What type of spell casting does /v/ prefer? >Dedicated spellcasting

Oblivion and Morrowind did it right

I don't know what they were thinking with Skyrim.

>>386287686
Morrowind's spellcasting is closer to Skyrim's than the one in Oblivion.

I like Oblivion for certain types of characters, but if I want to be a spellcaster I'd rather Skyrim style or a staff/wand that can be used

>>386287497
Obviously not fucking Skyrim
Oblivion magic was good because it mixed with the gameplay a lot better

spellcasting in a good engine.

Dedicated spellcasting button, of course.
Ideally something akin to bioshock 2's plasmid system.

I prefer the way Arx Fatalis did it.

>>386287686
You're an idiot. Morrowind's spellcasting (casting, not spellmaking, or skills, or anything else) was pretty much like Skyrim's, except more restrictive.

They made a step forward with Oblivion's offhand spellcasting, then two steps back in Skyrim. Classic Bethesda.

>>386287847
>>386288730
>the played vanilla morrowind

loving
every
laugh

>>386289218
>morrowind fags

every
single
time

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>>386287497

Dedicated spellcasting button like in oblivion makes magic too OP. There's literally no reason NOT to use magic when you can cast spells regardless of what your wielding.

Skyrim/dark souls spell casting is more balanced, since it forces you to have to choose what spells and equipment you'll be using in what hand and how you'll have to adapt your play style around that. Ideally, there should be a way to have both types of spell cast present.
>you can shoot spells via your weapon, but it'll have to be enchanted or some shit

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>>386289218
>he was born after 2002
Don't you feel foolish?

>>386289417
product of the 80s, pham

>>386289394
have fun playing shitty games

>>386289410
>dark souls spell casting
Dark Souls spell casting was absolute fucking garbage.
>OP as fuck
>tremendous range in a game with retarded, close-range AI
>stops you dead in place
>no variety in spells AT ALL
>utility spells are useless outside of very specific cases in PvP
>needs you to equip another item despite you knowing the spells already
>needs you to specifically assign your spells at a checkpoint despite you knowing the spells already
>spells are treated like items despite not being scrolls
>shitty, tier-and-damage based upgrades
No. Souls games did very, very few things right, and magic wasn't one of them.

>>386289410
>Skyrim/dark souls spell casting is more balanced
fuck the balance and fuck you
bloodborne has the funniest casting system simply because it ditched awful catalysts

>>386287497
Magicka does spell casting perfectly

>>386289763
Bloodborne magic is shit tier simply because even sneezing takes up Quicksilver bullets.

>>386289909
quicksilver bullets are literally non-issue because of a blood bullet system
which is a great compromise between mana bar and vancian casting

>>386287497
I prefer memorizing different combinations of elements to produce spells

>>386289763
>>386290069
I really hate the 'magic' system. Trinkets that lock you in place, telegraph an attack so obvious an infant could dodge it for the cost of my health and bullets. Oh boy.

>>386289637
>shitty game
>plays morrowind

kek

Skyrim's two handed spell casting system would have been great if mixing spells did anything besides just cast two separate spells at the same time. Imagine something like mixing a lightning stream with bolts of ice causes said bolts to explode midair and act like flak. Mixing fire and ice creates boiling steam etc.

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>>386290523
you sound like shitter, anon
bb of all fromsoft games has a magic that is quite usable in pvp, second only to des as far as speed and precision goes

>>386289410
Or you can just map spells to keys in skyrim and just switch between up to 9 spells instantly?

>>386289410
>Skyrim
>Balanced Magic
the magic is so fucking garbage that it isn't even worth thinking about

>>386290871
How could they go so wrong with dark souls 3 magic after both ds2 and bb improved on it?

>>386290871
>30fps
how do you do it

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>>386291771
ds2 spellcasting is dogshit and ds3 is way funnier in that aspect, especially if you're a faith caster or pyro
no idea why they ignored bb's improvements though

>>386290856
Fable 3 did that.

>>386292041
>ds2 spellcasting is dogshit
They're exactly the fucking same with the exception that DS2's magic is actually viable in pvp.

I prefer Skyrim's version, but I played a spellsword with no shield, so it worked pretty well for me.

>>386289685
>Souls games did very, very few things right
lol

>>386287497
I prefer a hybrid system. Spells that cast buffs on your character or summoning spells should be able to be cast while having weapon out. This makes paladin and other magic/warrior hybrids less annoying to play. Target or touch spells should have to be equipped in place of a weapon, since they are specifically designed for offensive play.

