Let's fix this bait image. Everything that's right

This is called Fedora Core.

MGS2 would have been better as a movie
as a 'game' it's flawed beyond belief

MGS2 has god-tier gameplay what are you talking about

>>375741578
controls like shit

>>375741384
This

>>375741384
t. useless member of society.

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Shitty 1 minute job, but I think this is a slightly better selection.

>>375741936
Controls fine, what the hell are you on about. It's a massive improvement over MGS1.

>>375742834
compared to how most games control (square for melee, circle for crouch, x for jump / interact, triangle for advanced) it's unintuitive and a total mess

>>375741203
>pure shitty bait games
>Okami
Kill yourself you retarded piece of shit

>>375742214
>trying to pass games as art
>he's the useless member of society

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>Drakengard
Tarofags leave

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>>375741203
>bloodborne
>artistic

>>375743039
>doesn't have the same button mapping as other games
>mess

Go back to Call of Duty

>>375741203
Replace Bloodborne with dark souls 3 now

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>>375741203
>dragondragoon stays
>DP goes

>literally the same games that gets put on every essential x games

what the fuck is the point of making this?

>>375743039
>Game doesn't control the same as every other game
"THIS GAME IS INTUITIVE, AND IT'S STATUS AS A QUALITY VIDEO GAME IS VOID BECAUSE OF MY INABILITY TO ADAPT TO ANYTHING THAT ISN'T THE STATUS QUO, GOOD DAY SIRS"
*FEDORA TIPS*

>>375743134
this, remove meme games

>Planescape Torment
Fucking really?

>>375743560
/v/ always gives games a pass if they have a spooky atmosphere

>>375743393
>>375743569
it objectively controls like shit, it's not a matter of it being slightly different
doing simple tasks like aiming and shooting is made unnecessarily difficult due to shit design

if it's perfect then why isn't MGS4 and V just like the originals?

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>>375742736
>Removes Majora's Mask
>Adds Limbo, Journey, and Heavy Rain

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>>375743779
>>375743039
>Plays an nonconformist art-game
>Expects controls to conform to the standard

>>375743779
No it doesn't you fucking idiot.

You're also comparing a game from 2001 to games from 2008 and 2015, respectively.

>>375743873
I don't see what the issue is. I love Majora's Mask, but it's just another Zelda game with a slightly better story then the others. It isn't all that artistic in my mind.

>>375743779
Just because it isn't perfect and not MGS4 and MGS5 doesn't mean it "objectively controls like shit", you objective autist.

>>375742736
>removing majora's mask in favor of shitty non-games
>leaves bloodborne alone
Yume Nikki is a good choice, but holy fuck. Limbo? Heavy Rain? Really?

>>375741401
>one of the few video games in existence that plays to the strengths of the medium by incorporating the player and gameplay into the narrative
>"would have been better as a movie"
I fucking hate you. Retarded piece of shit.

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so we are just gonna ignore this masterpiece?

>>375743994
>play game
>expect game to play well

my bad, maybe it would have been better off as a movie if it fails as a game

>>375744003
shut up bigot lalalala playing V for the first time is the exact same as playing 1-2-3 for the first time, the old games are masterpieces and play like a dream they haven't aged at all, timeless and masterful game design

>>375744205
MGS4 wants a word, nostalgiafag

>>375744107
It's not about the quality of the game, but how they hold up as artistic pieces, which I find the choices I picked to be more appropriate. Besides I think Limbo and Heavy Rain are good games.
>>leaves bloodborne alone
To my defense, I haven't played Bloodborne so I don't know much about it.

>>375744034
The way the ideas and themes are presented in Majora's Mask are more relatable to those from japanese and hispanic cultures. Unless you're from japan, spain, mexico, or america, you probably won't understand it without reading an essay or reviewing a study on it.

