Can someone please explain to me the appeal of this fedora edgy

He's evil.

He's vaguely similar to the Joker, and appeals to people's childhood. It's been long enough since FFVI that he has his own nostalgic value on top of that. Plus he won for a while. You have to respect that.

>>359861037
He's intelligent, nihilistic, and has a wicked sense of humor. What more is there to explain?

>>359861037
>for shock value because she's female
>>>/tumblr/

>>359861037
Final Fantasy 6 was weirdly darker than the rest of the series, at some point during my first play I was wondering if Terra was going to get raped.

Well he's a flamboyant psychopath who destroys entire worlds, kills countless thousands of innocent people, unleashes forbidden destructive magics to ravage the land..... because it's FUNNY!

>because she's female

What states that? It proves the strength of her character, to me.

FF6 is not a cheerful game, despite Kefka's "random" madness and the more light-hearted bits, overall the game is very dark.

>>359861037
>Can someone please explain to me the appeal of this fedora edgy as fuck angsty teen fanfic tier excuse of a villain?

Because people's first JRPG was either VI and VII so nostalgia fags will praise the villains despite them being average at best

>>359861774
>overall the game is very dark

Why Square went full shoneshit with 7?

>>359861259
Honestly this.

I liked him because he was the first villain who wanted to destroy the world AND HE FUCKING DID IT.

>>359861847
Every FF is different, man. You know that.

Mostly because he broke the whole "save the world" RPG trope in two. You FAIL to save the world.

He was the first villain to do that in JRPGs, which makes him all the more notable. If JRPG villains were considered top tier on madness alone, you'd have the likes of Luca Blight in everyone's top 5.

>>359861939
is he, dare i say, the /absolute madman/ ?

>>359861939
So you're a edgy faggot teenager then? Also Ganon, and plenty of other villains have successfully "destroyed" the world.

FF6 was one of the first games i had ever played where the villian legit killed people right in front of you by poisoning those people

now it seems like nothing but at the time that was pretty scary

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>>359861939
>>359862118

>>359861774
> overall the game is very dark.

How? The only "dark" moments I can remember in the game was Kefka poisoning the Kingdom and one of the characters attempting suicide. Those themes aren't new at all in a FF game. Hell, XIII had both of those

>>359862245
>now it seems like nothing

Actually, no. Active villains like Kefka are a rarity

>>359861939

Kefka never destroyed the world

>>359862350
This thing doesn't even have a personality.

Kefka was a class A petty troll who lucked into power. That's why he's the best.

>>359861037
Because he's not evil, he's just suffering

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Niulhs8ErCA

>>359861939
>>359862118
>he destroyed the world
>you fail to save the world
What? He fucks it up good, but there are still people living there. And you defeat him in the end, with everyone hard at work at rebuilding.

I'm pretty tired of this edgy bullshit about how he was the first villain to DESTROY THE WORLD (ALWAYS IN ALL CAPS TO SHOW HOW EPIC IT IS) even though he neither was the first nor actually destroyed the world anymore than Ganon did in LttP, which game out ~three years prior.

>>359862571
World of Ruin could be considered as the world being destroyed. It is also on a downslope to just straight up dying until he's taken down.

Kefka is a shit villain. Just like the Joker in the batman but normies eat that shit up.

A good villain is one with a genuine purpose, not someone who's just batshit insane.

>>359861259
>Plus he won for a while. You have to respect that.
But not really. All the work, intelligence and planning was Emperor Gestahl. At the very last moment when all Gestahl's plans came to fruition, Kefka Reddited around like an aspie and accidentally fell assbackwards into power. His bazinga so crazy shtick just happened to align with what was necessary for the Goddesses to imbue him with their power.

Had Gestahl taken power as he had planned, the Returners would be fucked. He'd have just ashed them all and then done whatever he wanted. Ruled the cosmos. But lolrandum clown had power and so he shot lolrandum lasers here and there. He was too crazy to even focus long enough to destroy the world. And when the time came where the Returners arrived to put him down, he was still too crazed to focus and bring his infinite powers to bare to squash them.

Kefka wasn't the villain, he was Gestahl's foil and the only thing that saved the world. The incompetent lackey that seized power from the true threat and was too retarded to use it properly.

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>>359862794
>World of Ruin could be considered as the world being destroyed
Only if you're a fucking illiterate moron. It isn't destroyed, it's just shitty.

>It is also on a downslope to just straight up dying until he's taken down
But he is taken down at the end of the game, so he doesn't actually succeed at doing anything other than making the world a crappy place to live for a while.

>>359862794

its only considered destroyed by edgy Kefka fanboys

he just moved a few rocks around

far worse things have happened to the Earth you are on and no one considers it destroyed

The darkest FF game is X. The encounter with Yunalesca was the only moment in FF history that gave me chills. I mean people like Yuna have been dying for no reason for 1000 years.

>>359863021
When I first played X it's story/theme was so convoluted i couldn't really understand anything that was going on towards the end

such a shame

>>359863021

To be fair, the system worked pretty good for a while only needing to lose a summoner every century. Then sin started to respawn faster.

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>>359863021
Agreed. X is fucking brutal, I can't imagine living in that world

>just living your life
>giant ass invincible monster swims up and obliterates your entire village and kills everyone you know for no reason
>have to live in constant fear that that might happen at any moment, no matter where you are

Oh, and also your loved ones turn into monster that will rip your throat out if there doesn't happen to be a summoner nearby after they die. Yeesh

>not Sephiroth
>he destroyed the world lmao

>>359861837
my first was FF I

I think he's also a bit notable because, compared to a lot of the villains that came after him in the series (maybe before as well, but I can't remember), he's a bit unique in that they don't give him some half-assed sympathetic reason to try to fuck everything up. Compared to a lot of other JRPG's it's refreshing to have a big bad who doesn't whine about how something bad happened to him and now he's going to wreck everything because angst.

>>359861037
(You)
also kill yourself

Nigga Hiroshima'd the entire fucking planet.

It's rare to see a villain actually succeed.

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ExDeath was the best FF villain desu

>>359863793
>they don't give him some half-assed sympathetic reason to try to fuck everything up

Yeah they do. He was just some normal teenager that Gestahl had cruel experiments done upon that broke his sanity and made him crave destruction and nihilism.