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>>386292557
>prenerf GRS
It was a time to be alive

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>>386292557
no, they are not
>no on-hold spells like lighting arrow which is also probably the single best thing faith builds got since the ds1 wog
>elemental damage can be easily negated so hard you can shut down any enemy spellcaster just by equipping a 100% elemental resistant shield
>spells are so fucking predictable even at max casting speed you can dodge them with your eyes closed, even "homing" ones, meanwhile DS3 added great soul dregs and black serpent, probably the best homing spells in series
>half-assed soul greatsword that is a pale shadow of the same spell from ds3 where it actually got cross-melee combos with heysel pick and 3 other versions of melee sorceries
>no poisecast mechanic which means aggressive rushdown shuts mages up
>DOGSHIT pyromancers overnerfed into oblivion that were robbed of free aim mechanic and got terrifying cast speed nerfs across the board
if ds2 actually kept beta mechanics like spell aiming or fire sorceries, it could be cool
right now it's a pile of shit in no way comparable to post-TRC ds3 magic

>>386292557
DS3 somehow made a focus bar worse than the vancian shit they had going with 1 and 2. DS2 was kinda fun in that you could attune the same spell multiple times and get more than enough casts for whatever you needed.

>>386293469
Focus bar is actually really cool, it removed busywork of getting multiple spell stacks and feels more like sorcerer spellcasting that gives you a pool of casts and allows you to decide for what you will use them.
A single blue flask is also extremely efficent, for example a cleric can pull off 3 full HP heals per a single blue flasks when a single estus would only restore 600 HP.

Invoker/Magicka method.

>>386291448
This.
And mods make magic op as fuck, you can literraly be a god

>>386293995
The wizard in gauntlet works that way. Pretty fun last time I played, though they overhauled the game a little since then.

>>386293420
>that second swing

dude, c'mon that should have hit you

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>>386291448
>Playing Skyrim
>Low-level character
>Find Clairvoyance scroll
>Cast it
>Trail leads off the path through a valley
>Follow it
>End up in some ruins populated by a bunch of Frost Trolls

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>>386293420
No matter how much you praise Ds3 magic it wont stop it from doing the worst damage it ever has for the entire series.

>"spells are so fucking predictable even at max casting speed you can dodge them with your eyes closed, even "homing" ones, meanwhile DS3 added great soul dregs and black serpent, probably the best homing spells in series"
>Implying the Ds3 rolling with infinite i-frames isnt infinitly more broken than the lasting hitboxes of Ds2
>"half-assed soul greatsword that is a pale shadow of the same spell from ds3 where it actually got cross-melee combos with heysel pick and 3 other versions of melee sorceries"
>Defending melee sorcery weapons when split damage goes through multiple defenses in Ds3 and therefore does no damage

>"DOGSHIT pyromancers overnerfed into oblivion that were robbed of free aim mechanic and got terrifying cast speed nerfs across the board"
And even with all that said, A grand majority of the pyromancies were fun as shit to use, And you can still free-aim wtf you talking about.
Meanwhile Ds3 has a grand total of 3 actually damaging pyromancies.

Any and all magic in Ds3 is trash.

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>>386295383
actually in terms of magical damage ds3 shares a lot of values with ds1, the only difference is that you need to use staff buff and all sorcery boosters to achieve it and there's no dark bead-type sorcery, and in terms of pyromancy damage it straight surpasses ds1
>muh rolling
even with ds3 rolling it's infinitely easier to hit something with magic simply because they added on-hold spells and unnerfed things like black flame
good luck hitting any player who has half a brain with magic in ds2, however
>Defending melee sorcery weapons
why should i "defend" high-tier weapons, micropenis?
heysel pick combos go up to like 800-900 damage because that thing has true combos with soul gs and old moonlight
>A grand majority of the pyromancies were fun as shit to use
no, they weren't
fireball-type pyros had virtually no manual aiming, try to throw it under your legs and see what will happen
combustion felt absolutely awful
there was no fire surge for finishing people
the only worthy addition ds2 did to pyromancies is forbidden sun and then they nerfed it into obivion, thankfully chaos bed vestiges in ds3 is extremely powerful

>>386293420
>spells are so fucking predictable even at max casting speed you can dodge them with your eyes closed, even "homing" ones,
>meanwhile DS3 added great soul dregs and black serpent, probably the best homing spells in series

How can one person contradict himself so hard.

GSD and black serpent are two of the slowest spells in the entire series. The only reason why GSD is good is because its cast speed is so fucked you can easily roll past the first projectile only to be hit by the second one as you get up

Black Serpent is only good because it has a fast cast speed and will follow you to the ends of the earth, making it fantastic for melee hybrids to rush into melee while your opponent is busy dodging the snake.

