if this game came out on the saturn as a launch title would it

nah. critics at the time would've said the series got stale and took away points for not being in 3D.

>>387869868


Telling customers when the console launches also helps.

>>387870628
This. 3D was such a hot craze that the console was even altered during late development to accomodate 3D technology.

>>387869868
it would have gotten slammed in the reviews for reusing old stages and blue sphere.
it comes off more as a sega cd or even 32x game.

Could this game run (with some modifications) on a Saturn? Could it run on a 32XCD monstrosity?

>>387870771
Yeah of course being a kid I was kinda caught up with it. 3D of that generation sucks, I wish there were more 2D games.

Doubt it. Keep in mind that sega had one of THE worst major game console launches by surprise releasing it with no titles (and having no titles for a long ass time as well as pissing off major retailers)+ $100 more then the Playstation.

Back in the 90s, I don't even remember the Saturn hardly being available in most big box stores outside electronic shops, and the game sections were always waaay smaller then the N64 and Playstation.

>>387869868

It needed a strong launch game, but Mania wouldn't have been it. A game that revisits zones from a franchise barely 5 years would have been laughed at then. Especially when there's only 4 new zones.

It's acceptable now because we're starving and haven't seen those zones in years.

Sincerely, this >>387870628
It would be dismissed as arcaid and not with the times. The late 90 and early 2000 was a pretty dumb age regarding technology and games. If you think gaming magazine nowadays are dumb, in the past they were even dumber.

Just remember that review calling medal of honor on ps1 a disgrace for having the shooting on r2/l2 and the analogs for aim/strife. We came a long way and don't even acknowledge that. Anyone who says otherwise its just too young to remember clearly or is just blindfolded by nostalgia.

Wake the fuck up, we live interesting times.

>>387869868
Nah, people wanted 3D games, there was a strong hatred for 2D stuff at the time

So much so that Sony strongly suggested devs stick to 3D

>>387870871
>32XCD monstrosity?

No. the 32X and CD hardware were both shit at the end of the day. 32X can't into large 2D backgrounds with smooth scrolling unless it makes the SEGA Genesis do all the work, which at that point would be restricted to the Genesis' 64 colors limitation with so so palette. Even then, it's not guaranteed that it wouldn't have slowdowns.

And the CD wouldn't play nice with the other two because it's a piece of shit. Not to mention the load times. The only thing CD would be useful for would be to stream the soundtrack.

>>387869868
The game references events and memes that happened long after the saturn. It cannot exist during that timeu

>>387869868
No because saturn games were expensive and sega of japan didn't localize the best japanese games anyway

>>387870963
>Just remember that review calling medal of honor on ps1 a disgrace for having the shooting on r2/l2 and the analogs for aim/strife

I thought that was the PS1 version of AvP

>>387871152
>hurf durf this thing can't exist in a hypotethical scenario!
go be dumb somewhere else

daily reminder sega of america was a mistake
they killed the saturn, the dreamcast and they killed sega
Remember who was the head of Sega during dreamcast?
Peter Moore.
Yes, the retard behind Fifa and Madden.
The fucking jew

>>387870871
>Could it run on a 32XCD monstrosity?
yeah it could, the 32x was a beast
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pOWZbydnlZE

>>387871357
Not really

The Jap division was extremely arrogant & had to play a part in Sega's downfall

Sonic Mania works because it's a return to something that's been missing for years. A true Sonic game that follows the formula perfectly. It's a Best of Album for an older generation. It would be fun, but it would have been forgotten and shat on for being more of the same while bringing nothing to the table.

SEGA did fuck up catastrophically by not having a strong Sonic game at launch to show off the hardware. Sonic Team's big game came out a year after launch, and although it was fun, wasn't that interesting to push hardware.

>>387871357
Sports games are fucking awful. Only played by dudebros that don't play shit other than that and CoD.

>>387871443
>yeah it could, the 32x was a beast

No it wasn't.

Knuckles Chaotix struggles to run at a stable frame rate and that game has nothing going on. A majority of the games on the 32x depended on the Genesis to step in and do some leg work just so that the 32x can keep up.

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Mania only works because old Sonic fanboys craved some nostalgia shit, and even then using the old stages so heavily feels meh as fuck.

