How the fuck did Square Enix go from making one of the greatest

>>383632437
Because places like /V/ likely shat all over XII when it was released... saying it wasn't turn based, and was open like one of those "new" MMORPG's....

And square went " well /V/ hated it, lets make something more linear"

>>383632437
But FFXIII came out after FFXII. Oh, wait. I see, you're trying to fit in. Nevermind, carry on.

>>383632437
XII was good, but it was the beginning of the decline. Remember, it was the first mainline FF game that took away direct control of your whole party. The gambit system was fun, but it was already a casualized version of full party turn based combat.

>>383632773
>Oh, wait. I see, you're trying to fit in.
I can assure you that the amount of hate I feel towards FFXIII is genuine and based in actually terrible writers, developers etc.

>>383633020
Upvoted

>>383633002
>Remember, it was the first mainline FF game that took away direct control of your whole party.
You could still micromanage your party though. I get that it's inconvenient but it's not like Gambits were a forced system.

>>383633098
Prove me wrong.

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>they actually fired Matsuno and put Motomu Toriyama in charge of FF13

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>>383632437
>one of the greatest JRPG's of all time
>an experimental game with involving and interesting AI systems

>>383632437

12 has shit characters and a shit story though. The world is A+, but everything around it was garbage. 12 is one of the worst, as far as rpgs go. It just has nice production values.

Final Fantasy XII isn't that radically experimental.

>>383633185
I can't, no matter what I say, you'll just go ''but nuh-uh'' and that will be that. That's how it usually goes with you delusional cucks.

Oh boy. Is it time already for /v/ to give ff12 the majoras mask circle jerking treatment? B-b-b but it's just misunderstood! It's a classic! It's an inferior FF entry. Fuck off.

>>383633762
So you have no argument?
>>383633681
You just described XIII's characters and story

>>383632437
Cuck Fantasy XII, the protagonist is so beta, so much that he even get cucked out of protagonist role in his own game

>>383632437

Because XII was really disliked by non-critics. People said the main characters had nothing to them. As a result XIII was to the exclusion of everything else about inter-party drama. The battle system was a combination of XII and X-2. Real time shifts between A.I. patterns, but more streamlined that would be easier to use and would sort of satisfy. The story was spoonfed in deliberate order and linearity like X. The trappings of the setting harkened back to VII here and there. The characters were terrible imitations of previous iconic characters.

They had no battle plan, it was just 'This is FF right?' 'They liked that, put it in.' kinda deal. The development was a disaster. (That being said, so was XII, so I guess it's not worth mentioning.)

>>383633696
No FF is, only brainlets who played a handful of games in their life think DQ's edgy little brother is experimental, the only one that actually tried was II and in fact it's the most hated.

With the release of Zodiac Age I see more and more "story is shit, characters are shit" and normally I'd chalk it up to general shitposting. Though I'm wondering what exactly is so shit about the story, what's so shitty about the characters?

>>383633861
My favorite after 6. Always has been. Maybe you just have bad taste

>>383634003
/v/ doesn't like story in videogames
XII has a very political story with important characters and that makes /v/ very irritated and feel stupid

>>383633914
Yep, an expected response.

I don't want to cave and buy the PS4 version because I'm still hoping on that PC release but it's fucking killing me seeing everyone get to play it

>>383633762
You could at least try. Not him but I really couldn't make it back to the "open world" section after replaying it, mainly because the level structure was far too linear, there was absolutely nothing to do aside from run to point A to point B, the story was extraordinarily generic as well as the boring character archetypes (I liked Sazh despite that but I honestly feel I gave him more of a fair chance because of his character design) and there's absolutely no variety in the game when you're leveling up.

It felt like a far more generic version of Eternal Sonata in my opinion, which really is an insult to ES because that game had layers of depth despite its linearity.

>>383634091
Just know that no one takes XIII fans seriously because you can't actually defend your views

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>>383632437
They fired the brains and forced him to make phone games to survive.

It's the same thing Capcom does with Itsuno. Sure he could be making DMC5 or DD2, but let's shovel him into some a supervisor role with no real power or creative control.

>>383634086
I wanted a more genocidal focused story from Matsuno

>>383632437
>How the fuck did Square Enix go from making one of the greatest JRPG's of all time - an experimental game with involving and interesting AI systems, a vast immersive world, a surprisingly complex soundtrack

Fuck you OP, thanks to XII we will never get a 3D Tactics game. Also, XII is a game released post-X, the story is dogshit.

>>383633914

13 was shit as well. At least it had Fang, though. 9 was the last good FF.

Why are people saying Matsuno was fired?

>Matsuno provided the original concept and plot but was forced to bow out of his roles midway through production due to health concerns.

>>383634386
>Overwork employees so you can take their unemployment pay and make them "quit"
(I have no idea if this is true, I'm mainly just shitposting)

Corporate nip culture isn't that different from the West.

>>383634086
>XII has a very political story with important characters and that makes /v/ very irritated and feel stupid
Nice projection /pol/

>>383632437

Matsuno got kicked out and the guy who replaced him hacked up the story and replaced the main character with a bland twink

You literally see the transition in the middle of 12's development from good to shit.

>>383634386
Rumors were he was difficult to work with from the staff, and the executives wanted a different product. Health concerns is a polite way to bow out in Nip business culture.

>>383632437
no one liked FF12 when it came out.

>>383632437
because the majority of japanese rpg fans have autism and changing the formula, for example in a final fantasy franchise, is just too much for their habitual autistic lifestyles.

>>383634560
>>383634603
I mean I get that it's totally possible that either Matsuno was overworked by Square's deadlines or Square didn't like his work, but it's definitely not as clear cut as people like >>383634601 say

>>383634003
>Though I'm wondering what exactly is so shit about the story, what's so shitty about the characters?
It's just /v/ bitching and moaning that Vaan and Penelo don't have a bone to pick with Vayne and Vayne not being a cartoony, mustache twirling villain that torments the main cast by killing their dogs or waifus like the previous games, there's nothing wrong with the characters and story, especially compared to previous FF like 4, 5, 7, 8 or 10, Matsuno sticks to his rehashed plot of starting with a political plot just to reveal that "It was all the Demons' fault guize" when you near midgame and that's it.
The game has plenty of flaws and it's pretty damn generic, but every single FF is like that, a hodgepodge of mediocrity masked by high production values and brand names.

>>383634069

6 was quality. 12 was not. None of the strengths of 6 resonate even remotely through 12. There were no memorable characters. There was little to no character development. The pacing was garbage. The story was hamfisted (b-but it was political!) the world design was the only redeeming quality because you got to visit ivalice at its most grand incarnation.

>>383634748
I'm admittedly still lost as to why the party is essentially siding with having mankind's fate and future being manipulated by the Occuria.

>>383632437
Because people shit all over FFXII for having "MMORPG style combat" (it doesn't) and a political story.

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After another playthrough I realized XIII did a lot of things wrong and did somethings so badly that the good elements were overlooked. Visually the world of XIII was beautiful and the character designs were nice. Combat was fun. Music was nice, although not near as good as previous entries. Atleast if FELT like a Final Fantasy, although a sub par one.

Final Fantasy XII didn't even feel like FF in the slightest sense so I couldn't get into it. Maybe I'll give it another shot after the remaster gets a price drop... I do like that Fran booty.

>>383634950
Because they're lawfags.

>>383634386

Japanese corporate culture is fucked up. It's possible that he actually did just overwork himself, but it's more likely given the changes they made after he left the position, that they forced him out because of creative differences.

