>is marketed around going fast >punishes you for going fast ?

yeah marketing kinda flubbed up a bit about sonic and it's been detrimental in the long run

>sonic dullard is here again

>>364791776
How?

>>364792431
Myriads of traps which are only avoidable by brute force memorizing the entire map.

>>364792431
have you ever played the Genesis games
especially 3

>>364792549
>myriads of traps which are only avoidable by brute force memorizing the entire map
Name 7

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>>364791776
>is marketed around dying
>punishes you for dying

>>364792549
I'd love to see you play a shmup or a fighting game or whatever and complain that you can't beat it on your first try
>WHAT IS THIS SHIT, HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO FIGHT IF I GOTTA MEMORIZE ALL MY CHARACTER'S MOVES AND COMBOS FIRST? THANKS NINTENDO

>>364792820
spike wall
spike wall
spike wall
spike wall
spike wall
spike wall
spike wall

>>364792549
Isn't that a good thing? It helps to create replay value.
How fun would a game about going fast be if there was absolutely nothing that could slow you down? You might as well be playing an auto-runner.

>>364792549
yeah, that was the point

You can play the game slowly or you can do it fast once you get to know the level.

I know most people here are underage and only played these games in ROMS or whatever but back then we played games repeatedly. Sonic was fucking amazing because of all the branching paths you could take to make every playthrough feel fresh. It also felt great to speed through a level you were familiar with.

>>364791776
git gud

Rewards you for being fast. Doesn't reward you for sucking.
I get the frustration a kid might have if every other game now is push a button to win. That's not an insult, I genuinely understand. I grew up on Sonic Adventure, so playing the classics is still hard. I can't beat the final boss on Sonic 2

>>364792549
>lol why would a platformer have obstacles that makes it too hard
come on man

>>364792964
Spikes are rare in the game and horizontal spikes are even rarer. The fact that you bring those up instead of badniks or even springs shows you've never played the game much and get your opinions from ecelebs.

Sonic isn't about going as fast as possible, moron.

You can tell who's under 20 based on how they see classic Sonic.

Having to die and retry a few times to get it right wasn't seen as a bad thing back in those days - in fact it was standard, a completely engraved in peoples memories from NES and arcade games. Not really sure why no games except for Dark Souls are allowed to do this in 2017, according to some people

>>364793856
Because actually challenging people and not letting them press a button to instantly win is """""""""""""bad game design"""""""""""""

It's so fucking retarded that a game for children is considered difficult to these people. I beat them all when I was in elementary school. This isn't even bragging, they're games for children, and children beat them. Heaven forbid it actually take some time to get good at a game.

>>364791776
that's why you can turn into a ball, u friggin moron

>>364793856
I don't want to retry over and over. I have a fucking life.

>>364791776
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kOAdhUlkt0

>He can't go fast

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>>364794991
>Playing any Sonic game through without dying takes about 40 minutes
>Playing a Sonic game through WITH dying and retrying takes maybe 4-6 hours
I would guess any game you've played in the last 6 months still took longer than 6 hours to complete.

There's nothing wrong with admitting that you have a diminished attention span due to the fact you're an under-21 who has been raised on mobile games, casualization, steam sales and constant internet access

>>364794991
>I don't want to actually get good at something
>I want instant gratification always
Fucking post-millenial children.

>>364792549
>Myriads of traps
Learn English please.

>>364794991
>Plays videos games
>Posts on /v/
>faps to traps
>"I have a fucking life"

Who are you trying to kid?

>>364794991
Sure you do

>only 3D game to get sonic right is a fucking fan game
What a shit show

>>364794991
please be joking

>>364795358
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/myriad
>Recent criticism of the use of myriad as a noun, both in the plural form myriads and in the phrase a myriad of, seems to reflect a mistaken belief that the word was originally and is still properly only an adjective. As the entries here show, however, the noun is in fact the older form, dating to the 16th century. The noun myriad has appeared in the works of such writers as Milton (plural myriads) and Thoreau (a myriad of), and it continues to occur frequently in reputable English. There is no reason to avoid it.
Pedantic ass.

>>364792549
please fuck off

>>364792549
>knowing the map and the physics means you will be rewarded with more speed
Literally what is wrong with this? You don't go as fast the first time you play a racing game too. Every game requires some degree of memorization.

>>364795437
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptUj2YDqmbQ

>>364792576
3 outside of carnival night zone basically gave you the fast route non-stop once you found it.

>>364795631
You don't even need to replay the entire game to get good. You just have to want to explore the level and use some common sense. Aquatic Ruin Zone is the perfect example where anyone paying attention should know to stay on the dry routes.

>>364795823
You know, nearly any game can be made to look cool when you rehearse like this. Regardless, are we seeing the same video? There's a lot of scripted loop-de-loops, grinding on vines, light speed dashing, mashing jump to chain homing attacks. Lots of flash not much substance. That kind of gameplay is not what Sonic should be in 3D space.

>>364791776
Genesis Sonic games were fine because they didn't punish mistakes with bottomless pits around every damn corner.

In modern Sonic games, regular enemies and obstacles will basically never kill you, just bottomless pits placed everywhere, even in level 1.

>>364792549
>brute force memorizing
what did he mean by this

>>364796313
I would say that it's just as hard, if not harder, to play SA2 like that compared to the Genesis games. I was showing off the "you can play it really fucking efficiently if you can git gud enough" aspect that both gameplay-styles have in common.

>>364791776
You fell for the gotta go fast meme. The best Sonic game, the fucking first one, doesn't even have spin dash.

the genesis games didn't punish you for going fast, they punished you for being reckless. you can easily burn through a level without ever slowing down if you know how to actually play the game.

>>364796497
Sonic Adventure and Sonic Rush games had quite a few bottomless pits, but I can't recall very many in Colors and Generations. There are a lot of situations in those games where falling meant ending up on the less ideal path, rather than death, just like the Genesis games. Unleashed as well, to some degree.

>>364794321
This. Anyone who says a Sonic game is hard is a fucking casual.

>>364796626
>first sonic game
>best one
please stop

>>364796723
Colors and Generations did reduce the number of them I admit, but still had em.

But Unleashed you could fall everywhere. If you didn't have a good handle on Sonic, you fly straight off the course.
And Werehog was 70% awkward platforming over pits.

>>364794321
>This isn't even bragging, they're games for children, and children beat them. Heaven forbid it actually take some time to get good at a game.
I understand you completely fampai. That was precisely my point in >>364793856. This is a game for kids (and admittedly some adults) - just kids from a different decade. There's nothing wrong with these gamegrumps "Sonic was never good" kids admitting that the real reason they don't like classic Sonic is simply that they've been brought up in the current era of internet-induced borderline-ADHD.

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>>364797180
>>364796723
There's literally no excuse for falling in a pit in Generations because it's the only game in the franchise that actually put up big glowing moving flashing signs to let retards know that there's a pit there.

This is what gaming has come to, where a fucking platforming game has to put up giant-ass retard signs so that braindead special needs manchildren don't fall into a pit in a fucking platforming game.

