Life is Strange Max's lesbian harem edition

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>>2051579

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>>2051580

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>>2051582

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>>2051584

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>>2051585

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>>2051587

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>>2051589

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>>2051590

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>>2051592
Excerpt from a comic just heard about looks pretty gay.http://whatifthecomic.tumblr.com/archive

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For the anon keeping tabs on my Amberpricefield fic, updated: http://archiveofourown.org/works/6483064/chapters/15672790

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>>2051579
Max's worst nightmare.

>>2051638
It stopped in March. This is madness, it's too good.

>>2051638
You mean hella gay.

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>>2051638
It's incredibly good and can't wait for whenever the next update happens. Still wonder what this spooky photo means.

>>2051791
rowanred, pls.
The comic is crap. The story is shit. The art is ghastly.

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>>2051768
It's only her nightmare if she's not in charge of the harem!

>>2051834
The only viable couple of this group is Max and Victoria since every other girl is dead.

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>>2051937
...Ignoring that's AU for shame in not saving Kate or Chloe for shame.

>>2051937
>>2051949
Actually all three can potentially die by your uncaring hands.
Rachel is the only one that 100% canonically dies, Kate dies if you suck as a friend and don't talk her down, Victoria dies if you "warn" her about Nathan, and Chloe dies if you decide to stick your fingers in your ears and let her bleed out on the bathroom floor (or OD her, or tell her to shoot the bumper of an old car, or don't stop a train from squishing her, or... you get the picture).

>>2051969
Max x Nightmare Max it is then
Being gay is suffering.

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>>2051969
Damn forgot about the Victoria death, even though I role played Max as a nice girl thinking warning Victoria was a good thing.

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https://www.fanfiction.net/s/11283311/1/So-Hardcore

Relatively enjoyable smut fic that's fairly in-character at times. Pretty sure everybody here's read it? I'm not liking what it does with Nathan and Frank, still hoping it gets updated though.

>Play Love Is Strange
>Come to the part where they talk about Mx. Dog
>Mx
>Be all "oh god here we go"
>turns out it's a fucking hotdog person
Well played....

>>2052274
Also a supernatural entity who chooses to manifest as a hot dog to the player for the lulz, if you go with the Rachel route author's headcanon. 10/10

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>>2051745
Loved the imagery. Amberpricefield nature camping and hotdog-roasting, guitar-playing bonfires is exactly the type of stuff I've signed up for with this roadtrip premise.

I'm genuinely excited for how you'll let things develop here. As of now the dynamic feels pleasantly authentic to me, if a bit muted. But then everything still very much is in the tentative figuring-out phase between them, and especially for Chloe the trip represents that of course.

>>2052274
>turns out it's
a motocrossing hot-dog.

>>2052274
Hotdog Man is the hero we deserve

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chasefield reporting in

I'm new to the board, can anyone suggest some good fics? I often have terrible luck in finding any that are good.

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>>2052375
Awesome, glad you're still enjoying it. The road trip shenanigans are so fun to write, I love how they all play off each other.

> if a bit muted
Noted, I'll be more careful of that in the future. I tried to rationalize Chloe's relative calmness with her having figured out about Frank and already been dealing with the idea of Rachel with someone else for a few weeks now, but. This fucking ship, sticking to >not!angst is a struggle.

Really appreciate the feedback, cheers.

>>2053025
This fandom has a ton of solid fics. What characters/ships are you interested in? Do you have a preference for tone/subject matter/length?

>>2053041
I'm good with drama, sequel-ish, and just general fluff. Doesn't really matter. I like all the general ships within Max's gay harem, but I like Pricefield the most.

>>2053058
I like these two Pricefield ones a lot, both are oneshots:

http://archiveofourown.org/works/5542766 - My favorite post game fic, through Chloe's eyes, about her and Max driving across the country.

http://archiveofourown.org/works/3704613 - Pricefield fluff/smut. It was written before all the episodes were out so it's an AU.

>>2053088
Any others that are longer/on-going?

>>2053090
I tend not to read long form stuff unfortunately.

http://archiveofourown.org/works/4489719/chapters/10206723 - Amberpice drama, it's about Chloe's life in the years Max was away. It looks like it's on indefinite hiatus, but what's there is good.

>>2053090
https://www.fanfiction.net/s/11649076/1/Shelter is my favorite.

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>>2052832
Pls, you're old and busted

>>2051976
That text doesn't make any sense.

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>>2053041
>sticking to >not!angst is a struggle
I bet. But I believe in you! Like you said, Rachel with her no-bullshit attitude will find a way to make things click in a non-angst-ridden way.

That said, precisely because there is so much (constructive and destructive) energy in this relationship dynamic, I kind of like the muted tone because it allows for the "road trip shenanigans" to continue without having everyone too aware of their own and each other's thoughts, i. e. without having even only the idea of the "triangle of doom" casting much of a shadow on their adventures. And you did say your fic concentrates on the formation of the pairing; I would read another 5 chapters of oblivious road trip fun, so don't take this as me trying to make you rush them into their feelings.

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>>2053410
It's a awkward reference to the time Victoria told Max to go fuck her selfie.

>>2053401
It's time for the new hotness!

>>2053177
Pretty good. Any longer ones?

>>2051582
Hot, but I'm pretty sure lesbian ghosts is illegal

>>2054056
> ghosts
You let her die.

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Do /u/ see yourself more of a Max or a Chloe? Do /u/ have a SO or crush that resemble either of the two? Which out of all girls would you bang?

>>2054096
They're gay so I wouldn't. Fuck head.

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>>2054107
Well I'm gay and I would a Max.

>>2051768
this actually quenches my NTR fetish

>>2054096
Max is too much like me that I feel absolutely neutral towards her. And I have a friend who's kind of like Chloe though I have no idea how we got mixed up at the first place. We aren't really that good friends anyhow.
There was a girl like Vic in high school who obviously had a thing for me for some reason. But I was too busy being into some other nice and qt straight girl.

>>2051582
It did

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>>2054205
In Kate's defense different bibles are worded differently maybe she read one that used the word man as a catch all for humanity or some biz.

