What went so wrong? inb4 "muh b-team" No, give actual

>>378945116
>No, give actual answers, not buzzwords.

Why, in a thread predicated on the retarded notion that a generally great game was somehow the blunder of the century?

Why should anyone treat your thread with more respect than you did making it?

It's my favorite in the series, followed by Bloodborne if we count that.

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Someone post the video, you know the one.

>>378945116
I don't think you know what buzz words are.

Original concept of the game was too ambitious, what we got was scraps from what would have been a larger more open-world RPG.

>>378945116
Its sluggish. Bosses that might have been good in the other games were trash in this because they made the combat worse than elder scrolls.

Also life gems.

>>378945996
To add to this, its like if they removed driving from GTA. It might still be a great game in some aspects, but when they fick up the core of the game, the games going to suck.

>>378945745
Seen as no one else is going to post it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRTfcMeqhig

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Nothing went wrong
1>2>3

The game threw mobs of enemies at you in small congested rooms without considering whether they were fair or not, it's the first game that really did feel artificially difficult.
Then if you get killed, you turn into a hollow and lose your health and the option to summon other players, so you have to farm constantly for Human Effigies if you die a lot.

People say SOTFS is better but it just accentuates the problems with DS2 by putting even more enemies in random locations throughout levels.

>>378945116
It's filled with anti-climatic payoffs. Example: Earthen Peak, Iron Keep, and Drangleic Castle have terrible bosses (Mytha, Iron King, Twin Dragon Riders). There are more but these are just examples. After lighting the primordial bonfires the game becomes linear and collecting the giant souls feels more like filling time than anything else.

The NPC side quests are also shit except Pate vs Creighton.

There are great things though that I don't see mentioned here often:
>A good pve covenant
>Introduces boss soul trading
>Easy to farm titanite
>Introduces respec
>Powered up rings
>Auto repair at bonfires

>>378945116
>Don't give me the actual answer

ADP, Soul Memory, and graphical downgrade.

>>378945116
If they were to make an anime out of Dark Souls, DS2 would work the best out of the three.

Prove me wrong.

>>378945116
It's almost hard to pinpoint for me, there were a lot of smaller factors that just made the whole game feel... off. The only Souls game I put down (although I plan to finish it soon).

>>378945116
Weapon degredation
Terrible character creation
Ridiculously harder than Das1 or 3

>>378945116
The answer is literally B-team though however not because the B-team is inherently worse but more because the B-team had never made a souls game before so didn't know what they were doing.

It's like they took the Demon Ruins from DS1 and just made an entire game like that.

>>378945116
but it was fun

>>378947862
So what are some notable things that B-Team did in DS2 that you felt were the worst?

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>Opponent is using Estus flask
>Leave the game, go cook dinner, then watch Titanic in my living room
>Take a shower
>Brush my teeth
>Come back to game
>Opponent still locked into the 5-hour-long animation for using an estus flask
>Walk up to him slowly and equip my strongest weapon
>Doorbell rings
>It's an old buddy from out of town
>Chat for an hour in the living room and make plans to hang out tomorrow
>Come back to game again
>Enemy still using the same estus flask
>Finally, buff my weapons
>Stab him with a tiny dagger
>He has literally 5526836974395 poise but still gets knocked back
>Follow up with heavy weapon
>Had literally 8425985262247555852552 armor, but my R2 still kills him in 1 hit

Sasuga B-team

It's bad because a youtuber said it's bad

>>378947773
It wasn't harder. It just couldn't be properly mastered like this games since it was a jumbled mess. Everything was so slow and random

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>>378945116

They scrapped their original design partway through development and went back to the drawing board. The finished game uses loads of completely repurposed assets swapped entirely around from their original purposes (Lucatiel and the belfry dwarf were supposed to travel around as a pair and had completely different characters, like a Don Quixote-Sancho Panza dynamic), leading to a disjointed, incoherent feel which is seriously jarring next to the tightly crafted, atmospherically intense worlds of the other games. In addition, the ugly lighting and generally bland environments give the game something of the feel of an empty film set. Many zones resemble first passes, where the basic level geometry has been laid down but limited thought has been put into what the visual feel, the type of combat encounters, and the general experience of the zone will be like. There are some exceptions but they prove the rule. The other big problem this reboot caused is that loads of balance decisions are redundant, like they had already worked out one fix for an issue in DS1 and then someone else came in and slapped down another fix on top of it. So people were getting chain invaded by low level twinks in DS1? Ok, we'll make it so theres no red eye orb, so you have to work to invade people. Actually, lets make it so you can only invade people with near the same amount of total souls as you, not level based matchmaking. And you can invade anyone, not just humans, so chain invasions are less likely. It's just overcooking it.

There is no "B-team" that is just a bunch of stuff. Very many of the same people worked on DS1, this game, BB, and DS3, and they made a lot of good content for this game and those other games too. The problem wasn't the people who were working but the lack of clear direction for the game culminating in this massive reboot of its development and the rushed, hacked-together product that was released.

tl;dr big eyes, small stomachs.

>>378947929

wisdom

>>378945116
It's incredibly tedious and repetitive for some reason. I don't even know why.

>>378945116
Nothing went wrong, DS2 is as good as 1 and easily better than 3. Have you even played the game?

They misunderstood what people liked about the 1st game.

They thought people liked the "difficulty" so they added more random bullshit to kill you more often that you can't see coming.

