that tourney.

Marowak and A-Marowak and even Togedemaru are great picks to cockblock those two completely.

>>30006840
what about Xurxitree?

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>Kartana used something
>Beast boost
>Instruct
>Kartana killed the other mon
>Beast boost

>>30006949
I'm testing it and so far it's really damn frail, so the same shit that kills A-Raichu will kill him too.

>>30006840
You can get normal marowak?

>>30007117
Unless there's a way to find a normal Marowak ingame, no.

>>30007544
Wasn't there a way to breed normal mons by giving Alola mons an Everstone?

>>30006223
I feel you anon

>never had interest in shaymin
>play tcgo and have shaymin ex

Now I love it. Just play with it and you will love it.

What are the currently used cores and thier counters other than a-raichu and taku koko

>>30006121
hey guys I never played online or on tournaments.

I want to start, not attending London because I live in Nazi-land. I want to participate in VGC 2017.

So here are some questions:
how can I participate? What should I know? Are there mons I should reset for? Is resetting for mons easy?

If I want to use PKhex, what should I be aware of? If I change IV and Nature won´t that affect the ID ?

>>30007890
Try some local events or battlespot/show down when they get sun and moon support and once you get a team.

>>30007789
Doesn't work with Cubone, Pichu, and Exeggcute. Evolving them in SM always gives you the Alolan form.

Kartana is going straight to Ubers.

>>30007919
>Local Spots
I live in the countryside I don´t think there will be events but I will mostly do battlespots.

Also my biggest concern is this:

>How to make a good team?

I always don´t know how and what a team I should do...for a noob like me this is really bugging me out. I mostly played rain teams on XY online (not ranked), but still don´t know what is good and how I should play it..

>>30007932
fuck off smogonfag

>>30006840
Tapu Lele completely and utterly shits on koko/raichu leads as well since it trumps Koko's terrain and blocks Raichu's fake out.

Smart players know that Bulu will just be the best lead Tapu, period. Lele comes in if you smell a fake out coming. Koko is best used as a backliner as well. Tapu Fini swagstrats with Chomp/Metagross will be very, very strong.

>>30007932
Kartana might see some use but glass cannons are much, much weaker in doubles. Xurkitree and Celesteela will be the two best UBs in doubles. Buzzwole's not very good because he lacks high BP moves similar to Kartana.

>>30007830
Xurkitree/Bulu literally has no counter. Enjoy watching it run a train on the meta.

>>30008619
Alolan Marowak says hello.
it enjoys bulu support too

>>30009846
True, but it's kind of a niche shitmon enabled by the meta being what it is. Will be a key counterpick to have though and probably isn't too bad with Fini support either.

>>30009950
>True, but it's kind of a niche shitmon enabled by the meta being what it is.
Then use it as long as the meta allows it. That's the right way to use random shitmons.

so, anyone played at all? Is Battle Spot active yet?

I'm still playing through the game

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>>30006121
>UBs are allowed
>haxxing still not fixed
>battles still in silky smooth 10 fps
>disgusting obese manchildren still the majority of the playerbase
guess I'll just stick to showdown this gen

>>30011649
3 out of 4 of the things you mentioned also apply in Showdown so I don't see your point.

>>30011649
Online battles don't have the same framerate problems, also UBs are overhyped to hell and back

What a coincidence, I wanted SM to be the first games where I actually tried to go competitive. I'm a complete newfag regarding anything like breeding and shit but I know the basics.

I don't know if there are many official tournaments where I live fucking hueland but I'll try no matter what. Is it possible to play the tournaments online?

Also, the Z-Moves sound like they're gonna be pretty fun. Not as much the attacking ones, but the Status Z-Moves are sounding very good

Most of my competitive battling has been done in showdown, so I'm gonna need to learn how to git gud for doubles, what should I know?

>>30011830
>Most of my competitive battling has been done in showdown, so I'm gonna need to learn how to git gud for doubles, what should I know?
How about reading the OP you monkey?

>>30011675
>low fps not a problem
>hacking obviously not a problem
>broken UBs will eventually be banned if they haven't already
>you can mute autists and most importantly you don't have to interact with them in real life
nice try TPCi shill

>>30011751
>Online battles don't have the same framerate problems
So you admit there are still problems and battles will drag to hell and back
>UBs are overhyped to hell and back
And you're able to tell this less than 24 since the game went live?

>>30011830
Watch youtube channels like Cybertron or Wolfe, I learned doubles pretty fast by doing that

>>30011953
If the framerate problems don't exist in online/link battles then how is it an issue pertaining to VGC?

>And you're able to tell this less than 24 since the game went live?
Then why are you complaining they're allowed?

>>30011904
>low fps not a problem
Battle Spot doesn't have lag surprisingly enough.

>hacking obviously not a problem
How can you say this with a straight face while also saying you'll play Showdown instead?

>broken UBs will eventually be banned if they haven't already
Literally none of the UB are broken you reactionary inbred retard.

>you can mute autists and most importantly you don't have to interact with them in real life
So just play in Battle Spot? Or are you under the mistaken belief that to play VGC you have to attend events?

>>30011953
>So you admit there are still problems and battles will drag to hell and back
He literally said the opposite. Can't you read?

>And you're able to tell this less than 24 since the game went live?
We've had the game for more than a week, stats and movesets for even longer, and theorymonned everything to hell and back.

Besides, I can turn your question back at you. How are you able to tell this less than 24 since the game went live?