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>>2054205
Are you talking about Romans 1:26-27? It is by no means clear Paul is talking about lesbianism, and the earlier church fathers tended to interpret it as a condemnation of non-procreative het sex.

>>2054319
That's probably because no one believed two women can even have sex with each other. No need to forbid something that's impossible.

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>>2051587
Fixed Max's skintone

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We need to get more of Max's harem in here.

>>2054490
the original council that decided what books went into the bible threw out several tales that encouraged women to be celebate from men as a virtue. theyre pretty much against lesbianism. at least the christianity before modernity.

>>2054869
abrahamic religions are the only ones that are against homosexuality, every other religion and culture in the world/history before abrahamic religions took over was very tolerant and accepting of homosexuality.

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Adorableness aside looks like Chloe finally got some meat on her bones and it looks good on her.

>>2054096
I always related to their dynamic as me as max and my best friend being chloe lol (except I'm not in love with her)

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>>2055702
why the fuck does their toddler have green hair

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>>2055713
From the looks of things it is based off of a fanfic, haven't read it so can't answer beyond that.

>>2055702
They gotta have crazy good washing detergent if that shirt and hoodie is still in good shape.

>>2055702
SHE GOT GREEN HAIR

>>2055702
That is adorable as all fuck and I love yuri babies, but the implications of that shit scare me a little.

>>2055702
Is this like the color triad thing? Where it's red, blue, green/yellow? But it could've also been purple by mixing red and blue instead.

>>2055713
>>2056243
Don't think so hard. yikes. Chloe's hair is dyed. maybe the dyed the kid's hair for fun.

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>>2056188
>>2056227
>>2056243
>>2056254
Here's the fic I'm a slow reader so maybe you might like it but it seems /u/ so yeah. I gathered you might think it was more /d/ related?
https://m.fanfiction.net/s/11573240/1/Family-Picnic

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>>2056369
Whoops forgot the first half.

>>2051579
No way Chloe would agree to share.

>>2056920
That's what makes it fun.

>>2054875
Are you one of those people who say that gays were everywhere in ancient Greece and that it was accepted?

>>2058379
Do your research and don't make assumptions of people because of one or two posts that was made.

>>2058391
>abrahamic religions are the only ones that are against homosexuality, every other religion and culture in the world/history before abrahamic religions took over was very tolerant and accepting of homosexuality.
Except that's what you said. While it was certainly more prevalent in Rome for example, it was in no way "accepted".

>>2058400
>While it was certainly more prevalent in Rome for example, it was in no way "accepted".
Beside, it was male homosexuality, not lesbianism. Ancient Rome was quite hostile toward lesbianism, Ancient Greece was no better, and China's views on it are lost to time because while they spoke of gay male lovers in neutral terms they never talked about lesbianism. For that matter, ancient cultures barely ever talked about female sexuality in general. You have to look at (some) African or pre-Colombian American cultures to find places where lesbian relationships were acceptable.

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Any good Pricefield fics? I'd like to read some.

>>2058433
>ancient cultures barely ever talked about female sexuality in general
In Talmudic literature, the Ancient Egyptians are known for their liberal sexual lifestyles,Maimonides refers to lesbianism as "the acts of Egypt".

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>>2059044
I love the gal pal pic!

>>2059093
Maimonides was born something like a millenia after the Egypt he's referirng to in "acts of Egypt" ended, and he referred to male and female homosexuality as well as polyandry with this phrase. His source for attributing those sexual mores to Egypt was said Talmudic literature, but once again it was compiled at a time when Egypt had already been Christianized.

Actual sources from Ancient Egypt are scarce, and while there are some stuffs alluding to male homosexuality there's pretty much nothing about female homosexuality. It's not clear either whether it was accepted or not.

>>2058400
>>2058433
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-SjIYKVxHo

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I never expected to learn this much about ancient perceptions of homosexuality in a Life is Strange thread on 4chan.

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Pricefield is the best ship

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>>2060450

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>>2060473

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Bumping for more good Pricefield fics.

>>2055714
Tfw this exact scenario has happened with me and another girl. Why feels

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https://d.maxfile.ro/rnexzncdqe.gif

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>Max's lesbian harem edition

>>2059272
There's irony in here.

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>>2063945
Shame that the servers are down. Hopefully they come back up, that was a quality gif.

>>2062502
That's horrifying. She looks like a zombie there.

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http://blues-man.deviantart.com/gallery/57397995/Happy-Life-Is-Strange-Fanart
Wew, lass

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>not wanting Chloe to play with your boobs

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>>2062549

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>>2054096
I'm more of a mix, but for the most part, I'm Chloe.

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>>2054096
I'm neither and would both. Victoria is delicious too.

100th for Maximum Victory.

>>2066291
I want Victoria to do that to me while Chloe is watching.

>Max's lesbian harem
>implying the only good pairing isn't Chloe X Victoria
That scene in the dark room where she's imagining Chloe and Victoria kissing made me feel all sorts of feelings.

>>2070201
They don't even interact in the game.

>>2070201
I thought that someone made up that scene? I definitely don't remember it in actual gameplay.

>>2070283

Looks like a pixar movie, pretty creative in a kind of way.

>>2070305
>tfw no gay pixar movies with qt lesbians
These are made by some guy who refs other footage but replaces the characters with Max and Chloe. youngechosugar.tumblr.com

>>2070303
It's definitely in the game.

>>2070283
Holy fucking shit, this made me happier than all of the smut here for some reason.

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>>2070529
I know right it's beautiful.

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>>2070529

>>2071851
I will be honest, that is kinda unsettling. Maybe it is the uncanny valley.

>>2070529
Cute fluffy yuri is superior to smutty yuri.

>>2071970
I'm guessing you wouldn't buy a lesbian lover robot in the future then!

>>2071972
Maybe not one that finely detailed.

>>2060450
Ayyyy I know that
But would Chloe be a better Homu or Kyo?

>>2071971
So long as it is accepted that erotic yuri can also be cute and fluffy.

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>>2065541

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>>2072016
Creepy eyes, creepy mouths.

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>>2072025
I have seen way worse. In SFM terms, this is pretty good.