Part of what made DS1 good is that if you're patient and you play carefully, you can avoid every instance of bullshit that the game throws at you. DS2 completely throws that out of the window.

>>378945116
It's better than 3

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This is the only truly good area of DS2

>>378948786
The 1st level of 3 already outclasses 2.
It had great attention to detail, good level design and good 1v1 encounters without relying on hordes to bump up the difficulty

>>378945116
Making a sequel to a perfectly self-contained story that needed no continuation whatsoever in the first place.

Same goes for DS3.

>>378948272
Kek, this so much. Fucking estus flask animation takes 10 fucking hours

>>378945116
For me it's that we got not what we were promised.

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>>378948889
Also best boss.

After playing through 1 again after putting 300+ hours into 3 and then finally moving back on to 2 I see why I had issues with it.
It feels less like a souls game but still has the basic fundamentals.

>>378948159
1. Movement - I think bar none this is the biggest problem with DaS2 as a game, movement is mechanically clunky and poorly animated making it a complete shitfest from every angle.

2. Game Design - I want to say level design here but that doesn't accurately describe the magnitude of the flaw because it's more systematic. It's not just that the levels are poorly designed geographically because combat encounters are just as bad. I fold things like SM and the AGI fuckery under this as well because I think they're all intrinsically related somewhere deep in the early design process.

3. Difficulty - B-team seems to have gone into production with the idea that people like souls games because they're difficult when in actuality this couldn't be further from the truth. DaS/DeS were fun because they were good, not because they were hard and honestly they weren't even really all that hard once you figured out how the mechanics worked. In their endeavour to perpetually one up themselves and the earlier series all they achieved was tedium.

4. Balance - This is kind of related to the above point but DaS2 was very poorly balanced. It's very difficult to get to a comfortable middle ground between steamrolling the game and introducing artificial tedium without purposely aiming for it, a casual playthrough is invariably going to end up with either an overleveled, overpowered character or an overleveled, underpowered character.

5. Development Cycle - If we're talking about DaS2 in its full context and not just the game that was ultimately delivered this is another massive problem. B-team evidently had no idea how to actually develop a game on this scale and it shows both in the fact that an entirely new director had to be brought in and the actual game we got.

6. General Incoherence - Everything from Lore to World Design to visual incongruity.

7. General Incompetence - Similar to the above but more just bad rather than just confusing, e.g audio and textural problems.

>>378948889

The DLC areas are better than much of the base game in the sense that there was a really clear vision for what the point of them was, but they still have a lot of the same laziness in visual design as the rest of the game. EL is the worst of the three about that.

obligatory

Movement feels off.
The game would be vastly more enjoyable if the movement wasn't so different from the other instalments.

>>378945116
should have made Dune Souls instead. or maybe Din Souls

>>378949537
daily reminder that DaS2 was originally intended to be Kings Field V

The fact that DS2 STILL has enemies that do that broken sideways run that looks goofy as fuck is enough to make it the worst Souls game.

>>378949387
Brume Tower was such fucking shit, like beyond shit. Eleum Loyce felt like Dark Souls 1 level design. It was Far better. Lots of hidden shit and optional backtracking to make the boss fight easier if you choose to, but having the option to go straight into 2 boss fights if you're a god and can fight an invisible boss + an army of knights while fighting a boss

I hate how slow and clunky the combat is. None of the bosses are epic...they are just a chore to get through and move on.

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The main thing that "kills" the game is the level design, which most of the time is very limited and boring and you don't have much space for interesting exploration or alternative routes or shorcuts. The levels are designed around warping right from the start, and that hurts it the most, like in 3, but that game has very good level design in almost all levels despite that.

Most of the bosses are pretty boring too, they have a similar problem than 3 has, which a lot of them look and fight too similar to other bosses you've fought before and rarely tries to experiment with weird boss mechanics like in DeS and DaS.
3 is much worse in that regard, where all bosses are designed to be "hard" instead of being interesting or original.

People complain a lot about the animations, but I didn't mind. I actually appreciate they took the risk of trying the make the combat a bit different unlike 3.

Also, overall is a lot less polished, most levels look ugly and empty in many areas and some enemies simply seem unfinished, like that fucking lizard that throws fireballs.

I don't think it's a bad game at all, it's just inferior to 1 and DeS in almost everything, including the special "feeling" those games had, and that's what makes people be so negative about it, perhaps making it seem worse than it really is. DLCs are very good though. Fume Knight is one of the best boss fights in the franchise despite just being a big guy in armor.

>>378948913
>First level
The level of quality is hardly consistent throughout though.
Road of Sacrifice/Crucifixion Woods is two zones after High Wall and it is hot garbage that does rely on hordes to bump up the difficulty.

The attention to detail in 3 is pretty awful as well throughout or are you telling me that the Taurus Demon is supposed to drop a fire gem (While also unlocking the boss soul weapons for crafting) or that Greirat is supposed to find gear looted from guards in a city that he doesn't even know the location of from pillaging the area you've just been to? Don't even think about the Giants in the game not being affected by the weapon that's supposed to slay Giants or how you can't cut the tails off of anything in this game even though it wants to get that reference in edgewise.
DaS2's quality is all over the place due to the disastrous development but DaS3 feels like there is exponentially less effort invested as things get less important.

Also the combat in DaS3 is pretty bad for various reasons.

