/domg/ - Dominions General

First for aboleth traps

From other thread,
What is the best way to clears mass undead?

2nd for Ulm did nothing wrong

>>161434767

Earthquake.

Firestorm

Rain of Stone

>>161433336
Pythium is actually best against Ermor in the early game, since with Thaum 1 they can do communioned banishment. In a try-hard duel vs Ermor, that's what I'd pick. Awakesnake, cash scales, spam forts, communicants (usually bad, but good for this situation) and rain down level X banishment

>>161434812
Good old Ulm, always stuck playing the Third Reich.

>>161434878
I suppose.

Pythium, Sceleria and Marignon can all do it, just Pythium has their communion special units.

Early game against undead it's really just anyone who doesn't have good priests has trouble with them, otherwise, send priests.

>>161434767
Earthquake, Rain of Stones. A good stopgap (or alternative, if the undead are ethereal) is Solar Rays.

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>>161429874
I'm truly scared

I'm surprised there are no battlefield wide spells for undead, since there are several that affect only living units.

>>161435465
>there are no battlefield wide spells for undead
undead mastery would like to have a world

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>>161435465
But there are? Mainly from holy paths and/or offensive but still?

>>161435552
Sorry, I meant to damage undead. I mentioned mass control in the last thread.

>>161435695
solar brilliance

>>161435751

Also blinds fucking everyone.

>>161435908
>not massing blindfighters

>>161435751
but it also blinds all your units(?)

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>>161435695
If you are that guy who picked a fight with me using a 1000+ stack of manikins last turn: Having very good fire resistance and not being an undead who will turned to dust under the grace of the sun will be your best friends.

>>161435973
lolwut?

>>161435049
Well, in addition to the communicants, Pythium's magepriests are also the cheapest. Marignon has the advantage of fire elementals (which are REALLY fuckin' nice, even at level 3) but that takes some gem prep and research time whereas ginormous banishment coms come online within just a few turns.

im excited

Someone please trade Fire gems with me, I have every other gem available

>>161429785
>Remember that any price offered by the market is, by definition, fair.
The utility of gems etc is objective in Dominions 4. It's defined by the game engine, not by our subjective preferences: there are only so many ways to conquer provinces, win games etc, and some methods are more effective at doing so than others.

Hey Admin, can you delete Lines 11088 to 11197 (inclusive) of Summod. There's a bug that's deleting all my sacreds as soon as they're recruited, which kind of sucks.

>>161435959
True, but other battlefield wide spells damage and kill your units.

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>Stale turn when I was sure I submitted turn 7 early
>Lost a turn in the all important expansion phase which now puts me at a heavenly disadvantaged position against Utgard, who already has a throne
Enjoy fighting against nip AI I guess

>>161436732
Don't be a bitch anon

>>161436645
A. No, that's literally impossible.
B. How on earth?

So, undead specific has
Darkness,
Wind of death
Bone Grinding
Rigor Mortis
Wailing Winds (conditionally since not all undead have 50 moral)

For anti-undead you have Solar brilliance which blinds everyone.

Seems legit.

>>161437000
ravenous swarm too

>>161437076
I heard that's total shit but I haven't tried it.

>>161437000
Bone Grinding hurts undead too, my dude. So does Wind of Death. There's also other things immune to Rigor Mortis and Darkness (or even benefit explicitly from Darkness).

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>>161436534
me too, time to see if tartarians live up to the hype

>>161436979
A. It is possible, you just need to e-mail Llama to edit the version of the mod that the server uses
B. s u m m o d

>>161436979
Near as I can tell, it's deleting them due to the lack of Second Sun, or it's thinking that I'm pledge to a different cult.

I built my entire plan around the Sun Cult, so this kind of sucks.

I miss t. Pan. Why did you all have to be so mean to him?

>>161437463
I don't miss him.

>>161437463
t. t. Pan

>>161437463
forgot my name

>>161437213
wind of death specifically says living beings. It applies Decay which doesn't affect undead.

>>161437575
I've seen it kill longdead mang.

>>161437575
>He thinks Decay doesn't affect undead
Okay, I can see that you're new. That's fine. When you want to figure out what a spell does, your best bet is to read the spell's effects on the mod inspector, which you can find in the OP. Some of the effects are not explicitly clear from the spell description.

WoD in particular is actually quite good against certain kinds of massed undead, such as Longdead, LA Agartha's Iron Corpses, and Corpse Constructs because these undead have intentionally low MR.

>>161437575
>Decay which doesn't affect undead.
Incorrect! Decay can and does affect undead, it just tends to wear off before it actually kills them.

>>161437667
longdeads have an age of ~200 out of 500, so unless you're using against some sort of enemy that has super high magic resistance and hundreds of years left it's not going to happen

>>161437575
>>161437762
Oh, and discussing spell effects that you're trying to figure out is totally great and helpful, but you seem to be making an implication wrt balance here >>161437000 which is triggering to some terrible autists like me that care about arguing that sort of thing.

>>161437894
Decay lasts until it is resisted. Given their very low MR, undead are very unlikely to resist it. There is a long time period after the end of the battle where decay and similar effects continue to tick. You can sometimes see the little numbers popping up super fast after a battle is over. As a result of this, WoD and other decay effects can and will age undead to death. I encourage you to try out these and other spells in your game! You may be surprised to find that spells that you had previously discounted are, in fact, quite useful.

>>161437762
sperg detected

>>161438194
Just trying to help out our new friends. Dominions has a lot of opaque mechanics, so it's helpful to point people in the right direction for figuring out how things actually work.

>>161438092
Ok, good point, I'll update my list.

So, undead specific has
Darkness,
Bone Grinding
Rigor Mortis
Wailing Winds (conditionally since not all undead have 50 moral)
Wind of death (conditionally since some undead may age to death)

For anti-undead you have Solar brilliance which blinds everyone.

