/4ccg/ - Death by Shitposting Edition

>wanting to decide half the babby in 10 minutes
Is PMB >merely pretending at this point?

Why don't we just have a fetus only for autopilots and probationary teams? That way no teams with some level of real support can get aborted, and there's no incentive for /sp/fags to spam autopilots out just to force /a/ into a fetus. Has anyone suggested this?

revive /ic/ it'd be funny

>>187117224
You can't tell me that a hypothetical autopilot team which gets 20 replies to its roster polls has less support than a managed team which gets 15, just because the latter found some guy autistic enough to take care of handling the tactics himself.

Give me a gun, six bullets, and point me at discord. I'll greatly improve the cup in less than a minute.

>>187117645
>only 6
weak

>>187117567
Depends on the relative size of the boards. If there's a managed team that in proportional terms has less support than autopilots, it should be made probationary and play in the fetus as well.

>>187118164
lol /trv/ i mean it's only making it less time before they do play another fetus

>>187117224
I like this idea because it would put a brake on this >>187117271

So, anyone willing to revive /3/ just for the hell of it?

>>187118749
You literally can make a thread right now and do it. Asking others to do it is the sign they shouldn't be revived.

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/hoc/

>>187118975
The fact it's /3/ is the sign they shouldn't be revived. le /p/ army is never going to stop with this, it's easy to force any board in if you want. If I hated you all enough I'd go make a poll and get 20 responses on /wsr/.

>>187119428
do it, I want /wsr/ in autumn

When does /ag/ legue starts?

>>187119746
The real question is whether /wsr/ wants /wsr/ in Autumn.

>>187119867
tomorrow cup time, sat/sun will be right after GSC (rip yuros)

>>187119428
/3/ could do it if the people on that board actually want one. If you get interest going back for them and a creation of a new roster, then they could be back. Plus they would need new music as supersonik is now part of sun of lava/ice's goal horn

>>187120163
>Plus they would need new music as supersonik is now part of sun of lava/ice's goal horn
I'm sure they'll be willing to give their 4cccore back.

>>187117224
I'd rather enforce a limit of 48 teams, but I guess that could work

lads what are your hot predictions for /ag/ league 2?

>>187117224
Error: Would involve /w/ in a fetus

>>187120491
dtroit will die on stream

/aco/ when?

I say we turn babbies into a minor league. Spring and autumn would be for autopilots, new teams, and secret board teams. New teams from normal boards can upgrade when ready.

>>187120250
Easily, since /sci/ could find another song, but who knows if /sci/ gives it up or not

>>187120845
In TTC4.

>>187117219
It's deciding the bottom 16 of the babby in ten minutes. Better letting fans decide than Boris arbitrarily deciding like that one time.

>>187108192
For context, the conversation was started by JB asking for ideas on how to remove the fetus.

>>187108671
>49 active teams right now
>poll would choose 16 teams from pool of 17 eligible to play in the babby
>to be 17th place, you have literally no support
What's the problem?

>>187121362
It stops being about the boards and starts being about the core cup fanbase.

can we start a conversation on how to remove JB?

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>>187121169
I can't wait

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>>187121581

>>187121489
It's a broadcast about boards. If you start with the idea that there is a limit to the number of boards that can participate and if you're worried about viewers, then involving viewers in deciding which teams play isn't an insane idea.

>>187121573
Why tho.

The spirit of the cup is lost on you faggots. Germanbro never cared about viewers. Germanbro just wanted people to have fun and have good matches.

>>187121742
because fuck the cardinals and fuck everyone who likes them

>>187121830
Germanbro didn't add more teams than can fit into the babby/elite format. You have to reckon with the numbers, which will involve a compromise somewhere like it or not.

>>187121830
This. GB would remove manager before he removed teams. People here are so embedded in the circlejerk they don't realise their existence is the problem. Not the small teams. They're pushing blame for their own failings.

>>187121834
They're nice birbs.

>>187121830
>Germanbro just wanted people to have fun and have good matches
which is why he didn't make people sit through /cm/-/po/ games

>>187122180
Yeah those teams just didn't exist when GB was streaming.

>>187122261
that wasn't by accident

>>187117224
Autopilots have been suggested. They were always a dumb idea.

>>187122353
You seem to be missing the irony here. You see, when GB was streaming we did have /cm/-/po/ tier games! But you missed it! Aha! Tricked!

>>187121830
>Germanbro never cared about viewers.
>Germanbro just wanted people to have fun and have good matches.
>Germanbro just wanted people
>people
And who do you think those people would be?

>>187122648
People who left the cup because it was ruined by circlejerkers and tryhards.

>>187122648
He didn't care about viewers. He cared about people who watch the cup. Duh!

>>187123719
Number of viewers you mouthbreather. Do you need things spelled out for you because you've surrounded yourself with so many circlejerks you have to try and look cool by dismissing how much you ruined the cup?

But really, what did he mean by this? https://pastebin.com/1BFSeHHC

>>187121362

> For context, the conversation was started by JB asking for ideas on how to remove the fetus.
> A guy that was in charge of making autopilots for the 'returning teams' until he jumped shit and went back to /sp/
> A guy that is trying to turn the cup into serious ESport

I'm beginning to feel that it might be a good time for him to resign completely at this point.

>>187124047
This totally goes against the spirit of the 4cc. It should be about fans of the teams, not fans of the cup. Why should 10 hardcore /i/ fans die for 15 /3/ bandwagoners who are going to watch the cup regardless and root for /mlp/?

>>187124262
He is also voting for removal of height abuse.
And he wanted access to the nightly exports too.
An active manager wants access to the nightlies, isn't this peculiar

>>187124424
Weirdly worded but I agree. If the board itself wants to compete it should have priority over a team /4ccg/ memers or reddit vote for.

>>187124524
>He is also voting for removal of height abuse.
>voting for the removal of something you won a cup with
damn

The combined sum of managerial menu autism literally nobody wants to see far outweighs the sum of game time for a small board that bores some people.

>>187124424
>The true spirit of the cup is Dragonfag reviving a dead team so we need to have a fetus in the first place

>>187124524

I'm a big enemy of HA because > 6'5" goalkeepers and > 6'5" header card CFs are fucking stupid.

Red offers more fluidity on the field and any smarter manager can use that.

The nightly shit? Wow why I'm not surprised. I remember how much people slammed horsefucker for suspicion of that. Yet he's being all cheeky cunt about it now.

>>187124524
>An active manager wants access to the nightlies
This shouldn't be allowed.