>>364797256
Bro, people where saying that shit looong before gamegrumps. The reason people jumped ship now is only because the series has become such a meme, that anyone unfamiliar with the series refers to the its most recent shitty outputs. Its not the grumps fault kids are parasitic leeches wanting to hop onto the new dank meme to sound cool.

>>364792998
It also clearly has an arcade style structure and that's often overlooked by critics. It didn't have a save function until 3(&k), you got Game Over and that was it. Special stages were also designed for more than one playthrough in mind. If you succeeded you got Super Sonic, earned continues, and the good ending. To acquire entry to these stages in 1&2 you needed to hold onto 50 rings and this rewarded skilled players for not using them as a crutch. It was obvious you weren't expected to unlock Super Sonic on your first playthrough, and the first two games aren't even that long.

>>364797874
>Bro, people where saying that shit looong before gamegrumps
Nobody was saying this shit in the era that Genesis Sonic was relevant - not anybody except SNESkiddies with no real arguments, that is. The console war is over now and Arin isn't here. Stop trying to retroactively force your "Sonic was never good meme", nobody is buying it. Not even game reviewers - who are notoriously tough on Sonic these days - believe that games like Sonic Mania are bad. 2D Sonic is quality stuff

>>364796313
I dunno, I think it still has pieces of what made the old games good, the game has a fast pace for a lot of it even if you aren't good, but level knowledge and experience allows a clean and quick run, the game rewards players knowledge of the map with lots of secret areas for more coins, lives and enemies. It's not like the old games weren't linear.

I'm not saying SA2 is what a 3D sonic should look like, but it's certainly not a terribe representation of it, at least in the better levels. I think Sonic Unleashed and Secret Rings did 3D sonic a fair bit better by putting it on move forward all the time mode. But I still enjoy SA2 for what it was. Despite having aged like milk.

>>364792431
You get less points by just going fast than if you go slow gathering all the rings and bugs and collectibles.

>>364798392
There's no real collectibles other than rings and you just need enough to enter a Special Stage to boost your score. That's also what the time bonus is for.

>>364798203
Never said it wasnt. I like Sonic. All im saying is that dissing sonic isnt recent. Its been around since like the late 2000s.

>Get hit in a Sonic game.
>Pick up one of the dozens of rings you dropped during mercy invincibility and you're perfectly fine.

What's the punishment again?

>>364798710
Not that anon but I'm skeptical. Aside from a few salty reviewers in the 90s, I've NEVER seen somebody legitimately dick on Genesis Sonic until the low-energy Youtube generation took over /v/.

>>364798930
You lose control of Sonic until you land, and if you were moving fast you come to a dead halt. It makes more sense than having a health system or something like Mario honestly. Still, wish they didn't just make you lose all control.

>>364793361
>>364792998
>>364792951
>>364792983
>>364792820
I have a lot of fun replaying sonic stages, but He's got a point.

Obviously, you should be rewarded for mastery, but there's no reason why it can't be designed so the "baseline" play is still the player being able to go fast, and master results in you going even faster. There's also the matter that there's just mandatory slow sections even putting aside being able to anticipate traps or not, such as with moving platforms, unless you are absurdly speedrunner tier good.

The sonic and shadow levels of the adventure games were good about this, especially in Sa2: Even somebody on the first time through the level who isn't particularly amazing is still easily capable of going fast and isn't forced to wait around, and due to 3d, can see and react to stuff ahead of them if they have the skill to do so in time, mastery just results In you finding shortcuts and going even faster.

3d inherently works better with the sonic formula, Sega just needs to stop fucking around and execute on it propely. The Adventure games were close and would have been if they had even an ounce of polish.

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If you can't theoretically clear a level without getting hit on your very first try (as in, it would literally be impossible to not get hit if you've never seen the level before), then it's a shit game.

>>364799357
You say that as if that was not possible. Take your time and you won't get hit.

>>364799275
>but there's no reason why it can't be designed so the "baseline" play is still the player being able to go fast, and master results in you going even faster
Except this is true? I guess Sonic 1 didn't follow this philosophy and nor did Metropolis Zone of S2, but otherwise, you don't have to be a first-timer to be slow in Sonic 2 and 3K - you have to be actively bad at video games, otherwise you'll still go faster than most platformers of that era by default.

>>364799275
>but there's no reason why it can't be designed so the "baseline" play is still the player being able to go fast, and master results in you going even faster.

which is why the games do exactly that?

It starts off slow, but has short burst of really fast moving parts to show the player what they can accomplish with practice. The end of GHZ 1, Pretty much all of Chemical Plant, and the snowboarding shit in Icecap. The games have those slow platform heavy sections for people who don't get it yet, and those who do can easily skip a large chunk of them

>>364799357
>If you can't theoretically clear a level without getting hit on your very first try (as in, it would literally be impossible to not get hit if you've never seen the level before), then it's a shit game
Sonic doesn't fit this category, so dunno why you're posting this tbqh

>>364799357
Good thing you can theoretically do that in Sonic. A game where you can kill any enemy by default as long as you're rolled up into a ball making the worry of running into a badnik a really stupid stupid one. Especially in the first game where the levels filled with tons of traps are the 90% platforming ones. Their level design intentionally segregated speed and platforming. If you kept trying to run at full speed in Marble or Labyrinth Zone you're beyond hope.

>>364792549
git the fuck gud

no it's actually
>rewards you for going fast
>punishes you for fucking up
just git gud kiddo

>>364791776
>punishes
?

>>364796641
This

>>364795151
DELETE THIS

YOU CAN'T GO FAST

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None of the iOS kiddies in this thread know the meaning of "punishment" in vidya. Losing your rings and your momentum is barely a punishment at all compared to the real difficult games of that era.

sad, really.

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I play video games to have fun, not be frustrated
classic sonic games are more frustrating than fun, the adventure games were far better
call me whatever the fuck you want, but this is the truth

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The vast majority of Sonic games are actually good. People just like to meme about the 2-3 outliers and then assume that every game is like it.

Use your head, git gud, and form your own opinion.

>>364801665
Man, that gif just makes me want to punch someone in the mouth every time its posted.
In what world is that funny/endearing?
Opening your mouth whilst eating is fucking grotesque.

>>364792549
Almost like the game is supposed to be challenging.

>>364801665
It's like they grew up in an era without actual punishments or challenge. They'd never last beating Battletoads for example, without using savestates

>>364801787
It's from a sitcom - the character is supposed to be retarded

You're supposed to feel disgusted at the way he eats

>>364801698
>this is the truth

There's one zone in all of Sonic 2 where the memes apply. It's an otherwise very EZ game.

>>364801665
>"omg dark souls is so punishing"
>You just lose your current stock of souls, which is fucking nothing since you can just farm some more at any time, and the game is perfectly beatable at low levels anyways.

I would love to see how people would react if Souls implemented an actual lives/continue system.

>>364791776
I liked 2 more than 1.
Also the music is great.

Playing sonic 3&K back in the day felt seamless and fast. Once you completed a few levels you knew where all of the bad shit *could* be. I remember blazing through carnival night and the ice level. That game was actually sweet af

>>364801978
Not only that, but imagine there was an achievement that would unlock content for the sequel, but only if you beat the previous game without dying or using continues.