>>378949847
DaS2 does have a fair amount of gimmicks in its fights even if it isn't on par with DeS in terms of good gimmick fights though as far as I know.

DaS 2 is a perfectly functional game but it's just so underwhelming to play
Everything feels so sluggish from rolling to movement, and weapon movesets are bizarre at best. I know they're mocapped but it just ends up feeling lightweight and restricted, especially ultragreatswords and axes.
The open world nature also doesn't benefit the game as they designed the level difficult against the player being able to go anywhere, unlike dark souls 1 where there were three paths of increasingly ramped up difficulty for the player to explore and work out which was the correct way to go. Forest of Giants, Gutter, Huntsman's Copse and Heide's are all easy as shit and it makes the early game a boring slog
The game never really achieves those 'wow' moments either. I only memorable thing I can remember is on NG+ when Freja climbs up the cliff and ambushes you way before her boss starts, I thought that was cool as shit.
The game really suffered from having to be redone halfway through, it originally wasn't even a souls game but an open world ARPG in the vein of the elder scrolls.

>>378945116
Ugly.
Even clunkier than 1. You have to stop attacking to actually turn your character by more than 3 degrees.
I felt that there were far less interesting things to find by looking around.
Leveling at some bitch, instead of just fire.
Every entry has some hitbox problems, but this piece of shit takes crown.

>>378949327
This is dead on + the downgrade bullshit too.

30 sec load times on ps3

>no hitstop
>slightly less IASA frames

>HURR DURR FUCKING UNPLAYABLE CLUNKY STIFF CONTROLS

>>378945116
nothing went wrong the game is fun don't listen to pvp niggers

>>378952067
but pvp niggers are the only people who like dks2

>>378952067
>the literal most common das2bab defence is muh pvp
>saying this

>>378950583

>Greirat is supposed to find gear looted from guards in a city that he doesn't even know the location of from pillaging the area you've just been to

DS3 has a lot of qc problems like this but the problem with Greirat is his inventory is offset by one stage of his quest for some bizarre reason. Obviously he wasn't supposed to have the Irithyll stuff to buy until you send him to Irithyll, or the Lothric Castle stuff until you send him to Lothric Castle.

>>378945116
here is your answer: skip this month. May bundle was the worst in years

>>378945116
Nothing went wrong. Best Souls game in the series.

>>378945635
>generally great game
Lol

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>>378945116
>des was too easy and short
>played 1 to death and can still remember literally everything years later
>bloodborne was very fun while it was new and unknown
>3 was linear and forgettable
>tfw das2 was my favourite in the series

>>378945635
fpbpzomgwtfbbq

>>378945116
I didn't like it as much as the other games

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>>378946476
the army of das2 haters in comments section upvoting each other is amusing

>>378945116
I hope you die in a fire faggot.

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>>378945745
Save yourselves
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kl8OjoOT8Tg

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>Soul memory

>>378956498
I want to fucking die

it's 2017 we already know what went right and wrong with this game.

>>378959213
But anon, how will he otherwise get his (you)s?

>>378945116
>Like 30+ bosses
>Maybe 6 are good, including dlc bosses
I liked no I frames during backstabs/slower estus heal but other than that it's the worst game for pve alone.
PvP autists need not apply

>>378959812
42 bosses actually.

Nothing it's actually the best DaS
Just fucking update it

>>378945996
>Its sluggish.
Holy fuck, confirmed for never having played Demon Souls and Dark Souls 1.

>>378945745
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_JFDPCtXFY

>>378960286
Just rebuild it from scratch. Has the potential to be miles better than the other games.

>>378954202

Das2 is my least favorite, but after Das3 you really learn to appreciate some of the things they tried with the mechanics, like power stance. Never bothered with the DLC but stuff like soul memory keeps me from going back to it. I just wish they had left more things from the beta, especially spell aiming and strong casting.

>>378956498
>that video
I don't think I have ever known true pain till now.

>>378961248
You should really try the DLC since it's miles better than the base game. It really shows you how much better DS2 could've been if they didn't have to scramble to finish the game.

>>378945116
Shut the fuck up cunt

>>378945996
>Also life gems.
Why not just, Gee, I don't know, Not use them?

>>378961397

I know, but cash is tight right now, so I'll probably wait for it to go on sale. My old computer bit the big one when vanilla released so I just played it on the triple. That being said, it's not like I don't have any fond memories of Das2.

>Miyazaki will never make whips as amazing as they were pre-nerf.

>>378945116

Nothing went wrong.

DS1>DS2>Des>DS3

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>>378960445

DELET!!!!

>>378962240
Dark Souls 2 Scholar of the First Sin is part of the next Humble Monthly Bundle. $12 for the game plus six or so other games added in a month.

Dark souls 2 has some good mechanics like powerstancing, stamina and rolls being directly proportional to equip weight, rolls having extra stamina cost if you spam them, magic etc
the game around the mechanics is absolute dog shit however

>>378948889
>Enemies that have an incredible amount of health and defense
That alone brings the area down. Everything is the equivalent of a damn giant, and then you actually fight a giant and it has about the same health as the mooks.

