GET IN HERE FAGGOTS It's time to settle this once and for

At least FF is an anthology and didn't ruin the previous entries canon.

>>388727146
FF has been on the JUST train for the past 10+ years. MGS however, is a different story.

>>388727252
Fair point.

On the other hand, at least NGSV has decent gameplay whereas you have to be a literal drooling retard to lose a fight in FFXV. It's neither challenging nor rewarding in any way unless you're really enjoying make believe.

>>388727369
The damage TPP has done to the series is permanent, the canon has been thoroughly fucked beyond repair. It doesn't matter if an entry of FF is shit because it has zero impact on the potential quality of the next.

>>388727462
what's fucked in V? it actually fixed how big boss was alive after MG1.

>>388728283
Not him, but I was mad at how it cut off so abruptly. Several story arks lead fucking nowhere.
Not to mention no memorable boss fights (although PW is equally guilty for that) and villain going out in a dissapointingly anti-climatic way in a fucking cutscene.

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>>388727146
MGSV was at least still a fun game with a great engine, the ending/one mission was just fucked/not there.
XV has shit missing all over the place, multiple DLC episodes, story updates that will never come out and other shit. And MGSV didn't have tons of trailers of basicly a whole other game and different builts of which almost non made it into the final game, only a few nsippets were missing.

And XV continues to shit itself, all those dumb interviews about DLC content and the stuff from the survey just to say that it might be too big so they might not even add it, wtf

>>388728452

The story archs lead into fucking MG1. Just because you're too fuckinh underage to know of those games doesn't mean the story is fucked.

>>388727146
These are legitimately my favorite games of this generation alongside Automata and Yakuza 0.

the only point of this thread is to deflect criticism from one shitty game that couldn't live up to expectations onto another shitty game that couldnt live up to expectations.

>>388728557

This.

Both of them were disappointing for falling for the open world meme and having shitty stories after years of planning and millions of dollars, neither deserves credit for being less shitty than the other because they both failed at similar things.

>>388727146
MGS never had a good game while FF stopped being good at IX... both were 100% garanteed to suck ass.

>>388728283
That was already in canon you underage fuck. After the end credits of MG1 Big Boss sends a message saying "I'm still alive". There is no explanation needed aside from "he survived the fight". Zero, the big bad of the series who fucking despises Big Boss and wants to fucking murder him suddenly rescues Big Boss from the helicopter crash, nurses him back to health and is even nice enough to create a fake body double to distract his enemies. Zero being in a coma before the events of MG1 also causes ripples in the timeline. If he is in his coma before MG1 it prevents him from carrying out actions which have cataclysmic repercussions of the rest of the series.

>>388728550
You're the underage faggot here for claiming TPP fixes why Big Boss is still alive in MG2 when that fact had already been addressed IN METAL GEAR 1. You obviously haven't played the games, just gone off a Wikipedia synopsis or know what you've heard other people more intelligent than you talking about. Fuck off.

>>388728452
well if V fucked anything it just fucked itself. it did nothing to the entirety of its' canon as this guy says >>388727462

MGSV may have ended bad but i'd like to think the true ending to the franchise is 4. whereas XV continues to destroy itself >>388728460 don't remind me of that upcoming ass creed event.

>>388727146
MGS V has a nice gameplay but shit everything else
FFXV is mediocre all around
Both shit bricks in the second half of the game

Honestly a tough pick.

>>388728956
>well if V fucked anything it just fucked itself. it did nothing to the entirety of its' canon as this guy says
Read >>388728675 and come back.

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>>388728283
>it actually fixed how big boss was alive after MG1.

No one cared about this. All the years of this franchise being discussed here there have been times that I can caught on my one hand of when people asked how he lived though that. All the reasons given none where "Body double"

What I was going into MGSV for and was most excited for was the war that Big Boss and Zero had. Though out all the games after MGS3 (besides MGSV and some before it, we were told on what made them split apart and why Big Boss hated Zero. In every game we kept getting told at how awesome of a solider Big Boss was and why he hated how the world treated soldiers.

This was why pretty much no one cared about how he lived though MG1. Cause the games told us he was a capable enough solider to live though the worst of the worst.

MGSV came in and retconned the following for no reason and took a shit on everything

>The war between Zero and Big Boss never happen they were really friends all along

>Big Boss never hated Zero for cloning him despite him saying so in PW and MGSV itself

>Big Boss clearly showed he hated everything Zero was doing to achieve his version of The Boss's will

>The Cobra Unit and Parasites

>Skull Face following Naked Snake around in MGS3 ready to take over the mission at any moment. Completely killed all the tension the game had.

>the entire cast from PW were written out of the game despite there being concept art and open stories with lose ends

There's many more but I think this covers all the important shit.

>>388727252
>caring about canon and being autistic
FFXV was in development hell for a decade, that alone is enough to choose it over another half finished game with a FRACTION of the development time

>>388729146
>>caring about canon and being autistic
>you shouldn't care, just accept the low effort shit being shoveled down your throat
This is not an argument.

>>388729021
>new MG game comes out
>fanboys shit themselves over canon
errytime
yet I didn't see you cunts complaining when PW threw the whole series in the trash and proved Kojima super doesn't care

>>388729227
>caring about videogame plot this much
>not an argument meme
>being
>autistic
lol anon, this is why your parents dont like you

>>388729239
I thought the story in PW was pretty good and ended on a nice set up for the events to come.

>>388729239
PW didn't fuck with the established canon. It had a lot of silly characters but nothing that shat on what was previously established. The ending of PW even sets the stage for MGSV to depict Zero vs Big Boss with Zero's assassination attempt.

>>388729319
Still not an argument.

The story sucked in mgsv but the gameplay was great. XV was a dull game to play and it was unoptimizied as fuck.
If xv fixes the loading times it might be a mediocre game with a bad story but right now its abysmal.

>>388729015
>>388728675
you're taking the metal gear saga too seriously. are you ok son?

