>He thinks Cyndaquil is a mouse >He thinks fennekin is

zodiacfags are retarded what did you expect?

>>26795395
>>26795444
Bait/10

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>>26795395

>>26795476
Fucking toppest if all keks

>>26795504
>Reddit pretends to know 4chan

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>>26795395
Zodiacs are real, I'm an Aries

>>26795530
Nice joke, anon! Many lels were had!

>>26795450
>>26795476
do people on this board really get triggered by being told the zodiac theory is bs or is it an ironic thing

>>26795537
No joke, its true

>>26795444
This. Zodiac is the dumbest shit.

>>26795539
'your opinion is shit' is like telling someone to get lost, since all we here are opinions. there are facts around, but don't count on it; if you read something on 4chan, you can't believe it.

the theory has a solid base so far tough.

>>26795395
Why even make such a big deal that you're against the theory? Just let people believe what they want, it isn't harming you in any way for them to do so.

>>26795724
Maybe every time the zodiac comes up, he gets stabbed in the balls with a dull screwdriver

Even if it is a mouse, it's supposed to be a rat.

>>26795584
Nice bait my main man

>>26795756
>implying he has balls

>not believing in the zodiac
How can people be so dense?

>>26795819
He took the bait guys

>>26795835
Doh ho ho, this guy...

>mfw pokemon gen 10 will be the last one and the zodiac ttheory will cause a world war

Cyndaquil is either an echidna or a hedgehog. Mice don't have quills.

Fennekin is most certainly a fox, probably based on the fennec fox. Foxes share a similar family of animals with dogs (canidae), but are not dogs in their own right.

I have no idea what zodiac theory is with regards to pokemon.

>>26796761
It's a theory that all the fire starters represent the animals of the zodiac.
You just pointed out the obvious flaws with that, of course.

>>26795395
>>26796761
>fire mouse Pokémon
>not a mouse

How dense can someone be? Beyond that, it doesn't have to literally be an animal... you wouldn't argue with someone on the street about a fox being a dog or not, so why push it here? Also, the fact that, ignoring these entirely, they all seem to fall in line with the zodiac otherwise, it points to it at least having proof. It's been 7 generations in a row... do you need it to be complete before you believe it?

>>26796842
>It doesn't literally have to be an animal
So you'really going to stretch the evidence in order to fit your theory? Nice. Smart. You are good at thinking.
>You wouldn't argue on the street about whether a fox is a dog
What is this even supposed to mean? If someone tried to sell me a fox telling me it was a dog, there's no way I wouldn't call that guy a liar.

>>26796842
>>26795819
>>26795724
>>26795585
I'm pretty sure this is one retarded samefag but if there's one thing I've learned it's to never underestimate the autism of /vp/.

>>26797005
Let me give you an example. You see Pikachu? It's the electric mouse Pokémon, right? Oh, but it's obviously not a mouse. Look at its ears! And that tail! You see sandshrew? The mouse pokemon, right? But it's not a mouse at all! It's a shrew, obviously!

Do you see where I'm going with this? Yes. They may not be literal mice, but these aren't literal animals. They're monsters. It can be based off of the zodiac, and they say, "let's not literally make a mouse on fire, you guys. A porcupine is close enough, right?" And everyone nods in agreement. Because... it's fine. It's still based on it, or falls in line with it.

With regards to the fox thing, it's basically an extension of that arguement. It's not someone trying to pass off a fox as a puppy to sell to you, it's like a book of canids was opened and it shows actual dogs, wolves, coyotes, foxes, etc. You wouldn't get mad that the publisher put foxes alongside dogs, because it's basically a dog. And the designers probably went, "we can have a more interesting design if we incorporate features of stuff like the fennec fox!"

Do you understand where I'm coming from?

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>>26797038
youll be suprised what kind of retarded shit people will believe
>>>/x/
>>>/pol/

>>26795395
The only true starter pattern is the water types being semi aquatic animals

>Ignores the fact that every single other fire starter falls directly in line with 0 interpretation.

>Fire Mouse Pokémon isn't a mouse

>Foxes, which are directly related to dogs, aren't close enough for a children's game

Look, I have really good, amazing friends who don't believe in the zodiac theory. I'd be devastated if anything happened to them. But goddamn if the world wouldn't be a better place, with a higher average IQ, if all you denialfags had gotten aborted like you should have.

>>26797088
The ancient grass-types works, too, though. At least so far. (Doedicurus = Chesnaught for the doubters)

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This thing I guess

>>26797053
>sandshrew
>mouse or shrew
looks more like a ground pangolin or an armadillo tbqh
>b-but the pokedex says mouse so i must be based on a mouse

>>26797088

>This fucking guy thinks turtles live on land

>>26797095

>This fucking guy thinks chipmunks, snakes, tortoises are ancient


And neither of you believe in zodiac? Hahaha ok buddy. There are no patterns except water types are weapons

>>26797113
You're literally ignoring the arguement. Yes. It's not literally a mouse. But it's designated a mouse by official means. So it at least has origins that correspond to that.