Oh wait, you are the same kind of retards mentioned on the OP post.

>>30008588
>Smart players know that Bulu will just be the best lead Tapu, period.
This.

50% Grass boost is nothing to sniff at just because of the 'grassshitmons' stigma, this gen alone introduced 4 grass types with 120+ offense stats and everyone appreciates passive lefties.

>>30008607
>Buzzwole's not very good
I wouldn't be so quick to just write it off like that, effectively what you get with Buzzwole is another flavour of Moxie Heracross. Higher defense and atk, slightly less speed but huge HP which kind of averages out the S.def.

Nobody ever is going to just straight up call Heracross a shitmon and if anything Buzzwole is a bit more flexible.

It has a means of psuedo heal in its STAB, psuedo boltbeam coverage, if anything the real thing it lacks is a proper fighting STAB without a major drawback beyond Brick Break.

>Xurkitree and Celesteela will be the two best UBs in doubles
I can definitely believe Celesteela being a complete menace, it's a complete tank with Wide Guard and has amazing coverage with the stats to back them up.

I mean for some reason they gave this thing the likes of Fire Blast, Leech Seed, Air Slash, Iron Head, Flash Cannon, Stone Edge, EQ and a average of 100+ stats across the board. This thing alone is a reason you need a good strong fire or electric attack otherwise it's just going to sit there whitling you down.

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Other than A-raichu/koko meme teams, what other team archetypes looks good? Is tr as good as ever? Herb mimikyu seems like is guarenteed to set up the room assuming you can keep it from getting double targeted with fake out or whatever.

where the fuck is the tcg thread

>>30012974
The usual suspects, weather teams will be solid as ever. TR will be anti-meta as hell as a means of speed control.

Thing about Mimikyu is whilst it's an amazing TR setter it's also relatively useless after that. It has little HP, very little in the way of offense and it's way too fast to be of use after TR is up. All it can do is be slightly annoying and spread burn.

What's better for alolan Persian? Fur coat or technician?

>>30013460
Fur Coat.

Persian realistically isn't doing much damage with those offenses but at least Fur Coat lets it stay around for a while to support its partner.

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Leave the Tapus to me.

>>30013460
Technician is probably never worth it. Foul Play is gonna hit harder against most targets than any Hidden Power type and without Fur Coat you don't have the bulk to Nasty Plot safely anyway.

>>30013620
pachirisu 2: fairy murder party

>>30011649
Most UBs are actually balanced and the minmaxed ones have paper thin defences.
I'm not saying they won't be used but they aren't that much different from your usual strong pseudo or inferior legendary.

>>30013075
Everyone in AZ is thinking tr or raikoko, Im gonna need to get on BS and just test things

>>30013620
Am I missing something?
Sure it fucks koko meme electric teams, but what about the others (aka Lele, since Bulu looks more like a singles mon and fini is just mediocre)?

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>>30013620

>>30013780
Bulu isn't a singlesmon. It has the slowest terrain which will be very important in lead weather wars. Its terrain also enables all of the ground weak pokemon to do much better. He also shits on literally every Garchomp variant that isn't carrying poison jab which is important in a meta where Garchomp is still a top 5 offensive threat.

Fini is a support Tapu. She stops burn from happening and gives confusionless swagger boosts to your Garchomp/Metagross/whatever decently bulky physical attacker you want to pair with her. Fini will be UU in singles but very solidly OU in smogon doubles and highly viable in VGC.

>>30013556
You think a modest nature with fur coat would be okay?

SALAZZLE IS FUCKING AMAZING

shits on celesteela
shits on every tapu not named koku

can't wait until bank's out so it can get fake out too

>>30013780

Togedemaru will be there to ruin Tapus strats.

>Lightning Rod to ruin Koko
>Fake Out if Lele is not on the battle
>Nuzzle for Lele, Bulu and Fini
>Tickle for Koko and Bulu
>Zing Zap for flinching after paralizing them
>Maybe run some sets with Spiky Shield

Not the greatest support but might be usable in the earlier stages of the meta.

Planning to pairing it with an Intimidate user or A-Persian with Parting Shot and Tapu Bulu.

celesteela + koku + chomp + pelipper is a great core

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>>30013904
>>30013075
Fini master race reporting in

Can't wait for sick swagplays and neutering dragons left and right specially that asshole of Mence and it's retarded Z-Crystal Draco Meteors

>>30014024
>Nuzzle for Lele, Bulu and Fini
>Fini
Anon...

>>30014054

Ah, yes, I forgot about status thingy on that terrain. I was thinking that Fini is the one that causes most problems to Toge anyway.

>>30014024
Fake Out isn't even stopped by Lele unless you switch her into it, Bulu's terrain comes out last so it sticks in the field and Bulu is a very good partner for Togedemaru.

who goes best with top lel?

>>30014107
things that die to priority

>>30014107
Trick Room

Shame Lele doesn't learn it herself

I think a Fini+Bulu team core would work very well, of course you only bring one of them in battles.

>>30014107
Anything fast, she is basically made to support and protect straight up offensive beatdowns from priority kills.

>>30006121

>Aloladex only

This is to my liking. I never bothered buying X/Y nor did I care to transfer my Gen 3/4 mons to Gen 5. Plus, all these new competitive elements give me the "actually raising Pokemon" hype.

>>30014107
>>30014386
Pheromosa. Add some Follow me and Wide Guard and you are golden.