FF6 in general was full of problems. The gameplay was terrible, there was no way to skip the cutscenes which were boring, the pacing was out of whack, there were bugs and exploits everywhere, half the time you had to do meaningless filler just to make a character better (getting the water rondo for Mog), and some characters didn't even see use (Gau was useless, Relm was useless, Strago was useless, everyone who wasn't being leveled up already was useless)

I hate to imply this, but this game is only loved due to nostalgia. From a more modern point of view, the game is complete cinematic trash.

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>>359863962
TURTLE!

>mfw a kid references it in WoFF

>>359862964
>Only if you're a fucking illiterate moron. It isn't destroyed, it's just shitty.

Ehhh. He accomplished much more than any other FF villain. No plants could even grow there anymore aside from weeds and trees.

>But he is taken down at the end of the game, so he doesn't actually succeed at doing anything other than making the world a crappy place to live for a while.

True, but if Celes wouldn't have stopped being emo no one would have even stood up to him.

>>359863010
Those far worse things haven't been caused by someone. With only the person being stopped as the only fix.

>>359864102
>caring about how useful your characters are
>not just picking your favorites
no wonder you didn't have fun

>>359863962
Well hiding as a splinter into the heroes foot was... unique to say the least.

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>>359864497

>only pick favorites
>have to go into a dungeon or area that requires multiple parties
>everyone is underleveled as all hell

>>359862434
I think you missed:

Shadow's past.
Murder of Terra's mother & subsequent mind-rape
Death of all the captured Espers
Murder of King Figaro (forcing Edgar to take the crown to let his brother free)
Cyan's "reunion" with his dead wife & child
Gau's rejection by his father
Death of Rachel
Setzer's flashbacks of Darill and her death

ITT nobody actually played the game???

>>359861961
Do they just keep the FF games together under one IP for marketing purposes? I do not know much about FF but I have noticed they have covered very broad territory.

>>359864354
>He accomplished much more than any other FF villain
Except he doesn't. Caius is the only FF villain who is legitimately successful at what he was trying to accomplish. Ultimecia was reasonably successful as well since she rules over the future and creates a time loop when she is killed. You can throw Yu Yevon in there too since he was around for a thousand years before the events in the game, and the FFX apocrypha suggests that Sin actually comes back even after Yuna defeats him. Hell, Sephiroth fucks the world up about as much as Kefka did if AC is considered canon.

Kefka isn't the most successful villain, or the best characterized, or even the most destructive. He's just a lolsorandum clown

Reminder Emperor is best. I kid. But he's up there.

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>>359864102
But i played it recently (first FF ever for me) and i had lots of fun

I can only agree about Gau being useless. Relm's painting powers were similar to his but more versatile, since you could mimick an enemy on the go instead of forcing a single moveset per battle. Strago had Lore, that was more than good once unlocking attacks like Doom and Fusion. And that's not mentioning how the Espers allow you to shape whatever character into the kind of role you want

And about the underleveled bit that rarely happened to me, you must be doing something wrong

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>>359861504
I had the same thought about Cloud when I first played VII.

Good thing it turned out that Mukki was just washing Cloud's back, r-right?

>>359862350
Great post

>>359862210
Ganon never wanted to destroy Hyrule just rule it

>>359864848
Not that anon, in my playthrough i apparently missed Shadow's past, Gau's daddy issues and when she died i couldn't even tell who Rachel was

The game's bigger than i expected

>>359861037
FF villains from what I've played.
Exdeath>Kuja>Sephiroth>Garland>Kefka>Xande>The Emperor>Zemus
Am I right?

>>359862434
>Those themes aren't new at all in a FF game. Hell, XIII had both of those

>Those themes aren't new in FF, they happened 7 games later

???

>>359865224
>Sephiroth fucks the world up about as much as Kefka did if AC is considered canon.
No he didn't It was Jenova. And he didn't do anything in ff7 till the very end. It was all Jenova. I wish that they focused more on her, gave he personality and more lines. Instead all credit goes to that fuck, many retards still think that it was he who killed Aerith

>>359861037
>because she's female

It wasn't because she's female, you sperg. It was because she was a traitor to the empire. It's also implied at one point that she was raped as well.

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>>359865490
"Ruling it" is exactly what Kefka is doing at the end of FF6. He didn't destroy shit anymore than this chucklefuck from ToP did

>>359865327

>since you could mimick an enemy on the go instead of forcing a single moveset per battle.
And that's completely useless thanks to the esper system, which lets you turn her into another flare spamming mage. Same with Strago, who had completely useless lore unless you grinded to find enemies that had good attacks, and even then you had to wait for them to use it, or goad them into using it, hoping the RNG of their poorly coded AI wouldn't screw you over. And need I mention that the only really good lore he gets, Grand Train, requires you going through RNG: the dungeon to fight a boss who may or may not use the attack before you kill him.

The espers should've been severely restricted, maybe as stat boosters only, not letting everyone llearn the exact same moves. It just made them all bland and nullified any special abilities they had because they were inferior to just spamming magicite crap. If you say that you actually used Blitz or Edgar's tools or Cyan's bushido in the endgame, when they could just spam magic everywhere, then I'm afraid your pants are on fire.

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>>359865661
>le sephiroth clones are jenova meme
no one cares about your headcanon faggot. go away

You're a generic buzzword memer there's your problem

HRRHH THIS IS CRINGE EDGE FANFICTION IT DOES NOT EVEN DAB

Delita best FF character

>>359865545
World of Ruin has a lot of choose you own path to it in regards to how the story unfolds..

>>359865636
I'd put the emperor and kefka above garland and xande

Vayne is the only good mainline villain, because he was right.

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>>359866245
Garland was fucking great though.

>>359865858
What are talking about? Have you played the game? It was jenova in form of sephiroth who killed aerith. It was jenova who infected lifestream and caused geostigma in AC.

Kefka is a good foil to the entire cast, and even though his personality and backstory are shallow he makes it up by having enjoyable dialogue and being one of the most engaged villains in the series.

Up until that point in the series' history, and even now to some extent, the villains usually wait around to fight you at the endgame and show up once or twice to show how untouchable they are. Kefka isn't the evil overlord or badass with a personal vendetta, he's the goofy sidekick villain who harasses you throughout the entire game and gets his shit kicked in more than once, an he actually succeeds.

