You faggots weren't kidding. The level design in this game

Game for completionists only.

Probably because it was done by amateurs.

Meh I thought it was a pretty good game.

I'm playing DS1 for the first time and loving it, is 2 with playing?

>>380857417
still better than DeS and DaS 1

>>380857497
Yes

No you don't get, the level design is just misunderstood and underrated. Go back to your Bloodborne you hipster contrarian pleb Dark Souls 2 is the best game ever and only a true souls fan would ever realise it!

>>380857497
>Not playing it and forging your own opinion

This is the problem with /v/. Almost nobody thinks for themselves

>>380857604
>t. soulsbabby

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How do you feel about based HBomberGuy eternally BTFOing Dark Souls 2 haters, especially MatthewMatosis?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRTfcMeqhig

The most forgettable part of this game is the poison area before you enter the giant tower which leads to the floating lava world. You can literally run past everything and it is so meaningless.

Bloodborne>DS2SotfS>DS3>DS1>DeS

>>380857493
It's okay to have garbage taste

>>380857695
>Hour long
>Lorefags

No thanks.

>>380857497
dark souls 2 is shit compared to dark souls 1. don't even bother

>>380857695
>almost 5k dislikes

he lost his credibility

>>380857652
I'm 50 hours into my first playthrough and still yet to finish Sen's fortress, I'm a little while off starting another. I wish I was NEET so time wasn't an issue.

>>380857695
>outs himself as a massive deluded fanboy

He's a joke.

>>380858057
>his previous videos are feminist drivel

Yeah, he had tons of credibility before.

>>380857829
when i first played DS2, i had just finished DS1 and i was coming off that high where i felt like i could speedrun any game i played.

i didn't kill a single mob, i just ran straight to the first boss, killed him, then ran to the part where you get invaded, killed that guy, then got stuck/lost and never played it ever again.

you shouldn't be able to get "stuck" in a Souls game, it's retarded.

>>380857497
There are people who loves it and hates it. It's very polarizing. Personally I liked it a lot.

I recommend for you to finish DaS 1 first.

>>380858204
>you shouldn't be able to get "stuck" in a Souls game, it's retarded.
What the fuck?
Have you tried playing DS1 without constantly reading guides and checking maps on wiki? You get stuck/lost in DS1 all the fucking time. That's one of features of souls games, you never know for sure where to go and what to do.
Except for DS3 because the whole game is a straight line. I guess this is the reason lots of retards like DS3 and say it's better than DS2.

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>>380857695
>Matthew in his critique says that Dark Souls 2 is a great game, best that came out in its year
>Miyazaki fanboys use the exact same video to claim that the game is garbage.

This is why I can never take DaS2 haters seriously. Most of them come off as autistic children. It makes sense to think that its the worst souls game, but going full autism and saying "OMG WORST GAME EVER MADE FUCKING B-TEAM REEEEE SAVE US MIYAZAKI" is the exact reason this community has been the worst in video games since the release of Dark Souls for PC back in 2012.

Now that I think of it, the community first started going to shit when PCbros got in. I wonder why

>>380858434
I don't get it

>>380858204
>Play new Souls game for first time
>Try to speedrun it on first play through
>End up not having fun

Whos fault is that?

>>380858204
>I rushed this shit. it ain't my fault I got stuck, the game sucks
what the fuck

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>>380858762
Top is the unused map data of the Gutter as it was seen in the concept art which would've been basically Blighttown on top of New Londo with an enormous town as backdrop, bottom is the lame-ass cave we got instead.

>>380858725
>muh PC boogeyman

Kill yourself

>>380859131
It looks like a corridor with bunch of pillars around it

>>380858204
Play DeS. You won't be able to speedrun it, I guarantee it.

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>>380859184
The stuff on the left is just the backdrop.
The actual level is on the right.

>>380857417
They were scraps of larger maps that wouldn't run on PS360 and were thrown together into the final product in 6 months. This game went through development hell worse than the first one.

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Dark souls 2 is confusing as fuck.

I tried playing it once, couldn't even figure how to get out of Majula (first hub area) so I just gave up.

And this is coming from a guy who beat dark souls 1 and dark souls 3.

>>380859813
>I tried playing it once, couldn't even figure how to get out of Majula (first hub area) so I just gave up.

Glad to know your a retard as well as a liar. Good job

>>380859813
Its ok to be retarded on this new age dont worry too much about it.

>>380859927
>>380859969
>have large hub area with many paths leading out of it
>be surprised people get lost

I'd have have a clear sense of progression like in real dark souls.

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>>380859606
Pretty much.
The game was slapped together which resulted in tons of stuff not making any sense.

>>380860214
>Many paths leading out of it
>Picked none

Like I said, retarded.

>>380859813
I remember not finding the pull chain left of the door and think I needed a key or some other shit to open it

I'm happy to have another DS game to play but DS2 is definitely bottom tier

>>380860214
To be honest, the way to the FotfG is probably the least obvious one.
The ones to the Old Akellare and Heide are way more prominent.

The only people that hate DS2 are DS3 babbies and shitters. Go suck a nigger dick OP.

Why was Dark Souls 2 so fucking slow?
Every animation is so slow, everything takes twice as long because your attack animation is so slow with such long recovery.

>>380860359
He made the right choice by dropping the game because it's shit.

