roguelike general /rlg

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1. How do I get in there
2. How do I not get brutally murdered?

There is a necklace of Bloodlust in there and I want it.

First for "I faulted at the same time the thread faulted."

>>165723218
It happened on the turn I entered the zone. Are instadeaths like this normal in Qud?

>>165725278
On the translucent wall, use a wand of digging (and/or disintegration if you're pre-trunk).

Oklob plants don't deal a tremendous amount of damage by themselves, but 4 of them could really mess you up. That'd be semi-dangerous even for an endgame character with rCorr. Still, they can't move. If you find yourself getting fucked, you can run/blink/tele away, literally just around the corner.

I personally don't think a Necklace of Bloodlust would be worth all that trouble, though.

What's a roguelike where I can have time manipulation powers?

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>>165725886

That did the trick.

Unfortunately, I don't have enough INT to equip it.

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Is the CoQ guide still relevant or have patches changed anything?
Just wondering, since I'm starting the game for my first time today.

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>>165726159

>>165726847
Neat. Game?

>>165726159
ToME4

Sadly the game itself is not that amazing, but it has some neat classes.

>>165726663
let's see:
-there are 2 more earlygame quests available in Joppa (one from the Zealot and one from the random shrine)
-both shortblades and longswords have had their skill trees reworked/buffed since that guide was written. longblades are no longer the shittiest weapon type, and max agi dual shortblades is just fine as a primary offense
-tinkering was also changed a bit.in addition to straight up crafting items you can also now find "mod" recipes that let you add bonuses to pre-existing equipment

>>165726983
PCB
timelords don't really have time manipulation powers in the sense of time travel and shit
they can zap monsters with time spells that have a chance to do shit like devolve monsters to weaker forms, but the only real time manipulation they get is the lategame double-move spell that just immediately gives them an extra turn

>>165727362
>-there are 2 more earlygame quests available in Joppa (one from the Zealot and one from the random shrine)
Should I do them before, after or while doing the red rock one? Basically, what's the ideal progression route through the quests?
>-both shortblades and longswords have had their skill trees reworked/buffed since that guide was written. longblades are no longer the shittiest weapon type, and max agi dual shortblades is just fine as a primary offense
Are cudgels and axes still preferred though?

Thanks, buddy.

The mechanics that were inspired in Dungeons of Everchange from the P&P RPG Dungeon World is kinda cool. Hope it doesn't get abandoned.

>>165727656
I think all the weapon skills are good now. Maybe cudgels are the least useful?
Longswords are pretty skillpoint-intensive though so maybe not the best choice for low-int characters, and shortblades are kind of point-costly as well because you are gonna want to take dual-wielding skills with them

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>Finally get a scroll of acquirement on D13
>Wish for armor since my drops have been sub par
>Get a hat
>Not even magical
>+0 Hat

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did you beat meshera alpha yet /rlg/?

>>165725184
I wish the OP was the non-faggot one instead of the memespouting faggot.

Are there any roguelikes available for vita or 3ds homebrew?

>>165728649
Shiren and One Way Heroics MC for the Vita.

Pokemon Mystery Dungeon and EO MD for the 3DS.

That's all I can think of.

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I told you I wouldn't forget, Nodens.

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>>165729701
Should've learned heal self, Morgoth.

>>165725278
Blink/lucky tp/passage or wallpass, forgot whats it called/wand of digging or disintegration if yuore pre trunk
But youll mostlikely die in a few hits unless your bulky and prepared

what does a
>you feel nervous
message mean in poschengband

>>165731786
so I killed a unique and got a
>you feel your luck is turning...
so I assume the 'feel' messages are about what's on the current floor?

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>>165731786

>>165732072
thankyou anon

>>165732034
yeah
the level feeling is a combination of how good the loot is and how dangerous/OOD the monsters are (those two things are tied together)

additionally if the level feeling is "special" it means there's an artifact or a big vault around

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>>165731265
And the Plain Gold Ring is finito, donezo, kaput. Enemies just can't handle all this manastorming.

Except for Talos. Fuck that guy.

>>165732919
thanks. another question- how does the pet mechanic work?
i purchased a capture ball, do i just throw it at something desirable like a baby dragon?

>>165733080
you don't throw it actually, you wield it in your hand and 'A'ctivate it

just like real poke mans, the chance to capture something is better the lower its hp is
unlike real poke mans, you keep the ball if you fail to catch something, so you can keep trying forever

who is the amy people keep posting about

>>165733657
amy bluescreenofdeath, developer of the world's best nethack fork and gay german foot fetishist

>>165733657

no one is posting about it except (You)

>>165734034
https://nethackwiki.com/wiki/Trap_(Slash%27EM_Extended)#Nasty_traps

>>165736625
im sorry but the OBJECTIVELY best trap is the sexy farting butt trap

is ananias worth to try and why?

How do we make polearms great again?

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Is Let it die a rouge like? or should i just get the fuck out?

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Is it just me or acsii version of dcss is much better?

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fuckin vegetarian : /

>>165738884
>Is Let it die a rouge like?

Fuck no.

If it's not turn-based or grid-based, it kind of automatically is a roguelite at best. But Let It Die really only is "like Rogue" for semi-procedurally generated levels and player ghosts. Otherwise, its main focus is being a hack-n-slash game.

>>165738590
>nethack has a glaive and a guisarme but no guisarme-glaive
>it has a bill-guisarme but no billhook
>"spear" and "lance" are separate skills from polearms

>>165739724
>billhook
Monica Lewinsky?

>>165725409
Only if you have low HP. But yes, enemies can do lots of damage in one turn in an area from a long distance away; that's what happens when casting Fireball is as easy as pulling a trigger.

>>165728383
>can't keep the aralgeean dinasty's name high because I'm eotking
Profound sadness.

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>>165725184
Hi everybody, I'm currently working on a rogue-like RPG and I was wondering how I should do magic and traps.


Should players be able to detect traps or should trap-detection be based on solely on the player's skill points?


Also I don't like the idea of having magic based around a mana system with regenerating mana (especially if a game has heal spells) since a wizard will have an 'unlimited' amount of fire balls he can cast but an archer doesn't have an unlimited amount of arrows. I was thinking of using a regent system in which a wizard will need to use magical artifacts in order to cast magic where the artifacts have a given amount of charges.

What do you guys think about these ideas?