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>>375744419
Sorry, but just because controls don't conform to the standard doesn't make them bad controls, just different controls, and guess what: Some people LIKE different control schemes, either for the sake of it being more satisfying to them or for the sake of trying something new. That's why people play these types of games.

>>375741203

Nocturne

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>>375744427
>But how they hold up as artistic pieces
>removes majora's mask.
>adds pretentious

>>375743779
Never said it was perfect, just that it's fine. Sick strawman buddy

>>375744530
>hold down L2, R2, L1, R1 and press square with your nose to shoot
>hurr durr sorry it doesn't conform to standards, doesn't make it bad some people like it that way

KIDF out in full swing tonight

>>375744429
Do you have any links for such things, becasue all I'm pulling up is the steryotypical "5 stages of grief' and 'how Majoras Mask is darker than you think.'

>>375744621
>>adds pretentious
The only one I can vaguely consider pretentious is Heavy Rain. How is Journey, Limbo or Yume Nikki pretentious?

>>375742834
I thought it was same exact shit, except you now had POV mode.

>>375744732
Controls are as good as they compliment the game, so it really depends on the context. For example, I found it satisfying in Let It Die where you have to hold down X and press the shoot button to reload a gun.

>>375744775
You're more likely to find good essays/video essays of Majora's Mask in spanish, here's one that was english translated.
http://elgeniomaligno.eu/majora%E2%80%99s-mask-the-game-with-a-thousand-narratives-miguel-bernardo-olmedo-morell/

There's also https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWQ9mEfBjLI

>>375741203
fatal frame

>>375741203
"I didn't play Pathologic: The Post"

It's probably actually one of the most profound games ever made. It's not a FUN game, and most people will probably not like it, which is fine, but it definitely belongs on that list.

>>375745328
The Void is better.

>>375742736
Yume Nikki doesn't even have any plot (it's just a abandonware exploration game), and any person who tries projecting their stupid theories to make Yume Nikki THE artsy baitsy game is fuccing stupid.

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>>375745435
I don't pretend that it has a plot. Its a literal walking simulator to explore the depths and confusing nature of dreams with surrealist imagery and sound. You don't need a 'deep' plot to have an artistic game.

>>375745435
>RPG maker game who's only draw is neat visuals in big empty rooms

It's a pretty shit game, but it IS very artfully done. A game can be crap but still be a solid art piece. See: OFF.

>>375741203
Fix the list by deleting it.

>>375745668
>OFF is crap
Yume nikki fags actually have to defend their own shit game by bringing down god-tier art games to their level.

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>>375741203
I haven't played MM, Killer 7 and Bloodborne, but for what I know of them, they fit in the image. I agree with the rest to varying degrees.

>>375742736
>Fucking Heavy Rain

Journey and Yume Nikki are also kind of acceptable. Limbo falls apart after the spider and wasn't really that good.

>>375745765
No, OFF is one of my favorite games of all time. I don't really care for Yume Nikki.

But as a fan of OFF, you can't seriously tell me that the gameplay is good. It is the most bare-bones cookie cutter RPG-Maker combat in existence. The puzzles and music and art and story are all 10/10, but the gameplay is just a vessel to deliver those things.

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>>375741203
What is an "artistic game"?

>>375746523
A game that obviously has a lot of effort and emphasis on being an artistic piece of work instead of just an arcade title.

>>375742736
>Heavy Rain
Opinions discarded.

>>375746523
A game made with artistic intent for artistic satisfaction.
For example Kojima tricked a bunch of Konami executives to release a powerful artistic statement on digital art under the guise of releasing the sequel to a stealth/action game.

>>375746523
It looks pretty and fedora fags like it

>>375742736
>limbo

all my keks

>>375746869
Wow kys

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>>375745765
have you ever gone to uboachan? YN dudebros hated OFF and other games, now they're just blogging "semi-hikki's" I miss my ubuu.