>>364801891
>>364801914
being challenged and punished isn't fun, and the only reason older games were like this was a carryover from the arcades trying to get as much money out of you as possible with retries, or because of memory limitations and the lack of an ability to create more meaningful content to put in the game

games are supposed to be a braindead and fun hobby you do in your free time, unless you're fucking autistic or masochistic

>>364802367
>being challenged and punished isn't fun
Says you, but I guess fun is subjective. To me, beating a hard game is very fun. Gives you a sense of accomplishment.

Can't have everything spoonfed to you, anon

>>364802367
the challenge is the fun man, and once you clear it under your own ability, it's an amazing feeling.

Not even memeing, but you seem like the kind of guy that prefers smartphone games & modern shooters.

>>364802589
>>364802668
I hope you realize that the kind of games you wish for were only difficult because of archaic design limitations or jewery

regular life is challenging and unpleasant enough, why do I want to be frustrated to the point of anger doing a hobby that's supposed to take my mind off of it and let me have a good time?
you say the reward is satisfying but going through tortuous trial and error 90% of the time until you get to the very end for a brief sense of accomplishment (which comes from the relief that it's finally over) sounds fucking insane and not fun at all

>>364796497
You're giving me flashbacks to Sonic Heroes. I swear half that game was rail grinding over bottomless pits, 40% was hunting down that last collectible for team Chaotix and 10% was platforming.

>>364803343
It's a puzzle of muscle memory and awareness that's fun to solve. Do you not enjoy doing crosswords or sudoku?

>>364801754
>disagreeing with the underage memesters
You wanna get memed at, son?

>>364803942
of fucking course not, people actually like doing those things?

>>364803343
This might surprise you, but some people don't find challenge tortuous or enraging. And if we're applying this to fucking 2D Sonic right now where you can attack from any angle by default and can take nigh unlimited hits then that's just sad.

>>364804280
Yes, yes they do.
http://www.websudoku.com/

To think otherwise is being willfully ignorant.

>>364795358
The irony is almost palpable.

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>>364792549

First you morons say Sonic is too easy and it was literally hold right to win

Now you morons are saying Sonic is completely bullshit and impossible to go fast

Be consistent.

>>364804419
I don't care how other people feel about it, I'm not other people
being challenged isn't fun and makes me mad

>>364794991

Sonic 1 is literally an hour long

>>364791776
>listenting to marketers
>ever
really makes think

>>364802367
>being challenged isn't fun
So you literally admit you're 12?

>>364805038
Get anger management and stop being a baby. Do you get upset and frustrated when you do cooking too?

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>>364804949

Made some key changes

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>>364795151
>those bounces right before the boss of GHZ3

>>364805240
I don't cook gaylord
cooking is for women
>>364805215
strawmanning the majority opinion is pretty dumb
why would facing adversity and failing ever be pleasant unless you had actual mental issues?

>>364805650
Ha! Oh man. This guy.

Enjoy you teens and 20s dude.

>>364805515

Do people seriously get hit by the starfish? I constantly take Shellcracker's fist to the face, but those little guys have always been a non-issue.

>>364805650
>why would facing adversity ever be pleasant unless
you had me up until this point. There's no way anybody legitimately believes what you pretend to believe

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>>364803343
>regular life is challenging and unpleasant enough, why do I want to be frustrated to the point of anger doing a hobby that's supposed to take my mind off of it and let me have a good time?

Do you hate movies too?

It's threads like these that make me remember we now have two generations of gamers at least that can't accept having to actually play a game and learn how it works, master its courses and challenges and so forth.

I hope Mania isn't too easy just so they complain more.

>>364805748
>look at me I'm so old kids these days lel
being proud that your parents forgot to use a condom before other people is a pretty empty source of pride
also if you're actually older than 30 and still on /v/ you are a far bigger loser than anyone else
>>364805807
sorry to shatter your worldview, but you're talking to one
believe it or not most people also think this way, otherwise shit like the mobile industry wouldn't be so retardedly lucrative

>>364791776
Name 5 levels that punish you for going fast

>>364806048
>people don't want to work to have fun instead of just having fun the whole time
sounds pretty reasonable
>>364805896
why the hell would I hate movies? what does that have to do with anything?

>>364806048

>IGN Review
>A beautiful game with a catchy soundtrack that fails to update the classic formula to today's standards. Sonic Mania is a game that claims it's a celebration of the speedy hedgehog, but it stumbles upon the roadblocks it places in the way.

>>364806408
the mobile industry isn't challengeless, it's filled with gatcha and doing the same shit over and over and over and over and over
endless runners intentionally try to eventually swamp you with so much shit that you inevitably die so that you'll buy revives with real money, 'strategy' games and RPGs ask you to buy chances to get real strong characters to bend the grind and challenge over their knees

that's not being a gamer, that's just getting extorted of money by one's egregious stupidity because they don't want a challenge or grind which is the entire point of those damn things

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>>364806592

>>364795151
I like how you have to completely glitch through Marble Zone to make it not look like an absolute slog of a level.

>>364806706
grinding isn't challenging at all, it's just mind numbingly boring
again, older arcade style games were just as bad with extorting people of their quarters by being stupidly hard and causing you to die very easily
the method of jewery was different, but it was still fucking jewery and no better than anything today

it's just that for actual games released these days people have higher standards and refuse to spend a chunk of money upfront for a game designed with that archaic style of difficulty, because newsflash, it isn't fun

people just want to sit down and have a good time with a fucking video game, not a second job that they paid to work at until it becomes fun

>>364805515
>>364804949
>Implying you can't just bounce off the buzzbombers in either version and bypass every """""hazard""""""
Jesus /v/ is even terrible at games when it comes to hypotheticals.

>>364807290
then how the hell is Dark Souls, a franchise that past the first game practically advertises its high difficulty, such a prominent

Reviewers don't like challenge, especially if they have so little time to work with one game, and sure, a lot of people opt for Mario games, FIFA, Call of Duty or quick and easy to play shit, but you can't just go and deride all difficult games as being awful and archaic because it doesn't appeal to you.

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>>364807495

That's implying /v/ is even good enought o combo bounce

>>364807504
Dark Souls is only popular against autistic people. That's why you see everybody sperging about it here, but it's not super popular. Bloodborne is the best selling game and it only sold 2 and a half million units.

Why would I want to train myself to the lightning fast reflexes and split second calculations necessary to go fast? Each level would require about an hour of death grinding to beat, or more. ...just so that you can toss all that training aside and go and do more grinding at the next level. Where's the gameplay in that? What's the use in wasting that many synapses on something so useless, instead of doing homework or lifting weights? Those are actual worthwhile challenges.

>>364807730
Ok I kekd at this edit.

>>364807769
are you implying that sales numbers alone mean something is a niche series, despite the mainstream hype and advertising Bloodborne and Dark Souls 3 got

because at this point your argument's devolving into 'only autistic people like challenge'

>>364791776
Sonic CD was particularly egregious about this.

>>364792431
The first game was full of really slow, tedious platforming sections with comparatively little in the way of wide open loop-de-lopp filled areas.

I remember 2 and 3 not being nearly as bad about it.