He's also one of the first JRPG villains I can think of who actually wins and changes the entire game world thanks to his actions. There's other ones who do that, Exdeath created the merged world in FFV and you have shit like Ganon's corrupted Sacred Realm in ALttP, but neither of those have the scope and impact that the World of Ruin had.

Execution and context mean a lot. It's why Exdeath is also a fantastic antagonist despite being a Saturday morning cartoon character.

>>359865772
Of course i used Edgar's and Cyan's personal moves, why wouldn't i? They're efficient and don't consume MP. What if i specialized Edgar with fire attacks but then there's an enemy that absorbs fire? I just use the tools. Same for Cyan

And the characters don't have to be all the same, it's up to you. For example since it's a damn RPG after all i assigned to characters espers that "made sense" for their personality or simply fit the role i decided to assign to them. Locke had an emotional attachment to Phoenix, Terra could be reunited with her daddy etc.

Saying you can break the game logic if you try hard enough isn't really saying the game is shit, especially since most players definitely wouldn't get that savy on their first playthrough. Is Morrowind shit too, because of how OP magic can be?

>>359866440
It was Jenova influencing Sephiroth to follow her goals using clones of his body, who was well aware of what was going on around him.

>>359861037

>edgy edgy edgy fedora edgy edge

this website has warped your brain

>>359866532
i love engaged baddies, one of the reasons Superstar Saga was such a good game

>>359866440
>It was jenova in form of sephiroth who killed aerith
It was a clone that he created while in the northern crater. Fuck off with your stupid fan theories

>>359862845
do you actually know what you're talking about or did you just watch a few clips of things on youtube here and there or what

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>>359861037
He causes the apocalypse successfully. He betrays the emperor and kills good guy Leo. He poisoned the entire city of Doma, except for Cyan. And he has hilarious and interesting dialogue, especially in the original translation.

Overall, he's a very entertaining, yet menacing and competent, villain.

What more could you possibly ask for?

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>>359866532
>he actually succeeds
no, he doesn't

>actually wins
no, he doesn't. did you miss the part where the party kills him at the end and the world is slowly being rebuilt? play the game you fucking morons

>>359866565
>using clones of his body
>In the original Japanese script, the clones are known as Sephiroth Copies. "Clone" is a misnomer; subjects were infected with Jenova cells to reproduce a similar effect to that of Sephiroth—who eventually exerts control of the subjects as his puppets—rather than being genetic copies.

>>359865772
>If you actually used Blitz instead of spamming magic then you're retarded
Blitz actually worked based on the magic power stat, and Blitz powers could do everything from damage to healing without costing magic. Bum rush was a 9,999 attack pretty much right out of the gates.

Why was using Blitz a bad idea? Edgar's drill was also still good against single opponents and Bushido was kind of lackluster from the start. Not to mention the enemies with whatever magical resistances, or how the magic might have interfered with Runic, which was useful.

>>359866887
A reason to do what he did.

>>359866995
Okay then.
It was Jenova influencing Sephiroth to follow her goals using copies of his body, who was well aware of what was going on around him.

>>359865772
>Dude, just grind with espers and the game is easy! What were they thinking?

Some of us aren't casual faggots.

Yes, you can theoretically make everyone hyper OP, except Umaro, but it's much easier and equally effective to focus your efforts on teaching magic to your most competent mages. Terra, Celes, Relm, and arguably Mog, Strago, and Sabin need as much Esper time as they can get. Why bother teaching it to the others when they have much more effective physical setups?

>>359861847
They did originally have a very dark idea for FFVII its called Xenogears.

>>359867114
vice versa dipshit

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>le "kefka achieved his goals" meme

>>359861415
[CRAWLING intensifies]

>Kefka
>angst
lolok

>>359867018
He hates the world, and is a nihilist.

He views all of human history as pointless, since everyone will ultimately die and be forgotten.

Whether or not you agree with him, or think he's "edgy", doesn't matter. That's his motivation.

Also, for the record, he's the result of a magitek research program that kind of fucked up his head. That's why he acts like this.

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Reminder that Kefka's goal was to destroy everything and create a monument to non existence. He did not succeed in this, and thus he did not succeed in his goal. He most definitely did NOT win anything more than a battle. The war was lost.

Picture for ants.

>>359867018
he was literally mad with madness.
mad people don't need reason to do stuff.
Sometimes, it's just that simple

>>359862434
>those themes aren't new these later games in the series did it too!

are you actually retarded?

Legitimately successful FF villains
>Caius
>Possibly Yu Yevon

Unsuccessful FF villains
>everyone else

Glad we cleared this up.

>>359867313
>>359867445
He didn't achieve his end goal, but he did achieve the goal of seizing the power of the Warring Triad and causing an apocalypse after which he rules as a god. I'd say he did a fine job compared to most villains.

>>359861037
>Can someone please explain to me the appeal of this fedora edgy as fuck angsty teen fanfic tier excuse of a villain?
hes evil for its own sake. pure, unadulterated douchebag. the epitome and embodiment of self service.
>Jesus Christ FF6 sucked
get the fuck out. dont come back until youve grown up.

>>359861037

He started as weak as you. He grows alongside the player character and his party. In a genre overpopulated by Black Knights and already powerful Evil Emperors, he breaks the mold by being a weakling and a coward for most of the game until he achieves power.

>>359861037
That sounds like at least one character in every piece of japanese entertainment media ive ever seen

like devil may cry

how do people actually play/watch this stuff, to me its just infinite cringe

>>359867597
I actually liked Caius because he was like a better version of Kefka. XIII-2 may have been a shit game but Caius was a pretty good character.

>>359867597
>Possibly Yu Yevon
Yeah I mean for the 1000 years before you stop him he was doing exactly what he wanted, keeping the dream zanarkand alive and perpetuating sin through the final summoning.

>>359867823
Sin returns at the end of the last piece of FFX lore they wrote, but we don't know if Yu Yevon comes back as well (I'd assume so).

>>359867597

Kuja was pretty successful

>>359867678
He wasn't though, he was created through the same experiments that gave Celes her magitek powers. So it can be assumed he definitely had magitek powers, he also outright kills General Leo before he even gains his god status from the warring triad.

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We can all agree this guy was a good villain right?

>>359867445
Kefka accomplished his goals.