>>165741018
refer to >>165736625

>>165738884
there's already a general mate, browsing it right now

>>165725409
qud instadeaths aren't really a thing unless you're running around the deathlands
(dont run around the deathlands)

but grenade damage doesn't scale with level at all, and so if you are unlucky enough for a random enemy to spawn with a grenade while you're level 1 you might be fucked

IIRC they made low-level enemies much less likely to have grenades and shit in the more recent versions

>>165741018
you could just give the archer unlimited arrows

>my first character that lived beyond 8th level of dungeon
>cleared the lair/orcish mines/dungeon
>time to do lair branches
>a dark feeling over looms me that my character is going to die soon
I just want to accomplish something
I'm not ready to lose another adventurer, not after all of this progress

>>165741976
If you feel like you're going to start badplaying, make a new character and splat that, then go back to the good character, take a count of all the panic button shit you have, write it down either on paper or in a txt file, and then the next time things are looking even slightly dangerous, refer to the list of panic buttons.

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What do you think about this guys?
Vampire confused and killed me, but I think I was pretty good warrior.
Anything I could do better?
I had also a Book of Control.

>>165736625
Jesus fuck, you need to really hate yourself to play this game.

>>165742676
with no MR and no identified !curing you probably shouldn't have fought the vamp in the first place

also i dont know if you know this but you're playing a pretty old version, the most recent crawl release was version .19

>>165742882
I like this version...
0.12.2
Anyway thank you and I'm gonna beat this game!

>>165742536
this actually sounds like a good idea, thanks anon

>>165738921
>>165739117
It's really comfy.

I wish I knew how to make PuTTy look like that.

Man, I want to win yet another historical /rlg/ combo like MuMo, or >10 conducts vampire convict, but nightmare mode PCB is just fucking bullshit.
Everything is hasted, has double HP and hits harder. Do you understand what it means to fight a 60 K hp serpent of chaos?

What's the closest thing, Edain morgoth killer?
But tons of people have done that already.
I need a new goal. Or a stronger meme combo than yeek Psion.

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>>165745382
Hint

>>165745382
Lazy snotling tourist is a classic

>>165745382
>dda
Really Bad Day + Tweaker + Wander Spawn + Dynamic NPC + Surrounded Start

>>165745694
elona snail race ported to some poschengpseudoelli-R variant when

>>165745382

0 death felid of Chei 15 rune on trunk. That's all. It can't be that hard amirite

Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.19.1 (tiles) character file.

6516 knifebutton the Cleaver (level 10, -5/90 HPs)
Began as a Minotaur Fighter on Jan 16, 2017.
Was an Elder of Okawaru.
Succumbed to a profane servitor's poison
... while paralysed
... on level 1 of the Abyss.
The game lasted 00:24:00 (7569 turns).

knifebutton the Cleaver (Minotaur Fighter) Turns: 7569, Time: 00:24:01

Health: -5/90 AC: 20 Str: 22 XL: 10 Next: 69%
Magic: 10/12 EV: 2 Int: 5 God: Okawaru [****..]
Gold: 217 SH: 0 Dex: 13 Spells: 0 memorised, 9 levels left

rFire + . . SeeInvis . a - +12 war axe {flame, +Fly rC+++ MR- Dex+3}
rCold + + + Gourm . J - +0 plate armour
rNeg . . . Faith . c - +0 large shield
rPois . Spirit . (helmet restricted)
rElec . Reflect + I - +2 cloak {+Inv}
rCorr . Harm . g - +0 pair of gloves
MR ..... (no boots)
Stlth .......... i - amulet of Bodily Harmony {Reflect +Blink rF+ rC+ MR+ SH+3}
(no ring)
q - ring of flight

@: paralysed, lethally poisoned (-5 -> -108), exhausted, heroism,
non-regenerating, mildly diseased, slowed, wreathed by umbra, drained
A: retaliatory headbutt, horns 2, cold resistance 1, weak 1
a: Heroism, Renounce Religion, Evoke Blink, Evoke Invisibility, Evoke Flight


You were on level 1 of the Abyss.


i fucking KNEW that run was goign way too well. l pick up that axe right next to a large sheild. Clear floor. Stairs. RIGHT NEXT TO THE STAIRS IS AN ORC MAGE. use hero. get banished. Die.

>>165746595

I've already thought of the challenge title by the way: Cats Against Kiting and 3 rune shitters (C.A.K.3)

In Crawl, what is the special property of blunt weapons if any? Like swords have riposte and axes have cleave etc.

>>165748471

Nothing. A waste of design space.

>>165748471
Raw damage

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POST THE SHEET OF THE CHARACTER YOU ARE PLAYING WITH RIGHT NOW
NO EXCUSE YOU FAGGOT JUST TAKE A SCREENSHOT AND POST THAT SHIT

>27 throwing and +9 blowgun with needles of sleeping against literally every archdemon
Holy shit
this is broken

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>>165749385

>>165749921
meant paralysis

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>>165749385
Got through Swamp and got my first rune ever!

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>>165749385
there you go
>>165750537
congratulations my man
I'm about to get my first rune too
I just need to clear one more floor to get to the sweet swamp rune

>>165746595
>crawl
I'm collecting historical wins for each game, anon. With MuMo you can write DCSS out.
>>165745707
>DDA
There's no win condition.
>>165745694
That would be a first.
I'd rather nightmare Psion though. At least I don't feel completely useless in the late game.

>>165748471
>>165748674
>>165748872
It's fucking easy. Give them bash chance.

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>>165749385

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>>165749385

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>>165752643
I died. That' sad

Is Irradiate any good? Vehu gives it to me but not sure if i should memorize.

>>165751810

Sounds like an excuse for chickening out. It's okay you don't have to force yourself.

>>165751823

What would that do? Additional damage is boring while a stun is problematic. It's not easy.

>>165753454
sure it is, make M&F negate some AC. a club negates next to nothing, while a giant spiked club turns plate into leather.

>>165733034
nice, PGR is nasty

>>165754519

>additional damage is boring

>>165754765
AC reduction does nothing to any enemies not wearing armor, so it's not a flat damage bonus, it's circumstantial. Do you switch from your war axe to your flail when you come across an orc warrior wearing chain? interesting tactical decision, since you will have some M&F skill from training axes, you will be able to use the flail effectively, but is the damage bonus worth switching?
>hurr de durr AC reduction means +5 damage across the board

>>165755093
>but is the damage bonus worth switching?
Sadly, the answer is going to be that nobody knows because crawl damage formulas.

>>165755093

Almost everything has AC so it's just additional damage thus boring.

