Big Guy shoots down Bf-109s, a Ju-87 and He-111 with a buste

>>85339184

>"Alas, I have become the Dunkirk"

What did he mean by this?

>Luftwaffe is a joke airforce

just like IRL

>>85339327
>Luftwaffe is a joke airforce
Right bud, read a book sometime. Best air force in the world at the time.

Why didn't he jump out over the beach and go home with all the other cunts? Was he retarded?

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>>85339375
HAHA

>muh exploding jet plane prototype

HAHAHAHAHAHA

>>85339184
Loved it right at the end when he turns the camera and grunts

>>85339472
>prototype
You said it yourself. For 1944 the Me-262 was a good piece of machinery and it happened to not be a prototype.

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>>85339576
LMAO

>>85339686
>posts a picture that has absolutely no relevance to the discussion at hand
sweetie...

>>85339462
you needed 3000 AGL for the pilots style parachute. He was too low to jump.

>>85339375
>Best air force in the world at the time.
why do wehraboos know so little about history

>>85339184
>Big Guy
For you

>>85339807
I'm a Wehraboo that happens to be right. Name the superior air force at the time.

>>85339791
If true makes the whole movie a lot better

>>85339728
>"best airforce in the world"
>cannot establish air superiority over britain
>cannot defend germany from being razed to the ground
>is only good at bombing defenceless civilians and making expensive failure planes

>>85339807
too bad he's right.

nootka

>>85339970
its true, there were no ejection seats in WW2, at least not in the beginning.

You had to literary jump out or invert the plane and fall out.

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>>85340066
>1940
>Germany being razed to the ground

And so what if they couldn't establish air superiority over Britain? They physically didn't have the amount of airtime over Britain necessarily to complete their objectives. That was a limitation based on their geography, not their ability to conduct air warfare. If Britain happened to be where France was the RAF would have gotten swatted out of the sky.

>lose nearly as many aircraft as the British do
>while operating mainly bombers
>outside of your operational territory

>>85339891
the RAF was the best in the world
It's not even up for debate

>>85340066
Don't forget having their transportation corps absolutely BTFO by the fucking Dutch
Even the French Air Force had a 2:1 kill ratio by the time of the surrender

>>85339576
>1944
A little late tho, anon

>>85340249
see>>85340196

and go shitpost somewhere else

>>85340274
>muh kill ratio
And then the French lost. Thanks French Air Force!

>>85340249
but it is

>>85340340
the french won ww2

>wehraboo so out of touch with reality he actually thinks ww2 ended in 1940

top kek

>>85339184

when it kicks up at 3:20 a tear came down

>>85340366
what part of >>85339375 "at the time" don't you understand?

>>85340478
KEK what? so they were the best airforce in the world at that precise moment? but then not like a year later? why what happened?

>>85339576
me-262 engines were garbage and very unreliable though

>>85340528
What do you mean what the fuck happened? Germany was losing and lost the war. That's what happened.

>>85340600
They weren't garbage and unreliable, they just required more service time for repairs like you would any other aircraft. If you're predicating how good an aircraft is due to how many times it needs repairing then every single aircraft on the planet is garbage and unreliable.

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>>85339184
I haven't been that touched while watching a film in a long while. Just everything about it was beautiful. Definitely the most memorable scene out of the whole film.

>>85339327
To be fair Hardy's team leader was the second plane to be downed. Just the fact that they suffered casualties is more than you could expect from an American director.

>>85339462
Are you people too young to have attended middle school or what is this meme?

I thought it was pretty damn common knowledge parachuted require a decent height to function, that's why base jumping is so "extreme".
And they use modern parachutes, not World War 1 technology.

>>85341070
*First

>>85341181
Yes or no, I thought it was left unclear. However it's the second revealed to the viewer.

so he got himself caught?
what's the next step in his master plan?

>>85341242
If you're talking about the first RAF fighter that got shot down, yes that was the Squadron Leader and then Hardy takes command.

>>85341282
burning his plane
with one survivor

>>85341338
did he start the fire?

>>85341293
I saw the movie today and I'm quite certain it goes like this
>all 3 flying towards france
>nazis
>all three split
>nazi plane chases hardy's team member
>hardy chases nazi plane
>hardy downs nazi plane
>hardy asks team member if he's seen leader
>hardy spots leader's downed aircraft

>>85339576
The british and americans were developing jet prototypes at the time too that ended up being far superior than the germans that came out four months after the war.

