This is truly the candidate of the worst design in the history

>>29253967
>my mom's _______

Why do I keep seeing this shit here? What does it even mean?

>>29254024
please leave

>>29254024
It's when something is so basic that it's bland and boring. In the case of Pokémon, it's when one is so close to its inspiration that it feels more like that inspiration than a unique Pokémon.

>>29254094
Nope :^)

>>29253967
MY MOM'S TOUCAN SAM

It is a nice-looking Pokemon. We have plenty of line that change the animal with evolution (Remoraid to Octillery, Marill to Azumarill, Mudbray to Mudsdale). What's the big deal? It's not ugly, so I like it. I love it, in fact. Clean and colorful and appealing.

>>29253967
Masuda probably thinks he's Darwin.

I keep staring at this trying to find any monster qualities to it.

Its literally just a toucan

>>29254186
It's clean and colorful and appealing because it is literally a normal toucan. Right down to the blue feet.

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>>29254186
>Remoraid to Octillery, Marill to Azumarill, Mudbray to Mudsdale
These designs are very specialized animals with shoehorned concepts(visually) and feel like fictional monsters with cartoony proportions. This design doesn't convey these at all. Its just a typical toucan in a cartoon universe and nothing else.
>What's the big deal?
The big deal is that its a flawed design in nearly every aspect. Its like didn't even bother trying with this thing at all. Why is this so hard to get?

>>29253967
>shakes OPs hand

Well said.

No one complained when a seagull evolved into a pelican.

It looks like alolan honchkrow....

>>29253967
>This is truly the candidate of the worst design in the history of the franchise from an objective scale.
>what is chesnaught
Hell, I bet you're a Chesnaughtfag too trying to deflect hatred over to the Toucan instead. Fuck off.

>>29255438
So gamefreak should continue making random shit for the sake of 'muh random'. Ohkey.

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>>29255438

>coastal bird evolves into coastal bird
>western temperate forest bird evolves into tropical bird of paradise

/vp/ is so dumb and autistic it really blows my mind lol

you know what I don't like about this thing? It's just a fucking toucan. That's it. They drew a real life toucan and made it cartoony. Seriously, it looks like someone took my mom's toucan and put it in the game.
Older pokemon actually had personalities to them. They had quirks that separated them from actual animals. This thing? It's. Just. A. TOUCAN

>>29255517
Nice copypasta.

>>29255438
Because the seagull was a piece of shit to begin with. Pikipek was actually kind of cute and cartoony enough not to just be literally my mom's woodpecker.

i like a lot this design

>>29255438
The pelican LOOKS like the seagull

This looks nothing like Pikipek

>>29253967
dont be so butthurt that its the new gen Bestmon

Hold up. This is Pikipek's evolution? Holy shit, I didn't even realize. I thought this was just a one-off. Wow.

>>29253967
It's literally a fucking Tocan, fucking the least creative Pokemon design I've seen

>>29253967
Follow your nose mate.

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>>29253967
>it doesn't even try to make itself look unique from it's animal basis. No forced design motif, nothing but my mom's animal.

>>29255322
>any pokemon design being flawed

They can be literally anything so how can it be flawed. It's just your opinion.

>>29255751
At least Pidgey doesn't look exactly like a specific bird, and evolves into having a mohawk.

>>29253967
Better than Pidgeot.

>>29254543
And Toucans are already very cartoony animals in real life, they don't have to do much to make it fit in as a Pokémon.

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>>29255489
Chesnaught maybe flawed execution, but its a FAR from being as this bad as the toucan. A design that tries to be more than just "my mom's animal" are designs that actually have effort put into them.

>>29253967
Truly the most gen 1 design.

>>29254024
its an unoriginal way of saying something is unoriginal

>>29255863
>Mohawk
You are literally retarded.

>Make woodpecker
>Turns into a different bird
>WOW WHY DID THEY CHANGE IT SO MUCH ITS MY MOMS TOUCAN
>Make woodpecker
>Turns into another woodpecker
>IT JUST GETS BIGGER
there is no pleasing you

>>29256095
>/vp/ is one person

They could have made it a steel drill woodpecker

It's a lot less autistic than Chatot's design, and because it's a 3rd evo it'll have better stats than Chatot too.

Cry harder faggots, this is one of the better regional birds we've had in a while.

>>29253967
>design is the worst because it effectively communicates all of its concepts
You don't know anything about design.

In a sea of overdesigned, ridiculous looking cartoons that bear only a vague resemblance to real animals that have polluted the last few generations, this design is actually very refreshing and pleasant to look at.

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>>29256222
but i like chatot...

>>29256261
What concept but 'Im a toucan?'

>>29254024
The true origin was when lilipup/herdier was revealed and some anon posted a thread saying "this is literally my mom's dog" and the rest is history

>>29256279
PMD Chatot was an asshole, that moment felt forced as fuck since PMD is all about melodrama.

>>29255489
>i hate chesnaught so anyone who doesn't think he's the worst automatically is a chesnaughtfag
You're a special kind of retarded, anon.

It just gets bigger is a common complaint for pokemon evos.
Gamefreak avoided this.
You complain

"Designs are too complicated" is a common complaint for higher pokemon evos.
Gamefreak avoided this.
You complain.

You cannot be pleased.

You will always find a way to whine and bitch and moan.

Gamefreak has no reason to care about what you think, because when you're so irrational, nothing you says matters.

And thank god for that.

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>>29255508
Toucans evolved from woodpeckeros loccos apparently

idk I won't even dare using Tikipeck anymore. First time ever I don't use a regional bird

>>29253967
>I hate it when Pokemon don't look like animals
>okay here
>wtf this is just a toucan

>>29256366
PMD made me hate chatot too but after i actually used him in game when i got his shiny the moves it learns, the cry, and it's animations really made the design for me

>>29254186
>(Remoraid to Octillery, Marill to Azumarill, Mudbray to Mudsdale)
Nice examples but why didn't you include literally every other regional bird? From day one this was a thing in Pokemon.

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>>29256095
They can still make it a toucan without making it look too much like a toucan. A woodpecker with toucan characteristics would've been more consistent. This atrocious design has ZERO woodpecker characteristics. It screams blatant laziness.

>>29255508
Woodpeckers are tropical birds

>tfw your mom doesn't have a toucan

>>29256296
I'm sure there's a little more to it than that, but even then there's nothing wrong with it at that level if that's the intention.

Pokemon are designed to present ideas, this one will help represent the colourful wildlife of Alola (and by extension of Hawaii) and Toucans themselves are oft-used in all sorts of media so watering them down with arbitrary bonus concepts would be completely counter-intuitive since it would distract from it's simple role in the series as well as creating an arbitrary Pokemon for the sake of making it 'radical' or whatever.

The only issue in any design is if it doesn't communicate its ideas. Anything superfluous constitutes bad design, objectively.
This lad is fine.

The whole thing is, Game Freak is thinking that the "interesting" thing about this evo line is that it suddenly goes from a woodpecker to a toucan! But there's nothing else. There is absolutely no theme to this toucan. Even Fletchling's line had the whole flaming arrow thing going. All the other birbs had something going for them; the most boring one of all was probably Pidove, and it at the very least had a somewhat stylized design to make it its own thing, especially with the gender differences referencing male courting displays.

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This thing really is no different from a regular toucan. They could have made the beak sharper or drill-like, maybe make it a woodpecker and toucan hybrid, but this is just an angry looking toucan.
I never cared for Pikipek in the first place, but this is just too weird to me.