>>30014390
>I never bothered buying X/Y nor did I care to transfer my Gen 3/4 mons to Gen 5.

To be fair the first VGC of a new gen is always "pokémon you can find in the games" only.

>>30014412
Only Follow Me/Rage Powder users in the Aloladex are Clefable, Ariados, Parasect and Lucario, only Parasect gets Wide Guard out of those.

So Parasect for new overlord?

>>30014412
what does Pheromosa have that makes it so great?

>>30014616
130/130/150 offenses and moxie for speed

>>30014616
She's Deoxys lite.

>>30014008
>egg moves that aren't legal until Bank
Fuck why is this a thing, I already made all my sets

would it be worth using Phero with speed swap in a trick room team?

>>30014761
Literally doesn't matter unless you are going to London.

>>30014044
What are you even swagplaying on? Unless you self swag on switch in, you'll probably be swaggering after your attacker moves

>>30014798
I could see that being good AGAINST a trick toom team, otherwise you'll just wasting turns.

>>30014819
Metagross has always been the premier Swagger-receiver.

Is there an image with every allowed pokémon?
I know I'll overlook someone if I look at a text list.

>>30014862
Have fun getting 2hko'd by garchomp

>>30015415
Oh no if only I had a fairy-type Pokemon or something that could beat dragons in my team or something like that!

>>30015450
Except tapufini has to run modest 252 special attack to even roll on the moonblast ohko so once again good luck with that garchomp match up

>>30006121
>February
>with less than a month for a meta to establish and for people to... breed their teams
????

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>>30015129
Here.

I read in a previous thread that something new got Sand Stream?

>>30007932
>Slugma used Ember!

>>30006121
>The UBs aren't broken.
Please stop this meme. They're pretty fucking broken.

Also, the entire Meta is gonna be Tapu Lele + UB.

>>30017888
gigalith got sand stream
pelipper got drizzle
torkoal got drought
vanilluxe got snow warning

>>30017888
Gigalith

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What archetypes are we going to see in vgc17, /vp/oreons?

What can outspeed 252 Phermosa?

>>30018632
Scarf 252 Phermosa.

>>30018632
talonflame :^)

>>30018863
>Talonflame
Top Lel

>>30019031
more like
Tapu Lele
amiright?

Someone have a list of all the Z-moves?
Shit, I forgot how much fun theorymonning was.

Let's play some moneymon.
Which mons do you think will only see success at the end of the season where everyone using it will hail them as a genius and score points for contributing to a non-healthy meta.

Can we play this shit on Showdown yet

>>30017453
If you want to exterminate Mence and Chomp, why would you run Moonblast over Ice Beam?

How do you get HA starters?

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Come up with a VGC set for this guy

>>30021226
Protect

>>30020762
tapu fini

>>30021226

Rest

>>30021226

>Lead with something holding Sash
>Once its sash gets activated, switch it out for Pyukumuku
>Z-Memento
>Bring back in your original mon

I missed this ded vgc threads

>>30020939
You still need to run modest 116 spatk to ko chomp which is a lot on what seems like a supportive mon if your plan is self swag

>>30022691
self-swag is worse now anyway with the nerf to accuracy

How's Pallosand?
Is it just me or does it seem like the meta for a good long while is going to revolve around DisQuake? Contrary to what people were saying, I think this is a pretty defensive meta with not enough hard hitters.

>b-but UBs
paper-thin defenses and/or no spread moves outside of the aforementioned Discharge combo
the strongest candidate is Celesteel

>>30024299
bulu deals with disquake spam pretty well

anyone have sets for new mons? like mimikyu lurantis lycanroc day and araquanid

So... with nerfs to burn, does that mean that BLOOD TOTEM builds are going to start running Toxic orb instead?

>>30024882
What was the burn nerf?

>>30026006
reduced damage to leftovers rate (1/16)

Are you ready for Oranguru and Ultra beast pals: the meta?

So pelipper should be pretty good, new drizzle mon, access to tailwind and wide guard, with STAB hurricane
not sure who to pair with, possibly magneton/zone, or any good steel type, maybe bulu.

>>30026672
I'm amazed you didn't think of Koko.

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>trying out Showdown
>only one z-move per battle among BOTH players
What the Hell were they thinking?

>>30026688
why koko

>>30026747
Can someone confirm whether this is true in-game as well?

>>30026890
It's not.

How far in game do I need to be if I plan on just injecting mons? The first PC's are the 3rd and 4th and I'd like to use more than my in game team.

>>30024882
Blood totem isn't really a VGC set, is sigilglyph even in alola dex?

>>30028534
You can get to Festival Plaza before the first Trial.

>>30011976
Did you learn to timestall cheat too? Good thing GF learned their lesson and changed the rules.

I'd like to see that hack try and win it again without cheating.

>>30011904
>>broken UBs will eventually be banned if they haven't already

look at this stupid smogon drone, look and laugh at it

>>30028573
Not currently, but come next year he will be. He also works almost better in VGC because of the partner being able to defend him.

Sigilyph is insane honestly after Talonflame nerfs. Now that he can't be taken out before he buffs, the only counters are fire/dark mons, of which there are two.

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>CTRL + F "Nihilego"
>Zero Results

Can someone explain this? From what I can tell, this thing shits on Tapus like they're not there, and it can OHKO any non-Yache Garchomp with HP Ice. Sure, it's Physical Defense is non-existent, but this thing seems really anti-meta.