>>187124808
We were having a fetus no matter what because of /out/ and /x/.

>>187124932
>Sou
>QD
There are active managers with access to nightlies already.

>>187124524
>And he wanted access to the nightly exports too.
I've only seen him say that he wants every manager to send a pastebin to the streamer one day before day 1 kickoff so that the mindgames can be unfucked before the stream starts.

>>187117645
You only get one and you're locked in a room by yourself. The door only opens once someone is dead and the bullet is spent. If the bullet is used and nobody is dead, toxic gas fills the room. The walls and doors are bulletproof.

>>187125037

> Sou
Implying he knows what to even do with them

> QD
I don't think QD is such a winning-driven cunt to pull off that stunt.

>>187125309
Careful with those goalposts.

>>187123954
By saying "Number of Viewers", you're saying he was an attention-whoring gloryhog who wanted people to watch his stream instead of wanting to entertain people. And if you honestly believe this then I have a very good political team to sell you.

>>187125504
>you're saying he was an attention-whoring gloryhog who wanted people to watch his stream instead of wanting to entertain people
>i'd rather have 50 happy people than 2000 bored ones
>this is attention-whoring
Is the concept of fun lost on you, by any chance?

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>>187125037
Proofs? Boris has said only he and f4r had access to the nightlies

f4r and Lear are the only ones with nightly access

>>187125414

It's more so leaving a $100 on a table with a guy you trust vs leaving a $100 on a table with a guy you don't trust.

As I said - JB lost his trust from me the minute he went "LOL TIME TO BAIL OUT /sp/" after retiring and not giving a damn helping Deek with an export. Also leaving autopilot exports to Feedback.

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>>187124759
See, this is the point. By now everyone figured out pes17 and how to abuse it.
Before summer he or merit, but I bet JB was the one proposed the Double A position for manlets, trying to throw dust into peoples eyes, give them something to use, even when HA is still a valid tactic.
Then /fit/ fucking dies, and JB signs up as /sp/ manager.
So now he tries to bend even more rules, just to assure that he won't lose face trying to advance /sp/
HA? Banned
Centering Targets? you can't use those lel
Mindgames? banned
Because even his inflated ego can't deny that pes is an rng sim at the end of the day and he is powerless against it.
So hence the rule changes.
Remember the pes16, and how broken shit was, more broken than now, yet nothing was done.
Now though? suddenly all those changes proposals.
Funny is it not?
And those latest controversies, one is happening right now, only serve to distract from JB plotting.

>>187125624
He's saying so because those two stream the babbies.

>>187125624
>>187125654
And the streamers because, guess what, they stream.

>>187125729
>Remember the pes16, and how broken shit was, more broken than now, yet nothing was done.
>Now though? suddenly all those changes proposals.
>Funny is it not?
Did you just miss /rules/ or...?

>>187125839

QD isn't streaming Babbies cause /vg/ is playing, Sou or Kekkels will possibly do it.

>>187125839
streamers don't have nightly access, they get the save from the organizers an hour before matches

>>187125957
And what do you reckon the save contains?

>>187125608
>HE'S DOING IT FOR THE NUMBER OF VIEWERS GUYS
>He doesn't care how many people are watching as long as they're having fun
You are literally saying both of these things at once. These two statements cannot coexist. If you're going to farm for (You)s, at least be consistent. You'll get more that way.

>>187125654
see
>>187125219

>>187125909
Meaning was, pes16 was broken but /merit/ and /rules/ did nothing. Now merit is screaming for changes, even if pes17 isn't nearly as bad as 16.
Coincidence?

>>187124047
The best part about this is /merit/ is so buttblasted by DF that they will literally do this just to keep /cm/ out.

>>187126034
I am sure getting a save after the nightly export deadline passed will help you a lot.

>>187126034

Hour isn't going to change much, anon. You can run one test.

>>187125943
Isn't Kekkels a /vp/ tester?

>>187126034
wow they get the nightlies for all the teams that they don't play for one whole hour this changes everything

>>187126131
>>187126142
It helps considering 16 of those teams will promote and meet you eventually.

>>187126142
>>187126193
>Hour
>One test

lol

>>187126110
>Coincidence?
No, because that's what /rules/ and /merit/ were doing on PES16. Literally the only difference is you've jumped to conclusions that things are going to be changed instead of just proposals.

>>187126302
What are they going to do after the nightly deadline has passed

>>187126142
I can rush at least 8 and that's assuming my team plays the first match

>>187126216
It doesn't help considering how those two teams perform.

>>187126110
What's the problem with not wasting time on mindgames before every game though, as long as only boris/sou has the actual sliders?

>>187126104
I'm not even going to bother arguing with somebody so retarded they think germanbro is an attention whore and can't grasp the concept of people wanting to make others happy.

>>187126472
Oh you mean the long elite streak /f/ once had? Yes, definitely a bad performance.

>>187126379
I will suck off a sheep live on stream if the height abuse poll isn't at least 70% pro-ban

>>187126104
How can you even breathe? He didn't say gb is doing it for the number of viewers, but the opposite from his first post.

Viewers are going down, but you're still here.

You should watch wrestling. You'd get used to ratings not mattering as long as the people in charge can fellate themselves more about their great product that they love.

>>187126629
Don't worry man Remain's got this in the bag

>>187126548
>GB isn't an attention whore
That's why he keeps posting pics of himself in the stream chat, because he isn't an attention whore.

>>187117224
fuck off horsefucker, quit using >our rivalry as a reason to remove the fetus only because you don't want to play in it. Besides, >we would never do something like that.

>>187126379
>you've jumped to conclusions that things are going to be changed instead of just proposals.
Because this time, changes are proposed by mighty JB himself, member of /merit/ and active /sp/ manager

>>187126405
Test to figure out if shit they sent works or not and find new shit if latter is the case.

>>187126479
>as long as only boris/sou has the actual sliders?
If that's the case? Nothing really.
But you can't assure that's the case if there are pastebins 1 day before the matchday.
Also it will kill testing against those teams in the group cause sliders weren't shown (by default), but that's only for muh esports crowd.

>>187121742
He's a weeb manager upset that an Elite Cup Winning Manager wants to take the mantle and make it Are Year. When JB/sp/ wins Winter and Art aborts /a/ out of the Spring Fetus within 2 months of each other, the night and day comparison between Weebs and People will be complete.