He put the slave crown on Terra and used her to wreak havoc.
>"Yeah but she broke free fag, rofl. That's not a success it's just a thing he wanted."

He poisoned Doma.
>"Lol fag, he meant to poison ALL of Doma but one guy lived. Get real! Plus he had other more important goals."

Not at the time, but okay. He also killed a shit ton of espers and absorbed their powers, causing a huge part of your plan to backfire.
>"omg he literally wants to destroy the earth fuck off with this esper shit. It doesn't count."

Then he destroyed the earth.
>"See this is what I'm talking about. He DIDN'T destroy the earth because even though it was destroyed and permanently changed for the worse, there were still people alive."

Then he became a god, or as close to it as he could be
>"He still didn't destroy the whole planet fag."

So basically this is just a shit ton of goal post moving to make it seem like Kefka never won, even he got his way numerous times and always did lasting damage when he did win. He extincted the entire esper race and blew up the planet. Yes, he didn't go so far as to make the canon ending of the game a "game over" screen, but he sure made a lot of meaningful fucking progress and took a lot of things away from both the player and the setting.

>>359867313
>>359867445
Didn't he only decide on that goal then and there? As far as his goal for most of the game goes, he certainly succeeded.

Why are villians judged by how "successful" they are?
When a hero has tons of "success" we call him a mary sue and its seen as a bad thing.

I never had a problem understanding Kefka. What truley frightens me is that I understand him all too well...

>>359868176
Running a race only to trip just before the goal line and coming in second is not winning. It's doing amazing and then fucking up at the last moment. That meaningful progress means shit when he's dead at the end anyway and love and peace and happy things ultimately come out on top.

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>>359868176
There's a big difference between "inflicting lasting damage" and "destroying the world" you fucking moron. The only one moving the goalposts here is you. Kefka wanted to extinguish all life on earth and FAILED when he was defeated by the protagonists. Most FF villains end up "inflicting lasting damage".

This is an example of the world actually being destroyed.

>>359868269
Because there's no fun in being a mary sue self insert here. A succesful villain is much more satisfying to beat. And Kefka isn't close to being a mary sue anyway.

>>359868302
tip

At least his reaction to the cliche speech gives him points.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qm_8kfdhDbc

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>>359868302
same

>>359867325
{Faggotry intensifies]

>>359868510
>>359868525
>if you ultimately get defeated at the end, you completely failed

Sure, I'm sure the protags of FF6 will agree with that in their nigh irreversibly fucked up world. Kefka sure was insignificant, right?

>>359868634
>a
>fucking
>blackberry

>destroyed the world
>somehow every town from WoB is still intact

the emperor making half of the world's towns inaccessible left a greater impression tbqh

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>>359868781
>he's still moving the goalposts
Yea, keep defeating that imaginary argument no one is making. No one said he was insignificant you stupid cunt, just that he didn't actually destroy the world since most of the same towns and people are still there and the game ends with them hopefully rebuilding

>>359861037
He poisoned our water supply, burned our crops and delivered a plague unto our houses!

>>359868510
>>359868525
These are just pointless reclassification of success to underplay what the villain even did in the story. Just because Kim Jong Il died doesn't mean he didn't have a meaningful impact on North Korea. Kefka had his own cult and people called his power the "light of judgement", which he wielded whenever he felt like towards anyone he wanted. Seriously, his next step, as stated to you, was to finally just kill everything. If he'd won that one, it would be a game over screen and the story would be a tragedy rather than a hero story.

He demonstrates over and over that every time he gets his way, he's going to ruin something. But because he stopped short of actually killing everything forever, you want to argue that Kefka wasn't successful as a villain.

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>>359869015
>He poisoned our water supply, burned our crops and delivered a plague unto our houses!
I wonder who's behind this post.

>>359868781
Nigh irreversible is not irreversible. Humanity will rebuild. The land may even heal, given how much green was in the ending. Just because the heroes took a fuck ton of damage doesn't mean they didn't ultimately win.

The idea with Kefka was that he was supposed to be a useful idiot but he went overboard and did shit you weren't supposed to do, just because he was hungry for power. It all came tumbling down on the Floating Continent when he betrayed Gestahl, who was a sensible tyrant with actual political motives. Kefka just became an insane ruler with power and no real purpose behind it.

So obviously he destroyed the planet and made a giant tower where he liked to fry the world with a lazer beam, just because he could.

Final Fantasy 6 had some of the best conceived character motives in any FF game. The fact that you had to go and convince your whole party to re-join you after a year of inactivity was great. Especially how some of them were reluctant and needed convincing. That's one of the real strengths of the game.

>>359865312
To his credit, he did fuck up the world about as much as Kefka did, AND ruled heaven and hell for a bit. He would probably get more credit if it weren't for the fact that he's in a shit game.

>>359868781
Not winning =/= being insignificant.
>>359869048
We want to argue he didn "win". No one is saying he wasn't successful. Hell, both the posts you replied to agree he did great with his plan for the most part but failed in the end.
Failed.

>>359869048
>If he'd won that one
The point is that he didn't. Your argument is literally fucking retarded.

>if Sephiroth had actually crashed meteor into gaia, he would have successfully destroyed the world!
Yea, but that didn't happen did it, he was defeated and his plan was thwarted. Same as Kefka; came a long was but ultimately was killed and the world was set to recover from his actions.

>>359869134
>The fact that you had to go and convince your whole party to re-join you after a year of inactivity was great
>great

more like tedious horseshit
good thing they never tried to pull that crap again

>>359869113
>The land may even heal, given how much green was in the ending.
The ending theme music in japanese is literally called "Reviving Greenery".

>>359869048
He was successful. He was NOT victorious. This is all anyone is saying.

>HE ACTUALLY WON!!!!!!

No he did not.

>>359869206
He did win, though. He won repeatedly. I can only think of two times he lost: once when he attacked Narshe for the esper, and once when you kill him at the end. Virtually everything else from start to end was victory for Kefka.

>>359869345
>>359869282
So broadly speaking, has anyone on earth ever won anything, really? I mean we all die in the end. How can you claim a victory if everything is just dust in the wind?

You guys are big thinkers. Very philosophical.

