Remember when technological limitations inadvertently produced

for every game that looked good and memorable due to technological limitations, there were hundreds that just looked technologically limited

>>383943903
Came in to say exactly this, not every game was like Silent Hill OP.

>>383943774
Do you OP? Because I get the strong impression that you just played Silent Hill for the first time because you were a fetus when it came out

>>383943774
good teams and designers are good despite art direction.
the look of 2, 3, and 4 didn't suffer because of the better tech. They looked even better because the team was talented and had a unique vision.

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>>383944317
*despite limitations
fuck, you know what i mean

>>383944443
How the fuck did a PS2 game even manage to look better than most Xbox games?

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>>383944818
the team was just very good
...My God. In the hole...
I didn't see that

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here's a way more advanced game that has very memorable art direction

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lets be honest, the running animation sucked
why is he leaning forward at a 45 degree angle?

>>383945376
theys just good
No fuck off, these games are some asian programming magic that has long since disappeared for no apparent reason. They're all regarded as technical marvels of the game industry yet I can never find someone who delves deep into why and how.

>>383946090
For some reasons I spoiler'd that instead of greentexting

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>>383943774
Gameplay too.
It wasn't all copied after the latest popular formula, devs experimented a lot.

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>>383943774
yes.

then story/cinematic games and open world sandbox shit killed it.

>>383946028
shit perspective
and shit model
thats why

>>383946565
>SH isn't a AAA story/cinematic game

>>383945908
Pt was just generic japanese horror style
>pale faced black hair bitches
>le moody lighting
> le psychological

>>383945908
>FOX engine

Such a waste. Sure PT was a corridor, but you can't deny how good the lighting was

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>>383946342
>there was more experimentation in the PS1 era vs today across all games not just AAA shit
r u joking m8

Console games still do.

>>383943774
I unironically want low poly 3D games to become a thing. Give me 32bit and 64bit type games that are well done. I'd buy that shit in a heart beat.

>>383946939
You can't just trivialize anything you want by putting "le" in front of it.

>>383943774
>posting up-rezed screenshots
You have no right to talk about art.

>>383946682
the model isn't shit though

>>383947162
http://gamejolt.com/games/Banned-Memories-Yamanashi/78205 you'll probably dig this

>>383943774

remember how for all of human history adversity has created greater art than bounty

lol it's almost like games used to be made by industry professionals with 10+ years of experience instead of 20-somethings fresh out of university

OP is one of the contrarians from the Silent Hills thread.

>>383946090
they're talented, what more do you need?
I'm sure you can find interviews or something.

>>383947032
The 5th gen was the most experimental time in videogame industry by far,a shitton of videogame genres were born and refined during that era.

>>383947343
I don't know why idiots like him think they're smart by doing this.

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>>383947162
there are a few indie devs doing this type of thing

>>383947638
>Wow you can throw the football really far! How do you do that?
>I'm talented
>no no I mean what form are you us-
>I'm talented
k

>>383946893
casual gaming took over the art of crafting good video games

that is what i meant

>>383947748
Just because genres were made (because they just hadn't been done before) doesn't make it more experimental. There are so many crazy concepts being games nowadays thanks to how many devs there are today.

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>>383947162
The Silent House

>>383947982
like i said, look for an interview or something
my guess is that the lead artist won't say "cus I'm a fucking balla like that"
how can you expect random anons to know the intricacies of their techniques and inner workings?

>>383948070
Indie shit shouldn't be counted

>>383943903
FPBP

>>383943903
>>383944073
OP never said it applied to all games. what kind of dumbass attempt at a counter was this? fucktards.

>>383944142
>Because I get the strong impression that you just played Silent Hill for the first time because you were a fetus when it came out

LAWL OP REKT

>>383948217
lole

Post more silent hill screen shots

>>383945908
Would it have been possible for the whole game to look this good though? I never played PT but fuck was I impressed by the visuals.

>>383943774
Is "low poly" an art style?

>>383948372
>lawl

>>383948548
I think that a lot of how good this game looks has to do with how small the area is

>>383947343
>le argument

>>383945908

oh yeah i saw they demo a few years ago whens it finally coming out?

