>normal z-move off of explosion is 330 BP and you don't

>tfw no Mega Glalie Z Explosion

Now thats scary

it gains 30 BP? that seems really low

>>29393802
It gets 80.

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>STAB Explosion fueled Z Move

Oh God why?

>>29393802

>and you dont faint

so, you can explode AGAIN

giga impact/hyoer beam with no turn skip

Wheres this from?

252+ Atk Lickilicky Explosion (330 BP) vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 586-691 (91.2 - 107.6%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
jesus

Maybe frenzy plant blast burn and hydro cannon maybe useful now

>>29393806
explosion is 300
selfdestruct is 250

>>29393809
i mean, sure

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>>29393732
>yfw Alolan Golem gets a rock type version of an -ate ability

>>29393732
move BP is stored in a byte and therefore cannot exceed 255 BP

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>>29393838

>>29393823
The strength of Z-moves depends on the move it draws its power from. Anon is saying if the Pokemon knows Explosion an uses a Z-move, the Z-move will have god-tier strength--stronger than Explosion--without having to suicide.

>>29393834
Explosion is 250, self destruct is 200

>>29393834
>explosion is 300
>selfdestruct is 250
250 and 200 goof

>>29393846
I just meant the pic

>>29393849
>>29393866
so it was shittier than i thought, got it

>>29393873
I got it from bulbapedia's explosion page

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>Anon sent out Mimikyu!

>>29393896
Why is Mimikyu so based?

Is it legal to be so based?

>>29393888
Oh I'm an idiot thought that was SM, health bar should have given it away

>>29393846
Does the damage category also depend from the move used to fuel it? If I use Solar Beam Talonflame, would I get a Special Grass Z move?

>>29393896
>Excadrill breaks the mold!

>>29393929
Doesnt matter mold breaker only effects abilities not type immunities

>>29393929
......you can't break through type immunity.

>>29393929
>what is a ghost type?

>>29393918

Beats me. It would be pretty cool if we could use non-STAB Z-moves, though.

Z powered outrage. No confusion or locked into it

>>29393918
yes it does, for example nuzzle would be a physical Z-move

>>29393929
>Explosion Excadrill
WDHMBT

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>>29393838
252+ Atk Choice Band Aerilate Golem Explosion vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 1092-1285 (155.1 - 182.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Aerilate Golem Explosion vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 528-622 (125.7 - 148%) -- guaranteed OHKO

>252+ SpA Adaptability Porygon-Z Hyper Beam vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 340-400 (52.9 - 62.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO


>normal z-crystal hyper beam barely dents this retarded blob

I hate this thing so much

>>29393918
Yes, and yes. You can easily check this by catching a Pikachu in the demo and using the Electrium Z on it in a battle. Both Nuzzle and Electro Ball change into different moves, one being physical and the other special with different BPs.

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>sturdy

>>29393732
z moves don't just get +80 power.

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>bird spam is going to get even more retarded with hyper beam/double edge/return normal type z-move

>>29393732
What normal types get explosion ?

>>29394026
Seems like they nearly double.

>>29394031
The multiplier is 1.8x, looks like.

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>>29394030
Lickilicky

>>29394043
Except it definitely isn't, because we know that Nuzzle, a 20 BP move, turns into a 100 BP Z-Move.

>>29394054
So x5?

>>29394030
Smeargle.

>>29394054
nuzzle is 30, isnt?

>>29394047
So nothing special
Like Arceus or Snorlax

Snorlax does get self destruct
Wait so would pulverizing pancake work off of self destruct?

>>29394066
>>29394043
there is no magical formula.
http://hastebin.com/wuweyoduzo.php

>>29394077
It only works off Giga Impact.

>>29393976
Did you factor in Hippowdon's resistance to rock?

>>29394089
Yes there is.
max(100,min(power+80,power*2))

>>29394109
quick attack, thunderbolt, several more counterexamples i'm sure

>>29394109
Can you say that in English pls

>>29394132
ignore quick attack i'm dumb

>>29394136
Wait nvm

>>29394066
That would be so fucking broken, I'm sure it's +80 but just imagine that shit.