Should I play this game if I like Dwarf Fortress?

>>161438450
Again, Darkness is not undead-specific (there are other things with darkvision and even things with dark power), Bone Grinding hits undead (weaker v ethereal stuff which, again, isn't always undead, but great against massed chaff like longdead), and Rigor Mortis doesn't affect lifeless units like elementals and golems.

In other words, everything that you listed is conditionally not undead-only. Furthermore, a lot of spells that do hit living things too are particularly good against undead given their normally low HP and prot.

>>161438513
This game is a lot more complex than DF.
Especially considering DFs complexity is 80% shitty interface in all its forms.


But all the people that I know that like one like the other, so maybe? Sure.

>>161438450
While it may not be battlefield clearing Wither Bones is very effective, especially communioned.

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>>161438513
graphics are too advanced compared to dwarf fortress you wouldn't enjoy the new modern look

>>161438513
This game has a much shallower learning curve than Dwarf Fortress and the graphics are several decades ahead. The only real things they have in common are dwarves and fortresses.

>>161438513
It is nothing like dwarf fortress mechanically but if you like the setting of DF then you will like the setting of Dominions.

>>161438786
>dwarves
I mean, I guess. CoE has an actual dwarf nation (which, conceptually, I actually quite like but in practice is shit like most everything in CoE), but that's also a rather different game

>>161437193
Maybe Drain dominion pushes its MR higher?

>>161438863
Yeah this game's dwarves are much less Tolkien style than standard fantasy fare, but I like it that way.

>>161439005
Pretenders also have high base MR so there's a high chance it just resists it

>>161438664
What is the longest hair you think you could split evenly in half?

>>161438705
But then there's also cloud of death, and you get into a completely different back and forth.

>>161436732
>Join a weeb game
>Play a weeb nation
>Go AI at the first inconvenience

Shamefur dispray.

>>161439105
If you want to list out spells that are generally better for undead than living folk in one column, feel free to fill the other side with spells that are generally better to deploy against massed undead than standard armies. Or you can realize that this whole argument is retarded and go on your way having learned a little about spell effects.

>>161436732
Are you serious dude? Turn 8 AI?
Did you at least lose your god or something? Because god damn

>>161439083
Also being in its own dominion boosts MR by a fair bit, depending on Dominion.

>>161439161
Not only that, it's a noob game, so a bunch of people probably lost an expansion army by now.

Please help I'm retarded.

I accidentally filtered my Research screen and I don't know how to turn it off. I don't even have any Earth Mages, why can I only see Earth Magic?

>>161436732
>Being afraid of utgard
literally worst age of frost giants

>>161439390
>noob game
Malakal would disagree with that

>>161439492
Haha nigga just smash that "e" again. And check that caps lock.

>>161439390
Well at least he isn't just LOLstaling!

>>161439524
85g nether darts casters, I guess? At least their research is better than EA's

>>161439561
I N N O V A T I V E
N
N
O
V
A
T
I
V
E

pfft, you just got INNOVATED on kiddo

>>161438786
This game, shallower? DF is easy as hell and doesn't ever really get too complex. Almost all of its difficulty is having a godawful archaic clunky interface that requires third party software to properly even use and parse without difficulty. Then ASCII being a relic from the 90s (ASCII is cool and all but damn) makes it even worse. Once you figure out the literal basics of the game, there really isn't much to it beyond discovering random autism like cats soaking up beer into their fur and then drinking it and dying of alcohol overdosing.

This game has way more going on.

>>161438863
God, I love the dwarves in CoE.

They're just beautiful ants. It's the best.

>>161439243
There's no need to be upset.

>>161439852
There's a version of ME that is.

>>161439965
fite me irl faget ill fukin drop u m8

>>161438513

Dwarf Fortress is a game for autists with too much time on their hand

This game is a multiplayer game for autists with too much time on their hands.

So in that respect you will like it.

FUCK

>>161440348

What's up vampy? Life got you downs syndrome?

>>161440469
Staled while I was moving house while I was sick ;_; very bad day ;_;

>>161439937
Shallower learning curve. You can pick up Dominions and begin playing right away.
Dwarf Fortress is really unintuitive at first. The UI is horrible, there are so many different mods and shit you need to work out before you can even get started, and even then you need to keep looking things up in a guide, you can't figure anything out as you go along. Even if the overall depth may be less, the curve is much steeper.

>>161440820
Hmm, I guess that's a fair way of looking at it. I was just putting more of "The rest of the game" into that learning curve.

I did need to read a quick guide on how to get started on DF to play it, but once I did that I basically figured everything out. That damn interface.
I didn't start reading guides for doms until after a bit, so that part was easy - but I haven't figured everything out at all.

What sort of pretender do you guys like for MA R'lyeh? Any advice would be appreciated! <3

>>161441759
Heavy scales awake expander or N9E2+

>>161441912
Should I go for erf snek, or void lord or kraken or? And, N9 and earth for what reason, specifically?

>>161442089
You need E2 for boots to put on your E random slave mages. That gets you crystal gear and golems. You can get the required E from an awake expander anyways, but it's not automatically included on an N build.

N9 is for making late game golem and tart stuff better.

>>161442089
Anyways, kraken, snek, and wyrm all expand fine and all naturally take the E you want. Water dragon works for expanding too, but you either miss out on E or pay a ton more for it. Assuming that you're playing with summod, the aquatic thing isn't as big of a liability as it is in vanilla. The exact of which one you want depends on what paths and scales you want. Void lord can expand too and can also become an SC midgame which is cool, but it comes with a notable scales hit since it's a more expensive chassis and has the same lack of E as the water dragon.

