Why is gameplay always used as a defense for poor graphics, art

>>379870363
make commentary about literally anything other than video game multimedia you actual fucking retard

food analogy goes in all fields

Because it's the easiest defense. Doesn't always work, I've dropped plenty of games with decent gameplay because the story was shit, but it's a better defense than "I will continue to play this game with shit gameplay because I like the artstyle".

>>379870363
becasue they are called video GAMES

not video graphics
not video story
not video art

I'm hungry.

>>379870540
I do and frequent many boards, not sure what your point is.

>>379870363
because video games are gameplay. Everything else is highly irrelevant.

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>>379870363
Why is called a 'hamburger' and not 'sauced buns with meat?'

>be american
>use food analogy
nice country drumpftards

>>379870363
Because gameplay matters the most above all those things. Graphics, art style, story, music, etc. are just condiments to make the overall game more attractive

Because you really can't have a good game without good gameplay, whereas the others can be ignored. If you don't have fun or like the gameplay of a game, what's the point of playing it?

>>379870363
Because being fun to play is what counts. My bike is dirty, bit rusty and a little ragged but fun as fuck to drive.

>>379870629
>>379870725
>the burger is the most important part of a cheeseburger
>this means only the meat matters and should be eaten by itself

gameplay and video games have the same relationship as a story and a novel

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>>379870891
You are now breathing manually

>>379870629
Even Cluedo has a story, art and graphical depictions on top of its gameplay and it isn't even video.

Gameplay cucks are fine with getting a handjob (good controls and handling bro!) from their gf while everyone else stuffs her holes.

>>379870363
Listen man, the proof is in the pudding. I'm not going to have 100 hours in a game that looks pretty but has nothing to do and the gameplay is garbage.

Meanwhile I have thousands of hours in the Ys series combined with 400 hours on Felghana and it has shit story, shit art, and shit graphics. The only thing it has is gameplay (and music), but because the gameplay is so much better than everything else, I played it for thousands of hours.

>>379870956
A piece of meat on a plate is boring shit compared to a fully dressed cheeseburger m8. You can't have a good game without good everything.

>>379871045
That analogy is so fucking retarded. That analogy is equivalent to saying "let's play a game with great gameplay that has literally no graphics not even a GUI, no soundtrack, and no story." Nobody would play that game, idiot. That's not even the argument. The argument is that gameplay clearly matters a lot fucking more than every other aspect. Nobody eats a burger and says "WOW GREAT LETTUCE ON THIS THING!!" If you wanted great lettuce(story) eat a salad(book) you moron.

>>379871417
My point is that there is no defense for bad anything, this is just autism speaking. No one says great lettuce, but fuck if I'm gonna eat a plain burger with nothing on it. That equally sucks balls.

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For me, it's the blue waffle. The best fast food analogy item.

>>379870363
stop trying to justify buying faux movie garbage and just watch movies even the crapier movies BTFO of shit like TLOU which is just the walking dead with shrooms involved.

>>379871243

Uh yes you can. I'd rather eat that pattie steak with rice.

It's funny that Japanese games neither have gameplay or graphics

>>379871243
>No graphics
>Zork

>No story
Galaga/Pac-Man/DDR

>No voice acting
Too many millions to list, and still better than bad voice acting

>No music
Arkanoid

It's like saying every movie needs romance. Games can be made millions of different ways, like burgers, using whatever ingredients enhance its intended 'flavor' or 'direction'

>>379870363
Because older games didn't have as good graphics, art style, or story as modern games today, but were still good.

If you refuse to believe a game can be good through just good game play, you're clearly underage or someone who hasn't played video games for very long.

>>379871634
You can't have rice, that would be something other than gameplay. No seasoning either.

>>379871607
If gameplay is all you need just walk away from video games and go flip a coin with your mates. Purest gameplay.

You can have the freshest lettuce or the spongiest buns, but if the fucking meat patty tastes like west cardboard, it's still a fucking shitty burger.

Get what I mean?

>>379871817
>Thinking flipping a coin is good gameplay
>Not superior rock/paper/scissors

kys

>>379871871
Yeah, you realize what's most important. The OP isn't saying otherwise.

>>379871794

But you cant have games with "gameplay" only or else you'd be just looking at raw data.

>>379871045
>food analogy

>>379871817
>Games aren't allowed to have just workable assets
Tetris was just fine on Game Boy, with 4 colors rendering at 256x256. The music was similarly simple. It doesn't need 'the best' graphics or music to enhance its gameplay.

Real talk though.

Big Macs or Whoppers?

>>379871554
Except, a good patty-burger is the best vs. no burger and gross-burger.

>>379870363
>burger analogy
retarded. You eat the whole burger and that's the only interaction you have with it before you shit it out again.
in a game you SEE the graphics and artstyle,
you HEAR the sound design,
you THINK about the story and writing,
and it all get tied together by what?
That's right, the gameplay. The sole defining characteristic of a game and the way of experiencing all the other aspects.
Gameplay is the most important aspect of a game.

>>379871948
>3 (three) different animations
Way too bloated in design, distracts from the gameplay.

>>379871817
That's literally the opposite. Flipping a coin is bad gameplay, there are no choices, and it's uninteresting. However Hearthstone continues to survive because its UI and flavor appeal to a lot of people. Coin flipping with pretty graphics is what you have to defend

>>379870363
FOOD ANALOGY

>>379872163
And a fully dressed burger is better than all of them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHVbWketK-o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vx7IGvusY6g

>>379872154
Whoppers, obviously

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>>379870363

>>379872203
You don't actually know what gameplay means, do you?

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>>379870363
probably because all that stupid shit you listed is tertiary at best compared to the primary function of a videogame, aka the gameplay

>i want to have my movie and play it too!
fuck off retard

>>379872232
But you never know which side will be up. Endless replayability!

>>379870363
the gameplay is the tastiest part. without the gameplay you're just left with bread and vegetables. who the fuck wants to eat that

>>379872281
>goalposts

>>379870363
>>379871045

>>379872281

Still depends. A fully dressed burger that tastes like a cheklist of ingredients is still inferior to quality beef, especially if it has added bacon.

>>379872409
OK? That's a different element than gameplay. I think you might be retarded, bro, get that checked out.

>>379871563
Do people still think blue waffle is funny? Jesus Christ go back to 2010.

>>379872398

>>i want to have my movie and play it too!

You just described most of Sony's latest western IPs.

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The most important aspect of any video game is being able to fucking play it

>>379872494
I will once I'm done gameplaying your daughter, gramps.

>>379872449
No goalposts were moved. Maybe you should grasp what the OP is saying first. Protip: it's not saying that gameplay is irrelevant. It's saying that "everything" is most important, not just one element regardless of its importance.

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>Burger analogy

>>379872654

Then why do people like STALKER? Shit's fucking broken.

>>379872281
>And a fully dressed burger is better than all of them
not shit vidya taste but also shit food taste too!

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>>379870363
Because if a game has shit story, shit graphics, and shit others but somehow is fun as FUCK to play, then I'd prefer it over something with the best specs in everything but is completely unfun and unplayable

>>379870363
Ryse: son of rome
Beyond: Two Souls
Destiny
Crysis
Watch Dogs
Dragon Age 2
Forza 5
Thief(2014)

What do all these games have in common? Depending on specific title, these games are either graphically beautiful or improve on graphics from previous iterations, but are considered the worst in the series or are completely disregarded by fans as being terrible video games. Nobody talks about these video games anymore. Nobody plays these video games anymore.

