Are you happy with the direction The Legend of Zelda has taken?

>>383511976
I like Botw a lot because it made exploring fun, however I really miss the old style collect the dungeon item then do things with it that they didn't do in this one. Hopefully a merge of the two can happen in a sequel, where you can explore but also explore cool dungeons like the previous games have. Something like a Tower of Hera would be excellent for this type of game.

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>More innovation like Breath of the Wild

The sad part is that people actually believe this. I'm guessing we have more open world trash to look forward to in Zelda's future.

I don't mind BotW, but I want a traditional top-down Zelda game except one that doesn't suck like ALBW

I think they will merge both.
Keep BoTW style but add more traditional dungeons

>>383511976
They need a Majora that just takes the assets of the last game and makes something better. You'd still need that excellent level design though. More enemies unique to certain regions, shrines that expand upon previous shrine puzzles with greater aesthetic variety between them, and some more story-focused side quests. The hidden parts of the game need to be more than shrines. I want to go to a dark area like that swamp and be greeted by a unique, horrifying monstrosity instead of a Hinox and a shrine. There's so much top notch groundwork to refine here I would hate to wait 5 years for the next one on a different engine.

>>383511976
BotW is a solid game but i hate that it's basically "Ubisoft's Zelda".
Nintendo, even though i hate this company, always stood out as making their own games and not pandering to common trends but this time even them fell for this retarded open world meme.
Game can be really repetitive and is fun only on the beginning.

>>383511976
One game does not result "new direction" just yet.
However, BotW did what I thought would be impossible: made me wonder if OoT is indeed the undeniable GOTYAY.

>>383512604
I don't think it's fair to shit on ALBW considering it's the best portable Zelda since Minish Cap

>>383512593
>i didnt play the game and am shitposting about it because im tired of seeing threads about it

>>383511976
Compared to the last decade, I'm very happy with the direction it has taken.

I really miss the medieval fantasy world and style of lore found in LttP though. I'm not asking for something completely like Dark Souls or the abomination that was TP but a more old-feeling, grounded and consistent Hyrule to make the more fantasy-like set pieces stand out more would be great. ALBW looked like shit and completely missed the point of what made the world and style of LttP so cool, despite being a sequel. The sense of progression in LttP is still unrivaled even today imo, despite it not being the best Zelda game.

>>383512417
>I like Botw a lot because it made exploring fun
do you like fallout or nier: automata?

because they are same as BoTW (minus half life psychics and assassins creed climbing)

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>>383511976
>Are you happy with the direction The Legend of Zelda has taken? More innovation like Breath of the Wild or more Zelda like features similar to the older games?
BotW was a much needed change of pace for the series and I enjoyed the game a lot, but it could still be improved:

>Include fully-featured dungeons non-linaer like Zelda 1. The Beasts in BotW were incredibly disappointing.
>Include proper underground areas and other buildings on the overworld. The lack of real caves to find and explore was a huge disappointment.
>Bring back the traditional item system from previous games, make the Overworld more Metroidvania-esc where newfound abilities unlock secrets in the world.

Essentially keep the open world and it's sense of exploration and discoverying while bringing back traditional dungeons, caves, and the item system.

>Where the does franchise go from here?
A Majora's Mask style sequel to BotW with the above fixes. I want a fucking out-there setting with a weird and new gimmick like the 3 day cycle. I want to be surprised mainly.

I'm fine with any style of Zelda they go with. Of course, if they still have a huge world but they also manage to put a more in-depth story and bigger/more dungeons in it, it would be absolutely perfect, but I don't know how feasible that is. Maybe now that they already have the engine and the assets.

>>383511976
The content tends to feel watered down as if to fill the space the game insists on taking up. You walk more and do less and the shit you do is never as in depth as a game that takes care to craft more curated scenarios.

Good example is taking MGSV:GZ and MGSV:TPP. Ground Zeroes is the best fortress between the two games by far.

Similarly, BotW would only benefit by taking its core mechanics (the physics based shit is fantastic) and focusing it into 8 or 12 dungeons designed to test the player's problem solving, exploratory, and technical mastery of the game.

And on this note, the locations can and often do look great but for the most part the game utilizes that space simply by making you traverse them and do nothing with vast stretches of those areas. They overstay their welcome. There's no focus.

The game is Zelda: Meandering Edition. And the devs knew it. They knew the space had to be filled so they padded it out with tiers of weapons and armor AND made them consumables so they'd never be redundant by the vast world offering them too much.

When you make a game so large that you can't sufficiently fill it with -unique- rewards not too far apart from one another you have a fucking problem. A problem the very first fucking Zelda avoided while still being a Goddamned sandbox.

It's a great game but a better sense of focus would have only made it better.

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>>383511976
>Are you happy with the direction The Legend of Zelda has taken?
Oh yeah. The innovation was great, although I don't think other companies can match Nintendo's greatness at this point. At least the Western companies. The best way to describe it is the Japanese create unique, creative games that explore different ideas and the Western developers only care about $$$. Everyone of them try to emulate GTA or Call of Duty which are shit games anyway..
>Where the does franchise go from here?
Harder enemies, great puzzles, great dungeons. Voice acting can also explore better stories than ever. The archery is great right now but mounted combat/melee combat can be improved upon. I'd want a smaller Zelda game with young Link and he's with a companion and there's a heavier focus on survival and towards the end he becomes a badass with the master sword and rekts everyone's shit.

>>383512934
I disagree completely, and the "ubisoft openworld" meme is so off the point that I don't even...

For starters, Nintendo themselves were pioneers when it comes to openworld games thanks to the Zelda series, and as said many times, Zelda 1 worked as a huge inspiration for BotW.

However, no matter what was the ultimate inspiration for BotW, it managed to cure and improve upon numerous flaws and pure sins of modern open world games. It's fucking ridiculous that a goddamn Nintendo game reminds me the most of STALKER of all things; you got a big, dynamic world to explore as you wish, you got a slow arsenal-based progression, weapons you cannot fix so you keep swapping and looting them all the time, and you can even run straight to the end from the very beginning, if you git gud.