>>29256576
The problem is that it doesn't feel like a Pokemon. It feels like somebody made a 3D model of a toucan. I am desperately hoping that it will still redeem itself somehow - maybe its dex entries will give it interesting features, maybe it will have an odd movepool as a result, maybe its animation will be something other than what we're expecting, just let it be something
I doubt I'll be using it, but it's just such a shame.

>A Pokemon that is a less colorful, less interesting version of a real-life animal

wow

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>>29253967
So this was actually a pokemon the whole time, huh

It only looks weird because a toucan looks drastically different from any other bird, but every single regional bird sans pidgey ends up being a different type of bird at their final stage, with this one at least they tried to make them all slightly similar (toucans and woodpeckers are known for their strong beaks, doves and pheasants have nothing alike).

It IS a shit design, absolutely, but it's nothing new.

>>29256874
how do they keep getting away with this

>>29256385
>there are people who hold both of these opinions simultaneously

Okay, I'll bite.

If the pokemon just gets bigger, it results in a lack growth between the stages, there was no creativity added to concept, it was exceedingly straight forward. Independent of that, a design can be too busy, have too much going on and as such is not aesthetically pleasing. These are not likely to occur together given the track record, but they're not mutually exclusive.

It's not underdesigned, it's not overdesigned, it's not designed at all because it's just a fucking toucan. There's literally nothing else to its appearance besides "toucan," not even "toucan with a silly/cute/badass style."

>>29256333
the rest is history? no my man. the rest was hilarious because of the replies.
>tfw googling shit like this never works and shows up with dumb memes and can never find the thread where /vp/ named OP's kid

>>29253967
>an animalistic pokemon that surely even genwunners would like
>people still complain

>>29256273
Absolutely agree, despite liking both options equally.

>>29256911
toucans' beaks are hollow and weak

>>29255438
Wingull and pelipper share a similar design and both look like Pokemon.

>>29256774
No idea where you're coming from, it looks like a Pokemon based on a Toucan and bears all the design philosophies that dictate Pokemon design.
If you're not liking it that's fine, but it's not fair to make false objective statements to defend a lack of interest; no one gives half a shit about what someone else likes.

>>29253967
Flying/Dark skill link best up

>>29255751
Looks cartoony and has cool eye markings. Stylized in neat and unique ways. If you put it next to an irl bird/pigeon it's obviously different.

toucan mon is indistinguishable from regular toucan

>>29253967
>woodpecker which looks like it's going to be fast as fuck
>turns into black Woody Woodpecker
>then turns into a toucan which looks like it's going to be slow as fuck because its beak is bigger than itself

>>29253967
At least it's shiny is pretty cool

>>29256222
Chatot has a sound theme and looks like a Pokémon
This evo drops all unique design in pikipek and ends up literally a toucan. There's no fucking theme, the middle evo is just the "excuse" for pikipek to lose all its stylistic design choices and turn into literally a toucan. Toucan and pikipek look 100% unrelated. Even remoraid is more related to octillary than this.

>>29253967
You know nothing of Charles Darwin and his study of birds. Fool!

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>>29255886
>cartoony animals in real life

>>29257168
Look at a picture of a real toucan. There are no differences. IRL toucans just happen to have a pokemon - like shape, due to them being odd animals. Might as well call okapis pokemon, because they're weird irl too.

Just because the animal is strange in real life does not mean you can plop it into the game unaltered and say it's a pokemon now.

>>29257168
I didn't pretend to make an objective statement. I was entirely speaking about how it feels (That's why I used the phrase "feels like"!). And Pokemon design philosophy generally involves creating a species based on two or more real-world concepts, whether those are animals, myths, objects, or even just vague concepts. Or even something original! This is not a rule, or a pattern, it's just how this shit works in order to maintain interest. There are rare exceptions, sure, just look at Seel. But even Seel has, I dunno, a horn and some limited stylization. This Pokemon doesn't. It is a model of a toucan, and I'd love to hear any way that it isn't. Really, I want to like this thing.
And it's all fine and good to say that nobody cares about other people's opinions, but if that is how you feel you should probably stop posting here.

>>29255751
I would argue Pidgey. It doesn't look exactly like any species of bird. It's a small perching bird, but has interesting features like its crest (which ends up being a focal point of its evolutions) and the peregrine falcon eye streaks that indicate the bird of prey it grows up to become.
Even if Pidgey WAS "my mom's bird", I would argue that that's more acceptable for a first-stage Pokemon. The first stage is generally the least bizarre/absurd/surreal/crazy, because it's there to get you excited about its potential evolutions. And that's fun! But when the final evolution is just an animal without any sort of unique feature, that's not very exciting.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Picocoraciae

the toucan is just a real life animal that looks like a pokemon.

>>29257432
It's quite clearly an image of a character designed for a game based off of a Toucan. Just because you consider it too faithful to it's source material does not change that. Check your privilege, lad.

>>29257516
>I didn't pretend to make an objective statement
Yeah, I was speaking in a general sense about the whole thread, then, to give a little more universal utility to me point.

>And it's all fine and good to say that nobody cares about other people's opinions, but if that is how you feel you should probably stop posting here.
Well, opinions aren't valuable to a discussion. If you waste time squabbling over likes and dislikes (subjective qualities that can't be measured or compared) then you'll achieve nothing; opinions are limited to smalltalk. Objectivity is the only mindset for actual discussion, which is pretty obvious when you think about it and even more so when your day to day life is built in discussions.

>This Pokemon doesn't. It is a model of a toucan
https://www.q-files.com/life/birds/woodpeckers-and-toucans
Sometimes a Pokemon simply displaying the surreality of evolution in the analogous real world is enough to merit its inclusion. Pokemon do a lot of things, their number one role in the games is to serve as an analogue to something else in real life (cultural or biological). This Toucan fellow represents that animal, as well as woodpeckers in general, and showcases the bizarre leaps evolution is capable of across relative species.

There were some more minor holes in what you wrote, but if I spent so much time picking out faults in 4chan posts I'd be long dead from exhaustion.

>Was planning on using cute woodpecker that turns into cool woodpecker
>Get literally a toucan

wtf i hate gamefreak now

>>29253967
i like the toucan i just don't get why it evolves from a woodpecker

>The family includes toucans, aracaris and toucanets; more distant relatives include various families of barbets and woodpeckers in the suborder Pici.

/thread

This looks like it won't even have a different typing from Normal/Flying

>>29254024
N E W F A G

>>29253967
PLEASE KILL YOURSELF

>>29253967
It's one of the worst pokemon ever. At least the other regional birds have had a sense of progression. This is an awful line.

>>29254024
Newfag

>>29258176
this. it's design is okay. concept is stupid. OP is overreacting.

>>29258176
>>29258378
Read the thread, mates. There's tonnes of explanations barely above your shitposts.
>>29257778

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>>29253967
Persian would like to have a word with you. Even its name is uncreative.

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It's not over designed, it's not edgy, it's not too simple, it's perfect. If you didn't know that toucans were real animals and you saw art of one you could easily believe it was a Pokemon and I think that's what they were trying to play off of. Here is an animal that already looks like a Pokemon. Im going to box my starter due to not liking their design and this line will take its place and probably be my favorite Pokemon of this gem and in my top 20 of all pokemon

>>29255554
>Wingull
>Shit

Please consider drinking some quicklime

>>29256657
>The whole thing is, Game Freak is thinking that the "interesting" thing about this evo line is that it suddenly goes from a woodpecker to a toucan! But there's nothing else.

Fucking this. Gamefreak and their 'surprises', jist like the starters. That they cannot be fucking nuanced enough not to just outright change species and abandon concept to be 'surprising', to me, indicates them masking poor design ethic.