>>2072114
It's not a high bar to pass. I imagine a screenshot of freshly imported models straight up from the 3d editing package is better than vast majority of the results.

>>2072025
I'm just a little mad about the way Max's eyes moving in such smooth, slow and rhythmic manner. Well, her whole face too. And Chloe's left shoulder looking like it's glitching in some way.
Cover Max's eyes or her face and it's better. And imagine YOUR face in there instead!

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>>2072125
I've found default SFM to look plenty creepy. And then try making an animation look authentic.

I agree of course: surpassing the cringy shit SFM "artists" throw together in a couple of hours is not saying much. I was just positively surprised by that one; gotta have low standards in this niche of a niche.

This youngechosugar person is good. Won't be doing lewds though I'm sure.

>>2072457
>Won't be doing lewds though I'm sure.
You say that as if it's a bad thing.
He does it in Maya+Vray iirc, that's why it looks a cut above the rest. There are still small cloth simulation instabilities if you look closely though, but it's done at a fairly high resolution so I'm sure it takes forever already.

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>>2072535
>You say that as if it's a bad thing.
B- But we're here for the lewds!

Nah, I also like the stuff he does now more than I would lewds. I just said that because I thought we were talking strictly in the context of the quality of NSFW renders. Which is a niche of an already niche-y game (and then you have to ingore all the ridiculous het shit too). And in that context >>2072016 is refreshingly "good".

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>>2072560

>>2072560
Are they making out in zero gravity?

http://unidentifiedsfm.tumblr.com/post/146006745344/maximum-friends-done-with-this-one-hopefully-it

http://pomf.nightboy.net/files/qoikve.webm

>>2073246
The cringe is real.

>>2073529
Artist did a good job on Chloe's room.

>>2073577
wtf are these

>>2073682
Looks like Dana wanting to fuck Max with a strap-on.

>>2073080
That is really cute, but that shirt still scares the crap out of me.

>>2072457
Max has absolutely no boobs!

>>2075959
Game Max also suffers from a lack of boobs.

>>2076013
>suffers

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>>2075959
Does too!

>>2076013
They are not big, but she has more than is visible through her shirts. Will provide proof some other time.

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>>2076019
Yeah Chloe would do that and then immediately get flustered when Max turns the tables.

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>>2076319

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>>2076320

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>>2076322

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>>2076965

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>>2076967

>>2076965
I recognize that scene, that fanart is based on this fic right? or the other way around
>http://archiveofourown.org/works/7223566

You only get the end-game kiss scene in the sacrifice Chloe ending? Fucking bullshit. Everyone who worked on this game should kill themselves.

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>>2077838
They ran out of budget by the time they got to episode five. They originally wanted more endings.

Even a happy ending where Max dies... but is revived. This comic is based off of that.

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>>2077844
Besides it'd be really weird if they were making out while their town is destroyed.

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>>2077845

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>>2077846

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>>2077848

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>>2077849

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>>2077850

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>>2077851

>>2077845
This comic is based on some headcannon, I don't think there's been any confirmation that there was supposed to be an ending like that.

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>>2077926
Here's a quote from the artist;

Based on the idea that there was going to be a third ending where Max sacrificed herself for Chloe and ended up in the hospital.

I'm too lazy to go look for any official confirmation at the moment but if it means so much to you I'd suggest you give it a gander.

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>>2077933
That last bit wasn't part of the quote... just to clarify.

>>2077933
>Based on the idea that there was going to be a third ending
This could as well be some fan's idea, tho, but it's not like it really matters.

>>2077844
>>2077845
This scene was also kind of full of holes. Why didn't Max stop Chloe dying by just revealing herself when Nathan came into the bathroom? That would have prevented their confrontation and she wouldn't have had to use her rewind powers.

>>2077960
Someone will tell you that it wouldn't have resulted in Jefferson getting caught, or that Chloe dying that exact microsecond is what's needed for the storm not to happen, or a thousand other explanation and excuses that contradict each other, but I think that's total bullshit.
"It was needed for the plot" is the best explanation you can get.

>>2077960
Pretty much Chloe was destined to die, by Chloe not dying Max altered the timeline. Chloe dies, Nathan gets caught and narc on Jefferson was always meant to happen.

Anyone reading the fanfic where Max is just using her powers to get rich while killing mobsters and special forces?

>>2078083
Ew

>>2078009

I take heart in tearing the photo that Mark gets caught anyway...Sure Nathan dies instead of getting psychological help, but I like to take into account that Max isn't a perfect being. She is selfish, and thinks about her own happiness, thus is willing to go that far for Chloe..if you play her that way anyway.

>>2051579
This game is on sale.

Worth buying yuri? Is it sexual at all or is this all fan art?

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>>2078569
It's about two teenage girls inching towards a relationship.

It's not particularly *sexual*, no. But the fanart isn't exactly pulling stuff from thin air either.

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>>2078333
>my two OTPs consist of one girl dying over and over and the other going back in time trying to save her ass without success.
I'm starting to believe I have a fetish

>>2078592
>without success
What?

>>2078083
W..what?

>>2078606
well, they didn't have success, otherwise they wouldn't have to go back in time.

>>2078610
true but
in the end they both made it out alive

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probably should've posted these in the right order

You know, say what you will about the ending, but it's really satisfying to see Max go through everything the last episode throws in her face and emerge as single-mindedly devoted to saving Chloe.

>>2078633
I thought the alternate timeline where Chloe ends up paraplegic was where Max showed the most intense, moving devotion to her. Would have been cool if you could have had a choice to continue in that timeline.

>>2079680
But the point was that Max would never let Chloe become like this. That's why she goes back and throws away the life of Chloe's father that she just saved with no second thoughts.
Besides the way they wrote it, Chloe would die soon anyway.

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>>2079680
Max's intense devotion to Chloe is what made her go back in time and let William die, so that Chloe never ends up paralyzed. That just goes to show how much Max does love Chloe, which she'll do again during the ending.