>>161442238
I'm not sure I'll be able to vie for Gift of Health with Pan in the game. Assuming that's the help with golem/tarts. And how can I expect to cast tartarian gate with at most a native D3 (Generally going to be D2) via Starspawn? And can't Starspawn get E2 to forge boots of earth anyways?

>>161442238
>>161442648
Can't the cap-only starspawn come with E2? I don't think you need to add it to your pretender.

>>161442648
I'm not playing with Summod. Sorry for not clarifying earlier. Yeah, the Void Lord looks nice, but having more scales just seems the safe choice. Speaking of scales... T3L3M3? Or Order3 Mis2?

>>161442671
It's the bless itself that you want. The capacity to fight for GoH is a bonus. R'lyeh has native ring access (well, with crystal coin) which makes boosting D easy and makes getting additional tart summoners possible without empowerment.

>>161442732
yes, but unlike S5 which you can wait and amass pearls for, you NEED access to crystal gear and golems. Rings are a useful bonus by comparison.

>>161442793
Oh. In that case, an amphibious pretender is important if you take an awake. You don't need A the way that EA r'lyeh does since your mages are at least amphibious, but you can't take a kraken or sea dragon

I prefer Order on account of the need for max cash, but I also don't like misf since you can safely dump temp scales and sloth.

>>161443050
>needing A for EA rlyeh
look at this non-sum1mod scrub

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>>161443125
>>>>161442793
>>>I'm not playing with Summod.

Here's a nation for you might like.

>have huge amount of research
>demilich
>cast burden of time
>cast darkness
>wish armageddon
>still lose
what

>>161443242
I don't give a shit about your little remark since your discussion is about MA rleyh, I'm simply putting out playing EA rlyeh without sum1mod is pretty dumb as a passing remark

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>>161442793

>>161443380
Thanks for this boring piece of shit.
... <3

>>161443050
Thank you. I'll go full jew route.

>>161443358
If you take, say, a big dumb snek or ghost kang, you can put up a coastal fort and start recruiting amphibian mages. It's not THAT unplayable.

>>161443259
Explain.

Please watch the Magic Pumpkin:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJ2PCJChsjo

>>161443648
I took out almost the entire world's population and somehow died. Then it said that I couldn't come back and that the other player won by default.

>>161443769

you likely got domkilled

Black candles bad

White candles good

all black candles no-one believes in you you go away

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>>161443851
Well fuck. How could I have prevented that?

>>161443990
More temples, preaching, blood sacrifices

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http://www.llamaserver.net/gameinfo.cgi?game=Conjunction

>http://www.llamaserver.net/gameinfo.cgi?game=Conjunction

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>>161444095
>Summod
>All the cancer nations taken

You sure about this Goshujin-sama?

>>161444520
Which of those nations are cancer?

>>161444607
>http://www.llamaserver.net/gameinfo.cgi?game=Conjunction

Narus for the Obvious reasons (laughs)
Ys for their long bless
Jotunheimu and Abysia for Blood
Caelum for glorious Nihon bird (VERY important)
Marignon for Nation
C'tis for... well, on a deeper look into nation it seems like poison, fog, miasma... all kind of unpleasant things. It should present itself well?

>>161444607
>Ys
Marignon
>C'tis
>Vanarus
>Abysia
>Jotunheim
>Caelum

>>161444890
Those all sound like fun to me kouhai

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BEING TRACKED BY A STARVING BEAST
LOOKING FOR ITS DAILY FEAST
A PREDATOR ON THE VERGE OF DEATH
CLOSE TO ITS LAST BREATH

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>>161445512
It has to be this way.

>>161439005
>>161439083
>>161439329
Missed the thread change, Sorry poorly worded question, I haven't cast it yet just wondering about factors that would apply as this may be my only chance to so easily kill it with it being alone without the protection of astral mages with it.

Whats the calculation(and chance) on if he'd resist the spell? I haven't gotten to that part of the manual yet. I understand spell penetration helps vs high MR?

>>161429637
>>161436557
Sure, I could trade some fire gems away.

Shall we discuss details in chat?

>>161429689
What did dwarves ever do to you?

>>161446363
Manlets tbfqh...

If I'm sieging a fort, can I cast Flames from the Sky to hit the army inside?

>>161446518
u will just hit ur own m8s thats 4 sure m8.

>>161446752
Are you sure? That doesn't seem right.

>>161447331
The spell just creates a neutral event, it doesn't care about the allegiance of the caster.

>>161434878
The best nation against undead would probably be Ulm or Agartha due to Earthquake spam.
Battlefield wipe spells usually trump spamming evos and banishment

>>161447560
>in the early game
Talking a small-map duel my dude

>>161447636
Earthquake is pretty early

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>>161447749
Not earlier than I have my Mass Flight ready,

>>161447813
How would Ermor even cast that.

>>161448230
Well, when they trash their scales, they can either go with a Tribless, a badass awake expander, or a pretender with the paths necessary to summon the necessary elemental royalty.

>>161448230
I've cast it with indy S mage com slaves

>>161448230
Communions. Crystal stuff helps a lot to pull it off turn 1.

It seems that Lemuria receives freespawn on enemy forts with temples inside of them when it has dominion on them. Most curious.

sum1won please explain yourself

http://www.pictaram.com/user/summod/3038903727

>>161449928
Vaype Nayshun

>>161449928

Literally what's wrong with Vaping?

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>>161444095
I might just change the map and start, but I'll give it a couple more days.

>>161451149
Thursday?

>>161451818
Sure lets say Thursday as an official start date

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>>160927076
>The next person to meaningfully attack Mathosia gets 3000 gold. By meaningful I mean you need to actually fight a battle of decent size or vulture a pair of forts.
>Post the proof in this thread and I will send the stuff.

Oh yeah if that bounty is still up for grabs I'd like to claim it

>>161440718
Should have asked for an extension.