>>30028705
>one point higher speed than garchomp
huh
only 6% chance to 1HKO without a +SPA nature though

>>30028705
I'm thinking you could run it on a sandstorm team to deal with certain threats, since it would get the benefits from sandstorm because it's a rock type

>>30028801
>>30028773
>>30028705
how much to survive a chomp quake?

>>30028817
I mean you could just give it air-balloon. Though there lies the problem of what would you give Gigalith then

>>30028817
Never ever. It's 4x Weak. But it outspeeds so that shouldn't be an issue. Also can be supported by Wide Guard.

>>30028817
It needs grassy terrain and max def investment to consistently survive one.

>>30028705
>HP ice

So, what, I have to soft reset until I catch a Nihilego with the right IVs?

>>30028885
At least you only need it to be HP Ice rather than HP Ice Flawless.
>nb4 'just inject it :^)'

>>30028817
4 HP / 244 Def with Shuca gives a 15/16 chance to live it. Not really worth it.

>>30028900
Is there really no alternative in terms of moves?

>>30028923
Not if you want to kill Garchomp.

Sludge Bomb kills all the Tapus dead except Lele and Fini but even then, they're at least 75% OHKO'd. HP Ice kills Garchomp. It also gets Psychic, Thunderbolt, Power Gem, and Grass Knot, which can go in the third slot since the last one belongs to protect. It's also pretty fast with Screens or Safeguard, but it's grounded so Misty Surge is probably the better option for keeping it from getting Paralyzed.

>>30029020
>they're at least 75% OHKO'd
Should read "Still OHKO'd 75%of the time). I need to go to bed.

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Will either of these be viable in singles?

Can I do an Oranguru trick room or Nihilego trick room/sandstorm team?

>>30029749
Nihilego isn't going to work well under TR.

Ok what about a team that's just Goodstuff.team. Like, JUST generically good mons that cover each other's weaknesses. Featuring Tapu Lele

>>30029797
Who cares as long as it sets it up reliably. It's all about that trick room Gigalith and...uh...other stuff I guess

Would TR and Hail have any sort of synergy?

Jesus, this thread sure is shit.

Literally no one talking about the format but begging to be spoonfed teams and strategies. Would it kill you to at least post a half-assed team at first so that discussion about why it is shit or not could arise or something?

>>30030832
I'll bite...
weavile/a-raichu/tapu/chomp/gyara/celesteela

>>30031181
which tapu you idiot

>>30006121
>tfw no chance at Worlds unless I go all the way down to London and win it
Why did they think only having ONE VGC17 tournament down south and then allowing anyone from any country in the world to compete (same goes for German players) would be a good idea?
Why do they hate Europe?
Where the fuck are the Regionals?

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>>30006178

>>30033038
top kek of course.A-raichu is rather shit otherwise

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I want t get into Pokemon VGC so I'm practicing learning more about doubles. But I can't seem to find an event list for regionals in California? Are the events held at the same time and Venue with the TCG? Can someone post a list of upcoming events?

>>30006977
Q. Does instruct has priority?

>"""competitive""" pokemon

ha

>>30006178
>I want to battle with my Bros and they're all subpar.
Everytime I hear this shit it's almost always just the player being shit when they could just simply build a team round the one thing they like.

>>30034465
For real. I've run the dumbest monotype teams and still come out ahead in regular battlespot. These people need to stop looking at "tiers" and start searching for ways to collect W's.

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>>30018534
One thing I'm already seeing is as the more experienced players predicted, Tapu Bulu is a fucking monster. I'm seeing games where it just utterly rapes everything.

Will toxapex be good in vgc
wish to so desperately shit on nerds with top tier defenses

>>30034635
tapu bulu+incineroar makes a very good core for Xurkitree. I moved to that with aerodactyl giving tailwind and fast rock slides after discovering on my skin how bad Gigalith is.

Let's predict the CHALK of 2017.

>>30034876
Incineroar with the unreleased HA? Ha.

>>30034990
it still has a good typing, Fake Out and Snarl. A nice alternative to Arcanina

I'm building in VGC for the first time. I have no clue on how to do this, so I'm just making shit up as I go along. I've found a little success so far, however, I feel like I need help to pick the last 2 pokemon on my team.

My current team (And what I'm using for Battle Tree) is the following

Pelipper @ Focus Sash
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
IV:0Spd
Modest Nature
- Hurricane
- Scald
- U-turn
- Wide Guard

Xurkitree @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Thunder
- Signal Beam
- Energy Ball
- Hidden Power (Ice)

Garchomp @ Yache Berry
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Claw
- Poison Jab
- Earthquake
- Brick Break

Tapu Koko @ Fairium Z
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Dazzling Gleam
- Volt Switch
- Brave Bird
- Hidden Power (Poison)

So far I'm making use of Thunder Spam on the Xurk. Outspeeds most things with his scarf on, and he hits hard. Garchomp removes common threats like Tapu Bulu and other Garchomps, Koko is the designated Dragon Slayer.

Also, I'm aware that I need to start ripping away moves for Protect, but I don't know what I can lose coverage-wise.

But I'm not sure what I should have for the last two Pokemon. I was thinking that Tapu Bulu could sub out for Tapu Koko against ground-heavy teams, and maybe a Pheromosa for the last slot, but I have no clue how to build her.

Thoughts?

>>30035103
>Thoughts?
Use pastebin next time.

>2017 format
>not using triple screens

Do Z-Crystals get consumed before/after usage of the Z-Move?