>>2080296
Some boards call it stupidly selfish. I call it being human. We aren't perfect paragons of humanity with that mentality of "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few." We are selfish, we have our own wants, needs desires. Why should Max be the virtuous one? She never asked for the power. It came into being through her love of Chloe. She didn't know it at the time of course, but i did indeed come into being for her. Max wants what she wants, and she wants Chloe.

>>2079731
>Be Death
>still working the Price case which should have ended a few days ago in the Restroom
>Come to work late today. Forgot to throw suit in the wash, dirty as fuck.
>Shit.jpg
>Go to office and sit down, begin working out new death orders.
>Decides to get foot caught in railroad tracks should do it
>feelsgood.jpg
>The mortal female Caulfield uses time powers boss gave her to stop it
>wtf.jpg
>Decide to shake it off and continue onward
>Time passes
>Mortal female Caulfield still messes with every attempt on the Price Female’s life
> “Fuck this bitch!” I audibly cry.
>QT Secretary stares at me oddly
>Shit…looked back at my computer screen and pretend nothing happens.
>The two mortals head to junk yard at night.
>The Serial killer kills Price
>Fuckyeah.jpg

>>2081295
>Prepare to close the case
>See the Caulfield mortal about to die
>Check upcoming files to look for her next on the list
>She’s not there
>Plsno.jpg
>Times passes and the time ways are fucked.
>Now Hell bent on killing the Price mortal because fuck all that paper work the Tornado deaths will bring
>About to place next Death Orders in
>Get phone call from higher up
>It’s God
>Fuckme.jpg
>Shrug it off and pick up the phone
>”Hello, Sir..Yes sir..I know she’s still alive, Sir...With all due respect, Sir if you never gave the Time powers to the Caulfield mortal, this wouldn’t be—Yes, sir…I know sir…Mysterious ways and all that…Okay…So keep trying to kill her then?......Wait…are you saying if she tears up the photo just chalk it up as a closed case?! Hundreds! If not thousands of people die in that storm! You have any idea the forms that I have to go through?! Just smite the punk girl and be done with it!....No sir....sorry for the outburst sir...okay sir..If she tears the photo I'll close the case...No that will be it all sir...Yes, I know...work on Christmas as well, scare that old banker as always...Bye sir..."
>Slouch in chair, grab bottle of scotch from under the table
>mfw God’s been punking me this whole time…

Does anyone have a link to a fanfic titled "Life is Stranger"? Its not the fix where Chloe gets Max's powers. It's a Google doc and a multi part fic. Starts off at the final choice of the game.

>>2081283
A problem with the 'let the town be destroyed' ending though is that logically, this is going to haunt both Max and Chloe. I can't really see them living happily ever after; the fact they (well, Max) let an unknown number of people die in exchange for one life is going to stay with them. That's some suicide inducing emotional baggage right there.

Unless the characters are literally sociopaths, which we obviously know they aren't.

Apparently the original plans for Episode 5 were very different and your past decisions were going to actually impact the ending, instead of it boiling down to a single A or B choice. But Square Enix reduced the developers funding so instead we got what we got.

>>2081730
>let an unknown number of people die
I like to think people know better than to stand around and wait in a tornado. As far as I'm concerned only that twat with a camera died.
>But Square Enix reduced the developers funding
Nobody really knows what happened because dontnod's explanations are flighty like a flag in a gale, but they probably had a fixed budget from the start.

>>2078569
It's yuri if you choose the play it as yuri. There's also a guy friend character you can romance instead, in which case the female potential love interest is 'downgraded' to best friend/virtual sister role. If you choose the yuri route you also have the option of hooking the guy up with an appropriate girl, so no one loses out. Well, until the final episode anyway...

Definitely more than worth the 10 bucks I spent during the sale. It's not flawless by any means, especially the final chapter, but it still managed to be one of the most emotionally affecting video games I've ever played. And it's actually compelling and genuinely good outside of the yuri aspects, which is frankly more than can be said about a lot of /u/ material.

Also the choices generally matter a lot more and have ramifications greater than in most of the Telltale games. Since Dontnod's goal was to raise the bar for these kinds of episodic adventure games, I'd say they mostly succeeded.

>>2081734
You can save a few people, but I remember there being at least one dead body lying in the street. It's ambiguous whether the people in the diner survive or not, but I can't imagine literally everyone in the town got to safety.

It doesn't help that the writers themselves don't seem to have been clear on what the tornado even is. Is it the universe seeking a death (or deaths, apparently) to balance Chloe surviving, or is it the result of Max repeatedly fucking with time? I tend toward the latter, since the weird behavior escalates over the week, getting more extreme the more you time travel. But the final choice seems instance that Chloe must die to prevent the tornado (and all the other times in between events conspire to kill Chloe). If it's just that Max needs to be prevented from fucking with time in the first place that starts events off, surely there are multiple ways to stop Nathan and Jefferson, Kate's suicide etc, without letting Chloe die.

And yeah, it could just have been a Mass Effect 3 situation where they simply overextended themselves: too many variables to realistically give each of them the amount of attention they needed. But still, having the ending be reduced to a single binary choice (almost) completely detached from every previous decision was very disappointing. Games like S.T.A.L.K.E.R. and The Witcher 3 have successfully done endings where the outcome directly flows from the sum of your previous actions.

>>2081730
All Max needs to do is look at her Chloe to realize she made the right decision.

>>2081757
>If it's just that Max needs to be prevented from fucking with time in the first place that starts events off, surely there are multiple ways to stop Nathan and Jefferson, Kate's suicide etc, without letting Chloe die.
Remember the very beginning of the game, where Max only uses her powers after Nathan shoots Chloe. Doing anything different is fucking with time.

Making the ending depend on a single choice was fine. This wasn't Mass Effect, where your choices over three games and more than a hundred hours have shaped the galaxy. The game was always about Max making binary choices, so ending the game on one felt only proper.

>>2054490
>>2054875
>>2058400
>>2058433
Broadly speaking ancient cultures seem mostly have have only cared about regulating sex in regards to procreation. Since, anthropologically speaking, the fundamental purpose of marriage is to further family lines and continuity of ownership of property, things like adultery are a big problem because if it happens you can't be sure who the father of any resulting children is, and that can really crew up the inheritance process.

