If you didn't play MMOs before WoW you don't know shit

>>385461976
If you play MMOs, you don't know shit about video games, and don't deserve to play or discuss them.

>>385462081
If you play any video games, you don't know shit about video games, and don't deserve to play or discuss them.

>fight boss for 24+ hours straight, whittling down its HP
>heals itself all the damage you've done, effectively wasting an entire day of your life
I get the appeal, but shit like this is why MMOs are the worst genre.

>>385461976
>>385462081
>>385462189
I like this thread.

>>385462529
There was a way to prevent it from using Benediction, so...

>>385462189
If you play any video games, you don't know shit about art, and doesn't deserve to watch or discuss it.

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>>385462701
>The methods to curb Absolute Virtue's difficulty were officially revealed when the development team released a video with hints on how to defeat it in 2008, nearly 3 years after the battle was introduced. However, the video was heavily criticized for being too vague and not providing adequate hints on how to defeat the monster. Furthermore, said method posted was quickly patched.

>Absolute Virtue had, on several occasions, been fought and held by linkshells for over 30 hours trying to defeat it, to no avail.

Is there any record of the reactions from the linkshells that experienced AV healing itself after all that time? Fuck...

>>385461976
>Knowledge of video games depends entirely on playing a certain genre before a certain game came out
what fucking logic is that

>>385461976
If you played MMOs before MUDs/MUCKs then
you don't know shit about video games and don't deserve to play or discuss them.

>>385462965
Didn't SE just continually nerf every method used to defeat him because they considered it the wrong way?

>>385463205
Yeah, if it wasn't the method they wanted, they would buff AV to counter the weakness

>>385461976
is this real

>>385461976
does Runescape count?

>>385462189
This should be a banner for /v/.

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The final redpill is that MMOs like TESO/GW2 are superior to MMOs like XIV/WoW.

Focusing on fun gameplay with self-direction and lots of exploration is superior to "endgame" content-grinder linear repeat ad-infinitum games where everyone gets autistic and does [Raid] (normal) to do [Raid] (Hard) to do [Raid] (DOUBLE MEGA HARD).

Sub fees also invalidate """traditional""" MMOs.

>>385463159
Fuck me I remember playing MUDs before MMOs was a thing. I was like 6 or 7 and my english fucking sucks.

>Go north
>You can't go north
>"Wtf why?!"
>You have been killed by XX_Sephiroth_XX
>Write in chat "HOW DO I PLAY THIS GAME"
>You have to >look to get an idea of your surroundings
>Shut it down and play with my Digimon tamagotchi

>>385463529
So what was THE method to actually kill him? I played FFXI for years, but never made it to end game CoP stuff because I was doing Zilart content when everyone was doing statics for CoP.

>>385461976
MMOs were always a low tier genre. I liked UO, but that was more because internet and my computer sucked dick and couldn't play much else without lag spikes and poor performance.

>>385462965
>People think XI is a good game

>>385462965

it wasn't a one-off surprise or anything, any shit linkshell could stop her regen for a while and see a Benediction, just by throwing bodies at her. but she'd just keep doing 2hr abilities and shitting on you anyway. much of those "30 hours" is just going to be holding the boss so it doesn't despawn.

>>385463093
WoW single handedly ruined the entire MMO genre so bad that it carried over into just about every other genre.
Gone are the days of actually figuring things out, knowing what actual team work is like, the struggle for obtaining something you are attempting to achieve, actual trust and loyalty being more than catch phrases.

If you didn't play FFXI in it's golden age then your level of understanding gaming is about as relevant as crappy cell phone games trying to take your money every 10min

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>>385463205
Pretty much. If people didn't play with their toys correctly, they'd make up rules. It was like playing a game with a kid; If you were winning, they'd make up a new rule on the spot so that they could win.

Whatever. I got my title. Most of his drops are only minor upgrades if I recall correctly. The fight is just about having the title to show you did it.

Meanwhile, few people remember the EVEN MORE FUCKED UP NM that they made in the next expansion.

>>385465530
much better than XIV

>>385465369
It had something to do with killing spawns in a certain way. However latency made it really hard to do, which is why SE could pull it off super easy but everyone else couldn't.

I'll try to find something talking about it.

>>385465702

I miss FFXI so much. It's not even nearly as hard as it used to be either.

>>385465369
I might be remember the wrong boss but I think you had to use each job's super 300% TP move at the same time he used certain abilities? Some specific horseshit like that.

>>385465169
But GW2 is the worst MMO I ever played even behind SWtOR...

Legion had more content, features, and polish at launch than Stormblood. XIV was a mistake compared to WoW AND XI. It blows my mind that so many people on /v/ defend it tooth and nail.

>>385462081
this

>>385466517
swimming and diving was a mistake

>>385461976
>If you didn't play MMOs before WoW you don't know shit about video games, and don't deserve to play or discuss them.
You say that like MMOs are good games to play and not shitty grinding social bullshit.