If your central premise is correct, that gameplay is unimportant, then how do you explain this?
Obviously, people play a *game* because they want to play a *game*. Extremely awesome graphics are a novelty that will not sustain players. To retain players you need games that are fun.

>>379872351
IMAGINE BEING AT COMPUTERS

>>379872232
>Hearthstone continues to survive because its UI and flavor appeal to a lot of people
No, hearthstone thrives because illusion of depth and skinnerbox. Has nothing to do with graphics. Hearthstone graphics are shit tier anyway.

Damn i want a big Mac

>>379872942
>Because if a game has shit story, shit graphics, and shit others but somehow is fun as FUCK to play
I can't think of a single instance where this has happened.

>>379870363
>tomatoes
>sauce
>onions

lmao

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holism

>Holism (from Greek ὅλος holos "all, whole, entire") is the idea that systems (physical, biological, chemical, social, economic, mental, linguistic, etc.) and their properties should be viewed as wholes, not just as a collection of parts.

>The total is more than the sum of its parts.

>>379872154
neither you fat fuck

>>379872073
Tetris is utter trash by current year standards. Bad argument.

>>379873474
I can't either but I guess more basic arcade games work by this logic? It's more hypothetical than anything but I'd still prefer shit at everything but gameplay over great everything and shit gameplay

>>379870363
Hmmm your food analogy the gameplay is still the best part.

>>379870363
Because we live in a real world, where you sometimes have to make compromises, not some fucking fantasy land like graphics whores believe where everything can and should be perfect 100% all the time.

Not only is gameplay the most important aspect to get right, but most studios don't have unlimited budgets like people like you believe they do and they have to make sacrifices. Better to have a great game than a pretty picture that can't really do anything.

>>379873567
A concept inaccessible to the minds of /v/ apparently.

>>379870363
I like burgers with just the meat and cheese better than fully dressed up bullshit like that. So what's your point?

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>>379870363
>>379871817
>>379871045
Why are GraphicsStory fags in this thread pigeon holing the enemy position by saying that the only 2 possible options are:
1. Top of the line Graphics
2. No graphics at all not even a GUI enjoy eating your pure meat patty with no bun

What the fuck?
There are games like Quake 3 Arena that don't have the best graphics of all time, but they still have graphics. And people still hail the game as legendary. Why? Because it has mediocre graphics, no story, but the best gameplay of any arena shooter of all time.
When someone says "Gameplay is obviously the most important" it is not a valid response to say "WELL I GUESS YOU SHOULD DELETE ALL TEXTURES AND STORY DIALOGUE FROM ALL YOUR GAMES!!! GG GET REKT NOOB!!!!!!!" What the fuck? Nobody ever debated that graphics on some level and barebones story on some level are minimally important. The argument is that gameplay is twenty five times more important than that shit. All of the classic games throughout the annals of history have varying levels of graphics and story but 1 thing in common; they all have extremely good gameplay.

The fact that you have to mischaracterize the opponent's view shows that even you know your argument is weak

>>379870363
because the point of a game is how you interact with it

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>>379873474
Pokemon Red and Blue. When it came out in North America the Gameboy was 9 years old and the Gameboy Color was less than 2 months from release.

>>379874004
>Better to have a great game than a pretty picture that can't really do anything.
Best to have a balance actually, which some games do.

>>379870629
>video
>video
>video
hmm why do you ignore the first part clearly indicating that this is a graphical medium

I can enjoy a burger with nothing on it

gameplay > everything else >op's reason for living

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>>379870753
Here's your (You)

>>379874182
You realize that most of the people disagreeing with the OP are also mischaracterizing, right? There's just as much "gameplay is most important so you're wrong" bullshit here as there is of that.

>>379874207
I guess. I hate Pokemon.

>>379874434
>bullshit
It's true though.

>>379871243
I rather have a quality patty on a plate than a shitty patty with condiments bun and vegetables that overpower said shitty patty

>>379870629
fuck you video games are a art

>>379872154

Big N Tasty.

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>>379870363
>Person orders a burger and it shows up with a thin meat patty that is half the size of the picture on the menu.
What happens? they complain to the manager, or they at least complain to their friends that this is the worst burger ever

>Person orders a burger and it shows up with half the lettuce in the picture, only 1 tomato slice
What happens? they barely notice as long as the meat is good, they eat the burger and leave satisfied

Even in your own analogy you lose the game, brother ԅ(¯ิϖ ¯ิԅ)

>>379874434
>"gameplay is most important so you're wrong"
That is an entirely true and irrefutable argument though.

>>379871045
This is why you don't make poorly thought-out food analogies you drooling retard

>>379873474
FE conquest

>>379874576
>>379874838
It's also completely irrelevant you dumb shits, because OP is not saying it isn't the most important among each element in a game.

>>379872154
Baconator

>>379870363
t.born in 2005

>>379870363
Why? Because good gameplay is good gameplay. The game could look like a pile of shit, but as long as the gameplay's top notch I could care less.

I can tolerate a bad story in a game with good gameplay.

If the story is so bad it's actually apalling however, there's a difference.

Compare Kingdom Hearts to something like Fire Emblem Fates.

>>379872281
a fully dressed burger with rotten meat is worse than a non-rotten bread+meat and nothing else burger

>>379875147
lol, and a fully dressed burger with quality meat is better than all of that.

>>379874226
I will take great gameplay with ps1 early 3d utter shit graphics over top-of the line modern graphics and average gameplay.

>>379874420
You buy the hamburger for the burger, moron. That's why it's called a hamburger. Thanks for the (You).

>>379871417
Funny story: I've been impressed with lettuce once. At Fatburger. They put a thick chunk of the stuff on your burger. But they also make a good burger, with good cheese, bacon, and buns.

>>379875302
Yeah and? The meat is still the most important factor.

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>take away gameplay, but leave graphics, story and music
>end up with cinematic trash like Bayonetta or Uncharted or Zelda

>take away, music, story and graphics and leave gameplay alone
>end up with timeless classics like Tetris, Dwarf Fortress, Gradius, Ikaruga, and many others

if you can't have fun with the barebones of graphics and story, then you don't want gameplay. You just want a damn movie.

>>379875520
oh it's you again
You need to mix up your bait

>>379870363
A good enough burger can be eaten by itself. Toppings can be added or removed per the eater's discretion. Sometimes one or more toppings don't come out right, and that's a flaw, but it's usually not a damning one.

So long as the beef is juicy and well-cooked, the burger retains some value. Without the beef, however, the burger is nothing. The best toppings in the world are wasted in a pile of bread encasing air.

See also: The Order.

>>379875517
No one said otherwise.

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>>379870363
This thread is just you idiots arguring semantics about a stupid food analogy.

Just give it up before you talk yourselves in circles.

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>>379874713
I enjoyed this post, brother.

>>379875630

>tumblr can't stand the thought of gameplay being important in a game

Back to Gone Home and Depression Quest, kiddo.

>>379870363

Because it's a pretty good defense.


I don't play something with an art style I find off-putting even if it has really good game play though.

There are too many games around that I also think look attractive, or at least unobjectionable.

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>2017 first world countries
>it's ok to eat meat
Pick one

>>379875775
Ummm the op says otherwise.

>>379874713
>What happens? they barely notice
I'm not a retard, I notice immediately and am far less satisfied by the quality of service of this restaurant.

>>379874713
>BTFO on your own food analogy

>>379875967
It doesn't, but you want to think it does apparently.

>>379875895
try again next time, when the thread isn't already having a discussion about the subject. Nobody is gonna buy it now.