>>380860480
huh?
the way of blue guy tells you to go to the forest of fallen giants, and you can see the pathway easily from his perch

>>380860602
>Couldn't get past the hub area

Dropping it was probably the best idea regardless anon. There's no shame in being dumb

>>380860518
>dark souls 2 cuck projecting his nigger fantasies

typical

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>>380860518
Please, I hated Dark Souls 2 long before 3 was announced

>>380857652
Do you expect him to spend money on every single game out there? Sounds like a good way to throw away perfectly good money.

>>380860782
DS3 fags are the real cucks. They suck off Fromsoft for making a shitty game.

>>380860843
Then a shitter you are.

>>380861051
>Do you expect him to spend money on every single game out there?

And how did you come to that stupid conclusion? There are literally millions of sources that are way better then /v/'s opinion to find out whether a game might appeal to you or not.

>>380857417
No need to be so rude and call us faggots..

Dark Souls 2 tried. Sadly it had a lot of bad decisions made during development. Like Soul Memory. Soul Memory was a mistake. If they ever rereleased Dark Souls 2 they should replace it.

>>380860519
Are you preparing to die yet? Oh, oh, here comes the first death achievement. Man, I'm such a hardcore gamer.

>>380857695
33 minutes in and holy shit what a waste of fucking time. save yourself the time this jackass takes every argument against dark souls 2 and tries to warp it into being complimentary to the game. he even goes as far to say the nonsense landscapes in DSII are good because it keeps you guessing and the interconnectedness of dark souls actually weakens the game, providing as his single example the blow dart guys in blight town having one life out of consideration for players returning to blight town. he defends fast travel and says he hates walking because he is a faggot. while dark souls interconnectedness may not be perfect, it could have been improved instead of completely copping out due to budget cuts and time constraints and selling this failure as a feature. even DSII fans acknowledge their world is a complete failure this second rate Vaati impersonator is deluding himself.

>>380861350
>Not playing it and forging your own opinion

Read before giving (You)'s

slut

>>380861348
>They suck off Fromsoft for making a shitty game.

how is it shit when it fixed all the issues with 2?

>>380861472
>If they ever rereleased Dark Souls 2 they should replace it.
they did. They still kept the bullshit like Soul Memory and ADP.

>>380861519
>how is it shit when it fixed all the issues with 2?
Not true, it carried over roll distance bound to weight.

>>380861472
As for good elements of Dark Souls 2... it tried some things that Dark Souls 3 also engaged in. But it ran into an issue. People are selectively willing to accept things the game presents due to being jaded by the lore-diving of the first game. So DaS2 and 3 hit you in the fucking face with things, and players ignore them. And when people bring them up they get really unnecessarily hostile thinking the person bringing them up is just pulling them out of their ass.

>>380861509
Yes, because buying DS2 equates to buying every single game ever, right?

>Reading comprehension

>>380861494
You didn't get to the good part.

The moron thinks that the Critics are 100% right about the game and that DSII is some meta commentary on the nature of sequels, just like MGS2

>>380861712
The point is that you shouldn't expect someone to purchase every single game that they're curious about

>>380860480
There is nothing wrong about going to Heide first.
Technically FotFG is completely optional until the very end game where you need to visit memories of giants.

>>380861658
>People are selectively willing to accept things the game presents due to being jaded by the lore-diving of the first game.
Such as?

>>380857417
still better than in first one
>muh interconnection
not an argument

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>>380857417
B team is called B team for a reason anon.

>>380861984
(you)

>>380862025
By FROM standards
In any other studio they would be the D team, only slightly above the janitors.

>>380861947
Like I said >>380861350

You can stop being retarded now.

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>>380860843
>DS1 and DeS above DS3 and Bloodborne

>>380861968
Let me throw out some details.

DaS2 is chronologically fucked in the series. It is set in the far, far, far future. You have to use the Time Is Convoluted pill.

DaS2 is the same area as DaS. Just in the far future. It's just things built on things built on things. The intro takes place at a questionable point in time where everything is in ruins. Your character is warping through a sort of convergent point that runs linearly through the timeline when they get sucked down the Dranglondo toilet.

Brightstone Cove Tseldora is the Crystal Forest.

As for DaS3... I'm not going to throw out spoilers as I don't have many and I haven't played the game yet. But certain things are presented that detail the fates of characters and people will deny the shit out of it. A lot of people hate to admit the fate of Gwynevere. But it's not ambiguous.

>>380862306
Also, humorously, DaS2 may literally not be canon based on the events of DaS3. Not in spite of DaS3, but because of it. Depends on the ending. In adherence to a linear timeline gaining a set end point.

>>380862306
>A lot of people hate to admit the fate of Gwynevere.

was she even mentioned?

Besides the one you meet in the first game was an illusion

>>380857497
Yes, get SotfS version so it's not as shit. The truth about DaS2 is that it feels the most different between the 3, it has the worst level design and art, but it has the most variety in weapons and viable builds. Despite it being the most flawed DaS it is still a really fun game to complete.

>>380862270
>DS3
>above everything
How to spot retard who played DS3/BB first and probably not even eligible to post on this site yet.

>>380862465
>was she even mentioned?

Big series spoiler.

She was turned into Rosaria. Literally. It's not ambiguous. People like to say it is but it isn't. The game doesn't really even leave this that vague.

>>380857579
DeS is way cooler to play. After DeS I was happy I experienced the game. After DaS2 I was just miffed at how it all felt.

>>380862596
where the fuck is that mentioned?

>>380862225
Your original reply never mentioned that. Forgive me for interpreting "thinking for themselves" as "go somewhere else"

this is a pretty retarded argument anyway

From Software is kind of bad at making games.
Honestly I had a lot of problems with Dark Souls.