A lot of the time with these corporations instead of firing you, they just put you in a position where you're forced to quit.

XIII is not nearly as bad as people make it out to be.

>>383633102
If you controlled only your lead character then it barely got cumbersome at all, and in that case all that gambits are is AI controlled party members whose AI you can costumize.

>>383635160
The Law route in TO was way better than Chaos though.

Are they just taking whatever position opposes Vayne?

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>>383632437
>JRPG

>experimental game
>involving and interesting AI systems
>vast immersive world
>surprisingly complex soundtrack

>>383632437
IMO Advent Children the movie ruined FF. Devs worried that everyone hates turned based after watching Cloud and friends ninja-ing all over the place. Look at how XIII and XV turned out, they made the combat more "fluid" etc.

>>383635062
>Music was nice, although not near as good as previous entries.
It's a very weird soundtrack.
the guy who wrote this god tier town theme, one of the best I've heard: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aat2hwglybs

also wrote some of the worst battle area music I've ever heard, lots of orchestral flourish with no themes or actual attempts at anything meaningful.

but I appreciate it, because so much of XII was trying new things

>>383635398
Big Dick Westaboo hall monitor coming thru #MAGA

>>383634003
It's a lot more down to earth than what is usual in Final Fantasy. The main factors driving the main conflict are purely political in nature, the personal issues that characters face are mostly internal and not fueled by any vendetta against the villains, in fact, both you and Vayne end up having the exact same goal but you still have to fight him because you're basically a resistance movement of a country that he conquered. It's not that there's anything wrong with a story like this, it's just that it's very far from what Final Fantasy fans expect from the series.

>>383635504
I was talking about XIII, don't care much for XII's music too much

>>383634950
They don't though, Ashe spends most of the later half of the game conflicted about it, sure, but she ends up deciding to destroy the Sun Cryst. After the Sun Cryst is destroyed the Occuria can no longer give Magicite to the human they choose as Dynast King, which essentialy severs the only way with which they interfere with mankind.

My favorite thing about XII is Ashe, she's like the first FF heroine that isn't soft, isn't immediately trusting of the rest of the party, she's already prepared to fight to regain her kingdom, and then she grows out of her stubborn, hot headed nature.

>>383635813
oh

XIII has some hits but I think XII is a lot better musically.

part of that is the implementation though, they play "The Promise" wayyyyy too fucking much. I think the use of recurrent theme in Final Fantasy X is much better because you had SEVERAL themes that were constantly recurring: Zanarkand, Suteki, the character themes, etc.

but having one theme play in almost ever cutscene, in many zones, and the rest of the time having mostly bland bleep or orchestral flourishes really doesn't work that well

>>383635308
>The Law route in TO was way better than Chaos though.
Desist.
>Are they just taking whatever position opposes Vayne?
Looks like it.
It's not like they have much choice at the moment, Vayne was expanding too much and the Bahamut and his subsequent transformation were too important to just stop thinking whether he would have effectively got rid of the Occuria if things would have gone his way.
Besides, Basch and Asche had their own bones to pick with Vayne, and so did Larsa and pretty much all of Ivalice, sure, Vayne might have had a noble goal(or did he?) but he fucked up half of Ivalice to do so, and if you want to look at the details Vayne wasn't really all that interested in fighting against the Occuria to begin with, he was just a tool of, ironically, a maverick Occuria.
And the Occuria themselves weren't apparently all that bad, especially compared to Vayne.
It's Matsuno's usual shtick of the machiavellic, well intentioned villain, too bad the only one he wrote decently in all these years was Guildenstern.

>>383633924
This tbqfh

>>383635915
Agreed, she surprised me with her grit and independence

>>383636030
Law Route in TO was a lot more unique, Chaos Route is just prototype FFT. Neutral, who even does that?

>>383636243
>Law Route in TO was a lot more unique
Nah, I've seen the same stuff in the Langrisser games countless times, it's the old hypocrite "MC wuz a gud boi, he dindu nuffin" route and the remake made it worse by adding waifubait to not make you feel so bad about it, Vyce is the only redeeming factor in that route since he becomes a badass. It has its charm though, I won't deny that, and it was written pretty well too outside of some particulars.
>Chaos Route is just prototype FFT
More like FFT was a poor man's Chaos Route.

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>>383632437
>and go to a game with a dumbed down story, worthless level design, next to no world or atmosphere, and a soundtrack with only two or three good tracks?

and then goes down further with XV

>>383636834
nah XV showed that they have good ideas still, just the development schedule was fucked

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>>383632437
I was so deep into vanilla WoW when FF12 came out that I bought it on release, played for a few hours and then never touched it again. To me FF12 felt like an MMO but I was the only player on the whole server

>>383636654
Law is the best route though, how far will you go to achieve unification? Can you live with the decisions you made? Ravness is just a bonus for picking the best route. I think we can all agree Neutral, the route of compromise and nobody is happy is the worst route.

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>>383636901
>nah XV showed that they have good ideas still

said "good ideas" were poorly implemented

not to mention you have this shit with branded the XV name

>>383632437
>copy ffv's job system, but tweak it
>copy ffxi's gameplay
>copy star war's story
>GREATEST JRPG OF ALL TIME

Just to be clear I'm not defending FFXIII, just wanted to call you out on your boner for FFXII.

>>383633002

XI was the beginning of the end. No matter how good you think it is, they decided to go away from single player stories to follow the MMO meme money.

>>383636983
>not to mention you have this shit with branded the XV name
ardyn is a great villain though
>>383637067
>>copy star war's story
fuck you no it didn't

>tfw steelbook editions ran out and had to get standar version
Brb killing self

>>383632743
/v/ didn't shit on 12 when it released in 2006 because /v/ was NOTHING like it is today

fucking child

also, we were too busy shitting on 8.8.
only us OG oldfags know about what IT is.

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They discovered their player base weren't actually interested in playing games.

>>383637194
>fuck you no it didn't
Really? Rather than writing out some long reply, I'm just gonna copy paste some websites. You don't even have to fucking google it.

http://xii.ivalice.org/cast/star-wars
https://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/939426-final-fantasy-xii-international-zodiac-job-system/40765513
http://www.zam.com/article/147/why-final-fantasy-xii-is-the-best-star-wars-ever-made
http://reading-thoughts.tumblr.com/post/54670297951/ways-in-which-final-fantasy-xii-is-basically-star

>>383637593
These are all just fucking blogposts, I don't care about blogposts.

Here's a blogpost: http://www.starwarsringtheory.com/

it's also unvetted bullshit with no basis in fact.

>>383637549
Nesfag is a faggot, everything he said is already applicable to FFII, no need to look for VIII, people still believe that the game is broken and you need to hit yourself to grind, the FF userbase has always been fucking retarded.

>>383635476

Correct. It's why I consider it the worst thing in the Compilation, even though CC and FFX-2 connection are worse for VII itself. It set Final Fantasy on the road to hell with S-E trying to copy the movie.

>>383637549
But if you even try to experiment you break the game.
>learn card
>card monsters
>get a bajillion AP for GFs but never level
>you are now the god of destruction

>>383632437
i still liked 13, but i liked the sequels even more and platinumed the second game.

>>383637549
>there are retards who think the junction system is "deep" and "complex" gameplay
Considering junctioning led to hoarding magic and relying on physical attacks, principally from Squall (to the extent where the OPTIMAL way to play FF8 is to have Squall at base level with card acquired magic junctioned to STR, everyone else dead, and avoiding all encounters, leading to you near one shotting bosses with Squall's base attack) then no, it was shit.