>>387869868
>>387870771
>>387870963
Reminder that the Saturn released before the N64 and Playstation. Reminder that they pissed off retailers by releasing their console earlier than expected and not giving the retailers a heads up.

This is one of the real key reasons the Saturn failed. Don't let revisionists on /v/ that likely weren't even old enough to have experienced the Saturn fool you otherwise. Another key reason for its failure was Sega's massive incompetence and their refusal to put certain games on the American market such as many of their JRPG titles while Sony thought smarter. The Japanese branch of Sega is pretty much completely responsible for their massive failures until they pulled out of making consoles all together.

Now with all of that said OP a Sonic game for the Saturn's launch in no way could have ever hurt. Especially not when they upset people the way that they have. Sonic was still a solid brand name at the time with very few being on its level. Nintendo's next Mario game wouldn't have came out until later and Saturn launched very early into the 3D era. The lack of a 2D Sonic on Saturn was a huge blunder.

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what if sonic adventure came out when the saturn launched?

>>387871357

None of what you said was true. By the time Moore came in, SEGA was already sinking and he was the only one not blind and stupid enough to see it.

>>387871489
yes sega of japan fucked up in almost everything
yet it was Sega of america that decided to close the sega hardware business.
Sega of America was like this: hired Peter Moore who never worked in video games, 2 years later he was the head of Sega and he had the mission to fuck up the north american release of dreamcast which he did.

>>387871604
so your just gonna ignore the video i posted huh

>>387871619
>their refusal to put certain games on the American market such as many of their JRPG titles while Sony thought smarter
give me a break with this bullshit. the ONLY jrpg that was big outside of japan during that era was FF and thats it.

>>387871684
After Sega of America making them produce 32X which was a blunder sega of japan decided to never listen to sega of america again that's why they literally didn't even consider building a more friendly architecture for the saturn

>>387871705
bernie stolar was a part of the saturn era. and the dreamcast had one of the most successful console launches of all time, only the ps2 and ps4 were more successful so idk what your talking about that he fucked it up.

>>387871631
It would have been beyond awful because 3D was still too primitive at the time for a speedy platformer. So for those who think Adventure is awful now it would have been far worst on the Saturn. Probably even broken. The Saturn wouldn't have even been able to have decent enough draw distances for such a game.
>>387871770
Not true it was a solid genre and while FF was clearly well above the rest in the genre the genre was still able to succeed enough due to the times. These days with their being a ton more into gaming and developers needing to sell that many more millions due to rising development costs the JRPG genre is too risky to produce. This wasn't the case in the 90's. A JRPG could sell as much as a mediocore selling one today and it would still be considered successful back then. You clearly have no idea what you are talking about or are baiting.

>>387871707

The video you posted is a tech demo, a shitty one at that. There's nothing impressive going on there, especially when the competition was showing off superior tech around the same time.

Try actually playing some 32x games. Where's all that fucking "power" that's displayed in that shitty tech demo? Because it sure as fuck isn't used in any of them. Tempo, a 32x game, barely makes use of the fucking 32x. 90% of the game is handled by the Genesis. The 32x only handles boss fights and some background elements. Knuckles Chaotix, the best game on the system, only uses the 32x for sprite objects, the hud, some scaling and rotation and higher quality sample playback to go along with the SEGA Genesis' YM2612 sound chip which played the main melody. The Genesis handled drawing all of the background and foreground elements.

>>387871357

SEGA of America is practically the only reason anyone even knows who the fuck SEGA is to this day. If it weren't for their efforts during the Genesis era, SEGA would be completely irrelevant and the video game market today would probably be entirely different.

>>387871705
>he had the mission to fuck up the north american release of dreamcast which he did.

The Dreamcast was one of the most successful and smoothest launches. Not to mention that it was loaded with a variety of games at launch, something consoles launches of today still struggle with. I have no idea what the fuck are you even talking about in that regard.

>>387871443
Play a sega 32X+CD game. It's awful.
It's a genesis + sega CD + mode7 graphics
the video you posted is nothing but virtua racer tier
it's garbage
It could run a more polished game at 20 fps at best

>>387872254

Virtua Racer on the Genesis had better draw distance than anything in that tech demo.