>Unlike Demon's Souls, Dark Souls had a lot of legitimately cheap trial and error deaths
>Interconnected world means everything is stacked way too close together
>Game basically just gives up halfway
>Lost Izalith and Demon Ruins are some of the shittiest game levels ever
>A lot of interesting environments like Painted World are inconsequential
>An incredible amount of bugs

Like someone else said, DS2 tried, but the decisions they made basically just doubled down on all the shit things.

>>380862684
>where the fuck is that mentioned?
If you look at Rosaria's soul, unlike any other soul in the game, it's twisted. If you transpose it you get the Bountiful Sunlight miracle that is linked directly to Gwynevere. Some character dialogue. The fact that Rosaria is effectively a fertility goddess. Just a fucked up one. Tittymonsteritis.

>>380857417
All Dark Souls level design after the first is trash, the bar was set extremely high and the games have only been scoring lower and lower.

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DaS > Bloodborne > DeS = DaS3 > DaS2

>>380862850

I really hate the Dark Souls lore. It's not even really lore, it's all just namedropping. Like how did that even happen?

>>380862531
DS1 baby got triggered it seems

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>>380863105
only valid opinion

>>380863189
All of it is vague to one level or another. And this really isn't helped by translation decisions being very liberal and loose. A lot of context is lost in the English versions of the games.

Some things are spelled out bluntly even with that, though.

>>380863105
Switch DaS and BB and we're in agreement. Still a good ranking.

>>380863475
>And this really isn't helped by translation decisions being very liberal and loose

http://00tn2.blogspot.de/2014/08/dark-souls-2.html

>>380864608
Didn't this guy do some stuff on DS1 too? I thought he did but i can't find them anymore.

>>380865380
Not that I know of.

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>>380862306
DS2 is referenced enough in DS3 to considered canon, but mostly irrelevant. Stuff like strong souls anchoring the lands, the design of the Giants, a portrait of Queen Nashandra in Lothric. Even Wolnir, fighting off the curse by combinding royal crowns, where have we heard that one before.... There are other things too that I can't recall off the top of my head.

Also DS3 is set after DS2 - and by the looks of things, long after. If DS2 is fucked because it's far into the future, you'll find DS3 on a whole new level.

DaS2 is better than DaS3 at least.

>>380862850
Rosaria is quite possibly a daughter of gwynevere, there are a few mentioned in DS3. It's not necessarily her.

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>>380857497
yes, it is. ignore the memesters here, it is a great game, and has lots of content to offer. It is definitely not AS good as DaS1. But it is still good in it's own right, and has a very oldschool fantasy rpg feel to it.

Dark Souls 3 is the one that's actually pretty terrible. I mean play it anyway if you like 1 and 2, but lower your expectations.

>>380860264
wait what is that area? I remember reading about the unused map data but where was that?

>>380867129
No one knows since it's the one map that went completely unused.
Some say it's an earlier version of the Undead Crypt, others that it's the area that went between Earthen Peak and Iron Keep.

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>>380867305

However, there are a lot of annotations in it.
Maybe someone could translate a bunch of them so we could perhaps find out what it was supposed to be.

>>380867593
where'd you even get these? I dont remember these from Illusorywall's findings

>>380867805
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1swwPpl6mIfY25wWlVpMzVvV1k/view

Open them in something like kHED.

>>380857493
I actually think it's the weakest entry in the series but I have more hours in it than the rest of them.

>>380866923
Ignore this poster. Dark Souls 3 is easily better than 2 and at least has more coherent level design.

>>380868032
well thats neat

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>>380867593
even more from Earthen Peak

>>380857497
It will feel different. It's the most flawed of the 3 games but has some of the best story ideas out of the 3

>>380857652
nothing wrong with asking for opinions to get an idea of what to expect and then forming your own as you play it.

it's having opinions without actually playing the game that's the problem with a lot of /v/

>Really want to play the DLC for Das2 because of all the praise
>Currently stuck on both Smelter Demkn and the Rotten and don't feel like putting the effort into beating them, since they aren't that fun to fight
Is the DLC worth the effort?

>>380867593
"this room is..." that's all I got

>>380872529
Both bosses are easy enough. You can summon some dude for The Rotten.

>Is the DLC worth the effort?
The DLCs are better than the base game

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>>380872529
>Having problems with the Rotten

>>380872529
>Smelter Demon
>not fun
One of the best bosses in DS2.
Also he is completely optional. He just unlocks bonfire for convenience. You can take a path to the left and continue exploring the level.

>Rotten
Very easy, unless you just have problems running to him because you didn't find hidden bonfire.

>>380872135
>It's the most flawed of the 3 games
no that's 3

>>380857417
This is the only Souls game I have 2 completed saves on. Eleum Loyce has to be one of the top 3 Souls levels. It is just so huge and challenging, also really good-looking without being over the top on the visuals.

>>380873024
Getting to The Rotten is still pretty hard even with the bonfire since you have to go an absolute meat grinder in between the bonfire and the boss room.

DeS is the only game I haven't played and I have to say DaS2 is far from my least favorite.

>>380873094
3 has a lot of problems too. At the very least, the gameplay feels better and the visuals look nicer. Storywise and weapon/magic viability-wise, it's the shittiest of all 3 and is ultimately more of a disappointment than 2 was. I platinumed 3 and will never touch it again

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>>380872529
>stuck on smelter demon but wants to keep playing to experience the DLC

anon I have some bad news...