>>161453948
CLAMDOWNBUDDY

>>161453948
That's a lot of ded xbows.

>>161453948
>says a nation under siege in its own capital

>>161453948
I warned you about statues bro

>>161454560
Not to mention mage support

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>>161454480
Do you see "our forces X" in the report?

>>161454560
Funny thing is, they didn't even reach the statue.

>>161449928
Yeah, that's not me. Summod, the dominions 4 mod, is the only place I use that term. (Half for the handle I use for dominions, and half because it started by mashing together a bunch of mods I liked).

>>161455785
Can you recommend a good vape shop in NYC? Asking for a friend.

>>161454704
Romans strong!

>>161453948

W E W

Funny thing is that my pretender is almost a year late. He literally wakes up the turn I get stormed.

To sleep is human, to wake up right when your senpai needs you: divine

>>161455905
40.7121911,-74.0016747

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guck you too, sum1

>>161460654
Forester Bob btfo

Sorry, ghosts, this is my cap circle. And I have magic weapons too, so please fuck off back to UW.

>>161443380

Order 3 Luck 3? Really?

I can see splashing Luck 1, because misfortune spirals fucking suck, but you'd be better going Order 3 Magic 3 for the better research.

Maybe want stronger dominion, as well.

>>161436732
>>161439390
I've already lost two expansion armies to my innovative strategy! =)

>>161461631
>tfw 6000 gold from events

>>161461631
The reduced event chances from order effect is very, very minor compared to the event shift from Luck. Order always being coupled with misf is a meme from people that see the synergy and never bothered actually seeing how it affects your game.

>>161462827
This.
Order Luck events are good too, permanent income increases on provinces, thousands of gold in events, free armies

>>161461631
>>161462827
I mean, I've won numerous games with Order 3 Mis 2. Sure, I've had some provinces lost due to events, but nothing has been crippling.

Speaking of Luck, I haven't gone through the events in detail.

Are there any scale combinations that lead to particularly interesting events?

>>161463182
That doesn't make the scales you chose better. You probably could have won with Turmoil/Luck or Order1 neutral or Order 3 Luck 3 and reduced scales from elsewhere because the difference in gold from picking worse scales is vastly less important than skill. Hurting yourself by taking misf and winning anyways doesn't make it an optimal build.

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RULES OF NATURE

this was a lot closer than the stats imply

>>161463294
That's true, but it doesn't necessarily prove that any of those iterations would be better or worse for each game. I've won a game with T3L3 as well, but it seems most of my games I go with O3Mis2. Of course, I'd love to pick whatever is optimal for each situation, and I'm fine with picking something odd or unconventional here.

>>161462827
>The reduced event chances from order effect is very, very minor compared to the event shift from Luck.
Event frequency reduction from order is -2% (whatever that means) per scale. Event frequency increase from luck is 5% (again, whatever that means) per scale.

Full Luck and Order scales is 9% event frequency increase, compared to 15% at Order0, and 24% at Turmoil3. Those are pretty big differences.

You could at best argue that event frequency % has an insignificant effect.

>Order always being coupled with misf is a meme from people that see the synergy and never bothered actually seeing how it affects your game.
Pretty sure that's mainly because Order is a very valuable scale and Misfortune is a fairly safe scale to dump. The synergy is nice, but I'd still take them together without the event reduction from Order. You likely see Misfortune/Growth often for the same reason.

and that's the last time i bring a devata into a battle as a thug

what a waste of gems

>>161463472
>24% at Turmoil3
21%, my bad.

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So, the elves are now at war with TC and Eriu. Having attacked both of them. Anyone that borders them and isn't at war with them yet better take action, or else soon they'll eat another 2 or 3 caps and will be completely unstoppable.

>>161463472
Yep. I like blood-hunting nations, generally, and O3 is a staple. Since I'm always hunting for more points in pretender design, Misfortune just seems a safe pick. So long as it's not Mis3 or Misfortune with Drain.

>>161463537
Eriu was a misclick. And TC was dying to Rus and Machaka anyway. I just took what I could.

>>161463430
I'm saying that O3L3 gives you a lot more dosh than O3/L0. A lot of a lot more. That's essentially it. The problem is that we don't have actual numbers for events over a large number of games and turns so I can't quantify it. The only testing that I know of was doing a few levels of misfortune and spamming end turn, which showed that O2/Misf 1 had more total money (just money, not counting events) than O3/Misf 2, but it was only one run. Given that it was just the capital, it should be even more dramatic with more provinces.

>>161463472
>The reduced event chances from order effect is very, very minor compared to the event shift from Luck.
By event shift I mean the shift in the value of events. The way that luck works is that there's a spectrum of uncommon good-common good-common bad-uncommon bad. Luck shifts it towards good, misf shifts it towards bad. This means that luck doesn't just mean more good events and fewer bad events, it means more better events and fewer worse events.

>>161452818
You'll be 3000 gold richer this turn.

>>161463605
>just money, not counting events
I meant not counting gems with this

thank god this shit is finally over

i did nothing but forge artifacts the whole game

>>161463680
Wait, what?

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>>161463605
I have points for 3 scales with this. L2M1? M3?

>>161463605
I know that Sy swears by luck too, but I'm pretty sure that's just because he runs Luck 3 IRL

>>161463680
All I did was summon disease demons and job to White. I was finally starting to get my vampire train going as well. Ah well, it was good experience for future blood nations.

>>161463725
Are you the only UW nation?

I'd prob go Luck1/Mag 2 or vice-versa since 1/1 unlocks some more events. You can also go sloth 1 or lower dom and then go 1/3 for even more gem events.

>>161463680
>thank god this shit is finally over
Agreed.
Cataclysm is kind of a headache.