>>364807504
dark souls is notable because it's literally the only modern game series designed that way, and even then it's still niche

I think anything intended to be fun that ends up being frustrating because of its design should rightfully be called a failure, and again what other perspective do I have besides my own? If it just makes me angry I'm not going to pretend it's good just to appease the fucking masochists that post here
2d sonic is bad, and I'm not parroting e celebs because I've actually tried to play them and always lose interest extremely quickly, whereas I could pick up the adventure games and have a great time still
a game who's appeal is going fast benefits from actually being able to see where the fuck you're going, who would've thought

>>364807817

Sonic games aren't even that fucking fast. Mario games scroll faster than Sonic games though, the movement mechanics and blocky square design just doesn't lend itself to flow very well.

If you can't fucking react to an enemy or an obstacle quick enough in a Sonic game then your ass should be playing an RPG or Harvest Moon.

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>>364807730
fixed that for you

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>>364805515
Even more accurate.

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>>364808250

What are you, a fucking masochists?

That's too hard

>>364792431
Low resolution graphics on a 4:3 display.
Sonic was too ahead of its time for the technology.

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>>364791776
>is marketed around jumping
>punishes you if you jump

what the fr*aking h*ck??!?!?!?

You can go fast
The marketing didn't say you don't have to avoid traps

>The marketing actually made fun of idiot grannys not understanding the hip new trends of speedy difficult game play for grown up kids over Nintentoddler games
>/v/ is now the granny and Sonic is too hard for them
Poetry.

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Why is Sonic 2 so difficult?

>>364809205
jokes aside i always loved that part about 1-1, the way they go from a regular pit to an endless pit, always made younger me feel nervous

>>364809831

Sonic Advance 2 will always have the best implementation of boss fights in Sonic games

>>364809831
You can do the same thing with Metal Sonic too.

>>364809946
That's not Sonic Rush Adventure

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>game has a green hill remake
>you cant do the ramp into ring trapezium via sick bounces

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>>364810003
Yep. Still can't quite figure out the timing to quickly beat the Death Egg Robot from behind, though.

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>>364810174
the sweetest bounces

>>364809559
This shit makes me madder than anything, and I've seen it a LOT from games journalists nowadays.

>I always thought Sonic was pretty bad, and the games are objectively badly designed
>the only reason anybody liked them was because of marketing
>everybody who wasnt dumb liked MARIO, which is a technical masterpiece!
>*sniffs own farts*

>>364809559
Imagine if Mania had been announced for the Switch as well.

all platforming and no fast makes sonic a bogus boy

>>364811316
It is.

>>364810094

>Sonic Rush Adventure boss fights
>Good
>Wait for the heavily telegraphed and slow boss attack to complete that exposes its weak point
>Repeat for a billion years because it's a health sponge

The best sonic games are the ones that separate speed and platforming (sonic 1, sonic unleashed) or go balls to the wall with their speed (advance 2, ds games).

Prove me wrong. No one wants to go fast for 3 seconds only to be interrupted by menial platforming and people making careful jumps dont want to be launched forward and lose control for a few seconds.

>>364812497

There's only two Sonic games that do what you describe, Sonic 1 and Sonic CD. Everything after those two was balls to the wall. If you had to do slow platforming segments, it's because you were shit at the game.

I have no idea why everyone wants SEGA to focus on the platforming portion of the series. They were hardly anything to write home about and the game's controls made slow precision based platforming more of a boring chore than something intense like Mega Man.

You can regain speed as quickly as using the spindash, or don't loose speed by not being shit at the game.

>>364812881
Nah sonic cd is generally faster than sonic 2 or 3. If its not direct ground speed then its because youre being launched in the air at wild velocity. Sonic 2 and 3 start out at a decent pace but the second half of each game is filled with menial platforming where youre forced to tip toe so you dont get stopped by something you cant see.

Mania for this reason looks better, the levels seen so far dont have randomly placed obstacles in the worst spots imaginable and theres a lot more free space to just zoom through. Being widescreen helps tremendously. Mania is the 2D sonic game that sonic deserves and its sad it took this long, but its finally here.

For your second point, I agree. You can see the sharp drop in quality in levels from unleashed and colors/generations, where the boost engine they use which is designed for speed but then gut it all in favor of the most bland 2D platforming possible. I'm not against it, its just a terrible use of the engine.

>>364813276
>For your second point, I agree. You can see the sharp drop in quality in levels from unleashed and colors/generations, where the boost engine they use which is designed for speed but then gut it all in favor of the most bland 2D platforming possible. I'm not against it, its just a terrible use of the engine.

I blame the classic fags and platforming babies for this shit

Unleashed's level design was mostly constrained a corridor, but the game had a ton of movement techniques that made it incredibly fun to maneuver around enemies and obstacles. Not to mention that the game also had some legitimate 3D sections.

Colors had some horrid 2D sections with a bunch of awful platforming. Starlight Carnival is carried entirely by its fantastic looking opening (although dull to play) and great music, but as soon as the game tosses you into the 2D platforming section, it turns into a 2D platformer game that reminds you more of a fan game made in Multimedia Fusion instead of a Sonic game.

Sonic Generations somewhat improved on the 2D segments and making movement techniques important again, but it still chopped the 3D sections and made them nothing more but glorified boost, grind rails, and transitions to the next 3D section.

It's like they're too afraid to just fucking outright embrace the formula they started in Unleashed and just go balls out. Turn that shit into fucking F-Zero already.

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The only good Sonic game is Sonic 1
Everything else is hentai shit that killed the series

>>364813892
Agree with all this man. They birthed something brilliant from Unleashed by taking the best part of 06 (mach speed levels) and making them actually functional, beautiful, and the fastest thing in the series for real this time with an immense amount of detail. Its always a speed runners wet dream, with tons of exploits both in the scripting and controls to mess around with. And for regular runs its still always a blast too, even with simpler things like just drifting around for barrier breaking speed boosts. They went balls out with the formula they started in Unleashed...with Unleashed. It was everything after where the classic and platforming babies cried that Sonic was for once going fast as fuck.

I always saw SU as a 3D version of Sonic 1. Even the slower half of each game (werehog levels and labyrinth/marble/spring yard), while slower yes, are not inherently slow. Sonic 1 is designed with old arcade sensibilities but the slow levels can still be gotten through quick with skill and knowledge. As for the werehog levels, the hot dog time trial challenges prove that they can be beaten in a few minutes rather than the autismal 40 minute runs or whatever retards were getting before. I mean shit, chun nan night time trial 3s target time is 3 minutes, shorter than even some day stages.

Sonic 1 and SU get a lot of hate but I think its just because no one understands them, their design. Its not haphazardly confused decisions, its all deliberately planned. Speed only or platforming only entries are like I said, fine with me to but they need to use a better engine targeted around that goal. But taking the Unleashed engine and then fucking making Colors levels? Or the Rush engine and making Sonic 4? Who the fuck thought that through and said ok? Fucking gooks man

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>>364792951
Now I want to see casuals playing R-Type and getting butthurt about enemies spawning behind you or right on top of you

>>364815562
Well bullet hell and fighting games arent for casuals to begin with

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>dying in a classic sonic game
>rings fucking everywhere

If you ever die in a classic Sonic game then you deserved it for being terrible at video games. It literally sets you up to never be able to die unless you're an absolute tool

>>364813892
Classicucks are a blight.