>>383945376
>tfw getting DP'd in the afterlife

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>>383946090
I doubt random anons will actually know how to specify what Team Silent did to achieve what they did. It obviously took effort, otherwise we would've seen more quality from around this time.

>>383943774
Yeah I agree. It's something that I've noticed in the last couple of years. A specific point would be fog. A lot of developers are so damn focused on showing of how great their new shiny graphics are that they neglect atmospheric fog and stuff like that.

Cool, you want to show of how far your draw distance is. Where is the goddamn fog?

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>>383948675
yeah but it means this now

>>383948137
By the looks of it, its still okay/high poly, just shit resolution/no aa

>>383948548
I think so. With more open areas they'd likely be able to find a similar solution to original Silent Hill with the fog. Otherwise, everything in-doors would likely have the same quality in lighting, textures, etc. But at this point, who knows what could've been.

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I-I did it too

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>>383943774
Can some one help me figure out way modern horror games pale into comparison to the first four Silent Hill games?

>>383947924
what game

>>383947924
What game? Reminds me of Babysitter Bloodbath.

>>383948176
>how can you expect random anons to know the intricacies of their techniques and inner workings?

Are you so new that you've never seen programmer Anons explain stuff on here? You know there's tech channels that look into these things run by average consumers right?
>artist
The style and direction of the game is never half the reason why games look good.

>>383949253
>Magical fog that vaporizes the city's ground level.
>But kills you if you travel too far down.

>Working subway system.

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>>383949118
It's not inherently bad, although its obviously easier to do these flat colors instead of high-quality texture over low polygon.

>>383949338
>figure out way
Shit I meant why.

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>>383949163
I think it actually is low poly. Just couldn't find a decent screenshot. Banned memories is better though

>>383949064
The fuck are you talking about? I hate how literally every game now has tons of unrealistic fog in them.

>>383949338
>First four
SH1 was alright.
SH3 was good.
SH4 was bad, and the rest are shit from then on.
I'm convinced SH2 was just a fluke and they just accidentally made a good game. None of the SH's are nearly as good.

>>383949338
Passion, talent, costs weren't as bloated, take your pick.

>>383946028
that's the fucking point, because it sucks it inadvertently gives far more unsettling vibe and creates far better atmosphere than watching mocapped chad mcnormie jog around.

>>383949432
>Runescape HD

>>383949472
>SH4 was bad

kill yourself you normie cunt

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>>383943774
Nope. Shit's improved. See picture related.

>>383949463
The fuck are YOU talking about? Jesus man. You're right, fuck the fog, let's see across the wooooooooooooooooorld.

>>383949727
>game

>>383943903
But theres also fewer gems nowadays, everything sort of plays well.

>>383949363
yeah, it's the same guy. I don't know what it's called yet
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wibD_xX5wac

>>383949790
Stop memeing, shitlord.

>>383949716
Was it just me, or did Walter remind anyone else of Kurt Cobain?

>>383949727
I'm honestly surprised they haven't gone bankrupt yet.

>>383946028
^to go faster. Its common knowledge

>>383949862
Based Konami!

>>383949727
Kek that was utter shit.

>>383946028

>Running around the streets after hospital, only hearing Harry's wooden clog shoes hitting the concrete.
>This noise starts playing on the backround.

https://youtu.be/6zzYvTF7P2M

Really kinda amazing how simple unsettling ambience can creep the fuck out of you. Simple yet effective tricks.

>>383949842
I think it's just harder to find those gems. You either have a brutal marketing budget or you hope word-of-mouth picks up. It's not like going to the shop and looking through the boxes. The Banned Memories game that was posted seems cool but the chances of hearing about this again is a complete gamble.

>>383949338

There are a multitude of reasons.

Firstly, development budgets have skyrocketed for games. This ties into the second reason, which is that horror games are a niche genre nowadays.The big game studios are reluctant to make a AAA horror title, because they're afraid that it won't sell well. So, less of the genre obviously equals less titles.

That ties into the third reason, which is that most horror games just flat out aren't horror games anymore. With the first two reasons in mind, it's pretty easy to see why we got shit like Dead Space 3. Sure, it's got horror elements... it's also got fucking co-op for some reason, and microtransactions out the ass. Same is true for Resident Evil 4, 5, and 6- they're just not horror games. They're action games with a bit of horror splashed in, because that will sell to a broader audience.