>>380873414
As much as I hate Black Gluch (it might be my most hated are on the series), it's still pretty short and you can rush it

>>380875621
>it might be my most hated are on the series

It's the most hated area in general right after Izalith.

>>380857417
well it was

>>380877402
Seriously, it's really fucking dumb

>>380857417
recycled poop jars from DS1
King's Passage
Earthen Peak and Lost Bastille elevators

that's enough you need to know about the game

>>380857497
Half of /v/ really like 2, and the other half absolutely hates it
There's no way to know if you'll like it or not

>>380857497
i dont know how far into the game you are but think about how good undead burg , asylum , sens and parish are ; now think about how bad the second half of the game ( anor londo, archives, crystal cave and all that shit)
dark souls 2 and 3 are the bad second half of the first one , theyre uninspired bland environments with enemies splattered around
the only good things about 2 and 3 are the dlcs except for ariandel which is just a mess of ideas that dont work together (most likely because its too short and the ideas arent developed properly)
also dont pay full price for the dlcs they went full jew with that shit

>>380857695
hate this video
the joseph anderson one is better in every way

>>380878717
Ashes of Memes is the coherent DS3 DLC m8. It's TRC that's riddled with not even half baked ideas and couldn't do what it needed to do to make Gael interesting.

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>>380877941
I honestly have a love/hate relationship with the game.
I didn't find it great or even particularly good but there's so much hilarious and unbelievable shit in this game that finding out what crap awaits me in the next area kept me pushing forwards.
Kinda reminded me of Lords of Shadow 2 with its completely fucked up production where the end result was also a glorious mess.

People who hates on Dark Souls 2 started the series with Dark Souls 1. Dark Souls 2 did so much shit right. It's what a sequel should be.

>>380879806
>People who hates on Dark Souls 2 started the series with Dark Souls 1

and? They were disappointed by a bad sequel.

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In this thread we list things Dark Souls 2 did that were far better than Dark Souls 3. I'll start:

>No bonfire and no death challenge where you can beat the game without resting at a bonfire or dying to gain a reward and bragging rights

>Non-linear first half of the game allows you to rush straight to the areas of the game that contain the items for your build

>Chugging Estus immobilizes you, and the heal isn't instantaneous meaning trying to chug while someone is sticking close to you will result in death

>Stamina regeneration is tied to weight, so a character at 10% burden will recover their bar faster than a character at 70% burden, giving an advantage and a reason to make a low burden character

>Poise exists and armor provides relevant, but not overpowering damage reduction, giving an advantage and a reason to make a high burden character

>Phantoms and Dark Spirits cannot chug estus, spirits can only heal via spell useage which is slow. This makes fighting outnumbered even without mob assistance possible since any damage you do sticks

>Can only perform four rolls before running out of stamina

>Can only perform 5 attacks of a rapier or straight sword before running out of stamina

>Parrying has longer recovery frames and consumes more stamina, making parry fishing riskier and makes parrying require higher skill

>Power stance allowing for unique combinations of dual wielding and unlocking an alternative moveset for weapons

>Being able to use the full moveset of a weapon in your off-hand including running, rolling, backstepping, etc. attacks rather than just being able to do a basic R1 swing and blocking with the weapon as it is in Ds3 (lmao who would ever want to weapon block)

>Bell Tower covenant providing two unique optional areas to PvP for Titanite Chunks, Slabs, and Twinkling, making farming for upgrades fun

>Bonfire ascetics to replay bosses you like and or gain items from NG+ and beyond without grinding through the whole game again

It's the favourite Souls of people who don't actually understand why souls are good games

>>380879924
If you start with 2 it's almost impossible to play 1 for very long because of how bad it feels in comparison

>>380879806
A horrible disfiguration of the game before it? Started with DeS by the way, try again.

>>380880081
Dark Souls 2, being better at doing shit things.

>>380880295
you sure?

I beat 2 and I was able to go back to 1 with no problems.

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>>380880584

SHIT SOULS 3
>the most linear of all the games, even compared to DeS and BB
>nostalgiafag reference pandering out the ass
>rehashed characters
>Lowest Boss count after DeS
>Half the bosses are gimmicks
>Boss weapons shit as usual, despite having 4 games to draw experience from
>weapons in general are 90% quality based
>these quality weapons are also usually the best weapons in their class
>some weapons have retarded stat requirements where they don't even scale with said stats, which also happens to be quality
>armor system a horrible imbalanced mess
>the heaviest armors are the heaviest they have ever been in the series, while offering basically no additional defense over medium/light sets
>poise implemented in such a stupid way that only Greatswords and Maces get the most bang for the buck
>Some UGSs, GAs, and Hammers weigh more than entire armor sets
>Equip load is now done by VIT, which for some reason gives LESS per level than fucking dark souls 2
>Souls required to level up not adjusted for splitting stats into two
>a majority of the small weapons sped up to bloodborne speed, but some of the larger weapons have been made SLOWER and consume MORE STAMINA
>rolls cost next to nothing with extremely fast recovery and many iframes
>magic is garbage
>faith is garbage
>FP system is weird
>Too many useless fucking stats
>WAs are mostly just special r2s or powerstance moves copypasted with an explosion or two at the end
>MLGS is the worst its ever been
>awful covenants
>covenants are stickers which can be changed on the go
>shitty rewards
>Dragon form the worst its ever been in both aesthetic and practical sense
>community now filled with normies who hold hands with their SL 800 Friends to get through the game
>invaders have the most disadvantage compared to all other games in the series
>First DLC was a 1.5 hour long disappointment with a rehashed arena
>Second DLC had no end despite being the very last dark souls thing we'll get for the forseeable future

>>380872757
>The DLCs are better than the base game

True save for the optional area in Ivory Crown.