>>388729341
I couldn't finish it, dropped it when I got to Strangelove and they retconned Big Boss' knowledge of MGS3 and turned him into a bumbling joke.
The harm to the story gets worse from 4 onward. The things people cry about in 4 are minuscule compared to shit PW does, and then V.

>>388729392
>PW didn't fuck with the established canon.
lol stop lying so you can continue to enjoy babby's first MGS

>>388729468
>tpp didn't ruin the series lore at all you underage fuck
Actually it did, and here's why...
>lol why do you care about the series lore you fucking nerd

>>388729569
You sound really furious, whats the matter? Upset you didn't play as Big Boob?

>>388727146
>inb4 you know who rigs another poll

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>>388729506
>they retconned Big Boss' knowledge of MGS3 and turned him into a bumbling joke.

He was bluffing he did not want to tell Strangelove what really happen during MGS3 cause she would have used that info to complete her AI based on The Boss and he thought it was a affront to her memory even saying once in that scene "I am NOT helping you finish that thing"

You must be dense.

>>388729564
Explain how it did then.

>>388729506
>they retconned Big Boss' knowledge of MGS3 and turned him into a bumbling joke.
Am I being baited or are you genuinely autistic? Big Boss was lying to Strangelove about The Boss betraying America so she wouldn't be able to finish the mammal pod, holy fuck, you're legit retarded.

The fact that 99% of this thread is and will just be MGS discussion and noone even gives a shit about XV anymore for the most part kinda shows the result without a poll

>>388729679
>>388729683
Yeah yeah, I've heard the shitty fanboy excuse before, except telling Strangelove the truth would have resolved half the plot immediately. So you can't have half your game just vanish, right?
Shit writing. stop lying to yourself.

At least MGSV gameplay was good
XV has continued to disappointment almost a year after it came out.
The devs have no idea what they're doing, especially after putting out a poll asking what fans wanted for future content. The winners were announced, turns out they don't really know if they're going to make a comic, movie, or a full game for them. The winners apparently have so much content that they cut from the game that they could fill an entire game with it

>>388729849
If he told her the truth the mammal pod would've been completed immediately and Coldman's plans would proceed just as they already did in the second half of the game. Retard.

>>388729778
>kinda shows the result without a poll
xv is currently winning the poll

>>388729913
>da boss was set up by da cia, strangelesbo
>omg what am i doing working wit ppl who betrayed muh boss!!
>the end
bravo kojima, another thrilling installment in a shitty action movie franchise

>>388727146
My expectations for XV were already rock bottom after it stopped being Versus XIII, MGSV was looking good up until it released and it turned out there was barely anything to the game outside of the trailers and it didn't even get finished. So MGSV is definitely the bigger blunder.

>>388730045
Coldman was not CIA.

>>388730009
That's what i'm saying, XV is almost nothing at this point and both before release and after relese it has been nothing but marketing so people don't forget about it.
What is even their plan with this game anymore.

>>388729849
He he told he then he would have still been captured and Coldman would have launched his nukes and fucked the world.

It's also not an excuse cause that's what the game flat out tells you if you are paying attention. Hell Big Boss has so many flashbacks to MGS3 it's not funny

>It retconned MGS3

You are just really retarded.

>>388730097
I wouldn't know, the game was too terrible to finish. I just watched what was important on youtube because I didnt wanna waste time on outer ops.

>>388727462
>the canon has been thoroughly fucked beyond repair
It was like that before MGSV released though, MGS4 and PW made sure of that.

>>388730179
keep making excuses, retard. I know PW was nice and easy and that's why /v/ loves it, but it's no excuse for a shit plot with shit characters
I only just played V recently because I knew how heavily it took from the worst game in the series

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>>388730182
>I wouldn't know

Thanks for admitting that you've been talking about something you have no knowledge of.

I expect nothing less from /v/. It's just filled with faggots like you who act like they play games but really they just watch them on youtube while barely paying attention.

You can say I am making excuses but at least I play the games I criticize.

XV hit me harder.
V was just a prequel to Metal Gear 1 or whatever.

But XV was 10 years of Versus XIII just turned into what it was. A movie and some okay tech and a butchered narrative.

>>388730191
They shoehorned in a lot of twists that came out of nowhere but, as convoluted as it was, it still made sense. TPP says shit which literally cannot be true, given the other events of the series. PW had zero impact on the MG lore. It's a self contained story that has zero repercussions on the rest of the series aside from Zero's assassination attempt on Big Boss at the very end of the game which is more truthful to the canon then TPP ever was.

>>388730182
So you admit you're a simpleton? Seriously now, you're legit dumb witted, you missed out on basic plot points which are spelled out to you.

Metal gear stories have never made sense and the "canon" is and always was worthless tripe. Kojima himself obviously doesn't even care about it, so why do you?

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>>388730182
>I just watched what was important on youtube
>this is the type of person who browses /v/ these days
neo-/v/ everyone

>>388730390
Sorry, I drop shit games instead of wasting more precious time on them

>>388730479
>you missed out on basic plot points which are spelled out to you
plot points =/= fanboy toddler headcanon, also this >>388730586

>>388730813
Clearly anything you don't remember is just excuses.

That logic alone shows how much of a retard you are.

>>388730813
>>you missed out on basic plot points which are spelled out to you
>plot points =/= fanboy toddler headcanon, also this
Everything I have said is clearly stated in the game.

It had been a while since I saw a thread with so much bait.

>>388730918
nah, I would have been a retard if I actually enjoyed PW.
Luckily I moved onto better games

>>388730949
Even if you could prove that (which you can't) it'd make the story even worse and more poorly written than it already is

>>388730982
So now you are already disagreeing with what you already said? About things stated in the exact game you are whining about not being canon cause you forgot them but are really just excuses by "fanboys" aka people who played the game?

You are such a deep and conflicted person.

>>388730952
Where's bait, you silly willy? It's a legit battle between two shit games for the title of the blunder of the franchise.

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>>388731057
I'm done with you unless you provide actual arguments.

FFXV is a multimedia disaster and worse game in just about every way.