Finally, I got 205 hours clocked to the game at the moment, and it is yet to feel "boring". On the contrary; I'm constantly finding something new I did not know to even exist!

Breath of the WIld's a cool game with lots to explore, the problem is it commits two fairly big sins that won't matter because by the time you realize they have occured you've had your fair share of fun anyways.

1), not alot to do or find when you understand the world, The shrines suck, period, and there are very little truly unique things to go find, the world is actually TOO big, at least its too big for the designers behind it, they ran out of unique things to fill it with.

2) because of the way the game is made, story telling took a massive blow, what plot there is will long be drowned out due to how far inbetween it actually exists from what you fill the rest of the game with.

>>383513204
I agree with you for the most part, but would say there's a certain fun factor to the pure exploration and meandering through the world.

>add traditional dungeons
>throw in more items from previous games like the hookshot
>add more enemy variety
>give Link some magic spells
>make bosses actually challenging
Suddenly BotW becomes the perfect Zelda game.

>>383512952

I might replay it and change my mind, one of my biggest gripes was the babby-tier difficulty, and the hard mode only unlocks after you beat it.

It just felt like dark souls with a story kinda... They removed dungeons i was expecting Nintendo to make zelda great again

>>383511976
If I were to make the next Zelda:
>Take BotW
>Get rid of durability
>Add a time limit of a week or two
>Remove shrines and other fluff bullshit that only exists to pad play time
>Focus on 3-4 main dungeons that are *required* because they offer upgrades necessary to get into the final area (hookshot/zora's flippers/whatever)
>Add a couple side dungeons that have unnecessary upgrades (magic spells, better weapons, mounts, whatever)
>Keep towns, great fairies, etc, make their rewards meaningful
Basically BotW but more Zelda with a Dead Rising style time limit

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>>383511976
I thoroughly enjoyed the game, but the idea of it becoming the standard for the series worries me. Open world has become a standard feature for the industry, but Zelda dungeons are still a pretty unique experience. While Majora's Mask and Wind Waker also sought to take the series in a similar direction and the dungeon design suffered for it, they were at least still there. In Breath of the wild, they're flat out non-existent and that's something I can't accept if the series tries to do it again

>>383513434
>The shrines suck, period,
I disagree. They're great intermissions from all that survival outdoors.

>story
It's not like the plot itself has been anywhat groundbreaking in the past games. And the few times Nin tried to focus on it (ie Skyward Sword), people complained about lack of freedom.

In BotW, the plot merely gives you a context and flavor for the world and your goals: shit has already hit the fan, but you need to fix and finish the job for good. So go train and be a hero, sooner or later.

the PROBLEM is, and this is a big problem with nintendo's inhouse studios since the N64 days....

they won't improve upon any of this with a sequel that is like this, but with the problems fixed, Nintendo is obsessed with doing something unique and then nearly never again, abadoning it forever.

Mario is the most egregious example, most of the core concepts always remain, but once that game is over, any unique thing from it is discarded forever (SUper Mario Galaxy 2 being a strange exception) they never made a game with an overworld like Super Mario World for instance.

they just don't hammer out the kinks and refine a concept, they make a concept, present it too us, and move on in very short order.

so expect the next Zelda game to be nothing like this at all.

>>383513548
>one of my biggest gripes was the babby-tier difficulty
The game has some serious flaws, but you can't really expect much difficulty when Zelda hasn't been challenging since Zelda II. The whole renting items thing was very poorly executed, but it was at least kind of refreshing to not have a Zelda game hold your hand the whole way through

>>383513886
>I disagree. They're great intermissions from all that survival outdoors.
I wouldn't mind the Shrines existence if they complimented proper dungeons, the problem is they don't and are the game's sole source of dungeon-like experiences.

Proper mini-dungeons implemented into the world itself, like caves, would make their existence completely worthless and would be a better alternative alongside proper main dungeons desu.

>>383513886
the shrines suck and almost everyone knows it, for a variety of reasons.

the Shrines, spread out across the world, is the culiminated standin for actual dungeons.

they all require load in-load out for what is basically 2 minutes of effort for one puzzle and its over.

half of them could be put on the surface world as the same sort of puzzle but werent.

>>383513045
I've only played F3 and NV and I've not played Nier 2. Most of my biggest problems with Fallout come from the shitty engine that makes combat really bad and that I really suck at role playing.

I think that Botw is fun for exploration even if it's kind of shallow since you often don't discover cool things, other than shrines. It does a lot of things right that do make the exploration cool like the sandbox combat, few waypoints on the map for quests, different biomes, and shrines to take a break from the outside. Basically you're learning new things all along the way so you forget that you aren't discovering cool things. You learn how to fight an enemy better, you learn a cool interaction that could keep you busy a few mintues, you find a Korok and waste some time there. Climing also works better than in Assassins Creed because you're climbing mountains or cliffs as opposed to buildings. It's more interesting to me.
What I'm trying to say is that the exploration complements the mechanics of the game well which is why it stands out more to me. In a game like Fallout the mechanics is the role playing as opposed to "gameplay."

The biggest flaw in the game for me is the difficulty really. It's insanely easy to just break the game and make it piss easy by upgrading armor and abusing food. There are also very few enemy types so fights usually feel samey even if you have access to different weapons.

>>383513930
>Mario is the most egregious example, most of the core concepts always remain, but once that game is over, any unique thing from it is discarded forever (SUper Mario Galaxy 2 being a strange exception) they never made a game with an overworld like Super Mario World for instance.
>they just don't hammer out the kinks and refine a concept, they make a concept, present it too us, and move on in very short order.

Super Mario 3D World was a direct sequel to 3D Land and was a refinement of that game. They do it occasionally.