Remember that last viewer survey where people didn't have a problem with the number of teams playing and most people took issue with bad commentary and boring tactical autism? Lets fix a problem that nobody actually has except the inner circlejerk though because we're the ones who keep the cup turning and it doesn't matter if the biggest problem is us, we need to act like something else is.

>>187126958
>Art

>>187126958
The hell is this idiot saying?

>>187126958
>chatting shit this early
Enjoy getting banged!

>>187126639
Hello ramen

>>187127061
People just want something to talk about in the offseason. Gotta pass 7 more weeks somehow. Nothing will come from any of this.

>>187127145
Banter is a full time job, bud. We just actually choose to think about ours and be creative instead of pulling a random file from our "smug anime faces" folder.

>>187127061
Welcome to Offseason Shitposting Hours™

>>187127280
>We just actually choose to think about ours
Hope you guys start choosing this option soon.

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>>187127539
>no u
Oh no, you really got me with that one. Here, I googled one of your cartoon characters for you - stay in your lane the next time you try to reply to me.

Extreme squirting mare pussies!

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Second revision is up
https://pastebin.com/Q9JgkJkW

>>187127779
Google me another. Quickly, while you are still this violently disconnected from reality.

>>187127170
not me i only argue in discord circlejerks in my ivory tower thanks

>>187128083
Bring Back PES 2011

>>187128083
This person has a fantastic solution.

>>187126761
That's literally what you said, my man. You can keep putting your words in my mouth if you want, I'll be busy putting my dick in your mom's.

>>187126639
Read the entire chain, he pretty clearly said he did it for "number of viewers".

desu the cup doesn't even matter anymore.
Just do what the fuck ever.
Nobody important or relevant still watches or engages in the cup.
Actually maybe consider pulling it altogether? Or at least find a way to make some money out of it. Otherwise literally what is the point at this point in the cup's history. Just move it completely off 4chan, monetize it and make it somewhat worthwhile again.

>>187128083
time for murder?

>>187128546
Will /merit/ face a conquest ending?

how to fix the cup:
every team is an autopilot. managers remain as normal
commentators stop shitting on teams
there i fixed it

>>187128659
So /ag/L rules?

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>/4ccg/ are in the /ag/ League
Do we even have an export? Because I did no recall submitting one lol

>>187128659
Just think of the amount of inertia you're dealing with when you say something like that, though. /4ccg/ isn't the actual cup viewership - they've got too much of a personal stake in their friendship simulator e-sport to ever give that up willingly. The cup needs to completely fall apart so it can be rebuilt.

>>187128950
There's plenty of people who think this though. The problem is the people in power don't.

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>>187128931
Well, the signing up guy should hurry up then

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Break the barriers, erase the lines that divide.
Remove Babby<Elite structure

Elite cup, now named Summer/Winter Cup, is for MUH BIG MARKETS and Larger Medium size teams/boards

Babby, now called Spring/Autumn Cup, is for Low Medium and Small markets.

No Promotions, no Relegations.

Big markets get to play in the same cup.
Small markets get to play too, without stepping on big market toes
Same cup structure, just like right now.
Fans are happy, unless they are sperging esports fans caring about """prestige""" of """elite""" cup. or their team shits the bed

how the actual fuck do you go from "send pastebins to boris to save time doing sliders on air" to "JB wants the nightlies so he can cheat"

>>187130120

Since you all off a sudden went "I need to bail out /sp/" after going into retirement.

>>187130120
I dunno, how does one go from "DF is banned from the cup forever" to "DF can do aesthetics and fuck it, PoI polls too I guess"?

>>187130120
Cause you need every advantage against rigors of pes, can't fail /sp/ now, can you?
Are you planning on checking nightlies too?

>>187130257
so something completely unrelated, got it
>>187130317
take it up with lear lmao I voted against df doing polls and even against the /cm/ one standing

>>187130120
Boris isn't a cup manager.

>>187130120
how the actual fuck do you go from "managing /fit/" to "managing /sp/"

>>187128353
He didn't. People was laughing at him saying both
>Germanbro never cared about viewers.
and
>Germanbro just wanted people

Then he said "Number of viewers", obviously referring to his first point.

>>187130382
And I said in the discord f4r or someone completely neutral would get the pastebins. Feel free to give me your sliders though lol.

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>>187130379

> so something completely unrelated, got it.

If it's something completely unrelated, why did you reply. Really makes one think.

>>187130597
DAMAGE CONTROL
Here, have those too
>>187130342
>>187125729
>>187126905

>>187130597
p/l/c/m/5 a/m/a/7/6 stop me i dare you

>>187130379
>voted against it
>Boris said the majority was against it
>Lear/DF won anyway
Do you live in a shed, by chance?

>>187130795
*whips out CSW 4-1-2-1-2*
heh, beat this without rigging

>>187121581
Whoever this asshole is, they need to get some fucking remover for that godawful drawing.

>>187130597
Can you stop trying to act like you're so above this and pretending you don't even care while actually tripping here like a faggot trying to damage control your image?
Fuck off back to your circlejerk where your fuckboys can kiss your boos, nobody here is interested in your see through insecure bullshit.

>>187131004
>Boris said the majority was against it
Boris also claimed he didn't know Rigtor was in charge of the rigshop.

>>187131004
>Lear/DF won anyway
>DF is now more banned than he was a week ago

>>187131141
This is why nobody listens to /4ccg/
>makes up conspiracy theories
>shoot them down
>STOP DEFENDING YOUR IMAGE??

>>187130379

Tell everyone, JB, who was charge with making autopilots for returning teams after the cull. And who quit and gave the job to Feedback.

Tell everyone, JB, how the moment /sp/ lost, you already edited the wiki to be /sp/'s new manager.

If you want to suck /sp/ dick so much, go suck off Dragonfag, cause he also loved to rig it for /sp/.

>>187131592
Tell everyone, anon, where is your proofs?

>>187131592
I was literally never in charge of autopilots. That's something you made up.

>>187130597
You just don't want to expose your day 1 sliders, admit it.
If it is not true, then there is no harm in allowing managers to request opponent's sliders exposure during their first cup game. Right? And it will take 10 seconds, so no "wasting time" arguments.

>>187131886

> Posting without trip to damage control as anonymous.

WEW LAD. Exposed.

>150 posts
>34 IPs

>>187131592
>Tell everyone, JB, how the moment /sp/ lost, you already edited the wiki to be /sp/'s new manager.
This is a double lie. First because he didn't edit the wiki before I removed my name, and second because he didn't edit the wiki anyway. If you're shitposting, at least put some effort into it.