>>385465702
>WoW single handedly ruined the entire MMO genre
This is the same flawed thinking of "Starcraft killed RTS games!". The game didn't ruin the genre. Everyone else saw the success of one game, copied it to death and the genre ruined itself.

>>385466402
There is no such thing as a "super 300% TP move" what game are you even thinking about?

>>385466104
>arguing over shit games
WoW is the best MMO ever made.

>>385465702
Tigole ruined MMOs. He guided the genre into a shitty formula with Everquest and then made it law with WoW.

>>385466453
There's no basis for that criticism. GW2 is extremely polished, and while flawed, is miles ahead of tab-target trinity MMOs like WoW and XIV.

>>385467329
GW2 was shit for hipster retards, XIV and XI are shitty weeb dumpster games for brainless morons. WoW blows everything else out of the water.

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>>385467329
GW2 is trash. Go to bed Sean.

>>385467560
You only think it's trash because it rejects the traditional, flawed parts of MMOs. Those same parts gave you Stockholder Syndrome so you don't even know that they're bad.

>>385467035

retard

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>>385466148
Google brought these
>Final Fantasy XI has Absolute Virtue. When it was first released, it was supposedly killable ("the Development Team killed it with 18 people"), but anytime players have managed to kill it Square has nerfed the method that they used within weeks. Worse yet, their released information on how they killed it required violating their own TOS. For a long time, it remained this; however, Absolute Virtue is now defeated on a regular basis by many linkshells.
>It turns out it was originally supposed to be unbeatable. Then people started beating it, but every time a winning strategy was found against Absolute Virtue, the dev. team altered either its behavior or the mechanics of the game to break the strategy. They would also occasionally ban the players who won using it.
>Interviews have revealed that Absolute Virtue was never meant to be beaten, and that he was supposed to be the risk for killing the last boss of the Sea region.
>the devs had strung along the player base with implications that it was supposed to be beatable, including releasing an incomprehensible video that supposedly gave hints to beating it. It was in fact downed several times, but the devs usually declared these attempts exploits, which only added to the confusion.
Now if I personally remember correctly, the method they wanted players to beat it with was bad because it required an input reader, which is very bannable and violates TOS.

>>385461976
>design a boss where you need to use an ability with a TWO HOUR COOLDOWN to lock out its ability to use it again
>make the timing window very tight
>don't account for the fact that the servers are in fucking japan and no one could hit the window without the use of a bot

IM STILL FUCKING MAD FUCK YOU SE

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>>385467696
Jokes on you I never played any traditional MMO before playing GW2 and I know it's fucking garbage.

I liked Ragnarok Online, and the high level content up to Renewal. After Renewal I lost interest in the game.

I played xi before wow but i never saw that fight, and im glad i didnt, why would you design some shit takes 36+ hours

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IT HURTS

>>385466517
XIV's pretty low effort, though. That's what draws so many people to it. It's very, very casual.

In fact, would it be a stretch to say that it competes with WoW in casual terms? There's not much difference in player skill for someone who's played for 100 hours, and someone sinking 1000. Neither will know their rotations, or know them well.

>>385466880
>shitty grinding social bullshit.
Good MMOs are more about having many opportunities for things to be more achievable through cooperation, but they don't force you into it. Runescape did this well, although it seems to be a lot more solo inclined than it used to be.

In older MMOs, you can do a lot of things solo, given enough patience and talent, but things are much more smooth with more people. In XIV, though, you're doing simpleton battles with strangers from other servers or from a raid group on your server at a scheduled time because the roulette put you with them, or because they were the only group recruiting or they were your friends before you played the game and you dragged them into it, and afterwards, you get something ev. It's not very social, and the fights aren't that difficult to memorise - they're simply more complex scripts to follow. It's because the game before that point only attracted people who would like point and walk handholding gameplay, so the difficulty comes from them being poorly suited.

In XIV, after every expansion, every update, there's always a period of fucking nothing, where you've got your clears, got your tokens maxed and don't feel like leveling another job just because you haven't got anything better to do.

>>385467979
Yeah you had to kill certain adds the moment it casted a 2 hour or some shit like that.

>>385461976
>tfw EQOA will never get private servers for PS2 emulation

>>385468092
Not him, but its actually pretty good. The world is massive and rewards you for actually exploring it and being a part of it. Combat is a hell of a lot better than traditional tab targeting, and WvWvW is fun as fuck.

Thats not to say there isnt a lot of it thats bad, but of the MMOs out it is one of the better ones. Maybe not as good as WoW, but at least both games storylines are trash

>>385467979
I call bullshit. If it was supposed to be unbeatable then its drop table would just be empty. Article probably just wanted hits and didn't think anyone could refute them.