>>383513886
Shrines are like croutons without salad

>>383511976

I love it but as I grew up with OOT I kind of miss the old "feel" of the later titles, but seeing where that was taking us (skyward sword) I'm happy to let it go.

There is nothing short of amazing at how much detail was put into the dynamic story of botw, I notice it only now by replaying in master mode and doing some shit differently, like approaching zora's domain from the back and skipping sidon entirely or snatching the master sword before being confronted by Impa.

>>383512934

you are fucking retarded, "ubisoft's zelda" existed long before ubisoft was even a thing, this is how zelda began

>Inb4 muh towers

they are NOTHING like ubisoft trash, they have unique challenges in climbing them and they do not give anything but a map of the region, no shitty icons

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>>383511976
Oh I am. I'm very very happy at how beautiful the direction BOTW has taken

>>383514136
very very occasionally, and usually its because there is an intermission for their "next thing" so they take assets from the last one and present to us "The Lost Levels" of it.

its still a massive problem with the company, their stuff is MOSTLY high-quality but its the most inconsistent shit ever, Mario is the big one.

Zelda less so, as they had 3 games in a row that were very similar, OoT (Majora's mask is basically an extended expansion) WW, and TP.

but that was a fluke it seems,

>>383514057
>the game's sole source of dungeon-like experiences.
So you've not gotten into any of the Beasts yet?

>caves and shit
sure, would be sweet, but they'd end up being static and easily exploitable elements on later playthroughs. And again, recycling old ideas.

>>383514078
>everyone knows it
Well I don't. My wife doesn't.
Seems like you're just whiny ADD bitch.

>>383514375
>Well I don't. My wife doesn't.
Sounds like you and your wife are idiots

>>383513982

It's true, but, for example, LttP was definitely harder than this.

>>383514184
Best analogy for shrines I've ever read

>>383514184
>crouton
...the what now?
>eating salad
kys bunny.

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I haven't liked any direction Zelda has gone in since 2010, BOTW was far from perfect and should be refined/grinded out in other to get the series closer to what it was 20 years ago

>>383514431
Sounds like you're just buttmad.

>>383511976

it's fantastic but I feel it takes too much to make.

Like they started planning in 2011, began production in 2014, delayed the game THREE times and some parts still feel rushed, it's too massive to be detailed everywhere and I feel it was too big even for nintendo, granted it paid off but I seriously doubt they'll make a brand new zelda the next time around, there's a high chance we will see a direct sequel like majora's mask because all those fucking assets they produced for this are too much for a single game, they just need to add more enemies, I'm fucking sick of bokoblins, where's my dueling stalfos, where's my wallmasters, where's my skulltullas, fuck where's my mother fucking POES and REDEADS?!!! jesus fucking christ OOT has more enemy variety than this shit and a lot of those enemies could easily hold a weapon for link to steal so no "muh durability > weapon drop" bullshit.

>>383514539
Says the sperg calling someone a "whiny ADD bitch"
Shrines suck, stay grumpy

>>383514375
>So you've not gotten into any of the Beasts yet?
I shouldn't have said sole, but they're the main source because of how short the Beasts are. They aren't proper dungeons.

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>>383514509
>still posting Sonybro bait version
I have played zelda since NES days, and BotW is easily the best games since n64 days

>>383514651
Says an ADD bitch.
Shrines are vary in quality, but are great and equally open in execution as rest of the game.

>>383511976
I'd like the gameplay of BotW in a game with more traditional world layout. More big dungeons, fewer koroks and shit to collect fucking everywhere.

That's not to say I didn't like BotW though. Some of the shrines were great and I loved shit like the labyrinths. But some huge dungeons to explore and more items would have made me love it even more.

Also not the biggest fan of the durability. Because I liked carrying around weapons useful for traversing the environment and solving puzzles fights turned into me cheesing enemies/spamming bow attacks.

>>383511976

Master Trials made me mad

mad because it proves nintendo can craft a series of levels and exploit the amazing mechanics of the game, every room is tightly designes and gives you specific tools to deal with the enemies, there's even multi layered design that makes you plan ahead like dangerously collecting lighting inducing battered iron weapons to refine with an octorock later, it's genius game design and something the base game hardly ever does beyond the plateau.

Next game should have an amazing overworld like BOTW but they should fucking ditch the shrines and make proper dungeons, shrines are good only the first playthrough, now they are just a checklist and some of them are fucking annoying (looking at you golf ball stasys challenge)

>>383514509

there are some underground sections, namely the Forgotten Temple and that top image looks like one of the northern labyrinths.

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Breath of the wild is zelda for minecraft and open world memers. I want dungeons, actual gameplay, non breakable items, item progression, story, and music back.

But this is 2017. Nintendo doesn't like effort anymore and their target audience is autistic kids and casual manchildren. Fuck the game industry today.

>>383513434
>the world is actually TOO big, at least its too big for the designers behind it, they ran out of unique things to fill it with.

equip that korok mask you missed 200 puzzles senpai

After Skyward Sword anything that took the series away from that overrated turd (lol 93/100 on Metacritic, Nintendo bias confirmed) is a good thing.

Might as well make it an MMO it already ruined the Zelda formula

>>383511976
To be blunt, BotW was a misstep in the right direction.

>>383513865
Why a time limit? That's stupid

I really do love this game but i was sort of disappointed with the story (like many) and while i did like the divine beasts in place of the dungeons I really wish that it had more than just the final blight like some mini bosses and maybe some longer puzzles.For the future of LoZ I hope that it goes back to a more linear (slightly) dungeon and MAKE THE FINAL BOSS SOMETHING ACTUALLY WORTH THE MULTIPLE HOURS THAT YOU CAN PUT INTO THE GAME

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>>383511976
It worries me. BotW is arguably a very important game, existing as a significant revitalization of an influential company's key franchise, but it's hard to put genie back in the bottle. Nintendo never mastered the old formula of ~8 dungeons and a more linear progression. They've managed to make a very nuanced and interactive open world system but if the old structured formula was something they didn't improve well on I can't see how they can consistently improve on this. The lag between each Zelda game as well doesn't boost confidence either, how long was this in development? How long will be an expanded successor be? The biggest problem is going back to the old format will just cause an outrage when everyone now loves this open world style.

