Lets settle this once and for all. What are your final thoughts

I like it.

Pretentious garbage

It's good

shit. The devs pretty much saying that the only good ending of the game is to not play it and focuing you into situations where things are your fault in a railroad.

Can't even walk to talk to the CIA/FBI guys. Just automatically shot.

Fuck the devs for thinking it an amazing story for a game.

They should just have made a tv show of Spec Ops: THe line.

>>377880530
While the story is good, it is pretentious and some parts, like the White Phosphorous, could have been done better. Gameplay is mobile tier.

>>377880970
Yeah fuck that bit. Theres always another option in the real world.

Good and short.

>>377881031
What they should have done is show that those people were hostile to them. Have them shoot you and in your panic, you decide to kill every person that you kill in your screen. Then you realize you killed civilians. Retroactively, if you do manage to win the firefight, the civilians look at you in horror as you have just killed their rescuers.

>>377880970
>>377881031
>implying he was in the real world

I think its established by now that Walker is basically in hell.

my only real complaint about it is the controls were a little sticky
when ever I died it was usually because he vaulted over cover instead of ducking behind it because of how its mapped

>>377880530
average gameplaay, good story

stop talking about this game its been like 6 years

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>>377880530
/v/ approved, especially if you've read Heart of Darkness or watched Apocalypse Now

Most people who shit on it either think the difficulty is too high or have only made a judgement based off a 10-minute review without actually playing the game.

>>377880530
Play it once, shitpost about it for the next 20 years.
You don't even need to finish it to shitpost about it

>>377880530
Cult classic, and like all other cult classics hugely overrated by the fanbase.

it's still the best plot of any "modern" fps to date

>b-but the game made me do it! it's not my fault

Yes fuckers, that's the entire point.
You're doing shit you don't want to do just because the game gives you no option.
You're accepting the linear nature of video games as an excuse to do something you know you shouldn't.
It's the Bioshock twist except more brutal, because you're not being misled by anyone. Not even the game really.

Nazis were just following orders too nigga.

It introduced me to The Black Angels so it's a 10/10

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>>377881912
The load screens were something eh

>>377880530
Decent if unremarkable gameplay, very good story especially for a shooter. Occasionally gets a little too pretentious for its own good, but overall a very solid experience

I wished they used a better name. Other than its fine. I get that they made the gameplay bland on purpose but if they DID give a shit, it would easily be a solid 9.5/10

Gameplay is okay, story is better than your average shooter.

Most people pissed with the story just seem to have a really thin skin and think the game is scolding them or something. It's not specifically calling you out, it's just more general commentary on the relation between American media and American politics, especially neocon politics.

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>>377882096
My favorite one

It's actually one of my favorite games. I know it wont BUT I hope it never gets a sequel, remaster or whatever. Its better this way. Kind of like the first predator or alien.

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>>377882475
Nice. This one complements it

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>>377882096
The tonal shift when you plough that water truck through the remains of a girls airsoft club room is truly remarkable.

>>377882176
I don't know about calling it pretentious in the least, Infinite had almost the exact sort of things to say about how unnaturally action game protagonists fit into the setting and crisis their game uses and I felt it was more pretentious, dated and patronising in delivering that message than Spec Ops was by a mile.

After all, in the end the player gets to decide what Walker deserves.

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>>377882475
>yfw you realise that the message isn't directed towards Walker, it's directed towards you

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>>377882792

>>377882636
I gotta say, the first time I played it I did genuinely forget that it was supposed to be a rescue mission in the beginning.

>>377882475
This should have been a banner for /v/

About as boring as watching two flies fuck. Gameplay is linear trash and the story I cant really comment on because I uninstalled after 2 hours of taking cover and shooting constantly. Who the fuck actually finds this shit enjoyable?

>>377882475

Whoa dude clicking on pixels I should feel absolutely horrible what a terrible person I am. I can't believe somebody paid money to have fun.

Give me a break.

>>377881912
How the hell is apocalypse now and spec ops even remotely comparable?

>realize everything you do is meaningless and the outcome will always be the same because the narration demands so
>start slaughtering absolutely everybody
Was I the only one?

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>>377880530
The gameplay's average and some parts of the story might feel forced, especially if you know any of the twists beforehand, but I genuinely liked it as shooter meshing with psychological horror.

I think it has a lot of interesting details that most people miss on the first run.

>>377883594
How ironic.

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>>377883369
>he doesn't know that the game starts off as a generic rooty-tooty-point-n-shooty game to lure you into a false sense of security

We wouldn't be talking about this game 6 years from its release if it was just a bland, similar experience to the opening sequence.

>>377880530
Gameplay: the epitome of mediocre and generic

Story: Unoriginal pretentious garbage

>>377883625
I dunno but I mowed down all those raghead fucks that killed Lugo.

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>>377883596
The theme of rogue military imposition in a foreign land and a protagonist forced to do horrific things after getting caught in the middle of it?

>>377883596
Which of those did you not finish? Be honest.

>>377883760
I realized that I can scare them off so I did because I wanted to shoot them in their backs.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_6LvKWy5vo

>>377883760
>not holding the line

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>>377883596
Do I have to post a serious response for this, or is it just b8?

>>377880530
Nier was better at the same deconstruction trope, but granted it's not as heavy-handed because it loses the subtext of 'Jingoism and the Military FPS'

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>>377883901

>>377883596

The politics. The common theme throughout Heart of Darkness, Apocalypse Now and Spec Ops is the politics of "civilized people" in "savage lands".

>>377883953
Does it have it's own version of feeling like a hero yet?

>>377883594
autism

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrXwXuhRo9Q

>Code Red! Delta is in the area! The Marina has fallen! The whole fucking city has fallen! All remaining units are inbound, everyone to your stations! MOVE!

>>377880530
Like it

Best PTSD game

>>377880530
>Buyers Remorse : The Game : I have to make it deep to compenstate it's shitty gameplay with overrated book/movie

Okay-ish rail shooter with interesting setting

>>377883629
Say what you will about the unimpressive gameplay, the attention to detail is what really sells the game. I would love another game in this style.