>>364818742
>"but dude shut the fuck up! you have a totally brand new 3D game coming up so everyones happy man!"
>it has classic sonic and will be 2D again
>"SHUT THE FUCK UP ITS 3D MAN BECAUSE I SAID SO!!! LOOK ITS 3D FOR 10 SECONDS HERE!"

>>364819726
B...but we need Classic Sonic because we need to get back to basics! Never mind that we've been getting back to basics for over a decade!

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>>364821398
Every time

If its not that then its fucking "BUT THEY STILL NEED TO NAIL SONICS GAMEPLAY!"

Look I enjoy the classic games but the classic fans are the worst part of the entire fan base. At least chris chan exists in his own bubble and doesnt influence the output of the games they release. Now we cant even have proper 3D games or stories that go somewhere otherwise the classic autists get triggered and start sending death threats to sega

>>364821398
>>364821997
You know Classic fans aren't holding a gun to SEGA's head right? Half the stuff you people blame Classicfags for is SEGA and Sonic Team's fault. No Classic fan asked for Sonic in 2017, we would have been perfectly fine with just Mania.

Or do you just need a scapegoat since Modernfags like you love sucking Sonic Team's dick?

>>364821997
My favorite is
>So you're saying you want another 06?!

The problem with all of the Sonic knock offs seemed to be that they kept the ability for the character to run through the levels extremely fast but made it impossible to do so
Like Bubsy, you can go hecka fast but everything kills you in one hit and you die from fall damage unless you glide

>>364822253
It goes both ways. No modern fan asked for classic in 2017 either and no one is mad that mania exists. Its great that a full fledged sequel is being made. But classic has no reason to exist in 2017. Its a fact that classic babies shit their pants when things dont go their way and are probably the reason why the series has stagnated since the 10s. Im a both fan and I fucking hate sonic team right now, and I imagine exclusive modern fans have nothing but hate for ST right now too.

>>364822290
Thats another good one. If its not spongebob sonic then its final fantasy princesses beastiality sonic. No medium like sonic adventure or sonic unleashed can exist under their vision. If its not baby worlds and sounds and designs its instant edge, another buzzword thats quickly losing its relevance if it already hasnt.

>>364822253
>Classicucks screech incessantly about how much they hate 3D and want nobody but Sonic in their games and want no story
>Sonic Unleashed comes out; has nobody but Sonic and no story
>reviewers and Classicucks chimp out and rate it worse than 06, a game that literally wasn't finished
>Despite being given what they want, Classicucks once again screech about how much they hate 3D and want nobody but Sonic in their games and want no story
>Colors comes out; has no one but sonic, no story, and is 2D.
>Despite being given what they want, Classicucks once again screech about how much they hate 3D and want nobody but Sonic in their games and want no story
>Generations comes out; has sonic only, no story, is 2D, AND has a Sonic based on Genesis Sonic.
>Despite being given what they want, Classicucks once again screech about how much they hate 3D and want nobody but Sonic in their games and want no story

Yeah, the 24/7 hatefest by the gaming press and Classic fags doesn't have anything to do with Classic fags being pandered to exclusively for 11 years.

>>364822882
Wow, it's almost as if maybe games like Unleashed and Lost World have problems of their own! No, that can't be, Sonic Team can't do no wrong. It's the Classicfags who are at fault. The guys who in reality don't do anything but post on Sonic Retro and make romhacks and fangames. They're actively killing Sonic!

>>364823141
Theres almost nothing wrong with unleashed and lost world is as shitty as it is because they again did nothing but try to pander to classic kids but still used modern sonic as a base. Kiddy aesthetic, kiddy music, kiddy story, and tons of 2D.

>>364822774
>I imagine exclusive modern fans have nothing but hate for ST right now too.

I definitely do. I don't hate the Genesis games or anything but I'm absolutely skipping Mania and 2017 since buying them is telling SEGA "Yes, I'm okay with this direction for the series forever. I'm okay with nothing but nostalgia bait and Pontac/Graff dialogue."

>Thats another good one. If its not spongebob sonic then its final fantasy princesses beastiality sonic.

I don't even understand why the bestiality maymay picked up. She kissed him because she cared about him and wanted him to not die; that doesn't mean she wanted to jump his hedgehog bones. Bulma was way lewder with Goku in Dragon Ball and she wasn't called a pedophile.

Besides, Human/Animal relationships in animation go all the way back to Betty Boop and Bimbo; even if they DID date (like Sonic and Madonna originally would have,) so what?

>>364823607
Alright man ive been agreeing with you on a lot of things but I draw the line at defending 06s story. That is actually one of the few times the series jumped the shark with the melodrama and realism shit and it shouldn't happen again. Not to mention time travel plots suck, the characters were very robotic, and sonics story was nothing but chasing elise down after she gets kidnapped like 5 or 6 times while shadow and silver actually get shit done

>>364824349

I didn't defend the story, I just said the endless meming over one thing was retarded. Besides, Sonic 06 was a game that had like, literally 1/4th of a team and 1/3d of the dev time it was supposed to. I don't think anybody could write anything coherent under those constraints.

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>>364823436
>Theres almost nothing wrong with unleashed

>>364824676
Now thats something I can work with. 06 had no team and no time to make it because of business shuffling around. But most people dont know this and think they had a trillion dollars and 800 people working on it and yet it still turned out bad.

Its an alpha of a game hacked together in about a year or sos time. As far as rushed projects go, its actually pretty impressive and theres a good amount done, but obviously a lot of shit is still missing or incomplete

>>364807817
>Learning a level's layout and applying what you know about the movement to make a route, then practicing your execution so it flows smoothly and constantly optimizing your speeds by discovering new tricks is "grinding"
Is it only true gameplay if it requires no effort or thought?

>>364821997
>Now we cant even have proper 3D games or stories that go somewhere otherwise the classic autists get triggered and start sending death threats to sega

Or maybe it's because...I dunno. No one fucking likes the 3D Sonic games. If anything classicfags are the saving grace of the franchise. Had it not been for them shit like Colors, Generations, and Lost World would have never happened. Sega would have kept shitting out garbage because it was "okay". Maybe they're vocal and obnoxious because they don't want to see a series that they grew up with get treated like shit and die, and maybe they make all these rom hacks and fangames to try fulfill their own dreams instead of harping on Sonic Team's attempts. But no, it's because they're manchildren desperate for nostalgia and the death of the franchise.

Fucking wow

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>>364816339
>R-Type
>bullet hell

>>364791776
>I like fast things and I thought that it would be nice to create a game where the more skilled you become, the faster you can complete a stage. Games back then had no backup or saving system, which meant that you had to play right form the beginning every time...As a result, the very first stage would be played time and time again, making the player very skilled at it. So we thought it would be nice if this would enable the player to complete those stages faster and that's the basis of Sonic's speed. We also thought this feature would help differentiate Sonic from Mario.
t. Yuji Naka

https://info.sonicretro.org/Game_Development:Sonic_the_Hedgehog_(16-bit)#Development_Process

tl;dr:
git fucking gud

>>364801754
>The vast majority of Sonic games are actually good
You have that backwards. A vast majority are simply mediocre. But only a small handful are irredeemably shit.