>>187130317
Gracen never made that jump. I fell into that pitfall as well, forgetting Gracen said DF was banned from management and we've offseason shitposting about whether he should be involved at all. Running an interest poll under a known name sets off some flags to do something.

>>187130387
You leave /fit/ and wait two seasons. If /sp/ hasn't won a star by then, there will be an opening.

>>187131480
He could've just posted a screencap of what he said to prove them wrong. He could've simply ignored it like a lot of the obvious shitposting that goes on in here. Coming in with a trip and speaking like he came straight outta Discord (which he did, obviously) pretending he doesn't even care means he isn't here to set the record straight, but to show how he's above the dumb /4ccg/ shitposters that are trashtalking him. It's cancerous circlejerk mentality, and he can keep it with his cancerous circlejerk.

>>187131948
If neither team knows what the other is going to run, why is that a problem unless you're part of the 30 man /mlp/ testing army?

>>187132126
>but to show how he's above the dumb /4ccg/ shitposters that are trashtalking him. It's cancerous circlejerk mentality, and he can keep it with his cancerous circlejerk.
Because /4ccg/ is also dumb shitposters trashtalking people.

>>187128659
I agree with this 100%

t. manager

>>187132206
We truly are, no denying. But stop coming here with a high and mighty attitude to remind people how better you are when all you are is an insecure tripfaggot who unironically uses "lmao" in the middle of a sentence. Keep that to your Discord buddies.

>>187132128
Never was a problem before. Suddenly mind games are an issue. Now that asspee needs a bail from babby cup

>>187132047
>Running an interest poll under a known name
He posted it anonymously.

Open your eyes people. All those changes proposed by jb just so he can give /sp/ an edge.

>>187132538
>>187132128
Testing is the cancer turning the cup into an esport
If week 1 nightlies make testing harder I'm all for them

>>187132538
It's always been a problem. But now viewership is down people are finding every thing they can change to curve it.

>>187132126
Or anyone can go and read them themselves. Don't want to let that ruin the anonymous "I'm going to shitpost for the same of shitposting" mentality.

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i like this

>>187133164
Even with no game 1 sliders people will test.
Only way to kill muh esports is to remove managers altogether.
Those half measures won't stop true pes autists.

>>187133172
See above. Also muh numbers, whocareslol

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What about a cup where there's only 2 elite cups and 2 babby cups, but spring ends up as a mega babby and autumn is a babby with only 16 teams. Also, cup time changes from late February to late December, late may to late april, and from mid August to the middle of July.

clearly JB is new the DF

the conspiracy is unraveling

>>187133904
>from late February to late December
yes we will all stream on christmas

>>187133164
It does make things harder.
Not a problem for jb though.
What a coincidence.

>>187130025
Can we do this? This sounds good.

#RemoveManagers

I wonder how many changes will be proposed after /sp/ fails to promote.

>>187131218
>can do team polls
>can revive teams
>can contribute aesthetics
>can't go on the dead IRC
Oh NOOOOOO that will teach him!

I think removing livemanaging would do enough to quell the idiotic esports fagging. it will never be killed completely unless there are no managers at all, like >>187133815 said. I think it's kind of bullshit that /sp/ went from a poor performance and sacking their manager to nearly immediately being taken up by the only active manager to have won two elite cups. I don't know JB, so I'm not going to assault his character, but from a player of the game's point of view, that just feels cheap somehow. I think it'd be good to make a change to the cup's organization so every team gets to play in at least two full-fledged cups per year, the best standing pitch for such a system that i've seen being what >>187133289 posted. /endblogpost

>>187135737
>can literally only do aesthetics there now and nothing else
He's even been re-banned from the wiki and stream chat.

I don't understand what people think this will accomplish. You can't ban DF from Skype or Discord. You can't ban him from 4chan or watching the stream. He can literally keep doing everything he was already doing before the ban, except now you can pat yourself on the back for "totally reking DF again gaise"

Its like putting a curtain over a tumor thats already metasticized to the lymph nodes. If we can't see it anymore it must be better!

>>187135737
>>187136695
Can't believe that DF is managing 10 teams again now that he made a roster poll and some blenders. This cup really is falling apart.

>>187137036
>Rules suggestions was ok, why not commentary?
>Commentary was ok, why not aesthetics?
>Aesthetics was ok, why not autopilots?
>Autopilots was ok, why not managing?

>>187133289
Its a good base to work from.

Due to Discord video being unfunctional for Dtroit for some reason, commentary will have to be done through Skype for AGL2. I believe Kekkels will still use Discord rigcam though for his games.

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>>187126034
If you think I'm going to do the thing I despise more than anything re:managing after waking up an hour or two before going live, when I need to collect all the music, pastebins, managers, and commentators, simultaneously setting up all the programs and shit needed, and getting ready to talk almost non-stop for 5-7 hours, you are sorely mistaken boyo. Also this assumes I would get the save for the day my team is playing, which I wouldn't, cause that'd be retarded.

I guess you can say that an active manager partially streaming an event their team is in means they get an official save at some point with all the tactics of the other teams after day 3. But this is only really a slight advantage because it means they only have to watch the previous game/VOD of their next opponent to see live-managing changes, rather than having to also analyze and figure out the starting sliders they used (if they're not shown on screen blatantly anyway at some point). So I guess there's that.

>>187125943
Probably streaming Fetus (if there is one), cause, you know. Dunno about the main cup, would definitely not do any days /vg/ is playing and Sou should have better internet by then. Depends I guess, I dunno.

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DF is our Pete rose. He's doing his damn job yet you all think he's endangering the sport. Who cares if he makes aesthetics. He's doing what he can and is playing by the rules

>>187131948
It was suggested by some that day 1 nightlies should be posted on the wiki beforehand.

>>187137991
But we must honour the banlist or others will follow.

>>187137932
>Only a slight advantage
The fact that active managers can stream tournaments they're participating in and receive the save of a fucking large scale breach of trust. We joke about /mlp/ getting nightlies. You're literally getting them. Wtf.

>>187139097
Yeah but we don't like /mlp/ while QD is a toplad so it's okay

>>187127886
*male

>>187139034
DF found a loophole in the system, and it is wrong. But he isn't managing in this case. Move on from the problem. We know it happened but let him do stuff like aesthetics.

>>187139358
He is doing aesthetics. And absolutely nothing else.

>>187137739
hello, /circleclop/, it was nice seeing most of you again in the suggestions channel the other day.