>>380857695
>Healing in DS1 is about attrition
DROPPED
How could someone be this shit at Dark Souls?

>>380881057
Dark Souls 2 groupies actually miss the gratuitous recovery frames, unbelievable.

>>380881607
I felt they made the game feel almost turn-based, which was really neat

>>380881764
except this is an action RPG, not turn based

>>380881858
Yeah, that's why it was interesting to me.

>>380857417
Its the retarded red headed stepchild of the series

>>380881607
Ds3 is intensely underwhelming, it's still a good game, but it's not as good as it could be, and it's not as good as the previous games in the series. Where Dark souls 2 became too hyper aware of itself, and ruined itself trying to "be" what it already was. Dark souls 3 is too satisfied with where it was, and confident that it's still there without any effort.

In demon souls, theres five distinct areas you can go to after the tutorial area.
all five areas connect to different areas. All areas are distinct.

In darksouls, you can leave firelink and go to 5 distinct areas that all eventually reconnect with eachother.
all five areas are distinct, but slowly lead and then bleed into eachother.

In darksouls 2 you can leave majula into 4 distinct areas. Some of these areas reconenct with eachother, others do not.
People complain that there is absolutely no visual tone connecting any of these areas creating jarring connections.

In dark souls 3, you can go to one area. You are 4 areas into the game before you get a branching path. No matter which direction you go, you hit a dead end at the end of the path, and are forced to take the other path before continuing four more areas till the next branching path, which are optional this time and lead to dead ends. All areas are functionally identical and fit into 3 categories. "recently ruined city" "Long ruined city" "Swamp"

Darksouls 3 also has the worst build diversity, and one of the lowest numbers of unique "new" npcs in it. It has the least unique "new" weapons and spells.

It all feels very... uninspired, like the developers didn't really care. Theres no passion in it, and you can definitely feel it.

>>380857417
Music is good
Dragonslayer
Sentinels
Last anus

>>380863105
Bloodborne > DaS = DaS3 > DeS > DaS2

>>380882258
>Sentinels

you mean the 3 on 1 mandatory boss fight early on?

>>380883440
>mandatory
As expected.
Haters didn't even play the game.

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>>380883440
The fight really feels like it was designed with the player going through No Man's Wharf in mind.

You have to be leveled pretty decently to enjoy this fight.

>>380883886
how is it not mandatoy?

>>380883886
You have to kill them to reach Lost Sinner.

>>380884004
>>380884128
And these people are shitting on DS2.

No, you don't need to kill them to reach Lost Sinner.

>>380857497
only once you've finished all the other souls games (including nioh, lotf, surge etc.) and have literally nothing left to do. then you might as well give it a try.

>>380884004

It's an optional fight, completely skippable. There are at least 2 different paths you can take to avoid it. One being the Griffon at the top of the giants forest and the other by breaking through some wooden boards after you come down the ladder after entering from No Man's Worf. Might be a third option I forget.

>>380883962
Sentinels is so fucking easy once you know what you're doing.
>Kill one on the platform
>Hit the second on the platform until the third jumps up
>Hop down and finish off the second
>Kill the third 1 v 1
And if you're still so shit you can't beat them, just equip mace+aromatic ooze, ezpz

>>380884004
>>380884128
DaS2 gives you something DaS3 doesn't which is choice as to how to progress.
I bet you didn't even know you can skip any of the 4 big dudes. I only went through the Gutter once.

>>380884334
I always came in through the Bird (via the Pursuer) and never found a way that didn't involve fighting that mandatory ganksquad

Let's put soul memory in a game with exploding mummies who constantly break your shit :3

DaS2 was fucking tedious to the nth degree. Its only loved because of the PC playerbase which tells you everything you need to know about it.

>>380884404
This. A Mace does retard damage to them. You can even grab a Morning Star for similar damage for free in Majula by jumping on some cliffs.

>>380884584
>Its only loved because of the PC playerbase which tells you everything you need to know about it.

because they only jerk about the PvP

>>380884404
why use a mace when it has worse stats than the fire longsword?

>>380884460

I misremembered, I think there is only one route to skip. If you come in from the bird route, you walk to the iron gate area near mcduff's and then go across the field where the 2 wooden towers are. End of that wall has some wooden boards, attack it and you enter a new route that skips them. Can also be gotten to from no man's worf entrance.

>>380884725
Because DaS2 bosses all get fucked by blunt damage because the game wasn't planned well. There are only a few that resist it, like Covetous Demon.

>>380884460
Technically you can still avoid them that way. You blow a hole in that wall next to McDuff, get the bonfire, and head left through the wood barricading the wall where the wood towers are. Past the next room is a small area with a well and you take the very next room which is very dark, but use the ladder on the side. If you make your way through there is a lift cage that takes up to the bridge leading to sinner's rise.

>>380884832
>Because DaS2 bosses all get fucked by blunt damage because the game wasn't planned well.

maybe never touching maces was a mistake.