>>165755596
maybe the devs should fix the game so not everything has AC as a crutch to make up for bad AI programming, then

>>165755696

But the game is already too easy even if everyone has AC. Actually, no matter how many new dangerous monsters the devs add, people still label Crawl as too easy, regardless of irony and credibility.

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>>165750537
First and second rune on the same run! Before this I hadn't even cleared Lair.

>>165748225
>wielding something with MR-
>expecting not to get assraped by magic effects

FAULT

>>165740746
Holy shit and you sound like uber dork.

>>165745789
its in SLEX already

>>165754765
permanent AC redaction
And it stacks

>>165762248
um this is clearly a axe ability??
havent u played qaves of cud ?!

>>165748872
I checked the wiki and except for the giant clubs which can be used by only a few species(I think only trolls and ogres), the highest damage flail has 17 base damage which is lower than exec axe. I don't know desu they look like shit to me. I also don't think polearm bonus is good, at least compared to riposte and cleave. Don't know about short swords

oh yeah qud axes are also great at dismembering people

chop off a high-level enemy's face and wear it for an ego boost

>>165763296
requiring 20 skill instead of 26 is a huge savings on exp that you can then put into other skills
unless you're a mi or be and literally dont care about xp costs

>>165763459
Are the random limbs you chop off still five pounds in the Steam version? The weights of some things in the game are silly: I think the dog corpses are equal in weight to dismembered limbs, so they must be some tiny dogs.

>>165753364
>Sounds like an excuse for chickening out.
Actually, I was thinking of an android psion.

>>165764319
I'm not sure actually.
There is some silly shit like plant stems weighing 1 lb each, but bullets being completely magically weightless
and butchering a 200lb corpse producing just 1lb of raw meat

What do you guys think of Cogmind? It seems neat but idk if the $30 price tag is worth it :/

>>165765197
pirate it

Why do centaurs have so low dexterity? Hunters are recommended class for them but they just keep missing everything. Either I'm missing something or CeHu isn't really a good choice. I know that I can kite the enemies with speed but that doesn't matter if every one of my shoot is a miss, I guess you just don't use your bow early game

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>vault spawns with trash mobs
>grab 30 levels in three minutes
Well, that escalated quickly.

>>165765530
Early game bow (especially for centaur) is fucking awful. You'd be better off with like CeMo for the Dex bonus that Monk gives, and then just going bow-less until you see another Centaur.

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>>165765197
Thinking about buying it. It's 20% off at the moment. (There's a coupon available in le reddit thread)

>>165755845
Also, holy fuck I'm lost. Never made it this far but I've cleared Vault until 4, Elf until 3 and am clearing Depths at the moment. I have no clue where I should head next.

Trog has given me more than 20 quarterstaves and a single lajatang so my weapon choices suck. My inventory is also constantly full and I'm afraid to drop anything.

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Guys I found the rune knight of Steamband
Maybe I can make it past 10 levels now

>>165766790
yeah but steamband is shit

>>165766041
>my weapon choices suck.
Yeah, but that Lajatang will carry the shit out of you. And, hell, you might find the "Hysh" quarterstaff to still be useful, since vamp, high enchanment, and MR+ are probably the best bonuses you could ask for on a random artefact.

>full inventory
Welcome to roguelikes, anon. Be sure to use "Ctrl+f" to find anything you've left on the ground.

Vaults:5 should probably be your next goal after Depths. It's dangerous, yes, but as long as you buff yourself up (haste, might, resistance, and agility potions before going down; I also recommend eating your rations until you're Engorged) and remember your God abilities (Trog's Hand if you need the extra MR+, Brothers in Arms and any summoning scrolls you have should be used time and time again; I'm not a fan of using Berserk on the Vaults:5 stairs, but you may have more success than I did), you should be fine.

The other potential third runes (Slime Pit and Abyss, arguably the Tomb, too) are a bit too weird and dangerous for a newb and nearly useless for a Trog user to pursue.

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>>165767420
Thank you, Anon. This is the kind of advice I'm looking for.

I was cast into Abyss earlier and caught a glimpse of the rune on my way out. Tried to reach it but it was way too dangerous and I had to get out.

>>165725278
>two answers
>no mention of invisibility

How does PCB race changing work?
Are levels recalculated based on exp, or does it keep your level?
How doable is it to run a Snotling until lvl 50 and just switch to another race?

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I do like the frogmen race.

>>165769719
>Are levels recalculated based on ex
yes they are
this means that if you're a chaos-warrior and your god changes you to a snotling you get like 5-10 more FREE chaos patron actions immediately

if you just recently hit 50 and you poly to a higher-xp-penalty race you will lose levels, but most characters will eventually get more than enough xp to stay at 50 as they fight bigger and bigger enemies

>>165769719
>Are levels recalculated based on exp
Yeah.

Snotling is really terrible, but I imagine you could start as an imp or something for quick levels and switch to a stronger race later on once exp is plentiful.

>>165769941
>he doesn't know

>>165770175
snotling lets you create an artifact mushroom tho

obviously you start as snotling and once you have the eternal mushroom of restoring you spam poly until demigod or tonberry

>>165770523
Huh, the help file doesn't mention that.
At what level to they get it?

>>165771038
ahahaha you don't get it for free; you have to read a scroll of artifact creation on a mushroom

this is only available to snotlings and is just as useless/wasteful as it sounds

>>165770523
>and once you have the eternal mushroom of restoring
Or you know. spend 1 K at the restoration shop.
By the time you choose to poly, you can spare 1000 coins.

>>165771038
You gotta waste the most sought scroll in the game, the scroll of artifact creation, on a shroom which is the lowest possible consumable with no use whatsoever

>>165771240
>>165771280
Ffs.. Why does every snotling based strategy I have get shot down instantly...

Is Snotling/Imp+Yellowmage a decent combo at least?
You can get your casting time up quickly to get you through the early/mid game, and then change into another race.

Also, what item even lets you change races?
Are there ones for classes/realms too?

>>165771678
Snotlings are shit anon.
Yeeks are literally (practically) 100 times better, have good apts and skills have an acid racial immunity at level 20 and have a 75% xp penalty instead of the snotling's 45%, which is nothing.

Also yellow mages suck big time. How do you plan on polymorphing anyway, considering it's a property only found on the stone of chaos and the fourth chaos spellbook?
>Are there ones for classes/realms too?
Nope.