FF9, by contrast, was an attempt to move to a system that both had the interesting stat and ability system that FF8 tried and failed to do through GF AP and junctoning, while also having different character classes that led to you using attacks other than the base Attack option.

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>>383632437
Because everyone saw Vaan in FF12 and said "wow, that is gay as hell".

So Square made the straightest possible game they could.

>>383634601
yet recent interviews with Zodiac edition releasing claim that Vaan and other story related shit was there from the beginning.

>>383638038
that's not breaking the game, that's getting good. those aren't glitches

>>383638170
i never thought any of that. i just thought that i was playing as a street rat. i guess everyone else was retarded at the time.

I don't see how it is difficult for people to get. Each major Final Fantasy game changes staff, changes director, and goes along with the vision of the new director, and sets out to make something different.

Matsuno was never a good fit to direct a Final Fantasy game. Every Final Fantasy game, in some way involves a lot of back and forth and submission of a broad variety of concepts and ideas from members of the team, it's how Nomura made it big really, and he said so himself that a wide variety of his ideas were used for the first time in VII.

From what others have said, working under Matsuno was described as a "director's dictatorship".

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>>383638170

>>383638038
As I said in my post, the best and easiest way to beat the game is to swiftly acquire Quez's Card ability (I think the AP from Ifrit's fight plus four Fast-F's on the beach is enough), then grind for a few hours off of Fast-F's using Card to acquire AP for GF abilities, then play Cards for a while at Balamb, and then bingo, you're set up with enough good magic with Ifrit's STR junction to make Squall a rape train at base level.

Once you get to Shumi Island where you can acquire Ultima, and have Diablo's No Encounter equipped, the game is a fucking piss take.

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>>383638496
>street rat
>jewelry
>armor
After seeing this image in the gamestop window I still gave it a chance despite taunts from friends. Gameplay was ok but it was just too cheesy for me.

>>383638551
but he made Tactics, the actual best Final Fantasy.

>>383638728
why would anyone know how to do that the first time they played the game? This is all stuff that you discover after playing the game and experimenting a lot. If you discover this stuff on your own after several playthroughs and exploring of the mechanics, mission accomplished. The game was designed exceptionally well.

I've called FF8 a "gamers game" in the past because it's full breadth of fun is finding these crazy things with the system. You can't go "oh the game is too easy because now that I know how to break the game wide open, it retroactively makes previous difficulty non-existent."

But FF13 is pretty good and the entire saga's OST is fantastic.

>>383638907
that looks pretty standard to me as a street rat for that world, but a step up because of the armor. since he does hunt giant rats and all that. it is rare that i find the same opinion on designs with people here. i find a lot of final fantasy designs to just be fantastical and fit the world rather than cheesy. i just can't see that being gay. i've always avoided using that word solely to describe things. it feels so unintelligent.

>>383633924
>the protagonist is so beta, so much that he even get cucked out of protagonist role in his own game
Drooped even before pick this up

>>383639465
It is unintelligent, but that's reality. Especially among teens and college aged people who mostly buy these games.

After experimenting with FF9 and 12 they went right back to typical "cool" looking characters.

>>383639537
He wasn't really the protagonist, he was someone related to the main plot who watched the important people do shit. I like to think of it as a second-person narrative.

>>383639967
all those teens and college aged people are retarded and easily manipulated into following the crowd. thats also reality. i can't see those types of people buying these games.

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>>383632437
>Implying 12 is even remotely good as the 13 trilogy

Take it and leave you faggot

>>383640557
Fuck off, Toriyama. Nobody wants your waifu.

>>383638907
Dude lives in the fucking desert

>>383640557
Muh Sarah
Muh time travelling to the future effects the past
Muh Not!Sarah

I want to get into the Ivalice subseries. What are the essential titles?

>>383640654
IRL you dont get skimpier in deserts, you cover up more. The sun will destroy your bare skin, dehydrate you, and cause general injury. This is why people are cooler after wrapping a bunch of cloth around their head.

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>>383632437
Because XIII was created literally by a fucking waifu fag and my biggest regret is that I fell for this bullshit back when they showcased the trailer. My brother bought it on release day and was massively disappointed by the outcome.

I played it from the beginning to the end and it was fucking painful, certain segments were literally impossible unless you crafted certain weapon sets that required rare materials or your party members to be 15 levels above the boss.

The worst thing is I had hopes for XIII-2, bought the CE and got the same bullshit except with lightning's sister and your average bishonen MC. What baffles me the most is the ending this awful crap received

>Lightning stepping off a train in france

That's just fucking stupid. Not to mention the louis Vuitton collab, I mean come on man. these guys have no shame.

>>383640557
Literally a Mary Sue

>>383640785
not in final fantasy

>>383640721
FF12 and FFTA2
save yourself the heartbreak and don't even bother

>>383640791
>these guys have no shame.
They never had.
Remember FFVIII's Toyota commercials? I member, same with the FFIX Coke commercials.

FF was and is nothing more than Squenix cashcow, if you seriously believe you're going to get a quality product out of that you're deluded, it's a mediocre series wrapped up in pretty graphics, now they're not even going to hide product placement anymore.

>>383641246
>FFTA2
>Ivalice

you wat m8

The three Ivalice games are FFXII, Vagrant Story and War of the Lions.

>>383641342
>t. NVfag

>>383641459
>NV
Wat

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>>383641342
>hur dur sponsors and advertisements are bad aherpa derp!

>>383641362
>takes place Ivalice
>has same races and characters, Vahn and Penelo even show up as playable characters
????

>>383641362
>Vagrant Story
huh

Is Ivalice the name of the continent or the world?

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>>383641541
>Unironically wanting product placement and more corporate shilling in your vidya

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>>383641771
>Unironically caring how his special vidya gaem company recieves/spends money unrelated to the games themselves

>>383641854
You are not my brudda

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>>383641854
>unrelated to the games themselves
>Product placement
>unrelated to the games themselves

>>383641963
>product placement
>advertisements
pick one

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>Ivalice MMO literally never

>>383642135
meant for >>383642025

>>383632437
XII isn't much better than XIII though.

Is it best to pretend that Revenant Wings never happened?

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>>383642186
They wouldn't be able to get Gria right seeing as how they fucked up the dragon race in XIV

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>>383642218
>Product placement
>Not advertisement

I see through your schemes, Schlomo.

>>383632437
>and go to a game with a dumbed down story

is this XIII ? I mean it wasn't delivered in the best way but it was not dumbed down.

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>>383642474
>this
>being product placement

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>>383642742
>Moving the goalpost
What's this then, big guy?

>>383642902
thats a product placed in final fantasy xv

>>383642951
Glad we agree on something.

>>383632437

FF12 just copied 11's MMO system you fuck.

>>383643135
>FF12 just copied 11's MMO system you fuck.

this is the most blatantly retarded thing I've read so far. and I still see people saying XV is like KH

>>383632743
>/v/
>shat all over XII
I can tell you're new here.

>>383633456
Matsuno quit.

>>383633681
I always find people confuse FF12 for having a good dub as meaning it has a good story.

>>383643135

It really didn't. You'd notice if you actually played the both of them.

>>383634003
vaan and penelo have nothing to do with anything

they are just there yet vaan is supposed to be the mc

>>383634601
The person who replaced him was Hiroyuki Ito aka the person who was co-director on it from the beginning alongside Matsuno. Also one of the directors of FF6 and FF9

>>383636834
Except it went way up in XV, fuck off KHfag.