>>29253967

I'll take my moms toucan over the digidestined beasts every day of the week

>>29258493
Show me a cat species with a rock embedded in its forehead. I'll wait.

>>29258569
>I didn't read the thread and haven't bothered to even research this before shitposting about it being 'bad' because I'm an impulsive, American hermit who has no idea how designs work at all and must voice my uninformed nonsense online because despite my complete lack of knowledge and despite how seeking out an explanation, reading it and learning (which I can do in this thread I shitposted in) would be far more effective than any post I could make it is my duty to make is next to impossible to have a proper discussion on this website by making posts without content based on emphasising how little I personally understand literally everything.
Fuck off, mate.

>>29258670
>one (1) gem makes my mom's mountain OK

>>29254159
Your mom is a whole. Who gives a shit take things less seriously, maybe you will get bullied less and a girl might actually blow you, when you stop being such a pathetic troll. It's pokemon either play the game for what it is or don't but it is not something to cry about children.

>>29258739
lurk more you dumb plebbitor

>>29258702
Lol wtf. I'm not American. Anon is impeccable design expert. K.

>>29258702
$0.02 has been deposited into your account

>>29256273
>In a sea of overdesigned, ridiculous looking cartoons that bear only a vague resemblance to real animals that have polluted the last few generations

THAT'S WHAT POKEMON HAS ALWAYS BEEN

>>29253967
I disagree. It's unique in that way.

>>29258766
You're a retard, seriously read he thread before posting in a discussion and don't discuss something you don't understand. Everything you wrote was covered and explained by other posts all the way through the thread.

>>29258769
Thank you.

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IT'S JUST A FUCKING TOUCAN
HOW CAN ANYONE DEFEND THIS SHIT
I'D RATHER TAKE AN OVERDESIGNED MESS THAN THIS UNCREATIVE SACK OF SHIT

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Even One Piece has a better toucan Pokemon.

>>29258842
I have read the thread you arrogant cunt.

>>29255751
this post roasted you faggots

>>29253967
Nothing, absolutely nothing will be worse than the trash bag or the ice cream.

>>29258728
It at least makes it better than Toucan Sam in that regard.

So this bothers you but Dratini to Dragonite doesn't?

So this bothers you but Chespin to Chesnaught doesn't?

So this bothers you but a pigeon to a pheasant doesn't?

So this bothers but a robin to an eagle doesn't?

People seriously need to fuck off about this woodpecker to tucan thing. Because it makes the same sense as everything I listed above, you're just being a faggot about "muh woodpecker".

>>29258870
It even has the blue feet and red feathers on its butt.
It's literally copied one-to-one.

>>29258432
so? they're in the same order/clade/whatever. still, woodpecker != toucan. its remoraid -> octillery all over again.

and OP is actually overreacting. there's shittier, lazier designs out there. hello there, alolan persian. there's probably some shit reason they have for it developing a giant ass head, but it's still hella ugly.

>>29258998
>when anon thinks we swallow all these designs and just have issue with this.

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guiz OP is design god he knows whats best o ok

>>29259030
Dunno about OP , but this>>29258842
smug arrogant cunt thinks they are

Looks great 2b quite honest with u familia.

Always happy to see GF find an animal to work with that they havent already. Animal-based designs are consistantly their best.

>>29259074
Work with? They practically just drew it, gave it angry eyes and simplified the gradient pf its beak into stripes. That is literally all they did.

>>29258929
>thread contains posts explaining the relationship between woodpeckers and toucans
>"IT DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE"
There's no arrogance you mong, you're shitposting and saying essentially what OP did. If you don't understand the idea behind the evolutionary line then you should consider getting a lobotomy.

>>29259017
Pokemon convey ideas based in the real world. You shouldn't need Woodpecker -> Toucan explained to you in that regard. Alolan Persian's face is clearly in reference to a breed of cat that has a weird face from being bred by rich people and makes perfect sense, regardless of likability.

>>29259066
Stop getting upset at having something explained to you, mate. If you have an argument then present it or stop being a fucking baby whining because someone knows more than you do.

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>>29258728
But Persian doesn't even have a lion-face to be considered a full-fledged mountain lion. Is it even based on a mountain lion at all?
>>29258870
THIS
H
I
S

>>29259160
Thats what half of gen 1 is and those designs hold up

>>29259030
even Rattata has more stylized features than Toucanmon,

Rats aren't purple, nor do they have curly tails.
The only difference between this cheap pokemon and a real Toucan is its blue feet. That's it.

>>29259207
Because there was nothing to compare it too. Many gen 1 designs are terrible but they have nostalgia. Nostalgia is a powerful marketing tool.

>>29259231
>he's never seen a rat embryo

>>29258525
>this line will take its place and probably be my favorite Pokemon of this gem and in my top 20 of all pokemon

Of course it is your favorite. It looks great. Mother nature usually makes pretty cool designs.

>>29259185
Tbh Mountain lion are overgrown house cat.
Like really, it is the closest feline relatedt

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>>29259231
toucans do have blue feet

>>29257071
It's not even overdesigned or color messed.

FUCK.

>>29253967

roughly half the regional bird lines evolve into a completely different bird

why is it only bad now?

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>There are Gen 5 apologists in the thread RIGHT NOW who think they have any valid input on poke designs.

>>29253967
I get your point but remember that every regional bird in a three stage line bar Pidgey changes the bird at the final stage. Talonflame is a Peregrine Falcon not a robin. Unfezant is a pheasant I think not a pidgeon. Staraptor is definitely not a starling. Pidgey is the only one that appears consistent. ALso I think they may be evolutionary relatives but again I do see your point.

>>29259231
haha this anon's digging his own grave using retarded arguments as a shovel

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>Draw a toucan
>Call it a pokemon
JUST

>>29259410
>There are Gen 6 apologists in the thread RIGHT NOW who think they have any valid input on poke designs.
Fixed your typo bro. No need to thank me.

>>29259178
Lol because it has real world basis its okay.

Stop trying to be patronizing you smug absolute CUNT as if I haven't known this stuff abour toucans and woodpeckers before hand and posted elsewhere how its like a meerkat evolving into a tiger. There is also the difference in how you could, feasibly, try to legitimize a meerkat evolcing into a tiger if enough of its design ethos is shared. But if you have to bridge it with something as ugly and bland as pikipek2, then the design doesn't hold up. Toucan is nothing of pikipek, in anyway. Except a beak emphasis. Could a woodpecker into toucan work? Maybe but not when not a single shread of commonality is shared between first and last stage and the second stage is an ugly clusterfuck tp overcompensate in bridging this gap. Trying to be too clever or unexpected with design can lead to bad designs. The toucan is literally literally a toucan, with no effort in trying to hearken back from evolving from a woodpecker.

I can't believe how fucking smug some cunts on here can be. On 4chan XD

>>29259270
Gen one was generally solid design-wise. "Its basically X animal" was a good philosophy. K.I.S.S.

Imagine if pokemon had started out as over-designed as digimon back in the day.

Our little pea brains would not be able to handle the abstract monstrosity of a modern-day pokemon.

I don't think it looks bad but it's just a super lazy design and thats why I hate it.
When they trace a toucan, call it a Pokemon and they think that's enough, I feel it's kinda insulting to the pokemon fanbase.

>>29259369
they still look like they belong to the same line even if they're different birds

if you put pidgey and pidgeot, fletchling and talonflame, starly and staraptor, tailow and swellow hell even pidove and unfezant next to each other, you can look at them and think "yeah I can see this pokemon evolving into this one"

you can't do the same with pikipek and the toucan without jumping through hoops

>>29259369
Because it doesn't come across as so gratingly juxtaposed as this. Design elements are shared and progress from 1 to 2 to 3 in most cases, here though we have a woodpecker and a toucan that look like they were designed totally seperately and then they made the ugly ugly middle stage to legitimize it as a line.