>>387872041
that guy is a retarded he believes the 32x is a miracle while in fact it is using the 1988 genesis processor and graphics engine
>>387872252
Sega was only good from 1990-1993 them Tom Kalinske went insane and fucked up everything including basically destroying the saturn.
Saturn release:
- expensive
- surprise
- no games
- only at selected retail stores

he literally destroyed sega forever

>>387872252
>has the smoothest launch of any console
>gets fucking buried by the comeption and Microsoft scavenges the parts to make their own console and plunge the Videogame in industry into the dark ages

God bless the dream cast.

>>387872408
He was against the early launch. SoJ wanted that.

>>387872252
>SEGA of America is practically the only reason anyone even knows who the fuck SEGA is to this day.
im sorry, was it sega of america who created sonic?

>>387869868
Probably but it would have needed less nostalgia pandering, 100% original levels and more 3D effects.

>>387872019
all your doing is spouting baseless claims

>>387870628
Early on enough and it would. Gex and Symphony of the Night were taken rather well. Sonic as a flagship killer app sort of franchise might have had more criticism due to that but I think overall the reviews would be kind.

>>387871796

The 32X was the idea of then president of SoJ, Hayao Nakayama.

>>387872408

>Sega was only good from 1990-1993 them Tom Kalinske went insane and fucked up everything including basically destroying the saturn.

What the fuck are you even on about? The 3 year period you're describing was under Tom's reign. Tom also had nothing to do with the Saturn because SEGA of Japan decided to call all of the shots. Silicon Graphics approached SEGA in order to pitch their tech to power their new console. Tom was impress by it and pitched it to SoJ but they wanted none of it. Their golden boys in Japan new what they were doing. Tom had to turn them away and they went on to form a partnership with Nintendo instead.

>>387872503

It was SEGA of America and SEGA of Europe that turned him into a worldwide phenomenon. Japan gave no fucks about Sonic the Hedgehog. To this day, Sonic's biggest markets are in the West. Hell, Yuji Naka fucking left SEGA after Sonic 1 was completed. It was SEGA of America that hired him back to begin production on Sonic 2.

>>387872497
that's the problem with having two CEOs in the same company
In both Sony and NIntendo there is one boss and the CEO is just there to get things going
Sega wanted early release but if Sega explained that it wouldn't work they would have dropped it
Thing is Tom was already wanting to quit sega and said ''fuck this''

>>387872408
Shut the fuck up. SOJ was entirely the reason for Sega's blunders. Entirely so. Sega as the other guys said was relevant largely thanks to SOA. Just read this article and enough of you shit.

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/may/14/sega-saturn-how-one-decision-destroyed-playstations-greatest-rival
>>387872579

>>387872817
>The 32X was the idea of then president of SoJ, Hayao Nakayama.
because Tom Kalinske wanted to sell Genesis in north america forever.
Sure the Japanese boss was retarded because he thought the Jaguar was going to hurt Sega but the sega of america didn't explain anything they simply followed the idea because the genesis was selling well

>>387872445

Dreamcast literally did nothing wrong. SEGA was too far into debt to fight back with any sort of decent marketing campaigns outside of trying to restart the 90's shit flinging wars.

Poor little guy. It introduced so much shit that's standard to this day.

>>387871604
>and that game has nothing going on

The music's nice, the day/night system is cool but pointless, the randomizer keeps things interesting and the special stages are probably my favorite in the series.

Now if only the stages didn;t all play exactly the damn same and it was easier to not get stuck with Fuck Heavy and You Bomb.

>>387872985
>because Tom Kalinske wanted to sell Genesis in north america forever.

He wasn't wrong. The Genesis was still selling consoles and games. More games were in production from several publishers. SEGA of Japan's idea was to cut off support for the SEGA Genesis entirely in favor of advertising the Saturn. That was a completely stupid fucking move on their part.

Tom shouldn't have caved in on the 32x add-on idea in order to keep the Genesis going, but it didn't seem like he had much of a choice. SoJ was dead set on killing the Genesis off despite its continued success. He ended up leaving the company shortly after since they didn't bother listening to any of his decisions despite everything he and his team has done to establish the SEGA brand name.