I don't really like calling games "art" or calling anything "art". It feels preachy and pretentious.
It's an uncompleted game on doing exploration on dreams for the lols before you kill yourself, its like calling LSD Simulator art.

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>>375745772
>Limbo falls apart after the spider and wasn't really that good.
I personally never found why people thought this. I don't think the game dips that much afterwards and there arer still lots of moments I really enjoyed like the maggots.

Still looking into Majoras Mask, but I've made the image prettier and replaced Heavy Rain with a game I thought was even more fitting.

Still looking into MM so don't worry Zelda anons. If anyone has any suggestions I'm open to looking into it or you could make your own

>>375741203
>Artistic

What the fuck does that mean and who cares?

>>375747161
>>375742736
>Getting rid of Drakengard
>Doesn't even replace it with NieR or Automata
How can one man have such shit taste?

>>375747161
>removing MGS2.
No, your entire list is wrong, and changing it for fucking Limbo? Disgusting

>>375747245
Non-arcade games that focus on using creative gameplay to tell a meaningful story.

>>375747161
Most people who play games for their artistic integrity hate every zelda game excluding majora's mask. Yahtzee from zero punctuation constantly berated the zelda series for being shallow, tired, formulaic garbage but praised Majora's Mask for its creative gameplay, philosophical merit, and uniqueness.

>>375747615
It's because anyone who tries to justify their hobby as art is pretentious and gay. Look at /tv/ and /co/ for example.

>>375747615
>Yahtzee from zero punctuation
Who? Why are you bringing this person up?

Can games that focus on gameplay not be artistic?

>>375747846
Because he can be considered a credible critic given his appreciation of games as an artistic medium even though he completely sold out and praised Bioshock infinite

>>375747935
Of course they can, the majority of the games in OP focus on gameplay.

>>375747935
Yes

>>375747935
Yes, which is why Pathologic should be replaced with the Void, because pathologic is literally a fucking novel while everything in the void is expressed purely through gameplay.

>>375741203
I think we should concentrate people who make such pictures in death camps.

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>>375741203
Updated the list but feel free to add to it

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>>375748303
>is literally a fucking novel
So, you had not played the damn thing. At all.

Look, one could easily argue that both games deserve to be included, I'm definitely not against The Void being on, but The Void is not better than Pathologic (at absolute best it's comparable), and both games achieve their brillance exactly through the incorporation of player agency. It's equally as important in both titles.

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>>375748569

>>375741203
only one or two of those games have deep mechanics

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>>375748671

>>375748805
"deep mechanics"
Most games don't have this.

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>>375748569
But its fun
>>375748671
People may disagree with me, but at least I'm not baiting.

I'm conflicted with having both Ico and SotC because while both fit, I feel it would be better to have just one to save space for a wider variety.

Also, I never realized how much Limbo was disliked here.

>>375749084
As much as I love Catherine, it's not really art. Has a nice aesthetic though.

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>>375742736
>heavy rain

>>375749310
lol

>>375741203
add Breath of the Wild

>>375749310
I'd have to disagree. I find that alongside it's aesthetic, the whole game combines its gameplay with the themes. I think visually and story wise it's a very packed game, plus it deals with topics not a whole lot of others handle.

I don't know if this is true, but I heard that in the Gook version, the two C/Katherines names were the same, so you couldn't differentiate between them while texting.

>>375741203
Is fucking nobody gonna defend Deadly Premonition?

>>375746869
Fucking ebin XD
You sure told us!

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>no deus ex or any of the ultima games

you done goofed

>>375747824
>pointing out titles that go above and beyond just being entertainment
>trying to justify anything
Quit being such a little bitch. The only people that think like that are faggots that don't actually play vidya.

I think there needs to be a clearer definitely on "Artistic Game", there's a few ways to interpret that and several games being thrown around that fit into each of those meanings.
Do you mean games that combines the story or themes with the gameplay in ways that a movie can't? Then MGS2, SH2, Undertale, even Heavy Rain/Other David Cage games, as much as I don't like them, would fit into that.