>>30035170
Nope.

>>30035170
They're treated exactly like Mega Stones or any other hold item that isn't a Gem (are these even in the game still?) or a Berry.

>>30034200
nope

>>30035103
give protect to everything not choice locked. It is an essential move in doubles for positioning and predicting.

Tapu Koko needs a better electric move. Get rid of brave bird, replace with tbolt or discharge. Replace HP poison with protect.

Xurk should have some speed taken out and put into bulk. Find out how much you need to outspeed pheromosa, then EV it to be one point faster. Replace signal beam with tbolt or discharge so you aren't relying on 70% accuracy when your rain runs out.

Give pelipper much more bulk and a sitrus berry. Its purpose is to stay alive and disrupt and support, not do damage.

Garchomp needs to be jolly and get rid of brick break for protect.

>>30034876
What do you even put on Bulu? Wood Hammer + Horn Leech + Protect + ?

>>30035354
wood hammer, superpower, and either a rock move (stone edge, rock slide, rock tomb) or megahorn

the alternative is a bulky subseed set with horn leech but it's completely walled by other grasses

Does instruct work on something like Nasty plot or dragon dance? it just makes the same pokemon use their last used move twice, right?
>get two nasty plot/d-dance/quiver dance/ off turn one

>>30035634
>stay completely open to opponent's offensive on turn one
yeah...nah.

>>30035661
i'm newer to vgc but is it more offensively based where setting up is less viable?

>>30035692
>I'm new to VGC
every time without fail
you think people would read or even just test before spouting shit

Tapu Bulu is fucking ridiculous.

You'd think Metagross is the perfect switch in against it right? Huge bulk, grass resist, super effective STAB etc. for the most part it's true and I got my ass handed to me for thinking it and then I checked the calcs after.

>252+ Atk Choice Band Tapu Bulu Wood Hammer vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Metagross in Grassy Terrain: 102-120 (54.5 - 64.1%)

Even fucking max HP Metagross can NOT safely switch into a CB Tapu Bulu, it just gets straight up 2HKO'd easy, remember the thing is faster than Meta by 5 base. You need a clean switch in with Meta in order to beat something it has a complete type advantage against and then hope that Meteor Miss hits.

Short of it is watch out for CB Bulu, it'll rip you in two before you know what happened. A solid grass resist or even better a 2x resist with more than 75 base speed is a near absolute must this gen otherwise you're a free kill.

>>30035754
yeah fuck those people who want to discuss, how dare they not be as knowledgeable as me

>>30035824
how dare you not even read the OP

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>>30035830
can't defend my retard self there

>>30035815
Xurkitree can 2HKO the entire meta as well, with Bulu and a little defensive investment it can survive a chomp EQ. With a scarf it outspeeds pretty much all non-scarfers too.

nothing good has levitate
i'm actually considering vikavolt
what's going on

>>30036043
there are lots of good flying types though

celesteela
pelipper
salamence
etc

so will there be any form of live streaming for the London tournament? That's going to be really fun to watch

What will the common Pheromosa builds be? +Spd or + in an offensive stat?

>>30036165
Yes, it's meant to be livestreamed.

>>30035941
Amusingly at the moment there are only 4 Pokemon in the entire Alola dex who are capable of OHKO'ing a bulky Xurkitree in Grassy Terrain with a Ground type attack.

Flygon and Palossand w/ Earth Power
A-Marowak w/ Bonemerang
Mudsdale w/ High Horsepower

Of these lot, Flygon is the only one who can outspeed both Tapu Bulu and Xurkitree and isn't weak to grass and A-Marowak is the only thing which can survive a attack from both of them.

Kind of fucked up really.

>>30006121
Will Porygon-Z be good?

>>30036394
Are you thinking of Z-Conversion?

>>30036355
>Garchomp used Tectonic Rage!

Anyone knows if the stupidly long animations for Z moves are a thing for Battlespot and tournaments? If so, I suppose it's not worth using them, as they drain a shitload of "your time". Also, are the trainer models visible too? That would mean more lag.

I'm still not done with the game so I can't check.

>>30036355
252+ Atk Choice Band Galvanize Alolan Golem Explosion vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Xurkitree: 212-250 (134.1 - 158.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
eat that, nerd :^)

>>30037259
>protect
nice :^)

Does instruct work for Z-Moves?

>>30037230
>If so, I suppose it's not worth using them, as they drain a shitload of "your time".
Your time explicitly doesn't include move animation time, only the time you spend selecting moves and stuff

Any good pokémon to pair with Toxapex? Tapu Bulu seems nice since it gives it longevity, but what else?

>>30035349
Made the changes. Only thing I'm still on is the Xurk. Think people will be running Pheromosa with the +Spe Nature? I'm not sure how much investment into speed people will give Pheromosa when she outspeeds most things naturally.

>>30037458
Not the anon from before but...

She naturally outspeeds even base 130's even with a neutral nature that is what common sense says but the tendency for most people will be to just run simple 252/252 in fear of Pheromosa mirror matches.

Thing is it's pointless EV'ing to outspeed a Pheromosa anyway since even with 252+ investment into Xurkitree with Scarf still falls short of Pheromosa's max speed by 1 point exactly plus going to that extreme completely culls most of Xurkitree's destructive power and makes it very fragile.

