Why does everybody, especially MMOs ignore the wastness of elemental

File: 947425111145579.jpg (25KB, 532x320px) Image search: [Google]

25KB, 532x320px

>>379193421
>ice + magma = Order

>>379193683
>all 4 elements combined

is it not obvious enough ? damn. sorry

File: 1444631358478.jpg (39KB, 242x208px) Image search: [Google]

39KB, 242x208px

>>379193421
>ice not between wind and water
>magma not between fire and earth

>ice IS between wind and water
>magma IS between fire and earth

are you even trying ?

>>379193920
i was a bit confused at first too, look at the color of the line tho makes sense

Because classical fantasy RPGs, especially MMOs, are a human centipede of plagiarized sacred cows that can be traced back to D&D, where the concept of "specialist wizard" just means you can have a spellbook with dozens of cherry-picked spells from 6 out of 8 broad categories instead of all of them.

File: wheel.jpg (9KB, 477x247px) Image search: [Google]

9KB, 477x247px

>>379193421
Why does everybody, especially MMO ignore the wastness of OP's faggottry?

i created this quick wheel to demonstrate what i mean.. just imagine a talent system like this, where you would start off with 1 dick, and maybe suck your way up to a second gay orgy. and OP in particular could actually suck 30 or 40 dicks, unlocking the "advanced" faggotry aswell

obviously inspired by boku no pico and 4chan

File: 11.jpg (56KB, 334x250px) Image search: [Google]

56KB, 334x250px

>>379193421

>water + earth = wood

>>379193920
They are dumbass, pay attention to the colours.

>>379193770
First
"Liquid" is any liquid. Including magma, which is liquid rock. Stupid. The natural progression of water control is ice control.

Water and wind give you nothing special at all. the best it could be would be mist, however that's a basic water control.

"Order" Isn't a fucking element. Give me an example of an order based attack.

Firestorm is fucking stupid, something you could create with those elements but ultimately not a controlling force.

Fire+Wind is just better fire. And Fire+Wind+Earth is smoke control.

Projectile is fucking stupid. Earth+Wind is sand

File: 1488195198145.png (637KB, 1023x723px) Image search: [Google]

637KB, 1023x723px

>>379194181
>argument

>>379194285
I've always equated OPs version of "Order" to Almighty/True/Raw/Pure/etc magic, a primal force not bound to an element and its ways.

>>379193421
The logistics here are that you'd need to create a unique set; maybe a handful, maybe dozens of abilities to represent points that have shit for design unique design space between each other. It's a metric fuckton of work and implies nothing in regards to whether or not the end product would be any good. Even if conceptually you had something that'd be simple, there's probably no reason it would want to be done on a wheel like this compared to just having 4 elements and distributing shit between them, then balancing according to that.

>>379194421
So Force?

Or are we talking Energy. because neither of those are "Order"

File: 1494349660279.png (52KB, 249x238px) Image search: [Google]

52KB, 249x238px

>>379193421
>MMOs are people

>>379193421
>Asian elemental wheel where wood and metal aren't core elements
>Western elemental wheel where Aether isn't the 5th element (order?)

>>379194285
you have a point. i've spent like 5 minutes making up the sub-elements, so yea it could use some help.

then again it wouldnt make a nice wheel/star thing.. what could fire/wind possibly make ?

also, wind+water=ice ---- whats the problem here ?

>>379194181
hm. if you inversed the colors itd be better. bcus the white could be dicks and the black looks like OP as pacman munchin on them. just a theory

>>379193421
>I created this quick wheel
Neat, OP.

>>379194534
probably closer to Energy. Order is a horrible choice of word to describe it, if it's what I think it is.

The idea of raw, uncontrolled power that makes up the very basis of magic is something that I've always liked though. Skills you could associate with it are the Time/Space style ones, like teleportation and time-stops. Or even just raw, non-fire explosions, build-ups of energy that just rupture and burst apart.

>>379194742
It's just some guy nitpicking you, since Ice seems a natural extension of Water (compacting it into a solid to be launched, at the cost of flexibility), as compared to something like Lava being Fire+Earth, since it's literally molten rock trying to be moved.
But, this sort of thing is why advanced elemental wheels are so hard to pull off in a game, because nitpicking and where to draw the lines causes issues. Why wouldnt someone that controls water not have control over Ice? Why can't someone that has control over Earth not redirect a lava flow? These sorts of things.

>>379194742
Wind+Water being ice is only acceptable if the Water upgrade is blood control.