You don't get extra points for finishing first

>>85341410
>he shot the flare into the plane to show that the fire rises

>>85339791
Then why didn't he crash land in the ocean like the other guy?

>>85341410
Yeah, they show him firing his flare gun into the cockpit. Not sure a plane would go up like that with no fuel though.

>>85341728
That's incredibly dangerous and chances are you'd drown.

>>85339791
>>85339970
I didn't know that about needing to be 3000' AGL to use the parachute. That seems awfully high to me. I'm more confused how he could glide a Spitfire from less than 2000 AGL, make what, 3 passes along the beach in different directions, shoot down an He111, and make another turn to land, with no hydraulics and no engine.

>>85339184
What's with the DSLs.

>>85341728
>choice of land or sea
>choose sea
hmm

I couldn't even tell which side the planes were on half the time.

>>85342403
American

>>85339375
sure buddy, just like the third reich was going to last 1000 years and germany never actually lost battles because they killed more then they lost.

>>85342190
>choose sea and run the risk of rescue
>choose years in a POW camp

>>85339791
>you needed 3000 AGL for the pilots style parachute. He was too low to jump.
I'm gonna need a salsa on that one my man

>>85342647
I think your idea of crash landing on ocean is skewed by the one plane doing it succesfully during the movie. It's incredibly unreliable and unsafe, most likely resulting to the death of the pilot. Not even considering the fact that he didn't have engines to use for steering.

>>85342706
Why didn't he just guide the plane in the direction he eventually landed in, and jumped out of the cockpit in the area where the evacuations were taking place?

>>85339184
Isn't that a ripoff of Nimrod?

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Name a more beautiful plane

Protip: You can't

>>85342960
bf-109, by a small margin

>>85342960
Corsair

>>85342747
It's already pushing the suspension of disbelief that he shot down the last fighter.

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>>85342960
superior in every way

>>85343259
Horrible. It looks like tinfoil.

>>85343072
It was a Stuka and you're right, it was really dumb. He would have falling airspeed and altitude. Hr wouldn't have been able to turn around and shoot it down.

>>85343259
That needed a British engine.

>>85343381
Wasn't there a prototype with a merlin engine?

>>85343259
Absolute crock of shite. Fuck off.

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>>85343283
I'm sorry you're too pleb to recognize superior American engineering.

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On a random note, which I found interesting, the yacht was flying a blue ensign, instead of the normal red ensign of British civilian vessels.

To fly a Blue ensign you must be:
>British merchant vessels whose officers and crew include a certain number of retired Royal Navy personnel or Royal Navy reservists, or are commanded by an officer of the Royal Naval Reserve in possession of a Government warrant.

So basically, the captain was ex Royal Navy. Thought that was an interesting touch that wasn't really mentioned.

>>85343445
The 303's they used were mostly worthless as they couldn't pen anything not made of balsa wood, and they only had a handful of hispano rounds.

The p-51 had thousands of rounds of 50cals and usually were loaded up with API

>>85343455
we are discussing aesthetics here, fag

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>>85343455
I'm not talking about engineering. I'm saying that the Spitfire is fucking beautiful in a way no other plane has matched.

>>85343484
I was wondering that too, thanks.

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>>85343445
>>85343381
Daily reminder the p51 is the only reason bong bombers could bomb Germany

>>85343531
Looks like someone put a bunch of bubbles on top of a paper airplane

>>85343416
P-51B used the Merlin iirc

>>85339184
Spinoff movie: Mad Tom

>>85342403
They literally have national markings you dunce.

>>85343416
Daily reminder without a Rolls-Royce this plane is a pile of shit.

>>85342403
You're fucking retarded

Not only were they clearly marked, the wings were completely different.

>>85341410

The fire rises, brother.

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>>85343494
>>85343531
And nothing is more beautiful than a Mustang with a garish paintjob

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>>85343681
Yanks proving their lack of taste as usual.

>>85343681
even your corsair looked better

why didn't the Allies just use the eagles to fly to England

>>85339184
it almost has me upset but that just sounds autistic.. but Tom Hardy is the coolest bro in hollywood right now. He shouldn't be this fucking badass but he is.. and I don't want it to sound like jealousy or hating
He really is a cool guy, I would like to hangout with him but he's too cool

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>It is me starts playing

>>85343808
The eagles didn't want to be involved until they decided to carry the Soviets to Berlin.