So, when the AAA studios aren't willing to make true horror games, that leads us to reason four: most true horror games are made by indie game devs nowadays. They pretty obviously don't have the budget (or the talent) to produce anything on the level of even the first Silent Hill.

TL,DR: Horror games don't make CoD money, so why bother trying

breath of the wild came out this year op

>>383943903
What modern game looks good because of technological limitations?

>>383950402

>obviously equals less titles.

Meant to say equals less "quality" titles there

>>383950541
Nowadays its not really about technical limitations, it's just talent and passion that are missing from most devs, unless its some incredibly specific Avatar style dream game.

Any one have torrent for the pc versions of SH 2 - 4?

>>383950402

>This ties into the second reason, which is that horror games are a niche genre nowadays.

Horror has always been a niche, not just in games but in movies as well. 99% niche, and then theres that one something that captures the attention of the mainstream and they play it/go watch it in theater during Halloween.

>>383950268
|It's so hard everything plays the same, big budget games are so well designed. That anything strange or fantastic gets drowned out. Like all titles are now designed by committee, not some kind of group of guys that follow their passions.

>>383950541
it's a whole genre of indie games.

>>383950831
talent and passion are absent from most old games too.
PROTIP with time, you forget all the shitty retro games. Welcome to nostalgia.

>>383946028
>>383946682
Fucking retards.
Leaning forwards shifts your center of mass.
If your center of mass is leaning forwards you are automatically going forwards at an accelerated rate.

>>383949381
and yet you're complaining that you've never seen someone explain from a technical standpoint why it looks good to you.

There's no reason to get angry

>>383946090
As someone with(albeit limited) technical knowledge, the main thing is that almost all of the detail is baked in. This was actually the standard before programmable shaders in the seventh generation and PBR now; almost all detail came from painstaking texture work. In a way, pre-seventh gen titles are more like 3D paintings, whereas post seventh(and especially modern games) are more like actual simulations.

As for why SH looks so particularly good, one thing is the dirty/grungy aesthetic of a lot of the environments helps to obscure low resolution textures. Also the environments are very small/controlled, so you can use higher poly models(to rival some modern games) and be more exacting with your art direction and color grading. Lastly, if the original SH is anything to go by, the dev team basically obsessively copied real life films, TV, etc. so as a result their designs were very grounded. In contrast, most games start as concept art with bizarre/impossible, impressionistic lighting and color schemes. Something is always lost in the process of conversion from concept to game, but when you're starting out with something that doesn't have a lot of fidelity to begin with, it's even worse.

As an aside, I actually have a huge beef with that last point, because despite having unparalleled technical accuracy with modern engines, most devs have actually "regressed" in terms of realism with their conceptual designs. Even stylized and cartoony media used to rely partly on real world influences, but pretty much everything today starts out as weird concept art with impossible colors and lighting. It's bizarre that they would work so hard to create technically accurate tools, only to then proceed to design completely unrealistic worlds with them.

>>383943774
Same can be said for film desu

>>383951038
During the steam sale I wanted to find something close to Dark Souls. Found one that has positive reviews, looks decent, seems to have a lot of content.
Not once have I heard a single person talk about it. I didn't have enough money to try it for myself but it can get desperate for devs. I know about games that haven't been released, won't be released for possible years by indie or solo devs, yet these ones that are already out just get lost, despite quality.
The Banned Memories is early acess and on gamejolt, not steam, so you can make the argument that's the reason but it can be daunting.
>>383951594
There has always been bad games, not arguing against that. But passion made the committed devs find interesting or creative ways to bypass limitations, both technical and personal skills. Don't know how to draw? Find a way to either hide or minimize the art. Don't know music? Create an ambiance or theme that doesn't use it much or that it allows for more experimental stuff. Etc, etc. That or just learn. That works as well.

>>383951647
Yeah 32 year old Harry Mason is really gonna run like that

>>383952070
People do that shit nowadays as well. There are more passion projects and more people making them. More solo projects.

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Is it just me or is the era of 2005 - 2009 harder to look at then the PS1 era?

>>383946028
>pathologic_gameplay.webm

>>383952305
It's the bloom, mainly.