>>383636983
I don't know why you are bringing up dome random liscensed game of war reskin as if it has anything to do with anything

>>383644417
>Except it went way up in XV
did we play the same game?

>fuck off KHfag
Just because I think XV is a bad game doesn't mean I like or played KH

>>383644526
>I don't know why you are bringing up dome random liscensed game of war reskin as if it has anything to do with anything

because it's a random Game of War reskin branded as a FFXV spinoff

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FF XII was 10/10
FF XIII was 8/10
FF XV was 9/10

>yfw you enjoyed all recent FF games unlike those gloomy negative nancies

>>383632437
The reality is because whenever a game is the first one on a new system, they generally do a lot towards making it look as amazing as possible. XIII still looking top-tier. But that comes at the cost of limited exploration.

>>383642902
cup noodles fits the world though and it's done funny

>>383644630
XII - 6.5/10
XIII - 8/10
XV - 4.5/10

>>383644528
Yes and it's obvious who you are because you've posted that exact webn trying to shit on XV countless times, where you've already been exposed as a KH/Nomura drone in previous threads you posted in.

>>383644623
It literally has nothing to do with anything other than using the license. It's not even made by SE.

>>383632437
They went from working with Matsuno and Team Ivalice to working with hacks.

>>383645008
>It literally has nothing to do with anything other than using the license. It's not even made by SE.

but SE had to give the license to those people, therefore SE endorsed that shitty Game of War reskin branded as a FFXV spinoff

>>383644630
>>383644904
>XIII - 8/10
you people are braindead.

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>>383644904
>XII - 6.5/10

its objectively the best FF ever made, if not one of the best rpgs ever

>>383645175
SE gave them a liscense because it prints fucking money. It still has nothing to do with the actual game you fucking retard.

>>383634603
Or for women, it's a codeword for being pregnant

>>383645225
I know.

XIII is like a 6/10 at best.
XV is a 4/10

Which is better OG or zodiac?

>>383632437
Because they have multiple teams working on these games. XII and XIII were in development at the same time. So were IX and X.

Final Fantasy as a whole is a very mediocre series, even the old 'good' ones

>>383645270
>It still has nothing to do with the actual game you fucking retard.

then why did they put FFXV in the title?

>>383645313
Zodiac

>>383645239
12 fags are some sad fuckers.

>>383644904
This has to be bait. XIII was a 2/10 tops. It was just awful.

>>383644741
So you lost the argument. Nice.

>>383635915
If she was written today people would bitch that FF is trying to hard to make a strong female lead

>>383637067
>copy star wars story

That was FF II. And Square is not hiding the fact that it took inspiration from SW.

Opinion discarded.

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All these negetive nancies. And I enjoyed all of the them !

>>383645083
>XVfags are already chimping out again
>>383644924
>KH/Nomura drone
>>383645093
>XIII-kun is awake I see.
>>383645174
>Says KH/XIII-kun.
>>383645289
>XIII is like a 6/10 at best.
>XV is a 4/10

>>383644630
XII 8/10
XIII 6/10
XV 8.5/10

If 5 is average.

>>383645289
I don't disagree. Both games were a huge disappointment, but at least XIII had fun combat.

>>383636030
>Guildenstern
The Hamlet character?

>>383645361
This is very true.

The only reason the series had staying power is because it was the first to do what it did. The fanbase is partly to blame for it's mediocrity though, considering they shun experimental titles like 8 and 12 because they want every FF to be exactly like 7.

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>>383634603
He was only difficult to work with executives. He wanted a more down to earth vision with only Balthier/Ashe/Basch at the team. The need to appeal to youngsters ruined it. And they felt the gameplay was too much of a departure when it would have been basically like playing Dark Souls while heavy.

>>383645547
>Both games were a huge disappointment, but at least XIII had fun combat.
amen

>>383645561
I think he means that one Onimusha guy

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>>383638170
holy shit

>>383645370
Because FFXV sold a fuckton and MachineZone wanted to use the name to draw in the Japanese audience to their games hence slapping ffxv skin over game of war.

Do you act like every star wars or avengers phone game is deeply rooted in the film universe too or are you always this retarded?

>>383645427
No, it fits the world because XV is a fantasy based on reality, real life mixed with fantasy is the point of XVs design sense so stuff like product placement fits, and the ones they use fit just fine. cup noodles is played for laughs too

>>383645916
>Do you act like every star wars or avengers phone game is deeply rooted in the film universe too or are you always this retarded?

No, but I see it as a product that was officially endorsed by the creators

Get fucking wrecked, haters. These are the maps of latter dungeons of FF7, FF10 and FF13. FF13 is the least linear FF game.
You will see even the last few dungeons of FF7 and FF10 are very simple.
FF13 is not so simple as them.
Gran Pulse is much huger than the world map in FF7.
in FF10 you can not go backwards until you reach a place near the end.
And you can go backwards in FF13 if you reach the half point of the game.

FF7
http://www.geocities.jp/kouryakubo/ff7/chart/image/72_tornadomaze.gif
http://www.geocities.jp/kouryakubo/ff7/chart/image/36_corel.gif
http://www.geocities.jp/kouryakubo/ff7/chart/image/51_nybull.gif
http://www.geocities.jp/kouryakubo/ff7/chart/image/71_gaiacliff.gif
http://www.geocities.jp/kouryakubo/ff7/chart/image/72_tornadomaze.gif
http://www.geocities.jp/kouryakubo/ff7/chart/image/84_underseafurnance.gif
http://www.geocities.jp/kouryakubo/ff7/chart/image/86_cosmocanyon.gif
http://www.geocities.jp/kouryakubo/ff7/chart/image/93_forgottencapital.gif

FF10
http://www.ffcompendium.com/h/faqs/ff10macalaniawoods.gif
http://www.kouryakubo.com/ff10/map/images/map17macalanialake.gif
http://www.kouryakubo.com/ff10/map/images/map19albed.gif
http://www.kouryakubo.com/ff10/chart/image/23nagi.gif
http://www.kouryakubo.com/ff10/chart/image/26gagazeto.gif
http://www.kouryakubo.com/ff10/chart/image/27zanarkandsite.gif
http://www.kouryakubo.com/ff10/chart/image/28airship.gif

FF13
http://www.geocities.jp/kouryakubo/ff13/chart/image/131_ofans.gif
http://www.geocities.jp/kouryakubo/ff13/chart/image/101_fifth.gif
http://www.geocities.jp/kouryakubo/ff13/chart/image/091_paramecia.gif
http://www.geocities.jp/kouryakubo/ff13/chart/image/112_gran-palse.gif
http://www.geocities.jp/kouryakubo/ff13/chart/image/116_taejintower.gif
http://www.geocities.jp/kouryakubo/ff13/chart/image/121_eden.gif

>>383645991
So you're an idiot.

>>383646158
are you dumb?

>>383646284
not an argument

>>383646480
you can't even revisit anything from ch1-10 and gran pulse is smaller than episode duscae map

>>383646158
How can anyone be this stupid.

>>383646797
>you can't even revisit
>>383646863
>How can anyone be this stupid.
>>383646284
>are you dumb?

not him but he's right, in terms of map complexity ff games were never anything special.

>>383647090
No he isn't right.

You literally cannot revisit anything from chapter 1-10 in FF13, Gran pulse is not bigger than FF7s world map, it's smaller than episode duscae map, and it's emptier too, and then ch 12 and 13 are just more coridoors.