The best of both worlds is obviously a dream game, one with 8 or more strong dungeons complete with progressively intricate puzzles and challenging bosses with an interactive over world full of adventure and exploration with a good story and music to match, but a perfect game like that seems so unlikely. I'd be less surprised if BoTW2 or whatever they call it is just 2 open worlds you can swap between as they've done so often, with little more depth than the original.

>>383513523
I'm honestly pretty pissed they made the fire rod etc., korok leaf, and torch into weapons with durability instead of having them as tools. They could have easily been made into runes and it would have not only given them more options for puzzles but would have alleviated the inventory problem.

>>383512728

This, and more music.
As we know, fine tuning the physics/environmental engine is what took like 80% of BOTW development, I can only hope with that now done they can focus more on the other classic aspects in future games.

>>383514884

this pic is fucking retarded stop posting, that building may as well be a tall mountain because you cannot enter it, fuck off

>>383513865
Fix the combat. Don't make a gear based progression system. You should be able to kill a Lynell right at the start of the game if you're skilled enough.

Get rid of flurry rush, and make weapon variety actually fucking matter.

Add WAAAAAAYYYY more enemies.

Add better Side Quests.

Change the gear upgrade system. So it doesn't break the game.

Don't make bosses total pushovers.

Add lengthy and engaging sidequests that lead into the dungeons.

>>383511976
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T15-xfUr8z4

>>383515197
and they gave us a worse turd. SS is actually good next to botw.

>>383515223
Because BotW lacked urgency and progression. It didn't feel like an adventure because you were never required to overcome any obstacle outside of the great plateau and ganon's castle, and you were given all the time in the world to fuck off. A time limit and the typical zelda abilities would make it really solid I think. And similar to DR, if you just wanted to fuck around you could, you just wouldn't be able to get the true ending or whatever.

>>383513434
>The shrines suck, period
The events tied to some of the shrines don't suck though. Like eventide island or the hyrule forest.

>>383514884
>one is an abandoned coliseum with a few enemies and no actual dungeon/maze
>the next is just a cave with a shrine and not actual ruins
shrines were a mistake

>>383515006
Forgotten Temple is basically just one large hallway with a few guardians though, there's no paths to go down in it and once you enter you can basically just beeline to the shrine at the end anyway

>>383513886
LITERALLY half of the shrines are a total waste of time with no thought put into them. And their rewards aren't meaningful.

Absolutely. The last 3D Zelda game that was worth a shit was Majoras Mask on the N64. WW, TP, and SS are just OOT again.

I never want to go back. I hope they keep this groundwork more fresh but BOTW is easily the best Zelda game for the time being

>>383515539
>WW, TP, and SS are just OOT again.
No they aren't. No game has done OOT since, mostly because as that one anon said earlier, Nintendo throws away all their innovations instead of refining them.

>>383515627
>No game has done OOT since,
Twilight Princess

That's not a bad thing, TP, is a great game, but it's clearly deriving itself from OoT the most out of the 3D Zeldas.

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>make the greatest adventure game ever for its time
>Nintendo: alright, people are tired of it. Let's make something else!
>twenty years later, people still consider it great
>man people really are tired of OoT. Let's make something completely opposite!

>>383515509

True, I wish there was at least one full-size traditional Zelda temple in the game but I have the sneaking suspicious people would find a way to complain about it by comparing it to previous game's temples.

In my opinion, the temple would be similar thematically to the Forest Temple. Big enough so that the player can get lost in it.

But a lot of players (and especially reviewers) ragequit games the moment they hit a difficulty spike and would shit-talk the game a lot more.

>>383515751
TP builds on the fundamentals, but then trips itself cause it leans too much on cinematic shit and tear padding that ended up becoming a staple of the series. Botw is that except it's the entire game. Useless padding.

>>383515627
No. All 3 of those games have surface level changes like "Ocarina of time but the overworld is an ocean" or "Ocarina of time with derivative wolf segments".

Breath of the wild completely changes the formula. The 3 OOT clones cannot compare.

>>383515506
sure, but that doesn't make the Shrine good.

Shrines and Korok's make up about 60% of what you'll be doing and the only progression in the game beyond weapons.

>>383515751

TP is not Ocarina of Time this meme needs to die.

OoT has more in common with Link to the Past than it does with TP. Only things thematically similar are "there's a big field" and "you ride a horse"

>>383515906
And all of that's fun as shit and leaves a lot of open room for the player to be creative.

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>>383515830
If they are suppose to be Oot clones, they were the worse clones ever. OoT has a specific set of design choices that no other game has followed since.

MM is literally a mod of OoT made in a year by the team.

WW is Nintendo going overboard with the new limitations given by Gamecube and giving us a huge ocean of nothing.

SS is not OoT at the slightest. This game just decided to make everything in the world a puzzle, then blind us with the most horrible colors ever. Then there's the terrible wagglan.

>>383514998

I want dungeons too, but they'll definitely need to replace shrines with some kind of other fast travel mechanic. The world is so big that the very particular fast travel is at least appreciated. The amount of shrines makes it so easy to teleport to almost any specific location you'd want, which ends up being great when you're doing pretty refined exploration. Like, you've seen most of the area, but you remember you haven't really looked at this hill over here, or this valley, or whatever.

>>383515974
>And all of that's fun as shit
Subjective obviously, I found Shrines to be braindead and I got bored very quickly. fwiw I only completed about 40 of em so maybe the rest are better, but what I played was just "use physics to roll a ball into a hole" or "fight a guy" and it was just tedious.