>the sniper in the main menu sees everything go to shit throughout the game

>>377885115
>End of the game
>He's dead

>>377880530
Its gay shit.
Gameplay is horrendous, and no, "good" story is no excuse for shitty gameplay.
Story is retarded, forced muh feels moments, trying too hard to be dark and deep, but at the and its just pretentious teen-tier edgy bullshit

I liked it but i felt the ending was kind of a copout, i would rather actually have done all those terrible things.

I know that you still technically did it on a past lifetime, but still

>>377880530
Boring and generic as shit military shooter, with a cool little spin at the end.
I dont like playing trash for 5 hours to get one cool reveal.

>>377880530
>Play it once
>Expect too much
>Find it okay
>Play it again for trophies
>Starts hitting hard
>Find myself tearing up at Lugos death scene
In conclusion it was pretty good when I didn't want it to be

PC version played like shit

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>People think the gameplay is bad

The gameplay is 100% competent. It's like Uncharted, it doesn't do anything new, but what it does do it does perfectly well. And that's the point

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>>377885410
>i would rather actually have done all those terrible things.
Which ones? Walker already had an impressive body count by the end.

>>377880783
fpbp
>>377880826
you're a faggot.

>>377880530
Ambitious and has some neato elements but at the end of the day the gameplay is awful cookie cutter shit.

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>>377885410
Walker was delusional, but not everything that happened was made up.

>>377885602
>It's like Uncharted
What the fuck are you talking about? Uncharted's entire gimmick freedom of movement and being able to chain gunplay and melee combat together, and that's not to mention the puzzles.
Infinitely more varied and mentally satisfying than the basic cover shooting of Spec Ops.

>>377886337
Nice reading comprehension, my man.

I was ready to let him shoot me. When he say two I just instinctively pulled the trigger. Why? I don't under.

>>377886406
Nice response, my bitch

>>377886552
It takes a strong man to deny what's right in front of him.

People who claim it pretentious are the people who have different taste not necessarily are fags, that said one of my favorite tps games.

>>377880530
Where's that veteran that said it turned him into a pacifist?

His story was actually pretty touching, I saw it here in /v/.

>>377886807
I think a third person shooter really has to have a defining feature about the combat to make it worthwhile. Anything to give it depth beyond just sitting behind waist high obstacles.

>>377880530
hollywood dark movie cliche garbage that passes off itself as a game. any game director can make a game where you abuse the emotions of the player through cheap emotional pulling scenes. it takes a real genius to interconnect several endings good and bad that are a result of multiple choices the player made like in Clock Tower. Clock Tower is a superior game that is far more heart-rending than this remorse simulator.

>>377883629
>"Do you feel like a hero yet?" appears after dying a lot
>It was a difficulty taunt this whole time
>For years people assumed it was 2deep4u

PPPFFFFTHAHAHAAHHHAHAHA

>>377887847
It's part of the ending monologue.

Not that you would know.

>>377887991
There is a huge contextual difference you're purposefully ignoring between the loading screens and the ending monologue

Not only that but he literally does not say "Do you feel like a hero yet?"

>>377882096
this could easily be a /v/ banner

>>377886471
>Lmao fuck this ending I'm gonna let him shoot me
>End up shooting him
I couldn't either odd feel

>>377888347
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmNPYCNwtec

Really blasts my processing...

>>377883356
Someone made one, but it wasn't implemented

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>>377888553
daily reminder that Clock Tower has far better game mechanics centered around making moral decisions than Spec Ops: The Line.

>>377888553
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=915FESKzjWM
He sure didn't say it in here like you said, and you're still ignoring the context of "The game is insulting me in the loading screens" (/v/ crybabies) versus "The game is insulting the character"

>>377887307
>>377888689
Cool man, so does New Vegas. Who gives a fuck?

>>377880530
The story is basically Far Cry 2, itself a take on Heart of Darkness and Apocalypse, but for retards.

The gameplay is nothing special. Except for the AA12. GODDAMN that's fun. And maybe the Deagle for headshot fun

>>377880530
It's good. The only people who hate the story are the ones who are like "waaaah railroads."
No shit. They are trying to tell a story. You aren't the character you're playing, but it's putting you in his shoes and using vidya tropes to help advance the narrative.

It's mostly effective at what it was trying to do. It's not groundbreaking but it's fun.

>>377888773
>Post a video that starts after he says the line in the elevator

Nice, nice. I'm just going to ignore the blatant projection in the rest of your post.

https://youtu.be/F8taheS34qE?t=57s

>>377888778
cus clock tower is way better than spec ops and new vegas. capcom survival horror games > that other shit.

>>377881204
I tried that, the AI will initiate a fight if you don't

>>377888897
>People saying the game is bad because it insults them is projecting and never happened
Jesus Christ you haven't seen spec ops threads for very long have you

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>>377884012
If you're asking if the game does things to make you question what you're doing and feel bad about certain things then yes it does.

One of the dumbest stories I've seen

And THE WORST fucking representation of PTSP

I swear it's actually kinda insulting that the devs think you should take this game seriously

It's just nonsense, the story makes no sense and as I said the PTSP just is not accurate to life even to the smallest degree, it's awful

Let's not even talk about the plotholes or the awful gameplay

>>377889471
Who said it was about PTSD?

>>377885602
You never played Uncharted then?
Spec ops gameplay is awful and bland and no, don't tell me that's the point

They didn't make a bad game on purpose, they just made a bad game and then used that as an excuse of pushing it as art

Gameplay sucks, nothing good about it, uncharted-like my ass

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>Game tries something different to subvert a stale genre
>Half of /v/ shits on it
>Game does exactly the same thing as its predecessors and doesn't advance the stale genre at all
>All of /v/ shits on it

>>377889551
So the game isn't about effects of trauma in war?
But okay then, it's not about PTSP

Everything I said still stands

>>377889630
Why is a basic cover based TPS with a crazy "twist" at the end special?

Spec ops came at a time when people had a hard on for making games seem like high art

Everyone was praising it left and right because it fit their narrative

The game itself is nothing special overall

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It's good, and once people found out it was good everyone decided it was "over hyped". Expect to hear people who have never read Heart of Darkness say "it's just a copy-paste of the Heart of Darkness!".