>>388731090
actually, it sounds like you're too retarded to keep up with the conversation anymore.
just sit down and play your shit game, anon. you must be tired

>>388731170
>I-Im done with y-you!
>y-you need a r-real argument against my baby MGS game...
lol man

>>388730813
Good thing you saved all those precious hours to debate about something you dont know fuck all about on a mongolian carpet weaver forum

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>>388731426

>>388731532
I do this all the time, PW fans are fucktards who get upset when you point out how shit the game was

>>388731123
In the guy that's baiting PW fans.

>>388731612
"I do this all the time, PW fans are fucktards who get upset when you point out how shit the game was" anon told his mother to post as he collected another coin. *bing* *bing* *Whaa-oo*

>>388731895
See? Look at how hard you're shitting your pants with anger. This is how I know PW is the worst shit MGS game, because only retard underages on /v/ like it
or mudslimes on facebook

>>388731612
except the point you gave on how the story was shit was explained in the game you admitted to not paying attention.

>>388731858
Its not bait when everything I say is truth

>>388732019
Who cares? It was shit and I didnt wanna play it anymore
so I looked up the story so I could play V

I was grievely disappointed with MGSV, where as enjoyed my time with XV, so easy choice.

>>388730813
>implying you play games

Watching and playing are two very different things Anon

>>388732004
*Yaaa-hooo* *1-up* *bing* *bing*

>>388727146
MGSV was just missing an ending and some explanations the gameplay was pretty fun why do you faggots keep pushing it was a blunder.

>>388732125
>>388732128
when /v/ breaks down, together

>>388732102
>Its not bait when everything I say is truth

Except when you've been pointed out to be wrong.

>>388732225
/v/ is infested with kinofags who play games for the plot and writing and cinematic experience instead of the gameplay.

>>388732225
infantile PW fans who miss being able to run through corridor maps and mash the CQC button to win

>>388732314
nah, you people still haven't proven anything
I dont expect retards to argue correctly, tho

>>388732287
How are they wrong though? I played PW and did not care for it but everything you said about the game is wrong.

>>388732225
I don't think it was missing an ending, Skullface dying was the end of the story, and the revenge was meant to be unsatisfying and lack finality.

However it was definitely missing wrap-up, the cut mission with Liquid and the sheer amount of tapes are the consequences of that.

Gameplay was great, just wish they had more time to make more Subsistence missions.

>>388732387
>MGSPW retconned Big Boss's memory of MGS3

>Anons tell you that was wrong and why even though the game did a good job of spelling it out to you

>Those are just e-e-e-e-excuses they never happened

>I only watched it on youtube and I know the facts!

>you are wrong because I say so.
6/10 bait

>>388732405
Prove it

>>388732583
>more headcanon forcing with no proof
when /v/ back-pedals their argument so you can see how dumb they are again, thanks!

>>388732806
Scroll up. Plenty of people in this thread broke down the scene and explain why he did not say anything to her about the events of MGS3. You yourself also admitted to not knowing what you are talking about. You dug your own grave and you keep digging after being long dead.

At this point the burden of proof is on you. Pray your youtube history of second hand knowledge can help you.

>>388732950
>Scroll up. Plenty of people in this thread broke down the scene and explain why
stopped reading there, see >>388732806
again plz

>>388727462
>caring about final fantasy's story

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>>388727146
The disaster that is FFXV is on a different scale.

MGSV is rushed out the door and disappointing, but it is an competent and fun video game. Replaying it recently made me really appreciate the open mission design as well Venom Snake and the themes of the story.

FFXV on the other hand is an aimless and haphazard fucking mess. A incomprehensible soup made by hundreds of cooks who's seemingly just throwing stuff that they think people might like into the pot. It's a game that's been in development hell for a decade and boy can you tell.

>>388733029
Ok how about playing the game? PW has countless flashbacks to MGS3 and Big Boss even says in the scene you were too dense to understand "I am not helping you complete that thing"

Or keep being retarded I guess. Burden of proof is on you. Since you say that scene never happen and said the game's story retcon MGS3

>>388733189
LOL please stop bringing up the exact scene that made the retcon, it's embarrassing at this point and only shows you don't even understand what is happening.
but that seems to be a trend with MGS fans
>Or keep being retarded I guess. Burden of proof is on you. Since you say that scene never happen and said the game's story retcon MGS3
still no proof, anon

>>388733359
>LOL
Go back to Reddít

>>388733414
anon, if grit your teeth any harder, theyll break :^(

At least MGV was fun to joke about.

FFVX was so mediocre that it didn't even spawn much OC.

>>388733414
This.

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>>388733453
Not the same guy, leave /v/.

>>388733538
see
>>388733453

>>388727146
have to go ffxv even though i think they are both the worst, but at least metal gear solid still had fun parts, and quiet is a better waifu i think.

>>388733582
>LOL
Go back to Reddít.

>>388733632
>literally grinding his teeth
Your dentist won't like to see that

>>388733632
dont be u p s e t over how bad PW is, anon
see
>>388733453

>>388727146

I'll go for MGSV. FFXIII was already a trainwreck so I had very low expectations for XV, and it managed to be a little better than what I expected. Meanwhile MGS4 was disappointing but not terrible.
I had high hopes for MGS5 and it's not completely trash but it's ruined by how unfinished it feels.

>>388733719
>muh teeth
What are you, a jew?

>>388733913
Peacewalker? More like /pol/walker, amirite?

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>>388727146
>That image

Jesus Christ FFXV straight up just ripped off MGSV's cover.

Nice "homage"

>>388733971
More like Hebrew and Ash

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>>388734030

Both games were pretty solid. I started with FF1 and MGS1 respectively so don't give me that "you weren't invested in the series" shit.

>>388734182
me on the left

>>388734042
More like
>Kojima gave Big Boss the personality of a man-child so man-children love him
>MSF are a bunch of dumb cunt videogame playing idol fans
>Miller is a yes man host boy and dies in a single sentence of dialogue in a game that was released almost 20 years ago
the only thing you take away from PW, is MonHun Island

>>388734220
>so don't give me that "you weren't invested in the series" shit.
imagine being invested in a videogame franchise past the age of 16

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>>388733164
this

holy shit, fucking THIS

>>388734297
Solid Snake and Revengeance's cast were the only good characters in all of MG.