>>85339184
Ever doubting Nolan

>>85343484
>>85343543
I think his character is based on one of the officers of Titanic who sailed down to Dunkirk on his own personal boat.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Lightoller

>>85339184
>>85339294
>>85339327
>>85339375
this movie sucked DICK compared to Red Tails

Y'all'd've been fucked with yall pastey british asses against nazi JETS

the red tails fought against nazi jets and WON, fuck Nolan and fuck his racist portral of the blackman. Go watch a real film

https://youtu.be/wVgb54D3p2Q?t=11s

Was getting caught part of his plan?

>>85343887
Isn't that the movie where they strafed a ship with guns and made it completely explode?

>>85343887
>>85343940
WE
WUZ
PILATS N SHEEEEIT

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>>85343709
What is going on in this pic?

>>85339184
The ending of this movie was absolutely fucking kino.

T.Hardy is a badass.

>>85344000
Planes take evasive action as Poseidon pops a boner

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>>85343709
>muh Spitfires
I think the reason everyone has such a boner for Spitfires is because Hawker Hurricanes literally resemble big goofy dogs.

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>>85343709
The nose is obese. Only looks good in dark colors. Get over the myth and accept the truth.

>>85344224
No, Spitfires really are aesthetic. They're all curves in a way that's very pretty.

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>that moment he jumps out of the plane and takes off the mask and just enjoys the sunlight for a couple of moments
>looks at the burning plane, knows the nazis will do terrible things to him but he's still proud of his actions

>>85344254
>if i take this mask of will i die

El Alamein when?

>>85344251
I mean compared to the Hurricane. The Hurricane was clearly the workhorse of the RAF and it's sad to see it get little mention.

>>85344254
But that's wrong. Especially for RAF personnel. He likely had a pretty alright experience as a POW. Even a month before Dunkirk they were releasing lads from conquered Norway back to England.

>>85344329
Anyone who knows anything concedes that the Hurricane was more effective due to the amount, but the Spitfire was the better plane.

anyone think the ending was a bit weird.

it randomly flashes cuts between train and the pilot but it looks like an editing error

>>85344352
I'm not saying it's better, I'm saying it's ignored due to the fact it looks dumb and the Spitfire has always and will always be the showcase plane for films and tv.

>>85344329
Especially considering he was an officer. He would probably lounge in some fucking mansion with no duty to work.
Or maybe i am thinking WW1 standards.

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>>85339327
The Dive bombers were designed to bomb stationery targets like gun emplacements or buildings. Boats sadly move, hence their effectiveness in Dunkirk was minimal. Strafing with machine guns caused the most casualties.

>>85344432
He was probably a Sergeant.

>>85344444
Checked those digits.

>>85339375
wehraboos are so easily triggered lmao

>>85344430
>better plane
>looks better
I wonder why

Hurricanes were really makeshift planes compared to Spits

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>>85344254
>WE SHALL FIGHT ON THE BEACHES

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>>85344444
>>85344477

the digits speak for themselves

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Are plane scenes real life or CGI?

>>85344497
I'm not wondering why, I know why. I'm just saying it's disingenuous.

>>85344254
>knows the nazis will do terrible things to him but he's still proud of his actions
it was 1940, they regularily let captured allied officers keep their weapons and sent the enlisted men home right away most of the time. only later when they needed the forced labour did things get rough. especially as an officer he would hardly face any hardships.

>Where the hell were you?
>They knew where you were

Damn, hats off to this fucking film. Really gives the big salute to the RAF and they deserve it.

>>85344477
Pretty sure all British pilots were officers.

>>85342747
>jumped out of the cockpit
You mean just jump it? Do you have any clue what speeds fighter pilots travel in? Even if you ignore the drop it'd be like jumping out of a racecar.

>>85339576on t
brits had the meteor and better engines.

they just didn't need to deploy it when tempests blowing the shit out of Me262's on approach to take off/landing worked just fine.

Also fun fact the spitfire was overrated, most Bong or saffa pilots preferred the tempest. Much faster in a dive and better armament

>>85344581
it really isn't
Chads always get all the glory, and Spits were the Chads of planes

>>85344520
real life, nolan doesn't use CGI ever

>>85344830
>Nolan actually threw Matthew McConaughey into a black hole with a GoPro to shot Interstellar

The madman

>>85344808
>it really is
You know I'm right so I'm just gonna stop here.