>>379194857
I was thinking on making the dick section smaller but the image of OP swallowing so many dicks that his jaw dislocated was too enticing

>>379195071
>Order is a horrible choice of word to describe it
yea i guess... i just wanted to get the point across yknow..

>>379195225
if it's supposed to be an "origin of magic" style element on the wheel, call it Energy, Primal, or Pure, depending on the flavor of the game its going in.

>>379195092
i originally wanted to write blood, but then i thought
>if i can control blood and water, why not melon juice ?

so just changed it to liquids.. (control the little amount of water in liquids, requiring fine watercontrol skills)

>>379193421
>ice from order and wind
>order from water and fire
>magma from order
>lightning somehow connected to fire

Did an actual retard made this abomination?

>>379195507
not op but fucking look at the colors dipshit order aint attatched to them like that at least read the other posts

>>379195398
im not using this pic anywhere so im not gonna bother improving it. just wanted to see a discussion about this type of magic in games..

but like >>379194491 said its a lot of work, thats why i meant MMOs, where no one can virtually master all elements, just pick a few and make something good of it..

of course this would cause the game to be hard, which is not good nowadays

File: Inner_planes.jpg (68KB, 383x509px) Image search: [Google]

68KB, 383x509px

Superior element stuff coming through

>>379195579
Why the fuck is it over the lines then, you dumb cunt. Majority of people will look at it and think it's shit because the representation is flawed.

File: FrozenRose.jpg (84KB, 640x480px) Image search: [Google]

84KB, 640x480px

>>379195662
neat

Ice is a subdivision of water, and wind is a subdivision of wood.

>>379195849
Ice, yes, Wind, fuck no.

Ice is just hardened Water, Wind is something completely separate from Wood.

Without trees, there won't be wind, anon. They're moving and producing it.

>>379196101
just take the (you). im done here

>>379195943
>>379196101
missed link

File: 12901018_10207679834328361_2912377373563216547_o.jpg (201KB, 2048x1278px) Image search: [Google]

201KB, 2048x1278px

>>379193421
Mine is better.

Probably never gonna use this either, since I came up with a more original one based on star signs.

>>379196101
>what are oceans
>what are waves
>shat is thermodynamics

>>379196468
>since I came up with a more original one based on star signs.
Post it

>earth magic is always shit tier
why?

Balance issues

File: IMG_20170605_214020.jpg (178KB, 720x833px) Image search: [Google]

178KB, 720x833px

>>379196898
Sure
1/3

File: IMG_20170605_214102.jpg (194KB, 720x647px) Image search: [Google]

194KB, 720x647px

>>379197083
2/3

>>379197083
What is the first bubble on venus?

>>379196942
>god tier
eletricity
water
fire
light
>meh tier
ice
poison
sound
bubblegum
>shit tier
wood
earth
darkness
dicks

>>379197183
The aspects of these are all too positive.

File: IMG_20170605_213949.jpg (120KB, 720x691px) Image search: [Google]

120KB, 720x691px

>>379197183
3/3

I have a long ass document detailing the ins and outs of the magic system in Google docs. These are just the images O made to make sense of it.

It's for a comic I'll be making down tge line.

>>379197324
Those are directly ripped from what the Enneagram actually is. They tie to personality.

>>379197223
They all have a Yang and a Yin, Soft and Hard persay.

Venus Yang is Charm
Venus Yin is Poison.

>>379197560
>They all have a Yang and a Yin, Soft and Hard persay.
That's actually pretty interesting. So how would it work in a game, you'd choose a sign?

>>379197229
Sound CAN be the coolest shit, but nobody ever uses it right.

>>379196468
>>379197083
>>379197183
>>379197351

Are you gonna make a game with this?

>>379193421
>water
>water + water?
>liquid

Yes OP. Very good. Water is a liquid. Thats one whole GBP for you!

>>379197871
>mind/crowd control
>massive destruction
>sonar detection
Sound is clearly underused.

File: 5e049885-26bb-4596-86b4-30985cd2c03b.png (874KB, 1280x1406px) Image search: [Google]

874KB, 1280x1406px

>>379197852
In the comic, it ties to when to your birth/personality, but there are also bloodline techniques that are genetic and the pride of various noble families.

Pic related is the MC, I've shown her around here and there, and /a/ and /col seemed to like her a lot.

This project is still ways away from being made though, as the world and lore still need a lot of fleshing out, and I'm currently busy preparing another comic about eSports which I'll be dropping next year.

The bulk of the story us done though.