>>386292041
jesus christ, I wish I could be a part of a shitshow like this

>>386296481
ds3 homing spells actually follow you instead of ds2's formula of "take two steps to the left and it will miss you"
GSD is so good because of a massive hitbox and acceleration it gets past some distance in addition to tracking, and it hits like a truck

>>386296183
>good luck hitting any player who has half a brain with magic in ds2
I run a dual blue flame build, ain't really that hard
>homing arrow
>homing arrow
>homing arrow
>homing arrow
>crystal spear

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>>386296672
that's literally a common day in irithyll, anon
make an SL~50 pyro and join the fun

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>>386296869
>take two steps to the left or simply roll when you see an obvious and painfully telegraphed tell
>proceed to melt your face with estoc
i've seen such an amount of shit eating casters on ds2 arena i lost count of them, and all of them were equally awful simply because magic in ds2 sucks ass

>>386297072
No, really, the build works wonders. People gets used to the timing of the homing arrow. Painfully slow, then speeds up, takes a half second wait before rolling, which is the reason you then chew up the crystal spear. Crystal spear should be more telegraphed but it's actually a pretty quick cast in 2. It's true that skilled players will dodge most of the shit, but that's why you get gud in melee in the first place

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>we will never get a game where magic isn't just superpower laser blasts
>we will never get a game that makes us feel like a fuckin wizard
>we will never get a game with a sourceless magic system, no mana bars or spell slots
>we will never get a game that allows us to study an improve our magic in real time via experimentation with ingredients, combining magical methods, utilizing potent times and places and more
>tfw you will never explore the continent for magical ingredients and search crypts for ancient tomes
>tfw you will never powerful ritual spells or cast curses on the fly
>tfw you will never engage rival wizards in arcane duels calling down elemental spirits and supernatural disasters
>tfw we will never get a game that makes magic magical

>>386297615
Magic doesn't feel magical in vidya because it has to follow a well defined system of rules. In literature and film it can be mystical and unexplained, but in vidya (if the player is going to use it) it has to have clearly defined limitations.

Example:

>Literature
‘Go and fetch Saruman, since you have become his footman, Gríma Wormtongue!’ said Gandalf. ‘And do not waste our time!’
The window closed. They waited. Suddenly another voice spoke, low and melodious, its very sound an enchantment. Those who listened unwarily to that voice could seldom report the words that they heard; and if they did, they wondered, for little power remained in them. Mostly they remembered only that it was a delight to hear the voice speaking, all that it said seemed wise and reasonable, and desire awoke in them by swift agreement to seem wise themselves. When others spoke they seemed harsh and uncouth by contrast; and if they gainsaid the voice, anger was kindled in the hearts of those under the spell. For some the spell lasted only while the voice spoke to them, and when it spoke to another they smiled, as men do who see through a juggler’s trick while others gape at it. For many the sound of the voice alone was enough to hold them enthralled; but for those whom it conquered the spell endured when they were far away, and ever they heard that soft voice whispering and urging them. But none were unmoved; none rejected its pleas and its commands without an effort of mind and will, so long as its master had control of it.

>Vidya
Plus 5 to Speech checks.

Dual wielding spells makes spells only a possibility, which allows for medium ranged gameplay as well as pretending you have force lightning.

You shouldn't be able to cast while holding both a weapon and shield, and there should be a delay if you try casting while holding a two-handed weapon or bow. However, it shouldn't be like in Morrowind where you have to entirely switch gears to cast a spell.

Skyrim's magic system was good fundamentally, but ended up being shit because they cut out like 50% of the spells that appeared in past games for literally no fucking reason. I modded half the goddamn spells back into the game myself, and I am by no means a skilled programmer. The fact that there was not even a cure disease spell in that game shows how plainly incompetent Bethesda are. It took me all of ten minutes in the creation kit to make my own.

>>386297615
I too would love a more serious Magicka

>autistic /dasg/ webm spammer unironically defending dark shit 3 and its ass magic

go back

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>>386297615
Dominions 4

It pretty much has the best magic of any game ever, though it is a strategy game, so it's not exactly what you're describing
>Cover the world in eternal darkness
>Speed up the aging process of every living thing on the planet, causing them to die within months
>Conjure a Ghost Ship armada and its admiral, who will plunder your foe's shores forever or until death
>Create a vortex of blood that sings a siren song, capable of being heard across the world, so that mortals will wander into it and kill themselves to fuel your Blood magic.
>Create a spell that causes demons to appear in the dreams of powerful individuals who oppose you. The demons will attempt to persuade the victim to sell their soul and join you.
>Trap the sun inside of a magical labyrinth, condemning the world to eternal darkess and also giving you boosts to magic as you siphon energy from the trapped sun.
>Siphon off all the horror and plague and suffering from the world to gain massive boosts to death magic, but also pretty much turning the world into a joyful utopia, causing everyone to gain increased bonuses from their provinces
>Unleash spirits of vengeance who will hunt down all the evildoers and Blood Magic practitioners of the world
>Create a second sun, causing the world to be blanketed in eternal light
>Create an enchantment that passively smites undead in your dominion with holy fire
>Create an enchantment that passively animates water in your dominion to assassinate enemy commanders

And loads more. There's something like 600 unique spells in the game across 7 schools and 8 magic paths of varying power and utility.