>>165771280
yeah, the only use for consumable restoration is fighting stat-drainers without the need to recall to town to fix shit

OTOH snotlings do get a bunch of secondary buffs from eating mushroom, artifact or no. I think at the very least haste+heroism, maybe something else too?

>>165771678
the only way to chance races is by spamming "polymorph". it's available on the artifact stone of chaos, rarely as an activation on chaos-themed weapons, and as an activatable mutation itself (beastmen are quite likely to get it)

you can never change class, but any spellcaster with 2 realms can change their secondary realm at will just by 'G'aining from the new realm's book. note that you permanently lose all the spell slots you spent on the realm you're giving up, so if you're planning on switching a realm out later on don't spend slots on spells you're not gonna use.

>>165772012
>at the very least haste+heroism
They get giant strength, haste, heroism and it cures poison/heals for a cure serious wounds potion.
Still, it's nothing.

Oh, also stoneskin.

>>165772012
>the only way to chance races is by spamming "polymorph"
You can also stand in front of a toxic waste breather, if you're particularly desperate. Also the stone mask makes you a vampire, which is on the better side of races.

>>165773018
>the_sun-s_rays.png

>>165773739
only if you don't have rLite though, which is mostly a concern earlygame

>first time playing mage class
>GrEE
>find an amulet of gourmand in the first level
>+2 hunting sling of fire in the same floor
>this gon be a good run
>first thing I see on the second floor is sigmund
>woops it would be a shame if you got insta killed with my spells lad
this is why I hate mages, warriors would literally tear that faggot a new asshole but mages are like glass canons and they need a lot of hand holding in every game

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>>165774469
>insta killed
unless you literally got killed or confused on the first turn in LOS you faulted hard anon

>>165774469
>Visions of tabbing Sigmund fill your mind!
>you cannot evoke your feet away from Sigmund!

>>165774469
>first time playing mage class
>this is why i hate mages

Literally
get
good

crawl needs an earlygame unique to force people to learn how to walk away

make it a Qud-style Slumberling that just sleeps forever unless the player wakes it by tabbing it, at which point it eviscerates them for a near-instant kill
something so monstrously powerful and yet so blindly oblivious that even the stupidest mibeplayer can figure out that it's better not to wake it up

(and i guess it would have to be special-cased not to wake up from noise or failed stealth checks. only from actual player actions)

>>165775383
>crawl needs an earlygame unique to force people to learn how to walk away
desu, I feel like hydras fill that role in lair already, as incredibly dangerous monsters that can't do shit if you evoke feet.

>>165775383
It's called "Sigmund".

>>165776337
not really

there are plenty of newbadplayers who have difficulty making it to lair or even to temple. the people who need to be tutorialized the most aren't even reaching hydras

>>165776825
nah, sigmund IS very dangerous but he's still beatable, and new players doing mibe or something will learn bad habits if/when they actually beat him just by going berserk and holding down tab

you need something that even a mibe has no chance of beating -- a unique where the ONLY way to survive is to play correctly by not waking it up

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>>165777165
But Sigmund's the best possible thing.
You don't need to hold a MiBe's hand. 99% of the people either learn to avoid him or they die, then learn to avoid him and by proxy all dangerous stuff.
Let god sort 1% of 4 int badplayers.

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We're on the cusp of something great, fellas.

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>>165780536
Lucky you!
I'm still trying to cheese my way around nightmare mode.
Fun fact: the mirror master ability to create a mana storm triangle predictably doesn't work if the enemies are behind walls.

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6th webtool win

Had to go MiFi to relearn the game because I haven't played actively since .14 and kept splatting before lair.

>>165781173
>skullcrusher
Senpai, why would you get 27 maces when you're using a demon whip, which is known for having a low delay, and thus lower amount of skill needed to swing at min-delay?

Other than that, congrats senpai

>>165781173
Sometimes I wish Dungeon Crawl was just Crawl, with only external environments and unlimited map generation like Minecraft. But if you go too far off the "path" your LOS will decrease and you'll meet horribly out of depth monsters.

>>165781475
Well I don't know really. I guess I was hoping for a juicy randart eveningstar or something like that. But when I got the critical skill levels I just put everything useful on and didn't really look at the skill tab again.

Does anyone even run with Elyvilon?

>>165782017
Not anymore!

>>165781589
Sounds like Caves of Qud.
Seriously.

Sigmund still kills people?
I feel like he's been nerfed over the years, I rarely get confused or paralyzed and when I do it lasts a lot less than it used to. Plus he now seems to take a long while before casting invisibility or confuse, I remember he used to do it the moment he saw you.

Now Grinder and Pikel are another story. These fucks are often generated with a wand of acid in my games on top of their old gimmicks.

>>165782226
I know right.

>>165782415
><Sequell> sigmund wins 23.24% of battles.

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>>165780536
Farewell, my old nemesis. STORM'd.

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>special quest
Oh god what is this, I almost died in the difficult quest

how the fuck do I git gud in poschengband

>>165785112
Learn to read ?tele

>>165785112
you need to understand the depth and math of tummies

>>165762717
I don't get it

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>>165784685
So it spawns a vault on the quest level
I probably cant clear it but Ill try to lure the badguys away so I can grab the quest item inside

>You are on level 4 of the Shoals.
>You can see Donald.

>Vanquished Creatures
> Mara (Shoals:3) (demon whip of electrocution)
> 2 illusory Maras (Shoals:3)
> Agnes (Shoals:2) (lajatang of electrocution)
> Wiglaf (Shoals:1)
the ride never ends.

>>165787518
He can't be as bad as any of those other negros, especially because it's a version of the game with Wiglaf existing.

>>165785112

I'm playing PCB for the first time but it seems like this suffers from the same problematic and scummy optimal player behavior Crawl has: walking away is too powerful. Not to mention the amount of redundant content that could be cut. It's not that different, except PCB seems thrice as boring.

>>165789151
made me slightly irritated, 8/10

>>165789424

I'm not joking, whoever thought unlimited shops and unlimited gold were a good idea? Obviously the only way a dev can retaliate is to design obscene monsters that can kill you regardless of your equipment quality. I could already sense Elona tier of bullshit here from miles away.

>>165785579
Do I need to understand ratios of tums to bums, and imaginary tummers

>>165765759
>PCB R
>R
What's this one do? The github description is rather unspecific.

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>go to lab
>suddenly bandits come out of nowhere

what the fuck

>>165793740
Generally slight playability tweaks, but also a bit easier because less experience is needed to gain later levels

I used to think I liked roguelikes, but I'm realizing I've never beaten any of them. I've played Brogue, DCSS, Caves of Qud, and various smaller roguelikes, but I've never won. I rarely get far at all. How do I get good?

