>enemies always scale to your stats and gear What is

>>388301684
you have to find a winning strategy, like a solution to a puzzle, rather than just cheese it by grinding git gud

>>388302110
>you have to cheese the enemies instead of cheesing them

>>388302110

what's the point of increasing lvls/stats whatever if enemies just scale to it?

>>388302225
To give you an illusion of progression.

The point is the satisfaction of fucking owning the next set of higher level enemies by grinding for like 5 hours.

not having to think about character design and level progression for devs

>>388302110
new weapons/gear should give you more options instead of [+9 damage to undead], like a new/altered moveset so you can actually form a strategy or a playstyle
just giving gear to beat the same enemies with more health with a proven method is just bad game design

>>388302207
>applying proper strategies/using various game mechanics instead of grinding to level 99
>cheesing
I guess for 'people' like you even starting the game and walking around is cheesing.

>>388302225
Usually (of course, that doesn't exclude the possibility of completely fucked up scaling) enemies scale linearly while player characters can stack combat factors upon combat factors. Say, every time you level up, all NPCs gain +2 STR/AGI/INT/WIS/CON while a player might put +10 to AGI, spec into a stun ability, and kill the enemy during the stun. And 10 levels later when enemies are at +20 stats, player character would be at +200 AGI killing several of them in one blow.

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>>388301684
>level 1
>do 36 damage
>cuts 1/3 of enemies health
>Level 63
>Do 957384 damage
>Cuts 1/3 of enemies health

>>388302225
So that your brain gets a hit of dopamine when you see yourself level up.

>>388301684
>>388302723
This is now an Oblivion thread.
What the FUCK was Bethesda thinking?

>>388302723
God i hate when JRPG's do this. I'm not even mad at the proportion of late game damage just make it fucking reasonable like at most around 800 hp

>enemy hp scales to your damage
>but not to your dps
>dps gradually increases as your weapons/skills improve

BECAUSE YOU FIGHT STRONGER THINGS
NARRATIVE IMPORTANCE

>>388302723
>Diablo 3
>starting areas
>OMG I can do low 3 digit damage now, I BECAME DEATH DESTROYER OF WORLDS
>lategame
>18567536 per hit x2 when critical
>whatever

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>>388302723
>level 1
>do 20 damage
>1/3 of enemies health
>level 72
>do 24billion damage
>1/50 of enemies health

Name the game

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>Enemy levels indicate nothing about actual power, and are effectively just there to say "This is the content you are supposed to do now"
>The game even outright prevents you from hitting enemies of a too high level

Why are both extremes so terrible?

>>388303004
Borderlands 2

>>388303004

Diablo 3

>>388301684
Oblivion in a nutshell
"Fun"

I just came to post in this thread that I FUCKIN HATE THE LAST REMNANT
peace out.

>>388301684
There isn't really one, beyond gating content and the Skinner box treadmill. e.g. think about Monster Hunter. You get better armour and better weapons so you can fight monsters who make your better armour and weapons meaningless.

This means that older enemies are now easily dealt with, so you can focus on the new ones. It also means you couldn't have fought the new ones before -- at least, not without a lot of skill, allowing skilled players to progress faster. It also means you get a feeling of progression just by making more armour and weapons, urging you to make more of both.

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>>388301684
>the more you study the harder the test becomes

>>388302723
>Numbers cover the whole entire screen

This needs to end

>>388303004
>stack skills just right
>position enemies just right
>each enemy explodes into a bigger fireball than the last
>eventually the game can't keep track of the massive amounts of damage you're doing and the counter maxes out at 9999m
>even the raid bosses go down in one hit

>>388303306
>You get better armour and better weapons
you mean "you grind for fucking days so you can get some piece of shit drop with a 5% drop rate so you can make the next piece of gear and then rinse and repeat"

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>>388301684
this is why i just play everything on easy diffculty, i use to be one of those kids that only played on hard, but everything is artificial and fake to some degree.

just enjoy the game, enjoy yourself, enjoy the experience.

>>388303523
Yes.