>>387870628
Pretty much this companies at the time were pushing so hard for 3D especially Sony/Nintendo with Sony in particular almost outright refusing to release non 3D games in the west. Capcom got some major shit from Sony about Megaman 8 and there were cases of developers needing to force Sony to allow them. If I recall it was either Konami or Capcom who had threatened to not release a game if they didn't allow a 2D game they had. Might have been MM8 or SotN can't remember.

Despite that some of my favorite games of that gen are 2D like Tomba and Mischief Makers.

The shit flinging in this thread is really high quality and detailed

>>387873279
if Kalinske contacted the marketing team and told them ''make a 2 day research in the market to see what people will think of 32X'' he would later send the report and sega of japan would simply forget about this
They thought it would sell well because japanese people are full of crazy ideas all the time

>>387871705
Dreamcast launch was amazing though, but they couldn't compete with PS2 & Sony buying out tons of 3rd party exclusives

Sega never had any chance in Gen 6, everyone was waiting for PS2 to play MGS2 & FFX

>>387873390
It is because the weebs just have to defend SOJ when it is obvious history at this point how shit they really were if a person just does basic enough research on this. SOJ quite literally hated their American branch due to their own pathetic Japanese elitism.

>There was, of course, another possible outcome. In the early nineties, after Sony had developed a CD-Rom drive for Nintendo’s SNES console only to be rebuffed at the last minute, Sega of America approached the spurned consumer electronics giant about working together on a new machine. Sony had its own game development studio, Sony Imagesoft, based in California, and it was making games for the Sega Mega CD. A relationship was there. Kalinske saw the benefit, he understood both the marketing and development talent that Sony could bring. He saw Nintendo waiting in the wings with its next machine – which would become the N64. He thought an alliance could win out. But according to him, Sega Japan turned it down outright.

>>387873496
Dreamcast wasn't marketed well too.
By January 2000 they simply stopped talking about it.
What if they released a new hardware revision with DVD in late 1999...

>>387871540
Just because dudebros don't play shit other than that and CoD, doesn't make sports games bad.
Don't judge a genre you don't know shit about, by part of it's audience.

>>387871054
>strongly suggested
More like "forced"

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>Tom Kalinske
>Becomes CEO of Mattel
>Revives the Barbie and Hot Wheels brands
>Helps launch Masters of the Universe, a new popular toyline and TV show
>Becomes CEO of SEGA of America
>Turns SEGA into a household name and makes Sonic a world wide sensation
>Becomes CEO of Leap Frog
>Successfully turns the company into an edutainment hardware manufacture that still makes hardware to this very day

>SEGA of Japan
>Turns Sony away and releases the SEGA CD, a crappy add-on no one bought
>Has fears over the shitty Atari Jaguar and rushes out the 32x to compete because they keep fucking up the Saturn
>Turns away Silicon Graphics who then forms a partnership with Nintendo and go on to power the N64
>Pulls off the biggest bafoonery of all time with the Saturn's surprise launch, only to be outdo by Sony just a few hours after their reveal
>Are so far into debt that they have no choice but to exit the hardware business

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I DON'T KNOW WHAT I'M DOING IN THIS GAME. I HAVEN'T PLAYED A 2D SONIC IN DECADES. I'M JUST GOING FAST.

>>387873747

Yes, I can see how Tom Kalinske and SEGA of America are the real villains here

>>387873747
Fuck now I have to read about that guy.

>>387873610
Wouldn't have worked. They were pretty much finished at this point. They even stupidly funded a game like Shenmue which was too expensive for them to produce at that time. On top of that they actually produced more copies of Shenmue than there were Dreamcasts. This is Sega for you /v/.

>>387873390

You'll notice that one side makes short accusations with nothing to back it up while the other side presents arguments.

You can easily look all of the info in the defense of SoA up too. The rise and fall of SEGA is probably one of the best documented history of vidya we'll ever have.

>>387873747
I though people actually bought the Sega CD? It sold enough to make it through the investment at least.

>>387873536
>Sony x SEGA
NO THANKS

>>387869868

I've never played the original Sonics because lololdgames, but I loved colors. Unleashed was ok.