Everyone makes too much noise about the white-phosphorus scene, but the game and its story has much more to offer than that.

I've beat it probably 3 or 4 times.

>>377889717
>Post traumatic stress disorder
>Post traumatic
>Post

The game isn't about going home and then getting overly pissed off about the mundanities of having to pay bills and shit, wishing you were back in the sandbox. The game is set while you're still in a traumatic situation.

>>377880530
Neat plot twist and story, repetitive and generic gameplay. I know that's part of like the meta of the game, but it's still generic cover shooter shit-for-brains gameplay that does nothing new.

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>>377886337
>>377889575
>Uncharted is a game that does nothing new, but what it does do is completely competent
>Spec Ops is a game that does nothing new but what it does do is completely competent

>>377881834
>stop talking about this game
Fuck you, you're not my real mom.

>>377889893
I literally said okay it's not

>>377889717
It had that twist when the closest thing its competitors had to interesting plot was THE GOOD GUY FROM THE BEGINNING IS ACTUALLY A BAD GUY, KILL HIM NOW IN THIS QTE.

Plus the little extras mentioned in this thread. The gradual decline of the loading screen quotes. The tone shift of the white phosphorus scene. The mindfuck hallucinations where things change as you look away from them, subtly enough that you could easily miss them. The TECHNOLOGY on display as Walker's animations and voicelines follow him down the pit of madness.

I don't remember any of this being advertised before it came out, it was nice to discover things as I was playing through and wonder if they were meant to be there or if I was imagining them.

The gameplay is functional, nothing special, not unplayable either. If you only ever play games for their gameplay, Spec Ops has nothing to offer you.

>>377889979
What, the entire Uncharted series?
You'd be a fool to compere that to gameplay of spec ops

Only the first Uncharted has gameplay that bland

>>377881912
No, the complaints about the generic, repetitive TPS gameplay are valid. The game was doing its thing and it was wonderful, but you still have to go through all of that tedious shit to get to the story bits. And the thing doesn't really start falling apart until near the end.

>>377890039
Did you even finish school or what?

>>377880530
Massively overrated meme game which people only discuss because it's babbies first "u were bad guy all along :O" story.

The only reason people still buy this shit is because they think they're going to be shocked by it. The 'shock' is mild as fuck and the game is an absolute snore to play through.

>>377890142
>"u were bad guy all along :O" story.


It's literally not that.

Gameplay: Generic as fuck FPS
endless unrealistic waves of enemies

the only good selling point is that it tries (but meagerly) to convey the idea that killing people is wrong instead of being a dumb methhead jock game like GOW

6/10

if its on sale for $2 or something go for it if you like FPSes

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>>377890172
>The people who dislike it always call it an FPS

>>377890039
What did they add? Can I climb trees? Can I actually explore?

Or are Uncharted 2+ simply also linear dumbed down actiony shooters with chest high walls with nothing else to do but mow down people using tons of auto-aim?

>>377890013
Most of that presentation made me roll my eyes, especially the loading screens

"You're still a good person..."

They were really fucking pushing it, way too hamfisted
Maybe that would have worked in a story where you had a choice to not do the BIG BAD THING, but in spec ops you do not

They actually removed the choice to do the good thing because most people didn't go for it

But then it's omission breaks the whole idea of the game really, in a way

Let's not even begin to talk about the "the good choice... is to turn the game off"

Absolutely fucking ridiculous, I guess the story of a book doesn't happen if I close it, or a movie

Does the game do some things well? Absolutely
The dialog, the twist, some of those things you mentioned, definitely

But everything I said stands, especially the story being awful and making no sense

>>377890172
>Gameplay: Generic as fuck FPS

No sweetie, it's not a FPS like your CoD.

>>377880530
Shitty gameplay, forced emotions. Just read the book or watch the movie

>>377890270
Yes you can

>>377890350
I always read that the lines were addresed at Walker. We control Walker, we aren't him. He's his own character.

When Big Smoke yells at CJ for not following the damn train, do you take that personally too? How do you enjoy games if you feel they're calling you out all the time?

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I think the fact that you are encouraged to enthusiastically slaughter US soldiers under with the idea that they've "gone rogue" like lord of the flies or something is great... especially when it becomes clear they were trying to keep the city alive and you helped to kill the few people left.

There are so many small things that make this game great, and the combat is pretty fun once you learn a few tricks like executing people to get more ammo, and using head shots to get a half-second of slow motion to plan your next move.

>>377890172
You're not killing people at all in Gears of War, numbnuts.

I don't get at all why or where this memr that you need to think this is about you you're playing a story through some dude that's not you as an mc. Is it because you have choice endings? Pretty sure they're not meant to be good

>>377880530
Simple story that modern gamer is too retarded to understand due to his insecurity and need to project himself onto a character even though the protagonist has well-defined background, causing said player to spergout when walker is criticized for doing literally everything wrong.
Player's agency in spec ops the line is equal to turning the pages of a book.

>>377890517
So what? Is that less pretentious? Is that good storytelling?
Putting the point of your entire store into a loading screen?

It just as might say

QUESTION WHAT WALKER HAS BEEN DOING, COME ON THINK ABOUT, IS HE THE GOOD GUY HM HM?

Come on
How is that confident storytelling?

But as I said the game does do some things very well
Won't deny that

Also, we're supposed to be Walker because we can make choices
We're obliviously not playing a set character

>>377880917
Why does the game need a good ending? You've never heard of tragedy?

>>377880530
Funny, I finished it yesterday.
Combat wasn't terrible, as a big shotgun guy it was nice to see a game in which shotguns aren't cotton candy throwers past 5 yards.

But it still was shooting gallery as fuck and drama felt forced as hell.

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>>377883903

>>377890541
>the combat is pretty fun once you learn a few tricks like executing people to get more ammo, and using head shots to get a half-second of slow motion to plan your next move.
You are easily impressed

>>377890694
You only make choices at the end when the story is over and that's just for variety. When you play games with choices you are not that person you're not Snake, you're not Geralt, you're not Lee.