>>29259410
It's true.
Toucan has been the blandest thing since Pidove.

>>29253967
it's cute. CUTE!

>>29258870
If they would only add ONE thing that would make it look distinctively different from my mom's toucan, I'd be happy. Pidgey line has that head feather. Persian is literally mountain lion, but has the gem and rounded, large ears.

I don't have any problem with this bird, but it is simply because it's a toucan and toucan looks good. Even the color scheme is not unusual. The only thing that sets it apart is the spot on its beak, but this is a very minor addition.

>>29259571
Ha, how long did it take you to type that load of complete bollocks, lad?

I'm pretty sure that Toucans are closer to woodpeckers than any meerkat is to a lion. Also, that comparison is completely irrelevant.

If you're going to criticise something, you have to look at what the idea behind it is and how well it accomplishes that idea. We've got Pokemon based on related species and one ends up as the other, in a game where evolution is a major mechanic. What's the problem?

Every Pokemon represents an idea, and this guys shows of how crazy evolution is and how closely related two seemingly different things can be. You may as well cry about Trapinch not looking like Flygon. Grow up.

>>29259580
>Imagine if pokemon had started out as over-designed as digimon back in the day.
That would've been impossible due to the Gameboy's limitations anyway. "Modern day" pokemon can be over the top because they're free to exercise their creativity now.

>>29259721
There probably is a species with a spot like that anyhow.If its head didn't suddenly become totally rounded off instead of crested like the rest of the line maybe it wouldn't be so bad.

>>29258525
It's a little bit edgy

>>29253967
I'm still hoping the colours randomly move along the beak similar to A.muk to differentiate it from a normal toucan.

>>29259745
XD pretty sure.

They are in the same fucking sub-order precisely how lions and meerkats are. Do you see now how meaningless it is to say they are both part of X group? That's what it entails.

Trapinch actually works compared to this because its a holometobolic metamorhpic life cycle with a highly distinctive larval phase: the antlion.

Really I'm just feeling insulted at how patronizing that anon was. What a cunt.

>>29259768
It's a shame they didn't keep the crest then. The evolution line would be much smoother and the final eco would have a unique feature that sets it apart. AFAIK there aren't any crested toucans...

So does it use its beak to beak holes in things still?
That seems kind of crazy getting feet-wide holes made from single blow

>>29259922
Exactly but no they remove any vestiges of woodpecker and trace a real life fucking toucan. See and people stil try to defend this? If it had the pointed head like pikipek it owuld have made a world of difference and potentially legitimized the design.

>>29253967
It's boring and I don't like it.

>>29253967
stop mistaking your autistic opinions for objective truth. no amount of claiming something is universal actually makes it universal.
captcha: click on all trains. don't autists love trains?

>>29259907
Nah, you're a super idiot, fella.

Trapinch works because it is designed with a concept in mind.
Similarly, Toucanboyo works because there is a very clear concept in its design which I've explained quite a few times already - it represents the variety of evolution. It also does so without stepping on any toes, since nearly every regional bird does the very same anyway, but the complete contrast helps get the idea over: the idea of a the wonder of evolution.

Like, it's obvious that you're a bit too dense to appreciate a well undertaken concept, but this one is incredibly straight forward so there's really no excuse.

>>29258670
My point is, all they did was add a gem. That's it.

>>29255322
The original animal looks so much better than the pokemon.

My problem with the design isn't that it looks like the bird.
It's that it's just fucking bad, woulld be better if it actually did look like my mom's toucan.

>>29259571
>>29259907
>XD

MODS

>>29259745
I get the whole "woodpecker evolving into a toucan" concept everyone is talking about, but do you think a woodpecker just turned into a toucan in a short period of time.
In real life that would take thousand of years. Thy could reflect that process of evolution in the second stage, but no. It still looks like a woodpecker and draws no connection to the third stage.

>>29253967
Because toucans are more tropical than woodpeckers. And alola makes every fucking thing tropcial

>>29253967
Klinklang and diggersby are worse

actually, I like pikipek's final evo

>basing an entire design off a single still

how do you fags know for sure there isn't more to the design?

>>29260078
Hi. I just want to be in a reply chain with you before you get roasted by a few anons with a brain stem. Believe me, the argument you just made is so retarded within the context of Pokemon that it'll look effortless.

>>29260078
You've missed the point, there.
The idea being put across is that a woodpecker is not so far removed from a toucan and that two very distinct species can be so closely related.
Additionally, it gets two culturally important animals into one family which is handy.

>>29253967
Well, woodpeckers and toucans are both in the same order of Piciforme, so they're more closely related to say, Remora and Octillery.

While I like the toucan, I really would have preferred there be a separate woodpecker and toucan line. I have no problem with this toucan; I actually really like it. But the fact that it takes up the spot of a potential final evolution of a woodpecker feels like something great that was missed.

And while it may be nothing but "just a toucan", but isn't that what gen 1 did? I know that certain people actually like simple yet realistic designs.

Poll related: http://www.strawpoll.me/11367322/r

Also:
>judging a Pokemon before you know more about it and not just a picture of it and nothing else

>>29260058
Also large round ears, cartoony whiskers and a coiled tail.

>>29260057
By this point you're trolling so I am giving no fucks, 'fella'. Cunt.

>>29260207
Please show me at least one gen1 Pokémon which completely reproduces a design of an existing animal without adding any features that set it apart and make it unique.

>>29260207
>same order

Give me a sea lion that evolves into a hyena please Gamefreak! Same order! Wonders of evolution!

>No.

>>29253967
I don't hate it but I don't like it at all. It's completely in the middle for me, design-wise because it's literally a toucan.

Give it a banana that grows out of the top of the beak. Give it an oversized beak. Give it something that separates it from an actual animal. Even Bibarel was cartoonishly different and he was supposed to be the blandest of pokemon.

RIP Steel/Flying jackhammer woodpecker. I have a feeling GameFreak really wanted a toucan, had this guy as a single stage and were having difficulty with the original planned final for Pikipek so they smushed the two into one.

>>29260290
>you made a point and I'm mentally stunted and have no idea how to make a counter argument so I'll accuse you of trolling and try to insult you
Mate, you're pathetic. Fuck off back to your play-pen, maybe by your 7th birthday you'll be able to decipher the ideas behind Pokemon designs like I was at that age.

>>29260357
XD literal troll my god I've been baited so bad.

Who knows. Maybe you have to see it in motion to see why its different. But I agree last light was like.

>pokemon
>pokemon
>pokemon
>national geographic
>pokemon.

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>tfw it's starting to grow on me

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>>29260158
>>29260169
>WOW LOOK AT THAT AWESOME DESIGN CONCEPT

>>29255489
Only Delphoxfags shit on other pokemon because they like the worst starter

>>29260397
>I'm only pretending to be a complete retard
Excellent stance, I'm sure your anonymous face value will be saved by this approach to discussion

>>29260459
>missing the point
Just because you know how somethings are related to others doesn't mean that everyone is. The same way that just because I'm well able to look at a design and pluck out the concepts from it doesn't mean that every braindead idiot in this thread, (you)rself included, should be culled for their ignorance.

However, asking for the same explanation multiple times surely means you're mentally challenged so maybe you should go look for a carer and shop for some safety harnesses.

>>29260459
Dinosaur that evolved into a chicken would be a pretty cool Pokemon

>>29260213
They added a color scale to the beak, red tailfeathers, and marks around the base of its. If persian or pidgey is different enough, so is toucan.