>>161463829
I am. I think going sloth is a good idea, though I dislike that it lowers my income. Only disadvantage is there's multiple nations that dislike cold, and not going cold 3 makes me sad. But I don't want my poor snek to get all chilly.

>>161463845
Wasnt there talk of another one with semi-natgen nations after this one or something?

>>161463539
More gold is useful for anyone, too.

>>161463605
>Given that it was just the capital, it should be even more dramatic with more provinces.
Anecdotal evidence (from me, few other people I asked) is that events get less influential as you get more provinces. While you seem to get more events with a large empire, it's not as large an increase as would be expected (i.e. 2x provinces gives less than 2x events)

Suggested reasons why event frequency doesn't seem to scale up linearly with provinces:
>Event frequency drops as turn count increases
>Event frequency is constant, more provinces just spreads out the area over which your events can occur
>Hard limit to number of events (unlikely imo, even in large games I very rarely hit more than 4-5 events in a turn)

This is obviously really hard to test (need to manually gather data from a large number of test games), and I haven't yet gotten around to doing so.

>By event shift I mean the shift in the value of events.
Right, I see. I thought you meant the event chance changes.

>>161463725
Doesn't R'lyeh have cheap S1 mages? Take full magic scales to supercharge your research.

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I won, so I guess I have to post graphs. Oh well.

>>161463929
It does. That's why I was thinking M3 over L3.

>>161463232
Magic + Luck gives you lots of gems , free laboratories and items.

Order + Luck gives you lots of gold , free PD and armies.

>>161463959
Man I sucked.

>>161463980
Death + Luck gives you a few events, including a 2k average gold event and a free wraith lord + retinue of undead

>>161463959
>>161464026
Any final thoughts on Cataclysm?

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I only played 1 Cataclysm MP game before, and for the last one I used some shitty rainbow. Lesson learned. I picked a strong multifunctional bless and good scales (misfortune 2 is manageable, so I often use it in my games) and hoped to get sacreds ASAP and don't get removed by awake expanders. I bet like 600 gold on UW mercs to get the much needed income for capital heavy cav, and it helped me a lot.

I found Oiorpatas near my capital on turn 14 or so, so I had almost no advantage early. Then I met Pink who had Troll Seithberenders (look em up, they're really strong)/Ktonian Reanimators, so I knew that he had to go before he can skelespam effectively. Then there was a second sacred province with Aphroi on the throne to the south of my cap. 28hp aphroi with E9N9 are great against usual Cataclysm shit, so I never stopped making them.

>>161463973
Yeah, a massive research bonus is way more important than events in my opinion. Assuming your mage group is primarily those S1 mages, it gives a 42% increase to your research.

Go for the sloth1/luck1 the other guy suggested and you get a decent number of events as well.

>>161464160
Thanks for the help. <3

REEEE SCOREGRAPHS
Is there any way for Llama to disable them without a restart?

>>161464143
i like the idea behind it but in practice it's very messy and painful to organize

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Skrattis really won me this game though. I would never win that quickly without them (I would've used golem thugs anyway, but early skrattis were just too handy). After finishing off Pink I made a NAP with Grey, hoping that I could kill White faster than him. Luckily, White only made chaff and couldn't do much in terms of late-game spells/thugs. He killed 2 or 3 of my thugs with petrification (a lot of Pans and E9 pretender have some uses), but I could just jump my dudes on his forts without worrying.

>>161464289
n

>>161464143
It was fun but if you dont find anything good its frustrating. This game taught me how versatile blood can be even if I fucked up the execution.
There should definitely be an option to build forts UW I think.

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After white was finished it was easy. I had 2 3-pointers with spring hawks inside my territory, so I just jumped 2 golems with shock resists on them, followed by H3 priests.

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>>161464316

>>161464416
Fucking restart, you piece of filth.

>>161464416
And you shouldn't tell everyone to vote in the thread. Make a strawpoll, and send the link through llamaserver "message to players" function.

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I haven't forgotten about the lore updates or your last post, Murmar. I'm just exhausted from picking up some extra hours so things will be slow the next few days.

>>161464416
This picture is too cute.

major fire bless or major death bless - which is better? I'm talking just about the additional damage bonus.

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>>161467621
F9, of course. D9 is MRN.

>>161467621
fire

>>161467621

It Depends. D9 is 1 AN, MRN untyped with increased affliction chance. F9 is 7 AP fire.

So there's more ways to mitigate F9, but D9 is less reliable to start out.

>>161467839
I thought D9 was 2 damage and F9 was 6?

>>161467839
While that's true, F9 is actually good for earlygame and midgame, whereas D9 is not very good at any part of the game.

F9 at least gives you a good earlygame, D9 won't ever be good.

>>161468067
Yeah, that's correct.

>>161468342
On the other hand, D9 will give you D end-game.

On the yet other hand, D5-6-7 is enough for that too.

>>161468342

Honestly, half of that's just because +Attack is better than +Undying.

Neither of the majors is particularly impressive.

>>161468402
You should've seen how niefel giants melt from F9W9 vanheres. You should've seen.

>>161468427

Oh yeah, it'll fuck up anything with negative fire res right good. That's a bit niche though.

>>161436732
jesus christ, fucking weabs

and I don't even border them

oh wow he actually went AI
pathetic

This is now a 4 v 1, and I fucked up a castle storm.

Congrats to Hinnom on winning Antiquis.

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when does DriftKing start
I waited like a week
this is unacceptable

>>161471259

Thursday.

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>>161471259
>>161471286
>tfw joined yesterday
Now to figure out how to play Lanka

>>161471115
Sick sempter, tyrannosaurus!

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>>161471286
I am absolutely outraged. Let every barkeeper, inn and brothel in Vanheim know that Coolstory is a hack

>>161471424
I submitted Abysia even though I don't know what the fuck to do other than early aggressive expansion. I just don't know what am I supposed to research

>>161470164
Should I go AI too?