>>187139097
>>187139224
Well, fair enough I guess. I just won't stream in the actual cup then. Kekkels will probably be available, or, if you have a problem with him being a /vp/ tester, probably Paval or someone else.

>>187137739
Why didn't you speak up during those then?

All of these shitflinging for a video game that doesn't mean shit in the end of the day? Damn you goys have no expectation in life

>>187139592
I'm just shitposting fǟm don't leave us with Kekkels pls

>>187139609
Because he wasn't reviving a team I don't like

>>187139890
More like your team is going to fail to promote from Fetus.

>>187139805
Shitposting or not it's something to think about I guess. We'll see when the date comes closer I suppose. And this is all assuming /mlp/ even make it out of the fetus and/or Sou's internet shits itself despite him painstakingly upgrading it anyway, if Sou's clear then he's clear for the whole thing himself.

>>187139592
Let me clear it up:

If you're involved in making tactics for a team for a given cup, don't stream that cup.

>>187140430
This is why Paval as a backup is great.

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>>187140430
Like I said, I can just not stream the Babby at all if it bothers people. Fetus should theoretically be fine considering they'd have to be silly to not change everything, then I don't have any access to the save for the babby, simple.

>>187137991
Pete rose gambled on baseball when he was a commentator, AFTER being banned from being a player or manager. So yes, DF being our Pete Rose is why he needs to be watched like a hawk and kept out of everything.

>>187140790
>considering they'd have to be silly to not change everything
Tell that to /his/

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Also here is your time and match guide for tomorrow, I'll probably do these for every match day so people can plan what they want and don't want to watch:

>All times are UTC
>17:00 - /4ccg/ - /remi/
4chan Cup General (You) vs Remilia I can only assume, I think it's like Tenko & Wives from last year.
>17:30 - /r&m/ - /ert/
Reddit and Memey vs Elite Ratings Team, Pickle Rickers vs the best players from the 2017 Summer Cup.
>18:00 - /ptg/ - /trainwreck/
President Trump General vs Trainwreck, /pol/'s biggest general that is a regular at invitationals vs bad anime that we all love to shit on.
>18:30 /csa/ vs /pcg/
Confederate States vs /pol/ communism, self explanatory really.
>19:00 /myteamFC/ - /ca/
Literally things Myuer likes vs Cricket Australia, Aussies will be in charge of destroying everything /u/'s manager likes.
>19:30 - /jojo/ - /ita/
Jojo references vs Italy, a sneak peek at an upcoming Multinat team and another invitational regular.
>20:00 - /nadja/ - /math/
Expect /naruto/ in place of /nadja/ desu
>20:30 - /ne/ - /homm/
and expect /bird/ here instead of /homm/.

All of these games will be streamed by Dtroit on his personal channel (for those looking for VODs) and hosted on the main cup channel tomorrow. I personally think the matches will not take more than 20 minutes each minimum, but the 30 minute slots are for safety.

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>when you don't have any real fucks to give over the streamer meta and are just worried that pissants are just going to keep the good commentators/streamers from commentating/streaming.

>>187139609
I did, every time. Nobody listens to me.

3 hours for /ag/l aesthetic exports, any additional stuff will have to be midcupped after that

also please someone make music exports rigdio is super nice to use

>>187140790
You should not stream. It's best to avoid even the appearance of wrongdoing. If you have to be told that, I worry about your judgment.

>>187141441
I am sure the majority of /merit/ would have noticed if you did.

>>187140941

perfect comparison. DF should be only banned from all competitive activities

Hear me out. What if we unbanned DF because it would make the horsefuckers walk?

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>>187141583
Okay, I won't ever again, see ya

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>>187141498
I did so at the very least

>19:30 - /jojo/ - /ita/

>>187141498
I will.

>>187141707
Pete rose isn't allowed on any "official" MLB shows (even on the MLB channel). He was a commentator for the Reds' TV channel.

The closer comparison is "Ban DF from all competitive activities and the official cup channel". Which is what we do now. The Reds' TV broadcast is like Pete Rose's Wrasslecup.

>>187137017
Because the less people we have doing aesthetics, the better. Better make sure Dag is the only person doing stadiums and a lone horsefucker is the only one who can do blenders.

>>187140790
You're my favorite active streamer right now bby, fucking stream the whole thing who cares it's only virtual football for >fun

>>187142106

he's also a commentator for for Fox Sports who do lots of MLB coverage and games.

anyways it's still ridiculous to ban a good commentator given the amount of shitty commentators we have.

>>187141498
I thought the deadlines were earlier than that, would have been nice to know so I didn't delay everything else I was planning to do today. You mind if I get my music exports later?

>>187137017
This has nothing to do with fear of DF rigging the cup. Turbo banning him a second time is like poking the bull and trying to encourage him from actively rigging behind closed doors instead of being transparent about it. They simply want a pat on the back for doing a good job at getting rid of DF when they've likely just made any actual rigging problem worse.

>>187141807
Which ones, all the guys that are already retired? /Ourguy/ is pro-/cm/.

>>187142398
>retired
Considering the constant PMB and BGP hot opinion posting I sometimes completely forget about that

>>187142337
Sure, I just tried rigging a bit with Rigdio and man it's so nice that I want to encourage it's use it's also easier on me so t hat's a plus too

>>187142536
Funny how people who cling on to the cup they don't contribute to rag on DF for having no life for clinging on to the cup he doesn't contribute to.

>>187142632
>for clinging on to the cup he doesn't contribute to.
But he does contribute, he makes aesthetics and stadiums. All those lazy fucks do at most is manage.

>>187142632

except he does contribute aesthetics and ran the rigshop for a while

>DF contributes aesthetics and betting for the fans to enjoy
>PMB only contributes aspergers outbursts and ideas on how to ruin the cup
Why is PMB not the banned one again?

>>187142873
He has kids he needs this job

>>187142873
because Boris likes him

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>>187143053
>PMB is Heath
>BGP is Whyno
I like it.

>>187142873
I said the same thing 2 threads ago, and the PMBIDF came out to call me salty and say I was making shit up. PMB just gets an opinion in his head and argues it with or without evidence wherever he can, up to and including making personal attacks and ad hominem arguments on everyone that disagrees with him.

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>>187142632
>DF for having no life for clinging on to the cup he doesn't contribute to.
>Rigshop
>Rule talk
>Aesthetics
>Polls teams for support
How is that "doesn't contribute to the cup"?

>>187143324
He's banned so all his contributions are voided and don't count.