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>>383646284
>>383646863
Ever notice how the anti-xiii fags always parrot the same things? It's because they can't think for themselves.
FF XIII is a great game, guys. There's nothing wrong with the story/characters, the music is phenomenal, dare I say better than some of Mr. Uematsu's work, and the combat is the best in the series.

>>383640557
Back to /ffg/ with you lightning poster

>>383647242
>You literally cannot revisit anything from chapter

doesn't matter when the game has very descent post end boss hunts.

>>383647242
>Gran pulse is not bigger than FF7s world map, it's smaller than episode duscae map, and it's emptier too

all wrong.

>>383647638
>doesn't matter when the game has very descent post end boss hunts.
So you admit the fact that nothing prior to Gran Pulse is worth revisiting

unlike even FFX?

>>383647318
>Ever notice how the game criticism is always the same
Ah, you're right, we should start making up different reasons for why we not like the game instead of the glaring flaws everyone can see.
Are you dumb?

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>>383632437
Don't listen to idiotic answers like >>383632743
or any other.

The only correct answer is as follows.

In interviews around the games release Kitase had stated that the dev team had so many unused assets they could make a whole game out of them. Which was why they were able to make XIII-2 quite fast and on a low budget.

The game went into full production in October of 2007 and released in December 2009.

You can understand then, how rushed the game was and that its design choices (like linear map with bad level design for example) were not done because that was their vision, but out of necessity.

They had to create their first HD next gen title in a little over than 2 years, using a very flawed and buggy engine.

Versus XIII, was the biggest victim of all this.

>>383640791
>steps off a train in france
Wait hold the fuck up.
I heard some shit happens that was teally bad, but is that actually what fucking happened? Toriyama just makes his waifu real?

>>383647691
yes

>>383647548
>XIII is objectively the most linear FF.

yes it is and they were not planning it any other way. the point is that FF as a series were never exactly complex or Elder scrolls big.

>>383647689
>using a very flawed and buggy engine.
Really? XIII seems to have very few bugs in my experience.
Or is that because of how linear it is?

>>383634154
It's the remaster of a PS2 game, so it's not like you're gonna get any massive improvements on framerate and graphics with a PC version. It runs perfectly with little load times and the spell lag removed. Unless you're waiting for a price drop or a big Steam discount, just buy the PS4 version.

>>383647689
forgot my copy pasta wtf

Because they were so focused on creating an engine for next-gen hardware that could be utilized across all platforms, they made the mistake of trying to accommodate every single project that was in progress at the time. In hindsight, it should have been obvious that it would be impossible to fully satisfy all of those needs.

While Final Fantasy XIII was in production, the development of Crystal Tools caused significant problems and delays. The programmers spent much time on taking all demands from staff into account. Based on this feedback, Murata's team tried to adapt the engine to the needs of several game projects, which proved to be virtually impossible and prevented the engine's specifications from being finalized. Furthermore, as separate groups were working on the individual tools of the engine, there was no comprehensive software documentation to ensure usability and compliance

As all of this was going on, the staff involved directly with the actual data construction had no choice but to start working before the specs were finalized. Their main concern was that they could not be able to keep up with the schedule if they continued to wait for final decisions.

Unable to wait any longer, the Final Fantasy XIII team had no choice but to begin creating assets to keep to the game's production schedule. However, the lack of specifications resulted in these assets being incompatible with the engine. In the end, it was decided that Final Fantasy XIII was to be the principal focus of Crystal Tools and the game's team began cooperating with the Research and Development Division more closely to receive the required tools and specifications.

>>383647689
>Versus XIII, was the biggest victim of all this.

you Tetsuya Nomura fags are possibly the dumbest people on this or any other gaming board. he is a great guy just not a good director.

>>383647787
IV on the SNES was more linear than XIII. You couldn't even pick your party in IV and skills were locked to levels on a static path. XIII at least offers party and paradigm choices, and a pretty nice postgame.

>>383648012
FFIV has an open world by the end game and you can revisit towns (ACTUAL towns).

>>383647980
you Square enix apologist who do no fucking research and just blame SE's scapegoat which in this case is Nomura are the dumbest people in the world.

The Development history of both XIII and VsXIII, why they ended up how they did and why they were delayed, is by now out in the open.

People who bother to look, know how much Nomura was fucked over.

>>383632437
Dude Lightning is literally the perfect video game waifu after Yuna. That alone is enough to make FFXIII good

>>383648190
>how much Nomura was fucked over.

by god for not giving him any talent as a director.

>>383648327
How much you like or dislike nomura is not my business, we're talking facts not subjective opinions.

Versus XIII being delayed had nothing to do with Nomura, at all.

XIII's combat is better.

>>383647980
Don't think he was talking about Nomura, but the engine was apparently fucking awful to work with. You look up stories of the development of FF14 to FF14 ARR you see that Square was making a lot of questional design choices during the Nova Crystallus stuff.

On a seperate case, I'll 100% agree that Nomura is a pretty alright guy but can't direct for his life, though in a way he's still responsible for a lot of 15's shortcomings.

>>383648602
No he is not, 15's shortcomings are its awful battle system and the open world setting development back, forcing the team to butcher the story completely.

Both were not decisions Nomura made, the gameplay was changed from the system Nomura wanted and the full open world was decided by Tabata, the guy who then sacrificed everything else to complete it but even then didn't managed to and had to turn the 2nd half into train stops.

>>383647638
So you admit it's the most linear also there is nothing worthwhile post game 13. While also in denial about gran pulse being emptier and smaller than episode duscae map.

Gran pulse is literally flat ground with only monster enemies and a few items, there's no NPCs, no towns, no nothing but monsters out in the open and a few items. The cieth stones you find are just you killing monsters in the same area.

Compare to episode duscae which has an inclined grass plain, pine forests, a mistwood, a dark cave dungeon with a summon and rare weapon, there's a chocobo post and a gas station with NPCs and stores, there's sidequests with different party members, there's the Behemoth hunt plus enemies ranging from monsters to daemons to magitek troops, there's items scattered throughout.

Seriously Gran pulse has less in it than a fucking demo version of a tiny slice of duscae from FFXV has.

>>383648451
I think the mechanics are better absolutely. However, the enemies you fight are fucking awful.

>>383648875
Versus was open world as much as XV is and XVs battle system is better and more fleshed out than anything we saw in Versus

>>383649112
No xv-kun, stop lying. Versus had a world map design similar to ff12 and your shitty taste in battle mechanics does not interest me.

We've gone over this before, you're going to twist words in interviews, say some bullshit about mistranslations, post some shitty webms and then screech like an autist until i get bored and leave. At which point you will think you BTFO'd another shitposter.

Just fuck off already and stop lying.

>>383649112
>a finished game has more coherent combat than what was shown in a work in progress

Really makes me think. But if VersusXIII's combat was going to be similar to KH2's, it would have easily blown the hell out of the dreck that is XV's current battle system.

>>383649308
>>383649324
can we at least agree XV > XIII

I'm still upset Fran is the only non-human you ever get as a party member. Kind of makes me wonder why they even bothered setting it in non-tactics era Ivalice.

>>383649308
Awww getting BTFO?

>>383649376
>story and lore
XIII>XV
>Battle system for normal encounters
XV>XIII
>OST
Equally good.
>Art direction
XIII>XV
>Boss fights
XIII>XV

Both games are shit but at least XIII is a complete game.

>>383649730
You forgot

>World
XV > XIII
>level design
XV > XIII
>writing
XV > XIII

Note writing is different than story. While XIII's story is fine, the writing is atrocious.

>>383649324
No it didn't. Nomura and Tabata both described the world map in the same exact way in that they are open world but not fully open world.