1250 BP Explosion?

>>29394132
The only counterexamples are spark and thunderbolt.
Spark is -10, thunderbolt is -5.

>>29394132
i guess it's just thunderbolt being dumb. maybe the designers forgot it was 90 bp rather than 95?

>>29394109
So if I use this calculation
Z move Explosion has 415 bp
Wew

>>29394189
Pikachu has thunderbolt so maybe they altered it for the demo?

>>29394097
Forgot, Ironically, I went to Hippowdons because I was too lazy to change Skarmory's typing so that it didn't resist flying.

>>29394010
>Explosion the next turn

>>29393947
Yes you can use any Z move as long as your Pokémon has a move that type.

So if these moves have no secondary effects, would slapping a Z-Crystal on a move like Close Combat or Overheat be useful?

But Explosion and self destruct don't effect ghosts unless foresight or odor slueth

>Pulverizing pancake off of 200 base BP self-destruct with STAB ontop
wew lads

>>29393732
drawbacks=/=secondary effects. Sheer force close combat still keeps the SpDef drop. I wouldn't be surprised if Z-moves based on explosion would still let you faint.

>>29393840

wait what ?

wha fuels z moves


how come gamefreak never explains this stuf clearly in their promotional material or game

so all i need is a pokemon to have a move of a type to use the s item associated with that type?

how does that affet base power of the z-move

what if i have two moves of the same type on a poke?

>>29393825
>a 330 BP Stab attack is not even a guaranteed OHKO
Eviolite was a mistake.

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>mfw protect

>>29395569
Only works off of Giga Impact

>>29393732
I'm pretty sure that Normal Gem, at least in gen 5 I think, actually would do more even without the defensive drop.

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>>29394291
>opponent has 1HP left
>use Explosion
Have you considered a career as a Team Rocket Grunt?

>>29397387
Gen 5:
252+ Atk Normal Gem Golem Explosion vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mew: 398-469 (116.7 - 137.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Gen 3:
252+ Atk Golem Explosion vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mew: 530-624 (155.4 - 182.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Gen 3's Explosion does significantly more.

>>29393879
Also it doesn't halve defense anymore.

Not that I knew that until they stopped doing it

>>29397465
Nevermind, I misread that post.
Here's Golem using a 330 BP Explosion (with gen 6's +10 to his base attack):
>252+ Atk Golem Explosion vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mew: 372-438 (109 - 128.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO

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HOLD ON GUYS I GOT THIS

>>29393773
Are you retarded?

>Z move
>Mega evolution

Pick one.

>>29397633

thou hast forgotten our lord and saviour Mega Rayquaza, insolent motherfucker

>>29397633
Are you retarded? Learn to read

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I wonder if will o' wisp still shits on physical z-moves

>>29393840
Maybe for older generations, but really?

I find it hard to believe, especially for gen 4+

>>29397633
Z-stones also let the user mega evolve.

>>29397788
One thing that's pretty scary is that apparently, if a move has priority prior to being turned into a Z-move, then said priority gets transferred to the Z-move.

Just imagine Sableye running around dropping Ghot Z-moves powerd up by Confuse Ray or Fire type Z-move powered by WoW or Poison Z-move powered by Toxic, all with priority.

>>29397633
I think that was exactly his point my dude

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>>29393732
Z-moves are basically the "skip fight" button meant first and foremost for children.
There is no point debating about balance.
They'll be certainly disabled in PVP.

They only goal is to look cool and be OP, stop going full smogon on them as they'll be banned everywhere anyway.

>>29395952
The you can choose to use the Z move with either of them, the strongest the move the strongest the Z move
And we know about the pokemon needing to have an active move with the same type as the Z move since forever

>>29393807
wtf i love lickilicky now

>>29397841
Though if the priority is transferred, Tsareena can just cancel it, right? So switching to it could potentially just piss away the opponent's Z-move.