>>85344736
They have parachute anon.

>>85344500
>English beaches
Didn't stop the Vikings. Or the Normans.

>>85339184
>He got himself caught

So what's the next step of his master plan?

>>85344998
Ancient Celts didn't have radar.

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>>85344998
>9th century Germanics could invade England
>20th century Germanics couldn't invade England

>>85344998
Or the Romans. Or the Pakis. Or the Africans. Or really anyone who tried.

>>85339184

>big guy
>wears a mask
>crashes multiple planes with no survivors
>getting caught was part of his plan
>starts the fire

>>85342960
Hurricane>Spitfire

>>85344224
cute! CUTE!!!

>>85344721
There were and still are flight sergeants and sergeant pilots.

>>85344989
You realize parachutes takes hundreds of meters to open? Jumping at 100m from an airplane it makes absolutely no difference if you have a chute.

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>>85342960
Not even a weeb, but the zero was prettier. Certainly the prettiest radial engine fighter

>>85345289
Then he should've turned his engine back on until he got enough altitude. Just admit you precious Nolan made a writing error and stop damage controlling every critique you fucking spergs.

>>85343887
Damn, Star Wars Episode 0 looks like THAT?

>>85342960
British pilots complained that it was slower and less maneuverable than the German planes. Read a book.

>>85345484
>turned his engine back on
He was already empty of normal and reserve fuel you retard, did you even watch the movie? My only complaint is he wouldn't have been able to shoot down that last Stuka.

>>85345484
>Then he should've turned his engine back on
wew nice bait lad

>>85345511
>"it's beautiful"
>"pilots complained about its performance, so you're wrong"

>>85345511
>It is an established fact that a difference of only 13 points in octane number made possible the defeat of the Luftwaffe by the R.A.F. in the Fall of 1940. This difference, slight as it seems, is sufficient to give a plane the vital "edge" in altitude, rate of climb and maneuverability that spells the difference between defeat and victory.

Who gives a fuck if it's slower in a straight line when you're using altitude to fight?

>>85345539
Spitfire have been reported to have glided for up to 15 miles.

>>85345600
Maybe ones that also didn't get shot the fuck up by 109s. Why would he want to glide 15 miles away from the beach he landed on? What would he have expected to find, more beach in deeper German territory?

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>>85345045
>>85339184

somebody PLEASE make CIA guy in Nazi uniform

>>85345596
>a difference of only 13 points in octane number made possible the defeat of the Luftwaffe by the R.A.F.
And I thought the reason was the fact that the Germans send dive bombers into dogfights, stopped bombing airfields to bomb radar stations they couldn't hit and that their planes, once having passed the canal and reached England, could last for like 5 minutes before their fuel ran out again.

>>85345715
>Taking the comment 100% literally

Christ. What it's saying is that in a 1 on 1 battle, the spitfire had an advantage due to the engine.

>>85345715
>when your faction's units are ridiculously OP, but you're a complete noob

>>85342960
I saw one IRL once, I wanted to have sex with it

>>85343892
jesus fucking christ how did it take this long?

>>85345715
I thought the Luftwaffe were the best in the world wtf

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>>85345704

>>85345821
Because people are over your played out shitty meme

>Luftwaffle fanboys

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hjz8pAGRvsg

>>85345857
/tv/ is master race of 4chan.
Thank you.

>>85345821
It's already been done in the thread.

>>85343484
Or that the Navy were on the verge of requisitioning the boat when he set off without them. He removed all his civilian gear and replaced it with lifejackets, so presumably this included the flag.

>>85345816
All of the German aircraft were mid 30's models. (Stuka, Bf109, He 111 from1935, Ju88 from 1936) In terms of equipment the Germans were generally mostly on part or inferior to the Allies in the early stages of the war. The technological superiority thing was just post war excuses.

>>85345963
Nope, because there were boats with the red ensign in the flotilla.

>>85345975
Me 109s were actually a match for the hurricanes and spitfires, and the later Focke Wulf 190s were better

>>85345975
>Hurricanes and Spitfires weren't mid 30's models
hmmmmmmmm

>>85344477
False.

Minimum rank of a pilot in the RAF is 'pilot officer'.