>>385467242
you are cancer, WoW will always be the worst game as it open the gateway to Anita Sarkestian and whiny twitter SJW hipster douchebags

I tried to save you /v/ but you have forsaken me

>>385462701

>Had to watch cloud beneath the monster's feet to find out which 2h it was using
>All servers were Japanese
>Benediction goes off before you can even tell it's being used

>>385468448
Apparently the drop table was indeed empty according to the same interviews. After people cheesed it once they added a drop table. Same googling, right after the "sea" part.
>Interviews have revealed that Absolute Virtue was never meant to be beaten, and that he was supposed to be the risk for killing the last boss of the Sea region. After players figured out how to kill him through exploits, they made him a guaranteed pop and gave him a loot table which he did not have the first time he was killed.

>>385468298
Why even lie? It all boiled down to using whatever the monster was weak to and just spamming that, that is literally all BLM did in FF11

>>385468391
Yeah that's what the FF wiki says, although none of that was from the wiki.

>>385468439
>Combat is a hell of a lot better than traditional tab targeting, and WvWvW is fun as fuck.
Into the trash it goes. Combat comes down to stand in a circle and hit it good. WvWvW was nothing but zerging another zerg.

Additionally all the classes feel same-y and homogenized, I haven't played the expansion to see if the new class skills but if I recall it forces you to get certain weapons and limits your options.

Mean the PvP that had limited builds must have even more limited builds than before.

Guild Wars 2 is garbage. Hot garbage. Not to say WoW is good but it's better than the steaming pile that is Guild Wars 2.

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>>385468523
>WoW will always be the worst game as it open the gateway to Anita Sarkestian and whiny twitter SJW hipster douchebags
Motherfucker what are you even saying?

>>385467979
>>385468448
>>385468592
I guess the devs were fans of Everquest. It had something similar called The Sleeper. Fucker had a death-on-touch ability. Players beat it by using mass rez.

>>385468298
Try only using those abilities in XIV, your dps will be terrible.

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>Got to 32 and then quit when 11 was originally released
>Get memed into playing with friends years later
>Play caster because apparently melee accuracy gear is stupid expensive
>Can't earn gil at low level so you fall behind on spells
>Have to get an entire set of elemental staves and mp regen wand
>Character phases in and out of existence constantly when I cast spells
>Later have to do a quest every 5 levels just to continue leveling
>Friends have been waiting years for level cap increases so you can low man 5+ year old content
>Constantly hear about how great the story is
>Some godawful deviantart OC donut steel character is all over the place
>Realize the only reason 11 is so fondly remembered is sunk cost fallacy

WoW won because it was actually fun to play

>>385469403
Except from stormblood release until patch 4.05 it was better to just use the 44 rotation on blm.

>>385469429
>WoW was actually fun to play
Remove those glasses bro. The roses will go away.

>>385468523
>WoW will always be the worst game as it open the gateway to Anita Sarkestian and whiny twitter SJW hipster douchebags

Explain this leap in logic

>>385469259
I have not played Everquest, but is that the giant killing machine that could only be fought once and rampaged across the game to kill a plot-important NPC, but it was defeated once with a massive army of players zerg rushing it?

>>385466938
>>385467298
I'd argue that PvP Battlegrounds were a worse "innovation" than raids. Battlegrounds were what first led to people idling around waiting for a queue rather than engaging with the game's world.

>>385465169
>GW2
>fun gameplay

gw2 is button mashing retardation
literally less fun to play than any other mmo i played, except maybe text based browser games

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>>385469659
It was a giant crystal dragon.

>>385470070
Yeah, and it just went through the land massacring players? But it only spawned once?

>he plays massively masturbatory online games

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>it's another XIfag salt thread
tastes so good senpai

play bdo

>>385470172
Yeah I think so? But it only woke up after kill certain other bosses if I remember correctly?

>>385470448
My friend who told me about the boss years back said you had to kill some bosses sealing it, yeah.

>>385468523
>Then most successful MMO ever made isn't good! sjws! Sarkeesian! Cancer!!!
Stay mad you fucking nerd.

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>>385470679
>popularity = good

>>385469823
I'll agree with you when it comes to WSG and AB, but fuck man, I loved AV. If they had put that kind of multi-faceted objective-based gameplay out in the open world with good rewards, it'd have been perfect.

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>>385470749
>being a breakthrough in the genre and industry. Must be shit
>the most financially successful and popular MMO ever. Must be shit
>Well I don't like it so it's all crap you're wrong lalalala
Pic related it's you.

>>385469823
It was almost killed twice, but they despawned it because it wasn't meant to be killed. People flipped out until they gave the server another chance and when they killed the Sleeper it dropped nothing

>>385470941
I never claimed WoW isn't cool, I just pointed out your retarded argument

>>385471113
How is it a retarded argument? WoW has gone to shit, it's not as good as it used to be, but it's still the biggest MMO on the market, so compared to the other hot garbage meme games like ESO, XIV etc, yeah, it's pretty fucking good. The numbers speak for themselves.

>>385471394
appealing to popularity/sales is the most retarded argument every, the most shallow, accessible things always sell the most where the best things tend not to

want an example? Compare the sales of Injustice 2 to Guilty Gear XRD