>>378945116
>combat is sluggish thanks to floaty animations and movement, lacks the weightiness of DaS1 or the speed of DeS
>most areas are ugly with awful texturing and environmental lighting
>half the skyboxes/backgrounds are literally unfinished
>quantity over quality in nearly every aspect of the game
>immersion killing world design at every turn (some areas literally just a bunch of geometry thrown together, unlike the areas in the previous games that feel like actual locations)

the level design improves in the dlc but they're still butt-ugly visually

Is craftsmans hammer broken as fuck in sotfts? My friend just started playing the normal version and it's so broken, didn't remember it being remotely as good in my playthrough

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>3000 people play DS1
>500 people play DS2
>2500 people play Scholar
>12000 people play DS3

>>378945116
Adaptability
Lazy enemy placement
Bad level design
Uninspired bosses

>>378962642

Well fuck son, you just made my day. Now if my NEET ass can land this job I hear back from on Monday, this'll be the best I've felt since I got canned two weeks ago.

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>>378945116
desu it is my fav dunk souls game

Nothing, it's the second best to DS1.

>>378963456
So DS2 is just as good as DS1 and DS3 is drying up way faster than DS2 did.

SAD!

>>378945996
Have you played any of the first two Souls games?

>>378945116
It doesn't have any ''major'' flaw but a huge number of little stupid decisions that pile up into a huge mountain of bullshit

>>378963132
Wahhh I cant steamroll through with my magic/pyro/dex

>>378963892
DS3 lacks longevity

Longevity comes with good PvP. And DS3 PvP is very limited.
People get most fun out of invasions and invasions are utter shit in DS3 so all people have is arena battles.

>>378961397
>You should really try the DLC since it's miles better than the base game

this is a lie and you know it.

I tried the first DLC and it's just as bad as the base game.

>>378949327
There is literally nothing wrong with the lore and movement is very similar to DaS.

>>378964007
I don't use any of those. I use the strong weapons so that shit doesn't take forever and even with things like the Greatsword it's like three or four hits to kill a single one of them and you get ambushed by two or three at times. Yeah, the humanoid mage enemies die in one hit, but everyone else take ages to kill and come in groups.

>>378964127
>There is literally nothing wrong with the lore

except it's hardly there

>>378964587
Just like in every dark souls game huh.

>>378964618
it was less noticebale in 2.

>>378945996
Life gems are balanced I feel like. Atleast the small ones. Your health doesn't go back instantly like it does with estus.
They're also good for when you're on the move and being chased because of how much more aggressive the AI is and you don't stop dead for half an hour to use them,

it was quantity over quality. There are something like 40 bosses and only 3-5 of them were any good

>SILVER AND BLACK KNIGHTS ARE BACK
>Love their armor and weapons, easily favorite from the series
>Gets the Silver Knight Armor ready for my Paladin character
>No Silver Knight Spear or Sword.
>feelsbadman

WHY FROMSOFT!?!

YOU RUINED MY HOPES AND DREAMS!!!

>>378946821
I like the overwhelming amount of enemies though. Makes you try different tactics instead of luring one at a time or dancing around to get a backstab. Not saying there's anything wrong with doing either one of those but that's not the point.

It was my first and I loved it's I may not be able to give an unbiased opinion.

On the other hand people who played the first one and waited for this might not be able to judge it fairly because expectations and not as a stand alone game.

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>>378965442
but it gets annoying when you aggro one and then like 3 others join the fun.

The engine was not really designed for anything but 1v1 combat and it shows when you get mobbed by enemies. Or when you bring 2 sunbros to a fight

>>378946821
t. Someone who's too retarded to use the right weapons and setups for the right situations

>>378947110
You didn't like the Alonne Knights? Come on man that area was cool.
In my opinion I thought the game was kinda ugly after you left majula. Just didn't look or feel a whole lot like Das or Des. Then when I got to the iron keep, man, that is a Dark Souls ass area.

>>378964127
>movement similar
Fuck no, play them back to back and feel the difference

>>378965768
there's not real "right" weapon. The basic longsword can take you though the entire game no problem.

and if that does not work, fall back on magic

>>378946821
>>378965596

I feel like this happens in all the games and don't know why DS2 always gets criticised for it. Can you guys name specific areas where it's prevalent?

I know this is clichéd, but Dark Souls 2 is a decent game by itself. It's not a good Souls game.

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>>378956498
I am been rused?

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>>378945116
10 Dark Souls thread erryday

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>>378965971
It's been a while since I played that mess of a game but getting mobbed by 5+ enemies felt more noticeable in DaS2 than it did in the other games

Its the most avant guard from the series, so its a pleb repellent

>>378947270
Well seeing as how the game has much more unforgiving AI, in terms of moves and placement, the high level ADP i-frames allowed you to sort of play the game more like Demons Souls or Dark Souls 1.

>>378965925
So you're telling me that something like a bastard sword is not better at dealing with swarms than a dagger or a lance?

>>378966118
Seeing as how you hate the DLCs more than the base game, I'll attribute this to the fact that you just plain suck.

>>378966118

Can you be anymore of underage pleb trying to fit in? Your entire post screams reddit

>>378966712
no, sunken king was badly designed.

>>378966606
never used the bastard sword. I never use the really big, slow, weapons unless it was some gimmick build.

>>378966748
>i have no legitimate counter arguments
>i will call him reddit to discredit him

Extremely annoying enemy placement and encounters (red and black phantoms in particular). This made several areas a total slog to get through, and never ever fun.

The way ADP scaled was stupid, and lifegems were a huge crutch, though I guess they needed to offset the reduced max HP on death somehow.