>>379197896
I have considered it. I liked the way it came together a lot, and since it's entirely mine, I thought about using it for a Monster Catching game idea I had. Totally unrelated to this universe, but same elemental system.

Deal is, I'm just a drawfag/idea guy, so I can't into programming.

That said, should Muse ever become popular down the line, I'd be down for making an RPG out of it.

>>379199316
I like your dedication and the magic system.

Too bad the manga stylisation is not my thing... i think i grew out of fantastical animu sexy girls.

U sure you dont want to adapt a western styled one too ?

>>379193421
boy somebody sure had fun with gimp's filters

>>379193421
It's neat OP but i prefer classic elements like light and dark, over shit like metal and steam or whatever

File: Technomancer Elf Prince_new.jpg (3MB, 3944x2030px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 3944x2030px

>>379200235
I can't say what the final art style for Muse will be desu. My preferences might change down the line.

I've worked in both western and manga styles before, for example, I'm drawing a very Marvel/Dark Horse styled comic for a client atm. For personal stuff, I usually go with the style that most suits the mood of the story though.

Tiger Square for example is very manga styled as it's about competitive gaming, and set in Seoul. Plus, it's directly aimed at anime/manga fans and gamers.

I have a couple other short projects planned which are more Noir, so they'll have a more western style to them.

It really depends, though my personal preference is heavily influenced by Asian artists. That said, I couldn't say what Muse will ultimately look like desu. It's a long term pet project that I'm slowly building as I gather more experience in comic-making, as I want it to be perfect.

Pic related is for the eSports battle manga btw.

>>379197896
Ooh ooh

Lemme know if you guys need a VA

Spoken lines, grunts, sex noises, whatever

>>379200956
Neat. To rephrase my post, i dont mind female protagonists in general.

However i am really getting tired of "This 14 year old 40 kg slim cute girl can wreck 20 badguys without a scratch so weebs can fap to hwr" narratives.

I know its a shit comparison but naruto had this sense of progression where you got from 0 to somewhere..

I like anime/manga in general so if this project of yours comes up i will def check it out !

>>379200956
Question: which anime/manga was your inspiration? What feeling do you want to adapt and where from ?

>>379193421
game balance since the more shit there is in game the harder it is to balance it all and even then include enough varied content so that one endgame tree is not overpowered or more usefull than any other one.

And not even then not even just over powered since weakness and shit can make one thing more desirable over another simply due to shit is just more versatile instead of stronger over other things.


Just that the more variable shit is the harder it is to make it all seem fair at least.

File: Elements.jpg (43KB, 934x597px) Image search: [Google]

43KB, 934x597px

all of your elemental charts are fucking retarded
have a real one

>lightning
>under fire
wew lad
>muh american animes made it so!
kys

>>379202214
Rust is actually the outcome of oxidation (air)

But really nice complex chart

>>379200235
western design is nice too, if the characters look detailled and emotional

File: hero_banner_magicka_01.jpg (425KB, 1600x1000px) Image search: [Google]

425KB, 1600x1000px

I think Magicka did a relatively nice job of letting you put together elements for your own spells. It was nothing particularly complex, mind, but if you didn't want to go through the hassle of actually casting something like Meteor Shower you always had the option of spam queuing Earth and Fire and just shooting a massive, exploding boulder. Similar applies across the board.

>>379194235
He just straight up took that from Naruto.

File: HERO-1.jpg (1MB, 1747x1576px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1747x1576px

>>379201676
Nah, I get what you mean.

I intentionally went with a female protag to break that convention. If anything, Calliope is the opposite of that, and in many ways, the story is more character driven and psychological.

The story of Muse is one that starts out as a light-hearted space western/scifi-fantasy, with a big world full of mystery to explore, but very quickly starts getting darker and more fucked up as you go on. Calliope is the MC cause she's in Greek mythology, that's the muse of epic poetry, and my character is a "Muse" of sorts that inspires heroes. That said, the story is meant to be deconstructive of the classic monomyth. Plus, Cal herself is a very fucked up individual, think Asuka in EVA if you want a comparison to her personality.

>>379201858
For Muse?

Quite a few:
One Piece and HxH most of all. Especially HxH. Evangelion no doubt. Fist of the North Star.

Xenogears, Final Fantasy VII, Bloodborne, in gaming.

But then it expands into western influences as well:
Warhammer 40k for the lore.
Star Wars (ep IV and V mostly)
Mad Max
Dune. There's a very clear Dune influence.
and ofc Lovecraft, if BB didn't tip you off.