>>85345857
Uh, you don't get to bring Heinz

It never makes sense to me how RAF does anything of note in movies while in real life, they were getting their asses kicked on a constant basis.

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>tfw seeing this in 70mm tonight
What will I think? Is 70mm a meme?

>>85346017
Maybe they hadn't been requisitioned yet.

>>85346051
Actually you're the one who's wrong.
>what is a Flight Sergeant and Pilot Sergeant

>>85346077
You've drunk the wehraboo kool aid

>>85345849
Ironically in spite of the aforementioned fuck ups they got really close to actually winning the Battle of Britain. I can be argued that Britain was close to the breaking point when the Germans abandoned the campaign.

In general the whole thing was extremely mismanaged though which can partly be explained by the fact that nobody in the German leadership was particulary interested or enthusiastic about it.

>>85346100
They'd made it to dunkirk, so they presumably had.

>>85346077
>battle of britian
No they didn't, they were top tier, i'm not even a brit. Can you evidence this claim at all?

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>>85346077
1.9:1 KD-ratio, kiddo.

Read more.

If history is written by the victor, where do wehraboos get their information?

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>>85346108

>>85346196
/pol/ and their own head

>>85346046
>mostly on par
do you want to argue that the stuka wasn't extremely outdated in 1940 already?
>>85346040
the focke wulf were indeed better and the 109 got updated to lost through the war. still people are acting like germany began the war with perfect working 262 and tiger tanks.

>>85346133
'Making it to Dunkirk' is irrelevant to whether they had been requisitioned or not.

>>85346208
What the fuck are you using that as a source for?

>>85346176
>LITERALLY the only air campaign where the RAF had a positive kill/death ration, and over their own territory with flak guns no less

>>85346077
It's a bit of a myth, there wasn't a single week in the battle of britain that the UK didn't outproduce and out-attrition Germany.

German pilots were captured at a rate higher than RAF pilots due to fighting happening over the UK and channel (where the UK had better SAR & naval dominance)

Post war analysis revealed that there was actually very little chance of a German victory due to British tech, operational and production advantages.

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>>85345975
Germans had better theory and design. It's just that their manufacturing methods weren't up to snuff.
Germans knew decades before the first supersonic piloted aircraft flew that swept wing was way better for high subsonic aircraft.

>>85346095
>Is 70mm a meme?
Not at all.

>>85346095
Screen is needlessly stretched out sideways but the audio quality of a good IMAX theater more than makes up for it.

>>85346228
Use critical thinking and look at it. The RAF bombed at night and flew far fewer sorties than the USAAF, and yet took far higher losses

>>85346217
>do you want to argue that the stuka wasn't extremely outdated in 1940 already?
No because that has nothing to do with you making the claim that all German aircraft were outdated just because they were designed and built in the mid to late 30's.

>>85346278
>his excuse is that fucking GERMAN manufacturing was bad

>>85346295
>Implying that the start of the war and end of the war are comparable

The fuck are you talking about? The USA wasn't even at Dunkirk, and most of the films about the RAF were during the Battle of Britain, in which they absolutely were the most relevant part.

>>85346295
Maybe it's because the luftwaffe were basically non existent when america entered the war? Britain was attacked, the USA were never that close the action. This falls apart as soon as you take the war into account.

>>85346250
Apart from that time when one (1) Spitfire held off an entire combined invasion fleet of Germans and Italians off Malta.

>>85346311
Yes? The Germans were lightyears away from fielding a heavy bomber like B-29
Or even producing heavy bombers in general in any meaningful quantity.

Are the magic fairies that made the unstoppable Wehrmacht fail the same ones that stole black civilization and gave it to white cave dwellers ?

>>85346581
Probably flown by Buzz Buerling.

>>85339184

Was getting caught part of his plan?

>>85346381
>Maybe it's because the luftwaffe were basically non existent when america entered the war?
Thats not completely accurate, Germany was producing more 109s late in the war than they were at the beginning, they still had a fuckton of planes to throw at the bombers, what was killing Germany was that they were running out of experienced pilots.

It takes a long time to train a pilot, and that's not helped at all by the fact that the 109 killed so many pilots in training. The later models of it were extremely finicky

>>85341282
Crashing this Reich.

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>>85342960
>prop planes can't be perfect...