Many bosses were forgettable but I didn't mind the more mini-boss-oriented format. DS3 had around 5 disappointingly easy or gimmicky bosses, but sometimes the way they were presented made up for that, to an extent. And the hig points of 3 easily trump the highs of 2.

bad level design
player character moves and plays like a sack of wet shit
story makes no sense

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>>378966118
>Dude I love Demon Souls the most which means i am oldfag which also means i am always right

>>378967069
my first game was Dark Souls but I liked Demon's more.

>>378963718
Good luck, friend I hope you get the job. Also it should be noted, if you buy the bundle early, you can get the advertised main game early before the full bundle, so buy it early

>>378964040
It also comes with reasons to play NG+. Which DS3 doesn't have.

>>378967658
DS1 doesn't have it either but people still do it there because revisiting the world is worthwhile.

Meanwhile every DS3 playthrough is pretty much the same with the game being so linear.

>only reason to go NG+ in DS3 is extra rings
>extra rings are only relevant for PvP
>PvP is shit in DS3

>>378945116
It's a great game. So to answer your question, nothing.

>>378967310

Thanks man, might still give it a few days, since I just got back to a build in Das3 after finishing Nier. Until I hear back I only have so much saved up, but they dug my portfolio so it should be smooth sailing

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUotRSRjrGQ

>>378964587
Only thing I felt was unclear is whether or not sitting on the Throne of Want grants passage to the Kiln or not. Aldia's ending at least implies you accessed it, although the Kiln itself is never shown in the game for some odd reason.

-Trying to find a cure for the darksign, you end up in Drangleic
-Just so happens the king there made excellent findings on souls before going hollow himself
-Shanalotte tells you to seek more adversity and gather more strength before you can be ready to hunt him down.
-This is even more true because access to the castle is restricted unless all 4 great souls are toppled.

-You journey through the rotted kingdom, slowly learning more and more about Vendrick's failure and ruin, and how much it mirrors your own, making you question your motives more and more. Aldia making you do so even more.

-Get to the castle and suspicions are true
-Vendrick fled the castle and never linked the fire, letting his soul rot out and refusing Nashandra's wishes to rest the flame (Nashandra can't access the Throne or the Kiln as a child of Manus.)
-You kill Nashandra and the Throne of Want is yours and access to the Kiln is yours, but you are unhappy that you failed to find a cure for your hollowing
-The crowns you obtain per Vendrick's advice grant you some closure and stop your hollowing.
-Aldia confronts you and ultimately demands your answer

-Much like Vendrick you leave the Throne but instead pursue your own answers.


>>378965857
I just played DaS a few hours ago. Only difference is how attacking feels, movement is mostly similar but DaS2 is more jerky.

I play DaS through backwards compat on Xbox One and DaS2 SoTFS on PS4.

>>378968681
>Aldia's ending

I played DaS2 and I don't recall his NPC at all. Or an ending besides "sit on the fucking throne"

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>>378966416
>Avant guard
>GUARD
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

This, ladies and gentlemen, is the DS2 fanbase. Retards trying to sound exalted but actually making fools of themselves.

>>378968950
You're trying so hard.

>>378945116
>no wavedashing
>no L-canelling
>no ledge-grabbing
>no de-sync
>no chaingrabs

how can you call that a video game

>>378945116
graphics were downgrade too much, could've at least tried to retain the gritty aesthetics rather than go full blizzard pastel palette

inconsistent world design

too many shitty filler bosses

floaty controls

>adaptability
>soul level
>hollowing reduces health
>enemies stop spawning after being killed multiple times
>changes to estus and addition of life gems
>weapon variety feels shit (many weapons have identical or very similar movesets)
>multitude of shitty bosses
>le prepare to die mentality
>ganksquads of enemies
>linear world design in some places, linear level design in more places

Conversely, here are some good points:
>looks good and well optimised for PC
>good co op system
>bonfire ascetics
>power stancing
>world design is non linear with a lot of choices for the most part
There's probably more but I can't think, overall DAS2 is still a good game, just not the best Souls game by far, there's a lot of negatives but also some positives.

>>378971648
>power stancing

tried it, seemed fun but it required rolling to survive (I did not know about ADP) so I stopped

>>378971817
I never really used it myself, hated the fact that you have to upgrade 2 weapons at the same time.

>>378946821
I find this funny because I feel DS3 does this way more in the late game and its DLC's more then it does in DS2. Ringed Shitty and the start of Ashes of Ariendel come to mind.

>>378972167
>sticking to single weapon in DS2
the game is more enjoyable and easier when you have a toolkit of weapons. Boss weapons and uniques have their own upgrade material so you lose nothing if you are smart about your choices.

>>378945116
Here's what went down

Original Dev had an idea, but they ended up having to scrap it due to PS3 limitations. They began work on a better version, then Bamco came in and cut 2 years off development time and said they want a game now. So B-Team rushed to put all the scraps together into making the game we know call as Dark Souls 2.

Dark Souls 2 is the video game equivalent of whipping up something to eat with only scraps in the fridge. This is why there's level problems like Earthen Peak -> Iron Keep, Shrine of Winter -> Drangelic, and etc.

That said, despite being literal scraps glued on top of each other, it's impressive that Dark Souls 2 was as good as it was, sure it's not better than BB/DeS or DaS, but being the 2nd to the worst Souls game isn't too shabby either. Still better than every other main stream game out there.