>>388734220
You just have awful taste is all

>>388727146
MGSV was great

>>388734297
when you keep in mind Kojima LITERALLY wanted to leave the series behind after each game, culminating in him basically disowning MGS4, it all begins to make sense.

>>388734372
I don't have to imagine it.

>>388734417
Nah, the haters of both were the type of people who watch trailers and make a fanfiction game in their head. When the released game doesn't line up to that fanfiction they throw a fit.

>>388734285
You're one of the worst party members

>>388734571
>When the released game doesn't line up to that fanfiction they throw a fit.

As in when a third of the game is missing and what's left is a plain mess?

Nah, like the other anon said, you have shit taste.

>>388734523
MGS2 was heavy on that

>>388734571
imagine being past the age of 16 and using the word hater

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>>388727146
MGSV had the best gameplay and stealth of the entire franchise. Looked absolutely gorgeous and ran incredibly smoothly. MGS never had a good story in the first place and the autist calling it a bad game because story needs to go neck themselves. Ff15 was a garbage shit tier game all around.

>>388734865
dabbin on them haters

>>388734814
You're delusional and entirely missed the point if you thought V was missing a third of its story. The only things missing were some wrap-up such as Eli's mission and some of the stuff included in the tapes.

>200 votes
>36 IPs
hmmm

>>388734865
Don't ever respond to me again unless you're going to capitalize your sentences.

>>388734814
The game was far from a mess, it wasn't perfect by any means though.

>>388734946
just imagine

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>>388735015
>when the apparent real response is way more autistic than the shitpost

>>388734985
Welcome, newfriend. Is this your first time in a thread where actual discussion happens instead of random dank ass memes being posted?

>>388735194
What?

>>388735101
Don't even respond to me with greentext garbage either.

>>388727146
FF hasn't been good since X so no one expected it to be the best FF ever, and the ones that did liked it because they were the fucks who loved XIII because it came with their PS3 that was their first console, so it was okay and that's enough

MGSV was acknowledged universally that it was bad halfway in

>>388735310
9* 10 was crap.

>>388735194
Do you want to try this post again?

>>388735270
>w h o a , a r e y o u p r e t e n d i n g ?

MGSV for me even though I like it more. It's incredibly ambitious but I still recognize its failed executions. FF on the other handhas always been an overproduced and mediocre series.

>>388735507
First off I gave you pretty clear instructions. Secondly don't ever respond to me with awkwardly space letters again. Here, I'll try to communicate on your level:

>imagine being so 16 that you can't follow instructions

>>388734985
I always vote on every poll i see even if i don't care about the tread

>>388735246
>>388735487
I've read 'posts' instead of 'votes'. I am a retard, ok?

>>388735736
You're amusing, anon.

>>388735935
Don't worry about it anon. You're in good company here anyway.

>>388735736
l o l
n i g g e r

>>388735942
Thanks. I personally find myself hilarious, I have to assume anyone that doesn't feel the same is just too dumb to get it.

>>388736045
Nice emote nerd, get out of here with that shit.

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>>388736203
>emote
?????????????????????

>>388734285
You're an even worse game than ffxv then.

>>388736337
The guy with his hands up overtop of your frankly rude spoiler.

>>388736485
literally out loud
l o l

>>388727146
Didn't you hear? MSGV is the 19th greatest game of all time.

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>>388727146
>MGSV actually caused a studio to close and people getting fired
>nothing happened with FFX, in fact it still getting massive support with patches, DLC and an upgraded PC release
>FFXV is the bigger blunder

>>388727146
neither, The Witcher 3 is more complete than those two trainwrecks

>>388737375
Metal gear didnt cause that you stupid cunt

>>388737375
Good bait. Have a (You).

>>388737448
MGSV is asgoodas___ TW3.

>Anno 2000 +17
>Underage faggots think MGS V and FF15 are Shitty games blunders

God, what happen to /v/? Creating shitwars about nothing

Metal Gear Solid V had drivable cars at launch.

>>388737375
>nothing happened with FFXV
even you-know-who isn't this retarded

>>388737375
>still getting massive support with patches, DLC
Which literally no one, not a single fucking living soul even XV-kun himself asked for, yeah.

>>388737448
W3 has meh gameplay

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>>388737830

>>388727146
200+ people at least agree that they're both utterly trash

This restore a bit of faith I have in /v/

>>388727462
MGS canon was always a big fucking joke. The worst offender was and will always be 4.

>>388738813
4 just made things convoluted, it still made sense.

Thanks to TPP you literally cant describe the story of Metal Gear.

>>388738993
>it still made sense.
I could maybe agree with you if the ending wasn't the joke it is.

>>388739170
Convoluted does not equal you literally cannot explain what happened, something only TPP is guilty of.

>>388738993
>Thanks to PW you literally cant describe the story of Metal Gear.
ftfy

>>388739263
If you can explain something, it doesn't mean it's good or that it makes sense either.

At least FFXV isn't canon to any other game in its franchise, is still being worked on to restore the content that was missing initially as well as add new content while MGSV is permafucked, fucks up the canon of the franchise, and the only thing being done with it is a shitty spin-off with zombies in it.

>>388738993
>Thanks to TPP you literally cant describe the story of Metal Gear.
All the Metal Gear games have the same damn plot anyway.

MG1: Guy infiltrates enemy base to destroy walking tank
MG2: Guy infiltrates enemy base to destroy walking tank
MGS: Guy infiltrates enemy base to destroy walking tank
MGS2: Guy infiltrates enemy base to destroy walking tanks
MGS3: Guy infiltrates enemy base to destroy a tank
MGS4: Guy infiltrates enemy base to destroy a Supercomputer
PW: Guy infiltrates enemy base with an army to destroy a walking tank
MGSV: Guy infiltrates enemy base with an army to destroy a walking tank

Everything is just details.