Botw reminded me that having a big stretch of land doesn't make a game good.

GTA 3 did the go anywhere angle better cause it had a lot of content density. Literally at every block in the city, there was something to do. You don't have that in Botw.

>>383515906
Those events are basically the shrine themselves.

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>>383515915
>3D and 2D game are the same
You're retarded. OOT could literally have ALTTPs map 1:1 and they would play less similarly than OOT and TP because 2D and 3D are fundamentally different.

TP is OOT with a new map and some items. The Wolf is just derivative garbage where you go into "not a Zelda game" form for a little while Exact same style of dungeons. Pacing of the dungeons. Settings practically identical to one others.

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Just get FromSoft to make a Zelda, I don't care how short it is as long as it has that compact overworld the first DaS had

>>383515762

Ocarina of Time achieved the golden ratio of adventure and action. It reached the Goldilocks zone in so many areas, music/atmosphere, structure/freedom, difficulty/fun, puzzles/fighting etc.

The only people who dislike it are lazy contrarians who probably rushed through it with a guide or gave up the second Mido blocked their path.

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>>383516016
>If they are suppose to be Oot clones, they were the worse clones ever
That's the idea. The three of them are completely valueless like a 3DS Pokemon game or an annualized shooter.
There all just shitty OOT with surface level gimmicks.

>>383515273

They practically perfected it with their first entry. OoT was one of the best 3D Zeldas for dungeons. Majora's Mask was the best for wold building through all of the sidequests. I love Wind Waker, but the biggest thing it had going for it to me was just style and a new game. It was the beginning of a kind of bland attempt at improving upon the magic of OoT and MM, and ultimately none of the following games could hope to do anything but meet those N64 games' quality of design.

I think BotW has clear areas to improve in, so I hope they don't fuck it up. It's the first in a new formula, I think they can do it. But I can see them fumbling into another stagnant period with the 3rd or 4th.

>>383516230
OoT and Alttp share the most similar features because OoT was simply lttp but in 3D. Every puzzle, every jingle, and every enemy you find in that game is in OoT translated into 3D. After OoT is when Nintendo decided to stop reusing their game design because they thought people were getting tired of it when it was far from the truth.

TP is not OoT. Tp is a cinematic zelda that is tailored more toward a PS1 audience rather than the core zelda fanbase, which is precisely why Nintendo made a compromise with its design, and why I consider it a weaker zelda game.

It basically went back to its roots. I want it to stay this way, only with better dungeons next time.

>>383516516
>It basically went back to its roots.
So it went back to when consoles had low memory and no capcity for saving?

>>383514307
>its ok when nintendo does it

>>383516649

It went back to when you were happy and not a miserable shell of a man.

>>383516230

False also those mundane opinions make you sound like you were born in 2004 please leave.

Ocarina of Time gives the player freedom (you CAN get a horse to jump the bridge, you CAN beat the temples in this order, you CAN defeat Volvagia with the bow and arrow, the majority of the game is optional and has leniency.

TP there's only 1 way to do anything and the game leaves no room for experimentation or variety, it's literally simon says for the entire fucking game.

Why don't you try graduating Highschool first before you spread your opinions on /v/, Arin?

>>383511976
>Are you happy with the direction The Legend of Zelda has taken?
No. No I am fucking not. Because I liked the traditional formula. Maybe it did get stale, but they didn't need to throw the whole thing out. It could've worked with a big game like this.

>>383511976
>383511976
I don't mind some linear sections, so I think they need more of that in the future. Similar to how they forced you to stay on the path when fist entering the Zora's domain. The game also really needs more enemies, with a world this big, there should be more of a variety. Of course, traditional dungeons should return as well.

>>383516790

They're going to go back to it, but keep the open world. It's the only thing for them to do. I can't see them literally just repeating BotW without making dungeons a more central part of it, and a more engaging story. They're the weakest elements of the game. Plus more monsters, bosses and such.

>>383516752
Ive been hearing this argument on multiple sites, and I have a funny feeling the people making them weren't born during that time.

So tell me, what is so good going back to when nintendo had to:

>reuse assets cause low cartridge memory
>used low quality music with low amount of music variety
>basic combat
>because of memory, dialogue could not be done and dungeons were very very simple, as well as the story

You don't see african americans going back to their roots, donning shrabs, and asking to work in the cotton fields again cause of "muh roots."

>>383516904
>They're going to go back to it
said no one ever. Even Aonuma, and actual documented case, says he doesn't want to do that again.

>>383516935

I think you know what people mean by that, and are just feigning ignorance.

>>383516935
When people say "bring x back to its roots" they don't mean it literally.

I never liked 3D Zelda despite growing up playing all of them to some extent as they came out, but BotW was actually fairly enjoyable, so I'm glad they're sticking with it assuming they don't fuck it up in the future.

I'm more interested in more 2D Zelda, though.

>>383517018

No, I mean they're keeping the open world like Aonuma said, but they're going to improve the dungeons and story. There is no way they're just doing shrines again, Nintendo doesn't like repeating itself. I think even Nintendo knows how disheartening it would be to just see those glowing yellow shrines all along the horizon again.

>>383517092

>You don't see african americans going back to their roots, donning shrabs, and asking to work in the cotton fields again cause of "muh roots."

Because they're retarded. Who wouldn't want to go back to sitting around, singing, eating watermelons and friend chicken all day?

>>383516790
eh, the "traditional" formula always worked better in 2d anyway, and (hopefully) they're still going to make 2d zelda games here and there

>>383517076
No I dont think people know what I mean by that because all they are saying is

>nintendo is going back to their roots with zelda 1

Except, neither of them even understand why the fuck they are saying it. They're just saying what an ignorant reviewer said who doesn't even know the design significance of zelda 1 vs modern zeldas. A journalist back in the day would be able to say exactly what Botw is and would further say that it DOES NOT have anything to do with Zelda 1. And if it did, then it's very bad for Nintendo to go backwards in game design for the sake of "muh roots."