If it's male-on-male and thus pregnancy isn't an issue there seems to have been generally a lot of leeway given. With the Greeks especially it seems like the dudes were fucking each other constantly, in a variety of relationships including pederasty. Female-on-female almost never comes up in ancient historical material, probably because stuff regarding women at all seldom crops up. Their primary function was to produce sons to continue the family line, outside of things related to that role no one really bothered to record much.

Sappho gets a lot of attention, but it's not at all clear if she was giving voice to something that was commonplace or not. There's just not enough information to build on. Really you could look at the lack of evidence two ways: lesbian relationships were as commonplace as male because there was no risk of pregnancy and we just don't have record of it because things related to women weren't felt important enough to record, or it wasn't accepted because women were tightly regulated in general. You could make an argument either way.

But imagining any ancient society as some kind of gay wonderland is wrongheaded from the beginning, since no one at the time would have defined themselves or others sexually like we do today. The dynamics and mindsets are just too different. If you went back in time and only had relationships with others of the same sex but never bothered to produce a kid at some point you would almost certainly have been viewed as a weirdo.

>>2081787
Also, not gay related, but the ancient Sumerians took active pride in prostitution and viewed it as a hallmark of civilization. In the Epic of Gilgamesh the wild man Enkidu is 'tamed' by the temple prostitute Shamhat fucking him nonstop for a week straight. As far as I know the earliest recorded instance of mind break. So there's that.

>>2081748
Yeah but Warren plays like no role in it. They could've removed him from the game and nothing would have changed. He was really just shoehorned in as the alternative straight route for idiots who realize two people of the same sex can love each other. The only thing Warren does in the game is the photo in Episode 4/5, but even then it could have easily been written to be a different character Max knew like Dana or someone.

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>>2081952
He also steps in for both Nathan confrontations. We don't know what would have happened without his interference. And he's there for Max after one of the (potentially) more tragic experiences Max goes through, and in the end again both for the photo and encouragement.

And if nothing else, as the "straight option" (despite never ~really~ being a romantic option), his existence alone serves to emphasize the "lesbian" romance; there is a boy, he is into Max, Max likes him - yet, romantically, she only has eyes for Chloe.

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>>2082090
The supposed Warren romance basically comes across as Max being afraid of her feelings for Chloe and grabbing the nearest male for cover. All Max and Chloe's flirty and romantic scenes still play the same way, Max writes about wanting to kiss Chloe in her diary and she still has a nightmare of Victoria taking Chloe away from her.

>>2081775
>All Max needs to do is look at her Chloe to realize she made the right decision.

This seriously doesn't strike you as psychotic?

If I could know for sure the town was empty of people I would let it be destroyed in a heartbeat. I would trade any number of things to save one person. At worst I'm creating a bunch of insurance paperwork headaches. Okay, probably a bunch of small animals would be killed as well, which I would really like to avoid, but again, if forced to I would trade any number of animals for one human.

But people do die if you sacrifice the town, likely including the mother of your waifu. I just can't bring myself to accept this as an acceptable tradeoff. And I can't see Max and Chloe ultimately accepting it either.

That What If? fan fiction somewhat deals with this, but cops out with things like only Frank dying in the diner. Which feels real cheap; "oh well that one pretty asshole guy died, who cares".

>>2083135
>"oh well that one pretty asshole guy died, who cares".
>implying

Frank did nothing wrong.

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>>2083135
Max was dealing with some cosmic level bullshit that the human mind is in no way capable of dealing with.

On top of the abuse she suffered through out the game that would break a lesser person.

And lastly I never subscribed to that needs of the many crap. Once you reduce human lives to math they become worthless.

Max saving Chloe is the right choice regardless of who did or did not die in the town.

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>>2083345

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>>2083346

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>>2083135
It's clear that David and Joyce would rather die themselves than bury Chloe. It's unfortunate that people will have to die, but it's not Max's fault the universe gave her super powers without explaining how they worked. She is in no way morally responsible for their deaths.

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OT3

>>2083357
>alyssa
>thin

>>2083135
>But people do die if you sacrifice the town
awww. too bad.

>And I can't see Max and Chloe ultimately accepting it either.

now, now, don't project.

>>2083345
>Once you reduce human lives to math they become worthless.

As opposed to all the people whose lives you would trade for one waifu. Clearly they matter so much to you.

>>2083357
>She is in no way morally responsible for their deaths.

She is though. That's literally the point of the final choice. Their lives or Chloe's, you can only pick one.

>>2084215
>don't project.

If you let Chloe kill Frank, Max says Chloe will never forgive herself for it. Letting the town die is the same thing, only writ large, for both characters. Chloe doesn't make the choice, Max does, but she is the cause of it.

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>>2084574
Aside from Kate they really don't matter to me. I'm not going to pretend to be emotionally invested in the lives of a bunch of people I don't know.

As for Max reiterate she's put in a situation and has gone through things the human mind isn't equipped to deal with. Max shouldn't be faulted for saving someone she loves over the town especially given those circumstances.

>>2084574
>waifu
>if I use meme words in a derogatory manner in my sentences, people will take what I say more seriously!!1!
yeah, that's not how it works. calling anyone who dares to disagree with you a waifufag doesn't help your argument.

>>2084574
>She is though. That's literally the point of the final choice. Their lives or Chloe's, you can only pick one.
Are you tormented by all the lives you could have saved if only you had chosen to go to medical school and join Doctors without Borders? I certainly hope not.

The reason Chloe wouldn't forgive herself for shooting Frank is because she would have been responsible for the action. While the tornado is caused by Max, she can't be held responsible for not foreseeing the result of her time manipulation.

This sort of feels as if I'm intruding, but I wanted to add something about the ending.

It's not purely about weighing 1 vs many. It's also about heroric sacrifice. Heroism, the concept of and the question of what makes a hero is a constant theme throughout the episodes. One of my favourite instances was when that nerdy guy keeps hitting the pchyco guy for way too long and afterwards he's basically saying how he doesn't feel heroic at all despite having just saved two maidens in distress, but I digress.