>>165797059
Winning at DCSS is probably the easiest. Just don't play like an idiot, learn from your mistakes if you do fuck up, and you'll eventually get into the hang of things. Crawl is the least likely to cruelly kill you by the time you reach Lair.

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>>165797059
>How do I get good?
Play enough times until you instinctively get a feel for which situations are dangerous and how to deal with them.

What are plain rings in PCB for? I just bought one for 1800 gold just because both my slots were empty

>>165800351
They are useless as-is, but you can use them for reforging to create artifact rings.

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All Olympians: Skooshed. Athena and Artemis were both megabitches, but never underestimate the power of hiding in walls. Not sure how a mere mortal spellcaster would do it.

>>165801079
For athena you just need a shitload of genocide charges in a staff or something.
Those ultimate magi she summons are pretty scary.

>>165800834

How do I exactly do this? I see no shops in town that involves reforging rings

How do I take advantage of Always Interesting Levels? I can't even get into most of the vaults for the first few levels, and without monster detection I'm scared to explore the ones that I can enter.

>>165803740
the artifact reforger guy is only in Morivant

How do I advance as an android?

>>165805381
as an android your level is entirely based on your equipped gear
so find some better items

(if you examine identified items they will show a "cst" in their description, which is apparently short for "construction". you can see how many cst points you need for the next level on your character sheet. )

So how is a spellcaster supposed to kill Talos?

>>165805932
you do not have to kill any enemies that aren't named "Oberon" or "The Serpent of Chaos"

>>165804407
Get detection and scum a good floor

>>165806210
Could I win the game with just experience from disarming traps? Or does that stop accumulating after a certain point?

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>>165805070

Nevermind, I didn't notice a unique called Zhu Rong was already flaming me out of nowhere giving it a couple of literally free turns and when I somehow managed to kill it an Ogre finished me off

Wand of Stinking Cloud 8/8 and still level 1, worth selling or keeping as an android weaponmaster?

>>165806645
try it and find out

>>165806408
you could also scum for potions of experience, or just play an android and get levels by running past all the monsters to steal loot off the ground

>>165806645
compare the wand's damage to your melee damage.
if it's still actually worth your turn to zap it, keep it. but when you're meleeing for 30-45 damage per round you probably won't care about a 15-damage stinking cloud.
plus you already have a built-in ranged attack in your ray gun power

>>165806418
S C R O L L O F T E L E P O R T

>>165807135

I sexually identify as a Formicid

FR: give all 'a'nt monsters in PCB-R teleport immunity

>>165808405
What's the lore reason ?
inb4 crawl.

>>165809125
everyone knows ants cant teleport anon
have you ever seen an ant teleport in real life?
no you havent
because they cant

>>165809375

Oh, but I have seen one. Ants teleport in PCB and I have seen it with my own 2 (two) eyes irl.

FR: add a "nexus worm mass" -- like a phase spider/blink dog but breeds explosively

I'll try to get into Nethack.

D E A D

>>165816553
Be bold, and jump in at the deep end by starting with slashem extended! After that, vanilla will seem like a walk in the park by comparison.

>>165816794

kill yourself you fucking faggot

>>165817516
why don't you jump off a bridge instead? wouldn't be a big loss

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I feel lucky today
should I dew it?
this could go both horribly wrong or horribly right

>>165817712
of course you should do it anon

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>>165817876
>not trog
dropped desu
RNG gods are in no fun mode today

>>165817652

I would jump off a bridge ONLY IF I would land on top of your face you fucking homosexual

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>>165818368
dont worry anon, you can sit on MY face any time you want~

>>165816553
First time playing?

>>165765498
>>165765197

does anyone have a link??? I've been trying to find an updated copy for ages

>>165819228
what version do you consider to be "updated"?
what version have you already found?

>>165818891
Yeah, man.

>>165820160
If so I want to give you some tips that I wish I knew the first time playing
-You can get a powerful artifact weapon, "Excalibur" quite early. If you're lawful and at least level 5 you can get it by dipping your long sword to a fountain with 1/6 chance. 5/6 of the time you'll get usual dipping effects, some of them are bad so just in case have an emergency escape item. It's usually worth it
-You can curse test items with your pets. If your pet doesn't want to step on the same tile as an item(assuming there isn't food on the same tile), or when it does but the game says "the pet moves only reluctantly" you can know for sure that one item on the tile is cursed. Also dropping items on altars, no matter who they belong to, show you if the items are cursed/blessed/uncursed
Other than these two can't think of anything you can't figure out with some logic, if you played some other roguelikes before you should be fine

>>165819228
here u go famalam:
http://www.gridsagegames.com/cogmind/

>>165821031
post some lolis getting tummy punched

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>>165820160
a virgin! rape it!

i mean play dwarf valkyrie start lawful with longsword get level 5 dip for excalibur as mentioned

basically nethack mebi

I got the best possible combo for nightmare! Hades demigod grey mage!

Been carrying cursed items from D:2 and I haven't found a removal yet at D:11. I started playing this week but damn, this is the most ridiculous game I've ever had.

http://underhound.eu:81/crawl/morgue/Lahna/Lahna.txt

>>165827991
>Lahna the Cleaver (Minotaur Berserker)
>read that Lahna the Clever
>then i check the background
Hehe.. Either way you can use enchant scrolls to remove curse, but tthats not recommended unless its in dire need honestly and it only works for equipment, not for jewellery i believe, unless they changed something again
And you should start clearing lair now and stop with clearing dungeon, remember to switch to the flaming axe whenever you see a hydra!

>>165827991
Lahna???

I've seen you play slex. Did you like it? ;)

>>165828226
I'll have to try it again with a wiki or guide of some kind. I was playing on a tiny laptop without wiki so I had some difficulties understanding anything.

>>165828809
The official hints page is here: https://nethackwiki.com/wiki/User:Bluescreenofdeath/Hints

>>165827991

Just how slow do you have to play to take a week from D:2 to D:11 with a MiBe?

>>165829771

The whole game lasted like 40 minutes, I have no idea what you're talking about. Started this morning and died this morning.

Splat.

>>165793740
https://github.com/floatRand/PoschengbandR/blob/master/PCB-R%20changelog.txt

Bit outdated, I made new log but didn't push it?
I should update R soon, though. Been bit busy...