And there is nothing in Versus that indicates it's better or more complex than XV when far less was shown and Noctis can do everything the other party members were shown to do in Versus in addition to still having the same basic attacks on swords and lances as he did in Versus. XV is not only expanded on every aspect but clearly better because Noctis can do far more now than he could before.

No one is lying here but you you fucking lying nomuracuck. You're so fucking in denial you can't accept facts even when slapped across your face.

>>383648875
Not that anon but I didn't mind XV's battle stuff at all. I like that a lot of things that could have been just cinematics in any other game were possible to do in XV. It's certainly not perfect. You still have to rely a lot on fucking healing items and it can get jank as fuck but I was able to figure out strengths of weapons I liked, how to do AoE's or how to do weapon throws or ariel combat or charges and so on. My only regrets are the literal on-rails sections and the little content that there was to do outside of hunting quests. But I genuinely wanted more to play, more things to fight and do.
When I played through 13, I don't think I felt the need to want to play more of it. I wanted it to end and I don't mean that in he good way.

>>383632743
>And square went " well /V/ hated it, lets make something more linear"
>he thinks a triple A japanese video game company values the opinions of a few fat, diabetic, hairy manchildren on a mongolian fingerpainting forum

He believes this

>>383649376
Obviously. Anyone with any sense knows this.

>>383649995
>both described the world map in the same exact way
>Tabata described it as "open world"
>Nomura didn't
WOW

>>383650090
Sarcasm must be a concept unbeknownst to you.

>>383649368
First of all no, second of all Versus looked nothing like KH2. having a command menu doesn't mean shit especially when it doesn't even have an attack command like KH does nor was it ever even shown being navigated.

There is nothing about Versus at any piint that is better than the current system. Even with character switching.

>>383649995
Nomura described as open fields separated by loading screens similar to ff12. He also specifically stated that you cant go to the mountains or anything like that because the game is not open world.

Again, i give no fucks about your shitty taste in combat mechanics. XV is trash compared to KH2FM and that says a lot.

Tokyo team was wasted under Tabata. Fuck off.

>>383649730
XV has better story and lore, better OST, better art direction and boss fights than 13.

XV is among the best FFs while 13 is among the worst. And XV is more complete than 13. Kitase literally said they cut out a whole games worth of content from FF13. All the DLC and side stuff in XV is self contained as the main story is told and resolved within the game.

13 is so bad they literally had to retcon the ending with 13-2.

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>>383632437
Ff12 is good

>>383632437
>383632437
By doing something different.

Most of the game play systems borrow from Secret of mana or chrono trigger or even romancing saga. No random encounters.

Ff15 is not that different from secret of mana. Just no power bar.

Ff13 isn't that different from Chrono Trigger.

Dragon Quest eventually dropped the random encounters as well.

>>383649730
>>383650492
>>383650569
this is literally just XIII-kun vs XV-kun

It's pretty pointless to argue about which piece of shit was shittier than the other.

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>>383650492
>XV is more complete than 13

You're gonna have to try harder than that fuck boi

>>383650147
Nomura and Tabata both said it's open world but not fully open world. Stop bullshiting.

>>383650301
http://www.siliconera.com/2010/06/23/final-fantasy-versus-xiii-has-an-open-field-with-roaming-monsters/


>Clips from an interview with Tetsuya Nomura reveal Final Fantasy Versus XIII has an open world. Players will be able to explore it by using a car, which they can ride at any time.

>Monsters walk around on the field and sometimes the will pop up if you are just hanging around. Another bullet point reads, “battles are basically seamless.” Aside from load times when changing areas, the world is seamless too.

>Nomura: There have been many questions related to the field, it is not a completely open world
http://www.siliconera.com/2010/08/08/final-fantasy-versus-xiii-world-map-feels-like-2d-final-fantasy-in-hd/#xbAdi7sxFC3y5Hzy.99

This is completely in line with how Tabata described it as being open world but not fully open world

>Speaking to Game Informer, Tabata added, “Not literally everything is open world, but it is pretty vast, and you will be able to freely explore. You may have noticed that they’re traveling in a car. You can technically walk around the world, but we recommend using a vehicle, and it’ll be a journey driving through the continent.”
http://gematsu.com/2014/09/final-fantasy-xv-director-talks-development-open-world-combat-demo#k0phAQGbE12dPiOB.99

He said nothing about the map being structured like FF12, he was talking about the CAMERA being like how FF12s is instead of like how FF7s is, FF12 uses a third person camera just like XV does and like Versus was shown to you fucking idiot. And there are mountains in XV you can't go on too so again it's still completely in line with what he said.

Versus was nothing like KH2FM to begin with and XV is better than anything we saw from Versus so eat shit Nomuracuck.

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>>383650569
Wow look at all these lack of arguments.

>>383651605
XV has a world to explore multiple times bigger than any explorable area in 13 with a fuckton more content.

13 is literally 10 coridoor you can't revisit, a grass plain smaller and emptier than FFXVs demo >>383648884 then 2 more coridoors.

Even ch13 in XV the most linear section of the game is like a maze compared to your average FF13 map.

>>383652293
how does a bunch of empty placeholder assets make something more complete

>>383635260
>all that gambits are is AI controlled party members whose AI you can costumize.

Well because that's literally what they are. And its disappointing that no other game has used XII's gambit system. Every other arpg with AI members falls into the same old

>Attack
>Defend
>Attack but don't use magic
>Defend but don't use magic

trap of basic AI control.

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>>383652293
This is your last (You) XV-kun. Leave this site now

>you don't live in the timeline where matsuno completed FFXII
How do i open a portal?

>>383634386
Didn't he basically refuse to go into work at one point when half the development team left? Or was that nothing more than a rumor?

>>383633456
Matsuno quit because they fired sakaguchi

>>383652946
He's right about XIII, though. Although it doesn't make XV good.

>>383651640
Huh, so that nomura fag was lying after all. Thanks for the links.

>>383652293
13fags BTFO.

>>383645436
Japanese games don't have that problem.

>>383652428
>empty placeholder assets
Are you talking about FF13? Because 13 is more emptier than anything in XV.

>>383652946
>Can't come up with a counter argument
>better just spout meme names and tell him to leave
typical

> Be me
> Loved original FF12, looking forward to Zodiac Age for months
> It's finally here!!
> Get to license tutorial
> Well shit

>people hype up gran pulse
>get there
>its a large empty field with some statue things that give you generic kill monster quests
I powered through 25 hours of hearing Hope and Snow for this bullshit.

>>383640791
>my biggest regret is that I fell for this bullshit back when they showcased the trailer

Same. At least their taking 10 years to actually release the game helped keep me from buying it day one.

>>383641362
Vagrant Story was never meant to be canon with the other Ivalice titles.

>>383632437
>le ff13 is bad maymay

also 12 is pretty mediocre and a prime example of wasted potential due to all the changes and the internal politics going on during it's development.

>>383654687
Thats what gets me, its considered an Ivalice title yet it has no references to it being in Ivalice.

>>383654108
Seriously, someone HELP me

>>383648451
Good combat stuck in a shit game that limits you at every turn.

>>383632437
I personaly blame 360. The same for DMC4

>>383632437
Because none of you faggots understood XII when it came out.

It got shit on by fans who wanted melodrama like X and sci-fi bullshit like 7 and 8. So Square went all in on melodrama and sci-fi bullshit, and then all you fuckers realized that wasn't really what you wanted. So they put all their cards on being "modern" with XV, but that didn't pan out how people wanted either since Square didn't know how to do that. So they re-release XII again and now people fucking love it. And somewhere Matsuno cries himself to sleep knowing that he produced the best FF game in the last decade hands down, and now he's stuck making shitty iOS f2p titles because everyone was too dumb for it when it came out.