>>379870363
Gameplay matters the most. Good everything else but mediocre gameplay can make a game that's at best just pretty good, where incredible gameplay can alone elevate a game to amazing heights even if every other aspect is subpar

>>379875961
n'wah

>>379876187

it's a little pathetic that you can't handle a little banter. Everything is bait to you. How do you live your life?

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>>379876010
This guy gets rustled over the quality of restaurants that offer pictures of the food they're serving.

alright fine I'll play along with your food analogy:
If the patties (gameplay) are fucking rancid or overcooked, the whole sandwich is ruined and you have to throw the whole thing out, there's no point in having the rest of it.
If the lettuce (soundtrack) is a little rotten, then fuck it, just take it off and hope you dont get sick, its not as important as the rest of the package in that case, you dont get a burger to enjoy the fucking lettuce. It can be nice, but its almost never the selling point

>>379870363
Because GAMEPLAY is literally the most important part of a video game.

If the gameplay is bad nothing else matters.

Because younger people got sucked into gaming while every studio pumped out eye candy movie games, they therefore take these elements granted and criticize one studio's fluff over the other studio's fluff.
Say you like playing darts, it's a relatively low key hobby that you play with a few friends. But then some Bar downtown pioneer Super Dart where the board glows, the dart spins and get movies playing as you play. It suddenly catches the attention of guys and girls just sitting and drinking. Girl wants to play, guys that came to the place just to fuck therefore also want to play.
Investors realise there money to be made with this shit and start marketing it to their mainline bars.

This is where these people jumped in. You just want to play dart but before you know it people are making threads about "Why is throwing darts at a board always used as a defense for poor glowing lights, mundane darts, background videos and other things ?" Because in the end all that matters is the gameplay itself.

>>379876326
Maybe make it not so obvious next time. When people are actively having a moderately civil discussion (for /v/), and you come full frontal with the same shit you usually post on lol threads no one is gonna fall for it.

>>379876419
>this argument for the 100th time
Again, that's nice and all, but it doesn't change the fact that:

A fully dressed burger, with quality meat, and all of your favorite toppings and seasonings > a burger that has less than this

i.e. gameplay might be most important but that doesn't mean it's more desirable to have it by itself than to have everything be quality in a game. Which in a way, means it really isn't the most important, what's most important is the connection of the whole thing together.

>>379876853

Make what not so obvious? How about you stop calling everything bait because the thought of a differing opinion scares you? 4chan isn't a hugbox, if you just want the same opinions that you share regurgitated back to you ad nauseum, then this website isn't exactly the right place for it.

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let's put it this way

if you were invited to hamburgers but then they only had veggie burgers, you'd feel kind of cheated

>>379877138

Gone Home isn't even a veggie burger. It's two buns put ontop of eachother in a "bold artistic statement".

>>379877059
>differing opinion
there are lot of different opinions in this thread. You posted bait, not a different opinion. Subtle difference.

>>379873096
Crysis is a great game (the first part of it, anyway, and Warhead too) and is still being played and talked about. Dragon Age 2 was widely panned for having shitty graphics and worse artstyle than DA:O.

>>379876986
aren't you moving the goalposts a bit though ? OP asks why is gameplay used as a defense for a game when all the rest sucks. The obvious answer is that good gameplay makes a good game.

It's obvious that have the rest makes it a better game overall, but it's superfluous and is not the subject of the debate. A game with good gameplay and terrible rest will still be a good game.

>>379877291

>You posted bait, not a different opinion.
What made it bait, exactly?

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>>379870363
I'd say artstyle is the only thing that comes close to mattering as much as gameplay.

>>379871045
that's just it though. I can fucking eat meat on its own. Just bread or just cheese while maybe not bad, is an incredibly middling experience.

If gameplay is the only thing a game has going for it then it's shit. Simple as that.

>>379871045
You should still be able to eat the meat by itself and have it be substantial. The rest is a bonus.

>>379877734
Humans can't survive on meat alone. We aren't true predators.

>>379876235
That's not one of the options

>>379870363
because they're games?

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>>379870363
because chances are the kind of game that it is might be an action game or similar type of genre that benefits from good and fun gameplay rather than a crazy story or intense graphics instead of catering to your arbitrary personal standards you fucking pretentious cunt

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>>379877812

A game CAN survive purely on gameplay, though. That's the difference.

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>>379877376
>The obvious answer is that good gameplay makes a good game.
That is the obvious one, a more truthful one would be that people suffer from tunnel vision without realizing it. Because gameplay is most important, they then claim that it's fine for everything else to be shit, which implies that the other things aren't important at all in comparison. They think most important = it's all that's important. They fail to look at the big picture, because maybe they can't even grasp the big picture.

Some people might genuinely be fine with eating a plain burger with nothing else, and whatever, that's some people's taste. It can be any food really, anything you like, and the argument is that your favorite ingredient in the dish is all that matters. I find that ludicrous and in poor taste. A dish needs all of its ingredients to bring out the flavor you like the most, first of all, and to have the most satisfying balance of nutrition and everything else.

>>379875520
Except those games are slightly above average at best.

>>379878051

you best not be talking smack about Ikaruga and Dwarf Fortress.

ITT:

fat shits

>>379878230
rude

>>379878230
I'm a hungry skeleton, actually.

>>379878230
stop fatshaming

>>379870363
How is it a game without gameplay? Your feelings and agenda don't make it a game.

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>>379870363
pic related

>>379877812
>Humans can't survive on meat alone
That's gotta be bullshit, I've had nothing to eat but steak, sausages, and bacon for weeks now and feel perfectly fine.

Pretty sure the other shit is just to help you poop or something.

>>379878326
A cheeseburger might not be itself without the patty. Does that mean you should just eat the patty alone and be happy with that?

>>379878402
Enjoy yer scurvy.

>>379870363
So gameplay is the meat of a game and everything else is secondary? Got ya.

>>379870363
Because all of those other factors act as a service to the gameplay, not the other way around. It's like the burger, Eating plain burger with just a patty is fine, but it's not as tasty as when you add some lettuce, tomato, chess, etc. Eating a sandwhich consisting of no meat (gameplay) will always be infinitely worse than a sandwhich with little extras but still has meat.

>>379878565
See >>379878467

>>379878467

>Does that mean you should just eat the patty alone and be happy with that?
Cutting down on the bread, mayonnaise, ketchup, bacon, and other assortments would be a far healthier meal, and you'd be at lower risk of diabetes thanks to your decreased carb intake.

That's what the game industry needs: a decrease in cinematic diabetes.

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>>379878402
DOG BLESS AMERIGA

>>379878467
Stop, just fucking stop. There's to many god damn food analogies which don't even matter to video games, because it's not fucking food.

A video game is not a video game if it doesn't have gameplay. Your bitch faggot feelings and agenda to push a fucking movie is not a video game.

>>379870725
>>379870629

let's play spot the nintenbro

>>379877812
Even true predators eat the stomach content of their prey from time to time.

>>379872763
But it can be fixed with just a single mod

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>>379870363
Probably because the GAME part is the most important, you moron. I fucking love the characters and music in Tales games, and sometimes the story if I give a shit enough, but the real reason I'm sticking to the thing is because the gameplay is fun and encourages you to improve and make your own combos. It's an example of a game prioritizing what it needs to, the VIDEO GAME part.

I honestly don't know what's worse, Dark Souls threads or these fucking food analogy threads, Jesus fucking Christ.

>>379878673
You could also exercise, eat healthy during the week, and have the whole cheeseburger on your off day since it's so much tastier.