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>>165831796
Splatting in style.

>>165832918
>whisky with a best before date
Every time

>>165833874
It's the best before date of plastic, not whisky.
At that date your whisky will taste of plastic. But it probably already does.

>>165725184
I'm sick of DCSS and I don't wanna play ToME at the moment.

Recommend me something I can pick up and play. Windowed modes only.

How does this gen feel about Mystery Dungeon?

>Prior to 0.X, attacking a target standing in water with an electrocution-branded weapon would cause electricity to race through all adjacent water tiles, lightly damaging anything there (possibly including you!).
Why the hell would you remove this

>>165834504
DCSS always dumbs down.

>>165834628
But this isn't even a dumbing down, it's not like it was a complicated mechanic or something and I'd guess this wouldn't even be relevant for 70% of the games. It just looks like it was a little detail they decided to remove for no reason

>>165834383
Nethack and its variants

>>165834801
Tell that to Femmy. She got pretty upset when they made it so that iron rings can no longer rust in Nethack 3.6.0.

>>165834834
Fair enough. What about a lesser known as well?

>>165834967
CastlevaniaRL?

>>165834801
It's pretty shitty, I agree. I used to like dwarf/orc/elf armour and weapons too.

Unrelated, is there a rl where the 'enemies' are in conflict with each other. Like those sequences in ToME where the camps are being attacked by snakes.

What do you want to see in a roguelike that you always wanted but no game implemented it
Whats that thing that will make you go "damn this game is better than every RL that I ever played!"

>>165834929
What did rusted rings even do? Worse effects than normal ones? Or made them uneatable to metallivores? I don't think I ever saw a ring rust

>>165834504
This killed me once, so I still switch out brands before attacking in shallow water.

>>165834504
this killed one of my grandfathers too
fuck shitty meme details that doesn't do anything good beside comforting autistic niggers
this is the reason that everyone hates roguelikes and associate the player base with autistic faggots

>>165835021
You're the man, man

>>165836046
>DCSS: so simple it practically plays itself!

Where can I download the most up to date DoomRL?

>get rpois
>go to the spider nest
>GET POISONED/CONFUSED 90% OF THE HITS
i hate that place and its fucking shafts so much

So I'm on and off with this game a lot, never even getting into Lair cause I'm too scared to start a game. Decided to try a Troll Berserker cause it's ez apparently. Is it worth buffing up int to get some spells later on or just stick to Str?

>>165840096
Stick to STR and DEX.
I myself have no fucking clue what's the ideal of each these days. Someone once gave me an arbitrary value of 16 DEX to aim for so I keep my base value at that. But then trolls are huge so they shouldn't be getting much EV from DEX anyway, no idea about how much that missing accuracy from it will hurt.

>>165840096
Dex only. You have enough str.

>>165840391
>>165840096
I don't know the actual values, but I've heard that dex starts to fall off at 18, and falls off harder at 21. So level dex until 18, then put everything else into str.

>>165834487
no one talks about it, but it's welcomed here.

I for one am getting many hours out of shiren the wanderer. it's too bad that the game is balanced around consume-ID though, I would prefer it if the ID scrolls were more common. At least making horribly overpowered amalgamations of items is fun.

>>165840096

I will put everything on Int because of statueform and shit

>>165839575
pls?

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What do?

>>165834801

It is a complicated mechanic if it exists. It doesn't have a gameplay reason for it to stay either so it needed to be removed.

>>165842301
Time to search for hidden doors.

>>165841594
Not really.

>>165844458
it's in the OP, and it's more of a roguelike than ToME which is allowed.

>>165827991
tbqh, neither of your cursed items are *that* bad. sure, you have a better piece of armor with your orange CPA, but I think that would lower your already crappy EV even more. You can still swap out jewellery extremely quickly (half a turn), so while the loudness ring sucks, it's also not going to kill you. Plus, you were a MiBe: Stealth was never going to be your main aim.

>>165840096
>Decided to try a Troll Berserker
>Berserker
>get some spells

Trog says, "Get the FUCK out of my religion."

>>165847532
>FeBe^Che

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>find wand of digging
>disable further wand pickup

I wish the devs would actually do something about this annoying tedium.

>>165820939
I think he means for free. I also want to try out the game but i cant find an up to date version.

>>165743123
>I like this version...
But why?

>>165852865
It's better than nucrawl in every conceivable way.

>>165852392
I could upload it if people wanted

>>165853120
I don't see it.

>>165853991
go away devdrone, sprint should not be default.

>>165854198
Well I agree with -that-.

>>165853179
That would actually be super appreciated, thanks man.

>>165849150
Why would you leave Trog? Especially someone who hasn't even been to the lair

>>165856108
For fun.

>>165854559
Here you go https://mega.nz/#!eZNWjIAR!SKiAyPRyXjSolimurl42urX9BxQspD-HMCbCI0tykHY

>>165857119
>eh I might as well give this "game" a try
>its actually pretty interesting
thanks anon for the dolphin porn, bitcoin miner and the "game" you put in there

>>165842207
>>165839575
Hasn't it been 0.9.7.7 for ages?

>>165859951
I'm not sure if it was public knowledge but there was supporter-exclusive preview build of next version. My forum account was apparently purged for zero posts so I can't even download it now.

>>165834801
they removed it BECAUSE it was an obscure mechanic that wasn't even relevant for 70% of games

Who removes the removers?

>>165839575
the official website?
https://drl.chaosforge.org/downloads
it is now "D**M The Roguelike" because whoever owns the Doom trademark/copyright/something got pissy and sent them a letter, although it's probably not that hard to find a copy from before the rename

>>165844768
nah tome has multiple lives but it's still mostly permadeath when you game over, except for the system of unlocking races/classes/alternate skill trees

mystery dungeon games usually have some permadeath-evasion shit like mechanics that let you keep items between runs

>>165851134
configure your autopickup properly then anon
you can use regexes and shit, its pretty robust

>>165834383
Frozen Depths

>>165864660
oh you mean like that donor incentive in ToME that lets you keep items between runs?

MD games have a bank and item storage. You can store your cash and items in there for a later run. Thing is, you keep nothing if you die. It's not permadeath evasion - if you win, you get to keep your reward so you don't start with zilch the next run. Each run resets you to level 1 and you get nothing to start out save 1 food ration. If you played well enough, you can give yourself a starting bonus, from the stuff you kept from the previous run. Even then, that's only in story mode - once you clear your way through that crap, or not bother with it at all, it becomes a regular roguelike where all dungeons force reset you to lv. 1 and no equipment.