>>383951843
a Good Post

>>383952305
My biggest issue with this era was the abuse of bloom. Nowadays devs are controlling themselves a bit better but some games abused it.

>>383948738
>What is sarcasm

>>383950541
age of decadence
underrail
iwanaga
iji
etc etc

>>383952305
I think its b/c its an unrefined realistic look
compared to the the mostly cartoony look of the ps1 era.

>>383947458
Silent Hill was made by 20 somethings tho.

>>383952305
it's because fps moved from fuckhuge carefully designed levels into narrow corridors normies can't get lost in. also consoles and gigantic guns that improve fps rate.

>>383944818
>>383944443
Pre-rendered backgrounds are underrated.
REmake still looks better than a lot of games today.

Muh camera control being preferred over static angles ruined everything

>>383952767
silent hill never used pre-rendered backgrounds

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>>383952440
>>383952482
Why did devs use bloom?

>>383953439
Its a cheap "filter" to add more cinematic feel.

>>383953439
New technology they wanted to show off. A lot of AAA games from that era were closer to tech demos that actual games.

>>383953439
I dunno, but it always looked like shit.

It literally hurts my eyes to look at the amount of bloom they used to shove in games, and if I can turn it off, you can bet that it's never getting turned on.

>>383953439
Basically this >>383953507 but to be a bit more technical, the eye is drawn to gradients. In the real world, gradients are everywhere and help us to distinguish form and volume, but in games it's difficult to do so convincingly. Bloom is a cheap way of adding gradation to a scene so that it seems more "alive" and the lighting more "dramatic" or even "realistic"

>>383949842
No, proportionally similar results. There are less games because games take more time and money to produce. The % of games that are gems are the about the same. People just like harkening back to "the good old days".

>>383952514
>Iji
>looks good
m8 I love the game to pieces but to be blunt it looks like shit

Good example of this is nu Deus Ex. Look at pic related. Fuckhuge gun taking 1/4 of the screen, overdesigned environment for no reason other than to show the art designer knows nothing about detail noise (cables and lights hanging from above multiplied by 1000), generic industrial backdrop etc.

Now the original game has been criticized for how shit it looks even at the time it came out, however it managed to create a sense of dystopia through its abstract and empty environments, cold nights, weird papier mache character models (look at those generic riot cops in this picture) and it just oozed atmosphere.

Same how they touted PREY as System Shock 3 when it's a mind numbing slog through an empty corporate environment, reading emails and looking at "retro" posters and slogans. Realism is boring, this isn't cinema.

>>383953003
Okay but RE did and they looked great

>>383949472
I'm curious, did SH2fags start with SH2? Genuinely asking because SH1 was my first, played it when it came out and it was always my favorite but I still loved 2 and 4(never played 3).

>>383951843
have a (you)

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>>383954045
That's the fucking point, it grows on you. It was made by someone who can't draw, but what he did draw he drew with heart and attention to detail. It has a very distinct art style that I adore. Look at it! Like an adventure devised in grade school.

>>383954185
Id argue RE2+ yes.
RE1 Original looked like a mud filtered mess.

>>383943903
OP BTFO

>>383949118
That's not "what it means now". That's just what it means period. Just because you dislike that persons interpretation of it doesn't make it bad champ.

>>383943774
limitations influence creativity.

I do much better under circumstances than I do with free reigns.

>>383954248
I think most people started with 2 since it's more popular, self-contained, character focus, and personally I think it's pretty much perfect.

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>>383954123
forgot pic

>>383954248
I started with SH2 but I'd say 3 is my favourite one in terms of art design and the sound design is the best ever made for a video game. I don't like the plot of sh1 - sh3 and I don't like the plot of sh2. I like the atmosphere but I tend to ignore most of the resolutions.

>>383954406
Actually today's games are much more limited. You would never be able to make a game like Deus Ex working for Eidos Montreal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8kZ3HfeqtA

It is precisely the neutered experience original DX would comment upon.

Remember when hardware limitations involved sound quality:

SNES
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OwRd3hI65ZE

Arcade
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0-FTVSBD1o

OST
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8ILNVOtaE4

I kind-of miss the days when devs had to experiment and try different shit to make things like this work. Like the cartridge-based version of Resident Evil 2.