>>380857497
if you played 1 first you'll only see 2 and 3 for what they are, garbage

its honestly astounding how much the sequels fuck up everything that made 1 what it was

>>380857695
I watched the whole thing and he uses all the ok points in his conclusion while stretching hard as fuck for the rest. If you want to watch an OK analysis that is positive then watch Joseph Anderson's videos or do yourself a solid by not wasting your time watching some shitty e celeb rant for an hour about how 2 is actually an underrated and way more clever game than any other soulsbourne game

>>380884725
They are weak to blunt and magic, so combine mace with some of the ooze from FotFG and you can do insane damage to them. Or just summon the bitch in the prison cell.

>>380886241
>Or just summon the bitch in the prison cell.

I did but she would always aggro the other two, die, and leave me on a 3v1

>>380886380
Then man up and solo the bastards. It's easy if you follow the other anon's advice. >>380884404

>>380857497
its like the evil within, its literally a love or hate situation, you either seem to absolutely despise it or love it

>>380886519
I mean, I did beat them eventually. I managed to find a good Player Summon so I made it a 3v3.

but man, I knew DaS2 was going to be a mess if the 3rd boss fight was a ganksquad

>>380886690
It's not a gankfight if you know how to play it. You can almost 1v1 them all.

>>380886859
except Sentinel 2 and 3 activate at the same time

>>380887102
Sentinel 2 will jump up first, then 3 takes a minute or two to follow. You can do a bunch of damage to 2 in that time, then when 3 jumps up hop down off the ledge and finish of 2. Then it's just a 1v1 against 3. Easy.

>>380857652
There's a million shitty indie games on steam waiting for you to prove you're not a hypocrite.

powerstanced great clubs were so great. felt op.

I felt that Sentinel fight was pretty fair. They are very slow and have very limited move set compared to all other bosses. The real bullshit was not the fight itself, but fall damage from the first platform and exploding suicide fucker right after the boss.

>>380857497

a lot of things are worse, but

the game is still fantastic. it might be the"worst" dark souls game but that's like saying 'this is the worst chocolate steak I've ever enjoyed! It's only a 8.5/10!"

Dark souls 2 is maybe the most infuriating game I've ever played. It's pretty enjoyable I guess but it's full of so many outright baffling design decisions that all of five minutes of work/thinking could improve. They re-released this game and proceeded to fix basically none of them and debatable made the game worse in some ways. That's just insulting.

Also, one of it's big strengths it's fans like to promote (build variety/pvp balance) is only a result of form nerfing everything into the ground for some stupid reason.

>>380888748
dark souls 2 is only good in the sense that leveling up and overcoming challenges causes your brain to release endorphins and DS2 is pretty good at triggering this

it's less of a chocolate steak and more like an all you can eat chinese buffet. endless "variety" and it feels pretty satisfying when you're doing it, but then in retrospect you realize that actually it was pretty bad and probably not worth your time/money

>>380888753
Seems like they went with "this shit needs to be hard" and filled the game with gank squads and really fast high poised enemies.

The first DS has a lot of bullshit in it but I don't remember being fucking annoyed like I was with DS2.

>>380857497
Absolutely, for all of its faults even the worst DaS is still far better than 95% of shit released.

>>380889243
I'm not even talking about the weird cheap shots the game likes throwing at you, but more fundamental stuff like the game encourging you to upgrade more gear than the previous games and actually bother with infusions, but they also made getting upgrade materials a way bigger pain in the ass, made enemies despawn if you grinded them too much without CoC (when drops are the main way to get most infusion items or titanite types for 80% of the game) and made soul memory work on souls obtained instead of level + gear (like what DS3 did)

Is DS2 supposed to be about trying out different builds constantly to adjust for the area (as its defenders love to say to shame people who "played it wrong" and didn't enjoy it)? Then why is getting upgrades for a bunch of different types of gear upgraded such a huge hasshle and potentially self defeating? not only does DS2 have the most types of things you can upgrade of any game in the series, it also makes the number boost matter a ton, many times even more than scaling.

The game is just fucked from head to toe, every stupid decision interacts with a bunch of other stupid decisions like some kind of knot of retardation, even if individually they look like good ideas that can be used in a shitpost list of bullet points about how DS2 is totally better than whatever other game.

>>380858725
>Now that I think of it, the community first started going to shit when PCbros got in. I wonder why
obligatory reminder that the fanbase burned itself to the ground when the port was announced.

>>380889626
>still far better than 95% of shit released.

Which given the ridiculous number of released games still leaves us with hundreds if not thousands of better games.

>>380890176
List over 999 or perish

>>380887867
Worst comparison of all time

>>380889801
All this shit you typed could have easily been shortened to 'I had trouble with the game'

Because 90% of the 'cheap shots' you talk of are series staples. Dark Souls routinely kills you just for going forward.

>>380891021
Something I mention off hand in the first sentence that has nothing to do with the rest?

Where in dark and demons souls do you get shit like

>A ladder that visibly has no enemies above it no matter how you move the camera. The second you start climbing it an enemy starts climbing down the ladder, but because you can't move the camera up while climbing you have to know to instantly dismount otherwise that guy is going to end up kicking you.
>A boss fight where you are constantly poisoned unless you know to set fire to a clearly iron part of a windmill, something you have literally 0 guidance for from any npc or item or even common sense.
>A ton of doors where the second you approach it an enemy just attacks the door down (because he spends his entire life hiding behind this one door for no reason) and attacks you which again there's no way to avoid, in particular the one where a giant monster knocks the entire wall surrounding the door down.
>Multiple mandatory drops that cause fall damage, when falling a similar distance in the previous two games would either do no damage or much less.