>>161471735
Generally the standard approach is to go for conjuration for firepower and then evocation for fireball. Or possibly evo and then conj I cant remember. Either way you will have fairly poor research until you get construction 6 and start shitting out lightness lamps.

I heard somewhere you shouldn't bother with salamanders and just go straight for dragons for your fireball spam and I can confirm a few dragons spamming fireball can do a lot of damage early on.

>>161472010
Everybody should go AI right now.
In every game

>>161471735
>I just don't know what am I supposed to research
Research "how to die gracefully even when I am being entirely rekt" because that's all you're going to be doing.
Punk.

>>161472348
t. Coolstory

>>161472479
Hey, I only shit-talk to people I play with.

>>161471259
We're waiting for the last pretender. Feel free to PM the guy who joined on Steam or gangbang him when we start.

>>161471115
Don't worry, I'll handle Himmon for you.

>>161470164
fucking weabs

>>161471115
Considering this war has left me weaker than I was when I started it, and part of the agreement was Agartha gets all of northern Asia and I stay away from it . . .

Like, if I was getting literally anything from fighting you beyond Poison golems in my land, fucking up my shit, making it so my battle reports bug due to something, something linux something something summod, you might be right.

Currently I'm still trying to figure out how to better support the allies against Germany, since Horror raids seem to be having very little effect now.

>>161471735

I hope for your sake you took Prod 3.

>>161438703
>This game is a lot more complex than DF.
The fuck are you smoking.
Especially considering dom4's complexity is 80% shitty descriptions and scripting limitations.

But yeah there is a lot of overlap in enjoyment.

>>161475312
If you're taking out your only serious rival, the fact that he is doing damage on the way down just means that this is the last chance anyone else has at turning things around. It leaves you in a much better position to win the game than before, even if you lose resources in the process.

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This update has some bug fixes and tweaks as well as some new modding features. It should also fix the sound that stopped working for Mac users that updated to OSX version 10.12.

General
Can change battle log details from battle menu
A few wishes got improved effects
Added a few missing adjustments when viewing strength details
Curse of Stones now affects units when they fly as well
Don't remove slave/master-vessels from overpopulation
Army of rats didn't result in the battle fright it was supposed to
Potential crash during host fix
Memory leak fixed
Description fixes
Stat fixes

Modding
Now possible to start dominions even when a mod is missing its name
New monster commands: #homeshape, #foreignshape, #addrandomage
New monster/item command: #blessfly
Can use #nextspell 0 to remove nextspell
#berserk fix
#slothpower now works for monsters too

Mac OSX changes
Portaudio support
Portaudio is default for OSX 10.12 and later

>>161477105
>Stat fixes
I hope machaka got nerfed again

>>161477105
>A few wishes got improved effects
I'm curious as to what this means. Is "Dominion" more effective? Is "Power" more effective? Is "More population" more effective? Is "Kill [pretender]" more effective?

>>161477052
It seems like you missed the part where other players (mainly Agartha atm from what I've seen) are gaining serious ground, such that sans some real fucking innovation in my strats by the war's end I will have gained little to nothing, and others will have gained much more.

It isn't like I can eat someone in the meantime sans Sauro if he starts stuff, considering one of the caveats was me *not* attacking people unprovoked.

>>161477302

Kill pretender is already fairly reliable. Dominion/Power/Friends getting improved would be nice though.

Fuck it, I'll just test some wishes.

Friends is unchanged. Whole bunch of people appears in a random province. Works on indies.

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Army. I forgot if it was less powerful before tbqh.

>>161478305
It was exactly the same.

>>161477731
Even if you don't expand -which is ultimately unlikely - replacing Ulm with Agartha as a rival is a definite step forward for you.

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I guess it changed one thunderbolts to a few?

>>161477105
>A few wishes got improved effects
>Stat fixes
I sooooo love those verbose and detailed changelogs!

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I have no fucking idea what they changed besides " a few thunderbolts". Everything else looks exactly the same.

>>161479202
Check the 'gems', 'slaves' and 'gold' also 'silver'.

>>161471735
Try not to pick fights with people who can cast rain.
Alternatively pick fights with them immediately and rush them before they get the research.

Yo Sylvania do your turn or ask for an extension.

>>161479953
Dont know why I bothered typing this message out, I know who he is and hes not online.

>>161477731
I guess that means after you Agartha is the next target
:)

>>161479278
Already did. 25 of each, 250, 3k like they were.

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Now you can see what a bunch of frogs, water, imps, and bugs can do giants!

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>>161481301

>>161468427
Fingolfin and Glorfindel proved that berserk elves can kill pretty much anything

>>161477731
Just eat Berry already.

>>161482073
>>161477731
I mean come on, when someone can't beat fucking fire ants, they should just be put out of their misery.

>>161482182

t.whoever is feeding Machaka hundreds of gems to summon more Chaff

He's down on his last legs so I wouldn't exactly call that "struggling"

>>161481394
Wizardly Aid.

>>161464289
I meant to vote yes on the restart

I have sent my turn 5 times since 20 minutes before hosting but for some reason llama didn't get it. No emails back telling me it was the wrong turn or shit, llama just ignored it.


Thanks llama.

>>161477731
>Oh boy, it's another Nicknight win

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Our Ancestors built this wall. Using ancient stones from the bossom of Pythium herself. And with a little Principe help, your scouts provided the mortar.

>>161463959
What. It's over already? I thought I'd get time to cast Astral Corruption and make everyone suffer for a bit. Or at least get eliminated properly.

Well played, Brown. I thought you were going to win, but I had no idea you were so close. You were the one that convinced Green and Aquamarine to attack me, weren't you?