>>387873747
I really like him I just think after 1993 he became reckless and allowed the release of 32X and fucking up Saturn's launch
>>387874003
Shenmue total cost was 80 million dollars
They didn't bankrupt because 80 million dollars

>>387874208
>he didn't played Mega Collection as a young teen
You missed out desu

>>387873536
The Japanese elitism was present even in the games

All the levels cut in Sonic 2 were the American ones, even if they were better & more complete than the Japanese ones

>>387874275

The first three games came out before I was even born (December 1998). You have NO idea how impossibly old/crusty they look and feel to my 18 year old brain. My brain's been fed on games from the late 2000s and newer, mid to late 90s stuff is just so wildly different from what I'm used to and feels really archaic.

>>387874234
>after 1993 he became reckless and allowed the release of 32X and fucking up Saturn's launch

What the hell are you on about? The Saturn launch was out of his hands. He was kept out of its development and research. The 32X was a the decision from SoJ, not from SOA.

The guy was essentially a fucking decoration during his last years.

>>387874275
My grandpa got me that as a gift when I was in middle school I think. I loved that game. Not just for having a bunch of rad games but also all the extra stuff like the comics and sonic CD opening.

Thanks grandpa I miss you

>>387873747
>>387873902
>>387874082
90s kid here, I didn't even know they released the CD and 32x until sometime during or after Dreamcasts launch. So for awhile I thought the only Sega consoles were Genesis, Saturn and Dreamcast. I didn't even know of the Master System either until sometime later.
>>387874234
80 million that they couldn't afford. I never said that is why they failed entirely. It is just yet another key blunder in their long lists of blunders. Shenmue did more damage than any good.
>>387874289
It is pathetic and sad since so many here just do not truly understand how big of a brand name Sega really was back then probably because they weren't born or are too young. SOJIDF is probably in this thread right now flinging shit about how they are the good guys. I mean I wouldn't be surprised if Sega really is shilling to make their selves look good kek. On a serious note though, they were able to ride out that Genesis success for awhile. People wanted Sega to succeed. Sega just had too big of an ego to succeed.

>>387874442
Ignore the shill. I already provided a real article proving him wrong. Meanwhile he still wants you to believe his shitposts.

>>387874381
I'm the same age as you and I love 16-bit sonic (except Sonic 2), the graphics of Sonic 1 have aged really well, and it plays with one button but it feels complex, it plays better than most faux retro games today honestly. You should give it a try in an emulator or play Mania.

>>387872667
This is true. People didn't mind that pretty much all the earliest PS1 games were 2D and some of them still were using codes because memory cards hadn't come out yet.

When I was a kid, 3D on consoles really wasn't even that impressive to me because I was playing PC games that did 3D a lot better and earlier than consoles anyway. The thing that impressed me the most however was getting arcade-grade graphics on a home console. It didn't matter if it was 2D or 3D as long as it looked good.

what a stupid fucking question OP

>>387874778
>shill
why do you have to do what? we are having a conversation
Your fucking binary DEFEAT-WIN mind is completely the reason /v/ is shit
>>387874645
To this day Ican't understand how the engineers actually thought the saturn was a good idea
The people working in the hardware business were not experienced enough

>>387874901
Saturn was pretty good for a 2D Console in conception, but they turned it into an abomination quite quickly for 3D in mind

I would have loved for Saturn to be a 2D powerhouse that focused on 2D games & Arcade perfect ports

>>387874823
My first system I played was a SNES at my babysitter's house. The PS came out like a year later and my parents got me one. At my age I didn't even realize the SNES couldn't do 3D and that it was special that the PS could. The difference didn't matter to my like 7 or 8 year old mind.

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>>387874901
>we are having a conversation

No we are not having a discussion. One side is insisting on spreading lies like he has some sort of vendetta against Kalinske. I also adore the complete lack of attention given to Bernie Stollar from this same shit poster.

Kalinske ist he man who made SEGA into a giant. Peter Moore came onboard a sinking ship. Yet Bernie's fuck ups are completely ignored by this guy.

Could the shit poster actually be none other than Bernie?

>>387870628
fpbp

>>387874901
>To this day Ican't understand how the engineers actually thought the saturn was a good idea
>The people working in the hardware business were not experienced enough

To be a bit fair here, consoles were still a relatively new thing due to the revival of gaming thanks to Nintendo and due to the beginnings of 3D. Still though you'd have to think it only makes much more sense for a console developer to make easier to develop for consoles but I guess a likely reason for it at least back then is that first party was in general a lot stronger (as in branding) than they are today. Today 3rd parties essentially blow out most first party shit in sales. Back then first party exclusives were truly a thing to look forward to. So I can see how each of the 3 wanted to build a machine that would give them unique exclusives you couldn't get anywhere else.