And a bunch of other stuff. I forget. I pick and pull on a lot of stuff based on what works. Again, the core of the story, focusing on the MCs is written. I know how it all ends. It just needs a LOT of fleshing out.


Unless you mean the eSports manga, that one is being written by my friend, but the art for the game in the comic is heavily inspired by Guilty Gear.

>>379193421
because the majority of "gamers" are brainlets and that would be extremely complicated for them
just take a look at ff11 vs ff14

Reminds me of Element TD Warcraft 3 map... Shit was fun

>>379203283
Got me kinda excited. I never watched a space/scifi anime/manga, not even cowboy bepop... but this sounds promising.

So you aim for manga only or are you considering animations too ? And your artist name, if you wanna share

>>379204637
Thanks.

I'm actually gonna be making some promotional animations for Tiger Square this/next year. But I won't be delving fully into it, as the medium is too time consuming for Storytelling. Comics are already time consuming as is. I do have a lot of appreciation for 2D animation however, and I do feel learning it will greatly improve my gesture abd fight choreography. My focus form here till next Summer is to continue to push my art so that it's ready for Tiger Square, all the while preparing that. We have a lot of faith in that project, and both me and my friend feel that if anything will get us fame/success, it's that, as the concept has a lot of appeal, especially with how we'll be executing it.

My trip is my artist handle btw, ManlySpirit. You can find me on most social media.

>>379193421
diablo 2's hell difficulty is a great model to show why having elemental systems that restrict you to only one or two elements is really bad
basically almost every monster has at least one immunity or extremely high resistance (sometimes even to physical damage). if you're an elemental caster (ie sorceress) or use a certain element heavily as a different class, RNG will dictate what you can or cannot actually fight unless you somehow have a way around it. it doesn't help that the synergy system that the game is based around in LoD incentivizes you to "put all your eggs in one basket", and because of the severe penalties to your own resistances and whatnot you can't fully invest in gear-based means of getting around these immunities or resistances.
of course that's an extreme example but it still highlights one of the core issues and why most MMOs that let you specialize in elements simply avoid the issue of resistances entirely (making elements basically cosmetic or having other gameplay differences, like fire mages vs ice mages in WoW)

>>379205142
So in any case this muse is a long way ahead i see. Good luck to you two

>>379196468
>tfw scrubs will never know about the be all end all element false vacuum which destroys all adjacent existence and permanently alters the laws of physics by disrupting current De Sitter space

Brainlet plebs need not apply to godhood

>>379203243
He just straight up took that from Captain Planet, they've been doing this elemental powers thing forever.

A system for selecting magic should only be as complex as as the magic itself.

For example you can divide spells into many sorts of different elements but if all it is a burst, dot, or aoe of damage in varrying different colors than it really doesn't matter much whether it's an iceball, a fireball, or a magma ball.

The reason MMOs espcially graviate towards streamlined spell selection is because MMO players spoil the game for themself. Everyone just looks up what the best build is for their particular class and if you don't do it yourself other people will be sure to tell you about it. If it's an mmo where players must work togeather to clear a dungeon than players will always insist you play the best build rather than the one you created yourself or the one you enjoy the most.

>>379205404
Yeah, Muse is a good decade away, as it's a very personal pet project, and I still lack the experience and skill in many areas as I'd like it to. It's my "Dark Tower" if you will.

I'm still very excited about all the projects between here and then though, as they're all very interesting and original. I think many people will really like them. We'll see. And thanks!

>>379205825
To be fair, everyone's just been copying Aristotle. It was his way of expressing the four states of matter:
Fire = Plasma
Air = Gas
Water = Liquid
Earth = Solid

That's why I dropped the original for the star sign one, as the 4 elements have been done to death, and aren't very interesting for a magic system.

>>379203243
The way wood magic worked in naruto was so fucking baffling, then again most things from that manga were clusterfucked in some way or another

>>379200956
>No artist sig

Thanks, stealing this shit.

>>379193421
why have the elements writen as japanese if your gonna use air-water-fire-earth they're shitty and misrepresentative and fire-water-air-earth-wood-metal is way better

File: ed2.png (180KB, 680x1483px) Image search: [Google]

180KB, 680x1483px

>>379206845
It's on my social media, and tons of people will call you out if you use it. I don't recommend it. Things are copyrighted upon creation, and I can prove I made it if things need to be settled legally.

I don't mind people borrowing ideas from me, or making derivative work. But taking something I made, and claiming it as yours... well, it won't work out for you. I'm not FAMOUS, but I'm also not some nobody.