My expansion went very well, but this was my first Cataclysm game and I've only had a couple of Dominions games before this, so I didn't exactly know what I was doing. If I had been more proactive about figuring out how to use all my resources, things might have gone differently.

Still, I had fun, and it was a good learning experience. One of the better games I've been in, though maybe I'm biased because I did pretty well until Green and Aquamarine teamed up against me.

I hope I put up a decent fight, at least.

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>>>161483598

You will PAY, for your BARBARISM!!!

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>>161483656

AAAARGH!

MY ARMY!

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>>161483738

It's not yours anymore.

Go now. Run along and tell your Guy de Lombard that he faces FREE MEN here. Not slaves.

Do it quickly, before we decide to make our wall just a little bit bigger.

>>161483738
What the fuck is with all the militia?

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>>161483793

No... Not slaves. Your women will be slaves. Your sons, your daughters, your elders will be slaves. But not you, no.

By noon this day, you will be dead men!

A thousand crossbows of the Marignese Empire descend upon you!

>>161483795
Peasant levy

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>>161483860

>Our bolts will blot out the sun!

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>>161483931

Then we will fight in the shade.

>>161477731
Yeah, I bet after crippling the biggest threat to you, you definitely won't attack the next biggest threat to you.

>>161477731
Why the ACTUAL fuck do people gang bang the 2nd biggest threat at the behest of the current leader?

This must be that diplomancy we've heard of.

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>>161483793

>>161484829
Shamanistic assistance.

>>161484829
Sorcerous Support

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PRINCIPES

PREPARE FOR GLORY

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>>161485252

A new age has begun.

An age of FREEDOM.

>>161484829
Goetic Gifts.

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>>161485332

AND ALL WILL KNOW

THAT 68 PRINCIPES and 8 Theurgs

GAVE THEIR LAST BREATH

TO DEFEND IT

>>161484524
Literally every single graph sans army size points to either Ulm winning, or being neck and neck with me . . . most in the former category.

I guess the feeling here is that Hinnom is a vastly better nation than Ulm . . . but I'm not seeing it. Sure, Hinnom's endgame is the best aspect about Hinnom - but that's mostly because the other stages of Hinnom's game are uttershit.

Ulm has all 9s (or is extremely close), Tart factories, a percent reduction site he elected to move his Monolith to, income vastly higher than anyone else's (with actual good fucking units to spend it on), and gem income that was competitive to mine before he attacked Vanheim. Also, full magic diversity - but then I have that too for the most part.

I should also note that, upon looking at the mid-EU provinces, I finally found where the income discrepancy was coming from - Euro provinces just have more people period. Even accounting for bloodhunting, I never had 22k pop provinces that *weren't* a capital of some sort.

>>161485367
Warlock Welfare?

>>161485669
Guess we'd better deal with you while you're still in the utter shit phase then :)

>>161485670
Arcane Aid.

>>161485823
Honestly, the single biggest issue is my total lack of viable end game recruitable blood hunters.

Kohens are nice early, sure, but god are they a fucking terrible idea for anything that even remotely looks like it's gonna drag out. Saves other people the trouble of armageddoning the world to turn off my blood I guess . . .

>>161485669
>Hinnom's endgame is the best aspect about Hinnom
Yes
Exactly

This is a giant-ass map, and you are firmly approaching end-game territory. You will soon be unstoppable if you aren't already, and for some unfathomable reason, other players are working towards your win

>>161485976

They haven't tasted the full horror of being under Astral Corruption.

They'll learn.

What's that damn DEF change that mounted units receive? Is it that it's -1 per consecutive hit in a single "turn" rather than -2, or what?
I know they get +3 DEF from being mounted, but I thought there was something else.

>>161485829
Conjurer Charity.

>>161486369
Hermetic Help.

>>161484829

Magnificent

>>161486631
Thaumaturge backing.

I absolutely love this meme.

>>161486631
>>161486754
Augurer Advice.

>>161486865

Augurer Anal Annihilation

>>161486952
Going to need some Magician Ministration after that.

>>161486865
>>161486952
p sure "augur" is the singular and plural noun, fellas.

>>161487386
Its an obsolete word according to the internet but its still a word.

Llama trouble?

Sent my turn in twenty minutes ago, still not showing up as having been received.

>>161485976
Hinnom's end game doesn't need to be *good* to be the best part about them.
They lack recruitable hunters that can be realistically used, have solidly meh recruit unit killiness, if that, se'ir are meh without a bless - and Hinnom cannot really afford a bless on Archaea (no nation that lacks good sacred recruitable units can . . except Xibalba). I've never tried Sheds, but I can't imagine they'd be more efficient than storm demons.

Insofar as recruitable mages go the situation isn't that good either, sans Melqarts - but they're generally less efficient than Vanjarls in the endgame since neither can realistically deal with *any* amount of mage backup, relegating both to thug status.

The Grigori are nice, but their presence is less apparent on a map this size, given their unique status.

I'd actually put Ulm slightly ahead of Hinnom in endgame - though I should note that strictly speaking neither of us are at 'end' game. In Ulm's case he only possesses a middling blood eco. In my case my research is far off from max. But with those equalized, nice as the Grigori are, I'd put the ability to recruit amazing dual wielding infantry just slightly higher.

I extended the time for hosting because Sylvania missed out last time and I felt bad for him but now I see he was online 2 hours ago and we are still waiting. Shame on me I guess.

Just ask for extensions if you need them folks, I dont mind giving extensions but waiting around for staling is mighty annoying.

>>161488010
>recruiting steel maidens is more important in late game than a full blood economy with multiple S/B, E/B, and F/B casters, as well as monster-SCs capable of spamming any of the late game troop summons.
If you have seriously gotten people to believe this, you deserve that win because they are pants-on-head retarded.

>>161488313

I've had people do that to other players in games I've been in.