>>29260603
Actually kind of would desu

>>29260632
>added red tailfeathers
>>29255322

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I think I like it better like this.

>>29260595
You literally talk so much shit anon my god. As if two extant species evolving one into another demonstrates 'the wonders of evolution' go fuck yourself. I bet you think humans literally evolved from chimps?

>admonish myself for still arguing with troll.

>>29260603
>>29260674
If they actually have a good design for it and don't just jump from a woodpecker to a toucan, then yes, it would be cool.

>>29258877
this bird brings the bantz to a new degree

>>29260353
...what?

>>29260807
Some cunty arrogant anon is trying to make the argument that the line progression is wonder of evolution or some shite.

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>>29260336
File name

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>>29260632
Colorful beak and red tail feathers are nothing unusual for a toucan. In fact I am surprised how nicely they managed to reproduce toucan's colors.
Pidgey and Persian have added details that change their shape to the extent that makes them unique. This Pokémon makes is a carbon copy of a real bird, with VERY minor color differences.

>>29260868
Eyespots become actual eyes though.

>>29260868
Your argument is self-defeating.

>>29260868
Literally my mom's asian swallowtail

>>29260057
Lol variety of evolution. Extant species don't evolve into one another you spaz. Their middle stage perhaps looks a little like what the extinct common ancestor could have lookee like. Still, its ugly and charmless.

>>29260718
>still missing the point
Do you think that a remora can evolve into an octopus in real life? Do you think mice are yellow and shoot electricity? What are you trying to argue? There's an idea presented about the relation of animals to each other. It's really fucking obvious, too. You'd have to be pretty stupid to not pick it up pretty quickly. That's why the toucan stage has so little in detail to compare against the first stage; it demonstrates the diversity between them while they still sit together as a family. It takes it into a tidy package. It's a self-contained idea, so clear that it shouldn't require explanation - indicative of good design, objectively.

It's also universal since there are no cultural cues in the design. Additionally. the toucan and the woodpecker are animals used in various media and advertising worldwide, giving the choice to use these animals for this example significance since everyone knows both so discovering their relation would be noteworthy.

On top or that, the toucan has tonnes of colour in it and will surely add a lot of ideas into the region's perceived culture in-game.

Because I'm not a retard I thought all of this withing 0.2 seconds of seeing it for the first time. Please stop trying to discuss things since you have no idea what a discussion is and you're a fucking idiot.

>>29253967
Itll look better in game
Right now its in mid animation making it look cranky

I still love this thing though

I wish it had more design liberties that made it an actual pokemon rather than just a freaking toucan.

Like some spots or something. Just a few things between it and an actual toucan.

I hope it's not flying/normal.

>>29253967
>from an objective scale
fuck off ahahah

>>29260953
>I take things too literally and force myself to miss the point because I'm completely incapable of lateral thought
You must have the worst taste in everything.

>>29260868
Eh, this is pretty close, but I think that eyes, large head and 'cartoony' look make it a bit more unique. It's evo is better in that sense.

Arbok could also be an example of a 'carbon-copy' pokemon, but the pattern on its neck really makes it stand out.

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>>29257298
>looks like a Pokémon
what did he mean by this?

>This evo drops all unique design in pikipek and ends up literally a toucan.
This evo drops all unique design in Seel and ends up literally a dugong.

>There's no fucking theme, the middle evo is just the "excuse" for pikipek to lose all its stylistic design choices and turn into literally a toucan.
There's no fucking theme, the middle evo is just the "excuse" for Trapinch to lose all its stylistic design choices and turn into literally a dragon.

>Even remoraid is more related to octillary than this.
wew lad

>>29261094
It keeps the horn, funny face shape and smooth white body

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>>29260336
Not an animal but

>just give it a face, arms and legs

It's not really enough to me to make it stand out as a unique, compared to say Venusaur that has a similar plant attached to a unique looking creature.

>>29261132
It drops the yellow joules, eye color, upright position, and its flippers change entirely.

>>29261094
Actually Vibrava is an adult antlion and Flygon is a draconic "what if"

Antlions are larvae

>>29261160
So basically everything other than the flower is new?

>>29260957
Remora are well known as fish with suckers. It is also purposefully designed to evoke a pistol.

Octopus have suckers and octillery is designed to look like a cannon.

What exactly is the underlying concept linking the physical design of pikipeks line? That they're totally disparate isn't a theme because in cases where this appears to be the case there is usually underlying conceptual reasons.

How is this presenting an idea of animals to each other? To bring forth my example again, would a tiger evolving into a meerkat for the sake of demonstrating they are evolutionarily related make a good deaign concept? Probably not. Hence why this doesn't really work that well.

This 'neat tidy package' you mention relies upon a terrible middle stage that can be nothing aside from serving as a laboured bridge between two very different visual designs. It has a crest like pikipek which then disapears when it evolves again. It's wings are very similar to pikipek's but become pure black when it evolves again. It has a colourful beak that sort of evokes a toucan and that's about it. The line is a shambles. Its final stage is also an actual expy of a real life animal.

>>29261253
It gets peckier

>>29261253
Wait for the lore before judging the evolution as not making sense

you're excusing Remoraid despite it looking more like a squash than a gun and evolving into a generic cartoon octopus, but you're not giving a giant toucan a chance

>>29261309
Remoraid also attaches to Mantine's wings as armament so it becomes 10/10

>>29255508
the "autistic" anons are the ones getting annoyed over the toucan. that means you.

>>29260957
[not the guy you're replying to] I wish you would kill yourself.

>>29261160
yeah maybe this is not much - but it is still a significant addition that makes it, well, a Pokémon. If you remove its eyes, arms and legs - what remains would be exactly the same as this bird Pokémon is to a toucan.

>>29261302
Lol. Remains to be seen. Its huge beak looks very cumbersome for rapid pecking which seems stupid since pikipek and its evo have thin dextrous looking beaks.

>>29261363
Thank you anon. This guy talks total shite and Im baited by the bait :(

>>29261253
You're putting a lot of effort into not getting it.

There's an established trope of regional birds going from one species to the other.
In the first and final stages being completely dissimilar (and in their being two species of birds who are household names and recognisably so) it hammers in the fact that those species are actually related in real life. It;s that simple. It's one of the meta-pokemon that serves as a reference point for understanding/underlining concepts behind Pokemon - it helps young kids realise there are idea behind Pokemon and they're not just random monsters, it also exclaims 'these birds are related in real life'. There'll be regional importance to them too, even their existence adds to the atmosphere of the in-game region.

>>29261363
Nah, I'm a hugely successful person who is paid to write like this. If anything, you should be grateful. People pay 1000s a head for my criticism.

>>29261309
In the case of remoraid, clearly there are no pretences of trying to justify a fish into an octopus, because it is its non-animal conceptual basis which has evolved. This isn't the case with pikipek; its second evo is a laboured attempt to bridge this.

>>29261469
>ALL species are related in real life anon.


> and never was more shite uttered.

>>29261469
Hugely successful.

Baiting troll on 4chan. Kek.

>>29260685
>>29260885
Real toucans have red assfeathers. Toucanmon has red feathers on his tailplume. Toucanmon also has a color scale on his beak, not a colorful beak. Toucanmon also has exaggerated proportions that would make it impossible for him to fly. I'm not arguing that toucanmon is not bland and uninspired; my point, however, is that it is as bland and uninspired as persian or pidgey.