That is a huge thing with consoles then compared to now. The wars made so much more sense because of how different consoles were. Often games would be very different for each console if they were multiplatform. These days this doesn't really happen and when it does it is usually one game being vastly inferior on a console (like Switch/Wii U) then different.

Also yeah I'm going to post DEFEAT-WIN when I see some blatant bullshit being posted here. As I already said in regards to Sega, it is widely known among the neckbeards here that it is actually SOJ that fucked most things up for Sega.

>>387875129
>that spoiler

Possibly and SOJIDF too.

>>387875039
>I would have loved for Saturn to be a 2D powerhouse that focused on 2D games & Arcade perfect ports
me too but many of the great 2D games were left in japan and they didn't make any major sonic
A 2.5D sonic game would be everything saturn needed

>>387875129
>One side is insisting on spreading lies like he has some sort of vendetta against Kalinske
you are a schizophrenic
I've said many times I liked Tom but I just think he was also responsible for 32X and saturn launch

>>387875039
This actually might have been for the best in actuality. I don't care what people here say. 2D was still pretty strong at the time. Sure Saturn would likely have still been third but I'd bet it would have done so much better had it chose to be one or the other rather than doing both. If it were 2D we would have had 3 extremely unique consoles for the 5th gen. Would have made that gen even better in hindsight imo. With that said, a 2D powerful Saturn with nothing else would definitely have meant they would have had to release another console sooner, which they did anyways with the Dreamcast due to Saturn not selling well. Dreamcast would have had more hype behind it as well since it would have been the first official fully 3D Sega console.

Launch amazing Sonic game on a 2D powerhouse Saturn? I'd want a time machine just to go back to that alternate universe. Not to mention all the other amazing 2D games such a console would have had.

>>387875284
>The wars made so much more sense because of how different consoles were
and today we have no other option other than AMD and the same CPU
Sony could have done something different with PS3 but they wasted too much money to make a hard to develop CPU while AMD offered a very cheap alternative just as powerful
No company today invest in 2D or 2.5D games and they would never invest in something like Outrun or Afterburner

>>387875609
>I've said many times I liked Tom

That doesn't suddenly make your claims about Tom being responsible for the Saturn and 32X launches valid. There's numerous articles and recollections proving the exact opposite. The 32X was an ill-fated idea from its inception. The Saturn was rushed to the market because the suits in Japan panicked. Neither of these decisions were directly attributed to Tom. This was papa SOJ knowing best and SOJ will do what it pleases.

When all of your good ideas get shot down, all your left with are shit. What a surprise when not even Tom can polish turds despite his various successes and experience throughout the years as a CEO for various successful companies.

>>387875832
Well 3rd party developer/publishers have way too much power today anyways. In fact Microsoft throws tantrums and doesn't even want games on their console if it is much superior on the Playstation consoles. It is basically a pipe dream to get your hopes up for any of these consoles to truly be different. Gaming advanced too much past this anyways to where differences largely wouldn't matter anyways unless you are a turbo nerd and know what to look for. This is why Nintendo sticks to gimmicks now. They can't compete directly with Sony and Microsoft but they can gimmick their selves to a win still imo.

>>387876126
if I win 1 billion dollars one day I will pay someone to make a sequel to
Outrun
Afterburner
Scud Race
Sega Rally
Streets of Rage
Street Fighter Alpha 4

>>387870628
I genuinely believe that Mania good reception couldn't have happened without 3D games going full retard and indie devs shitting up good 2D stuff.

Anyway, it really goes to tell that 3D turned people into retards back then.

>>387876265
Make sure Max comes back in Streets of Rage.

>>387869868
did sonic adventure save the dreamcast?

stop asking dumb questions

>>387870871
>3D of that generation sucks
better than modern 3d games

>>387871357
sega of japan killed sonic xtreme, the only game that could save the saturn

>>387876916
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzvS_beXtXk
Is this legit?

>>387877243
Yes that is legit. That game would have been ass. Which is why Sega cancelled it.