Actually nvm troll harder

>>26797116
>>26797103

>>26797116
Also wtf yes turtles do live on land

I'm curious what weapons seel #3 will have.
a bow will be nice.

>>26797116
>>This fucking guy thinks turtles live on land
Are you fucking retarded? Are you telling me the turtles I see around here are just visiting from the ocean, which is +100 miles away?

>>26797124
>Blastoise is not actually a shellfish. But it's designated a shellfish by official means. So it at least has origins that correspond to that.

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>>26797148
I'm pretty sure that's just because it has a shell and is water-type...

You're reaching pretty far to try and disprove me.

>>26797135
>>26797145


>Waaaaaahhh waaaah I'm only pretending to be retarded

You're thinking of tortoises you mongs. Which I talk about in that same post. Turtle=water only tortoise=land only.

>>26797141
how would you go about a bow on a pokemon? have it evolve into a waifu mermaid or something/

>>26797165
Are you from the UK? I started searching google to see where the fuck you may have come up with, and I stumbled upon the wikipedia page for "turtle" and it says that in the UK "turtle" has that distinction, but that the actual group is either water-dwelling or amphibious, and everywhere else in the anglophonic world doesn't make that distinction.

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>>26797165

>>26795395
cyndaquil literally is a mouse though
you are right on the other points

>>26797198
It also evolves into a badger and a bear. This is fine, except then Charmander isn't a dragon and doesn't evolve into one until its second evolution. It's even literally called "the Lizard pokemon," as counterpoint to the Cyndaquil thing. Not mention Charizard a western dragon in design, not an eastern one. Yes yes, western dragons aren't associated with fire. But then why do firestarters for the zodiac at all, if GF is actually doing this? The whole thing has always been kind of screwy, and only became a thing when we got three starters in a row that were indisputably the animals the theory says they are. Although that's also when we got more than two examples to go on.

The problem with the zodiac theory is that it requires bending and changing the specifics of it for fully half of the current starters (we'll have to see how Litten plays out), all in different ways. Which is, hey, fine. People want to go "if you squint a bit and take this thing like this but this other thing like this, it kinda fits the zodiac," that's perfectly alright. It's when people bring up that it doesn't really make much sense as an actual "theory" of anything, and you get comments like this >>26795819, that it becomes a problem. People acting incredulous that anyone might disagree with them for legitimate, logical reasons is always annoying and always ruins theory posting. It's why I'm glad the Striaton siblings were confirmed to not be the Shadow Triad. I liked the theory at first, it was an amusing idea based purely on circumstantial evidence, but people got so up their asses about it being true that it was better to just nuke the thing from orbit.

OP still shouldn't have posted. It's not exactly bait in the way 4chan uses it now, but it's flamebait in any case. Zodiac posting is only a problem when people try to push it. If everyone just shuts up about it except when they make proper topics about it, that's fine. Pure butthurt OPs are always dumb, no matter the issue.

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>>26797162
>pokedex calling sandshrew a mouse pokemon means it's a mouse
>pokedex calling blastoise a shellfish pokemon doesn't mean it's a shellfish

>>26797295
Nice bait, deserves a (you) since I'm a generous guy

>>26797295
Look, I know this is hard to grasp, but it doesn't have to literally be the zodiac animals. The fire starters all seem to have design or origins that reflect the zodiac... and if that's intentional, then that's cool. It means the zodiac theory is true. If... if you look at it that way... it looks true. If you say, "Here, we can use this as a template for all future [fire starters,]" then that makes a lot of sense. They had a dragon, so they decided to have a salamander (which is associated with fire) to become a dragon. They had a porcupine instead of a rat because they decided it was close enough, and they called it the "Fire Mouse Pokémon" for good measure (for those interested, it's called the "Hinezumi Pokémon, which as far as I'm aware is a flaming rat.) They found cockfighting and a bunch of other stuff for Blaziken (seriously it has like 6 different origins,) they went with Son Goku for Infernape and kept the Journey to the West theme going in the next gen, and in gen 6 they decided a fox was close enough to a dog because Kitsune and whatever else.

Why does this not make sense to anyone else?

>>26797324
>I can't see that there are multiple meanings
>I don't understand that they can give them species names for various reasons, and not because it's literally the same thing
>I still don't understand that the design, name and dex entry work together to create the mon, and not just one of them

>>26797376
because a fox, while a canidae, isn't really close to dogs.
By that logic, a sheep could be said to fit the ox, because they're both bovidae. - as close as fox and dog to each other.