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>>359869360
>this team won 18 games to get to the super bowl. I can only think of one time they actually lost: the super bowl
>therefore they are basically the world champions

>>359869316
Well, from a character point of view, it meant that every character had to actually have a specific motive (with a few exceptions) and those all ranged from revenge to "I must protect what's precious" to "I want to pal around with my old buddies" and so on. Character motive is practically the most important aspect of storytelling and it's often overlooked in video games.

>>359869014
You're the one moving the goalposts faggot. Kefka didn't ultimately win, but he had so many victories that caused substantial damage to the world. By the halfway point of the game, it seems hopeless for the heroes. The protags won, but it was a Pyrrhic victory.

>>359869113
>>359869206
See above.

Again, it's true that he ultimately lost, but that doesn't mean he wasn't at least partially successful, which is more than can be said about a ton of villains.

>>359869360
You can use this to say Hitler won too.
Hell with this logic you can say a lot of villains won. Did Exdeath win too because he erased almost every town and absorbed the void in the end just like he planned? Does he dying not count? Why does it count for Exdeath as losing but not for Kefka?

Kefka has no over-arcing goal or motivation. There's nothing to be won. He was in it for the heck of it.

>>359869540
>Kefka didn't ultimately win, but he had so many victories that caused substantial damage to the world.
Okay? So did Sephiroth, Ultimecia, Yu Yevon, Caius (who literally won), Exdeath, fuck even Zeromus who sucked shit. Pretty much every FF villain made some headway at one point or another

>The protags won, but it was a Pyrrhic victory
So it was a victory. Glad we settled this, you can stop posting now.

>>359869540
>Again, it's true that he ultimately lost
THAT'S WHAT THE ENTIRE ARGUMENT IS ABOUT
NO ONE CARES HOW MANY CHARACTERS THE VILLAIN KILLS
NO ONE CARES HOW VERY ITTY BITTY CLOSE HE GETS TO THE GOAL
NO ONE CARES HOW NIGH IRREVERSIBLE THE DAMAGE HE CAUSES IS
HE LOST
THIS IS WHAT THIS HAS ALWAYS BEEN ABOUT, ALL THESE YEARS, EVER SINCE THE FUCKING CONCEPTION OF INTERNET SPACES WHERE PEOPLE COULD TALK ABOUT FUCKING KEFKA ONLINE AND ALL THESE "KEKAROOOO KEFKA WON I'M GAY" STARTED POPPING UP
>but that doesn't mean he wasn't at least partially successful
THAT DOESN'T MATTER
THAT'S NOT WHAT ANYONE IS ARGUING ABOUT YOU M O N G O L O I D
>The protags won
EX FUCKING ACTLY
>Kefka didn't ultimately win
EX
FUCKING
ACTLY

>>359869506
>Only two teams in the entirety of football
>Team Kefka wins 18 games against Team Returner
>Team Returner wins the final game by killing the other team, preventing them from ever playing again

Okay, but why are you acting like Team Kefka didn't win when he won 18 out of 19 games? Even if Team Returners got the big trophy at the end of it all, Kefka still goes down as a formidable team that thrashed the Returners way more often than he lost. If the story had ended after he destroyed the World of Balance, then from your point of view he "won" because you don't see any more of the story.

But then Kefka does still win in the long run, doesn't? Because the Returners and everything alive during Kefka's reign does eventually die of old age? How much do you need to stretch for Kefka to have not won.

>>359869850
Shit I want to disagree with you, but then I remembered even that fuck up Xande tore up the world quite a bit.

>>359864970

yes. They're pretty much unrelated.

Starting with vii they pretty much jumped the shark though and became a mishmash of edgy retardation...although 12 offered a slight reprieve.

>>359869937
>why are you acting like Team Kefka didn't win when he won 18 out of 19 games
Because he didn't win the only game that mattered.

>Kefka still goes down as a formidable team
Who cares.

>If the story had ended after he destroyed the World of Balance
It didn't.

>from your point of view he "won" because you don't see any more of the story
So your headcanon takes precedence over the actual ending of the game? Just when I thought you couldn't be any more of a fucking retard.

>How much do you need to stretch for Kefka to have not won
Not very much, you just need to play the game up to the part where he dies and the world is slowly recovering. This isn't a difficult concept.

>>359869489
Yes. Kefka's death was not a natural one. He died because he faced off against a superior force and couldn't come out on top. In their competition, the prize of which was the world or the destruction of it, he lost. When they finished trading blows he was the one who stayed down. Their war was over and he was the loser.

>>359870182
What if Kefka's penultimate goal was to pee on Terra's chest, and he did that while she had the slave crown on. He has no other goals. That's all he does, and he does it.

Then the game carries on and at some point Kefka dies.

Did he win? Or did he lose because at some point he dies? Because if it's the latter, all humanity is a loser, anon.

>>359861037
ITT: It's popular so it's bad

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If Kefka was a FFXV character he would look like this

Kuja was more successful than Kefka


he actually destroyed a world for real

he achieved all his goals until he went nuts at the end

>>359870336
Okay, so if he'd died from the flu, a natural death, then he would have died a winner even though technically in this case the flu virus defeated him.

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I swear people who think Kefka lost are so simpleminded.

>>359868302

haha...this made me laugh.

Post like this are why I love v and will be on here the rest of my life. No one understands me like you guys.

>>359862727
You can't even compare the world of LttP to VI, fucking zelda drone. One villiage, a castle, and a few people here and there vs an entire world?

They are both great games, and both had great villians. Not sure why you have to choose one or the other.

>>359862350
While Lavos was innately bad and main threat just because it was going to consume and destory the world, the actual people in the game turned out to be a lot more evil. Also you change the past so it doesn't happen at least in one timeline according to Chrono Cross, and the other time lines ends up dead sea or something I didn't really understand

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>>359870792
I love you too anon.

>>359869506
All of those moments were like Super Bowls though. Just because he was finally beaten doesn't mean he didn't achieve his world-ruining plan and didn't scar the planet and civilization and genocide all Espers from existence.

Because he "won" halfway through the game.
And by win, I mean he fucked up some stuff then fucked off for 90% of the second half of the game.

Honestly I think Lavos, despite not having any real personality due to it being primal, es one of the best villains in vidya history.

No matter how you end or play Chrono Trigger, in the end Lavos wins and gets what it wanted. No matter how strong your party gets it's always going to be extremely difficult to defeat it in that time line and it also possesses a real good question on "Is it really evil if it's just following it's life cycle."