You can deal with the bridge dragon or the first fight with seath in real time, there's no way you''ll not get pranked by stuff like this the first time through unless you play improbably slowly (IE you walk a couple steps and then instantly back up in case you walked past one of the millions of invisible enemy trigger lines that makes someone sneak up from offscreen)

Dark and demon souls werent designed to be challenging, they were challenging as a side effect of the sort of game they were trying to make. Meanwhile DS2 feels like a romhack.

>>380889801
>but they also made getting upgrade materials a way bigger pain in the ass
Why are you spreading lies? The game showers you with titanites the entire time. By the time you reach Bastille you can upgrade multiple weapons without even buying any extra ones. And if you somehow manage to run out, half an hour as a bellfag will have you swimming in that shit.

>>380891962
>Dark and demon souls werent designed to be challenging, they were challenging as a side effect
I love how you idiots keep parroting this despite Miyazaki calling himself a masochist and saying he wanted to make a game for players like himself in Demon's Souls interviews

>>380859813
You're actually brain dead. Game's not good, but it's no excuse to be so dumb you can't even find you're own way out of the hub.

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>>380859813
You sound like the kind of guy who might drown in the shower.

>>380891962
>ladder bit
What are you even talking about? I honestly can't remember a single instance of this happening or being a problem.
>poison
Many players me included fought her with the poison intact and it's not even a particularly difficult fight. But it is an interesting fight that way because you're forced to play aggressively for a change.
>doors
That's bullshit yeah but there are like 3 in the entire game.
>drops with required fall damage
Those were a thing in Dark Souls 1 as well, but there they were actually bad because of how limited your healing was. 2 has lifegems.

>>380892337
You're right, I guess challenging was the wrong word to use because DS2 is objectively the easiest game in the series, especially on launch when I first played it, because due to having the most options it also has the most potential broken shiit

You can literally just powerstance maces and destroy the entire game with your poise stunlock and insane damage bonus before even getting into how broken faith and hexing where before the insane nerfs or the fact that infinite buyable healing items and the new roll mechanics make it impossible to die.

DS2 tries to be Difficult by just doing stupid shit all the time to try and make you take damage, thats why it has a LE WELCOME TO LE DARK SOULS achievement for dying.

>>380892095
small titanite is in limited supply until way later in the game. you can get unlimited large for some reason at bastile though.

As for bellfag, SotFS made that way less viable than soul memory already did, because they moved all the keys and other actually really useful stuff out of the towers and you can summon new NPC phantoms with way too much health

>>380892639
The ladder is at the beginning of FoFG in order to get up to where the hollow shooting projectiles at you in the room with ether the heide knight or a ton of sleeping hollows is.

What mandatory fall damage is there in DS1? Also justifying it by saying DS2 has lifegems so it's okay is a pretty bad point because lifegems were a horrible idea

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>>380891962
>A boss fight where you are constantly poisoned unless you know to set fire to a clearly iron part of a windmill, something you have literally 0 guidance for from any npc or item or even common sense.
There is actually some guidance to the boss but the npc is too hidden so most probably miss it and it kinda amounts to
>the boss likes bathing in poison
>you should probably do something about that

>>380892695
This is rich, considering Dark Souls 1 was literally marketed as "Prepare to Die" when ported to PC.

>>380892884
The entrance to Nito has a mandatory fall, followed by a range attack that you might not see coming the first time.

>>380892884
>The ladder is at the beginning of FoFG
That doesn't happen though, were you using the champions covenant? May have been an issue with it increasing enemy aggro ranges.
>What mandatory fall damage is there in DS1?
Off the top of my head there's 2 really massive ones with Stray Demon and Nito. Those drain a precious Estus charge right before a boss fight.

>>380892884
>lifegems were a horrible idea
What about humanity? If you think lifegems are horrible, you must admit humanity (being infinitely farmable from the first time you reach Firelink, and even more so after Depths) are just as bullshit, if not more, since they're a full heal, instantly, with the animation being only slighty longer than estus, and you can carry 99 of them.
>>380893012
There's actually a summon who keeps pointing to the windmill too until you do something about it. (inb4 >using summons)

>>380892695
If it's trying to be difficult why did it give you infinite healing

>>380893012
I knew about this, but that doesn't at all point you towards the solution for removing it. If anything it makes you think to try the lockstone slots instead.

>>380893179
By namco bandai, not formsoft.

>>380893269
>>380893591
I actually forgot about nito so you got me there. Although I personally feel that's still a bit better than stuff like "if you want to drop down to where the fire longsword is just take some damage because we didn't bother to put a ladder here" since that fall and the follow up attack feels like an intentonal prank on people that are estus happy (with the solution being "just dont drink the second you take hits, nerd, something that should be pretty well established by now) and it happens after a fog door so it's not like you aren't prepared for an attack.

That's me basically saying It's okay when DS1 does it though so if you don't agree that's fair.

>That doesn't happen though, were you using the champions covenant?
I literally booted it up right now to double check. Maybe this was Sotfs only?

>>380893860
Lifegems are objectively worse than humanity, which is at least kind of annoying to farm shitloads of. More importantly humanity was something invaders could also use. Invaders can't use lifegems so they have a massive disadvantage for basically no reason, way worse than DS3 with hampered estus uses

You can buy 99 lifegems whenever you want for cheap as soon as you clear FoFG. They also have a super fast animation (made faster by agility, so if you have good rolls you have good lifegems), heal over time (so you can pop a gem, tank a couple hits and then have the gem heal the damage as you roll away)

They're a mess.