>>377890694
Breaking Bad is much the same formula. A guy does something awful because he believes he's doing the right thing. As he starts to unravel he rationalises it to himself, thinking the ends justify the means. He continues doing worse and worse things because if he doesn't, everything he's 'accomplished' so far would be for nothing.

It's a pretty popular trope.

>>377890796
Did you play this fucking game or what?
I can recall at least 3 choices before the ending and I played this game like 5 years ago?

>>377890350
Dude you need to separate yourself from the characters in game. That's not you you're just some dude watching the show.

>>377890859
>Which hanging corpse to shoot
>Shoot CIA or not
>Kill crowd or not

These "choices" change nothing. It's as much of a choice as what gun you pick up.

>>377890859
Did you?
You choose to shoot this body or not and it turns out they were dead the whole time.

It's just flavor.

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>shot the mirror
>walked out and went back home

>>377890517
Not that guy but yes. I do feel like Big Smoke is addressing me.

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I love Spec Ops but I'm longing for a war-game that truly deals with the psychological terror of war. Such a shame SDIF was cancelled.

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>>377891018

>>377890971
Yeah.....you never actually went home man. The actual ending is killing yourself. Not even joking.

>>377890924
>>377890934
They change nothing but they change if CIA man lives and if the crowd gets shot?
It's almost like those kind of choices do make a change and would define Walker?
But they don't count because you say they don't?

Also, the corpse thing was retarded and is one of many plotholes
The only reason why the 2 guys follow Walker is because of the plot, not good writing
Them following him and taking his orders makes no sense

>>377890894
Separated or not, the story is awful

But as I said for the third damn time, the game does some things very well

>>377891119
>They change nothing but they change if CIA man lives and if the crowd gets shot?

CIA man and the crowd both die no matter what you do.

>>377891119
>Them following him and taking his orders makes no sense

That's not what guys in the military do, right?

>>377884972
This nigga gets it.

>>377891030
>press X to cry yourself to sleep
I don't think videogames are the ideal medium to explore PTSD.

>>377891164
Don't you understand that still defines Walker as a person, as a character?
That it's in these ways the game tries to get you to roleplay as yourself?
You don't know these choices don't make huge changes, but you don't know that when you first play

>>377891258
They wouldn't follow him if the story made sense

>>377891367
You are not Walker.

>>377891475
Even with that in mind, the story is still bad
It doesn't make it any matter

>>377880530

If you look at it for what it is, then it's a great game.

What it is, is a criticism on war themed shooters of the time (primarily CoD) and the way they glorify war and killing. Spec Ops isn't trying to say that killing people is bad, its saying that the reality of war and shooting people takes a heavy toll on people mentally and physically.

This is pushed by the "do you feel like a hero yet?" line, as the player is doing the exact same things they would be normally doing in CoD or Gears of War, except the game doesn't show it in the glorified heroism it normally is.

In addition, the game falls flat if you aren't the target audience. The target audience being your typical CoD fanboy who thinks FPS are the pinnacle of gaming (AKA, not /v/). The entire advertising before hand tries to show it off as an action packed shooter with Michael bay everywhere, but it doesn't actually do this.


>tl;dr if you try to play the game for anything else other than a criticism of 2007 era shooters, you're not going to have a good time.

>>377891507
>the story is still bad

wtf I hate Spec Ops now?

>>377880917
>They should just have made a tv show of Spec Ops: The line.
this or a movie

>>377891521
Dude, it's literally just a bland TPS with a forced twist and drama

Nothing more to it, people just looked into it too much

I guess they spent millions making the MP mode as another grand "criticism" huh?

What a joke

>>377891338
No? The most interactive form of entertainment wouldn't be able to convey PTSD? SDIF actually started development because Marines were tired of having run of the mill shooters like CoD portray an unrealistic image of modern war. They wanted to give players a more accurate vision of what it was like being a soldier in Iraq. Hence the developers marketed the game as a survival horror rather than a shooter. I can't think of a better medium to tell that story than something that people can actually interact with.

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>>377891643
>Implying the MP wasn't tacked on shit mandated by the publisher, like so many other MP modes in history

>>377881941
no binary domain is genuinely better in gameplay and story (tho it's about a different subject)

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Bretty gud

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>>377883629
my favourite one is the level immediately after white phosphorous scene after talking to Conrad, you rappel down a building. If you look carefully in the glass, you can see someone hanging by their hands in the reflection.

there's nothing to make the reflection

>>377891580
A story with that many plotholes and forced drama is not good
It only gets a pass because it's attached to a game

>>377891689
Sure it was, whatever feeds the art narrative

>>377891723
Binary Domain is a better game but it has the same problem of being a game with lofty goals and a heady story but mediocre gameplay.

>>377891643
>people just looked into it too much
>in a story with a shittonne of detail and narrative associated with it
>the developers saying they wanted to make a point in their game

nigger pls

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>>377891521

Plus, what another anon said, it points out how the player blindly follows 'game logic' to the point you forget you were there for a rescue mission and are just blindly mowing down everything in your path to get to some resolution that doesnt exist.

You take for granted that the 33rd are an unlimited number of faceless soldiers, so when you walk in and those guys say "we're all that's left, we surrender" it's kind of jarring to realize every other fucker either died in the violence with the locals, died of thirst or was killed by your team (until both of them vainly died in the quest to blindly move forward).

People shit on this game too much... the visuals of wrecked dubai were great, the music was great, the combat was pretty good once you got the hang of it, and the story made you feel things. That sounds like a success to me.

>>377891824
What are these plotholes you keep mentioning, pray tell?

>Sure it was, whatever feeds the art narrative
Ah yes, publishers pushing MP on developers is something very very unheard of in modern gaming, you're right.

>>377891830
nah the major problem of SOtL is that the gameplay doesn't suit the message nor the story of the game.
if you have recomendation for TPS with better gameplay than Binary i'm all hears.

>>377891643
>I guess they spent millions making the MP mode as another grand "criticism" huh?

the devs literally called the multiplayer a "cancer" on their game

>>377891894
>they wanted to make a point in their game
and they failed
also
>in a story
the fact that you refer the game as a story made me chuckle

>>377892065
I'm curious as to why you think Binary Domain's gameplay is anything special. The only interesting element is locational damage, it's standard fare otherwise.
To answer your question, Max Payne 3 has the best gameplay of any TPS I've played.