>>388738993
no. 2 basically made it its mission to destroy the idea of the MGS canon, so

>>388739372
But I can explain it and it does make sense. You need to tell the difference the between "I don't like something" and "it doesn't make sense". Is it stupid and silly? Yes. Is it convoluted? Yes. Those are opinions basically everything agrees with. Does it make sense? Yes. That is a fact. We have a tangible series of events that we are told and can understand. In TPP we are told a series of events which are the exact opposite of the established canon.

>>388739573
>MGS: Guy infiltrates enemy base to destroy walking tank
It was more about the government using Snake as a vector to spread Foxdie so they could retrieve Rex undamaged.
>MGS2: Guy infiltrates enemy base to destroy walking tanks
The Metal Gears in 2 are ironically the least important part of the entire story. On a literal level it's about the Illuminati attempting to shape history as they see fit. Thematically it goes beyond what any game could ever dream of achieving. The Metal Gears are literally inconsequential to the series of events in MGS2.
>MGS3: Guy infiltrates enemy base to destroy a tank
The main objective was to eliminate the "traitor" to avoid World War III. Destroying the Shagohod was a side objective.

>>388739783
But 2 didn't ruin the canon at all, it added to it.

>>388740202
The point is that all the Metal Gear games have the same goddamn formula, only modified to suit the current needs.

>>388740202
But 4 totally retconned half of the plot of 2. Then how does this game make more sense than TPP?

>>388740440
But it didn't. The end of 2 was intentionally confusing, to leave us clueless about what was real and what wasn't. 4 simply answered that question by saying it was all real.

>>388740385
Not really. Gameplay wise 2 hits the same beats as 1 except it took advantage of the PS2's hardware to take these elements to the next level. Story wise 2 is nothing like 1.

1 and 2 are almost Metroid styled, you're restricted to a compound, find keycards so you can backtrack and unlock previously unlocked areas, find items and tools that allow you to access previously inaccessible areas, etc.

3 is a linear game where you're always moving forward, in this case through a jungle environment. You eventually reach a compound but spend about 15% of the game there. This game has minimal backtracking.

4 has zero backtracking and is a global trotting adventure. You progress from area to area, always moving forwards into new areas, but each area is a wide open space that dwarfs the maps of previous games.

The reason each Metal Gear sequel is so polarizing is because of how different each entry is.

>>388741162
No, you didn't understand what 2 was going for and consequently interpreted chunks of mgs4 wrong as well. Why should I listen to your opinion on lore again?

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>>388739372
>not being happy with an epic battle between 2 men on top of a outer haven
>happy with MGSV just ending. No epic final boss, no real conclusion. Nothing


4 was meant to be a symbolic gesture of the franchise as a whole. Everything has aged (mainly for the worse, very little better) and technology and warfare has gone beyond what an old school guy like Snake is capable of handling and yet he manages to get himself into insane situations and is outmatched at every moment and yet comes out on top every single time. Everything is working against him, even his own body. MGS4 may be insanity but it tried to at least stick to the fabric of what makes MGS such a great series and I'll never not find it charming and endearing. The game aged and yet still tried to go out with a soundly bang. Some don't hear it but others like me do and I'll always appreciate 4 for what it is (still think the game should've stop at 3 but I can let 4 go, not guilty).

I'll remember the BB crew, and Raiden and Snake and everyone else more than I will skullface. 5 doesn't give off that same feeling, that charm. It's like I'm not playing a MGS game anymore, more like something that would appeal to the lowest common denominator of players that expect nothing as long as gameplay. All flash, little substance that made the original games. Maybe newcomers or even guys who've played everything and love it all will tell me I'm wrong but I'll always stick up for what's right, I what's right is wanting MGS games to not only have the one good point of "having great gameplay".

>>388741462
>>not being happy with an epic battle between 2 men on top of a outer haven

literal QTE

>>388741162
Ok, retconned may have been the wrong word.
How do call it when a game has good messages, and then the message gets destroyed only because frauds needed an excuse to make a sequel?

>>388741462
>happy with MGSV just ending.
I didn't even imply that. So I won't even try to read your post since it wasn't directed at me.

>>388741446
Great argument. 2 was ambiguous. A sequel could not be made without addressing what was reality and what was fiction, autist.

>>388741591
>How do call it when a game has good messages, and then the message gets destroyed only because frauds needed an excuse to make a sequel?
We call the people responsible for such situations "hacks".

>>388741162
>Story wise 2 is nothing like 1.
Half of the story in MGS2 is literally about recreating events from MGS1, which in turn recreated events from the MSX games. MGS3 and the rest also recreated a lot of stuff from the previous games. You have to be naive if you don't see the pattern in each game.

I assumed >>388741591 was the same as this >>388739170

>>388727146
MGSV. I can not understand Kojimadrones who defend this piece of shit game which embodies all the worst parts of open world meme games.

>>388742060
>Half of the story in MGS2 is literally about recreating events from MGS1
The story takes a nosedive away from typical Metal Gear stuff when you get to President Johnson and he infodumps you with GW and The Patriots.

>>388742186
>FFXV. I can not understand Tabatadrones who defend this piece of shit game which embodies all the worst parts of open world meme games.

there ya go

>>388727146
They were both kinda mediocre for how hyped up they were and had a lot of bullshit around development. But neither was exactly a blunder.

>>388742201
Those are just the details. The rescue of President Johnson to infodump is just another trope recycled from a previous game

>>388742139
My point was that you guys are giving way too much credit for a serie that hasn't produced a single good story in more than a decade. Not that V's story can be defended in any way.
V is shit in its own right, but I won't let you say that 4 and PW weren't around the same level of bad.

>>388742439
I wasn't talking about Johnson himself you moron, he introduces the two pivotal plot points of MGS2 which are the main focuses of the game, GW and the Patriots.