Even then Modest Xurkitree struggles to beat base 130's with a full speed investment but the only things up there are Tapu Koko, Jolteon, Aerodactyl and Crobat. Two of which you lose to anyway and the other two are easy prey for you.

You're better at aiming at base 125 where Weavile sits where speed advatange can make the difference since they have a even matchup. 212 speed + modest will be enough for Xurkitree to speed creep Jolly 252 Weavile by 1 point.

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>>30006121
>broken just because they have one very good stat
137/137 offences and 151 speed is just one good stat. Okay.

Will we see a lot of Poison Jab Chomp to check the tapus?

>>30006121
If I wanted to participate in VGC this year, would I have had to already compete in ORAS tournaments to get in any SM ones? Or is that just a UK thing and if I'm in Murrica I don't have to wait until next year?

>>30037978
>137/137 offenses
In fairness, that's awful because it guarantees the other stats will be shit.

>>30037978
>its ability is practically useless
>bug/fighting/ice coverage
>cucked from most ghost types and fairies
it work better in singles most likely

>>30038343
Apart from Worlds you don't need to qualify for tournaments by playing smaller ones.

A lot of the big ones now require pre-registration and a wad of cash though.

>>30038521
>Fairies
Poison Jab

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So my bro is confirmed awful in singles

Is there hope for him in VGC

>>30038617
Why are Decidueye fans so loud

>>30038617
Probably not. Incineroar seems to be the only starter people are using, and that faces tough competition from Arcanine.
I've only played about ten games though, so I could be wrong.

>>30038795
Fake Out gives it a useful niche.

The problem is whether GF will release the HAs or if they'll blue ball us for another generation.

>>30037982
They might carry it as a backup but chances are most Chomps will just start praying the Rock Flinch gods instead.

is venoshock good in double battles or is there no reason to use it over sludge?

>>30039306
It could work as part of a gimmick team but you'd be better off running Sludge Bomb. Nobody good would ever use it.

Are HA starters legal? I thought they weren't but everyone on Showdown is laddering with them.

>>30039595
From what I've seen Showdown doesn't check for availability yet.
Gonna be fun seeing people in London DQ'd for running Intimidate Incineroar.

>>30039595
as far as I know the only way you can get hidden abilities is SoS battles, and none of the starters are in SoS battles

Playing around with Ribombee and Oricorio Dancer shenanigans. Feels gimmicky but I'm having fun.

>>30007976
A good team is one that can answer the meta (the most common used mons and strategies). You do damage calcs trying to come with an ev spread that let's you achieve something offensive (to OHKO or 2hko something), defensive (to guarantee an attack would be a 2hko or 3hko always), both or something different (speed to outspeed or underspeed something, odd HP, lefties HP, etc.. )
Start with something you wanna run and check what fucks it over, then add pokemon to deal with what fucks you over. I for example love exeggutor, and built a team around it so it can shine (alolan one makes my dick hard, that is a better defensive typing at least).

For example, let's say you wanna run Breeloom, and let's suppose it's still gen 6. There was no way you survived bravest bird, so you added something like rotom-h, tyranitar or whatever that resist flying and fire. Then, lets say you used rotom - h, you want to outspeed and OHKO excadrill and to have something to deal with any other mold breaker+EQ user, and deal with tyranitar and other special Walls. And so on. Then, you plan how to play against common stuff and do changes. It takes some time to know how to read the meta and know what to use, but is a fun ride!

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Surprisingly enough this big guy is ruling the VGC2017 meta in showdown

>>30040481
>guy

Anyone else going to fort wayne?

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>>30040608

What about Talonflame for VGC?

It outspeeds many Alola mons, STAB Life Orb Flame Charge deals a ton of damage to Celesteela and Togedemaru, not to mention even after the nerf, brave birb still checks the everloving shit out of Pheromosa.

Thoughts?

>>30041908
VGC17 is a meta where everyone is using Tapu Koko and A-Raichu. Do you really want to be using a Flying type in this format?

>>30041908
talonfags btfo

>>30041908
I think Salazzle does the job better.

>>30041908
>It outspeeds many Alola mons
In fairness, Slowking outspeeds many Alola mons.

>>30042282
To be fair Celesteela is one of the best Pokemon in this format is a flying type, it plugs up so many defensive and offensive holes it isn't funny, it just depends on what you're trying to use it for.

>>30041908
>Life Orb Flame Charge
>Has Flare Blitz and 126 base speed
Okay stop. Fucking stop. Go away and come back when you have something sensible to say.

I'm one of the people who believe the Gale Wings nerf does fuck all to Talonflame and people kneejerking and I still think what you just said is silly.

>>30042809
I assumed he mistyped Flare Blitz to Flame Charge
Gotta set up to outspeed those Pheromosa though!

So people keep meme'ing about Fini + self-swag teams. What are good swagger partners for Fini?

Obviously, physical attackers are a given, furthermore, with Intimidate being the only way these physical attackers could be hindered something with Defiant or Competitive would be an excellent thing to add to the team.

>Wigglytuff
>Primape
>Milotic
>Braviary

These are the users of it, sadly, Braviary seems to be the only one with good synergy with self-swag as Primeape is too fast and the other two are special-based and share types with Fini.

From top of my head Metagross and Scizor are good partners for Fini. A pseudo-Japan sand core with Fini/Gigalith/Soutland/Mence or Braviary could work too. Marowak could help too with Lightning Rod support to cockblock Koko meme teams too. Trick Room could also work well here too.

any advice on creating a team with scizor?