>>377891901
Also the voice acting sells a lot of those heavier moments. Stuff like Lugo screaming He turned us into fucking killers! , Radioman, Konrad, Walker as well, specially in the end I didn't mean to hurt anybody

>>377892180
I groaned when I heard Nolan North in ANOTHER game, but he really sold it as walker.

>>377890441
So you can climb trees? Show me a video of that.

>>377890924
>Which hanging corpse to shoot
kek, there is always a 3rd option sweetie
>Kill crowd or not
3rd option, sweetie

>>377892169
>locational damage
this was the main thing, the interaction with your team mates felt really good too (played it on PC with the mic so it helps).
i haven't played much TPS and every one of them were either disappointing or boring (except for the chainsaw in gears, this shit is really good) so i don't really now how high my expectation for the genre should be.
haven't played any other max payne before, is it ok to start with the 3rd ?

>>377892437
>Which corpse to shoot
>Pick neither
>Kill crowd or not
>Fire over their head which is most definitely not killing them

Wow you sure showed me by completely not contradicting me at all.

I think the devs should never have implied that their "you could've stopped" somehow meant the player stopping the game. After the initial reveal that Spec Ops the Line wasn't some bogstandard military shooter, they should've tried to sell it more as Walker's personal story, while keeping the fourth wall breaking moments a secret but never imply that the players were at fault.
>>377891821
I love the one in the end. Letting Konrad shoot you, you have a frame of Walker having shot himself or Walker mouthing Konrad's lines when its showing Walker alone in the penthouse.
>>377892293
I was honestly surprised by everyones' performance. Nolan North managed to give Walker a lot of the small emotional details.

>scene with the crowd
>try to just walk through or aim at them to get them to disperse
>reluctantly fire into the crowd
>find out later that I could have just shot up into the air and didn't have to kill anybody

Fucking video games man

>>377892542
>is it ok to start with the 3rd ?
Sure, though the other two are also really good.

>>377892574
>Wasted the crowd's water supply and condemned them to death by dehydration
Shooting them was the moral option.

>>377892675
Max Payne will feel dated. 2 is my personal favorite. 3 is good but you can feel the difference with the original developers gone.

>>377892542
>start with the 3rd
Yeah you're fine but look up a synopsis of the first two. MP3 has one of the best TPS sequences I have ever experienced later on in the game.

>when you're at the airport and the music kicks in
Vidyakino

It's an OK game.

/v/ is just retarded because the believe that the story is about THEM rather than being about WALKER.

"hurr durr the game forces u 2 do this den sayz ur bad shit game"

no, the game forces WALKER to do it and makes HIM seen like a bad person. Not you.

Fuck off.

>>377892808
This.

>Watching The Mist
>Ending scene
>HURF BLURF STUPID FILM FORCED ME TO EUTHANIZE MY FAMILY JUST BEFORE I WAS RESCUED FROM THE MONSTERS, MOST RETARDED TWIST EVER, IT'S NOT MY FAULT FOR WATCHING A MOVIE, I SHOULDN'T BE SHAMED FOR SOMETHING I HAVE NO CONTROL OVER, SHIT FLICK SHIT FLIIIIIIIICK

>>377892808
The point of the game is to make you feel bad for doing all that stuff so you're quite wrong

>>377893026
who says?

>>377893026
Well since you said so it must fucking be true, right?

>>377893026
No, it's about watching a man do all that bad stuff. The only time you're fully in control of Walker is which ending you think Walker deserves. You're basically his last sane part of his consciousness. Stuff like WP is Walker deciding over the player. You're not really in control of Walker.

>>377892579
>Walker mouthing Konrad's lines when its showing Walker alone in the penthouse

Holy shit, never noticed this.

>>377893026
It's meant to make you feel bad in the way that The Room was intended to be bad. After the fact, and only to save the creators' pride.

>>377892073
They lied to push the art narrative
They made a shit game, nothing more
Get over it

>>377893234
wtf I hate spec ops now?!?!

>>377880530
shit-tier gameplay
shit-tier characters
shit-tier story
shit-tier morale forced onto you on every single step you make

>>377892764
LOVE
SAVE US ONCE

>>377892808
fucking this

/v/ is full of retards

>>377893040
>>377893073
>>377893207
>>377893231
If you said so it must be true right?

>>377893359
>can't back up his retard claims, so retorts with "i know u are but what am i?"

incredible

>>377892808
They probably felt manipulated or tricked. Most people here would die of an aneurysm if they saw the movie Funny Games.

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>>377893359
>Man what the fuck fucking game forcing me to give the materia to Sephiroth what a fucking piece of shit now it's calling me a retard and making me sit in a wheel chair fuck this

>>377893402
>>377893436
So if I use the same argument as you it's bullshit?
Gotcha
Some leaps in logic do have to be made to actually think highly of spec ops

>>377893563
You're the one making a positive claim here. It's up to you to back up your point. If you're just making a positive claim without any evidence, it's bullshit.

>>377893563
>Be retard
>Get called retarded
>no u
>wtf i didnt won argument???

>>377893359
Assuming this isn't bait, Walker is not a blank slate to serve as the player's vessel. He's his own character who reacts how he feels. The player is just his body reacting to the circumstances.

As a whole it was good, but they should've avoided using those ridiculous loading screens, it detracted from the game imo. Music was top notch though.

>>377893621
>no, the game forces WALKER to do it and makes HIM seen like a bad person. Not you.

This was the original comment on the subject
He offered no proof, it's on him
At least follow the chain a bit before replying

>>377893703
>no proof

Except all the parts of the game where Delta and Konrad call Walker a total fucker.