>>29261611
here's your (you) for pursuing the "pretending to be retarded" angle far beyond its limits

>>29261650
>you have to be a hermit to access 4chan
you could at least learn to greentext before shitposting so poorly

>>29261194
>and Flygon is a draconic "what if"

the point

your head

Antlions are not dragons. Woodpeckers are not Toucans. OP is a faggot.

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>show this to friend who doesn't know much about Pokemon outside the first 3 generations
>don't tell him it's a Pokemon
>asks me if it's fanart of Toucan Sam

Fuck my life. I want to like this thing, I wanted a toucan so badly.

>>29261873
>implying you have friends
fake and gay

>>29253967
>it doesn't even try to make itself look unique from it's animal basis.

The beak will spin as it drills into things, and look like one of those rainbow twisters of car washes.

>>29261712
>tailplume
>color scale
>proportions

Those changes are all VERY minor, except maybe for proportions. But real toucans also have an overly large beak so it does not make the design stand out.

Persian and pidgey added new details to real life animals, not (very) slightly tweaked existing ones. Not that I like their designs very much - but they are Pokémon. This is a toucan.

>>29261902
I have online friends.

>>29258998
>95% of /vp/ hates Orange Barney
>60% of /vp/ hates the disgusting pinata mess of a starter
>a bird evolving into another bird that shares the same aesthetic qualities and overall design nuances
>a bird evolving into another bird that shares the same aesthetic qualities and overall design nuances


>a small woodpecker turns into another woodpecker and shares aesthetic qualities and design nuances
>which then evolves into a toucan that shares nothing with the first stage except black feathers, no similar aesthetics, no design nuances the same

it's complete and utter trash

>>29253967
You saw alolan Persian, dugtrio, and the final starter evos and THIS was what bothered you?

>>29261958
Can you please just shut the fuck up

>>29261958
exactly, i can look at Persian or Pidgey and I don't immediately see a mountain lion or a pigeon(or whatever), i see it as a pokemon. But with Toucanmon it's immediately just a toucan

>>29262019
one thread at a time

>>29262082
Upvoted
I agree you sure got him

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>>29261720
I hate you so fucking much anon. So much. You're a detestable person. Your 'concept' of how they're related is basically bullshit that has no bearing on how gamefreak chose to design this fucking line. It was a case of 'surprisu' and not much else.


This 'established trope' you speak of regarding regional birds is also kind of bullshit because no other regional bird tries so unflinchingly hard to be a real life species. They all look hybridized to a degree with mixes of raptoral and passerine traits. However what they all have is running thematic elements through them (pidgey: striped headcrest, starly: facial marking/crest, pidove: prominent cere that developes into other facial ornamentation, fletchling: 'flaming arrow' concept/ arrow fletching tail) and also their designs just intuitively fit together better than this one, where body shape changes far too radically. Also you could argue that the reason the regional birds seem to change species is because they go from cuter, smaller and passerine in appearance towards raptorial adults. Real life raptor birds do actually look kinda cute and fluffy when they're younger.

You're really fucking reaching abd presuming so much to think YOUR idea is exactly what gamefreak had in mind when that probably wasn't the case. I'm trying to argue that there really is no theme to this line but 'surprise' and that they have prominent beak aspects. Furthermore the other main criticism is how the toucan is barely barely stylized.

>>29262082
Thank you for adding to the discussion.

>>29261712
In any case, I hope that its animation will be something cool and unusual - like using its beak as a drill during battle. Or maybe its tail will look unique - we don't really see it all on the picture. It's too early to condemn this poor thing at this point.

>>29262213
If its beak drills tgat changes everyrhing. But that doesnt look likely as its so downcurved.

>>29262213
It is absolutely not too soon to condemn it.
We condemned Luchalitten months ago and nobody is trying to defend alolan persian

>>29262152
This. That anon is deliberately making this thread run circles; his replies are fucking painful to read and he also acts like a straight up cunt.

>>29262152
>You're wrong because I can't comprehend conceptual design and I will keep trying to argue against your developed points with 'nuh-uhs' because I have no self-awareness
>your explanation of it playing off of other regional birds while using its inherent distinctions to get the idea across is wrong because I use that distinction as an excuse for it being bad so you can't make sense out of it.
>you're really reaching, despite having made points and the fact that I've made no real effort to even comprehend them, let alone argue against them

Your post literally spells out that you didn't bother trying to get it and just went straight to stubbornly saying I'm wrong and it's bad because you want it to be bad.
Game Freak are conceptually meticulous, you shouldn't overlook them just because you're analytically challenged.

>>29262082
Sorry I hurt your feelings anon

I think the Toucan looks good

I just wish Pikipeck didn't evolve into it

>>29258525
>If you didn't know that toucans were real animals and you saw art of one you could easily believe it was a Pokemon and I think that's what they were trying to play off of

Honestly this.

Hell even with the case of Caterpie and Vileplume
>>29261160
>>29260868

Back then, I never even knew the real caterpillar and flower existed until many years later and thought the real life counterparts were cooler because of it.
Same could be said if a person has never seen a Toucan

>>29254186
The big deal is that the woodpecker had potential to have an amazing evolution line but instead it turns into a toucan which could've just been an entirely different pokemon on its own. I mean how would you feel if starly evolved into chatot? Except chatot was just bigger

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>>29262315
Sprry anon do you mean me who posted cute birb, or this cuck?:

>>29262323

>>29262582
We don't all live in a small isolated villiage in Algeria, everyone knows what a fucking toucan is

It is LITERALLY my mom's toucan.

>>29262323
>Game Freak are conceptually meticulous

Ohhhp. We fould the gamefreak apologist

>>29253967
Here's your (You).

>>29255508

>Fish evolves into octopus
>"B-b-but muh gun theme!"

This is fine. Leave Sam alone.

>>29255508
>bird with essentially no gular pouch evolves into a bird with a pronounced gular pouch
>bird with pronounced bill evolves into bird with pronounced bill
Just WOW!

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>had a grandma with a pet Toucan
>tfw I can actually say LITERALLY my grandma's Toucan

>>29262710
That wasn't the main reason that anon was trying to convey.

What anon meant was something like this: not everyone knows about Asian Swallowtail caterpillars or the rafflesia. So, imagine if someone had never knew what a toucan was until they saw Pikipek's final evo. It would be the same experience as one would have with seeing Caterpie and Vileplume for the first time without knowing about Asian Swallowtail caterpillars and rafflesias.

>>29262747
>professional designers are bad and points are wrong because of my expert shitpost
(you)

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>>29262877
nice

>>29262789
that's just it though, there is a theme there
the toucan line has no theme just shit exectution

>>29262899
>taking anon's word that they're a professional designer, on 4chan

Even if you are a designer doesn't stop you from being a cunt or the toucan from being pretty dreadfully dull.

>>29262887
Yeah, it would be the same experience. But everyone does know what a toucan is, so the idea behind that doesn't work for it.

>>29262949

>Shit execution

Bird looks dope and gets Skill Link. All I care about.
People on /vp/ cry about the weirdest shit.

>>29262949
This.

>>29262697
Um, I mean the condescending cuck anon who seemingly gets paid 1000s a head for his criticism. He's stalling the discussion and I don't think he's necesssarily baiting. That's just how his mind works and that's very sad!

>>29263008
Sorry anon, my bad.
I forgot that there are people who care about an artificial metagame and don't care about actual designs

>>29253967
The shiny version's beak is the bisexual flag colors and I'm a humongous faggot, so I like it.

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>>29253967
>forgetting about the gen 6 dex which had some of the worst designs

>>29253967
I like the overall design, it has Gen 1 animalesque vibes however I cannot explain how did Pikipek ended with this as third stage evo, the second one may be ugly but at least you can tell what its pre evo was, the only thing it shares with this toucan is the beak shaded orange color at best.