And the cat doesn't work for tiger, because there is literally a story, why the cat is not part of the zodiac: the rat tricked the cat out of it's spot

>>26795395

A fox is a type of dog though

>>26797414
Can it mate with a dog and produce a non-sterile offspring? No? Then it's not a fucking dog.

>>26797414
But it's not a dog

>>26797408
I don't think fox=!dog is worth arguing over any more, to be honest. No matter what your opinion is. That's not being salty either it's just "OK."

But the cat - I assume you mean Litten - still might evolve, so we can't say anything for sure. It does have stripes, so maybe it actually will be a bona fide tiger, but if it's not I'd personally default to the fox=!/=dog arguement. Either way, we'll know for sure once gen 12 rolls around, I guess.

>>26797399
The only thing sandshrew has going for "mouse" are it's english name calling it a shrew and the pokedex calling it a mouse.
Both design and dex entries are way closer to ground pangolin and armadillo than to mice.

And if we're going off of names, than sandshrew is also a mole (Korea) and a weasel (France)

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>>26797414
Right and owls aren't birds


They're both in the canidae family, but definitely not the same thing

>>26797452
Cats are dogs.
Owls are dogs.
I'm a dog.
Suck my nuts.

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>>26797469
I'M SO FRESH YOU CAN SUCK MY NUTS

>>26797376
>Look, I know this is hard to grasp, but it doesn't have to literally be the zodiac animals
Yes, actually they do.
Disregarding thgeir biological differences, the zodiac is an aspect of Chinese mythology, a dog and a fox have EXTREMELY DIFFERENT lore in Chinese mythology.
You know your theory is complete bullshit when proving it comes down to "eh, close enough"

>>26797479
...why does it have to be the exact same thing? We're not talking about actual chinese mythology. We're talking about Pokémon, where jewish golems can be ordered around by a llama god and the commanders of time and space are dinosaurs. The only qualification for being based on something IS "eh, close enough."

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>>26797502
>Anything can just be anything if I want it to be because LOL CLOSE ENOUGH!

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>>26797510
Pokémon are based on things, they aren't the actual things themselves. It's called artistic license. But I'm done arguing for now, goodnight anon, it was fun.

>>26797524
Looks like we won and you lost.

Are you all stupid or something?

>>26797376
>The fire starters all seem to have design or origins that reflect the zodiac... and if that's intentional, then that's cool.
Sure.
>It means the zodiac theory is true.
No.

Again, the main problem is that people aren't allowed to disagree here. People aren't being allowed to say "I don't really think that makes sense" without people saying they're being dumb and illogical and "just don't get it."

For me, the problem always is that justifications for Charmander, Cyndaquil, and Fennekin only make any sort of sense if you take the Zodiac as being true and then looking at them. Disregarding Litten, who is still largely open ended, that's half of the starters. The starters themselves are evidence supporting the Zodiac theory. The theory can't merely be taken for granted then the starters examined as if it was true.

People are allowed to like it, that's fine. People are allowed to have explanations for why some of the starters fit perfectly and some don't. People are also allowed to not believe any of it because it doesn't work for them.

I should also add
>in gen 6 they decided a fox was close enough to a dog because Kitsune and whatever else.
Is a pretty bad way to argue for Fennekin being close enough to a dog. Kitsune are very specifically foxes and distinct from dog demons.

>>26797546
>Pretending to be the good, reasonable one

No, no. Fuck off. Us Zodiacfags go out of our way to call it a theory. Then we're shouted down and called morons. I haven't heard even one person ever say that it's a fact that they're based on the zodiac, but look in this thread alone and you'll see multiple people saying it's a fact that it's not.

>>26797408
>>26797479
>>26797546
ITT: Denialfags who got BTFO by logic and common sense, and don't want to admit it.

>>26798964
>>26797510

>>26795395
>He thinks Cyndaquil is a mouse
Literally just fucking read it's Pokédex classification. Zodiac or not, it's fucking autistic to deny something that is a given fact.

Explain to me how an owl is an ancient animal.

>>26795444
Both sides are fucking retarded.

>all these idiots who thinks that Fennekin don't fit the zodiac perfectly even though foxes are canines just like dogs

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>>26797072
>retarded shit

>>26795795
No really, zodiac is so stupid.

>>26795585
>the theory has a solid base so far tough

>Charmander is not a Chinese dragon

the theory has literally no base

>>26800029
>what is charizard
It's a dragon.

>>26800053
Its a lizard, just like Cyndaquil is a mouse

:^)

>>26800053
Charizard is a western dragon

nothing at all like a Chinese dragon.

It not only looks completely different but also it doesn't fit thematically either.

Because Chinese dragons are more often associated with water. See Gyarados.