>>364825083
>If anything classicfags are the saving grace of the franchise. Had it not been for them shit like Colors, Generations, and Lost World would have never happened.

All of those games sold worse than 06.

>>364822882
>Classic fags being pandered to exclusively for 11 years
what?

>>364826009
Sonic 06 came out in 2006. Every game after that has been cutting more and more out of the franchise to please Classic fags.

>>364826070
And it turns out all they had to do was hire some.

Don't blame classicfags for Sonic Team being too incompetent to get it right the first time.

It's funny though that you're throwing a fit over Sonic Team siding more with its original fanbase over the kids it roped in as a desperate attempt to save their doomed final console.

>>364826070
Let's run down the list then
>Focuses exclusively on Sonic to allow for more focused gameplay and plot
>Re-introduces Eggman, the main villain of the series as the major threat of the game
>Brings back features such as Super Sonic

Wow, such RUINOUS decisions.

>>364826070
I don't know about that, lets take a look at what happened after 06 for a few years

-the storybook series was made, secret rings in 2007 and BK in 2009, while both being average at best, they took the series to fantastical places and used the cast really well and were decent party games if you played the multiplayer
>rush adventure comes out in 2007, an improved sequel to rush in every way with tons of variety, improved level design, an expanded story, and lots of content
>unleashed, easily the biggest budget and arguably the biggest sonic has ever been spanning a globe trotting adventure with high quality music, tons upon tons of content/replay value, 2 fleshed out gameplays, and supported with dlc after it launched

Really, I'd argue sonics last year where he had any semblance of identity was 2009. Everything that happened after that has just been really shallow, either gameplay or character wise. Yeah, for me sonic was 1991-2009

>>364807290
There are a lot of mediums you can engage with passively, don't try to turn video games into yet another one of them because they never were like that. Fun comes from learning and improving, there's nothing engaging about a game that hands you the victory. It turns into a dull mindless process that you won't even remember after a couple of hours. It's amazing how common this casual mentality is on /v/ nowadays. The same mentality that's been ruining games across genres for over a decade now.

>>364826070
Well everyone consistently praises the shit out of classic Sonic unless they were IGN, who flipturned last year and tried to make Sonic out to be always bad. Every 3D game has its share of criticisms and bad points, and even Colors and Generations have jackasses that spread around the "hold boost to win" and Sonic Cycle memes regardless of game quality.

It also helps that the games have been more successful since then, besides Lost World. So there's no reason to stop in the eyes of SEGA, who are a stingy Japanese developer/publisher like any other, just not absolutely stupidly chaotic about throwing away money hoping to make money like Capcom or Konami.

>>364826352
Unleashed was good but it was absolutely pandering to classicfags, since they cut out every character, made sure only Sonic was playable, and had 2D sections.

>>364826070
I'd argue it was both necessary, and well worth it, in order for Mania to be a thing. And Mania being a thing is good. The brand could use some dignity.

>2008: Unleashed integrates 2D gameplay back into the main series
>2010: Colors puts the story in the back seat; Sonic 4 "revisits" the Mega Drive setting but botches the gameplay
>2011: Generations brings back Classic Sonic but again botches the gameplay (with some improvement)
>2017: Mania finally gets it right

Now their further classicfag pandering in Sonic Team games can fuck off. I'm no fan of Classic Sonic being in 2017. It's not necessary.

Iizuka/Sonic Team can go back to dumping their weird experiments all over Adventurefags' chests, and I'm fine with it. I've got mine now.

>>364791776
I'd honestly rather die and restart the level than get bounced back by fucking springs.

>>364826357
The thing is, people aren't willing to put the time in to understand a game anymore. Since there's a wealth of entertainment everywhere the appeal of a game is based solely around first impressions nowadays. As kids, we were limited in actual quality entertainment that what little we got we stuck with. Games have been forced to turn more casual to appease this new generation only interested in games as a "distraction", rather than a hobbie or even a passion.

>>364826070
Most Adventurecucks are Nintenbabbies who started with SA2B on the Gamecube. That was in 2002.

You fags barely had a 4 year reign. You're not that important. Get the fuck over yourselves.

>>364826623
I don't really see it as classicfag appeal. One of the rising points of content for everyone, even modern fans, was the excess of characters. Meanwhile the game shoehorned in the Werehog, and 2/3rds of the game were a mediocre platformer that played nothing like a Sonic game mixed with a poor man's God of War for kids.

Also the most annoying battle music known to mankind. You don't even have to open the video to remember the opening strings.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlNa7RQju7Y

Mega Man X and Zero games are the best go-fast games.

>>364826880
Race the Sun is basically Sonic's boost gameplay done right.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDLfSg3YwVQ

>>364826835
>Sonic 1 came out in 91
>Adventure came out in 98

19 of the 26 years Sonic has existed has been post-Classic, Classicuck.

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>>364803343
>>364802367
>>364805038
>>364794991
>>364807290
>>364807817
>>364821997
>>364822882
I don't know or care if this is bait, but holy fuck, this is today's teenager in a nutshell. The whole point of a game was to play it, learn what to do and not to do and learn its mechanics and gameplay. I learned that you could run in Mario by holding the B button and that saved me from falling into pits due to low momentum. I learned that Sonic gains momentum and a form of attack by pressing down when you have enough acceleration. That's when it becomes fun.

That meme where people die on the first goomba is a reality, just from the faggot(s) in this thread.

>>364826836
>shoehorned
>2/3
>mediocre
>god of war

theres those buzzwords again

>>364827149
You didn't read half the post you quoted

>>364827223
The werehog isn't fun. Or at least it's fun for a bit but grows into a chore with too many levels and long ones at that. There's your buzzword-less response.

>>364826357
learning and improving is not fun, sorry
you saying it over and over isn't going to change how I, or the apparent majority of people these days looking to play games feels
learning and improving is fucking work

>>364827293
then you're a monotonous human being with no proper sense of growth or evolution mentally

>>364827270
And you can't form an argument, too challenging.

>>364827275
>to many long levels when it has an equal amount of act 1s as sonic
>nevermind that sonic has another act, sometimes 2 extra acts for every level while the werehog only has 4 extra levels
>long levels

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLmUR_sBFB0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crbC_mQSLKg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fz8wg49o7x4

>b-but theyre hard as shit the first time!
>sure, maybe, but once you replay them and learn the level and come back with more power and combos its not so hard-
>replay? HAHA WHATS THAT FAGGOT? YOU JUST HAVE TO REPLAY CLASSIC SONIC TO GET...oh....

>>364827016
>Sonic 1 came out in 91
>Adventure came out in 98
>this "Classicfag fellating conspiracy" from Sonic Team apparently started in 06

If this anon's >>364822882 persecution complex is taken seriously (and it certainly is by the retards calling themselves THE True Sonic Fans who know the ONE and ONLY path to True Sonic Spirit™), apparently Sonic has only NOT been "classic" or "classic pandering" between 1998 and 2006.