What makes the end sort of interesting is that Chloe is willing to take up the mantle of a hero. This contrasts he earlier shitty tendencies -yet isn't ooc for her - and Max's growing conviction of saving Chloe regardless of the cost. Where the ending fails in this regard is that the game isn't letting Chloe take her stance strongly enough to let the choice be between her and hers. Instead the choice feels too much just of a choice between two internal points of view of the player. Letting Chloe stand more for one and having Max stand more for the other would have made the choice more meaningful and profound for the players themselves. As it is, the ending feel too much as 'So which colour ending to you want, senpai?' instead of an introspective moment for the players and the definitive moment for the characters. I guess they were afraid of taking agency away from the player.

This doesn't mean that one choice is more valid than the other, just more heroic. And in a game with such relevant themes it's hardly unintentional.

>>2084707
You're taking this way too seriously, even the devs indirectly admitted to bullshiting through in order to fuel their morally-loaded ending choice.

>>2084574
>If you let Chloe kill Frank, Max says Chloe will never forgive herself for it.
>Letting the town die is the same thing

Not really. Killing someone by your own hand and being able to stop a magical mumbo jumbo tornado and not doing it out of self preservation is not the same.

It's like you kidnapped a person and forced them to choose a bunch of strangers or someone they love and tried to blame them for whatever they choose. It doesn't work that way, they did nothing wrong, the blame is entirely on you. In this case, the blame is on whatever granted her the powers. Neither Max nor Chloe did anything wrong at all. It's not wrong to want to live or want the person you love to live. You have no obligations to act in accordance to some society mandated standards of morality.

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>>2084707
>I guess they were afraid of taking agency away from the player.
Well, consider how the scene would play out if Chloe really was set on dying and Max chose to save her. She would be taking Chloe's agency away, which could only result in their relationship breaking apart afterwards. It would have been the ending of The Last of Us all over again. Besides, it's more believable for Chloe, even in an otherwise heroic moment like that, to leave Max with the option of saving her. Dying is scary and she just isn't that heroic.

>>2084834
>You're taking this way too seriously
That is never an interesting addition to a discussion.

>>2084842
>That is never an interesting addition to a discussion.
They are right though. It's same old "hurrr greater good or happiness?" babby's first moral dilemma and the game does nothing interesting with it, doesn't even write it coherently. The tornado is literally forced into the story for tragedy points and makes little sense and the devs did in fact say at several points "well we dont know why this happens, lol just go with it and cry" which is borderline disrespectful for their audience

>>2084834
>You're taking this way too seriously
I don't get your point. Are you saying that some experiences are less valid since the devs didn't envision it or write it out in black&white?

>>2084846
>it's babbys first moral dilemma
I agree, as it is it's pretty underwhelming. Hence why this
>>2084842
>you'd be taking away Chloe's agency
would have been more interesting.

Our society revers self-sacrifice and this is echoed in games where often the player character commits a heroic sacrifice. Here, the devs had a chance play on this by utilising a little twist.

>start Max off as the hero who has to figure out how to save the day much as the player would expect
>start Chloe off as a sort of selfish and ignoble, someone who's out for revenge and herself first, relatably so
>have Max and by proxy the player gradually grow into wanting to save Chloe from her inevitable fate by any means necessary
>by contrast have Chloe slowly come to realise - thanks to Max no less - that there's still good in people and worth in Arcadia Bay
>have the final choice be the confrontation of an exasperated and angry Max, who's so mad at fate for not letting her save the most deserving person that she's willing to damn the whole bay
>and a Chloe who can't bear to weigh all those lives against her - in her eyes broken and certainly undeserving - self and doesn't hesitate to volunteer to sacrifice herself when she realises that it would save everyone

Now this leaves Max and the player in an impossible position. The heroine has arisen and the day can be saved, but against expectations it's not you. You'll lose everything you've come to care about and everything you've worked towards. Or you could deny Chloe her brightest moment, the culmination of her growth throughout the episodes and rage against the gods and the the narrative ingrained into us since the very first stories, embrace the true love and and take the chance to make something beautiful which you both undoubtedy deserve.

>>2084945
Are you French?

>>2084945
I don't think turning Max and Chloe into ideological opposites like that would have suited them. They're shaggy indie movie heroes, not figures in a philosophical thought experiment. Besides, that is hardly an impossible position. Forcing Chloe to survive against her will would have been both selfish and cruel.

Also, isn't that basically what happens in Madoka and The Last of Us already?

>>2084979
>The Last of Us

>Murdering a child because we don't understand science is okay because the child consented

Metal Gear Rising covered this. You don't cut out kids' brains.

>>2084985
I'm not really familiar with the plot of MGS games, but every bit I hear only completes the absolute fucking bizzare picture I have of it.

>>2084990
The bad guys of MGR kidnap kids, scoop their brains out, and put them in cyborg bodies. Child soldiers, but better, basically.

>>2084961
Je voudrais. But what makes you ask that?
>>2084979
They are not ideological opposites. What has ideology got to do with anything? Their experiences of their week together make them grow and shape them so that at the penultimate moment they would solve the 'impossible' situation - or a sort of catch-22 if you don't like the previous phrase - in different ways. To make it more interesting and meaningful, have them subtly and unknowingly change their position by the end.

It doesn't have to be about the philosophy, it's just a way to enhance the ending. Make the choice more meaningful and to tie it to the rest of the game. As it is, it's not much of a choice.If Chloe is friendzoned, you'd just go 'I'm sorry' without much of a thought. If you held hands with Chloe, dooming her after you finally have her ,after having literally killed to save her, is weird. It's not much of a choice, really, more of a confirmation.

Also
>letting Chloe die
You fucking monster.

>even this long after the game, there's still LiS threads with a buncha stuff in.
I like you guys a whole lot

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>>2053088
>http://archiveofourown.org/works/5542766

This is bretty good.

I bought the game because of this thread.

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>>2087636
I just got into it 4 months ago,pic related was one of the first pics i saw before watching the playthrough of the game and thought was gonna happen when you save arcadia bay cried for weeks when it didn't

>>2088217
This is sort what I expected as well. Or wanted to happen. Or felt where to story itself wanted to end up at.