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Spec-Ops's biggest problem was that it became overhyped to shit as soon as people found out about the big twist at the end of the game, followed by people who hold it up as some kind of holy grail of storytelling

The point that nobody seems to be able to even agree what it was even fucking about serves to highlight that it was writing was just shit for the sake of making people ~guess~ when they instead ended up dividing people into groups of 'it's just a game' and 'oh my god the whole game is a metanarrative about how you the player is the villain in all of this because you played the game'

Couple this with things like the repeated helicopter scene or the snipers in the scene with the corpses that can somehow kill you and your team without actually existing and it comes off more like a mess the writers didn't know how to pull together cohesively so they went 'lol all theories are correct' to save their hide

tl;dr play Pathologic or something

>>377893703
That comment was make as a counter towards the MAIN positive claim of the conversation, which was that /v/ claims that "The story is about them". The counter claim here is that it is not about the person playing, which the game never outright states. it's just about the character like literally almost any other story in existence.

It's a story. The default state is that the story is about the character, not the viewer. People are making the claim that it is a deviation that is about the viewer. That is the main positive claim here being coutnered.

>>377893680
I think it was a necessary part. Maybe the ones more obvious about the player could be avoided but I think they wanted to make sure the player was in the same mindset as Walker. Both keep moving forward while having that constant doubt in the back of their head on whether or not you're supposed to be doing all these things.

>>377893772
>the snipers in the scene with the corpses that can somehow kill you and your team without actually existing

Wait, wait this isn't right
We did this already...

>>377893703
holy shit you are the biggest retarded autist I have seen in the past 2 months

>>377893837
>>377893761
Funny how even if you were right, the story still falls apart

>>377893772
Pretty much this
The story was so full of those kind of idiotic things that I couldn't take it seriously, it wasn't good writing for a game that's about the story at all, kind of shocking really since the gameplay sure wasn't the focus

>>377893234
then why are you even here? go troll waifu threads on /a/.

>>377893772
>Spec-Ops's biggest problem was that it became overhyped to shit
I agree with this. Same thing always happens with every hyped game.
Last of Us, for all its faults, is a good game but when you have crowds claiming its the best thing since sliced bread, an opposite crowd will form claiming its the worst imaginable piece of shit, almost as if to establish the status quo.

>>377894041
>Funny how even if you were right, the story still falls apart

Maybe you can tell me about those plot holes the other guy was talking about and conveniently stopped mentioning when queried.

>>377894041
What do you mean by "the story still falls apart"?

>>377894053
Nobody says the last of us is shit except for this shithole, I hope you know this

>>377894048
Sorry I triggered you anon. Stay safe

>>377894041
How about you actually answer the original question and explain how the story is about the person playing and not Walker?

Very nice narrative experience. People blew it out of proportion because whenever a game attempts and even succeeds a bit at creating a compelling product with regards to themes and plot, faggot ass gaymurs have to hail it as the ultimate proof that vidyagaemz are art and everyone needs to know about it.
Shit gameplay.
I think people took the "THE GAME IS CALLING YOU A BAD PERSON" shit too far. It was about Walker, not the player.

Tolerably dull derivative story, intolerably dull derivative gameplay.

>>377893703
>Game released. Like 99% of media, it's about the characters. Default formula. Character in story even talk shit about Walker for his actions.
>/v/ says "GUYS ITS ACTUALLY ABOUT YOU NOT WALKER
>anon says "no, you're wrong. it's the same formula as it always was. This isn't special like you claim it to be, it's just a normal story like always
>implying anon is the one making the postive claim here

retard alert

Simply awful.

The gameplay is like a bootleg gears of war, the aesthetic is ugly (although i've always hated desert locales) and the story is just awful. I don't get why the main characters first reaction to literally every single event is to shoot it or bomb it.

>>377880530
Did you shoot the civilians? I did. Lugo doesn't deserve that death

>>377894096
>>377894107
I'll go over one briefly, how the fuck does it make any sense that the 33rd got stuck in Dubai not being able to extract the civilians when 3 guys can somehow get there?

The main premise itself does not work, yet alone the rest of it

Mediocre. It wasn't fun to play.

>>377894684
They got in and got wrecked by the storm wall.

>>377894684
>3 Delta operators got in
>Why can't an Army infantry battalion with a bunch of civilians in tow get out?

>>377880530
>Bland, generic gameplay.
>Good story.
>Incredibly pretentious and overrated metatext.

The problem is that you can't make a game that's literally all about killing enemies, add in some snarky loading text messages about how killing is bad, and then pretend it's a deep anti-war game. Because first of all it has zero depth, and second of all turning war into entertainment is literally the opposite of anti-war.

>>377894684
So this is the level of intelligence of people who vehemently hate this game. Really makes me think

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>unmemorable linear gameplay with half of a slightly above average story

It's not really something I enjoyed playing and felt rather unenthralled with both the gameplay and story halfway through. Also, the fact that people people this game vehemently without mentioning gameplay while projecting onto others as "not getting it" is pretty petty.

>>377880530
overrated but not bad. The ending was great imo.

>>377891901
>to the point you forget you were there for a rescue mission and are just blindly mowing down everything in your path to get to some resolution that doesnt exist.
You're not on a rescue mission though. You're on a recon mission. The very first thing you're told is that you should get the fuck out the moment things get hot. The generic main character just turns it into a rescue mission (to rescue someone who only exists in his head nonetheless) on his own authority.

It's still a shit game though. The only thing I really liked about it was the various little ways they displayed the gradual breakdown of the main character.

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>another Spec Ops thread where faggots talk more about how """""good""""" the story is instead of whether or not it is fun to play

>>377894684
holy shit dude please stop what you are doing

this is a fucking embarrassment

>>377895273
It is fun to play.

Now back to the story, the only thing I don't understand is why CIA acts like everyone is going to kill America for the storm. It's not like they fucking caused it.

>>377890971
Yeah, went back home with dementia and lived the rest of your days in a mental institution. And that's not even the canon ending.

>>377895024
I don't hate the game

>>377895273
That's because there really isn't any argument to be had there. Everyone who's actually played it knows that it's just a depressingly generic cover shooter with no real redeeming qualities gameplay-wise.

The only thing that leaves any room for discussion is how """deep""" the story is.

>>377894684
>answers the comments asking about the story
>AGAIN avoids answering the comment referring back to the original questions about how the game implies its referring to the player and not walker

really makes you think, huh?