I was so confident that Pikipek and Toucan were from a multi stage line and a single stage mon like Chatot and such.

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>>29263053
Aw okay thank you anon. I can sleep peacefully now knowing I'm not the only one who thinks this guy is a total creep. Goodnight /vp/ :3

>>29263091
I forgot that there are people who care about artificial designs and don't care about an actual metagame

>>29263150
>missing the point
>reading comprehension

>>29263150
completely ignored the thread, didja?

>Majority of Gen 1 designs are recolored animals
>People defend it

>Already colorful bird gets made into Pokemon
>Everyone shits on it

Nope, nothing wrong here, just /vp/ being /vp/

>>29263197
haha u're right lmoa
just literally let pokemon become math and physics

instead of pokemon sprites just slap them their species name, should be enough

no need for games at all, just meta

>>29263274

Except again, toucan looks dope.

Nobody complained when the lizard became a dragon.
Or the sick snake dragon became Barney.

>>29262988
>not knowing how to read
Where did anyone claim to be a member of GameFreak's design team? Maybe if you spent more time reading the posts you're responding to and less time stubbornly calling things shit and ignoring explanations this thread would have less bullshit nonsense.

>Even if you are a designer doesn't stop you from being a cunt
So making a statement makes someone a cunt and you have to call something shit regardless of the ideas behind it to be a cool dude such as yourself? I never knew

>dreadfully dull
So, because you didn't instantly think it was cool as shit it's not good? Again, designs are carried out to communicate an idea and anything else is superfluous and definitively bad. Your entire approach to understanding it is flawed.

>>29255438
Pilliper doesnt look like a mere drawn pelican
This thing does look like a mere toucan
Fucking Zazu from the Lion King is more of a pokemon than this

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Literally every single regional bird pokemon is a unthemed bird that evolves into bigger, dumber unthemed bird, save Smogonbird. He has the honor of having flame motifs.
Pidove was a pigeon who evolves into some other kind of pigeon (or a quail of some manner.)
Pidgey is a bird that evolves into a bigger bird.

Stylewise, this line goes through an interesting number of changes, with the enormous beak and it's yellow to red gradation being one of the boldest changes in a regional bird.

And don't whine about the woodpecker becoming a toucan. We've had MUCH stranger evolutions out of pokemon...

>>29253967
Is this level of bitching going to continue forever because people had this false dream of a steel flying woodpecker?

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>>29253967
>shitting on pokemon designs
A reminder to get a load of this and be grateful for what you have

>>29263351
>nobody complained when orange lizard kept the consistence of its line and eventually became a flying lizard known as dragon
There's nothing to complain.

>nobody complained about dragonair evolving into barney
That's incorrect and you know it, it's been 20 years and the opinions are still divided about it.

>>29263374

Remember that this is how majority of /vp/ is:

>THIS IS A SHIT POKEMON BECAUSE I DON'T LIKE IT! IF YOU LIKE IT, YOU'RE A FUCKING AUTISTIC FAG!

>>29263424
come on man

this thread was deep enough

>>29263150
>>29263424
off topic
please read the board rules before shitposting

>>29263053
>>29263188
please don't samefag

>>29263374
When did my post specify gamefreak designer? Go peck yourself to death.

>>29263450
Yeah, I'm well aware. This board is one of the worst for actually discussing things and has a userbase made almost entirely of NEETs who do nothing other than play Pokemon so they don't understand the references being made in the designs.

I like to entertain myself by engaging with people who are fanatical about a property they don't even understand fully, honestly.

>>29263390
>Unthemed bird
Brown almalgamation of birds with a pronounced focal crest of feathers
>Unthemed bird
Spooky hypnotic design
>Unthemed bird
AS FAST AS POSSIBLE
>Unthemed bird
Red crest and zigzag chest vigilante bird
>Unthemed bird
Facial additions that become focal point
>Unthemed bird
Flaming arrow

>>29263374
>>29263598
In other words you are sadistic malicious cunt. Wonderful anon.

>>29263390

Thank you.

Holy fuck, you people are upset because we have an actually interesting transition.

>>29263627
>interesting transition.

Kekeke

>>29263573
>Game Freak are conceptually meticulous, you shouldn't overlook them just because you're analytically challenged
>Ohhhp. We fould the gamefreak apologist
>professional designers are bad and points are wrong because of my expert shitpost
>taking anon's word that they're a professional designer, on 4chan
Seriously, learn to read

>>29263622
Nah, I research human culture and the delusions of contemporary man brought about by the 'infinite distraction' leading to absolute laziness and unwarranted self-righteousness. Ignorant shitposters like you, who complain at length about perfectly fine things purely because they refuse to understand them, are nice little case studies.
It's also remarkable to me that people can be so incapable of figuring out surface level concepts like that of a Pokemon's design, since I have been able to figure them out since
I was a kid and it has always been the only really worthwhile thing about Pokemon as a series as well as the driving force behind the franchise.

>>29263612
Well if you're a fan of nitpicking over aesthetic details:
>Unthemed Toucan
Comes from a line of birds known for their beak power, has a massive beak with colors saying 'beware of this shit' in a gradation that looks like it's on fire, a pissed off expression and body posture saying "Come at me bro."
The black, simple body directs all your attention to the beak, which is obviously a powerful weapon.
The pokemon is not overdesigned, still has pokemon touches (pikachu cheeks), and easily accomplishes what it was intended to do.

>>29263390

This is /vp/. People don't give a shit. They'll talk shit about anything that they can no matter how minor and insignificant it is.

Shows how pathetic this board is getting, especially since this shit is a meme.

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>>29255863
WRONG FUCKING BIRD

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>>29263138
I'm not a huge faggot and I like it too. People saying it's pandering to bisexuals are as annoying as tumblr saying Sylveon was for trannies though.

We can't just have color schemes anymore without them fucking being related to LGBT, can we? No issues with LGBT, but goddamn, making the rainbow into a symbol of homosexuality was bad enough.

>>29263822

Nobody cares about the background and concepts of the Pokemon around here unless they want to.

People purposely ignore the fact that some Pokemon can be more simple or complex than others background and design wise and just take it from first glance.

Basically, stop trying. People around here are gonna keep bitching no matter what logical thing comes from your mouth.

>>29263822
So everything gamefreak does is perfect?

>>29259231
Raticate really is just a rat though. I actually find it humorous since ratatta is like a cartoon rat but it evolves into a more realistic rat for some reason.

>>29264002

I love how retarded people on /vp/ are.

He never said that everything they do is perfect. He's saying that they have a better thought process than close-minded people like you.

They're actually coming up with interesting concepts and following themes in designs that get shit on, but you people don't believe it because of ignorance and just believe your opinions.

By in no means is everything perfect. it's just a matter of perspective, something only a few people on /vp/ have.

>insert immature reply here

>>29264002
Not sure how you managed that leap of logic, especially following my post about how all the birds evolve into other, regular birds, but...
No, I don't think Gamefreak's designs are always successful.
They have a number of different artists who create these pokemon designs, and each very clearly have their own unique approach towards their designs.
Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, and this is always highly subjective.

My point here is that this pokemon, by the design tropes it's using, is successful in what it wants to be.

>>29257225
Look at the gen one pidgey sprite. Literally had just plain bird eyes

>>29263424
Why do these always include some decent looking ones? That moth and the eye hydra thing alone can pass off as pokemon

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>>29263966
I still don't understand how gay = rainbow

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>>29255489
>disliking bara grass type

he fucking saved the series
he proved that good pokemon designs still exist and rescued Quilladin from mockery

you're a monster

>>29264066

>Cartoonish animals in Gen 1 are okay to people

>Cartoonish animals in any other gen are shit to people

I'll never understand that complaint...