A mere 8 out of Sonic's 25 years, and most of you furry Nintendo kids were only there for the second 4 years of it. Which is fucking ironic. Which was my entire point.

>>364827293
>learning and improving is not fun, sorry
There's a lot of psychological research that says otherwise. Also that's pretty fucking pathetic, guessing you don't have any other hobbies then.

>>364827369
>>364827524
this is how the public school system raises people
thanks for insulting me though, really helps change my outlook

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>>364827293
you have my pity

>>364791776
Sonic needs the ability to wall jump and vault over smaller objects to preserve momentum, would compliment the core gameplay mechanics already in place.
I'm actually not certain why these aren't already features, but they make too much sense I suppose.
Sonic's new "drop dash" in Mania will alleviate momentum loss from falling or those half pipe sections where you fall to a stop.

They need to design the levels and Sonic's mechanics to allow for complete preservation of momentum. There's no need for boosting when those two factors are present.
Also
all the Sonic games that feature it are absolute garbage

>>364827596
I come from the same public schooling system and I still fucking enjoy my games enough to lament when they don't have actual complexity to really get into. You're just a boring person.

>>364827624
The games were intentionally designed to only utilize a single button so that playing them would be simpler. Those additions could potentially screw with the core gameplay. I think they'd be pretty cool to have, but it'd be tricky to get them to work properly.

>>364826352
FYI, Secret Rings was being made by the B Team at the same time as 06, but they had more time to finish. The plan was to originally port 06 to Wii but it wasn't powerful enough, but they had a contract so they made a new game for it.

>>364827748
weren't those the same guys that made colors? it uses the same engine, and it's on the wii like all their other projects.

>>364827717
Wall jumping can be done with well timed A presses and vaulting can be done by well timed B presses.
The B button+ Down D Pad is already utilized for the spin dash, that's using only two buttons for some very helpful abilities.

>>364791776
You gotta go fast while avoiding traps.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VVQPSrHGa8

>>364827809
Pretty sure Colors was made by the A-team at Sonic Team, but I could be wrong. Even then, some project leads switch off between games, so Unleashed and Generations share certain leads while Colors and Lost World share the others.

>>364827596
Seriously, do you not have any hobbies? I cannot imagine anyone seriously believing that learning and improving at a difficult task isn't fun if they ever had any sort of hobby creative or not.

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Sonic tends to be pretty fair as a whole.

Save for one thing.

>>364828040
unless you're playing the ios version, which put hidden palace down there

>>364827945
no
unless you count watching YouTube/twitch or browsing 4chan a hobby

anything I did in the past I never practiced and just coasted along with the least amount of effort I could, and by now I've fallen out of all of them

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Arin hanson you are stupid

>>364827149
There are so many good games out there though, why should anyone autistically spend dozens of hours playing a mediocre one when they could just switch to something more gratifying?

>>364828310
>Super Mario Bros.
>mediocre
actually leave

>>364827809
The team that made Sonic 06 left the company almost entirely as punishment from on high for not making a good game in the short amount of time Sega mandated.

They then got a fresh new batch of student grads just out of University to make Unleashed.

Sonic Team then had some reshuffling and then made Colors. Then the team was reshuffled again

Here's the big secret about Sonic Team, you ready?

There is no more set Sonic Team, everyone floats around Sega to help out on whatever needs to get done. Whoever gets chosen to work on the new Sonic game is called for that game "Sonic Team". It is true that a lot of the same people that worked on Colors were some remnants of the Unleashed team and would almost all go on to make Generations, and yes, Lost World as well.

If you wanna blame somebody for Lost World, blame Executive Producer Takashi Iizuka, he's a mark for Mario and it was his vision to make Lost World, Mario-esque.

>>364828380
I was talking about Sonic. A 5 year old could breeze through SMB.

>>364791776
>punishes
>not challenge

shit I guess enemies attacking me in a FPS games punishes me for not moving behind cover or racing games punish me for not using brakes

Fuck off

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if your sonic level isnt like this it sucks

>>364802235
Name 52 1/2 games that did this.

>>364828449
famous last words

>>364828448
i hate iizuka so much lol

>>364828493
What's hilarious about this is that retards who think this shit is good fail to realize that the driving force of speed in Sonic is vertical terrain. If you don't have that Sonic won't go very fast at all, and half the amazing shit you could do in the original games is fucking gone.

>>364828310
Sonic's not mediocre though, it has pretty damn great movement mechanics that keep it interesting for a very long time, and some solid level design to go along with it. Even once you get good at it playing it is very fun because there's always a ton ways to optimize your movement through the levels that aren't just about holding right to stay at max speed

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>>364827624
>that spoiler

its refreshing to see an actual anon on a sonic thread on /v/ that say something not retarded

>>364828448
source

>>364828547
0 games. I actually heard it in a developer commentary achievments shouldnt unlock content thanks to the rules of sony&microsoft

>>364828759
The source is to look at the credits of the games and see who's there and who's not.

>>364828759
It's a half truth. Check the credits for the last three Sonic team games. Producers and Directors are generally the same, but the other team members are consistently swapped in and out. But to be fair, that's been the case ever since the classic games. Mostly because Sega's staff management is pretty poor.

>>364791776
you're probably the same shitposter that's on /vr/

get gud faggot

>>364828194
what the fuck. The games are literally designed with multiple paths so that falling is still valid.

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>>364828708
That must be why white boy spergs like it so much
>Optimizing your movement
Lmao nigga just play the damn game you dont need to be performing quantum physics in your head while you go thru the level

>>364828194
where's this from?

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>"classicucks"
>praising of unleashed
>complaints about platforming in sonic
>shitting on the genesis trilogy and colors
>want the series to be boost and nothing else

I love these games and would like to talk about them but holy fuck

>>364829109
I dont know, I ssved it from a other sonic thread

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Did anyone else play this. It's Naka's newest game.

I played both versions and the Wii one is definitely better, but the game overall is just pretty bland. Next Sonic/NiGHTS it ain't.

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>>364826983
>he wants the game to be an infinite version of pic related

The sad thing is that you actually think you make a good point and not instead fuck off forever.

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>>364827293
>learning and improving is not fun, sorry

You are either a woman,mentally challenged or baiting either way you got me. If anything this whole thread got me. This is literally video games at the very core.

>>364827293
Name one game that you beat with the same skillset from the start as you did at the end? Isn't it more satisfying to beat when the game is throwing everything it has to stop you?

I'm not even trying to take a piss on you when I saw this but sounds like you prefer more casual games where immediate consistent rewards rather than gradually increasing-difficulty rewards is your thing.

Curious, what game does achieve this challenging but not punishing goal you're looking for?

>>364829060
>Lmao nigga just play the damn game you dont need to be performing quantum physics in your head while you go thru the level

Stupid ass nigga the game does the math so you dont have to so when the "classicucks" complain that the movement and platforming sucks in the newer games this is what they refer to.

people really don't get this at all huh?

a big selling point of the genesis was that it could scroll the screen much faster and smoother than the SNES which was actually completely 100% true
even though they used the infamous term "blast processing" to make it sound cooler it really was a meaningful thing

in reality Sonic is not THAT fast of a game sure but it did ultimately show off the capabilities of the system very well
but in the end Sonic is still a platformer there's no way it could it just be constant high speed sections
the bottom line is it was faster than Mario and thats all it needed to be to get people to buy a Genesis and they were both good game series anyway which is how people look at it in retrospect now
how fast Sonic really goes is kind of irrelevant now that we can practically make any game move as fast as we want

>>364829437
If you think it's anything like those shitty boss fights in anyway other than not being able to stand stationary, you probably haven't played it.