>>30042935
I don't know how Braviary would do in a meta were you'll have to fight countless of top kek + electric mon leads.

Metagross has clear body so intimidate won't mess with him, it doesn't get +1 like a defiant mon but it's still good, also punches Lele and Bulu easily.

>>30042282
>Tapu Koko and A-Raichu

Yeah, the scrubs that kept using Pashitrisu in every format after 14.

>>30043621
Yes, but unlike Pachi this is more like the scrubs that used Y-Zard + Venusaur in the early XY VGC meta.
Sure they're predictable as fuck and dumb, but that combination is still something to not take lightly and keep in check.

Someone let me know when Z-moves are fixed on Showdown.
I mean, it would be a temporary inelegance, but you think they'd just add a simple flag for now.

Smeargle can copy Z-moves or is that a Showdown thing?

So how does the difference in EV points work from lvl 100 to 50? I heard full investment becomes worse at lvl 50, what's the math for that?

>>30044044
Read the OP again.

What do you guys think a third move for Togedemaru could be?
Currently running Zing Zap, Spikey Shield and Fake-Out. I'm running him to fuck over setup mons and to ruin the Koko/Raichu meme dream team. I would want to run a Steel move BUT SINCE IT ONLY LEARNS GYRO BALL AND HP STEEL JESUS FUCKING CHRIST I'm considering Poison Jab to plug that hole. Thoughts?

>>30044772
Nuzzle or Tickle.

>>30044772
>>30044810
Imagine how much better it would be if it could run Iron Head to mess with the Tapus properly.

>>30045181
Imagine how much better vanilla Raichu would be for that slot.

>>30045228
Pretty much.

There's too many tryhards here who think they'll become the next sejun by trying to force their meme sonic oc.

Does a Metagross with Clear Body still get the speed boost from Adrenaline Orb?

Also, is there a compiled list of all the new items and their effects?

>>30046284
No.

Yes.

For a moment I thought that there wasn't a Rock Slide TM and we were free of RS Chomp, but then I checked it...

>>30046706
I can't wait until the genies return next year.

And so the meta changed overnight
Ninetales-A on every team

>>30047467
why?

>>30047849
Same reason as people running Pelipper
STAB powerful move in WEATHER with decent Spec.Atk

But Ninetales-A has utility

>>30048231
what kind of utility anon?

>>30048343
Aurora Veil, fag.

FINALLY HAIL IS GOOD

FUCK YOU ALL

>>30049168
>Hail is good
People are "using" hail because of Aurora Veil rather than using hail and Aurora Veil being an added bonus.

it's kind of a TTar situation where you can use it on a non-sand thing just because of all the neat things TTar can do.

Hail, dedicated proper hail, the archetype, is still shit and the worst weather of them all. And I say this as a hailfag.

>>30048343
It's pretty fast, it passively takes aggro, Aurora Veil, freeze chance, moonblast debuff chance

Pelipper has utility too
Wide Guard
Twind
Scald Hurricane

>>30049168
People will adjust with Bullet Punch and fast Poison types
Expect Lele with Ninetales-A

>>30049271
Scald Hurricane Pelipper hits like a fucking truck.
I honestly wonder if you could run an offensive build with Scald Hurricane Protect and Wide Guard/TWind and see success. It dies to any Electric-type move, but it chunks a lot of things super hard.

I've been running with some friends this: Marowak / Pelipper / Bulu / Mimikyu / Celesteela / Xurkitree in Showdown and been doing okay...
I don't know, I want to try Conversion-Z Porygon-Z and some randome shit. Ideas?

>>30049834
give sets nerd

how are you guys running pelliper?

So how is everyone enjoying early 2017

ok i made it to the top 90 on showdown, ask me anything about this one day old meta i am an expert

>>30050651
most common cores you ran into?

>>30050747
tupu lele, fini, and kek

xurkitree and celesteela

loadsa harambe shenanigans too.

>>30050651
what team were you using? so i can import it and practice because im a noob to this meta and still don't know how to teambuild

>>30050816
>lele, fini and kek
all together?
not that many ninetales-a?
they're rampant where I am on ladder

>>30050816
I told you faggots that 3tap was viable.

>>30051031
how do they deal with the other poisons and steels in alola? who are their common partners?

>>30050973
there are a lot of ninetails/sandslash ice teams but it is honesty terrible.

>>30051031
i just meant those are the most popular ones, and at least one is on every team. people don't run more than 2 usually though. 3 is too much with celesteela being on every single team.

>>30050925
nah you'll make fun of my absolutely retarded ev spreads.

I'm starting to think TR might just be the best way to go, things like Xurkitree hit really fucking hard and most people seem to be going for high speed. How does a Porygon2/Bulu/A-Golem core sound?

My biggest issue is that having multiple potential TR setters would be ideal, but P2 is looking like one of the few really useful ones.

>>30051125
> i will make fun of nerds that think your team is bad bby pls

>>30051397
holy shit i forgot to mention porygon 2. that thing is EVERYWHERE at the moment and it is wrecking face. TR is definitely viable, and the most common setters I've seen are porygon 2, orangaru, and mimikyu

>>30051470
O fuck, somehow I missed that Oranguru gets TR. Instruct Shenanigans sounds fun, especially with how Bulu 2HKOs most things in the meta.

Mimikyu seems like it wouldn't be very useful after setting up though.