>>29397869
>They'll be certainly disabled in
See the 1 hour video footage, the one when they were fighting in battle royale and both eevee and pikachu used their Z moves
If anything they are a waste of an item sloth and should only be used on pokemon you dont know what the fuck equip them with

>>29397869
>Z-moves are basically the "skip fight" button meant first and foremost for children.

Only if you put them on already OP mons. Z-moves might make a ton of the dex actually useful.

>>29393732
I was thinking about this a couple days ago, glad to see you don't faint.

>>29397929
But you can't control that.
So by default everyone will pick the format that defaults everything to level 50, no items dubs and no Z-moves.

Showdown might set up a framework that restrict Z-moves for a meta-savvy list though, but that's a small fraction of players.

>>29394109
>Spark 65 120 55
max(100,min(65+80,65*2))
max(100,min(145,130))
max(100,130)
130 != 120

>>29393732
And it still doesn't outdamage pre genV explosion. Metagross will never be back.

>>29397633
>reading comprehension

>>29397869
Except spamming Z-moves would probably take longer than just KO'ing mons with normal attacks

>>29397929
Assuming Z-moves will actually be useful they will just be put on pokémon that are already strong.

Chances are they will suck though.

>>29397998
Would it?
>Stupid kid using his shit move build
>Half of the attacks do jack shit because he didn't read beyond the attack name
>Have to stop to heal, revive and switch pokémons

as opposed to
>touch the BEEG GLOWING BUTTON
>OHKO.

Anyone that needs the Z moves to win probably takes ages to do so normally assuming they can at all.

From a DM perspective I can't really look down on winning against a gym leader/Vilain/E4 by spamming Z-moves with your last standing pokémon after you've burned through your 7 revives.
Whatever makes them have fun.
I'm just warning anyone that might think this will add a layer of strategy to the game.

>>29397929
Not really since literally everything gets Z Moves and obviously already good pokemon will be much better users of them than shitmons unless shitmons get special Z-moves, or a higher Z-move multiplier.

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>>29398051
Anon I'm pretty sure a 330 BP with 100 base accuracy doesn't "suck"

>>29394077
Snorlax gets self destruct

>>29398086
Wasting a moveslot for a predictable 1pp move does

>>29398170
People run Normal Gem Explosion, what the hell makes you think they'll pass up the chance to explode twice?

>>29397633
>it's too bad you can't do this
>you can't do that you fucking retard
?????

>>29397281
>Z-Move powered by Feint

>>29398081
Eevee has it's own z-move, other underpowered mons are probably going to get z-moves too.

>>29397929
No it won't because the second it uses the crystal even if it KO'd a strong pokemon, it goes back to being shit again. An example let's say sunkern uses a z crystal and KO's a Mega Tyranitar. Great, but wait now I have a regular old shitty sunkern left, oh no.

And yes I realize no one's going to be using a sunkern, but you still see the point having a powerful move doesn't make the pokemon any stronger, hell if it were the truth just give stuff Blast Burn or Frenzy plant and they'll be fine.

>>29398068
You can only use them once per battle though.

>>29398068
>spamming Z-moves
They're once per battle anon

>>29398110
Yeah he just said that

>>29393732
Source?

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>>29398068
>Look guys, I am a retard -The Post

Sylveon pixilate hyper beam

>>29398209
Z-moves don't get the secondary effects from the base move.

>Double Battle
>Opponent used Surf
>Golem hung on with Sturdy
>Golem used Z-Move
>OHKO
>Opponent sent out X
>Your Pokemon used Follow Me
>Golem used Explosion

>>29393809
Can you do that?

Explode twice in a row?

>>29398919
>Protect
>Z-move is rendered useless

>exploding your mega

>>29397633
ITT: Anon embarrasses himself because he's an illiterate retard

>>29397831
I don't think they do, my man

You're just able to use the Z-Ring to mega evolve your pokemon