>>386300081
Isn't it just a map simulator though?

>>386298639
I know you can't perfectly replicate a fairy tale-esque mysticism, but there's such a sore lack of variety in a lot of magic systems these days, or it just feels like it. I'd love a deeply autistic open world survival crafting game except you're a wizard who needs to scrounge for ingredients for spells, from there you can add gestures, incantation and words of power, pacts with spirits and morw to your spells, the more you explore, the crazier stuff you can find and experiment with. Spell variety is a necessity. Lots of different practical stuff, offensive options, defensive options, sneaky options, brute force options, levitation, walk through walls, see through walls, shields, summoning, buffs and debuffs, hovering lights, shit, let me be a goddamn wizard.

No mana bar, no spell slots, if you have it, you can cast it. Hoard fireball ingredients for days! Yell words of power to deflect enemy attacks, you don't just run out vaguely defined energy or forget shit like a retard. Magic should be like cooking, if you have the ingredients and a little know-how, you can do it.

>>386300170
Yes. It has an interesting setting, but the gameplay is distilled autism.

>>386290871
that looks like broccoli on your head

>>386300483
It's known as broccoli mode for a reason

>>386299697
There was a lot cut just because they wanted the stupid fuckin 11/11/11 release date.

>>386287497
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LesIchrdNkk

Why not magic like in Fable: TLC?

>>386300081
Thanks anon, I might try this if my toaster can run it

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>>386300170
I guess. In the same way that Diablo 2 is a clicking simulator and the Witcher 3 is a walking simulator. You can make anything sound bad if you boil it down to two words.

>>386301372
All I've ever seen is pictures of the map, so I thought it was like a Paradox game

>>386288724
this
casting needs to be more than a button press, any kind of ritual casting is good

>>386301525
Everything does happen on the map and various other sub menus but you get to watch replays of battles to see how your units did.

I recommend at least watching a lets play. It is similar to a grand strategy, but simplified in most of the areas people would find autistic.

>>386301525
the game is mostly about crunching numbers and memorizing huge lists of spells so you can plan battles hundreds of turns in advance.

>>386302480
Have you played Master of Magic?

>magic can't just come out from your hand, wand, scroll, or staff but instead must be performed using reagents or rituals that often involve sacrifice and are intrinsically linked to some supernatural force in the world

The only correct answer.

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>not even 50 posts in and this has already devolved into an elder scrolls/dark souls shit flinging contest
see you next thread magic boys

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>>386287497
I don't think my preferred spellcasting type is in a game
>beginner
hold the book/scroll/whatever the spell is written on in one hand, the catalyst in the other, have to stand still and cite the spell
>apprentice
doesn't need a book/scroll/whatever in his hand but still needs to stand still and need a catalyst
>master
you can freely cast any spell your learned while moving, catalyst only enhances the power/reduces mana cost

>>386291448
Dude, magic is broken as fuck in skyrim when you have the stagger perk + destruction magic reduction enchantments.

>>386302859

Not that poster, but the time you get that shit you could have just been rolling with 2 handed weapons and demolishing everything in your path from the get-go while still doing everything magic can do at later levels.

That was the issue with Skyrim's shit magic system and why Morrowind's was infinitely better -- magic was literally "not as much damage as melee, not as much range as using a bow". It was a shitty mid-range mid-damage option.

>>386287497
I CAST FIST

>>386302859
broken as fuck for all the wrong reasons, it did fuckall damage midgame and its only saving grace was stunlocking enemies since destruction damage didn't scale worth shit

>>386304257
It didn't scale at all. The only improvements you got from levelling the Destruction tree was more cost effective mana-per-cast.

Conjuration had the same problem. You were stuck with the same three shitty summons for the whole game. There were exactly as strong at maxed out conjuration skill as they were when you first got the spell to summon them, the only thing that changed was the duration. Even the most powerful one was totally useless against even basic mook enemies by the midgame.

>>386292041
>that dodge roll
It looks so retarded, even in its native game, let alone in others.

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>>386287497
Like in black and white, but not possible in a fast paced action packed fps.

>>386302856
I like this, this would be a neat visual indicator of skill actually

>>386287686
are you insane? skyrim has the best magic handling in the series.

bethesda just fucked up by removing spell crafting and making magic useless in general.

>>386307563
>be able to 1 hit a god
I know i love it, but it was too much.

two world 2 had a nice magic system

>>386307563
>skyrim has the best magic handling in the series
>making magic useless in general

Dude it was absolute shit

>>386287497
Whichever one blows the clothes off my enemy