Metroid Prime also had a similar 'villain' up until Metroid Prime 3 kinda ruined it by making Dark Samus (and by relation Metroid Prime itself) sentient and knowingly fucking stuff over.

>>359870810
>Also you change the past so it doesn't happen
That's not how time travel in CT works. Where do you think Robo goes back to at the end of the game? The end of the world still happens, just not in the timeline that Chrono and crew are living in.

>>359871120
Of course. He just didn't win in the end, which is all anyone is saying. Of course he did a lot of bad stuff. There's no excitement if the villain can't get anything right. But he was not ultimately victorious, and that's what people are saying.

>>359871287
Yeah the whole "cattle" metaphor was pretty fucked up with Lavos. I always wondered what the end dialogue was like when you brought characters other than based Lucca. Did someone else just explain the whole "life cycle" thing?

>>359869316

You didn't actually have to recruit them. You can beat it with only edgar, celes, and locke.

>>359871356
>He just didn't win in the end, which is all anyone is saying.
Bullshit. Your initial mission statement was to prove that Kefka didn't win at all. The whole basis for your argument is that Kefka eventually dies, even though before that he won repeatedly and with devastating results.

Nobody disagrees that Kefka died in the end, but he achieved victory throughout most of the game and it's stupid to argue that he never "won".

Caius is the best FF villain. Good, sensible motivations, well characterized, and unlike Kefka he actually wins at the end of the game. It's also debatable whether or not he actually is a villain since all he really does is make the world "end" a couple hundred years earlier.

>>359871334
I thought that in Chrono Cross it was said that the other timelines were destroyed by their actions which made the dead sea or whatever?

>>359871589
yeah, if you grind them enough to go through that retarded final dungeon with that party split up mechanic, which got old in the WoB

>>359871634
Actually, the original argument was against the statement that he is the only successful FF villain, and therefore the best. So either way, you're fucked. If he was a successful villain, then nearly every FF villain was successful and Kefka isn't unique. If he wasn't a successful villain, then he isn't unique either since every FF villain ultimately failed except Caius.

>>359871356
But the entire argument of Kefka actually succeeding was that he did scar the world, did genocide an entire race, and basically did rule for a year in an apocalyptic hellhole. No one denies that the player characters won in the final boss battle. As far as his main goals for most of the game, Kefka actually did succeed and drastically affect the world for a long time, and even permanently. That's what makes him stand out in that regard.

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>RPG
>BBG is actually a cute little furry boy
>You have to save him from himself

>>359871796
>>359869316
>Goddamnit, this fucking game made me travel around the world and find my friends! SO TEDIOUS AND RETARDED.
>"Well, anon, just take the starting three characters and beat the game with them"
>Ugh that's fucking impossible I'd have to grind SO MUCH. I mean I basically may as well go look for my friends and gather experience like the developers intended if I'm going to do that!

The worst part is that there are guides to beating this game at a party level of 7, so your bitch-fit about what you HAVE to do is kind of meaningless.

>>359871634
Yeah no. I know what I'm saying. I've been saying since post number one that I've made >>359867445
that he was ultimately the loser. He won nothing more than battles but he lost the war. The world fucking heals. Humanity fucking rebuilds. Kefka. Fucking. Lost.

>>359871868
>Kefka actually did succeed and drastically affect the world for a long time, and even permanently. That's what makes him stand out in that regard.
How does that make him stand out you fucking retard? Have you played any FF game other than six? What you said could be applied to literally every FF villain, ESPECIALLY Yu Yevon, Sephiroth, Barthandelus, Caius etc...

>>359871861
Okay, anon. Whatever. At some point everything dies so everybody is a loser, and in the grand scheme we all have small victories, so by a very contrived twist of sophistry you're TOTALLY right about this and not a dumbass.

>>359872069
>How does that make him stand out you fucking retard?

Consider this: the average Joe in the FF7 world will never know who Sephiroth is.

Kefka will be forever remembered by the whole humanity of the FF6 world.

>>359872238
He fought a battle against an opponent and was found wanting. In their battle, he lost. Old age, viruses, whatever the fuck other goal post moving bullshit you want to throw out there, none of it has anything to do with their fight. A fight he lost.

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>>359872238
>not responding to a single point he made
glad you're done posting at any rate

>>359869134
That's why playing as Celes in World of Ruin is what makes the game amazing in my opinion. Getting the band back together is something you rarely get to do in a story.

Wasn't Kefka the first FF villain who achieved godhood?

>>359872027
>Goddamnit, this fucking game made me travel around the world and find my friends! SO TEDIOUS AND RETARDED.
>Ugh that's fucking impossible I'd have to grind SO MUCH. I mean I basically may as well go look for my friends and gather experience like the developers intended if I'm going to do that!

Don't see what your point is except that both options are terrible and could've been easily avoided if the party split up never happened

>>359872542
Exdeath is probably ultimately stronger than Kefka, though I guess it's hard to say

>>359872069
That's what makes him stand out as one of the first cases of that which people note. Also, his plan was something he worked toward during the game, not something in place before it, and the crowning moment of said plan actually works and stays working for the rest of the game (and the setting's history as far as the Espers go). It succeeds and has consequences for over a year, and the player even goes through that post-Kefka world.

He's not the only FF villain to ever have a successful big plan (I never argued as such, you were arguing that with the other guy), but he is one of those villains, and one of the earliest and most notable in the series.

>>359872861
But he isn't the first villain to do that, and he's arguably not even the first to do it in a FF game. He's also not the most successful FF villain.

So why again is he notable other than being an edgy clown?

>>359864102

>Gau
>useless

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhOuNpDuH_Q

>>359861037

I like him because he honestly represents me. We're both intelligent, nihilistic, with a wicked sense of humor.

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If FF Dissidia is anything to take out of, it seems Kefka more or less was extremely depressed.

Terra later comments on that it was his broken heart that led him to such destruction.

>>359861504

>Final Fantasy 6 was weirdly darker than the rest of the series

The opening sequence of FF 4 has Cecil and a bunch of soldiers slaughtering innocent mages and everyone felt bad about it.

>>359867017

>why was using blitz a bad idea

Diagonal inputs on a D-pad are the worst thing to have ever been implemented.