>>380894308
If you buy 99 lifegems right away, you're giving up on maybe 3-4 levels, titanite reinforcement, buying arrows if that's your build. Heal over time is so slow that using it to tank is fucking insane, I'd say it actually prevents tanking as you can pop one and still die if you're careless.

>>380894674
You can pop 2 or 3 and still die desu because the regen is so slow.

>>380894905
exactly, that's why they're not as bad as people want to think

>>380894905
That's why they were great.

>>380894674
>If you buy 99 lifegems right away, you're giving up on maybe 3-4 levels
Which is irrelevant because you can make this back really fast due to all the souls this game throws your way, and 99 lifegems can carry you the whole game

you can die if you're careless no matter what type of healing you have. life gems are super fast and exist in a game where you can get DS1 fast roll equivalent amount of iframes while wearing most of the havel set and all actons use up tons of stamina

>>380895150
That's why soul memory was a thing until crybabies complained because they wanted an easy game.

>>380895248
Soul Memory also fucked with co-op.

if Soul Memory was in DaS1 there would be no way I could complete the SL1 run.

>>380895248
what did he mean by this?

>>380895402
If you needed co-op to do a SL1 run, you're probably not ready to do a SL1 run. Also, it didn't fuck with co-op. It only prevented scrubs from continuing to be scrubs.

>>380857417
yeah the level design is pretty bad but the game is still decent
some of the bosses like singh and alonne are really good

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>>380857604
t. PCuk

>>380857497
you are very young right?

I've only played 1 and 3 should I give 2 ago ?

Why does /v/ like BB so much ?
Is it because this board is full of sonybros ?

>half of BB's bosses are just clustershit waving their arms
>a third of BB content was placed in those awful boring calices dungeons
>horrible framepacing
>low replayability
>shit stats
>dodging feels off as you can spam it

>>380895958
Sure, if you liked 3 then your standards shouldn't be very high

>>380895631
it fucked with me being summoned.

and with y DaS1 SL1 run, I only used it to farm the Gargoyles (Pyromancy fucks them up) to get the Flame to +10 as soon as I could

>>380895631
> It only prevented scrubs from continuing to be scrubs.
Soul memory literally does the exact opposite of this. If you buy lots of lifegems or die over and over and keep losing your souls, you will have a much higher soul memory than the average for your area and the chance that someone will bother to invade you with a SL appropriate character is much lower.

>>380895495
Soul memory was a great balancing tool. It ensured that people would be equal when meeting together because you were forced to
>spend Souls on stats to use strong equipment
>spend Souls on upgrades so weak equips were stronger
>spend Souls on item for survivability
So when you met someone else in a hostile situation, you both were equal in some way. As for the co-op, it prevented mother hens from letting scrubs learn the game by continuously beating a single boss for them.

>>380896126
Frankly, if you die enough that you differ wildly from the average, you just plain suck. That's be like beating two bosses in a row and clearing their areas and then losing all that souls. That's how much you'd have to lose.

>>380896018
> then your standards shouldn't be very high
You can't be this insufferable in real life surly

>>380896042
Why do you need to be summoned if you're doing a SL1 run?

>>380896427
And? What's your point? You said soul memory punishes scrubs, but it makes the biggest scrubs that would die like that safe from further harm.

>>380896218
Ignoring the part where the numbers are not balanced in the way you want to pretend they are. For example someone with higher stats will probably lose to someone that just upgraded an estoc or a mace a shitload because most of the best weapons have relatively low requirements or caster stats. There's also stuff like soul memory counting people buying spells to test them out only to realize they're useless as part of their total power, or that someone that's at SL1 or is waiting to get a key item for their build and just has a shitload of souls collected as a result can be in the same soul memory bracket as a guy that's dozens of levels higher.

Soul memory is not balanced at all until you get to the very high tiers where it starts to even out because everyone just has everything, and combined with even getting invasion orbs being a needlessly large pain in the ass for no reason and the non-linear layout of the first half of the game and it means that the odds that someone that has your specific soul memory bracket is in any give area is extremely uncommon even before the reveal that DS2 is objectively the least played game in the series at any given time after demon souls.

>>380897231
Why are you even attempting PVP if you're SL1? If you're just attempting the boss, there's always NPC summons. The only people who would complain are the people who wants to play a single boss over and over again, which is bad for the people attempting the boss because it teaches them nothing by having an overpowered think daddy beat it for them. And I was over exaggerating because nobody would die enough to kicked out of the soul memory range.

>>380897746
>Why are you even attempting PVP if you're SL1?
When did I say that? Soul memory means you can get invaded at SL1 by everyone instead of just twink builds in burg or whatever.

The rest of your stuff is basically just saying "I don't want people to play the game in this way even though it doesn't effect me at all" and fails to actually argue any sort of defence for soul memory

>>380898107
Because that's the ways Souls was intended to be played. It was never meant to be co-ordinated. It was always strangers coming together. And if there really is "lack of invasion items" then it should be no trouble doing an SL1 run.

>>380898324
>It was never meant to be co-ordinated.
DS2 has an item specifically designed to make it so you can only connect with specific other players in co-op, including making it so you can connect to a wider range of soul memory (AKA so you can summon higher level people than normal and have them baby you)
http://darksouls2.wikidot.com/name-engraved-ring

Who are you to say how souls was "intended to be played" over the actual developers?