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Just saying that XIII's OST is objectively better than XII's and has the best Chocobo theme in the series.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDwAN90MKTo

>>383655373
Matsuno is doing stuff for XIV, so there's hope that Square-Enix might bring him back on fulltime.

>>383643587
>the game plays itself!

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>>383655468

The composers were the only ones with their shit together in the entire XIII team. God damn that OST is good.

>>383655373
To be fair vanilla FFXII was kinda of iffy, especially when you could just easily max everything for everyone and never need to use gambits ever, also kind of a slog without the double speed.

>>383655580
artists and animators did a 10/10 job too

only the gameplay team fucked up and unfortunately for the rest of the team that's the most important part

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>>383655580
The OST was just one guy, same guy who saved X's OST.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxJE6SSX-aw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xF-XlIS3keY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_PjUvwHBs4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZGOLjgXCJaE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AABvUTUTdcw

>>383655468
>objectively better than XII
Nah I don't agree.
See >>383635504
and >>383636008

>>383635062
>Combat was fun.
What? How?

>>383655373
>ask for a return to NES/SNES final fantasy mixed in with HURR DURR WE WANT CLOUD BACK
>get given XIII/2/3LR

i fucking hate our community and the DUMB AS BRICKS square that we have left now. At least FFRK is neat and they are trying a little more...
>looks at FFXV
yeahhhh never mind. VIIR is going to be a shit isnt it boys

>>383655736
Hamauzu didn't write "A Fleeting Dream/Someday the Dream..." that was Uematsu.

Also X was a team effort between Uematsu, Hamauzu, and Nakano.

>>383655756
Having motifs throughout a soundtrack help keep the cohesion something guys like Uematsu and Kondo are masters of, Melodies of Life appears fourteen times in IX, the Main Theme from VII appears ten times in VII, most character themes from VIII are rearrangements of Balamb Garden in VIII and so on.

Also XIII and Hamauzu by extension is one of the most versatile composers, XIII has rock, blues, jazz fusion, solo guitar, solo piano, ambient, pop, industrial while XII's was largely orchestral arrangements with tracks like Eruyt Village being stand outs since they deviated from that. I mean the reviews speak for themselves and Hamauzu is still the only composer I know of to ever use salsa and techno in the same OST, Sakamoto has some catching up to do.

>>383655704
>also kind of a slog without the double speed.

I never really understood this complaint about XII, especially in a series that includes VIII and IX, the epitome of "SWOOSH [Black Screen] [Camera Pan] [Delay in ATB charging]".

>>383655836
VIIR is said to be episodic, thats already 1 foot deep in the shit.

>>383655836
>At least FFRK is neat and they are trying a little more...
>That XII music playing on the home screen today

Pure bliss

>>383656021
Did you read what I said? XIII has one motif. X has 5-10.

Stylistic diversity is not quality. Might as well crown XV and Undertale as the best soundtracks of the decade if you want to have that argument.

>>383655836
>HURR DURR
>random caps lock shit
>...
>yeahhhh
this entire post is autism

>>383656008
Uematsu composed Suteki da Ne but Hamauzu did that particular arrangement, you can tell just by listening he also did the one for Spira Unplugged and I'm well aware of who worked on X's OST but Uematsu was doing stuff like this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4v0xAiMIaY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iiH0-J88QGE

His best stuff was VI-IX and Lost Odyssey was really good too not sure if he's still composing any more, he had some good songs on X I'm not denying that but most of it wasn't as good as his past stuff.

>>383656223
I guess I could understand that, but that's not so much Hamauzu being this God compared to Uematsu.

I think Uematsu, after composing for three different systems with three different possibilities for music, didn't want to relearn the PS2 interface for composition.

>>383656195

Eh, there's like 2-3 in XIII. The Promise does come up every 10 seconds though.

>>383656195
>XIII has one motif.
Are you retarded? There's the motif from the Prelude (Determination), there's Lighting's motif (Blidned by Light), there's Vanille's motif (Memories of Happier Days, Nascent Requiem), there's Dysley's motif (Fighting Fate, Ragnorak), there's Snow's motif (To Hunt l'Cie, Atonement).

There's probably more, been a while since I've actually looked at the OST in depth.

>>383656348
I never said that, I just said that on X Hamauzu's work was by far the best and I know I'm not the only one to think that. I have far more respect for guys like Uematsu and Kondo than Hamauzu since they've been in the industry for so long and have inspired pretty much everyone else, Hamauzu even admitted in an interview that he got into video game music because of Uematsu.

>>383656049
Probably because in those the atb system is always ticking and its always tense unlike XII where any on the fly change in tactics or magic usage means the whole battle pauses for you to choose which to use, in most cases the automated battles get so brainless than its much better to just 2x everything.

>>383637317
>I just saw the twilight princess image guys, i've been here since 4chan was born!!

fuck off cunt

>>383656498
There's also Hope's and I forgot to add that Lightning's appears in the Yaschas Massif as well as Dust to Dust as does Vanille's.

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>>383656541
>Probably because in those the atb system is always ticking and its always tense

That is not the case at all with VIII or IX, even with it set to Active.

>>383656498
Here's an example: every single time the Fireworks festival scenes play, that peppy version of The Promise plays. EVERY SINGLE TIME. I don't know who to blame for that terrible decision.

>>383656691
Whoever the sound director was, not sure if that was Hamauzu or not but stuff like Melodies of Life appear way more than the Promise does, like I said Final Fantasy OST's have always been built around recurring motifs. Almost half of IX's OST are rearrangements of past songs and if you listen to almost any Mario OST done by Kondo every song for a level is a rearrangement of a single theme.

Plus Archylte Steppe is max comfy, my second favorite overworld theme behind Over the Hills which happens to be one of IX's many arrangements of Melodies of Life.

>>383656556
lurk more newfag

>>383656673
>>383656541
Speaking of Active, play XII with Active set, and you won't find battles so automated.

>>383656927
I just don't think XIII has nearly as many memorable themes as other entries while also not being as well implemented as XII. Truth be told though, I don't have a big grudge against it.

Playing XIII now with some beer, maybe I'll like it for once.

>>383632437
All the shit truly wrong with XIII started with XII, cunt.

>>383657193
XII had a lot of good tracks and the soundtrack fit the game which is all I really ask for, Eruyt Village and the Salikawood are two of my favorite FF songs and I love the Empire's Theme.

I think it's a hell of a lot better than XV's, not really sure what happened there but I felt like that one was all over the place outside of the battle themes which were all really good.

Why is it that everything on Gran Pulse (in the water area) is just a fucking chore to fight
Am I underleveled or something? How many "optional" hunts should I have done.

>>383657873
Probably because your Paradigm deck is garbage or you haven't upgraded your gear, buffs and debuffs are not only worthwhile in this game they're overpowered.

>>383657971
Yeah I mean when I'm fully buffed up (Lightning, Vanille, Sazh) it's pretty damn easy.

>>383633002
>Remember, it was the first mainline FF game that took away direct control of your whole party.
No it didn't.
If you didn't equip any gambits, you had to directly control each member of your party, or they'd stand there and do nothing.

>>383658309
Yeah, SYN and SABs are incredibly good. Fang with a Taming Pole fully upped and as leader is probably the best character in the game since she learns Haste, has all the standard SAB spells and good cast animations.