>Go back to the very beginning at the classroom
>make the walk to the bathroom through the school, further reflecting on your choice and everything since the first episode while an appropriate song is playing
>don't rip you photo nor take a picture of the butterfly
>intervene to take the bullet for Chloe
>this is followed by the surreal fever-dream sequence confronting the supernatural element and tying stuff up
>an 'after credits scene' reward of waking up in a hospital with Chloe nearby going 'Hey'

I'm sure I wasn't the only one who thought this was it was going to play out.

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>>2088217
It's ok, you can always imagine a better ending.

>>2088341
Why would that have changed anything? The problem was Max rewinding time to save Chloe. The result would have been the same whether she hit the fire alarm, took the bullet or decapitated Nathan with a machete.

>>2088347
But that's not how chaos works.

>>2088347
The reason for the storm is rather vague. Is it due to Max using her powers or due to Max saving Chloe when she was supposed to die? If it's the former, then why would saving Chloe in best scenario not be ok and why using letting her die in the end would be. If it's the latter, then what makes saving Chloe such a crime. Max uses her powers to save herself and many others on numerous occasions. She even kills people. Wouldn't these be just as much of a cause for retribution as saving Chloe?

My own personnel dounat steel headcanon is that the spirits/angels/gods/G-d had planned for Jefferson to be exposed right then and there. Max, however, accidentally - or due to a paradoxical ripple effect of her own time-manipulation - gains her powers and by saving Chloe throws a spanner into the delicate works. This makes the spirits angry for being denied their retribution or just because a punk messing stuff she doesn't understand - the butterfly effect - and prompt them to guide Max towards finding Rachel.

Damage caused by liberal time-travel could have been used as a cause for the time-limit - as in Max has a week to fix the mess she made until it grows so big that the spirits/angels would rather nuke the whole town with a storm than risk letting the damage spread any further. This is why a better surreal scene with the supernatural elements would have been needed - to explain why the storm had to happen and why the best scenario of mid ep. 5 wouldn't avert the storm while Chloe dying would.

This is also why Max dying instead of Chloe would be different. The spirits/angels would still be satisfied with Jefferson getting busted as planned while Max would still get to save Chloe and everyone else without any butterfly effect messing things up later. And as this would be done without abusing her time-powers or leaving any temporal plotholes and through her own free will, this one change from what was supposed to happen would be ok with the higher powers.

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>>2088403
But it is how tired time travel clichés work.

Really, has there ever been a time travel story where the moral is "You know what, altering the past actually is a pretty good idea"?

>>2089017
Of course not.
See, we're humans that don't possess such abilities, thereby our lacking imagination prefers to just pat us on the back saying "everything has already happened in the best possible way" and "you could never get better results with time travel"
It's sad if anything.

>>2089017
Sadly, I can't think of any example.

>>2089019
It's as if they are afraid someone might go home wishing he had such powers. So they try to make sure their audience feels ok about it, as it wouldn't have made their lives better anyway

>>2089017
Life is Strange.

>>2089017
Depends on how you define altering the past I guess. In Groundhog Day the protagonist's last day is completely different from his original one, technically altering the past. But then again that particular piece of fiction's lesson was becoming a good person and not taking responsibility/making do with what you have.

>>2089029
It's not that rare, really. There's Kitty Pryde, Cable, Bishop and Rachel Summers in X-Men alone, the Terminator films, Back to the Future, Timecop, Sailor Moon, Madoka Magica...

>>2084595
I don't actually care if people take me seriously or not. That's your problem, not mine.

>>2084603
Really? This isn't some abstraction about hypothetical people you could theoretically save if you became a doctor. This is a choice between one person or a town full of people. The town is literally right down the cliff from you when you make the choice, you were even in it just a few minutes of playtime earlier, walking past corpses in the street. There's a reason so many of the post-save Chloe ending fanfics wuss out and depict the victims, at least among the named characters, as mostly a bunch of people in hospital, injured but alive. Few people seem able to stomach the real consequences of saving their love interest. You included, apparently, given how you keep trying to twist the issue into an ethical and intellectual pretzel.

I once saw a comment on a video of the Sacrifice Chloe ending the gist of which was the commenter took 4 years of Bioethics and came out with the 'understanding' that since it is morally unacceptable to kill one person, it would be equivalent to killing any number of people. And so sacrificing an entire down to save one person isn't morally reprehensible. Which is fucking insane. Four years of college to make someone educated stupid. In the ending you're forced to make a choice: at least one person must die. If you want to make that choice, okay, but stop trying to morally justify it. The Max who makes that choice is the same Max who makes fun of Victoria or lets Warren keep kicking Nathan.

>>2089374
>And so sacrificing an entire down to save one person isn't morally reprehensible. Which is fucking insane. Four years of college to make someone educated stupid.

Have you considered taking a step back and reevaluating your position before calling others stupid?

The way you're wording it does not even properly describe the situation at hand. Because you are not sacrificing a town to save one. That one is perfectly safe already and needs to intervention to remain so. You are choosing to kill that one safe person, to save the many.

Your arguments would have some ground if this was a situation where both the 1 and the many were in danger and you chose to save the one instead. But that is simply not the case here.

>>2084997
I haven't played Metal Gear Rising, but from the sounds of it these are two very different scenarios. The MGR one is obviously wrong (really it sounds over the top and comically evil).

The Last of Us presents the possibility (it's not at all guaranteed that cutting up the kid would even lead to anything useful) of saving the human race. There would be a genuine purpose in doing it. And the kid herself consents to it.

In the end the main character lies to the kid so he can keep his surrogate daughter. And it's not even necessarily a bad end for the human race; it's entirely possible humanity could shoot and scavenge its way to survival. The whole thing is ambiguous. You could argue for both sides.

But anyway, there was an actual argument to be made for slicing the girl open. Metal Gear saying kidnapping kids to turn into robot soldiers is bad, well, no duh. That's not even attempting to be a difficult moral quandary.

>>2089378
I have taken a step back and tried to reevaluate. The answer is always no, it is not acceptable to offer up a town in exchange for your girlfriend/BFF.