>>379878727
You didn't address the question at all though. Let me translate: why should I be satisfied with playing a game that has good gameplay and nothing else?

>>379878402
Besides fiber to prevent your intestines from seizing up eventually in agonizing pain, the lack of potassium that ultimately numbs your hands and feet to make you feel like you're in a state of a constant stroke, and the lack of vitamin C which will cause lock jaw and insufferable illness from the weakened immune system.

Nah an all meat diet is okay.

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>>379870363
Because sometimes the whole experience can be summarized by that.

Superhot really doesn't have a lot going for it besides the gameplay but the gameplay is a lot of fun. The shapes are crude, there's no music, the story is hit-or-miss, and it's short. But what it does deliver on is just something that is enjoyable for the time it lasts.

>>379878827

Nah man, even Nintendo fans have fallen for the cinematic meme. Look at how many people like bayonetta and Zelda.

>2 hours of cutscenes each
>one runs at 30 FPS for that "movie-like feel"
>one has quick time events and "cinematic action finishers" so the product feels less videogamey

If anything, the only people left who value good gameplay are TRUE indie games, not those artsy fartsy retro walking simulators.

Gameplay is a part of the whole. Saying that any individual part simply doesn't matter is asinine. Sure, you can like some parts more than others.

Film is made up of multiple parts. Sound direction, music, story, and visuals (which comes down to a lot of categories). Video games are the same with added interactivity and gameplay on top of it. People generally don't argue that visuals simply does not matter for a film. Sure, some films exist that get rid of visuals and use the other elements, but these are few and far between.

You can emphasize elements and you can sometimes, under the right conditions, forgo elements, but saying some elements don't matter EVER outs you as a retard.

>>379878935
Because there are games carried solely on their gameplay and they happen to be the most popular still today.

Gameplay will always be the most important factor you fuckwit.
No one plays CS:GO for it's aesthetics or story elements, because there really isn't fucking any. It's all gameplay.

>>379879054
Super Hot had good sound design. There is more to the sound based parts of games than just music.

>>379879095
Indie games are shit ACfag, even the ones without cutscenes to avoid triggering your autism. They generally fucking blow.

>>379878009
You're looking too deep into the food analogy. It does not apply to that degree. Amusement is a pretty simple process, give someone a pile of sand and some spare time and he'll find a way. Gastronomy however is very complex and its quality usually increases only with its complexity. It's completely fine with its monochrome board and identical pawns.

This is not the case for video games. The most basic games like Chess can be considered extremely complex while being of a extremely simple design. It doesn't need anything else to make it better. You could add stuff over it all you want, it wouldn't make it a better game.

Food doesn't work that way. There's always a drive to innovate and make the dish better by adding ingredients or removing them while attempting to keep the original taste.

It is cute to play a Star Wars themed chess while listening to the OST and movies on the background, but that doesn't make the game any better.

>>379879095
>using torture attacks in bayonetta decreases overall time scores dramatically

No wonder all you fags keep getting stone ranks

>>379879215
So because gameplay is the most important factor, I should be satisfied with games that have

>garbage art direction
>bland music
>poor use of sound or none at all
>weak graphics / low graphical options
>no story or cutscenes at all

Yeah, your argument just holds no water, unless all you play is shit like CS:GO. In that little world of limited taste like yours I guess it makes perfect sense then.

>>379879235
Well I'm not saying ALL of the game is bad but the game is mostly carried by its gimmick.

The minimalist vision works for the scope of the game so the lack of ambiance in almost every form is understandable.

>>379878935

>it's so much tastier.
Why though? A burger is nothing more than condiments and fluff that's trying to mask the burger. That's why I take issue with restaurants that pile a bunch of garbage ontop of the patty in an attempt to make the meal look bigger. All you need is some essentials, top quality meat, a skilled chef, and some good seasonings. You don't need meme food like bacon or fancy barbeque sauce, because too many flavors detract from the main meal.

>>379871045
Yeah, I can appreciate a plain burger sometimes.

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>>379879341

>Indie games are shit ACfag because there's no cowtit waifus and gorey special effects and graphics

>>379879420

>I willingly put a mechanic into the game that makes the game objectively worse, just to appeal to the casuals

Bravo Kamiya.

>>379879558

Again, games like Dwarf Fortress fit all of your descriptions, but they're some of th ebest video games ever made.

>>379879615
A burger with other things on it isn't tastier to you than just a plain burger? I mean it's possible, sounds weird though. At least have cheese and seasoning or something.

>>379879558
Well you're definitely in games for the experience over, you know, playing a game. You've got the right to your opinion, just know that you're part of the cancer of this hobby.

>>379878009
It is fine for everything else to be shit though. It won't make it the best game ever but it will be playable.

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Music can carry a game even if the gameplay isn't the greatest.

>>379879932
>Dwarf Fortress fit all of your descriptions, but they're some of th ebest video games ever made.
Not in my backyard.

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I don't mind people saying the gameplay is the most important part - often times, that's true.

I take issue with fucking retards who think gameplay is the ONLY thing that matters and also who say "lol graphics don't matter you idiot go play cawadoodee".

It's such infantile logic. Of course graphics matter. Art matters. If you disagree, you're a dumb right-wing bumfuck.

>>379879779
Well no its because the gameplay is worse than the games they rip off.

>>379879558
The point is, all of that shit is subjective not objective you fucking mongoloid. A video game will remain shit if has shit gameplay. A classic example of the first NieR and every fucking drakengard game, has absolutely abhorrent gameplay and texture quality, but only a story to tell. They are only praised as story arcs nothing more, everyone unless you are truly willing to eat shit knows Cavia could never do gameplay right. This is why NieR and Drakengard sit just at 6/10. A story can hold a game down, but the gameplay if it's terrible holds everything about the game back to the point not even nostalgia can save it.

Gameplay will remain to be the most important factor always as there are many games out there carried solely by it.
Debating this is basically ignoring the entire NES/SNES/Gameboy/PS1 and arcade generations which still have some of the strongest gameplay that keeps those games alive today.

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>>379880042
What are some examples of this?

>>379880150
>you're a dumb right-wing bumfuck.
you're right my man, this thread is shit, let's summon the /pol/fags, let them kill this thread for us

hitler was evil
miscigenation is good
there's nothing wrong with being gay

>>379879954
In your camp I might be. To me, video games are more than just games, they're opportunities to go on grand adventures in a simulated fantasy world. Can't quite have that on just the bare mechanics and rules alone, and the adventure gets increasingly more enjoyable when everything else receives a boost in focus as well.

>>379879934

>A burger with other things on it isn't tastier to you than just a plain burger?
honestly, no, it isn't really tastier. if given the opportunity between having a burger with fancy gimmick foods ontop, or just making a meatloaf out of that meat, I'll always choose the latter. In the end, the toppings always just be masks for a bad burger, and will just get in the way of a good burger.

I kinda have a similar deal when I go to a buffet. instead of getting every single thing on the menu, I'll just stick with 2-3 dishes and enjoy them. I don't want to shove a bunch of conflicting flavors in my mouth, I want to enjoy fewer, higher quality flavors that I can enjoy in better depth.

>>379880301
jet set radio

>>379880198
If you want to talk about objectivity, then you have to consider that VIDEO games have a visual/audio component to them. Objectively, you're fucking wrong in saying that gameplay is the most important thing to the medium.