>>359873638
>If FF Dissidia is anything to take out of, it seems Kefka more or less was extremely depressed.
That's literally what he acts like during his entire final speech before the final battle in VI, no?

>>359862890
>Reddited
Stop.

>>359864848
Sabin knew his Dad was murdered and ran away since the whole kingdom ignored it and played nice with the Empire

in the Ruined World you find out that the entire village where you find Terra was nuked by Kefkas light of Judgement killing almost all the adults and leaving the children to possibly starve to death

Mog is the last of his kind, the rest went extinct.

>>359873638
>depressed
Depression isn't a real thing so fuck off.

>>359873897
He just seems like an ultra fedora-atheist that destroys the world because he sees no meaning in living because everyone dies.

>>359873074
I didn't say he was THE first villain, FF or otherwise, to do that. I said he was one of the earliest and most notable cases, and he accomplished his main plan pretty thoroughly and with permanent consequences for the world. These things were even observable by the player during a good part of the game itself.

As for being notable in general, in addition to the above he appears throughout the game as a foe who grows more competent alongside the party and has a ton of great lines.

>>359874062
Nice meme.

>>359862890
>Kefka Reddited around like an aspie and accidentally fell assbackwards into power

I don't even like kefka (or VI for that matter), but there's a scene in the magitek factory where he says he plans to use the goddess statues

>>359873638
Literally one of the first NPCs in FF6 mentions how there are rumors that something broke inside Kefka after experiments.

>>359874062
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depression_(mood)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Major_depressive_disorder

>>359874073
>I didn't say he was THE first villain, FF or otherwise, to do that. I said he was one of the earliest and most notable cases
Every villain that isn't the earliest is "one of the earliest"

>>359873227

Ah yes, a glitch that was actually removed in subsequent releases. Very useful.

>>359874203
It's not one of the first, it's not even early, and it's completely optional and you'll probably miss it if you don't go out of your way to get to the bar/whatever that guy is in and talk to him. And he says he isn't even sure and it's just rumors.
Unless there's another NPC I don't know about.

>>359874357
He's in the town where you meet Leo the first time. Pretty much every NPC gives hints about experiments and how sometimes things go wrong.

>>359868736
You got me there, anon. Curse your wit.

Venat was the only FF villain to actually succeed in his goals. Kefka was just some edgy clown.

>>359874685
too bad we don't actually know shit about Venat

>>359874217
>wikipedia

>>359875179
https://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/topics/depression/index.shtml

>>359861037
Can someone please explain to me the meaning of edgy?

>>359875501
Something I don't like.

>>359874791
He wanted to free humanity from the control of the Illumina-I mean Occuria.

>>359875590
because?

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>>359875501
Of or pertaining to intelligence, nihilism, and a wicked sense of humor.

Kefka was doomed from the start since there was no way he could be better than Exdeath so Square didn't even try

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>hyped up to destroy the world
>all he does is push some statues around
He's not bad but a bit overrated in my opinion. His dialog is pretty amusing and he definitely is threatening to a degree but he could've been developed much better. I feel like if FF6 ever got a true remake he should get more focus, really the entire cast could.

>>359875501
/v/'s definition: Anything or any character that's dark or morally grey

Actual definition: Something about trends. Using shock to catch attention or pushing some new design that people haven't seen before.

>>359864102
>relm with her sky high magic stat
>useless

>>359875662
Fuck the Occuria.

>>359861637
>OMG SO BADASS AND WITTEY BEST CHARACTORE EVARRR!!! XD

>>359861837
Who are they kidding? Their first JRPG was VII by they pretend it's VI to try and stand out.

Fact is that Sephiroth is a way better written villain than this shallow fuck.

>>359861037
holy shit look at this fag

>>359861386
Well he kinda does remind me of myself.

>>359865327
>I can only agree about Gau being useless.
Retard detected, Gau is by far the most powerful character in the game.

>Can someone please explain to me the appeal of this fedora edgy as fuck angsty teen fanfic tier excuse of a villain?


You posted the wrong guy, that's not Sephirot.

At least Kefka destroyed the world.

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>>359878226
>Sephirot
wow so edgy

>>359878059

Not everyone can understand the concept of 4X damage cat scratch.

>>359873074
So who was the first one?

I'm more in disbelief as to how people still suck FFVI's dick (and older entries as well) after all this time and claim the newer entries as shit when the former is an extremely average game (besides the 3-party thingy you do at times, that is pretty cool).

It was good for it's time, but it has not aged well.

>>359873852
While Blitz does ask for diagonals, you did not have to do them, as the programming for the move does not actually look for diagonals or something. I'm explaining it poorly but basically you sub in standard directionals for the diagonals.

Look it up sometime. Most Blitz guides should mention it.

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You know what the best villains are? The ones that don't view themselves as bad at all and say things like, "You don't see it now, but some day you will." That condescending attitude is what makes great villains like you see with liberals and leftist and Final Fantasy villains like Marche from Final Fantasy Tactics Advance.

>>359879029
>it has not aged well
not true at all

>>359879029
>(and older entries as well)
>implying
FFVI is terrible and deserved none of its praise but FFIV broke new ground and FFV is still a standout JRPG to this day.

>>359878340
What's his name?

>>359866803
Fuck off piece of shit, play the game, and still Kafka did a beter job than that Edgy fan.

>>359861939
X-death did more than the clown. Gains full power and uses it to to fuck over the main characters personally man.

>>359879542
Sephirot

>>359879542
THEY MUST NEEDS GO

>>359861037

Can someone please explain to me the appeal of this fedora edgy as fuck angsty teen fanfic tier thread ?

>>359879450
I thought FIV was pretty terrible in terms of plot and characters and FFV is incredible lackluster besides Exdeath as a villain.

>>359870441
>he actually destroyed a world for real

That world was pretty much already dead and all the soul vessel monkey people were successfully transported to the other planet beforehand.

>>359879175
>YOU SEE, THE REAL VILLAINS ARE PEOPLE ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE POLITICAL SPECTRUM
Do you ever just, like, wake up in the morning and realize you're getting old and kids probably roll their eyes when they hear you talking? I feel like you're what happens when all the magic and light of youth finally dies out in a person and is replaced by a desire to be a part of a powerful yet complex system you don't even understand.