>>388303004
disgaea

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>>388302225
filthy nihilist

>>388301684
Depending on the game, you get more moves and powers and said enemies now require other powers rather than just brute force

>>388303523
Except in Monster Hunter you don't actually need better gear, you could potentially beat the hardest missions naked if you were good enough. Stuff like Jaggi armor exists specifically for experienced players. It's an extremely easy armor set to get and it takes like 10 minutes, and it gives offensive bonuses to help you kill monsters faster while having shitty defenses and resistances. Other armor sets just make it easier to beat monsters if you're having trouble and need a crutch (Or you're at the end of the game and want an optimized set), but you definitely never need it when progressing through the game.

>>388303794
Soooooooo u wuz sayin enemies scale not only to your gear and stats but also to your moves and powers?

>>388301684
but then when you outscale and one shot everything the game becomes boring as fuck and you make another thread on /v bitching about it

>>388303864
>you could potentially beat the hardest missions naked if you were good enough.
no, you literally cannot. if you don't have weapons that do enough damage the time limit will run out way before you kill the monster. who the fuck are you trying to fool?

>>388301684

Ideally leveling should be about making yourself strong enough to be the end game, if everything levels with you it's bad design and the point was they were to lazy to attempt a decent game design.

>>388303982
I didn't know you wore weapons as clothing anon.

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>Get a legendary sword forged by the Gods themselves
>15 minutes later you find a wooden club in a trashcan with better stats

>>388304057
i didn't know i said clothing instead of gear, asshole

In a perfect game the game becomes easier the more you level up
So final boss is an easy QTE as metaphor how powerful you are

>>388304079
>the wooden club was forged by the super creator god who comments on it if you fight him with it

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>>388303935
>but then when you outscale and one shot everything the game becomes boring as fuck
speak for yourself, faggot

>>388303885
Yes, instead of bashing them some more, they are smarter and move like player characters, like those duel bosses everyone jerks off about.

>>388304101
In the MH community naked means no armor. Getting a half decent weapon isn't a problem in any of the games if you just follow the metal/mineral line. If you specify a run with literally no weapons or armor then you specify that.

>>388303306
Not exactly. When I picked up monster Hunter it took me all 50 minutes to kill low rank monsters because I sucked at the game. I would have to grind armor and weapons sets just to be able to barely survive the next monster. Now when a new monhun comes out I can breeze through early shit with early unupgraded equiment just because I'm better at the game now

>>388302225
The enemies will scale in a dumb way.

>>388304101
How does that change what he said at all? He responded to your post about gear with a comment about armor.

>>388303982
Unless if you're talking about soloing multiplayer missions like Moran, you can beat the entirety of single player with the starter iron equipment. Feline heroics exists just for that kind of retardation.

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>>388304079
>Witcher 3
>do the legendary blacksmith quest
>says he will craft me a weapon that has no equal
>get the weapon
>cant use it yet because im too low level
>finally get to the required level
>Already found better weapons during that time

>>388304446
> Here take this legendary sword passed down from generation to generation in my family. It has super powers and has slain many great foes. We wouldn't exist without it
>It's shit
>Sell it for 350g

This is why you only scale partially.

Bandits always have 150 HP and deal X damage, but if you fight them at a higher level they'll be more aggressive, they'll be more bandits, they'll have a few dogs and traps with them, they'll be a captain with full iron armor instead of just a few pieces, etc.

This way when you revisit a low level area it's not an absolute cakewalk but you're still clearly getting stronger.

>>388304591
Skelligers make shit steel.

>get magical sword
>super powerful against demons, used to stop the world ender
>actually jk it's basically a tier 3 sword that *sometimes* deals bonus damage to demons as if it was a tier 5
>weapons go up to tier 9
>can't even fight demons without cheese until you have at the bare minimum tier 6 weapons

>>388304664
this only works if you actually give enemies different behaviors and combat patterns or everything just ends up being varying degrees of meattanks so enemy variety doesnt actually matter

devs had this shit half figured out in the late 90s where everything had like elemental weaknesses but it was done with the wrong intention and ends up just being an arbitrary lock and key system when enemies are all easy mode but only if youre specced to specifically deal the damage that theyre weak to and without it youre in hell
but somewhere in the 00s everything went wrong and game devs basically just gave up on proper enemy design
i miss it honestly, at least they used to try

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>>388301684
>enemies scale to your stats and gear
>it's not an RPG

>>388304776
Runescape?

>>388302457
This describes Destiny perfectly.

>>388304776
Tiers are one of EoC's bigger mistakes