>>383517207
>but they're going to improve the dungeons and story
said no one ever. Again, show me where they actually said this.

>>383516790
I really enjoyed BotW, but I really wish they had done more dungeons. I might be incorrect here, but I remember hearing that BotW was going to have dungeons like the rest of the Zelda games, except they didn't require you to have any specific item to do them.
I think they really should have included dungeons, because while I had a blast playing it, I really thought shrines were boring after a while, and the "traditional dungeons" in the Divine Beasts fucking sucked

>>383517353
they're going to improve botw's story by charging for the real ending

>>383517245
>the "traditional" formula always worked better in 2d anyway
I don't agree at all. I think it works well in both 2D and 3D. It just depends how well it's executed.

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BotW is basically the point where numales and millennials took over.

They don't want a Zelda game. They want a game that is called Zelda for their "nerd creed" that is chasing all modern day trends like the empty open world shit that BotW copied so well from other turds.

>>383517269
It has lot in common with the first Zelda, underage.

>>383517269

When people are saying it's going back to its roots, they don't mean "it's going back to being 8-bit and having low memory". What they're talking about is design philosophy. You had true freedom with the first Zelda. You could tackle just about any challenge you wanted in any order you wanted, or go straight to Ganon.

>>383517539
No it doesn't, underage.
>b-b-but open world
Stop. They're completely different.

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You cannot mix open world with the old Zelda design, which is why I rather they return to the old formula if they want to bring back that adventure feel. My gripe with link between worlds is that the whole freedom angled weakened the dungeon design and made backtracking even more retarded than SS.

Fucking get away from this shitty open world meme. It's a retarded game concept that only works best in theory. No dev will do it right because actual effort is required to make open world work. The world has to evolve as the player progresses, no matter what order they do things, but that'll take too much work, too much work all business orientated companies, including Nintendo, will not put the investment in.

So fuck off with open world. At least with a more structured experience, we'll actually have some function of progression and challenge again.

>>383517609
>You could tackle just about any challenge you wanted in any order you wanted, or go straight to Ganon.
But that's just not true. Play the game.

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I liked it.

>>383517609
You only had true freedom because the NES is low tech hardware and zelda was literally just them taking the rpg formula and making it into a casual actionfest for people who didnt want to play all the calculators of rpgs released at the time.

>>383511976

What made a Zelda game a Zelda game was the puzzles, the boss fights, and the side quests. BotW sucked at all this. I'd rather have a linear game like Majora's Mask than another BotW.

>>383516757
alttp oot and tp are all extremely similar games in terms of actual gameplay/progression. the fact that they vary somewhat in linearity doesnt change this (no, being able to do the fire temple before the forest temple does not make oot considerably less linear than tp). if you were born before 1996 youd probably be able to see this pattern.

>>383517539
The only thing it ever had in common was the freedom to go anywhere. Except original Zelda had structure where it required you to do dungeons and obtain certain items to find secrets. BotW gives you everything off the bat and expects you to make your own structure, leaving everything in the game to feel incredibly lackluster because they have to design the world to where anyone at any point in the game can go there and do whatever. It's really boring game design.

>>383516757
>freedom

You think it's freedom to beat a required boss?

>but I used a deku stick to beat gohma!

Ocarina of Time doesn't have freedom. It can be kind of lenient in the order of the dungeons you go through but even that usually requires a playthrough to realize considering Navi specifically puts you on the Forest, Fire, Water, Shadow, Spirit route (undoubtedly the route 90% of people take to get through the game). The entirety of the game is optional? You mean the like five side quests? I love the game to death man but your characterization is utter nonsense, it's certainly no more free than Twilight Princess.

>>383517747

You should be telling yourself that

>>383517534
>They don't want a Zelda game. They want a game that is called Zelda for their "nerd creed" that is chasing all modern day trends like the empty open world shit that BotW copied so well from other turds.
Zelda's been that way for years Anon. Doesn't prevent people from legitimately enjoy the games though. The games are certainly a breath of fresh air when the majority of games coming out are AAA Western multiplayer service games that try to jew players left and right.

>>383517885

> BotW gives you everything off the bat and expects you to make your own structure

Why is that such a bad thing though? In fact, the way you described it makes the game seem incredibly appealing.

>>383518050
>The games are certainly a breath of fresh air when the majority of games coming out are AAA Western multiplayer service games that try to jew players left and right
Oh the irony

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>>383517885

>growing up learning how to make games
>the number one thing that most devs at this time said was that you should always make the experience so you can keep the player from having to get lost and make their own
>2017
>suddenly it's wrong to restrict a player's freedom. The very sin of letting a player get lost is now thrown out the window and the tables have turned

I would argue however that the only reason this game concept works these days is because the gamers who buy these products have gotten stupider and less aware. They don't want to play games anymore. I've been doing game dev for fifteen years professionally.

Botw is a game made for people to play in 10 to 15 minute segments. OoT was a game made to be played in hour or longer segments. It reminds me currently of how wrestling is structured these days. Before, it had more hardcore fans, so they invested in longer storylines. Now these days they assume everyone is not paying attention, so all content and stories only last for one week or one ppv cycle.

>>383518167
>Why is that such a bad thing though?
Imagine LotR if they could just walk to Mt Doom with 0 obstacles

>>383517362
In the next game I want more dungeons like BOTW's Hyrule Castle. They should be fairly non-linear, have the traditional item, map and compass them, they should be designed in a way that encourages you to return to them later and explore them more, and beating the boss isn't required to beat the game.

If they were to do something similar to the divine beasts and the shrines though in the next game, I hope they still make them all feel more like traditional Zelda dungeons at least. Just be more than a single room and have more enemies to fight in them.