>>379880150

Wrong

*cuts arts funding*

>>379880165

>Well no its because the gameplay is worse than the games they rip off.
Sure they are. I'm sure you've read many kotaku editorials about the evils of not supporting your local AAA developer too.

saying graphics don't matter in video games is like saying looks don't matter in a relationship. you can love someone/something even if it doesn't look too good but looks improve everything dramatically

stop justifying garbage graphics from the start of the millennium and further beyond because muh gameplay. you almost make it sound as if gameplay is more than mash buttons for quick dopamine rush. stories and atmosphere at least invoke some kind of deeper thoughts and emotions

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>>379880301
This game wouldn't be half as memorable or likable if it wasn't for the music.

>>379879098

graphics only matter to plebs

I have just as much fun playing on textureless test servers

>>379870363
That looks like a California Classic from Carls Jr (Hardees) but with seeded bun

>>379880346
how many dicks do you have in your mouth right now
cm and y are less gay than you

>>379880581

t.shallow

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>>379880543
No, I just don't have shittaste like you. I rarely even play modern games, you autistic faggot.

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>>379880728
t. brainlet

>>379880581

What purpose do the graphics serve though? Same with the story and """atmosphere"""? If it's not making the game better, its existence means nothing. For example, why does your game have grass in it? Is your game a Zelda-like, where you cut down the grass to find hidden items? Is it a stealth game where the grass actually visibly hides you from enemy guards? If not, it's just taking up time and money.

As for the story, is not a game's purpose to deliver the story via the gameplay? I don't need a cue card held up infront of me, telling me to cry when the game thinks something sad happened. That's the Big Bang Theory method of quality. Might as well throw a laugh track in there too.

>>379880946

>No, I just don't have shittaste like you.
Do you even know the games I like, or do you just make blanket statements at will?

>>379881147

> If not, it's just taking up time and money.

and more importantly, framerate

fuck grass in vidya and anyone who supports it

>>379870363
>Why is gameplay always used as a defense for poor graphics, art style, story and other things?

Because as long as the graphics perfectly represent the gameplay in a comprehensive way, it is a perfectly good video game.

>>379881147
>What purpose do good looks serve though?
Would you rather wake up next to a pretty face or a hobgoblin every morning?

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>>379880906
> t. big "beautiful" women

"real gamers" appreciate games with low textures on their bones!

>>379881321
Terraria and TF2 are autism fuel garbage.

>>379880346
And why not ? Games like Dwarf Fotress, Battle Brothers or even tabletop games like Pathfinder or Shadowrun have the best means to "Go on grand adventures in a simulated fantasy world" while having nothing but gameplay mechanics. It uses imagination and deduction for all the fluff which is many times better than cutscenes and top tier graphics.
I agree that a good attention to the rest can often make the game better, but it's entirely superfluous in the world of games. They do are extremely important to other mediums though, such as movies or novels.

>>379881374

>Would you rather wake up next to a pretty face or a hobgoblin every morning?
The pretty face might cheat on me with a Chad, while waking up next to Hobgoblin means that I'm in the Spiderman Universe, which means I have bitchin spider powers. I'll take the latter.

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>>379881501

>Tf2
True, at least due to the influx of children and cancerous unusual traders. I won't offer much resistance there.

>terraria
You take that back.

>>379881524
Dark Souls feels grander than a game like DF. The total sum of the art adds to that sensation. DF is technologically and visually inferior and also inferior on a craftsmanship's level.

>>379881935

>Dark Souls feels grander than a game like DF.
And yet it runs at 10 FPS, has pricey DLC, is buggy out the ass, and needs multiplayer to be fun.

>>379881405

yes you are right

you could take all the textures from every game and I would enjoy them the same because they are ultimately unimportant

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Games are a whole package.
None of the games that we know and love so much would be the same if you stripped away the characters, the music, the settings, the story or the graphics. Controls, mechanics and all the things listed above all come together to create an experience we call gameplay. There are few if any games where any of these things exist in a bubble and are not in some way reliant on the other.

>>379882032
>10 FPS
Maybe if your PC still runs on XP.

>DLC
How is this relevant at all?

>buggy out the ass
"out the ass" is an exaggeration, I've actually never encountered a bug in any of the games. Also, DF is not flawless. Also, I don't see how it's very relevant.

>needs multiplayer to be fun
The fuck? No it doesn't. But it does have multiplayer, which is a great addition and yet another thing it has over DF.

>>379881935
This comes from someone who never played Dwarf Fortress.
Even though it "feels grander" because it had a bigger budget and TP 3D controls doesn't make it a better game.

It's excellent battle system, variety of weapons, pacing and exploration makes it a better game, given it depends on your taste as they are two different genre.

>>379870363
>without the meat you don't actually have a burger, it's just a salad.
For once, a food analogy isn't complete ass.

>>379882032
And it's still better. Fancy that.

>>379870363
Because a game is all about gameplay dumbass. It's a game, everything else is just a bonus

>>379870363
because it is a game and gameplay is the most important thing

Risk of Rain has almost no story to speak of, simplisitc pixel art and is still very fun and replayable.

>>379882365
>>379882456

>Maybe if your PC still runs on XP.
*cough*Blighttown

>How is this relevant at all?
Sunken cost. You want to justify it being better because it's more expensive, when it really isn't.

>"out the ass" is an exaggeration
Every boss can be bugged out so you can roll+dodge+slash them to death with that "epic" combat engine.

>The fuck? No it doesn't.
Not much reason to replay then, since new game + is unbalanced.

>>379882375
>Even though it "feels grander" because it had a bigger budget and TP 3D controls doesn't make it a better game.
True. Being a better game, makes it a better game. No one has ever been able to show me why DF is even as good as it's praised to be, aside from posting funny pics of dwarves' limbs breaking and they continue to fight and shit which is just a borderline sloppy system to me.

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>>379882526
> a theater show is all about the text, costumes and furniture are an extra!

>>379882310

go read a movie

>>379882786

yes the script is the most important

>>379882786
>i don't know what a movie is

>>379870363
Because without it you get shit like Gone Home.

>>379882786
Those aren't even comparble

Because they're surface-level elements and don't contribute to the depth of a game in any significant way. They're only good at holding attention in the short-term unlike gameplay which can keep people hooked for hundreds of hours

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>>379882786

>theatre show is glorified fanfiction written by a 5 year old
>"but the couches in the background looked fancy, 10/10!"

>>379882946
the foundations of a house can be the most important thing and still worthless without the roof on top of them. and this is a generous analogy since games with good atmosphere and shit gameplay exist and win praise

FOOD

>>379882761
>True. Being a better game, makes it a better game.

Don't misquote me, DS having a better gameplay makes it a better game.

My guess is that you don't like real time simulation/strategy games. Either that or you just have too short of an attention span to really grasp the game and why it's fun. There's no achievement and no way to beat it so you can jump to the next AAA game. Therefore you see it as a waste of time better spent invested on "real games" instead.

>>379883254
Analogies are shit. A game can be great with just good gameplay. You can't however have a great game with just good graphics or sound

>>379883254
What you mean flavour of the month shit that's praised by journos and won't be remembered much less played in a year or two after its release?

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>>379870363
Gameplay is literally the only thing separating the medium from others

>>379883254

the engine of a car can be the most important thing and still worthless without the rest of the car. and this is a generous analogy since houses with good foundations and shit roofs exist and and can be lived in

>>379882681
>*cough*Blighttown
You bring up 10fps as a negative against the entirety of the game because of one area, which isn't even consistently at low frame rate. You are desperate for an argument it seems like.

>You want to justify it being better because it's more expensive
Money is everything to you I guess? When I see high production values I don't think, "yeah, they just did this so they can get more money out of me." That is a ridiculous and incorrect line of thought.