>>387877574
it doesn't look bad except for the fish eye camera

>>387877574
I always thought it looked pretty good

>>387877574
It would have been worth playing it at least for the soundtrack, the leaked tracks of the game are good.

I don't see how this could compete with Mario 64 or the big Playstation platformers though, it looks like a novelty third party title.

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>look for some Mania videos
>front page gets filled with """celebrities""" bashing the franchise
>they'll inevitably mention 06

>>387877821
I only open youtube to watch game sack and search for old PS2 gameplays

>>387877821
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RkPnepwOj_o

>>387878052
>8.7

HAHA DEAD IN THE WATER

Scoring systems are fucking shit anyway. Of course a short game is going to get shit on in favor of 20 hour long "epic" AAA games

>>387878052
Sonic 3 and mania are still better than all 2d mario games since Super Mario World 2

The 3D boom was happening around then and it would've just been scorned for not trying to be a 3D game.

>>387878465
Weird how Nintendo apparently forgot how to make a great 2D mario game after going 3D.

>>387878446
>>387878465
did you actually watch the video?

>>387878661
they simply abandoned 2D Games after 1996 except for Kirby and a couple of metroid games
>>387878691
yes I was just thinking about how reviewers actually believe new super mario bross wii/wii u is better than sonic

>>387877574
There are so many things that went wrong with X-Treme, dude
>started as a tie-in game for the ABC cartoon
>then a 32X launch title
>then someone saw the episode of Home Movies where Brendan wants a fish-eye lens and took the wrong lesson from it, so the game had to use that
>then the Saturn got a last-minute architecture change to support 3D graphics that killed the engine's performance
>so they borrowed the engine from NiGHTS
>Yuji Naka screamed in autistic rage until they took it away
>by now the game was half NiGHTS engine, half original engine
>the original engine was the one sega execs told them to use
>programmer died of pneumonia with no documentation
>replacement programmer's health failing
>oh hey the Dreamcast guys just made Sonic Adventure and it's a thousand times better than this

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>7 days

>>387879498
>Dreamcast guys just made Sonic Adventure and it's a thousand times better than this
I'm still mad they didn't fix the camera for the Gamecube/PSN/Xbox Arcade release
I'd pay them to fix it

>>387879529
>Console players have played through it like 30 times over at this point
NOT FAIR

>>387879529
Still waiting here too.

no because its just a shitty rehash

>>387878465
even nsmb2 is better than every sonic game

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>>387879639
>>387879759
>he spent too much money on a memevdia and now can't afford a PSs4

>>387878465
>Super Mario World 2
>Yoshit Island featuring crybaby Mario in collectathonland
>better than classic Sonic or Mania

>>387869868
Fuck no. 2/3rds of the game is a retread of past games. It would've been torn apart back then.

>>387880617
I didn't say that I said Super Mario World 2 was the latest good 2D super mario game

Hahaha no way
It would have been laughed at as a rehash and would have been an embarrassment in an era that was all over 3D

>>387870628
The giant ring are 3d. I luv 'em.

>>387869868
>Sega expects people tu buy the same game ????

This would be the title of most articles back then.
Well, maybe, afterall we had SFII which is the absolute emperor of rehashes.

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>>387882448
>the rings
>the special stages
>the statue in the metal sonic fight
God I love it so much. I'm glad it's not abundant but I wish there was a little bit more of it in the game. Maybe give the Heavy King a shitty 3D model in the final boss fight since he has the ruby.

>>387882721
I'm disappointed by how bland the final fight looked. I was hoping for some Knuckles Chaotix level 3D fuckery.

Is this a general Mania thread? Because I have to mention my amazement at the Egg Reverie stage.
Seriously, I were thinking "How would they top a Final Boss fight set in the space like The Doomsday Zone?" Luckily the answer was...

>A FUCKING BATTLE IN ANOTHER DIMENSION
>AND AGAINST TWO BAD GUYS AT THE SAME TIME
>ALSO THE TIME COUNTER GOING CRAZY

literally the best threesome of my life.

>>387878465
Sonic 3 & Knuckles is the best 2D platformer of all time. My favorite game of all time. I don't give two fucks what the /v/irgins here say. Yes it is better than any Mario game I've played. Mario are overrated platformers. Tons have came since then and improved upon what Mario has done greatly. Meanwhile there are almost no 2D sonic clones since you need really good level design to make the games shine.