>>187143438
Ban /mlp/ so their two stars don't count

AW SHIT HOW LONG DO I HAVE FOR /ag/?

>>187142632
>only managers are allowed to talk about the cup
>fans are just clingers
So this... is the power of circlejerks... whoa...

>>187143274
You blatantly made up fake quotes and provided no proofs. Stop creating drama.

>>187143897
They are. The cup would be better off without those faggots.

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>>187143438

>>187143762
team?

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>>187144058
>fans are faggots

>>187143897
>Managers contribute to the cup
As a manager this is patently false unless they also do other things in addition.

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>>187144031
Wow, it's almost like I had to take a screenshot of it to cover up you saying the same lie on Sunday.

>>187144390

they kept the team alive before autopilots at least

>>187144315
/punic/, got the aesthetics but I haven't copied over my tactical export to the right invitational slot (I started working in invitational 1before the correct invitational slots were announced like a retard)

I should be done with tactics in an hour or so.

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you are loved

>>187144495
>50 (fifty) errors

>>187144495
That's fine, I'm taking all exports before I go to bed. Only ones I'm worried about are /pcg/ and /house/ as I have heard absolutely nothing from either people in charge and the backups for them may not be ready.

>>187144485
The bullshit part was claiming it was PMBIDF because nobody would willingly defend his garbage

>>187144605
I forgot about weak foot usage /accuracy nerfs for height abuse and I set my height abuse gold to 95 instead of 94

>>187144685
Who do you think I was replying to when I took the screenshot on Sunday? Again, don't make things up to accuse someone else of making things up.

>>187144485
Post a screenshot of "I'm replacing /merit/ with my people." That was a doozy.

>>187144801
I'm not PMB I'm not saying you made things up, I'm just saying

>>187145017
Post where I said that he said that instead of saying that he was up to bullshit behind the scenes. Do you just assume that everyone says every single stupid-ass thing they want to do, like a Kid's cartoon villain?

Don't answer that. I just realized that's probably all you expect from your kid's show.

>>187145292
>calls out PMB for making "personal attacks"
>makes personal attacks
what did he mean by this?

>>187145578
Alright, fair enough, sorry. Let me make this clear, though: PMB has done some shitty things behind the scenes. He's gone to individual managers and polled them on how they felt about /merit/, and you and I both know he didn't do it because he really just wanted his own informed opinion on the matter. Just because he didn't come out and announce it in Discord like Dr. Fucking Claw doesn't mean that he doesn't have shitty opinions about what the cup should be, and doesn't mean that he doesn't double down on it every time people call him out (as they did on Sunday).

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>still no /LISA/ team
You wonder why the cup is dead?

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>>187145984
Because the Soup is not ready.

Yet.

>>187145984
Lisa it's your birthday
Happy birthday Lisa

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>>187145932
>Be manager
>Not polled by PMB
I am never in this spy shit.

>>187145932
>He's gone to individual managers and polled them on how they felt about /merit/
not sure if meme or if this is real

>>187145984
Rando did nothing wrong.

>>187146148
Year and a half ago.

>>187146217
Real.

>>187145984
>middle finger statue as goalie
>Buddy,Brad,Buzzo and Terry as medals
>Players include gasoline bucket, Gary The Hot Soup, Howdy Mother Fucker and Harvey Alibastor
>Goalhorn is 666 kill chop deluxe
>Anthem is work harder

I will make this after the invitationals are done

>>187146278
I was still a manager back then.

>PMB goes to 17 different managers
>Lear just goes to DF 17 times

>>187146291
Well I guess now I finally know what the shitposting about a coup like a year ago was really about
Still though, you have any proofs before I start believing a random anon on /4ccg/? I want to believe it but we both know where we are.

>>187146448
Does it really count as 17 different managers if they're all part of the horsefucker Borg?

>>187146492
I don't think anyone involved actually wants to give their name out at risk of shitposting to death. Some of us, like Jack, are dead now but were pretty liked.

>>187145932
What happened to the anon that ran a poll here every week about /merit/ and Lear? I saw zero complaints or paranoia about that, and that one was real and we all saw it.

>>187146857
Maybe it's the fact that he was doing it in a clear and visible poll that anyone could get the results of, posting it with a chart and notes every week. Maybe being clear and transparent about what you want gets you a lot further than slinking around on Skype.

>>187146735
Something like a screencap of PMB's side of the conversation probably wouldn't hurt anyone, but fine, I choose to believe this anyway

>>187146985
It's gonna sound like bullshit but since I uninstalled skype to use discord I lost the logs.

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The leak PMB doesn't want you to see...

>>187146958
You sound hurt by this. Show me where the horse touched you.

>>187145932
Why would independently polling managers about /merit/ be a bad thing? I get the whole idea that going behind their backs may not be cool, but what the fuck is PMB going to do?
He managed mulp for a few tournaments, earned them a star and retired shortly there after. He's not in /merit/ and they're not bound to his will. So what, he's basically powerless. He can be loud, but still powerless until he's given validity by /merit/, the managers, or the fans. So what if he planned a coup? He'll start a league that a whole seven people will watch?

And just because he has ideas about a virtual soccer tournament that you don't like doesn't mean he's a piece of shit. He's a human being that has a different opinion than you. Yeah, he's steadfast on them and i'll agree, I didn't particularly like his 4cc re-structure plan, but I didn't really like anyone's ideas. In the case of this afternoon, Johnny and Twain were far more annoying and vociferous about their ideas, but so what? The winning ideas will rise to the top and clearly his didn't.

But I won't act like DF didn't deserve his ban. He got caught rigging the cup years ago. I don't care if he's had a change of heart, he still fucked over multiple boards.

I don't know why I wrote all this, not like anyone's going to listen anyway.

>>187147158
Jesus, dude. Reverting to accusations of molestation when people point out that they don't agree with PMB isn't a good look for you.

>>187146958
>Maybe being clear and transparent about what you want gets you a lot further than slinking around on Skype.
So DF vs PMB?

>>187147269
Easy, there buddy. I was implying that your multiple days of angry shitposting about a tripfag sounded like you were personally hurt in some way, because I don't know why else you'd carry this torch. Not that you were actually molested through your computer.

Another bad look: OBSESSION.

>>187147206
Not that guy, but PMB isn't a piece of shit because I disagree with him, he's just a shitty person in general.

>>187147206
I've been on PMB's side for more than one thing in the last year. I probably agree with the dude more than half the time. I will say that he made everyone that agreed with him on the Comfy stuff look like a fucking idiot after he did his little panel and doubled down on it with "not technically against the rules!", and that probably taints how I feel about his actual arguments. I'll try to separate that from him as a person.