>tfw no an RAF pilot

reeeee

>>85346794
Put it out of its misery

>>85345093

The dude on the radio sounded like he was doing the Bane voice as well

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>>85344444
*blocks your boats*

>>85339184
can't wait for the epic new memes

>>85347125
They tried to destroy one of the developed versions with a wrecking ball because nothing else worked but even that was almost insufficient. Can you imagine this thing with dual jets? The propeller model could carry 2x1000lb bombs and 4x20mm cannons.

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>>85339327
Okay.

>>85349717
I heard he was a raging asshole and all the other Luftwaffe aces hated his guts. Also he got all of his kills seal clubbing on the Eastern Front. He never got transferred west like a lot of the other top aces.

>>85344977
I know seriously, bravo nolan

>>85347125
it was actually an excellent aircraft.

don't judge a book by its cover...

>>85349717
Who is this, Hartmann? That guy was shooting down measly Soviet pilots. Wouldn't be surprised if he shot down mainly IL-2s.

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>>85342960
>Name a more beautiful plane

There isn't one from that era, anyone who says otherwise either has no taste or is a contrarian mong.

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>>85344224
Hurricane is nice too. Here's based Guy Martin with his Merlin engine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wkxrQOkNdc

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>>85342960

>>85346017

The Royal Navy probably just didn't have enough flags for all the boats they were requisitioning. What happened at Dunkirk wasn't exactly the sort of thing you prepare for long in advance.

>>85343484

Mr. Dawson seems to be a lightly fictionalized version of Charles Lightoller, the (in)famous Second Officer of the Titanic, the highest ranking officer to survive that disaster. Lightoller served in the Royal Navy in the First World War, commanding the destroyer HMS Garry, and rescued 130 men at Dunkirk aboard his yacht while accompanied by his son and a local boy. Indeed, he even had a son who died in the RAF early in the war. I'm not sure why Nolan would choose to fictionalize the man by changing his name and that of his boat.

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>>85342960
Yes, very good... very good...

HOWEVER

>>85346362
Retard, follow back the replies and you'll see the original guy is talking about how the RAF is depicted in movies in general, nothing specifying early war

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>>85350207
>4 in the Lancaster bomber

beast.

>>85346381
America entered the war in 1941, German aircraft production peaked at over 40,000 in 1944

>>85350714
FLYING WAR CRIME
L
Y
I
N
G

W
A
R

C
R
I
M
E

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>>85339327
anon...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_World_War_II_flying_aces

>>85350913
Germans constantly sent their best pilots up time and time again. The RAF rotated and rested theirs, along with the more experienced pilots being busy continually training noob pilots.

>>85351025
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_World_War_II_flying_aces
>It is not clear what impact each individual nation's rules for score crediting have on the counts listed below, although the impact is likely to be significant. Germans credited a shared victory to only one pilot, while the French credited full victory to all participants. British, Finnish and US air forces credited fractional shares of aerial victories, resulting in fractions, such as 11½, which might be for example 10 aircraft and three shares with the second pilot. Some U.S. commands also credited aircraft destroyed on the ground. The Soviets counted only solo kills, while group kills were counted separately, as did the Japanese. Probable kills are usually left out of the list.

Germany having the most aces is even more impressive considering the way kills were scored for French and American pilots. Americans got partial credit for every kill they participated in. French got full credit. Germans only credited one fighter per kill in group fights.

>>85350727
>production

how about looking at serviceable aircraft and pilots, there's a reason why they turned to unmanned rockets. After the blitz they just couldn't field air power on that level ever again.

the Luftwaffe were infamous for have lots of empty planes broken down and sitting on airfields, brits and americans were able to replace lost pilots and repair damaged machines a lot faster. Also actual pilot rotation where as the luftwaffe were forced to fly the same pilots constantly leading to fatigue.

>America entered the war in 1941

and the bulk of the American forces didn't arrive until 42', long after the battle of Britain.

Either way they could deal with the krauts just fine without American assistance late war

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Steinbock

>>85350913
>>85351226
When you look into the history it's not really surprising.

The likes of Hartmann weren't going up against Spitfires or p51's each flight. They were flying against underpowered wooden aircraft that the soviets fielded.

Hartmann himself said shooting down Russian IL-2's was like fish in a barrel, they were piloted by literal peasants at low altitudes rock steady with basically zero defensive armaments.

out of that entire wiki page the only one that stands out is Marseille, he flew against spits regularly and dealt with them well every time.