>>388742513
>but I won't let you say that 4 and PW weren't around the same level of bad.

they're finished games tho
PW because it's finished and portable
4 is worse because gameplay literally stops after Act 2

>>388742513
MGS4 tried to end the series in a way that respected but also destroyed the originals. Its intent was to kill the series by killing off all the characters or making them unable to continue fighting.
MGSPW is needless filler, but it's harmless, the only thing it really changes is that it makes Big Boss an autist.
MGSV tried to completely kill the series by just being shit. I feel like Kojima intended MGSV to be disappointing(he even says so when it comes to Skullface in the guidebook) so that it'd have negative reception, and then he'd waste so much money on it, it'd never make returns (FOX Engine development, hiring actual actors rather than cheap VAs, all the small details like showering and base development things most players never touch being put in).
So, in short, MGS4 should've been the official end, but it got dragged out and Kojima did the equivalent of shooting a diseased cow.

>>388742758
And I wasn't talking about the storyline itself, idiot. I'm talking about the formula/template/whatever that the game uses to present those plot points.

Ultimately, all the MGS games have the same plot, regardless of how complicated the actual story becomes.

>>388743109
>I'm talking about the formula/template/whatever that the game uses to present those plot points.
MGS4 strays as far away from the formula as a MG game could've.

>>388743065
>I feel like Kojima intended MGSV to be disappointing(he even says so when it comes to Skullface in the guidebook)

could you elaborate?

but it's really fucking obvious he wanted to wash his hand of the series since before MGS4 with the Alan Smithee teaser trailer. and MGSV he literally ends the game with "there, you're Snake. yes, YOU the player. finally, like you always wanted. now fuck off."

>>388743340
True, but it does reuse some ideas from previous games.

>>388743659
>could you elaborate?
He said Skullface's quick death is meant to leave the player feeling a 'Phantom Pain', and I assume this extends to his lack of interaction, as well as lack of interaction Venom has with most characters.
Also, Kojima wanted to end the series since MG1. MG2 was only made because the NES game was getting a sequel, MGS was only made because he wanted to make a 3D game, and MGS2 was made to kill the series by being overly-confusing

>>388743065
>MGSV tried to completely kill the series by just being shit. I feel like Kojima intended MGSV to be disappointing(he even says so when it comes to Skullface in the guidebook) so that it'd have negative reception, and then he'd waste so much money on it, it'd never make returns
I actually believe that it's just Kojima that hasn't any talent and wanted to pull a not-MGS2 and actually feel like a smartass.
It's really a shame we didn't get a satisfying game that could simply be the Apocalypse Now of the MGS series, the same way MGS3 was a tribute to the James Bond movies and such.

>So, in short, MGS4 should've been the official end
No, 2 should have been the official end. 4 did answer some questions that no one wanted to have answered, or they answer questions in a way as retarded as midichlorians in Star Wars.


>>388742892
They may be finished games, but none of those are even close of being as fun to play as V. Like maybe you'd take the bad, unenjoyable but complete game over the fun but not complete one. It's fine by you, we all have opinions. But don't make this opinion sound like any option is much better than the other one, because they're clearly not.

Like, in MGSV you can punch children. How is it not fun?
https://youtu.be/9vupRn3PJvg

>>388727146
I unironically loved both games.

MGSV is full of tedious gameplay. Fulton is made more of a chore just as PO and distracts form the main missions. Open world was empty. Hated it in both gameplay and story department.

>>388744004
>I actually believe that it's just Kojima that hasn't any talent and wanted to pull a not-MGS2 and actually feel like a smartass.
Kojima is a talented guy. He's made good non-Metal Gear games, but he was typecasted to always direct just MG. He's done Zone of the Enders, Policenauts, Snatcher, they were all great games, but past the PS2 era, the only other IPs he got in on, were Castlevania for about 2 minutes, and Silent Hill, which, while not being a good SH game, PT was a pretty alright horror game, especially since it was free.
>2 should have been the official end
I agree, but if it was, rather than people complaining about how shit V was, /v/ would still be saying MGS2 is shit and Raiden is gay
>or they answer questions in a way as retarded as midichlorians in Star Wars.
That's because 4 was meant to tie up the series, leave it so that there can be no more adventures. There were questions that were made not to be answered, but Kojima answered them anyways so the series would die and he could move on. Sadly, that didn't happen, what with Big Boss having years between 3 and MG1, and Platinum completely changing Raiden's character for a shitty meme game

>>388743928
>and MGS2 was made to kill the series by being overly-confusing

hmm it wasn't tho. just open to interpretation and even then there are solid conclusions you can draw.

but I get you, he wanted to end the series a million times and finally got his wish.

>>388744004
>Like maybe you'd take the bad, unenjoyable but complete game over the fun but not complete one.

don't get me wrong, MGS4 is a dumpster fire but PW is literally the proto-MGSV, with a complete story, boss fights, memorable/better characters, multiplayer, and an all-around better balance of content and gameplay. MGSV is fun, yeah, but PW is the way better package. plus, it's portable.

>>388744549
>and Platinum completely changing Raiden's character for a shitty meme game

Revengeance was a better sequel to MGS2 than MGS4 was

>>388744549
>Silent Hill, which, while not being a good SH game, PT was a pretty alright horror game, especially since it was free.
He always said the actual Silent Hills game would play nothing like PT. He's not dumb enough to make a combat-less horror game and turn Silent Hill into a hide and seek simulator meme game. He wanted Silent Hills to be third person but considered having certain setpieces in first person.

>>388744647
>it wasn't tho
Who were the Patriots? Why were they funding Snake and Otacon's NGO? Was everything Raiden experienced real or virtual? What was the AI talking about before the Solidus fight, were they aliens living in the White House, or something else? How was Liquid able to control Otacon? How far does the control of the Patriots extend?
MGS2 left countless questions that received no answers to years later.
>Revengeance was a better sequel to MGS2 than MGS4 was
Revengeance had a shit story and subpar gameplay. MGS4 at least let Jack have a character and didn't make his music just edge shit.

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There's no point in criticising V on here because it never results in anything, you can argue and point out:
>how elements of V are worse than their PW counterparts
>how the plot literally makes no sense and is badly written (we're talking literal plotholes here, not just "muh mgs was never smart" or whatever)
>how the literary callbacks prove that Kojima had no idea what 1984 or the Lord of the Flies were really about and just make anyone who read books cringe
>how the solid gameplay core eventually gets tedious and repetitive
>etc.