DF deserved his ban. He continues to deserve his ban. People shouldn't have the attitude that "let's let him do it anyway, he'll slink around and try to weasel back into the cup if we don't!". If he's grown up, he'll realize that he really doesn't belong here, and some burned bridges don't get rebuilt. It's this attitude >>187147356 that makes people think "DF vs. PMB" is a thing that you have to take sides on. Both people can make mistakes.

I invite him to have ideas that people don't agree with. But once your ideas become fighting words, you need to take a step back and realize that it's a virtual soccer tournament. The last 3 things I've seen him argue on (PES 2017/HA rules, DF, and Comfy) he's resorted to personal attacks. For someone that's kind of presenting an "I'm more mature than you, I've seen more, ergo my opinions matter more" attitude (especially during the Comfy Conversation), it's not a reaction that pushes people to your camp.

>>187147667
>People shouldn't have the attitude that "let's let him do it anyway, he'll slink around and try to weasel back into the cup if we don't!". If he's grown up, he'll realize that he really doesn't belong here, and some burned bridges don't get rebuilt
I personally take the attitude 'DF is doing more for the cup than a lot of people. Making a PoI thread is bad but he shouldn't be blocked out entirely'.

>>187147667
I don't have a truck in this fight, but tbqf I've seen way more viciousness from other people in those same debates than PMB. I don't remember him calling anyone retarded or whatever. He called people DF's friends in the debate about DF, but if you consider that an attack, then you're implying that being DF's friend is a shitty thing to be. Meanwhile, Boris told DF to neck himself in the same debate but nobody's talking about that. If PMB is a problem for personal attacks, then everybody in the cup is a problem. Everybody flings shit.

>>187147906
The fact that he did a team's poll without consulting anyone until after the fact really chafes me. I don't agree with the people that got anal about "Throw it out!" because that just fucks over /cm/, but you have to draw the line BEFORE this. Because then:

"DF made this poll, but we can't throw it out because that would screw over the /cm/ fans that voted!"

Quickly turns into:

"DF made the tactics for /cm/, but we can't throw their win out, because that would just screw over the /cm/ fans!"

Yes, we did that once before, because we had to. Everyone's going to have their own different lines, and they're not all going to be mine, but mine is "Let him make all the aesthetics he wants, but don't talk to a single user or 'fan' about the way the team should be created and managed". Which he crossed.

>>187148157
I probably should be more angry at Boris for what he said. That crossed a pretty fucking dark line for "guy that wants to be involved in joke-ass soccer game". I get having a personal investment given the time he put in, but Jesus Christ some of the things he said there were tasteless.

>>187147667
I wasn't paying attention to the DF and Comfy stuff as it went down, so I don't know anything about those instances and i'm not doubting you, but I did watch pretty much the entire 4 hour debate had on the discord this afternoon about re-structuring the cup and I didn't see him once attack the others for what they had to say. I could maybe see some people misconstrued some of his counter-points as personal, but I didn't see it.

I'm not doubting that he's made mistakes, but I haven't bore witness to his mean streaks. I've seen exactly the opposite.

And regardless of what he thought of comfy, beyond the cringey opening, the 4CC panel was actually pretty cool. Wish he would've kept the archive up longer than a day.

>>187148318
As far as I can tell he was alright today. And yeah, I read through that with the expectation that he was going to cross the line at some point. I'm not going to fault him for being human, it's the doubling down when people don't agree with you that bugs me. Like I said, I agree with him more often than not, it's when he's in the minority that I get a little annoyed by the way he frames his arguments.

Watch some dead team do what /lgbt/ did and somehow manage to win a babby and elite up.

>>187148312
The thing is, it all comes down to your definition of managerial duties. I don't see organising a PoI thread as DF overstepping his boundaries and trying to sneak back in to managing a team because the board still votes on everything. Others see it as DF trying to manage a team again, and treat it as such.

>>187148520
Hopefully /x/ or /c/

>>187148647
>/c/
Unless they go down the /cm/ and /u/ route (having an actual interesting roster and good aesthetics) they can stay dead.

me too I'm excited for all the divegrass this weekend

>>187148556
It's weird that you call it a pol, and I'm not holding it against you, but it's super weird. But anyway, I think the line is as soon as tactics get involved. And no, I don't think DF was going to make an export, or test, but there were tactical questions on that poll, and DF for everything we've accused him of being sure as hell isn't stupid. He knows how to ask questions to get the answers he wants.

>>187148556
>I don't see organising a PoI thread as DF overstepping his boundaries and trying to sneak back in to managing
I tend to agree with this, especially since he went himself to lear with the results of the poll after he was done with it. That's not something you do if you know you're doing something wrong.

>>187148752
Asking Lear if you can make a poll as a banned person is what you do if you know you're at risk of doing something wrong. This is a "Beg for forgiveness, don't ask for permission" situation. He knew that most people were going to say "Don't fuck over /cm/ for some gay irishman's stupidity".

>>187148742
>And no, I don't think DF was going to make an export, or test, but there were tactical questions on that poll, and DF for everything we've accused him of being sure as hell isn't stupid. He knows how to ask questions to get the answers he wants.
On the contrary. Dragongate is a massive sign that DF is in fact very stupid. In fact, there's been absolutely nothing to show that DF isn't completely and utterly retarded and naive in the first place.

>>187148862
Would you rather he went and did it without telling anyone? Being as transparent as he was in this whole situation is a good sign, not a bad one.

>>187148862
This. If he wanted to help, he should've cleared it in advance. It's the fact he took that initiative on his own and more or less leveraged /cm/'s fans to make his actions stick that rubbed people the wrong way, considering his history.

>>187148976
I'd rather he not have done it. It's a 3/10 sign instead of a 1/10 sign. Neither of those numbers qualify as "Good".

>>187148318
It probably helps that the people discussing things were all quite respectful and most of them aren't people who have history with PMB.

>>187148862
>Asking Lear if you can make a poll as a banned person is what you do if you know you're at risk of doing something wrong.
As >>187148976 says, it just proves that he was clueless, considering he only fucked himself in the end by telling lear he had made the poll.

>>187149007
In the suggestionsbox discussion, he said that he did run it past multiple /merit/ members first though. But /merit/ all says they were all against it other than Lear. Funny that.