>>383954567
i'm talking about creative tools. you're talking about ideological creativity.

go make your own game if you think your creativity is being stifled by your parent company.

>>383954282
Nope, Go back and play it on a crt. RE2 is obviously more advanced, but the original looks damn good too

>>383953745
>A lot of AAA games from that era were closer to tech demos that actual games.
Why did anyone even try after Crysis though? Especially on consoles.

>>383954831
I'm talking about creative culture itself. Deus Ex was an AAA game of its time. Creative visuals give you even less leniency from the mid level management.

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>>383954282
he's talking about REmake, not that RE1 garbage

>>383955096
delusion & ego

>>383943903
fpbp as usual

>>383952305
I like Bioshock's atmoshpere. It looks find to me. Come at me.

>>383955287
who cares about companies. you can make any game you want, there's nothing limiting you at all besides your will to spend the time it takes to make it.

>>383955096
Just cause someone does it better doesn't mean you're not going to try and beat it. Also Crisis was a weird case where most knew about its technical marvel but most could barely run it so consumers preferred a game that looks worse but is playable then something that could hold up for at least ten years but back then it seemed like it required blood rituals to get it to work.

>>383955554
Just ask devs of Hatred how nothing is limiting you to sell your product.

>>383954123
I think you're cherry-picking with that one. There's nothing wrong with MD's art direction as a whole. It's mostly interesting and it nails the look and feel of a near-future society imo. Just look at Prague: It's full of striking combinations of old buildings and snazzy new structures, holographic advertising and old monuments etc.
it's a great visualisation of the main theme of the game: the natural vs the augmented. That's what good art direction is. And it's pretty atmospheric in its own way.

>>383956046
why do you have to sell your game?

that has nothing to do with creativity.

>>383953938
Also, bloom - and depth of field, and ironsights - all cover up graphical deficiencies due to technical limitations by lowering the quality of most of the image on screen without making it obvious to the average consumer.

Just as some might say the silent hill fog makes the game more atmospheric, some might say bloom and dof make a game look more realistic. But in both cases they're techniques which cover up shitty visuals (in a technical sense) and whether those techniques make the visuals better (in an artistic sense) is down to personal opinion.

>>383956240
It's hard to be creative when you're either starving or working a 9-to-5.

>>383956240
because food and shelter costs money
you're not a pinko, are you?

>>383956071
that's hardly a near future society since every old city in Europe strictly forbids Jewish architecture infesting city centers. London being the only exception but it's due to their industry being in the center so there was nothing to spoil.

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>>383956426
What the fuck are you on about? It's a fictional work, also you're kidding yourself if you think that some european cities dont already look like Prague in MD. I've been to Paris and Amsterdam, there are plenty of modern buildings right between and near historical ones.
Go back to /pol/ mate. Futuristic architecture isnt a Jewish plot.

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>>383957012
That's not futurism, that's just cheapass glass n plastic crap.

>>383957186
Mate I don't give a fuck about your views on architecture. I'm not a fan of modernist buildings myself, but that's only tangentially relevant to the discussion of art direction in VIDEO GAMES we were having. Futuristic buildings in a futuristic setting makes sense and supplements the themes of the game well, nothing more, nothing less

>>383956353
>>383956418
money has nothing to do with creativity, especially in video games.

this is entirely different discussion and I would argue creativity is far less valuable in creating wealth than it is in creating something unique.

>>383957642
>money has nothing to do with creativity, especially in video games.

but you need a computer, food, and shelter to make a game. How can you get that without money?

>>383957642
Imagine a sick man who wants to make a video game. He has five years to live. His dream is to make a game to X specifications, which would take ~5 years if he worked on the game full-time. If he also has to work a job, then he has to compromise his vision, which impedes his creativity and prevents him from making the game he wants.
Money does matter.

>>383957186
what's the problem, both look good.

>>383959362
You kidding right?
you trew the whole bait can.

>>383959420
how is liking both "bait".

>>383954818
My favorite theme is Thunder.

>>383943774
This should have never changed. There will always be tech limits that can be "bypassed" via innovation in presentation.

That being said, it's more like remember when care for the product produced games that had blah blah blah.

>>383952691
gigantic guns help frame rates how?