In the end it won't matter because nobody in these threads cares about having a discussion, it always results in name-calling, deflecting to shit on 4 or PW in spite of the fact that their problems have no bearing on V, saying "you just wanted Snake to kill African children" and pretending like Kojima intended for V to be deep and left certain elements to be intentionally shitty. Save your fucking time, don't bother.

>>388742017
>2 was ambiguous
no it was post-structuralist. Much of what goes on in 4 is contradictory to 2's ending

>>388744549
>Sadly, that didn't happen, what with Big Boss having years between 3 and MG1, and Platinum completely changing Raiden's character for a shitty meme game
I didn't know SolidKenny was still on the internet after being assblasted by everyone for his shitty video.

>>388745048
>not a single gameplay critique

hmm

>>388745048
Let's break the mold and have a discussion then

Could you elaborate on your points? cuz I agree with a lot of your statements especially how it's worse than PW

>>388744549
>PT was a pretty alright horror game, especially since it was free.
I personnally didn't like it because it used the name of the serie to do some pretty cliché horror. But he also said that the complete game would be different, so who knows what could have happened. But right now, we're condemned to have 3 more years of trailers that show nothing.

> /v/ would still be saying MGS2 is shit and Raiden is gay
I mean, I won't lie that I really disliked some parts of MGS2, especially each time both Rose and Raiden were talking to each other. But it was character building and shit, so it was kind of ok to my book.

>Platinum completely changing Raiden's character for a shitty meme game
Well, I can't really agree with you that MGR was a shit game. The combat was satisfying, the musics were fitting, the slicing part was fun. Like, overall, the game was pretty fun to play.
And I don't really think they "ruined" anything, since the game was kind of a parody of the serie.


>>388744647
I get what you mean with PW. And I respect that opinion.

>>388745285
Literally who? I just don't like Revengeance because it's pointless and the prequels because they're filler and add nothing outside of 3.
Does he also like Resident Evil Survivor?

>>388738530
XV has shit gameplay why MGSV has good gameplay that's rendered pointless by garbage level design which forces you to run the same missions over and over again in the same 1-4 areas in order to progress

>>388745580
>MGSV has good gameplay that's rendered pointless by garbage level design which forces you to run the same missions over and over again in the same 1-4 areas in order to progress
Was that the case up until mission 32 tho?

>>388745569
>Literally who?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_e4BrZepC1w
Watch out if you're wearing earbuds.

>I just don't like Revengeance because it's pointless and the prequels because they're filler and add nothing outside of 3.
Who gives a shit! All video games are pointless filler. Rising is fun at least.

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>>388745030
man, nearly all of this is answered in MGS2
>Who were the Patriots?
a system of AI controlling the USA, possibly the whole world
>Why were they funding Snake and Otacon's NGO?
iirc Snake and Otacon were to be framed for the Metal Gear Ray theft but I really don't remember. maybe someone else could answer.
>Was everything Raiden experienced real or virtual?
it was real, but Snake says at the end that it's up to you to decide.
>What was the AI talking about before the Solidus fight, were they aliens living in the White House, or something else?
again, they're an AI
>How was Liquid able to control Otacon?
in MGS2 it's literally Liquid's phantom. MGS3 explains this by revealing Ocelot to be the son of The Sorrow, a powerful spirit medium. MGS4 retcons all this and says Ocelot was just pretending lol
>How far does the control of the Patriots extend?
Everywhere. That's what made the end of MGS2 so spoopy

>Revengeance had a shit story and subpar gameplay.
The story built on the themes of identity and the war economy from MGS2 and MGS4 pretty well. Gameplay's subpar compared to games like DMC3 or Ninja Gaiden Black or Bayonetta but still fun.

>>388745580
you're never forced to repeat missions, that said the loadout system is designed around making the missions repayable. There's so much shit to try out in that game it's ridiculous

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>>388745305
What's the point, so you can say "it doesn't matter" or keep ignoring it? /v/ is an awful fucking place for discussion, because as I've said before, you don't give a fuck about it. You just want to bait each other for le epik trolle, or whatever the fuck other motivation you might have.

All of this is a gigantic fucking waste of time, and a prime reason why the best advice someone can give a person on 4chan in "never take it too seriously". That's the price of this place being completely anonymous.

>>388745367
Side ops, R&D options for development, constructing your own Metal Gear variety were all better in PW. Better, as in "existing". PW had gunporn, more gadgets, etc. PW had these pooyan missions and monster hunter shit, and the like. PW's missions had plenty of little easter eggs here and there. PW's tapes were several orders of magnitude better than anything in V and gave you plenty of commentary on the world of 1970s, where V's are mostly played straight, boring, and sometimes venture into the same territory as the Code Talker's tapes (and entire existence in the plot, really) feel like self-parody at times.

Now, if you want to argue that PW is objectively worse than V, you're probably right. V has shit like the Walker Gear, an explorable mother base, and tight controls. However, MB is shallow as fuck and so is the open world. So while gameplay wise V is better, I've yet to see someone refute what I've written above. There's way more you can criticise about V's gameplay itself, but I can honestly stop here, enough tl;dr autism.

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>>388727146
these are small time blunders
behold my mediocrity

>>388745048
Im thankful that we have even minded people like you on this board.