>>359878618
Catscratch is just the easy mode gamebreaker that's available to you right away. It's got nothing on magic rages that are way in excess of anything else you'll have for ten hours, rages that can make you immune to everything, or Nightshade.

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>>359867445

When he got all that power, he realized all he could do to do that is snap a finger and everything would get fucked

Instead he decided to give a pitiful life to people and remind them he is a greater god, and will fuck shit up if they try to fight back.

Even the biggest nihilists sought out for human contact in some ways, and this is Kefka's way

>>359879895
>I thought FIV was pretty terrible in terms of plot and characters
Which isn't where it broke ground. Mechanically it was lightyears ahead of every competitor it had and the things it innovated or standardized are still in use.
>FFV is incredible lackluster
No.

>>359880183
I don't care about the fact it brought some good mechanics to the table if the mechanics themselves are obsolete. FFX-2 improves on it's battle system in every way in terms of ATB gameplay while having a better job system than FFV.

When you have a game that beats it so hard in mechanics, then the only thing you have left is the story and characters and in those cases (for the most part) they pretty bad. Like, not Charlie's Angels ironically bad, just plain bad.

>>359880654
>FFX-2 improves on it's battle system in every way in terms of ATB gameplay
Really? Because I recall being able to autopilot through most of FFX-2 with Chemist.

>>359880654

Funny you bring up X-2 then bring up that the story is a god awful shitshow.

>>359880654
X-2's story isn't "ironically" bad, it's just garbage and retroactively ruins X's story
and unlike shit like XII I can actually remember the characters from IV

>>359869850
Kafka murdered a lot of people, destroyed the world and people lived in chaos by years, ultimecia didn't achieved that, or necron, zeromus , or sephirot, or chaos, etc.

Now you can stop posting .

>>359880968
FFX-2 is at least self aware (for half the game at least) that the plot is stupid and you in for the ride.

Older FF games actually want the player to take those godawful cliches seriously.

>>359881113
Necron is literally death and things have been dying since second 0.

>>359880045
You sound quite triggered. Do you need your safe space with Millennials? My bad, demonizing the right and Whites while stealing from the rich and middle class to give to the poor who didn't earn that money and benefits because the poor are just lazy and degenerates is too easy of a tactic to use by the left.

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>>359861939

>>359881113
Ultimecia plunged the world into several wars, and destroyed time itself. Zeromus killed a lot of people too. Sephiroth killed a shitload of people, wiped out Midgar, and nearly killed all of humanity in AC. Kefka didn't do anything notable at all outside of being a crazy clown.

>>359882731
Is Gyigas even a villain? Isn't he forever suffering because he lost his mind and is happy when you kill him?

>>359881224
>FFX-2 is at least self aware (for half the game at least) that the plot is stupid
No it isn't, and that isn't a defense regardless. The plot of X-2 is complete trash and it ruins what was actually a good ending in X. IV has a shitty nonsense story but at least it didn't ruin the game that came before it.

>>359883061
He's literally a fetus upon whom you are performing an abortion

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>>359883351
no he's a Mewtwo depressed that his father betrayed him and stole the secrets of PSI from his species

>>359883008
The best part of that, is that Kefka made more impact in the world than those powerful characters, I mean, Kefka was a normal person with a wicked mind but slowly he escalated to a semiGod and fucked the world by several years and maybe forever, the other villians was just "lol look at me I'm strong already".


Ultimecia? Everything went normal after her death. Sephirot? Comet destroyed, everyone happy. Zeromus did nothing to earth.

>>359862350
Chrono Trigger came after VI, retard.

>>359874061
Don't forget some poor guy living inside of a landworm's belly for who knows how fucking long.

>>359883830
Who cares? Yu Yevon fucked Spira for a thousand years, and possibly more since he comes back in the novel. Caius literally destroys the world with no chance of recovery. Kefka isn't unique in this regard; he didn't even do the most damage.

>>359883830
The world began to heal after Kefka died. Everything is green instead of brown. Also >>359869318

He's gone for 5 minutes and things are looking up. They haven't even landed the airship yet.

>>359865224
You forgot Vayne Solidor, who accomplished everything he set out to do.
He was easily the most successful villain in the series.

He freed mankind from the Occuria, prevented war with Rozzaria, and carved a path for his little brother to become a great Emperor.
The fact that he died was of little consequence, he already won before you even enter the final dungeon.

>>359883939
less than a year, and lavos destroyed the world a lot more than kefka did

>>359861037
I knew 15fags were bitter their game was shit after 10 years of claiming it was the savior of final fantasy but this is too much. Gotta sling buzzwords you learned your first day on 4chan at something that's actually good just to lash out your childish rage that your faggy boy band game is awful beyond imagination.

>>359881113
Everyone was living in fear once Sephiroth cast Meteor

>>359862434
>Those themes aren't new at all in a FF game. Hell, XIII had both of those
>Hell, XIII had both of those
>XIII

Okay but we're talking about FFVI, the sixth iteration in the series not the thirteenth. The themes were new at the time. Don't be stupid.

>>359861637
>because it is funny
Seems you haven't played the game, meme man. Nor has OP.

>>359884061
After how much time?

File: 1436124857769.png (324KB, 624x480px)

324KB, 624x480px

>>359883351
>almost 2017
>there's STILL people that believe the fetus shit

>>359884580

BUT ITS A THEORY

>>359884058
>Who cares?

LOL

>>359883830
>Ultimecia? Everything went normal after her death
Nope she did what she did because SeeD was hunting her for reasons she didn't understand and at the end of the game Squall goes back in time and tells Edea to make SeeD and hunt down Ultimecia. The future is still fucked
>Sephiroth. Comet destroyed, everyone happy
No more Mako
>Zeromus did nothing to earth
It's Zemus and he controlled Golbez who fucked shit up

>>359884634
pope undertale

>>359883830
>Kefka was a normal person
Garland was a normal guy and he was the first antagonist. Also Kefka had magic from the start
>Kefka made more impect
Kefka doesn't beat the emperor who just decides to conquer Heaven and Hell after you kill him

>>359885095
>the emperor who just decides to conquer Heaven and Hell after you kill him
Mateus was one hell of a guy

>>359885349
>>359885095
This world can have but one Emperor, and I am he!
FF2 had a more engaging story than most FF games

>>359875179

>your ass