What monsters in particular are you stuck on?

>>383658439
It's just this lake area where the little lizard fuckers do a shit-ton of damage but die easily.
I'm finding the buffs from Sazh help a lot. I considered using Fang but I don't like her as a character so I don't want to lol

deck is:

Com/Med/Syn
Com/Rav/Rav
Com/Med/Com
Med/Med/Syn

>>383659096
I'd recommend having one with a SAB and SYN at it so you can focus on getting buffs/debuffs out early. It'll help you increase the Stagger meter faster, also small tip if you're playing as a RAV: if you alternate between two different spell types it'll increase the amount the stagger gauge goes up by.

MED/MED/SYN also seems pretty situational, I'd need to know specifically what you're fighting but that seems a bit too defensive. Typically XIII is a very offensive orientated game but some fights require some defensive paradigms.

Fang is also really good, you can kill Adamantortoise when you first get to Eden which is coming up if you have a Genji Glove on her. You can probably kill them now with Sazh if you have the Procyons for him.

>>383659365
Currently in a fight with Orobons and Cetarosaurs (I believe) which use courtship dance and summon a fuck ton of OP red lizards.

They do 500 with each attack and with roughly 2k health for each member it's fucking brutal

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>>383632437
Yasumi Matsuno was fired. That's how.

>>383655468
>but these random 5 stars are proof
of literally nothing.

>>383659597
One tip about Orborons is that if you attack them then it'll completely interrupt their actions so wide AoE spells like Ruinga or any -aga spells are great against them since they can't take a turn.

>>383659672
He wasn't fired he left.

>>383655373
the fuck are you talking about
XV more than succeeded in presenting a "modern" era set FF world.

>>383655836
XV was the best FF in about 20 years

>>383656195
XV has multiple motifs too, much better motifs and also more diversity than 13 does.

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>>383659976
>He wasn't fired he left.
You don't seem familiar with how corporate Japan works. You get a job for life, so long as you meet their expectations.

People who don't meet company expectations (like how Square was angry that FF12 was delayed so much that it released basically right at the beginning of the PS3 era) are given a hard time until they """quit"""

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/17/business/global/layoffs-illegal-japan-workers-are-sent-to-the-boredom-room.html

https://japantoday.com/category/features/kuchikomi/how-companies-go-about-forcing-employees-to-quit

https://hbr.org/1990/11/what-working-for-a-japanese-company-taught-me

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>>383660158
>>383660226
I wonder who this could be.

>>383660326
He represents approximately 20% of FF15's fanbase just on his own, so he has to make up for the lack of manpower

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wow what a cringe soundtrack

>>383660252
>For more than two years, he has come to a small room, taken a seat and then passed the time reading newspapers, browsing the Web and poring over engineering textbooks from his college days. He files a report on his activities at the end of each day.
Seems like my current job at my local library.

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>>383632437
What did you just say about my wife's game?

>>383632437
But 12 was a boring mess that did nothing to improve its combats as the battle system evolved. To the point where end game battles had you pretty much making most major decision for your party, completely negating 80 percent of the gambits system anyway. Nor did it even take advantage of the ivalice setting. 13, for all its flaws, was a complex work of art that has many layers in all its facets. It was pretty much the most complex game in the series.

>>383653921
talking about chapter 13, clearly

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>not playing FFXII HD 2.0

>>383656541
The only game where the atb system felt even remotely tense was X-2 tbqh

XIII is better than Vagrant Story 0.5, though.

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>>383632743
>/V/

>>383632437
With the success in America, FF got too big a name and the series was hijacked by people with huge egos without the substance to back it up,

>>383635062
>>383635504

13's best asset was it's music the composer is actually a renowned pianist. he's no longer with square but XVs soundtrack is the best video games have ever had.

It's called over-correction. When XII came out, it wasn't as successful as the other games, especially X. So they tried to take elements from the previously successful games (X, X-2 & VII) and throw it all together and focus on "Graphical Technology."

So we have a linear game with a sphere grid, and active time battle where you play as one character, and an edgy lifeless character.

Final Fantasy XV is another example of over-correcting, as the game is so incredibly open world that it just feels empty, and like everything suffered so that it could be open world.

>>383662429
Every FF has focused on graphics, every game looks incredible for the time they were released in.

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>>383662429
>15 over correcting
Nigga, everyone's doing open world now.

>>383662429
This. SE just doesn't know how to make FF games anymore.

>>383662649
Persona didn't.

>and go to a game with a dumbed down story, worthless level design, next to no world or atmosphere, and a soundtrack with only two or three good tracks?
Wait, are you describing FF12 or FF13 here? I can't tell.

>>383632437
anyone else think menuing is slow as fuck compared to the original? also
>removed opening movie before title screen
>no camera sensitivity
even the combat feels slower and i had the PAL version

So um. Just to clarify. What differentiates someone that likes FF15 from a FFXV-kun?

A

>>383660326
You're also agreeing with those being true.

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>>383637194
>ardyn is a great villain though
Jesus fucking christ, have RPGs sunk so low that people are accepting edgelord mustacio-twirling villains as "great now"?

Tuck me in and let me die

>>383662429
XVs world feels the same as any FF world map, just at 1:1 scale. The various settlements and outposts are the same exact thing as small towns and villages. The world maps of the older FFs are more emptier than XV is if anything.

>>383663510
Here on /v/ if you like XV you will get accused of being XV-kun no matter what.

>>383663676
>The world maps of the older FFs are more emptier than XV is if anything.
There are literally more gas stations than there are cars on the road, XV is the epitome of the an empty world.

>>383663645
Ardyn is one of the few redeeming aspects of the game, granted his backstory could've been actually explained in the game a lot better he was still a solid villain.

>>383663645
He isn't edgelord mustacio twirling at all, in fact he's easily the best villain in the franchise because he completely succeeded, while having a good reason and motif, while being a likeable character, while having all he set out to achieve work out, while having a strong connection to the MC. But hey you're the faggot earlier who tried to act like FF12 somehow has a good villain because you don't want "mustacio twirl" or whatever the fuck because you don't actually know what a good villain is if it slapped you across the face.

>>383663803
>There are literally more gas stations than there are cars on the road
No there isn't and you are full of shit. Also at the gas stations there are a bunch of cars parked at them so you are even more full of shit even more so.

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>>383663873
>in fact he's easily the best villain in the franchise because he completely succeeded
So did Kefka and Caius with the latter being voice by Liam O'Brien I'm going to have to say he's better than Ardyn.

>>383663989
>caius
top cuck

>>383663803

How would more cars on the road enhance the XV experience?

>>383663989
>So did Kefka
Didn't fully succeed.

>Caius
Didn't fully succeed.

Ardyn's VA is fucking fantastic in both JP and Eng, and Keiji Fujiwara is better than Liam O'brien, and Darin Depaul did far better in expressing Ardyn than Liam did for Caius.

>>383664087
By making it believable that all these gas stations can stay in business, it also got pretty lonely on the roads of Eos from time to time.

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>>383654893
>>383654687

>>383664176
Dude did you even play XV? Every gas station has multiple cars parked at them and there are cars driving frequently between them and through other outposts.

>>383664256
>Dude did you even play XV?
Sadly.

>>383642396
>dragon race in XIV
Au Ra aren't dragons.

>>383664098
Ha! Caius was the only one who actually succeeded. Did Ardyn bring about the end of the world? No? Then he didn't succeed.

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>>383654893
>>383654687
>>383664198
hmm, that was a shitty tweet, serves me right for saving it as that name