And the DLCs remain the second best in the franchise. Just like BB, the DLC is what made the game really good.

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>>378956498
Jesus Christ, I share the same binomial nomenclature with this being?

>>378965780
The AREA was good but the big boss fight was trash. Tseldora and Black Gulch had decent fights but the old iron king was just bad.

Aldia's Keep to the ancient dragon is another example of this. You traverse neat areas just to get a key with no real boss fight (the guardian dragon boss is just a regular enemy in the next area)

There is absolutely NO doubt that anyone that say's Demon's Souls is their favourite is just a contrarian hipster.

DS1 > BB > DS3 > DeS > DS2 and that's the official canon ranking and if you don't like it you can just sit and be wrong.

>>378956498
In his defense, I had a hard time figuring out how to equip an item too using my keyboard. I first tried from the inventory menu, then I either figured it out. I don't remember. I probably figured it out by just going to the second menu.

I'm my defense. The only RPGs I had ever played was the Fallout games.

>>378975245
DeS was my last game played, and was my favorite

Get fucked
DeS > BB > DaS > DS2 > DS3

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>>378945116
I loved the game tbqh, its faults can be attributed to a troubled development period and the inexperience of its director, Tanimura (who improved massively in the DLCs, which is the reason he was co-director in DaS3).

>>378949154
>>378948272
>actually being able to punish healing
>a bad thing

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>>378945116
the answer is actually "muh b-team"
less than halfway through DS2's game development miyazaki started pulling his best guys off of DS2 to work on bloodborne

>>378977193
>the answer is actually "muh b-team"

whatever you say

>>378976421
>Tanimura

He saved DS2 if anything.
Shibuya fucked it up and Tanimura got into the development later to fix the mess

If you wanna see what Tanimura does when he works on stuff from start to finish -> Look at The Ringed City in DS3

>>378977746
>If you wanna see what Tanimura does when he works on stuff from start to finish -> Look at The Ringed City in DS3

But the Ringed City isn't very good.

>>378978307
It's clearly better than most of DS3s maingame

>>378945116
Need a challenge? Add more gank.

Instead of having the interconnected world ds1 was praised for just make it a series of pathways you never revisit.

>>378978307
TRC is better than Base DaS3 and AoA.
If you want to good comparison of Miyazaki and Tanimura design then no better place to look than to compare

AoA (Miyazaki) and TRC (Tanimura)

Disclaimer: i haven't played any of the DLC.

There were several areas packed with 4+ enemies. The game shines in 1v1 combat, but not when you get mobbed. Losing max life on death was extremely frustrating, and the only real offset were life gems (which I'm not a fan of). The magnet attacks used by enemies was a horrible method of preventing backstabs. Weapons were pretty lame. The map felt very one dimensional. The bosses were boring, and not very good either.

The game probably suffered the most from the developers thinking people play souls games for the difficulty.

>>378978487
In what way?
The level design is pretty bad (at the very least for Dreg heap with its angel sections and one way drops), many enemies are reused from the main game, there are 2 swamps and the bosses are mediocre aside from maybe Gael.

>>378978790
You're assuming I think either of those are actually that good.

>>378978790
>TRC (Tanimura)
What the fuck are you talking about? Ringed City was done by Miyazaki, you can tell because level design is actually good unlike DaS2 dlc.

>>378979269
>, many enemies are reused from the main game

Original Enemies
Harald Knight
Reaper
Reaper (Caster)
Lothric Knight (Banner)
Angel
Ringed Knight (Sword)
Ringed Knight (Spear)
Corrupted Cleric
Cursed troglodyte
Troglodyte
Preacher
Preacher (Small)
Painted Guardian
Giant

Reused Enemies
Dragonslayer Armor (once)
Thrall (in Earthen Peak ruins)
Lothric Knight (Sword) Dreg Heaps
Fungi mob (Earthen Peak ruins)


Hmm...

>>378946553
DeS >1=3 > 2 slightly
Idk they all have strengths and weaknesses.
Don't even meme me that 1 is better than 3.

>>378945635
FPBP. Suck a dick OP before you get trashed

>>378979395
He's right Tanimura was behind TRC.
TRC is very similar to the 3 Crowns DLC, which Tanimura also directed.

You're confused into thinking he did Base DS2 level design, when that was Shibuya

>>378945116
Nothing, the only reason people started shitting on it was because some e-celeb wouldn't stop spamming this board with his shitty video

>>378980754
it was being shat on long before that Matt guy made his video

>>378980824
When the game was in beta there was nothing but praise. You're wrong.

>>378979639
Banner Lothric Knight is exactly the same as a spear one, and Ringed Knights are just reskinned Lothric Knights with different attacks.

Also painted guardian only appears in a boss fight. That's like counting Midir as an original enemy.

>>378945116
Spinning enemies
Poise sucks now, I dont know but the new ivasions and gank squad bossfight are just horrible since infinipoise, making short weapons impractical
magic is useless in dlcs
Levels should have been archestones ala demon souls
I have played it for over 1,5k hours I just have enough. Game is good, fantastic for what it is but some shit just doesnt add up

>>378980954
>When the game was in beta

this game was never in beta. The fuck are you smoking?