>>30051522
yeah in my opinion mimi isn't very good

>>30051522
mimi could be good taking the fact it can Destiny Bond Z

>>30051632
do z-moves work properly on showdown yet
also does any effect of destiny bond z get priority?
I don't see how that really matters otherwise

>>30051397
Golem gets some interesting toys with Wide Guard, Hammer Arm, Rock Slide, Gyro Ball, and of course, Galvanize Explosion and Double Edge. That shit tier Sp. Def means it'll be killed by a stray Water Gun though.

>>30051698
sand stream :^)

>>30051670
Z Destiny Bond causes a Follow Me effect too, which is actually really interesting.

>>30051730
that's what I'm asking, does it get the redirection with priority but the destiny bond aspect only works on its turn?

>>30028586
I just want to let you know that you have every right to be mad. Wolfe Glick timestalling prevented you from winning a single event (or even placing Top 16) the entire VGC 2016 year and probably the rest of your life. Timestalling may no longer be a thing, but the damage has been done. I'm sorry that you'll always be a failure with no outlet than to find things to criticize others for, Verlisify.

>>30051769
What was the rule change anyway?

>>30051727
>Gigalith is the only Sand Stream user this year
>using him with A-Golem on top of the TR user that'll be almost absolutely necessary for those two already uses half a team
Sandfags finally lost this year.

Speaking of which, outside of A-Ninetails/A-Coldsteel meme teams, how is hail looking? Is Aurora Veil strong enough to justify running it?

>>30051814
Separate timers for each player.

>>30051769
Tell that to that one chick who was clearly going to beat that one smug, timestalling faggot, and who was one turn from winning away anyway.

>>30051854
Well many people have beat Wolfe before, so clearly she just wasn't as good as them. Back in the 2014 Verlisify anti-Smogon controversy, he claimed that he had gone undefeated in Regional tournaments with his shit teams before, when he was called out, because obviously the only person to go undefeated could only be the winner of a Regional, he claimed that his only losses were due to the timer running out and that "those don't count". If you're team can't pull off a win in the fastest format in the game, then it's not a good team. If you have a bunch of low-HP, highly offensive pokemon and can't beat your opponent before time runs out, then your team isn't good enough for VGC. If I decided to run a stall team, like are popular in OU and do very well there, but then lost a tournament game because time ran out before I could get any kills, then it's not the format or my opponent who is bad, it's me for bringing a team that did not take advantage of the rules in order to win.

>>30052037
No one's calling the win illegitimate (except that first anon, who I am not), I'm just calling you a fucking faggot for using that kind of strategy.

>>30052126
Now, I'm not even /that/ anon, but really?
>lmao bro how dare you come to this tournament and try to give yourself the best shot at winning it
???

>>30052126
Personally, I've never used it because I've never had to. But if I was in Top Cut at a tournament and I realized that I had lost my win condition in a match, but they would need more than say 4 turns to finish me off with only a couple minutes left, then yeah I would timer stall it. At that point I've spent several hours in a tournament and am in it to win it. I'd do whatever I could within the rules.

Now would I go to a tournament planning on timer stalling? No, that's dumb and no one creating a team for the purpose of stalling will ever get more than one, maybe two wins in swiss. But if the situation arose where it's the only way I could win, then I'd do to. Same way if I could only win off of a flinch or say a draco dodge I'd do that as well.

All this is mute though as it's no longer possible to do this in 2017.

>>30006223
Most of the legendaries look shit this gen anon. Heatran and landorus-T also look like shit.

>>30006519
>this is VGC a hugbox for autists

FTFY

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>>30006223
(You)

>>30050589
I can't enjoy it if nobody is on Battlespot. Showdown is a buggy mess so I won't bother with it.

Primarina looks to be pretty nice on doubles. Would giving her specs be a good idea?

>>30053383
I hope you realize the HA is unreleased

Glad to see this general back, I'm looking forward to playing VGC on cart for the first time this year. See you guys in the next thread!

>>30051544
Mimi has an amazing ability for a supporter but people try to make everything that gets SD a setup sweeper.

Does Burn Up Arcanine have a good set?

>>30006381
>they're special snowflakes
>im definitely not a special snowflake for not wanting to use them though

>>30039719
Can't you QR Code them somehow for an encounter?

>>30039719
Smogon is allowing starter HAs, so I'm assuming there must be some way of getting them?

>>30051854
>Check
Trista's a tranny. When will you people ever get it right?

Besides, Trista chocked by using Eruption instead of playing it safe with Earth Power. But of course you wouldn't know that you disgusting white knight beta orbiter?

>>30056078
there isn't

>>30006223
I don't have respect for anyone who doesn't hate Landorous-T.
That thing is a disease.

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>>30052241
>>30052414
>>30057290

>>30038524
Okay, so which tournaments do I need to do for worlds this year? Are there regionals/US Nationals coming up or what?

>>30057492
Literally all of them. Otherwise you better be ready to shell out a few thousand bucks to travel overseas for one of the International thingies. The CP earnings and CP line are utterly fucked up this year.

>>30057514
>Literally all of them
As in I would need to go across the country to participate in every single regional as well as nationals, or do you just mean I need to compete in my local regionals, as well as nationals? The whole system is incredibly obtuse

>>30057571
>>30057514
I want to go back to the days when placing in a regional guaranteed a spot at nats and placing in nats guaranteed a spot in worlds

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What nature would be good for Alolan Exeggutor?

>>30057676
Adamant probably. Maybe Brave if you are going full TR.