>>387883512
What on earth was good about that fight? It's literally over in no time flat if you just land on the ground and jump at them a few times rather than try to use any of Super Sonic's abilities.

>>387870961
>and haven't seen those zones in years
Nah, I am really, really tired of GH and CP zones. Like really sick of it all. God damn at least do Emerald Hills and Marble Zone to mix it up with the nostalgia pandering, Mario never rehashed this hard.

>>387883738
>Mario never rehashed this hard
>Literally four straight games with the same 7-8 level themes

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>>387883738
>Mario never rehashed this hard.
>4 NSMB games
>All with the same world themes
>3 of which using the koopalings for boss fights
I like Mario but I'm much more tired of that shit than I am of any Green zone. At least Odyssey looks great.

>>387878465
Nah, NSMBU + Luigi U btfo both of them. But they are still great.

>>387870628
If it was a Saturn launch title, I think it would have been fine.

The Saturn came out in '94, Mario 64 was two years later.

>>387876462
While I do think Mania would have gotten good reception either way, I do agree that the biggest reason for it getting as much love as it has is because the 3D games were doing so poorly.

If the 3D games were as well received as Mario 64 was, then Mania would have no reason to exist. (Especially if Sonic 4 was actually good.)

>>387880973
You are still just as wrong.

>>387883830
>>387883897
They still at least looked different, despite what your memes have tried to sell people.

>>387884203
Can't tell if I'm being baited or if you really are this retarded.

>>387883529
It would be good to see what Mario fandom can do when it comes to make own games...

Sadly Nintedon't doesn't give them the support they need and deserve... aside from the awful Mario Me-Maker

>>387883738
Is there even a difference between green hill zone and emerald hill zone?

Not at all. Times were different then and the craze, the hype were too high. People wanted to see the transition to 3D and experience their favorite franchises in 3D. Mario 64 took off the way it did because it was revolutionary. It would've made a nice 32X game and a great send off, using pieces of the special stages as hype. But it wouldn't have saved it. Critics would have complained about rehash levels then, which are classic, nostalgic levels now. It was STI's job to save Sonic and the Saturn but they failed worse than a bunch of interns. They couldn't code, design, and they were out of their league.

>>387884024
It would have sold well as a launch title, yeah. Though it would most definitely have been the last major 2D sonic game to be made in that era, since no doubt the next one would have been a 3D one.

But nah, they decided to rush Sonic 3D Blast for 1996 instead. But at that point those graphics were nowhere close to being on par with Mario 64. It felt like Sega was still trying to compete with Donkey Kong Country like they were two steps behind

>>387884092
Mario 64 good reception is way overrated. People wanted more 2D Mario even back then.

>>387884314
As long as they calm their autism down and not make levels that only the most extreme of autists can beat I would bet they can do a better job than Nintendo at this point.

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>>387884203
>They still at least looked different, despite what your memes have tried to sell people.
I have literally played all 4 of them barring the Luigi dlc for U. The most interesting ground they ever tread is the few ghost levels in U that have a painting aesthetic.

>>387884364
Most of /v/ claim Memerald Hill to be godlike for any reason although is just fucking GHZ without totems and palm trees

>>387883738
>Mario never rehashed this hard
If you ignore the whole New Mario series.

>>387884314
Get some of the guys from SMW Central.

I really don;t think the "lack" of a 2D sonic really affected what Sonic became. Believe it or not Jam was pretty fucking rad with it's original mode and museum which gave us such great shit as "Hero of the Year". Xtreme was a fucking disaster but it looked awful and I expected no less from STI. Plus there was Sonic R (Which got referenced in Mania) and 3D blasts. It's not like Sonic died on the Saturn or anything.

I mean Mania would have changed something but that's like saying what history would be like if Teddy Roosevelt went back in time and killed Hitler.

>>387885646

Jam was ports of genesis games, Xtreme was shit and got canned for it, Sonic R was a slippery mess thrown together just in case people didn't want to play 3D Blast, ANOTHER genesis port. If it had an original title to launch with, it would have done it good, not a bunch of ports and a godawful original game.

>>387869868

No. People would have called it a rehash for using so many remixed versions of old stages.