I remember someone telling LA R'lyeh that the way to deal with Lemuria was recruiting more mindblasters. He actually did it, the absolute madman.

>>161485968
>Guys I'm already leading the game, haven't entered the strongest phase of my nation yet, so please attack the early scales nation because they had good research.

>>161488313
First, good as the Grigori are, correct paths Tarts are better for being SCs. HP is the relevant issue, and Grigori just don't have high enough values. And yes, I did say that the 6 Grigori were Hinnom's main endgame power - 6 on a map of 400+ provinces. As for the S/B, E/B, and F/B casters - my advice is to actually play Hinnom and try to manage the logistics of *using* those casters, moving them around . . and still having provinces to blood hunt. The only reason Hinnom isn't the most frustrating nation I've ever played is because I've played LA R'lyeh.

>full blood economy
That is required for endgame, yes. Ulm's already in blood, he'll have a full scale eco going if unharassed by the time I finish researching.

Seriously, is anyone else noticing issues with llama taking turns?

I've sent mine, but gotten no "Llama has received a turn" message, and am still showing up as waiting for turn on the game's page.

>>161488941

Looks like its stuck again. Imma mail llama.

Therodian Thread.

>>161492716
Thanks, m'ephor.

>>161486160
Both of those are correct.

I sent my turn but the server wont accept it.

>>161494805
Try again, mine just went through for another game.

>>161495230

Got the confirmation after some time but now it doesn't show on the game page.

Guess its just slow.

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Bump.

>>161482849
This puts it at 4-3 in favor of a restart. I voted for a restart as well because it's still early and scoregraphs are cancer, but
>tfw turn 2 Loki

>>161498417
Why are you afraid of people knowing that you're researching Conjuration?

>>161482997
Same problem here with Bob

>>161498627
State secrets desu senpai

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I know she was playing hard to get but shanking 9 of my guys was totally uncalled for, High Elves. If all your PD commanders react like that when confronted with a few horny marauders then it's no wonder that no one ever visits your island. You better improve your hospitality by the time the rest of the gang arrives or we will seriously consider vacationing elsewhere.

>>161499115

Fuck off Slaanesh, we are not lewd.

Go visit the Dark Elves instead, they are exceedingly lewd.

I bought this game on steam sales and it asks for a serial key I don't have. What do?

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>>161499737
Don't you have this option?

noob game when

>>161499737
Go AI

>>161499929
No I do not. I made steam check the game files and it fixed. Thanks.

How do you deal with forts that have mages that can fog warriors/rain of stone spam turn 1?

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>>161499260
That's one of the very few places I can't reach yet.

Got any other trip recommendations?

>>161499260
Sorry, but they're suffering from a rather severe infection right now.

We don't think it'll clear up.

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I officially hate this map.

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This is what I can make per turn. In that case, I'll be going AI as well.

>>161500167
Armor up some mages and cast fire or air elementals.

>>161500167
Use durable troops and let the RoS kill his mage before it kills yours
Cast Fog Warriors yourself, have more dudes.

>>161500587
I was in witch haven first time around. Now I hope I'm not in the caves, expansion is much trickier there.

>>161500752
Well that's due to your scales. I have practice a few expansion builds extensively enough that I memorized the best t1 recruits. It doesn't change based on where you are..

>>161499929
>>161499737
Is there a way to increase font and unit icon size? They are very tiny

>>161501142
See, at least I could've gotten some resources from surrounding provinces to recruit more shit. Now it's gonna be much harder. I bet it's a heavy cav province. Pls god, don't be a heavy cav province.

Well, last time I started 1 tile away from Therodos too.

>>161501324

Maximize the window?

>>161500167
Durable elite troops and mages that can take it, custom SC counter, smaller number of troops/mages that can take it and wear the defenders down even if they don't win outright, assaulting the defenders with remote attack spells like Flames from the Sky and Earth Attack, relieving the siege temporarily and attacking defenders with assassins (unless you have access to assassins that can climb walls), letting go of the siege and letting the defenders just rot inside their fort or entering your turf where they don't have defender's advantage, continuing siege with a token force (like defensive turn 1 RoS caster of your own) such that defender cannot break out while you take the bulk of your force elsewhere

>>161501324
'<' and '>' keys can be used to increase or decrease unit icon size. You can view all available shortcuts for every given view by pressing '?'.

>>161501435
I'm playing in fullscreen. It's just the font, the soldiers and some UI things are very tiny.
>>161501604
Thanks

Does Demon Cleansing double damage before or after protection and resistances?

How the fuck do I deal with a Marble Oracle that casts RoS
The madman actually went and empowered it twice and put Earth Boots on it
Other equipment: a vine shield, a fire shield, starshine skullcap, elemental armour, ring of regen and an amulet of antimagic

>>161502261

If it works like resistances do, then after prot.

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>>161502561
>Ring of regen
>On a lifeless stone being
Anyway, a couple of antithugs (anything with good stats) with smashers will likely do the trick unless it's a propheted marble oracle with 1000+hp and an N9 bless

>>161502261
Before prot, after resistances.

>>161502948

That's impossible. Resistances are after prot.

>>161502872
It's got an N9E6 bless, didn't notice that it only had one source of regen lol @ him
Imma shash tonight boiiiiiii

>>161502872
Gate Cleaver might be better depending on how much strength the chassis has.

>>161475563
I had to re sumbit my pretender but yes I took it.

>>161479408
So nations with water mages? But wouldn't everyone want to get rain at some point knowing they are vs abysia?

>>161503026
>Resistances are after prot.
Are you sure about that? How'd you test it?

From what I've seen of Demon Cleansing, resistance definitely comes before protection.

5 fire resistance is enough to block 5 fire damage even under demon cleansing, but a demon without fire resistance would treat that 5 fire damage as 10 damage for the protection roll.