If you mean more experimental games that don't really fit into pre-existing genres then I would look more to games like ICO, Shadow of the Colossus, maybe even Deadly Premonition.

Maybe you mean a game with just a strong art direction, Bloodborne mixes things up but is very much a Souls game, however I would argue the aesthetics are really nice. Obviously this one is the most subjective of meanings.

You could also expand on that and have a game that has an unique graphical style like Killer 7 or Mad World.

This is by no means my end all list of the best I was just naming games as they came to me and there are some that could fit into 2 or more meanings.

>>375753253
Despite what most people think, "art" is a pretty simple general label for virtually any work of exceptional quality, that is publicly recognized as deserving special attention and appreciation. Historically, items displaying exceptional craft, skill and effort were most commonly recognized as "art", though through political pressures as well as gradual loss of importance of manual craft and work, emphasis has been often shifted towards items conveying meaningful or profound messages rather than to mere items of craft.

As such, items (usually intuitively or institutionally) recognized as "art" are going to still be extremely varied in regards of what gives them the right to gain special attention: from being uniquely well made to representing aesthetic ideals of their era, to meaningful symbolic quality. I think the same will apply to games.

What I'm saying, basically, is that any and all of those categories you mentioned can be sufficient to consider a game "artistic" or having an artistic merit. Art is and always has been varied - and conflicting and contested -
category. I think hoping for simplification is going to be in vain.

>>375741203
>likes MGS2 and bloodborne

>dislikes okami

at least your shit taste makes sense

>>375754367
Sure, sure, my point is that all of those meanings are perfectly valid, but if you're declaring something as an "Artistic Game", especially an essential one, you're clarifying what features about the game that are it's reason for being artistic.

I think it's fair to say more than a few people were thrown off by Bloodborne in that list but if you specify the reason as being just a strong art direction then it makes more sense.

>>375755749
>all Bloodborne has artistically going for it is art direction
I haven't even played the game and I know that's bullshit.

>>375755749
>you're clarifying what features about the game that are it's reason for being artistic.
Yes, but you don't have to have one universal set of criteria that apply to every game under the label, right? A good critic would probably take time off explaining and specifying why each individual work specifically deserves such attention, but lets face it, this is /v/ and lists like these are basically more grown-up equivalents of "who could beat Superman" arguments, designed primarily to incite conflict alone.

I think the problem with Bloodborne is the fact that art always tended to have some form of elitists and exclusive connotation (understandably, since it's literally a concept for an exclusive class of "elite" objects), which at least in modern eyes does not go very well with broad appeal and mass popularity. There is also a possible point (I can't be a good judge whenever it's valid, since I have not played much of Bloodborne) that while it looks pretty, it does lack any kind of more profound or unique features, such as philosophical or psychological observations. Again: can't really make a judgement call, but just on the looks of the game - it looks undeniably pretty, but so do so many other games these days, and the looks alone are usually not enough to warrant the game such a unique label. TW3 also has incredible art direction, yet you don't really see people proposing it it: mostly because they intuitively realize that as good as many of its aspects are, it's still a "mere" genre fiction and does not go much further beyond good looks.

>>375741203
>Everything that's right is:
>>Drakengard

die die die
10/10 dialog
I hope Taro dies of cancer.

>>375741401
>as a 'game' it's flawed beyond belief
kek

You can't be serious.
2nd best boss fights right after MGS3.

>>375741936
>controls like shit
it's not a shooter, you dumbass.
It's a stealth game.
Controls are perfect for stealth gameplay.

inb4
>Metal Grind 5
that's a terrible fucking CoD kiddie action shooter, not a stealth game.

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>>375743873
>>375744107
>>375746723
>>375746921
>>375747327
>>375749478
>List of games exclusively for their artistic merit of visual aesthetic and presentation
>Complains when shit that this doesn't apply to is removed