>>378979639
The Lothric Knight with the banner is essentially identical to the Spear wielding variant as far as I could tell aside from the ability to cast a buff. Might as well add Thrall (Dark weapon) to the list while you're at it.
The angel is far more of an area hazard than an actual enemy. Your restraint shown in not adding Angel (Cocoon) is admirable.
The preacher (small) is barely worth an inclusion.
There are no Giants in this DLC otherwise the Stormruler would have an effect on any of the enemies present in the DLC. I believe you mean "Notably tall individual".
Painted Guardian is an NPC with the same abilities as any invader and is a boss minion.
You're also missing Ringed Knight (double greatswords) in the original enemy pile and Skeleton in the unoriginal enemy pile.

I guess you're right though, I may have just been annoyed that the Thrall displays its tendency to infest most areas in the base game rather prominently in this DLC just as the Giant Crab displayed that tendency in AoA.

>>378981094
There was a beta in 10/2013. Can you at least pretend to know about the games before you spout off revisionist shit?

>>378945116
a bunch of things but to me it's the most replayable of all the Souls games

and in comparison to 1 and 3, the game actually improves in quality the longer you keep playing as the DLC content is some of the best the series has

>>378981461
>There was a beta in 10/2013.

... are you seriously calling the initial DaS2 release A BETA?

I have seen some stupid shit in regards to DaS2 but this takes the cake.

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DaS2 has the easiest mobs in the entire damn series, I can't fucking breathe looking at these posts complaining ganks are too numerous.

You can just blender them at any door opening and they literally will not attack because they can't can attack through walls and will wait until they are past the entrance. Also every Souls game has fucking ganks but DaS2 hands down gives you the most space to deal with them.

>>378955034
top rated comment is from me actually, and I did not upvote anybody. But thanks for telling me upvoting logic triggers you, ill be sure to upvote some comments that completely blow apart his poor logic.

It's a funny reviewer and definitely more intelligent than your average /v/ approved e-celeb but he's very wrong on quite a few things here.

> THE WORLD IS POORLY CONSTRUCTED BECAUSE THATS THE NARRATIVE

being the most hilarious of his 'reasons'.

>>378946821
t. a casual

>>378981181
>>378981075
I guess with severe reductive reasoning you could just say every enemy is the same, I like how you get cute and say giant doesn't exist, I meant the 3 Judicators running around the DLC. I was unsure or not to list the Painted Guardians, but I did anyways because they're an original enemy in the game.
Yes I missed the skeleton and the paired knight, but the point still stands the the amount of original enemies are more than tripled than the amount reused enemies. I was pointing out how wrong you were with the "dlc 2 is mainly just reused assets" complaint.

>>378981783
The fact that the game relies on it is more disappointing than anything else.

>>378981721
Dark Souls 2 released March 11, 2014.
What do you gain from shitposting?

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>>378945116
Dark Souls 2 is a good game, it just varied on the Souls "formula" more than people expected. Add in a couple design flaws (less unique enemies, parrying, soul memery, i-frames, design around "killing you" instead of patience and caution leading to victory, downgrade, unfinished textures, shitty world design (no, it did not have shitty LEVEL design. there's a difference), and plenty of other stuff), pandering nobody wanted and a fanfiction story and it was a recipe for "BLUNDER OF THE CENTURY", when really it was a pretty decent game that just grinded too hard against what people were expecting after Demon's Souls and Dark Souls.

But shit, how I felt about Dark Souls 2 is exactly how I felt about Dark Souls 1 after Demon's Souls. They slowed everything down way too much and the design felt like a forced meme rather than natural, since they literally made the world of Dark Souls for the sole reason that they couldn't make Demon's Souls 2. I don't know, it just felt weird to me but it wasn't a bad game. It was a good game with bad parts and some design choices I disagreed with.

Have a good day.

>>378982546
>design around "killing you" instead of patience and caution leading to victory
that's funny... wasn't DaS1 the game where they designed an encounter exclusively for killing you just to progress?

>>378982695
Yes, an encounter. Dark Souls 2 basically made it their motto. I'm not defending it, man. You are correct. Though it is fair to say that a single scripted event is pretty different from a design philosophy.

>>378982832
>Dark Souls 2 basically made it their motto.

they made a fucking achievement called "Welcome to Dark Souls" when you died in #2

>>378982024
I just got DaS two days ago and I'm in Undead Parish. So far there's just as many fucking mobs and the enemy placement is barely different.

Don't give me that shit. I'm enjoying the game but you faggots seriously overrate how different DaS is from DaS2 and for some reason every other game in the series.

If you wanna talk about parts that 'rely' on ganks, Iron Keep is really the only overwhelming example outside the first room in Drangleic. Everything else is you running past shit and not paying attention to how many enemies you alert, and it's literally like this in every game in the series.

I recall Bloodborne having the hardest mobs for me. By far. DaS2 you can just hold them at a chokepoint.

>>378982832
>Dark Souls 2 basically made it their motto
I mean people say this, and they usually only justify it because the Shrinemaiden laughing about death. But the game felt no-less bullshity than every other souls game in the franchise.

Hell nothing has topped Fools' Idol yet.