>skill based on memorization and twitchy movement
>controls are simple, movement in 2 directions and 1 button
>speed boosting power ups
>running into an obstacle = death, but the sun setting also equals death so you can't fucking stop
>the more collectibles you have, the higher your score gets, the more difficult to navigate the course becomes

Simple controls, addicting gameplay, replayability, and a real sense of speed. I guess it's missing 3D Sonic's trademark bottomless pits, so that's a negative, or something.

>>364829998
Pretty sure he's referring to the fact that Race the Sun is basically an endless runner game with white shit spewn all over the environment, where as Sonic is a platformer with speed based gameplay. There's no platforming in Race the Sun, it's a bunch of dodging shit. Sure it's fast, but a full game just like that would probably be shit.

>>364829998
I bet you think you're clever all the point you listed save for the sun bit can be attributed to a lot of mobile run games like temple run and even normalfags are tired of the "skill based on "memorization and twitch movement".


I suggest you keep playing unleashed or whatever because I don't see the series going in this direction,Thankfully.

>>364829729
see
>>364828095
I don't even really have the drive to play video games anymore, besides a gacha DBZ mobile game that takes pretty much no effort at all
any game that I have to practice becomes immediately unfun, because practice is work and I refuse to do it willingly

>>364830391
Sound like a personal problem with these negatives to your personality do you really think you should be throwing those reckless opinions around?

>>364792949
I know this is bait, but no they don't, the only thing you lose upon dying is some souls, which are incredibly easy to get back, and Humanity, which, while taking slightly longer to obtain, are still easily obtainable. You can get both souls and Humanity through grinding, and if you can get to where you died, (which isn't usually too hard) you get it all back.

>>364830391
Oh then you just grown out/burnt out/lost interest for spending time on video games. There, problem solved.

The fact that the only games you do play are mobile ones is pretty much a symptom of that in the first place.

>>364830482
>do you really think you should be partaking in discussion on an anonymous image board saying things others don't agree with
what the fuck are you going to do, jump out of the screen and beat me up because I don't have fun playing tedious things?
and for the last goddamn time, saying I have personal problems or a negative personality doesn't change a fucking thing, I don't care about other perspectives on what people enjoy when mine are the only I can experience
I think things are shit, sorry

>>364830201
>>364830245
I'm not saying this is what Sonic games should be, I'm saying that Boostshit would be better if its gameplay was more like this.

Every platforming segment in the Boostshit games is fucking awkward because Sonic's movement is obviously not tailored for it.

Boostshit would be better if it accepted what it was and went all the way to the kind of shit Race the Sun is.

And even then, that would be acceptable only as spinoff stuff.

tl;dr: Boost style Sonic games are a bad idea to be the "main gameplay style" and would be better suited to spinoff shit like this, or some sort of multiplayer racing game.

>>364830625
Being forced to grind is punishment, as is losing progress in a level/boss fight and having to redo it. Its as punishing as a lot of easier retro games like Megaman which is a massive step up from the constant checkpoints all big budget games have nowadays

>>364830650
but the issue is that all I'm even interested in is vidya, with no desire to broaden my horizons

>>364791776
This so much. Not even reading the thread because it's not defendable.

>>364792549
Sonic was made with multuple playthroughs and speedrunning in mind. Sorry it truggers youbso much and youvcan't get git gud at it Egoraptor.

>>364799558
>Take your time
>In a game based off of speed and advertised to be all about speed

I've never fucking understood this reasoning.

>>364830979
>>In a game based off of speed and advertised to be all about speed if you get good

>>364830979
Speed is a reward for good play and is a risk vs reward element of the game. Are games like DMC3 bad because a newbie won't feel like the stylish badass the games show you can be? Nonsense.

>>364830694
Oh so you're autistic. Gotcha.

>>364791776
git gud

>>364792549

>Myriads of Traps


Well then i dont get the hate since you /v/ faggots love Traps

>This thread

Don't people who complain about Sonic games being "punishing" realize they're just looking like complete idiots who fucking suck at the game? I was able to play through all the Genesis games, the Advance games & even some of the 3D games no problem, because Sonic is not that damn hard.

OP, you need to git gud. Fucking hell.

>>364792549

not really true at a;;

Sonic has a high risk high reward style of gameplay

this is the whole reason they gave Sonic the ability to stay alive forever as long as he has one ring
it basically means that if you make a minor mistake you aren't really punished that badly but if you mess up twice in a row you are extremely punished
so you can go slow and have low risk of dying if you're a beginner which allows you to learn the level or you can go fast and have a higher risk of dying but of course if you're good thats how you want to play
its actually not that different from an actual racing game funnily enough and its quite simple and elegant in design really

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>>364831896
You expect people to actually try? They have other things to do, like complain more that Sonic sux.

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>>364832139

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>>364830782
Based on
>I don't even really have the drive to play video games anymore, besides a gacha DBZ mobile game that takes pretty much no effort at all

Doesn't' really matter if it's your only hobby or not. It sounds like you physically can't muster the patience for it anymore and its nuisances if you only play games that basically play themselves.

Try a different genre entirely or buy a game on a whim and see where that takes you. Grab some Free-$5 indie game on steam which you can beat in a sitting or something.

It really sounds less and less like you disliking practice and more just being burnt out.

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>>364794991
Then play modern video games, they are catered around people like you.

>>364832798
I'm burnt out on my whole life man
and I'm serious about the practice, that doesn't just apply to video games. I absolutely can't fucking stand it for anything
I really don't want to just try random shit I'm unfamiliar with either, that's not my style at all especially if I'm spending any amount of money on it
I also don't have a computer that can play games so picking up random trash off of steam or TPB isn't a viable option, plus my internet sucks and downloading games takes literal days

>>364828858
sure, that applies to achievements, but Ratchet and Clank still had rewards for progressing far enough in the game that unlocks extra stuff in the sequels (becoming a gadgetron employee in R&C1 unlocks the employee discount in R&C3)
so why couldn't just check savefiles from the previous game, unlock x and y if you have a post-game savefile with 0 deaths on it

>>364791776
off yourself

So does anyone know where unleashedfag has been, i like talking to her. I know in her wake shes created a few more unleashed fans, some even in this thread, but they lack the dedication/autism that she had

Anyone friends with her maybe?

>>364834118
Sorry man, don't know what else I can say. Your situation sounds pretty fucked. I was in a similar rut and Ace Combat + Rhythm games saved my motivation despite never playing either.

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>>364791776
>Is marketed to jump high
>punishes you for jumping high
>?
And it was about going faster than Mario you underaged Arin-shilling nignog. Fuck off with your bait thread.

>>364792949
>wearing a ring of sacrifice
lol fag