>>187149028
That's true of anybody in general in life. During the DF debate, people kept bringing up the panel and telling him to fuck off. Agree or disagree with the panel or on DF's ban, if you're in a room and everyone is coming at you, you're gonna get heated eventually.

>>187148742
It's not "pol", but "PoI", as in "Proof of Interest".

>>187148647
Id like for /c/ to do it, but give me one spaghetti moment from konata again

>>187148742
>He knows how to ask questions to get the answers he wants.
If you take a look at the questions you'd probably agree that they are decently neutral.
>>>/cm/3128707

>>187149132
>But /merit/ all says they were all against it other than Lear. Funny that.
Yeah, and Boris also said he didn't know Rigtor was DF despiste
>Rigtor being in the IRC
>Talking to him
>Never denying it was Dragonfag
And then Boris told Dragonfag to killhimself.

>>187149293
And they seem to have just gone for the most entertaining options in every field.

>>187149296
Was that the conversation where he got called out for mentioning the rigshop on IRC AFTER knowing it was DF? We're fact checking pretty decently tonight, so I don't just want to say that it was, but I know that came up somewhere at some point.

>>187149367
It's almost like cup fans just want to see some fun and don't really care about all this tactical crap we obsess about.

>>187149296
I'm confused. Are you implying that Boris was lying about everyone other than Lear being opposed to DF doing the poll? Lear confirmed that himself on Discord during the debate.

>>187149202
You should capitalise the O to avoid confusion.

>>187149397
It was

>>187149514
This. Sorry for getting confused about it, I know the o usually isn't, but we've got a pretty well known PoI here that likes to shoehorn itself into every conversation.

Dragonfag was openly talking about his /cm/ intentions since the autopilot thing was announced. He even openly discussed ideas for kits in the /vg/ discord. I think that was an issue that led to some heat. For some people it was out of the blue while for others its something they had known about for months and assumed they were wondering why /merit/ didn't do anything in the months before the poll.

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>>187149296
>>187149434

>>187149414
Who woulda thunk it.

>>187148954
I mean, dragongate was like 5 years ago. Is it not possible that a highschool kid could have become less retarded over 5 years?

So I take it that DescendingBear resigned in disgust? I can respect that.

>>187149731
Once a cheater...

>>187149668
Sure, but I don't blame him for wanting them in the cup, I don't blame him for wanting to make things that would make /cm/ fans want to get involved in the cup. It's the tactical thing I don't like.

>>187149775
Lear's wording was "If he's not going to say, I'm not going to say". Take that however you will.

>>187149731
Hey, he can be just as stupid 5 years later if he can still be a cheater 5 years later.

>>187149397
Yes, Boris said "I didn't know that at the time".
Apparently the whole /cm/ was the first time he realized Rigtor=Dragonfag, since he went ballistic and kicked him of the official discord.

>>187148705
Soon™

The problem with PMB is usually that at first he is right and then he overthinks it and nonsense comes out

The issue with BGP is he doesn't think at first and nonsense starts, but eventually he becomes right

Bent and Tony were always right though and everyone is just in denial

>>187149775
So what actually happened to him?
I haven't been following at all. Why did he leave?
Who will verify new people now?

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>>187149818
That sounds pretty incriminating. Bear left a day or so after that debate where Lear called him and a few others out as obstructionists, so it would make sense.

>>187149818
I'd be irked by the tactical thing, but if I was trying to revive a team, I'd probably also want the board to pick instead of relying on /merit/ to decide the fate of a team.

>>187149991
Oh, and the reason /aesco/ discord is now unofficial is because Boris couldn't kick DF and /aesco/ backed a content creator, who knew.

>>187149731
Doesn't matter. He should not be allowed remotely near anything that is close to management. Aesthetics is fine.

>>187149991
https://implyingrigged.info/w/index.php?title=Dragongate&type=revision&diff=42683&oldid=37073

It's been on the page for two years. No excuse. Also, it definitely and clearly came up during Winter in IRC.

>>187150032
shit, I read that third line and you still got me

>>187150032
This is the most deliberately backwards post I've ever read on /4ccg/. I actually applaud you for being so openly and deliberately wrong. You have truly earned my (You), anon

>>187150053
Incredibly disappointing if true. I don't know if that line is enough for me to think it's a conspiracy, but I'm disappointed that he at least didn't give us a proper goodbye. He was always one of the good ones.

>>187150047
Bear left /merit and /vr/ and presumably everything else immediately after the debate. Put two and two together.

>>187150135
He was even in the IRC during the comfy talk.
Seriously, how can I blame the thing on Dragonfag if apparently /merit/ is so detached from the cup they don't even read their official channels?

>>187150120
Don't get me wrong, I was here for OG Dragongate, I don't think he should be managing ever again. I just don't see how a roster poll and some blenders are going to lead to the death of the cup (yeah, yeah muh slippery slope).

Hell if he really, really wanted to manage again it would be super easy to sockpuppet some rando. Which despite all of the circlejerk-based memes doesn't seem to have happened yet.

DB please Descend to us and tell us where you have gone

>>187150490
That's my stance also.

>>187150421
Resigning because you disagree with a major decision is standard procedure in the corporate world for board members.

>>187149818
That's a shame because bear giving a statement could have really shone a light on some things.

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>>187150490
>f he really, really wanted to manage again it would be super easy to sockpuppet some rando.
The attached picture is completely unrelated to the above quoted comment. Please do not try to associate the two.

Lear is a bully and should be suspended

>>187150647
You forgot /fit/.

#BringBackGracen

>>187150579
Shit, how will 4CC Ltd. recover now?

>>187150162
>>187150367

admit it, PMB was right about Comfy being shit, but got to deep into the rabbit hole and started saying stupid shit.
And BGP was wrong about +7 abuse then eventually realized he was wrong and then was right at assuming his wrongness

>>187150490
>Hell if he really, really wanted to manage again it would be super easy to sockpuppet some rando.
Which he totally didn't do with Tom and Kinsey :^)

What are the current 4cc cliques and who's in each of them?

>>187150945
It's great to meme but nobody has even the slightest proof. You're giving DF way too much credit too if you think he's that good at PES.

>>187150915
Stared DOING stupid shit. I'm >>187147667, I agreed with him, then he doubled down on the panel garbage. Didn't realize BGP's position had evolved though and I can appreciate that. Always liked Bent, never liked Tony.

>>187150994
i only know about /merit/ and /ag/ and i dont know who's in either of those

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>>187150135
>>187150472
Boris apparently knew DF was doing stuff for the cup, but didn't know Rigtor was Dragonfag.