>>383517885
>because they have to design the world to where anyone at any point in the game can go there and do whatever

I mean you say this but you're not just going to wander into Death Mountain, the desert or Hyrule Castle your first go through and not get your shit pushed in. Hell, when you first start off before you start getting more hearts and better armor any decent sized mob is a potential game over. Breath of the Wild only really starts to open up once you understand its systems and have some hours under your belt.

>>383518505
>they should be designed in a way that encourages you to return to them later and explore them more
Oh fuck that. Why the fuck are you guys praising Botw for doing this shit and yet we shat all over SS for this?!

This is exactly how I can tell that the entire generation of Nintendo gamers has changed. You fucking settle for the worst shit.

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>>383516163
>Subjective obviously

>>383518505
>beating the boss isn't required
No, God, just stop. Enough with this "make your own experience" "do what you want" "nothing is required" bullshit. It's boring. There's nothing to learn if there's nothing to overcome. There's no challenge if you can walk away from every problem.

>>383517834
>What made a Zelda game a Zelda game was the puzzles, the boss fights, and the side quests.

Except these are all better than they have ever been in the series.

>>383518750
In a game that doesnt exist cause Botw has none of that.

>>383518304

Well this isn't a movie

>>383511976
I think I should just give up on this series. I haven't liked any of their console games in over a decade now. They just keep fucking their games up, but in different ways. First with motion controls and handholding and now with open world trash. I just want to play a good console zelda again. I guess if the next one it given to their handheld B team the next game could be at least decent though.

>>383518750
BotW has puzzles? I thought it just had ballmazes

>>383518802
Wow anon, very good observation! Really though, pay attention. The point is it's not engaging if there's no conflict.

>>383518750

Wrong.

>>383518847
It's better than the rest of the series where you push a block or shoot an arrow to open a door.

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>>383518750
wrong

>>383518732
Kids dont want to learn anything these days. Why do you think homeschooling is so popular? We're in the mobile age of gaming now. It's all about instant gratification and self identity. If they have to have any semblance of challenge, they will not play it. In the army, they have fucking stress slips. Teachers are now punished for making children learn. If a kid is autistic or has ADD, they aren't considered "special" anymore, but normal. Minecraft is the peak of education, not Teddy's ABCs.

This is the 21st century and we are doomed if nothing changes.

>>383513865
>Add a time limit of a week or two
I surprisingly really like this idea. It kind of gives you a goal and a purpose for the work you put into progressing.

>>383518263
It's easy mode for lazy developers. They don't really have to think much about shit like level design and so on + it pads game time nicely when the idiotic player constantly gets sidetracked with collection trash or has to travel for a long time. It hides the lack of actual content quite well.

>>383518808
>I guess if the next one it given to their handheld B team the next game could be at least decent though.
A link between worlds was tainted by open world shit. It's a lost cause.

>>383517885
>I-I-I know more than the creators that created BOTH of these games
>p-p-please pay attention to me
Please consider suicide, retard. Nintendo has said several times it's inspired by the first game. It's really obvious.

>>383519096
I noticed the game pattern ten minutes into the game. Once I was an hour in, my thoughts were confirmed. At that point, I decided to finish the game by completing the four beasts and going to ganon. Everything in the game is not tailored for old zelda fans. I've played minecraft and instantly realized what the game design was taking cues from. Botw is not an adventure game as much as it's a sandbox game, which is the worse direction to take a zelda game.

Problem here is, Nintendo owns the zelda ip so we're going to be stuck with this low effort crap for another decade. That anon who was saying that they are going to improve upon that design doesn't realize what that really means. It means Nintendo is going to get even lazier now.

BOTW having open world is not new for the zelda series at all. The very first zelda game on the nes was "open world", go around wandering aimlessly and find a random dungeon. It's just that with the Wii U they could finally accomplish there original goal.

>>383518927

There is conflict though. I don't know how you can't see that. You can't just rush to Ganon and beat him without any effort, there's preparation involved, even if you can go straight to him, and it's not like that's a guarantee of victory. I mean, have you even played the game? Hyrule Castle alone can kill you in an instant.

No I absolutely hated Breath of the Wild. It felt more Ubisoft than Zelda, and was actually significantly worse than both. Of course if I criticise people will tell me I haven't played it.

Even if it looks like Winkwaker I'll never buy another open world Zelda because of it.

>>383519274
>my first drawing was shit but I'm inspired by it so I'm going to make shit again

thats what you sound like

>>383519274
Ah the old "if you're not the dev your opinion is invalid" bit, aka argument from authority fallacy
fuck off

>>383511976
Should have gone back to its roots. A 2D platformer. We all know Zelda II was the best entry in the series.

>>383518620
The problem with Skyward Sword was not returning to areas that you've been before, but was that there was pretty much no secrets anywhere in the game to be found. It'd be fun to freely explore a dungeon like Hyrule Castle for as long as you want and then return later.

>>383518732
Maybe it's because I still end up doing everything anyway, but I like it when a game gives me the option to not have to do something. It feels more like you're actively choosing to do something because you want to and not because the developers want you and that's the only path given.

>>383519274
No shit they said it was inspired by the first, tbey are trying to attract old fans and nostalgia. You think they are going to say they ripped off Assassin's Creed and Dark Souls? Don't be naive. Do you take everyone at their word blindly? You can plainly see the attributes from others games in this one. You're being retarded on purpose.

>>383519527
>The problem with Skyward Sword was not returning to areas that you've been before, but was that there was pretty much no secrets anywhere in the game to be found. It'd be fun to freely explore a dungeon like Hyrule Castle for as long as you want and then return later.
I'm sorry SS wasn't your autistic minecraft fantasy of needing something to find in your distracting quest of fake freedom.

>>383519527
>when a game gives me the option to not have to do something
Like sidequests? You don't have to make the meat of the game optional to have optional content

>>383519356
>the game is not tailored for old zelda fans

When did you start playing the series because it's more like the 2D games instead of the 3D ones that were hampered by technological limitations and Nintendo feeling like players have become idiots and need everything laid out for them.