>>29263791
You're a disgusting person anon. You claim to be research human culture but you spend time picking fights on 4chan.

Professional designers are not infallible, nor are you omniscient so as to know, perfectly, gamefreak's design intention furthermore the intention does not equal the result and clearly the result is divisive; a perfect understanding of its concept does not validate its design or make it good.

You are remarkably arrogant and condescending and if you claim to be what you say you are, you shouldn't be here. Unless you are as debauched and autistic as the rest of us. You are a troubled individual.

>>29264237

>debauched and autistic as the rest of us

No wonder this board is always full of shit

>>29262871
I love toucan mon but woodpeckers have beaks, not bills

>>29264237
Not that guy but desu it feels like YOU'RE the one being arrogant and condescending here.

>>29264141
How do KNOW what design tropes were used in creating it? You give too much credit to gamefreak by trying to expound exactly their intention. Pikipek is NOTHING like Toucan in a way that is just not comparable to other regional birds who all have degrees of hybridization or stylization to their designs.

File: Pileated_Woodpecker_Ash_RWD2.jpg (3MB, 3791x2843px) Image search: [Google]

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Clearly the connection is that both it and Pikipek are my mom's birds

>>29264373
First stages are often just my moms _____, and then evolve into something with an actual design

this goes from my mom's woodpecker, to my mom's woody the woodpecker, to my mom's toucan

>>29264237
>picking fights
Nah, I made an educated analysis of a design which I happen to have the ability to do. I was then shitposted at and continued to explain, matter-of-factly, my points while facing streams of nonsense from stubborn idiots and samefags.

>a perfect understanding of its concept does not validate its design or make it good
Actually, it's concept being legible makes it good, objectively. It's impossible for universal transmission of an idea because people are difficult (e.g. you). I'm schooled in this stuff, I have many designer friends, I work primarily in 'art' myself - which is actually more akin to the philosphies behind Pokemon designs than any other field is. I've more experience and knowledge on any of this than you do. That much is obvious purely based on your response there.

>You are remarkably arrogant and condescending
Nope, I'm communicating factually, I have no opinions represented, I have no feelings behind my words. I'm stating things as they are because that's how a discussion works. Anything else is a product of your own lack of self worth. You're projecting on top of me as a defense mechanism because you're so afraid of people and criticism that you take it as a personal assault as though you're a special, fragile snowflake and any logic or explanations that put your random assumptions into question are evil and must be destroyed. That's on you. Grow up.

>>29264292
Both of the are actually just being cunts

>>29253967
>Toucan pokemon revealed
>It results to be a toucan
>"M-muh flat design"
Shut up, I bet you like all the overdesigned shit we got in this gen

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>>29264335
Well, I couldn't say for sure the exact thought process that goes behind it, but I will say this...

I'm an artist by profession, and character design is part of that. Just based on my experience in that field, I'm drawing conclusions based on what I can see.

What I see is a line of pokemon who heavily emphasize their beak/bill power, and have a red/black/white color theme.

I'm not really super concerned with the fact that it evolves into a toucan, especially when you consider that Spearow is literally a ratty sparrow who evolves into a crane, and between the two, they have less in common than this line does, even by their color layout.

>>29264486

Always remember. On /vp/, if you're mature and try to be factual, idiots will shit on you for no reason. And you are doing a damn good job with holding up

>>29264335
Anon meant that Gamefreak wanted to make a toucan Pokemon, so that's exactly what they did, with nothing else added to the toucan.

Besides, Gamefreak will never ever tell us how they work and think. And they probably never will.

>>29264486
But anon, why are you here? Surely your educated self has better things to do?

>>29264373
is fine for pikipek to be your mom's bird, just like caterpie and herdier are fine as they are going to evolve. Even then pikipek has the giant head and super deformed proportions going for it.
Toucan has nothing, it could at least kept the red crest to differentiate it from normal toucans.

>>29264615
This

Eh, you guys' mums are weird ass animal hoarders what the fuck

>>29264566
I like to think that by shouting them down calmly they will all eventually learn how to read an image. It's part of my approach to working in general, so it's like practice. I'll check those dubs for you, too.

>>29264602
Nice deflection, great way to stay on topic and excellent attempt at making me seem 'wrong' because it's impossible for someone who knows something to have internet access, you're very smart.
I already explained that anyway, though I am going to bed now.
Plus, working in art isn't exactly profitable or busy. It's 90% research and starving and complaining about the lack of available opportunities, 10% weaseling your way into a show.. Until you get enough name value. My name value dipped a while ago due to my insanely ambitious projects' affect on my psyche and I took a big break to recover so I've loads of time to teach schmucks like you how to read a character illustration based in a design made up of simple ideas. But I've already gone through that pretty wholly so I think I'm done here now.

>>29264557
Isn't that evolves into a toucan it is that aspects of its design just drop off when it reaches its final stage. The toucan in no way recalls the crests of the previous stages, has a completely different and non drill-like beak shape that becomes sharply curved and cumbersome. Its overal shaping is rounder and bulkier compared to either of its previous stages who have many angular aspects to their designs. The design does not flow well. You outline the crux of its design with colours and beak emphasis but the actual end results when placed side by side are not well executed because the toucan could just as well he wholly unrelated to pikipek and no one would bat an eye. Try to do this any of the other regional birds.Furthermore the toucan doesn't look so culminative that it is not the only possible direction the line could have gone in.

>>29264804

You choose to come to here witg your Internet access because of a superiority complex as if shouting into the void at anonymous posters teaches anyone anything. Go teach a class or something don't spend your precious time or brain power being an arrogant cuck on /vp/

Good well, your smug arrogance deserves that you starve. Hope you die anon, I hate your fucking guts.

>>29264804
>My name value dipped a while ago due to my insanely ambitious projects' affect on my psyche and I took a big break to recover so I've loads of time to teach schmucks like you how to read a character illustration based in a design made up of simple ideas.

The arrogance and pretentiousness are real

>>29264949
I come here because I like Pokemon; as the poor kid growing up Pokemon was all I had and has always been around, it also thought me to read a concept which ultimately lead to my career choices. When I certainly across an idiot like you posting as you have been I'm obliged to tell you off. Any sensible anons will see my posts and get an idea from them and in seeing your juvenile responses my ones will come across even better and thus my aim to educate will succeed slowly as my way of seeing (that of someone charged with communicated in much the same way as a Pokemon's designer would) is picked up by more and more posters and spreads accordingly.

As I said, it's like practice for my real work. I'm not so pathetic so I will refrain trying to discredit your non-points with irrelevant name calling.

>>29265022
Learn what words mean before you use them, please.

>>29265164
Arrogance and pretentiousness? No, both seem pretty apt.

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>>29264848
You have to remember that the foregone conclusion in pokemon evolution isn't always what you wind up with.
I don't think the incongruities with the toucan line is as bad as you think it is. Or at least as bad as it could be.

>>29265256
Here you are, a final (you). I hope next time I find you shitposting that you'll have at least learned how to make sense or use words.

>>29261712
>my point, however, is that it is as bland and uninspired as persian or pidgey.
The problem with that argument is that people will defend Persian and Pidgey because they were the first of their kind and will shit on this because it's just trying to do the same thing. Not saying you're wrong, but it's pointless to argue about the designs of new Pokemon because the counterpoints almost always lie in nostalgia.

>>29265326
yikes

pikipek looks more like staraptor than its final evolution.