Also, ways to cheap on bosses isn't the same as bugs you idiot. Exploits also don't exist for every boss and you won't uncover most of them as you play. The fact you bring this up makes me think you haven't played the games and just look at webm dumps.

>Not much reason to replay then
Replayability is the last resort of the idiot who has run out of good arguments. If the game is good on the first playthrough, which it is, that's all that matters. Plus, these games are 80+ hours, bitching about replayability is really unnecessary. Plus, they do have new game +, when most games don't.

It almost sounds like you can't afford anything and you have a shit rig based on your complaints, so you praise a game like DF which you can infinitely jerk off to because it's all procedurally generated.

>>379883440
graphics,sound,characters and story create the game's atmosphere. and that alone can hold a game and even do so well

pure gameplay gives you pong and sanic. garbage for idiots who don't actually like games for more than quick dophamine

>>379883752
It also gives you practically every competitive game in existence. But hey I guess retarded artfags like you like games more than people who dedicate portions of their lives to them right?

>>379883601

>You bring up 10fps as a negative against the entirety of the game
Because it shouldn't happen at any point.

>Money is everything to you I guess? When I see high production values I don't think, "yeah, they just did this so they can get more money out of me."
I'm also looking at it from a value perspective. Dwarf Fort offers me 500 times the amount of fun for free, while Dark Souls requires 500+ dollars in DLC and sequels just to try and match it. Cost effectiveness.

>Also, ways to cheap on bosses isn't the same as bugs you idiot.
Bosses are supposed to not be glitched into being unable to attack you, and this is something that should've at least been patched.

>If the game is good on the first playthrough, which it is, that's all that matters
Why shouldn't a 60+ dollar game be replayable? Even at its current price, it should have replayability.

>>379883752
>that alone can hold a game
If you're some faggot who likes walking simulators. A game isn't a game without gameplay, it's the one defining feature of a game and the most important. Yes having good sound and graphics is nice but not necessary in the slightest. If a game has shit gameplay might as well not even buy it and if you still want to know the story you can watch it on YouTube like a mongoloid

>>379875012
It's absolutely relevant. What is the questioned asked in OP? The answer is "because gameplay is more important by a level of magnitude"

>>379883957
when you have a game that carries itself almost entirely by gameplay you get garbage for casuals like sports games,platformers,racing games and generic FPS shooters AKA garbage for normie casuals

an ideal game features the whole package, a "game" that has no gameplay at all is not a game but a visual novel so your argument is invalid, atmosphere is more important

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>>379884424

>when you have a game that carries itself almost entirely by great gameplay you get games with bad gameplay

That's not how it works.

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>gameplay not the most important part of the game
>meat not the most important part of the burger
Fucking vegans, ruining everything with their shit opinions

>>379884573
i'm sure people buy mario rehash #9001 because they really like him as a character and not because they are fucking autists with unholy dedication to playing the same platform shit endlessly

>>379884424
Those "retarded casuals" have more passion, stronger experiences and more indepth understanding of games than you ever will though. Ever thought that you're the normie? Your preferences seem to match up after all.

>>379884184
>Because it shouldn't happen at any point.
Some frame rate drops in a 1 hour part in an 80 hour game. 4/10 it's fucking irredeemable shit - /v/

>Cost effectiveness.
Thank you for making me feel better about the size of my bank account, so I don't have to jump through hoops figuring out this dumb shit. I can just enjoy what I like for what it is regardless of finances.

>Bosses are supposed to not be glitched into being unable to attack you
I do agree. However, this is not a valuable enough point to make me change my mind about Dark Souls being a better experience than DF.

>Why shouldn't a 60+ dollar game be replayable? Even at its current price, it should have replayability.
Why? It's just $60. Much cheaper if you get it on sale which happens all the time. I want quality, not quantity.

>>379884836
The meat was pointed out as being the gameplay for a reason, dumbcuck. It is the meat of games. But it's degenerate to think the meat alone matters.

>>379884884

I don't know if I can speak for mario or the filthy normies, but when you buy a game purely for gameplay, you're buying it because the gameplay is good enough to nullify any flaws you find in it. I'm pretty sure, for example, that nobody cares about Mario as a character, and they don't care about character development. It''s fun to jump on platforms and dodge goomba shells and throw hammers.

That doesn't need some cinematic justification.

>>379870363
But a burger with fantastic meat and mediocre bread and topping is still pretty good and one with great buns and a shitty patty is a shitty burger.

>1 post by this ID

this is my favorite meme

>>379885120

>80 hour game
Gonna need source on that.

>Thank you for making me feel better about the size of my bank account,
Yes, how dare someone who works hard for their money want the best bang for their buck?

>Why? It's just $60
literally the "WHAT ARE YOU, POOR" excuse. I'm sorry if I value my money too much to just give it away to any schlub.

>>379885001
> Those "retarded casuals" have more passion, stronger experiences and more indepth understanding of games than you ever will though

yeah chad and friends™ play the yearly rehash of fifa because they have deep undying love for video games and not because they just love dicking around kicking balls and sheit

as for actual autists these people always had crazy passion for insane things and while they're talent and dedication deserve recognition i'd still rather not be an autist and i can't get behind autistic shit

>>379870363
The real question is, why are nice graphics, art style, story and other things always used as an excuse to bad gameplay?

Universally acclaimed shit like The Witcher 3 comes to mind.

>>379885268
If you can't eat the meat by itself then it was a shit burger anyways. At that point your just masking the flavor

>>379885591
witcher 3 is one of the greatest RPGs ever made, the bad combat meme is a hoax it has better combat than the majority of RPGs

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>he uses frozen patties instead of ground beef

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>>379870363
Look at the biggest selling games of all time:
>Tetris
No story
>Minecraft
Bad graphics
>Grand Theft Auto V
Shitty versions exist in last gen consoles with inferior performance and the game still sells like crazy, the biggest draw being GTA online which is more gameplay, less cinematic
>Super Mario Bros.
>Mario Kart Wii
>Pokemon Red and Blue
>New Super Mario Bros
Story basically non-existant, certainly not the biggest draw to any of these games. Also non-impressive graphics / art style
>Skyrim
On launch was a buggy mess with shit graphics, modding is the biggest draw

How many of the best selling games of all time are story driven, or defined by their art style?

>>379885602
His defense for that is literally just. But all of them together is better.

>>379885548
>falling for "everyone who has passion for something is autistic" meme
Really sounding like a passionless normie drone right there

>>379885268
Did I say the meat alone matters? I said it's most important. Maybe read posts before you reply.

And it IS the most important, since gameplay makes or breaks games far more than any other aspect of a video game, much like good meat does the same for burgers.

>>379885521
https://howlongtobeat.com/game.php?id=2224

Most players probably average the main + extras, so it's a bit less, but then I'm sure plenty try to do completionist runs. Also, for people who don't look anything up, it most likely takes somewhere between those two times.

>Yes, how dare someone who works hard for their money want the best bang for their buck?
Why do you assume I don't? Evidently I just make more than you, or I forgo other things in my life for what I care about.

>literally the "WHAT ARE YOU, POOR" excuse
And yet, it's still just $60, you fucking twat. Guess what? A good game is a good game regardless of the price tag. Dark Souls could be free, or be $200, either way I would play it and be like, "God damn this is fun." Get your head out of your wallet for once.

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>>379885858
This is how I feel being one of the few people who's actually capable of criticizing TW3.

TW3 is not a bad game. But you do not give 9s and 10s to a game with subpar gameplay.

>>379885602
What's your point? I'm not an animal like you, I like having a bit more than just a piece of meat in front of me.