And you know exactly what the choice is: walk away with Chloe or go back in time and let her die so the town is save. One life or many. The scenario forces at least one person to die.

>>2089374
>I don't actually care if people take me seriously or not
oh, but you do care, you wouldn't share your long ass rants here if you didn't.

>>2089412
Killing Chloe makes you a monster, case closed.

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>>2089374
Even if game devs intended to portray the town getting rekt completely, they sure did a shit job portraying it. Why would I take their word for it instead of what their product shows?
And even if everyone died, they could've hidden behind one of the many still standing wooden signs and stayed alive.

>>2089374
>Four years of college to make someone educated stupid.
Says a person with silly babby's first understanding of ethics.

>>2089624
Fucking animals were okay but i'm to believe that the humans couldn't survive that? If they're more ignorant than animals they deserved it.

>>2089646
Never used what, a vagina?

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>>2089652
Ahh the joys of summer.

>>2089624
Let's not forget the game kept throwing in our faces the fact that there were multiple bomb shelters.

>>2089651
You mean the deer? Pretty sure they wandered into the town after the storm.

>>2089630
Rather be a babby than a sociopath.

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>>2089950
Yes because saving someone you love after seeing them die repeatedly (one of which might be an assisted suicide) and going through a physical and emotional hell at the hands of a real sociopath on top of the cosmic bull shit clearly makes Max a sociopath equal to Jefferson.

>>2089950
your black and white understanding of the issue and clear lack of any kind of empathy and acknowledgemet that human lives are something more than a mathematic equation seems way more sociopathic to be honest

>>2090005
No, it isn't.

Saving Chloe is an understandable choice, and can even be completely in character depending on how you play Max. But it is never, not for one second, presented as the morally right option. And both of the characters themselves know that; just look at their faces as they drive through the wreckage of the town in the ending. In fact part of Chloe's entire character arc is her evolution to the point where she is willing to accept her own demise in exchange for saving the town, if that's what Max chooses.

And what I see here is people who are also not able to escape the niggling feeling that it isn't the ethical choice, and so they try to mitigate its results or make excuses. This after the game goes out of its way to show people killed and trapped in the town before the bulk of the storm even hits. It isn't about reducing people to math. Presumably every single one of those people (well, maybe not Frank) matters to someone just as much as Chloe does to Max. If you choose to save Chloe you are putting Max's (and you, the player's) emotional satisfaction above the lives and happiness of an unspecified number of other peoples. It is, by definition, the selfish choice.

And I both love and hate the developers for forcing me to make that choice. I fully understand what sacrificing Chloe means. It means a girl who life has repeatedly shat on ends up bleeding out, with no friends (as far as she knows anyway), on a bathroom floor.

Neither ending is truly a good one, from either Chloe or Max's perspectives. Putting aside the final choice, in either eventuality Max is guaranteed to be a mental basket case because of all the shit she's seen and done.

>>2090635
>just look at their faces as they drive through the wreckage of the town in the ending.
The "shit's fucked, but we have each other so it's gonna be okay" smiles?
>In fact part of Chloe's entire character arc is her evolution to the point where she is willing to accept her own demise in exchange for saving the town, if that's what Max chooses.
That's what you choose to see.
I see a girl who sees no value in her own life and doesn't want her best friend to live with a choice she might hate herself for the rest of her life for making so she tries to be brave and make it easier for Max. But if you choose her it's clear as a day she didn't really want to die.

>And what I see here is people who are also not able to escape the niggling feeling that it isn't the ethical choice, and so they try to mitigate its results or make excuses.
Nope, stop projecting.

>And both of the characters themselves know that; just look at their faces as they drive through the wreckage of the town in the ending.
They're literally driving through and away from their hometown that just got wrecked. How do you even use their sadness there as "proof" of guilt. Would they by contrast be happy and cheery had they not felt guilty? No, they'd still feel fucking gutted to see it.

And morality is a very subjective thing. It's like you're trying to tell us there is a morally right choice in the fat man variant of the trolley problem, and that is to push him on the rails. Sure, if you're a person whose moral compass says the ends justify the means, it might be. But to many the ends do not justify the means. So throwing a safe bystander on the rails to save the people in danger is very much not morally right to them,

Not only that, but Chloe was not even the cause of this, Max was (albeit indirectly). So you're killing someone else for problems you created. Again, morally wrong for many. A self sacrifice would have been more fitting as, additionally, it would also not leave the creator of the problem, ie the power wielder, still around.

>>2090662
>Not only that, but Chloe was not even the cause of this, Max was (albeit indirectly)
I wouldn't even say it would be fair to blame Max for this, indirectly or not, as she had literally no say in her powers activating. They just did. It's not like she signed a contract for time travel powers because she wanted to fix mistakes of her past and therefore bears any responsibility.

>>2090661
>But if you choose her it's clear as a day she didn't really want to die.
I like how Chloe was written there. It made the ending feel more like a dramatic situation in a work of art than a philosophical thought experiment.

>>2090662
>A self sacrifice would have been more fitting
I also liked how this wasn't an option. It's much more interesting if both options are in some way wrong.

Since we're talking ethics and we're past the bump limit, I wonder if Simone de Beauvoir's Moral Idealism and Political Realism was an influence on the game. She writes about facing a situation where a person is forced to choose between saving one or saving thousands and how the former might be an acceptable decision and emphasizes that whatever we choose, many ethical dilemmas leave us with dirty hands. There's nothing about time-traveling lesbians there, though. I guess that's in The Second Sex.

>>2090661
Actually it's Ashly Burch's view of the character as well, and that's pretty close to Word of God for something like this.

>>2091482
>implying a voice actress' opinion is better than other opinions

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>>2076019
>Will provide proof some other time.
Delivering.

>>2090662
>boy, it's sure sad that our town got destroyed. If only there was something we could have done to prevent this. If only there was something...

>>2091500
Yes, why would the person playing character, with full access to the script and story notes, and contact with the writer, know more than the average player.

>>2093276
Death of the author.

>>2093324
Max's shirt is endeering.

>>2093297
Post-modernist bullshit.