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>>377895405
The canon ending is TURN THE GAME CONSOLE OFF RIGHT NOW

>>377893207
I think the real question here is, who is Willy Pete and what part does he play in the whole ordeal? Was he behind it all?

>>377895545
The real, real question is; Who is Cuban Pete and how did he become king of the rhumba beat?

>>377895273
I enjoyed it. Purely gameplay wise, it's standard but the music adds to the action, character interactions are great, moments like the mannequin are fun. For me, it is a fun game, if the story was different and more typical, I wouldn't enjoy it because it would just be another military shooter.

>>377896597
The partner AI is actually decent for once, too.

>everyone says its shit generic tps
>but generic tps max payne 3 with bullet time and jumping has the best gameplay ever
/v/ just sinks lower and lower every day

>>377896907
>people praising this garbage "game"
It sure does.

Good for a blind playthrough and then one where you know what's going on. After that there is no replay value
kinda like undertale

>>377897447
the problem with people is that they can't be objective. When I see movie/game reviews it's either 10 or a 1. This is 7/10 game, but no, it's "wow so deep 100/100", which brings out another group of assholes "1/100 worst game ever". How petty do you have to be?

>>377896907
But Max Payne 3 has great gameplay.

>>377880530
Generic gameplay, overrated story since there was no choice. I'm supposed to feel bad about throwing white phosphor at civilians but the game forced me so it did not affect me like it could.

6/10, it's a decent game.

>>377883629
Most of the points in that image are completely false

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i gotta say the game is alright in some parts but really overrated in others. for example, half the shit in >>377883629 isn't even real. i played the game through two different times, too. the game could've actually been fine itself if it didn't get extremely preachy like 'JUST TURN OFF THE GAME DUDE' or 'KILLING FOR YOURSELF IS MURDER, KILLING FOR YOUR GOVERNMENT IS HEROIC, KILLING FOR ENTERTAINMENT IS HARMLESS' and it just gets pretty dumb later into the game, though i understand (or at least hope) it was meant to be read as walker's own thoughts, but it was still preachy and got repetitive pretty quickly.

it would've been a little interesting if they added something in like far cry 4 where if you just follow orders the game pretty much ends like it would- walker gets the fuck outta there and they head back to where they came from, and maybe we get an ending cutscene, the end. but no, the game pretty much just wants to be really deep about it and doesn't at all give you the choice to go back because 'if you don't do all this bad stuff, it just becomes like every other call of duty shooter!!'

needless to say, the game's more enjoyable when you see everything from walker's point of you, but don't think what it says is pointed at you. the game made me feel bad for like 5 minutes after my first playthrough before i realized it wasn't actually pointed at me, so on my second playthrough (FUBAR mode) i went ahead and did pretty much every evil decisions i could make, and the game did get a little bit more fun, but it was all still 'eh'.

FUBAR mode was frustrating as fuck, too. the game had a few impassable moments because of dumb and unfair shit that i had to do like 15 restarts to get by, but i did complete it in the end so w/e.

in all, i'd say just don't look too deep into it like a lot of people here are doing and it's an okay game. i wouldn't say it deserves a lot of the praise it gets, but it's an okay change in story compared to a lot of other shooters.

Today, by pure chance, I learned that this game is from germany. I'm german and I had no idea. I refused to play the german dub because I'm so used to the dubs being shit. And now I feel kind of ashamed, we have a virtually non-existant local video game landscape going for us as is, and then our guys make a game with a real budget and that is not utter trash for a change - and I wasn't even aware of it and go out of my way to not use the original language.

But also I thought the subtle but serious anti-americanism was kind of revolutionary and unheard of coming from an american title so that's kind of disappointing that it wasn't even americans making it. So now I'm undecided whether or not that makes the message of the game stronger or weaker, realizing that it does not come from a place of self-reflection but rather international critique.

I cried tears of joy.

>>377883596
They're both based on the same source material.

>>377880530
Well, it's good as a surprise. Got darker as it went, and a really nice attention to detail and an amazing soundtrack.
I enjoyed it maybe because people didn't sell it to me as something spectacular, and just as an "immersive shooter with an interesting story". And if I did expect more than some really shitty mindless shooter as in the demo, I would have been probably shitting on the game as half of /v/ is doing, to the point I'd pretend the game is breaking the 3rd wall and shaming you because you play it.
But yes, as a surprise, it was really interesting. A really memorable experience. Too bad many people didn't buy it expecting nothing

>>377880826
spbp

It's pretty much the only cover based TPS that I enjoyed.

>>377896907
max payne is way better in terms of gameplay

>>377901107
They're not though. Did you play the game?

>>377899264
>overrated story since there was no choice
I don't think you quite process what "overrated" means.

>>377893772
>play Pathologic
I tried. The writing of this game is amazing. Like, everyone is insane, but yet everyone is making a fool out of you. The atmosphere is really unique, the game is stressing some times and so on.
But holy shit, is it atrocious to play. Like, interacting with NPCs is fun, but going from house to house with that walking speed just gives me the want to kill myself.

Like, I would love to enjoy this game. And by enjoying, I don't mean "having fun". But the game doesn't want me to.

>>377880530
Gameplay was meh. Levels were nice to look at, and the plot was LoL.

>>377903501
The 4th wall, asshole. Breaking the 4th wall.

>>377890694
While the loading screen messages are ham-fisted, I think conceptually they're quite clever. Loading screens have always been used to give little tid-bits of advice about the game, like certain controls or tricks. When they start slipping in these story splices, these little prods at you, the player, and the nature of what's going on, it's an interesting subversion of that feature. It can be used very well to really accomodate a shift in tone.

>>377903904
Fug, I really need to get some sleep

>>377895385
i guess CIA believed konrad gone insane and killed all those people so they wanted to assasinate him to bury it all into deep sand.

>>377894987
>>bland, generic gameplay
>turning war into entertainment is literally the opposite of anti-war
You're an idiot.

>>377895273
Declaring that fun is the only thing that matters in games is equivalent to saying that looking cool and pretty is all that matters in film. What I'm trying to say is that you're an infant.