>>379885925
look at the best selling music albums right now and tell me you dare call that garbage real music. using tetris as an example for a video game holy shit kill yourself

>>379885990
people who keep paying for the same rebranded platformed over the course of 20 years are mentally ill.

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>>379870363
if gameplay is meat, this is a nintendo game

>>379886191

>And yet, it's still just $60, you fucking twat
Well, I'm sorry if I don't bend over for corporate interests. Dark Souls might have some redeeming features, but I don't want to give them the thought that a game should ever be 60 bucks unless it can guarantee me 5000+ hours of gameplay, like Minecraft for example.

>>379886191
Dark Souls isn't a good game though, it's a poorly made, janky repetitive mess that only got popular because idiots with no experience thought it's the hardest game ever and discovered the age old concept of a fair challenge for the first time.

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>>379886570
And this is a Sony/Microsoft/PC game

>>379886326
> This is how I feel being one of the few people who's actually capable of criticizing TW3.

you are not criticizing shit you are repeating the same meme that gets pushed around here for two years by that gothic 2 spergmaster

>>379870363
Why is graphics always used as a defense for poor gameplay, mechanics, story, and other things?

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>>379871417
>nobody would play a game with No GUI, soundtrack, or story

Imagine being

--->>> SO FAT <<<---

That you try to make a point but all you talk about is food.

>>379886540
Agreed. But people who play games for "the experience" are also brainless casual fags who have no business talking about video games, since they know very little about them.

>>379874974
Hey FE Conquest had goat soundtrack as well.

>>379886712
>Well, I'm sorry if I don't bend over for corporate interests.
No bending over is happening. The only thing happening is you thinking about people getting bent over, you fag.

>A game needs to have 5000+ hours to be worth $60
Clearly, you don't give a single shit about video games. If I thought this then I would have played over a thousand LESS games than I have in my lifetime.

>>379886540
>using tetris as an example for a video game holy shit kill yourself
>Implying that tetris isn't one of the most purest video games experiences that exist
Confirmed for walking simulator faggot

>>379886779
Ever thought it might be a "meme" for a reason? Different people played it, took the same conclusion, and posted about it.

>>379870363
Video games, objectively, are necessarily a combination of two things:

1. A system of coded rules with which a player can interact with some sort of goal, feedback, etc.
2. An electronic visual representation of these rules.

Everything else, while it can enhance or take away from the video game, is necessarily secondary. A "Video Game" (capitals signifying the concept of the video game describes above) is to be judged on the gameplay and how effectively that gameplay is presented to you. On top of the Video Game there are other factors which constitute the video game, the experience of the other secondary characteristics devs have built in. You can criticize these aspects as well, because they are part of the package that a dev is presenting to you. However the Video Game is always primary, and other substance like music or story should come back to the Video Game.

For example, one doesn't evaluate the music and story, one evaluates how well the gameplay is used to tell a story and how the music compliments the gameplay.

>>379886886
thank you

>>379886540
Too bad many of the games he pointed out are also culturally revered in addition to selling well

>>379886712
> he isn't willing to pay $60 dollars for anything less than FIVE THOUSAND hours of entertainment

jesus christ nigger $60 will barely get you a few hours worth of gasoline in what kind of nightmare world do you live in?

>>379874974
>Fe Conquest
>shit graphics
But Anon
Anon, that muh fucking Pixel Art
That shits orgasmic

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>>379870363
>Good graphics
>Nice art style
>Interesting characters
Welcome to Va-11 HALL-A

>>379887057
>>379887407
see>>379886886

I'll take lesser games with better gameplay, over more games that I would just throw away. Quality over quantity.

>>379887259
this meme comes from the fact BBfags are still assmad about their gotay and from the fact /v/ loves shitting on anything that gets praised

W3 has better combat than most RPGs

>>379887370
> culturally revered

has more to do with that fact most of the public couldn't name a videogame that isn't super normie trash even if their lives depended on it. angry birds is really well known with the masses too

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>>379886770
>vegetables
>less meat

ladies and gentlemen, i rest my case

>>379888324
Nah they've been hugely influential on other high quality games and are regularly studied and appreciated by game designers of all kinds. Try again, you clueless fag.

>>379888123
>better gameplay
That's false though.

>>379888728
yeah i can really see the influence of tetris,mario and DF leaking out of every game i play. bitch please

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>>379889190

>muh metacritic scores

>>379889479
he didn't even mention metacritic you idiot

>>379888324
>angry birds is really well known with the masses too
Angry Birds doesn't even make into the Top 50 best selling, and things released more recently and without massive casual-tier shilling (i.e. movies, cartoons, plush) like Terraria make it into the list. It's almost like Angry Birds is a fad and it's success comes from the number of kids that downloaded it into their mom's iphone.
It's like saying that the Minions movie is representative of what makes films great because kids love it.

>>379870363
The art is easy to make. Tons of artists can make it.
The code is hard. Few people can do it.

>>379870629

>>379889231
Of course you can't see them because you didn't even bother to look into what the mario games brought to the table in terms of game design, camera techniques, etc. I called you clueless for a reason.

>>379870753
Why isn't it called Meatloaf Sandwich?

Besides, most hamburgers don't even have ham.

>>379890064
i could open google and give you names of films from the early 1900 that innovated some photography technique and they still wouldn't be good films even for the time they came out in

those games are garbage get over yourself

>>379870363
because a game can still be good with bad graphics

>>379889231
If you've played a game with a scrolling screen you've seen a concept that was brought into the mainstream by Super Mario Bros, but you sound like such a UnderageFag that I would not be surprised if you've never played a game that only took place in one screen.

>>379890505
t. low test

>>379890416
By which metric? Normies love them, actual players love them, game designers love and learn from them, they're hugely influential. Your only metric is your personal opinion which is kind of a joke truth be told

>>379890252
Hamburger comes from "Hamburg + er" which is to say, something from Hamburg.

>>379891456
> Normies love them
intothetrash.png
>actual players love them
there are all sorts of gamers, your opinion isn't even close to representing all of them. and most of the market for this shit isn't actually hardly invested gamers
>game designers love and learn from
them
mostly game designers that make the same kind of games
>they're hugely influential.
influential in the sense they got into pop culture by being normie games
>Your only metric is your personal opinion which is kind of a joke truth be told
my opinion is more based in objective facts than yours for starters

>>379893689
>there are all sorts of gamers
And most of them at the very least enjoyed Mario lol
>mostly game designers that make the same kind of games
Nope, pretty much all of them. Don't pretend you actually know anything about this anon.
>my opinion is more based in objective facts than yours for starters
Such as?

>>379870363
Yeah!
Who doesn't want a uk-tier just-bun burger!?!

>>379889871
There's as many programmers as there are artists, if not more. There's a lot more software and tech industry jobs than the arts.

>>379894619
>And most of them at the very least enjoyed Mario lol
when they where at elementry school maybe
>mostly game designers that make the same kind of games
Nope, pretty much all of them. Don't pretend you actually know anything about this anon.

there is nothing to learn from pong, there is nothing to learn from tetris, there isn't anything to learn from sonic, i can even give you the benefit of doubt and say there is something to learn from these games it's nothing that wouldn't of happened either way. nobody in the videogame industry discovered the theory of relativity
>my opinion is more based in objective facts than yours for starters
Such as?

such as the fact if you'd claim you are a gamer because you played megaman exclusively for the last 20 years you would or should be laughed at to death at any half serious video game thread for starters. in what are you different exactly from school children who download jetpack joyride to their smartphones. you play games that have only one layer to them that all comes down to the bottoms you press instead of games that have deeper layers to them such as moral judgment and artistic themes

>>379895771
No one wants a plain patty with no seasoning either.