>>388745941
MG1, 2 and MGS1-4 told a complete story with a prequel. MGSPW, V and Revengeance added nothing to that story and took away from it by making Big Boss and Zero overly sympathetic when what 4 did was enough
>>388746034
>a system of AI controlling the USA, possibly the whole world
What I meant was who created them and who were the 12 members?
>It was real
MGS2 never establishes that, and provides information to prove it was all fake (people just walking by the crashed Arsenal Gear)
>again, they're an AI
Listen to that Codec Call again and what they were talking about. They provided enough info to convince someone that they're maybe not an AI, maybe they're a extraterrestrial.
>MGS3 explains
MGS3 wasn't supposed to be made
>The story
MGR's story was still shit

>>388746230
>small time blunders
>two disappointing installments in massive long running franchises that spent decades in development versus flavor of the month tortanic
Get out

>>388746225
>Side ops, R&D options for development, constructing your own Metal Gear, etc.

man, I'm with you. I love PW and was sad to see so much imaginative shit absent in V. PW is packed to the brim with ideas and stuff to do that V just jettisons. building my own Metal Gear and having it reflect in the final boss was a thrill. and you're right the tapes alone are far better, particularly Kaz's.

now what about

>how the plot literally makes no sense and is badly written (we're talking literal plotholes here, not just "muh mgs was never smart" or whatever)
>how the literary callbacks prove that Kojima had no idea what 1984 or the Lord of the Flies were really about and just make anyone who read books cringe
>how the solid gameplay core eventually gets tedious and repetitive

>>388746487
>What I meant was who created them and who were the 12 members?
meant to be a mystery.
>MGS2 never establishes that, and provides information to prove it was all fake (people just walking by the crashed Arsenal Gear)
can't take everything in MGS2 too literally. at the same time, the game works better when it's interpreted as real.
>Listen to that Codec Call again and what they were talking about. They provided enough info to convince someone that they're maybe not an AI, maybe they're a extraterrestrial.
I remember nothing about aliens. Or egyptian pyramids. Or whatever. Since Emma built a worm to combat the AI and the AI fucks up when the worm works, it's pretty clear by then they're an AI
>MGS3 wasn't supposed to be made
well no, but it was a far better explanation than MGS4's "Liquid's just pretending." in MGS2 you were just supposed to take it at face value. in MGS1 we already witnessed all sorts of insane shit like everything about Psycho Mantis and Vulcan Raven getting eaten by birds, and Liquid's awesome, so him surviving in his arm was great.

>>388727146
MGSV was at least a good game

>>388727296
Mgs4?

>>388729778
It really just goes to show not many care about FFXV

>>388746732
Paz is told to nuke mother base if Big Boss doesn't agree to CIPHER's (so basically, to Zero's) demands in PW. We all know what happens afterwards. Then, Paz has a hate boner for Zero and goes "Will you kill him for me" to Skull Face. At the end of the game you learn that Zero never wanted the conflict to escalate to that degree - what the fuck was it about him trying to nuke MSF then? He must've given Paz the order to do it, but this is never elaborated on. Either both Zero and Paz are incompetent and just do and say whatever the fuck they want at the time, or Kojima can't write.

Who recorded the Truth tapes, and why is Big Boss all like "yo did Zero hate me or was just afraid of me?" in 4? Zero literally visited you when you were in a coma and explained everything in detail, you'd think he'd at least tell Ocelot or leave a fucking letter or two?

Why does Skull Face let Snake go during the events of TPP? He has him at his mercy like two or three times, he can literally execute him on more than one occasion, but then he just monologues to the player and has his plans blow up in his face. Remember what Solidus immediately does to Olga after he catches her in 2 and learns of the betrayal?

Why are Kaz and Snake acting all triumphant at "avenging" MSF and killing Skull Face when they're literally alive ONLY thanks to chance and SF banking on a really unstable Metal Gear and Eli getting in the chopper?

Why doesn't Skull Face try and attack Mother Base directly at any point in the game? By the time ends you have like a 1000 soliders under your command, that's way bigger than any black ops group like XOF. Why do Diamond Dogs never attack XOF, for that matter?

I could go on. The whole thing is fucking retarded.

I enjoyed the ending of ffxv
I didn't finish mgsv

I traded in MGSV last year before all the FOB patching, updates and shit.

It's currently a fiver on PSN, is it worth getting back in to for the online? Is there much changed?

>>388748058
They doubled the specializations but with things that only add modifiers to your FOB stats, but they've also added the option to throw resources at a FOB to reduce stats when invading. It was a pretty good update in my opinion.

>mgsv has cassette tapes and licensed music
>could put in the entire diamond dogs album, the man who sold the world album, osts from across the series and other kojima games
>literally just snake eater and man who sold the world
It hurts

>>388748184
Hmm I might as well pick it up and see for myself. I remember the FOB stuff being surprisingly fun and challenging.

So did kojima ruin it or konami?

>>388748407
Both.

>>388748419
Kojima intentionally did it. Konami intentionally buried the series by freaking out for a few month

>>388748303
You know licensed music costs money, right.

Anyway, just get it on PC

>>388748629
Kojima wasted a shitton of money of Kiefer, which could've gone towards getting better Bowie music

>>388747653

I've always considered MGSV a good game with a shitty story, FFXV I thought was "baffling design choices - the game".

They're both garbage games but I voted for MGSV because I actually thought it was going to be good, while I went into FFXV expecting exactly what we got because FF hasn't been good in 20 years

>>388748629
>Anyway, just get it on PC
*pirate it

It's not worth paying for it and it wouldn't be even if Konami was an all right company. I don't know why people have such a hate boner for Konami where they're just a product of the times. They don't give a fuck about the games and should've sold most of the licences, but I don't get why people pretend like they're worse than, say EA. There was a time where Konami was good, which is more than I can say for EA.

>>388747817
hey if you like bullshit that makes no sense you'll love FFXV

>>388748693
nah

>>388748869
Hey now, FFXV makes perfect sense if you watch the movie, download 59GB of updates, stop at Ch3 to watch an anime, play the mobile game, and read the Ultimania guide.

>>388748861
>It's not worth paying for
Yes it is and the best content is online.

>>388749089
Also play the DLC

>>388748869
>caring about Final Fantasy in 2017
The series effectively ended on FFIX. I think XV tried to go in the right direction at least, but they fucked it up for the usual reasons. Maybe the Remake will be good, it's completely fucking unnecessary but at least following a better game to a T means your chances for fucking up are smaller.

This is a discussion for a different thread but people at Square should just like, stop and just play through the first disc of Xenogears, Chrono Trigger, and FF6/7/8/9 if they want to learn what worked. X and further just miss the mark so fucking hard right off the gate that it's near hilarious.