>>377903830
I did, and so did >>377902376
On the top of my head, the trigger discipline is not real, the calling out isn't eihter, because I remember hearing KILL THAT FUCKHEAD in the plaza, which is in the beginning, but knowing the game, it could've been just a bug.

>>377904942
>the game is supposed to be shit!

If you believe that, you're the real idiot.

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>>377880530
>None of this would've happened if you just stopped. But on you marched. And for what?

>>377905321
The game isn't shit, it's just very run-of-the-mill. It wouldn't make sense for the gameplay to be fun and exciting because it goes against the game's main idea. It's critical of shooters that fetishise war and killing like it's some fun activity. The reason you don't have much choice in the game is because of this as well. When you play a shooter, you know that you're diving into an experience based around war and killing and that you'll be doing these things. You are AWARE of that. Yet you still follow along with it. Even when the game starts telling you that you shouldn't enjoy doing these things, you keep going, hoping that you might get something satisfying of it. Maybe it'll start getting fun? But it won't. War isn't meant to be fun. Their focus was very heavily on story and message, not on creating an engaging gameplay experience.

>>377905225
>>377902376
Can't confirm the majority of that, but both the thing with his finger being on the trigger later on and off the trigger in the beginning, and animations / soundclips for the melee kills as well as general interaction between your crew members, when giving orders and what not, that definitely changed a great deal throughout the game, being all formal and snarky in the beginning and desperate / violent towards the end. For me at least. Maybe it's a random occurence, maybe it only triggers when you do certain things or whatever.

>>377880530
good game

i recommend the book too

>>377905578
We could maybe say that they acknowledged and accounted for their lack of talent / resources to make the gameplay more exciting by focusing on the story more so than the shooting, and that the game benefitted from that decision, BUT the idea that it's a thing that happened intentionally and that the game benefits in any way from having boring as hell paint by numbers cover shooter gameplay with finnicky controls, nah man.

>Even when the game starts telling you that you shouldn't enjoy doing these things
It's not atrocious enough to make me stop playing because on top of the lackluster gameplay is a good story, one that would have been improved by better gameplay.

Like, can't you make the gameplay good and tell me I'm not supposed to enjoy shooting people? What's the point in making it not good? All you're showing me is other games have done it better and I'm enjoying those and I'm not enjoying yours. That doesn't work in favour of any "message" you're trying to convey. Games with less good gameplay are less fun to play, who would have thought.

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>>377892997
>The Mist
>when you realise the crazy religious woman was right all along

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>>377884751
>shootout in the scrapyard while alone
>killing everyone and surviving the assault
>hear soldier say "how is this even possible?"

>>377880530
it was epic finally a game that lets be be a bad guy that does bad stuff. the end where it lets you kill all those troops that think you were on their side was beastly

It's shit.

Praised only because the "journalists" and neckbeards were/are desperate to make vidya seem serious, respectable art. But the writing is absolute garbage and the gameplay is really bad.

>>377906385
>Games with less good gameplay are less fun to play
Yes, that is the exact point. It isn't meant to be a fun experience. When something is working more towards being artistic than entertaining, of course it's going to avoid being fun. Art is often abrasive, but that's part of its experience. It's commentary. This is a pretty well-known artistic technique that's been transferred to the gaming medium, now. I think it's good that more developers are trying to be more artistic, rather than pathetically pandering to man-children by making everything "fun". The video game community is the only community with this mind-set and its depressing because if it wasn't then the medium may be more respectable. There are a lot of possibilities that come with an interactive art-form, but nothing has popped up that really does anything with it because everyone's too afraid to do it, and when someone tries, it gets shat on by almost everyone.

>>377894661
>Lugo didn't deserve that death
>take out city's water supply
>kill their protectors
>bomb them with WP
I do feel like Lugo shouldn't have died as well, but even then the crowd's anger was justified
The whole game is vendetta after vendetta, no one is right, but no one is wrong either.

>>377907067
You're honestly saying they were intentionally making it so that every other time I try to jump over an object I punch at it like an idiot because the melee attack and jumping over objects share the same input and I need awkwardly precise positioning for the latter to trigger, that is intentional and the fact that it annoys me is desirable and sends a message over how much war sucks or what. My AI comrades do weird jiggles from point A to point B because the pathfinding is suboptimal. Intentional? AI opponents with uncomfortably accurate hitscan detection even from wide distances. Intentional...?

I can understand the sentiment that art is art and it doesn't have to be fun to be of merit. But defending what clearly is a technically flawed game with the idea that it wasn't even setting out to be fun is, frankly, ridiculous.

its basically this overly too determined guy (usual protagonist) that goes after everything. and then he finds out he shouldn't really have been too determined

>>377892997
You realise games and movies are quite different, right?

>>377905578
>It wouldn't make sense for the gameplay to be fun and exciting because it goes against the game's main idea.
That's just a fucking cop-out.

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>>377902376
>extremely preachy like 'JUST TURN OFF THE GAME DUDE'
Honestly, that never really bothered me. It might be a stab at the player mentality of always continuing forward no matter what happens, but I think it's just as reflective of Captain Walker's character arc and his downward spiral of instability. And I can appreciate it for that.

It's not like they completely break the fourth wall and undermine individual character choices within the actual game.

I consider it the sort of foil to Binary Domain, incredible story with just good gameplay, while Binary Domain is incredible gameplay with just good story.

Sort of stupid that you can't try to negotiate with anyone. It would work much better as a movie.

>>377881912
>Heart of Darkness
good god that was a clusterfuck of a book. I'd rather eat a pile of shit than read that again.

best plot in a tps

>>377911469
You do try to talk in the beginning. The response was fuck you and bullets

>>377880917
>They should just have made a tv show of Spec Ops: THe line.

I hope you're suggesting ScHoolboy Q play the lead role, because that might actually give it some redeeming value.

Decent game, weirdly over-hyped on here. Cool setting that was pretty surreal, interesting story, awful awful dialogue, decent gunplay.

>>377914830
And our only translator didn't have a lot of luck convincing the locals that we were only accidental mass murders.

>>377880530
tlou is a better movie game

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>>377880826