>>379896939
Plenty would want that more than just bread and as others have pointed out once you stop desperately clinging to a shitty analogy you can see that gameplay focused games like dwarf fortress are generally considered better than graphics/music focused games like walking simulators.

>>379896541
>>And most of them at the very least enjoyed Mario lol
>when they where at elementry school maybe

There is a game where literally all you do is make your own Mario levels and player other people's levels, and it is one of the best selling exclusive titles this gen.

>>379896541
AI research could learn/develop from video games

>>379896541
Nice job shifting the goalposts, let's ignore the fact that Mario has made significant contributions to scrolling in video games and the techniques are still used to this day, or let's ignore the implementation of the camera in 64 which was hugely influential and is still followed albeit indirectly.
>would
You won't
>or should
Nice objective facts there lol
>you play games that have only one layer to them
Again showing how utterly clueless you are. Give TGM a try some time and notice how utterly shit you are the game because you don't know the techniques, strategies and have no mechanical skill all of which gets revealed as you put time into the game and try to push yourself. It's far more deep and intellectually demanding than some shallow artistic themes or poorly presented moral judgements that's for sure.

>>379899108
>Plenty would want that more
Most would want a complete dish over that.

>>379899793
>ignoring the rest of the post about not desperately clinging to a shitty analogy and just looking at what people actually prefer in games
Are you underage, autistic or baiting?

Sure it's great to have a game with the very best of everything but if resources and time are limited and you have to focus on one thing over another gameplay is the way to go for games. If you were trying to make a movie it would be different.

>>379899575
> let's ignore the fact that Mario has made significant contributions to scrolling in video games and the techniques are still used to this day, or let's ignore the implementation of the camera in 64 which was hugely influential and is still followed albeit indirectly.

as i said before and you ignored:
>>379890416

>would
>You won't

equivalent to "girl gamers" who only play one niche game. at most you could call yourself a platform gamer. don't expect me to believe other pure gameplay games like racing are any better either

> gain showing how utterly clueless you are. Give TGM a try some time and notice how utterly shit you are the game because you don't know the techniques, strategies and have no mechanical skill all of which gets revealed as you put time into the game and try to push yourself. It's far more deep and intellectually demanding than some shallow artistic themes or poorly presented moral judgements that's for sure.

> you don't know the techniques, strategies and have no mechanical skill

so videogames for you are only regular games that needs to run on a computer to visualize certain element that can't be created in real world circumstances? not a package of different experiences? thanks for confirming why i always took this kind of opinion for garbage. might as well just go play soccer and at least rip the benefits of actually being fit at least

>>379902404
>as i said before and you ignored
>>379890416
>those games are garbage get over yourself
See

>>379903069
>>379899196

>>379901623
But my statement overrides yours, even if it just touched on the analogy.

>gameplay focused games like dwarf fortress are generally considered better than graphics/music focused games like walking simulators

Who cares? Games that have a proper balance, like anything that comes out for sale and gets talked about here - Breath of the Wild, Horizon Zero Dawn, Prey, RE7, For Honor, Nier Automata, Nioh, Call of Duty, etc. and all of the other games released just this year - are being played more than a game like DF. And they are played more not just because of their gameplay, but because they deliver the whole package and that appeals to people more.

And if you think most people play games just for gameplay, then your basis on this depends entirely on /v/ or a few other internet forums full of equal retards. The player stats for all these other games say otherwise.

>>379871045
People DO eat the burger by itself, it's called Hamburg Steak you faggot.

>>379902404
Yes at their core they're automated traditional games. They're vastly different experiences when compared to traditional games simply because of this fact. As a product games are a collection of video games, movies, music, story telling, etc. I don't mind or like them being there as long as they don't get in the way of the core enjoyment, but using games as just a method of silly escapism while denying anything that focuses on the gameplay is foolish because it's ignoring the potential of the medium since it's capable of much more than than trying very hard to immitate its well established cousins.

>>379903069
it's late night where i live so i'll wrap things up for you and leave

you have a tool that gives you certain capabilities, it could be a PC or a console. you only use that tool to a limited extent to create basic elements that can't exist in real world games, for example tetris can only exist as a computer game in the sense you wouldn't have an infinite rain of cubes falling down for you. you are shutting down several other layers of experience that video games can offer you. shutting down the ability to experience visuals,sounds,complex characters motives stories and decisions. you are a person who plays computer games you need a PC as a crutch while a more serious gamer plays computers games because they offer a compelete interactive experience that NO OTHER MEDIUM CAN CREATE

you could play chess, you could play soccer, you could solve crosswords. but you call yourself a "gamer" because you chose to play a game where you jump on platforms instead. you view games only in a mathematical way not as a whole package of experience and therefore you don't actually utilize the medium

good night

>>379903791
They're only played more because they've been recently released unlike DF. They won't stand the test of time, many have been completely forgotten already.

>>379905393
Oh hey it's that retard icycalm

>>379905609
Games released the same year as DF were also played more than DF at the time.

>They won't stand the test of time
Hundreds of games already do.

>>379906601
Most of those games are gameplay-oriented unless you want to claim that games that came out less than a decade ago stood the test of time

>>379907297
>Most of those games are gameplay-oriented

Deus Ex, Planescape Torment, System Shock, Fallout, Resident Evil, Castlevania, Devil May Cry, Diablo, Metroid, Armored Core, Silent Hill, Eternal Darkness, Onimusha, Secret of Monkey Island, Half Life, Halo, Jet Set Radio, Grim Fandango, Final Fantasy, GTA, Metal Gear Solid, Shadow of the Colossus, Far Cry, Crysis, Thief, Okami, Red Dead Redemption, Deadly Premonition, many more...

Are you saying all of these games are remembered purely for their gameplay?

There are examples of games remembered purely for their gameplay. There are a ton remembered for more than that as well.

And, there is definitely something to be said about:

>all the complaints about character redesigns or story reboots we constantly see
>the fact that both developers and consumers alike have advocated for better graphics and larger dev teams and budgets over the decades (evidence: we are no longer playing Pong)

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>>379871045
Damn not here

>>379910039
System Shock, Castlevania, DMC, Diablo, Metroid, Armored Core and Thief sure as fuck are. Also on top of listing new games, literally who games outside of small cult followings on /v/ and games known only because of their impressive tech you've listed like half of all the well remembered muh story/atmosphere games. Also what consumers want and devs follow is not an argument for quality.

>>379870363
Name a single game with great gameplay but poor graphics, art style, story, and other things.

>>379912001
You're wrong though. All of those games are remembered for their themes as well.

>you've listed like half of all the well remembered muh story/atmosphere games
You're full of shit and you know it.

Also, more points I raise:

>everyone who listens to game soundtracks outside of games
>everyone who buys concept art books
>people who are fans of voice actors and go to see them at panels
>cosplayers
>all the guys that spend tons of hours filling up Wikis of lore
>all the threads across the internet about video game characters and stories
>the fact there are now Story trailers vs. Gameplay trailers
>the fact there are books extending the lore of some games, and people who buy and read them
>the fact that tabletop gamers sometimes take video games as a model for their world building
>the fact people purchase character figurines
>the fact people use video game characters as avatars
etc.

Face it, the human spirit is more complex than that. It needs more than just mechanics and some rules. Characters, music, writing, art design etc. brings things to life for people and these things leave lasting impressions on us.