>>26800080
Charizard is also a dragon. Nobody said that a lizard can't be a dragon. You anti-zodiacfags are already defeated.

>>26800147
The Pokédex says nothing about Charizard being a dragon.

>>26800138
Charizard don't have to be a specific kind of dragon. Being a dragon is enough for the zodiac.

>>26800153
Fuck off Richard. Besides, Mega Charizard X is dragon type, so get fucked.

>>26800147
I guess Scrafty, Kecleon, Ekans, and Totodile are all dragons then, huh?

>>26800159
>Richard
Nice meme, but the Pokédex is what you delusional niggers use to justify Cyndaquil being a mouse, so make up your fucking mind. Does the Pokédex matter or not?
I guess Mega Sceptile is a dragon now.

>>26800171
What a fucktarded argument. Nobody ever said that. We're just saying that even though it's a lizard, it is ALSO a dragon.

>>26800181
Nope

Its a flying lizard, not a dragon

GG

>>26800174
Even if the pokedex never called it a mouse, that doesn't matter. It looks distinctively rat-like enough that it can easily pass for a rat.

>>26800154
>Being a dragon is enough for the zodiac

Says who?

Following that logic, you could make almost any animal fit the zodiac theory because of how vague being "close enough" is.

>Gen 8 fire starter is a Sheep
>Well, they are both farm animals, so it counts as a goat!

>>26800200
So your Zodiac theory is shaky and lacks any basis in reality? Thank you for admitting it at least.

>>26800193
>BU-BU-BUT IT'S NOT A DRAGON!!!!
I see you're already desperate and panicking. And you know why. It's because the zodiac theory is real. It's because GF is inspired by the zodiac. And you know it, and that's why you're terrified.

Well, this has been an interesting thread. But as always, the Zodiacbros has already won.

>>26800205
Refute this, Zodiacshitters.
>>26799640

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>>26800200
>It looks distinctively rat-like enough that it can easily pass for a rat.

This is what a rat looks like.

>>26800207
Says the guy who thinks that Charizard is not a dragon.

>>26800218
Its a lizard, not a dragon.

Its ok friendo we cant always be right :^)

>>26800228
It's a lizard and a dragon. But it seems that you're too intellectually inferior to properly grasp that.

>>26800236
how is it a dragon?

>>26800218
>B-b-but it i-is a dragon!

This entire zodiac argument seems to hinge on fennekin being "close enough" to a dog because it's a fox which isn't how this works. Its design clearly based on a fox. Its name is based on a fox, the fennec fox to be exact as pointed out by another anon. Your entire argument for fennekin being a dog is that

>It's close enough

Which doesn't create a strong enough base to support your theory on.

Moving on to cyndaquil... Just come on. The name is already a giveaway that it's based on a porcupine, which is what the flames on its back are probably there to represent: its quills. The ones porcupines have. That pokedex title could possibly allude to its cry having a high pitched, squealy sound similar to mouse. Again, the argument boils down "close enough" and "but the pokedex says so!"

And finally, charmander, your argument for this one is that it evolves into a dragon, therefore making it a dragon, which seems to stray from the rest the affirmations. Cyndaquil doesn't evolve into a mouse nor does it retain any of its mouselike traits. Charmander is seemingly based on a salamander or lizard which is cool but are distinct from the eastern style dragon that's in the zodiac.

I do see the other points in the argument and think it's a cool little idea that could be a fun way to look at things within the universe but many of its pull information from its ass and backpedal around to delude themselves into believing it's true.

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>>26795395

You are inaccurate. Cyndaquil is a fire mouse Pokémon.

Jesus christ, I hate anti-zodiac fags just as much as I hate zodiac fags. Neither will ever just fucking shut up about it.

WHY DO YOU BOTH HAVE TO BE SO AUTISTIC OVER SUCH A DUMB FUCKING THING.

>>26800218
Poor little child. You aren't smart enough to comprehend tge fact that you have misspelled your entire sentence. If anyone us worse or lower than humans that would be you and your failed attempt at Grammar and sarcasm. Yiu insolent fool. What kind of being are you to even be making yourself look" cool" when in reality you are scared and are quivering because you aren't able to even shut anyone up. The most possible logic i have is this. You never put others down which made you a pathetic low scum, when you're a pathetic scum you have no friends or girlfriend and when that happens you resort to last thing you call "hope" it really is humorous.

>>26800205
Not a zodiacfag but the Chinese word used for the goat isn't specific and can be translated to sheep or ram.

It often isn't because people would rather be called a goat than a sheep and ram isn't gender neutral. Furthermore, I believe the dynasty that established the zodiac had more contact with goats than sheep but sheep is still valid.

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>>26795395
>>26795444
>>26795450
>>26795476
And every other post in this thread