>>383511976
mechanically, I enjoyed BotW a lot, I liked how Stamina was an actual stat you could develop, it was great to use weapons other than the Master Sword, and I think stealth was implemented well enough. I don't know if I would like big open world again, I think TP is a nice world size for Zelda, provided it has decent options for fast travel, and I did kind of missed having proper dungeons

>>383519721
Let me rephrase that.

It's a game not tailored to fans of lttp and OoT, the greatest 2d and 3d zelda games of the franchise. This isn't nostalgia speaking. Nintendo has literally regressed in their game design philosophies.

>>383519721
>Nintendo feeling like players have become idiots
BotW is the most idiot-friendly Zelda yet

>>383519360
see
>>383517885

>>383511976
>innovation

Are you serious anon?
Go to suck Miyamoto's dick in other place.

>>383518263

Tastes change over time, it and it forces devs to change their development philosophies. What people thought were good movies in the 1970s is different than what people think are good movies today. Were they wrong? Are we right? I don't think that's really the case, just a matter of consumer preferences making a shift with time periods.

For all we know, it could shift the other way in the next 10 years. Look at capeshit, suddenly it's really popular again when nobody really gave a shit about it in the '90s (save for the odd Batman movie or 2).

>>383519990
Capeshit is popular for reasons not like those in the 90s. Micheal Keaton and Tim Burton made Batman work cause of their mix of good acting and artistic style. Marvel is a matter of the right actors and the fact Disney has the best advertisement power right now.

Tastes change, but it doesnt mean those tastes are good. I have once thought that it was me who was wrong, but I've come to see certain trends that show it's simply a matter of devs becoming lazier and consumers becoming stupider. I wish I could reverse this process, but money, social media, and the world of tech is fighting against me. It's a losing race and the only thing that will set things back is a technological setback, aka a war of some form.

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>>383520245
>aka a war of some form
VIDEO GAAAAAAAAAAMES

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This will be the first zelda i wont complete

I waited for hard mode cause i was nored on how easy it was
Hardmode has come and although it started out amazing im 80% done the game and im just burnt out

The bosses are WEAK
The enemy varity isnt there
Level design is mediocore
Puzzles are meh
Combat is okay but i feel OP as fuck
Art is good
Sandbox is decent

Its not well put together at all
Really disappointed and sad that i payed for hard mode

>>383520552
Once upon a time, video games were less shallow and didn't impose shit in your face with casino psychological skinner box designs, but at the same time, didn't throw a movie at you either.

>>383519692
So... Skyward Sword couldn't have used more secrets and actual stuff to do in the linear overworld?

>>383519702
Well that's true. I liked BOTW but I guess more structure would be welcome for future games. I guess what I would really want for a main quest is to be like the 2D Zelda games where they tell you to go somewhere, but you're free to get lost on the way and not the 3D games where you feel compelled to go where the story tell you to go and that's really because of how the world in the 3D games is designed with the open main hub area and the linear offshoots.

>>383519464
>>383519435
Not exactly but they created both games and it's obvious to any fan of the series. What the fuck are your retards argument again? Oh that's right. Fucking nothing.
>>383519642
Naive what, you stupid retard? Some fans have nostalgia for the series, some don't. Either way they get something they love. SHOCKING, right? Seriously, kill yourself. And stop bringing up Dark Souls, you guys are legit autistic. The series isn't even good.

>>383520870
>Not exactly but they created both games
So fucking what? You gonna tell me Nomura or Sakamoto are worth a shit because they did some cool stuff two decades ago?

To be honest if the next game just doubles the dungeons, and half's the shrines, I'll be happy.
Maybe triple weapon durability but make them slightly rarer would be nice. You can get a good strong weapon but it feels like you only get to kill 3 or so enemies with it before its gone for a while

I also think the more open quest system worked fine, since it was still pretty structured.

>>383521012
Why are you still butthurt by BotW? You really need to let go.

>>383520575
Agreed, also the quests are just so bad.
Majoras mask nailed quests and almost 2 decades later and still nothing comes close

>>383511976

Easy: more NPC interaction. BOTW is a great, amazing foundation and can become something truly great if there is a greater variety of things that can be done with individual NPCs.

>>383521551
No thanks, the game has enough useless padding as-is

>>383516058

>he doesn't have a 5 star speed horse

lmeo

>>383516016
>If they are suppose to be Oot clones, they were the worse clones ever.

that's the point, they suck dick because they just mimick was OOT did without the good parts, they have cool parts to them though, like the setting of WW, the charm of Midna and the genuine zelda of SS that actually acts like a fucking person

>>383511976
The next game will be to BotW what MM was to OoT

It won't take nearly as long as BotW to make, will be denser and with more of a focus on story and characters

>>383516436

they literally had to mash OOT and majora togheter to make the best zelda ever made and they chose instead to chase after gimmicks like the ocean, the sky and CRAWLING IN MY TWILIGHT, fucking idiots when the fans asked for a mature zelda they meant no pedantic and stupid hand holding of wind waker, not the graphical style (which 90% of the haters ended up loving ANYWAY once the game released)

>>383517885
>BotW gives you everything off the bat and expects you to make your own structure

not in master mode, there is no OHKO protection so you are essentially a fucking niglet for most of the game, even a fucking hinox waking up can obliterate you by waving his gay ass hand

How come thunderblight ganon was the only challenging boss?

>>383518263
>Botw is a game made for people to play in 10 to 15 minute segments

then they did a terrible job because it hooks me for 12 hours on end every time I boot it up

Add more durability and a crafting system and I'll be content. Maybe a way to repair every item.

TES meets OoT/MM/ALttP.
>no copy/paste shrines.
>season Hyrule with crypts filled with Stalfos/Redead/bandits/crazy cultists.
>the ability to have consequences for stealing and attacking people,but not brutal due to esrb.
>more towns/villages