File: Untitled-1.jpg (2MB, 3944x2030px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 3944x2030px

>>379207447
Uh, no? Your technomancer is in blue robes, Mine is clearly in red. Maybe you're the copycat and you stole from ME? I've had this idea since 2001, and I have 1000+ friends who will defend my honor and call you out for being a stupid artist thief. So ha!

File: Planescape-Innerplanes_map.jpg (100KB, 597x600px) Image search: [Google]

100KB, 597x600px

>>379195662
YOU ARE TINY AND UNREADABLE

>>379207767
Nice mlp reference, faggot

File: Jace2.jpg (102KB, 670x948px) Image search: [Google]

102KB, 670x948px

>>379200956
Wew lad, ask me how i know you're underage

>>379207743
Lol.

I'm stealing your recolor.

File: Red Hood_new_new.jpg (1MB, 2104x1489px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 2104x1489px

>>379208091
Dunno, how do you? Considering I'm 26, soon to be 27. Hell, I wish I could draw as well as I do now, back when I was a teen. I'd be godly as fuck now.

Good job picking out one of my influences though, figured Link and Cloud woulda been more obvious. Try another, I always like people picking apart my sources, it's interesting to me.

>>379207743
I like this alium skin better.

>>379197083
What happened to Uranus?

>>379209269

I don't know anon, this guy gave me a drink and the next thing I knew..

>>379209269
Uranus is the God of the Sky in Greek mythology (or was it Titan? I can't remember), so I couldn't think of anything elemental to tie to it that isn't already covered by everything else. All of the signs tie to what each Greek good represents in some way, Fire and Life, Feminine Traits, Masculine Traits, Water and Mentalism, Ice and Death etc...

Also, chances are I might change the names of the Gods to fictional ones, idk, depends on how I flesh out the lore.

>>379208538
>Considering I'm 26, soon to be 27
Maybe in your head. "Sources" is a nice way of saying "rip-offs"

File: 6edfa494e92170e49b161d03798ee44f-free-shrugs.jpg (84KB, 600x857px) Image search: [Google]

84KB, 600x857px

>>379209948

>>379210137
Put your trip back on so i can filter you

>>379210315
No.

>>379194181
I don't think there's enough black in this chart to fully represent what exactly is going on with OP here. I implore you to regraph it.

>>379195409
I want a melon juice bender

>>379207915
What

>>379209269
It's just a big black hole

>>379211246
Gross.

File: AyoTeach.jpg (28KB, 468x313px) Image search: [Google]

28KB, 468x313px

>firestorm
>not smoke
???

>no game uses fundamental interaction as the basis
Feels bad

>>379193421
because if I understand what you mean, the end game there is only one path that everyone will take, then because the meta is 1 path, they nerf the fuck out of it, now all the characters are useless if you don't allow a respec, if you do allow a respec you are either going to be cuntish and charge real money or path of exile that allows free respec on meta change.

now to combat that, you are either going to have the system be a 'you will eventually get everything' so it ultimately doesn't matter, or you design the meta in a way that it only rewards one play style.

you would be better off with a defined role and a few branching paths to take rather then just adding in a massive fuck off grind fest at end game to get everything, or a constant need to meta game.

>>379197351
>putting black sun and commie fisting brigade next to each other
fucking faggot

>>379197083
>>379197183
>>379199316
>all this dedication and talent
>wasted on what will inevitably be a shitty comic forgotten before it even goes anywhere

>>379203283
>The story of Muse is one that starts out as a light-hearted space western/scifi-fantasy, with a big world full of mystery to explore, but very quickly starts getting darker and more fucked up as you go on.
wow amazing how original never before seen

File: 2657133832_dc4083c07a.jpg (71KB, 500x364px) Image search: [Google]

71KB, 500x364px

Tales of has the easiest to digest system that works well and doesnt overcomplicate itself

Water beat Lightning and vice versa
Fire beats ice and vice versa
Wind beats earth and vice versa
light beats dark and vice versa

>>379214287
Sounds like my Bonkles, nice and simple without the need for crazy elements like your Berylliums and Promethiums.
Air - Earth
Ice - Fire
Water - Stone(???)
Light - Dark
then they added a bunch of crazy shit that didn't make much sense as far as opposites went, like plantlife, explosions, and magnetism

>>379213971
To be fair, everything that can be done, has been done before. Execution trumps concept.

>>379197229
>bubblegum
OH

File: High_power_elements.jpg (997KB, 2562x1800px) Image search: [Google]

997KB, 2562x1800px

Swerve, peasants.