Think of it like permadeath whether you win or lose, but without character selection, and if you win you get to have equipment on your next run (story mode only).

>>165864797
I think >>165851134's point was that wands (in trunk and onwards) are now mostly/entirely pointless, besides digging.

As someone who previously defended them...I can't disagree. Wands, by design, are weak; it takes fairly high skill for them to be useful against even moderate threats. And yet, very few species have good aptitudes for Evocations: the ones that do tend to get more firepower out of magic (Spriggans, Deep Dwarves, and Kobolds), along with their melee skills. So, you'll very often be dumping XP into a skill that could have more use somewhere else.

Like I said, I'm a fan of wands. Removing them entirely would be a mistake, but right now, it's not the worst idea...

IMHO:
* Removing the overpowered self-wands (hasting, heal wounds, tele) was a good idea.
* Unless the average aptitude for Evocations improve (and there's little in-universe reason for that), then Evocations should be abandoned as a skill.
* Wands should istead scale with, say, your XL or perhaps nothing. But, importantly, they should be heavily buffed (and also have much fewer charges).
* Wands should be rarer; recharging scrolls could either be much rarer or about the same (depending on if wands should even be considered for extended game use, which I'm not entirely against).

In my ideal vision, wands would be strong and powerful panic buttons in the early game (a huge boost to, say, a mage who finds an early wand) but become less relied on as the game progress, partially due to their rarity and limited charges.

>>165867627
oh yeah i forgot about that tome donor thing
it's pretty bullshit

alright i'll concede that MD is probably more roguelike than tome4

>>165864223
>obscure
Obscure is their damage calculations. Obscure is the number by which an amulet of inaccuracy decreases your to-hit. Obscure is the lines of code which prevent AoE effects from hitting outside your field of vision even if their AoE is sufficient to do so.

Obscure was not the water-shock mechanic, since it had an animation and a message related to it.

>>165867854
OR, here me out here, this is a crazy, radical idea that is probably going to get me a lot of flack, there could be some sort of higher power, something above the player, a sort of 'god', if you will, that is dedicated towards wands. They might, potentially, give the player a boost towards using wands, rewarding the player for using them, and allowing the player to perhaps build a character around using wands.

I also have this crazy idea that makes no sense, but it involves that same higher power, and that higher power uses your evocations skill instead of invocations, and gifts you cards that you can do all sorts of crazy things with, simply by evoking them. But that's just crazy talk, a fever dream.

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Well then.

>>165867971
To be fair, what I said applies mainly to Shiren the Wanderer MD games, Pokemon MD games are a different beast entirely since Pokemon can't have permadeath, and who knows about the other, untranslated MD games.

>>165868430
You can hop out of there, can't you?

>>165868182
yeah you knew it existed once it happened to you in a game
it was still obscure because t was so rarely relevant and DIDN'T happen to most players,

>>165868592
Yep, pretty rad mechanic. But otherwise feels like naga 2.0, no constriction edition. Do Barachians evolve at a certain XL or something?

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So are Wutugu and Mulu not Stronghold-exclusive? I've done about 30 recalls and nothing yet.

HELP ME ROGUELIKE

THIS GENERAL IS THE CLOSEST THING TO AN RPG GENERAL ASIDE FROM ROGUELITE

I JUST PLAYED LISA THE PAINFUL, LISA THE JOYFUL, OFF, AND UNDERTALE

NOW I NEED MORE RPGS TO SATISFY MY THIRST

WHAT ARE SOME RECOMMENDATIONS?!?!?!?

>>165868923
The Binding of Isaac: Antibirth
Enter the Gungeon
Nuclear Throne
Final Fantasy XV

>>165868923
Adom, Elona, OWH, CoQ, CDDA

>>165868923
Slashem Extended
MaiDenSnow Eve

>>165868835
>babble still alive
all you need is some ?forestcreation and a poison needle anon
and i guess enough hp/healing to survive doubleturn psychospear but i think you're gonna be fine on that front

>>165868923
One Way Heroics is short, easy to get into and has a lot of possible endings.

>>165869316
Did it while you were formulating your post. Still no real solution for Talos. Off to search for the southerings in orc.

>>165869495
>The Serpent of Chaos casts Summon Uniques!
>but nobody came...

>>165869643
Unicorn can create clones of dead uniques
IDK if J can do the same

>>165868835
>So are Wutugu and Mulu not Stronghold-exclusive?
They are only in stronghold, and are rather rare since they only appear OOD.

Talos you have to use archery or smack him in melee, probably not worth the effort if you can even hit him.

>>165870779
Anon's playing a lich, right?
For talos surely you'd just try to get a decent-size pile of summoners and a staff of restore mana then walk around a corner and wait for 9999 turns as the ever-growing pack of dudes tickles him to death
he can't heal-self and he can only summon aid if he ISN'T currently getting gangbanged by a room full of LVWZ
also you wanna go into the pet menu and disable "allow use attack spells" so your liches wont waste time trying to cast spells at him

>>165871201
He hits to shatter, though, so keeping your pets alive might be difficult.

>There's no spell to regenerate mana in PCB as a sorcerer

That's pretty shitty. I have all the spells, but once my SP are finished I'm a qulythug.

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>>165870779
One of them spawned FINALLY

probably took about 50+ recalls

>>165871972
Don't you get eat magic ability eventually?

Also regeneration in general increases mana regen, so the regeneration spell in craft or life will help.

>>165872205
>Also regeneration in general increases mana regen
That's not gonna help when when I gotta spam herbal healing for 60 SP a pop and mana storm for 50

>>165869962
If the unicorn can, the serpent must be able to do that too. They use the same "summon uniques" spell.

>>165868791
one more range for the hop at 13 or so

tips for newfucks for poschengband?

>>165871467
the trick is getting a critical mass of summonerssummoningsummoners so that as the unique kills them they're constantly getting replaced with new bodies

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>>165871972
Don't they get eat magic after level 25? Also regeneration equipment affects SP regen in a big way.

>>165871972
you get 'eat magic' so you can just suck off your wands/staffs/rods for mana
it's not a spell it's a power, so press O or U depending on vikey settings

>>165872846
>>165872814
Alrighty then

>>165872205
>>165872814
My own post clone! Now neither of us will be virgins!