>>378981938
>I guess with severe reductive reasoning you could just say every enemy is the same
The difference is whether the enemy can cast a buff or not. It's barely a difference.
I also didn't say "Mainly" but rather said that it had "Many" reused enemies due to the thralls and several of the Lothric Knights present in the first area(Poison bugs roam around Earthen peak so that'd basically be forgiven if the Desert Sorceress had featured as more than an NPC invader).
> I like how you get cute and say giant doesn't exist
I just really dislike that the Giantslayer that gets several mentions in its flavor text about being useful for fucking Giants up gets used once in this game and then never does anything before or after that point despite being broadly applicable to many encounters.

>>378982947
Yes, yes they did.

>>378983041
>I mean people say this, and they usually only justify it because the Shrinemaiden laughing about death. But the game felt no-less bullshity than every other souls game in the franchise.
>But the game felt no-less bullshity than every other souls game in the franchise

Then you are misremembering. There are several encounters that couldn't be avoided through patience or observation where you'd just get clusterfucked for for approaching it as you would in Dark Souls 1 or Demon's Souls.

>Hell nothing has topped Fools' Idol yet.

I don't know, man. I didn't even know about the dude who kept her from dying because I naturally progressed to him before the boss by virtue of simple exploration. It wasn't until much later that I learned that was even a mechanic at all. I think it IS bullshit, but I think it's bullshit that is well implemented. I will defend that one, since it punishes you for just blindly running around to get to the boss rather than observing your surroundings.

>The engine was not really designed for anything but 1v1 combat
nonononononononono
fuck off
learn to disengage lock-on and whiff punish you fucking scrubs

>>378983505
>since it punishes you for just blindly running around to get to the boss rather than observing your surroundings.
but yet you criticize DaS2 for the same?

>>378945116
I don't even know
I really liked playing das2, then I bought 3, played it a fair bit, thought about ending a playthrough on 2, and then 2 felt so tasteless, clunky, ugly, unappealing.

>>378983505
>There are several encounters that couldn't be avoided through patience or observation where you'd just get clusterfucked for for approaching it as you would in Dark Souls 1 or Demon's Souls.
Please tell me of one, then.

>>378983025
The banks aren't even my top ten complaints either. Don't start me on how broken the world is spacially.

Ok I have a big problem with all the people talking about the difficulty in DS2 being alot of mobs thrown together. yet think DS3 is great.
I played DS3 and it has so many group mob areas, the first area you go has a room with like 3-4 mobs waiting for you at the bottom of some stairs, getting to the magus is some building with a fuck ton of mobs waiting to gangbang you with magic, cathedral of the deep is just a fuck ton of guys on a roof. Farron Keep is dogs and archers spam, catacombs is gangbang of skeletons that is just better to run away from, then there are the fucking woods with more annoying groups of lizard men wanting to just fuck up your day.
It is just such a big sense of bandwagoness with the muh "B-Team". DS3 Does the exact same thing yet gets praised for it.

>>378982546
>They slowed everything down way too much
Dark souls was slow but it wasn't that slow. Better than demons overall

>>378985117
The difference is the ganks in 3 make sense. Said dog ganks were backed by hunters who were using the forest as camo. DaS2 has some jackass sitting in a hole in the wall with his arm raised forever until you walk past it.

>>378984867
Don't care.

>>378945116
>healing wares
>kill 50 grunts to continue
>fast travel

>>378985617
>b-but it just makes sense!

"It's okay when A team does it": the post.

>DaS2 has some jackass sitting in a hole in the wall with his arm raised forever until you walk past it.

Holy shit what the fuck are talking about

>>378985617
You mean the dudes hanging out behind paintings or what do you mean?

>Meanwhile invisible jailers hiding in a corner forever

>>378985617
A bunch of soilders in a room makes sense in 2, so does the guardians in Hiedes.
Also DS1 and DS3 both have undead hanging from ledges waiting for you forever. So don't pull that bullshit.

>>378986219
Nice memes, now give me an actual response.

>>378986380
You did a meme by saying it just makes sense. That isn't the argument the argument is gank squads which are prevelant in every souls game yet DS 2 gets shit for it for no real reason.

>>378986380
How about you substantiate your initial argument first. The quality of your response mirrors the quality of your argument.

>>378981926
> THE WORLD IS POORLY CONSTRUCTED BECAUSE THATS THE NARRATIVE
there is nothing wrong with a world that isnt exactly "physical"

time and space is convoluted blablabla get over it

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>>378945116
It's consitently shit. And by consistently shit I mean it's shit in every aspect. The PvP that the autists parrot is complete garbage, powerstancing nearly completely useless because of not having a running or rolling attack, don't even get me started on the "build variety". Dex dominates yet again, all strength weapons are useless against anyone with a brain. Hexes and magic are nearly completely useless, pyromancy is absolute garbage. Just pick up your katana/warped sword + ice rapier and dominate in pvp/pve.

>>378959812
bosses suck in souls games, except for literally 2-3 from the entire series, which is just that - an exception

i have monster hunter for epic "bossfights"

the major part of what makes souls games good are the "gauntlets", and das2 ones were top notch: challening, engaging and varied.

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>>378976884
Being forced to punish healing by having lightning fast reactions and game sense and letting enemies with better game sense and maneuverability be able to heal is MUCH, MUCH better than making healing a death sentence for either party by making the animation so fucking long, even the absolute most TRASH players can punish a heal.

>>378987475
no one gives a fuck about your peeweepee austism

>>378987475
Only plebs have to runaway and heal, I'm not a PvP fag but it's fun punishing invader cucks in das2

>>378956498
That's just a troll, right?