>>165872515
yeah but PCB spells are often special-cased to have different effects based on the caster

e.g. Artemis has the same "shoot arrow" spell as a halfling slinger but she shoots 4 arrows instead of one and they're unreflectable

Anons, I want to punch things. What's a good and semi-idiotproof monk? Ideally PCB, but other stuff's fine.

>>165873212
Troll Fighter in dcss, using Unarmed Combat. You can do Troll Monk too, but the fighter has better starting gear and classes don't matter too much in crawl.

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The first refugee center mission is pretty easy.
The leader, Sean Mc Laughlin should be zombie brute or shocker brute, not shocker zombie.
Shocker zombie is a joke.
Nevermind, I'll edit it myself.

>>165873212
Tonberry monk is the meme combo.

What are some roguelikes where all the character "creation" happens during play? Brogue for example, there's no class or race selection, there's no stats. You build your character as you play based on the things you pick up.

>>165873212
Demigod (or pick your preferred race) monk of life/nature is literally one of the easiest combos in the game.

>>165872978
although looking at the code it looks like the ability to summon clones of dead uniques is actually just tied to being above level 98, So J, Morgoth, Unicorn, and GCAWDLs can all do it

it's a 1/3 chance to happen if they dont get any alive uniques from the casting, otherwise it summons something else like angels or greater undead
and it can only rez uniques who are over level 70

Turns out that Freelancers can grab Death (for assorted genocides) /Nature for herbal healing, wall of stone/detection spell etc/Trump (teleport away/dimension door/teleport/ various summons), which is impossible as any other combo except for sorcerers, which are really horrible for a ton of other reasons.
But they have no way to regen SP as Sorcerers can. Also they're an experimental class, so it feels like cheating.
In the end I guess it's always psions who get the upper hand with these things with their ability to deal 600+ damage, heal for 600+, regen SP by the truckload, haste and god knows what else.

>>165873212
Yeek monk of nature.

>>165873212
Dont listen to the anons telling you to pick any race that isn't Tonberry. It synergizes amazingly with Monk's large number of blows and gives you great damage without the tonberry's normal item-reliance (needing to find +attacks weapons).

Nature is a great realm because it's chock full of utility spells, giving you resists, mapping, detection, and eventually clairvoyance and a sizable heal. Monk (especially tonberry monk) doesn't need any damage from their spellbooks because they're good at punching things.

>>165873978
>you feel confused. You stumble. You drink a potion of cure critical wounds. The lich spams confusion now that he knows you're weak to it! You keep spamming !CCW. You have no more !CCW. Your staff of teleport has burnt away fifteen turns ago when you didn't up your elemental resistance to get 3 pips of RF. What a noble sacrifice!

>>165874731
you drink a potion of speed and THEN the potion of CCW. since youre faster than the badguy you'll eventually doubleturn him and be able to quaff->tele

also dont stay in fights if your _tele gets destroyed, thats just dumb

>>165876090
>tfw i never get doubletummed irl

>tfw qud has double arms, double legs, double muscles, and double head mutations but no double tum

>>165876741
you could mod it in

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This always happens when I play monks.

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Second refugee center mission - Missing Caravan mission cleared.
Meh, they don't even have guns.
Well, at least now I don't get morale penalty for killing bandits and thugs, even without Psychopath trait.
-400 morale penalty for killing human being is fucking annoying.

>>165878824
that isn't a good weapon though?
you've probably found plenty of better ego weapons already

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Hey guys, just escaped with the orb for the first time! MiBe with good drops sealed the deal I guess.

However, it's hard for me to get past the lair on any caster character. I feel like I never get any decent spells to deal with all the enemies.
I've tried DeCj hundreds of times and can never get past Lair 6. I get battlesphere up and running and still end up getting rekt.
Should I worship Sif Muna instead of Vehumet?

Also, what's the best start for a spellcaster? Air,Earth,Fire,Ice or Venom? Fuck being a wizard.

>>165879151
Certainly not great, but far and away better damage than anything else I'd found. Second best was something like a garbage craft spear.

>>165879451
like it's actually better damage when you wield it? because a 4d5 weapon is gonna do less damage than a regular 2d5 sword with an elemental brand except against resistant shit, but on strongold:15 you dont care about that yet
unless you just havent found anything with a non-shitty to-dam enchantment

>slays and brands aren't cumulative, only the most effective variation is used
Just like that, my desire to play a Deathsword has died.

>>165879256
Have you tried a DjCj/FE/AE^Mak? Vehu and Sif also work, too, so it's just a matter of who you encounter first. Dj are the easiest way to learn2spellcaster.

>>165879256
Wizard>ice>fire>earth>air=venom

to win as a spellcaster you MUST stop being a tablord

>>165867854

This could be remedied by removing Ranged Weapons entirely (except for monsters) because they encourage kiting and is better than Evocations by a large margin. There you go, no need to buff Evocations; that's like 3 (three) goblins in 1 large rock.

>>165879759
The regular ele brands do more than double damage? I'm going to have to pay more attention to that next time I play a non-monk.

Also, do shields on monks have some hidden drawback? Seems like it's just the usual weight one. I was expecting it to negate all my double kicks and the like.

>>165881639
yes anon, most brands are x3 damage vs nonresistant, super-general ones like slay evil/living are x2, *slay* drac/undead is x5

note that brands only multiply damage from the weapon's DICE, not any +dam bonus from enchantment or slaying gear or tonberryness. this is why brands are more effective on big-dice weapons. Ringil is 5d5 but effectively 10d5 vs evil and 15d5 vs non-cold resistant enemies.

as a monk you get an AC bonus for leaving slots empty, but other than that and the weight limit there's no downsides to using a shield

>>165881307
I'm playing on the current Crawl engine, I think Dj's are obsolete.

>>165881393
You're telling me Wizard is a better start than a conjurer? Wizard only has good utility, but it lacks any hard hitting spells. Sure you can probably get by with conjure flame and mephitic cloud, but it would be a struggle until you find another book.

>>165881595

Ranged weapons is currently suffering from the past Pakellas problem of having unlimited charges except it's worse. It encourages kiting because the ammos/charges are practically unlimited instead of a feature that is only used to gain advantage for a moment while swapping to melee once the enemies are in range because the resource should have been limited. The solution for Ranged weapons is not to mulch enemy ammo because Okawaru and Trog still exists and both of them are not going to get removed any time soon therefore its only salvation is to get removed.

>>165882630
>I'm playing on the current Crawl engine,
I could give you a version that has Djinn if you want, you could l2spells on it and then go back to the current Crawl once you get the hang of it.