Why didn't the Rohirrim use bows? Horse archers are the

They did, haven't you played battle for middle-earth?

>>81603927
They did.
For example, we see Gamling using a bow to attack a Mumakil

>>81603927
There were horse archers in the movies. Lots of them.

Why didn't Aragorn wait to release the dead army? They could've swept through Mordor and it would've been done with.

Why didn't Gandalf just put Frodo on an eagle and fly the ring to Mt Doom?

I think what OP really meant was why didn't Rohirrim go full parthian-tactics-mode and harrass enemy with endless hit and run. My guess would be that they never really needed it. Parthian tactics emerged as a tool to counter more organized/heavily armored foe, and as Rohirrim never really went to war with anyone except swarming orcs and dunland tribes, it seems highly unlikely they would ever give a thought about something like hit and run. After all, even on Pellenor, with 10x manpower ratio, the orcs were scared shitless by the usual Rohirrim charge

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4b5IclFJ8Q

>>81604105

Why didn't Skynet just send the T-1000 back to just after the T-800 was destroyed to catch Sarah Connor off guard?

>>81603927
The Rohirrim were historically not based on Vikings, but rather the Polish cavalry which saved Vienna from the Ottomans (i.e. muslim filth)

>>81603927
Rohimmir use light cavalry to defend their vast steppe from raiders. Its analogous to Cossacks in South Russia/Ukraine. The constant likehood of losing harvests ro raiding facilitates that.

>>81603927
>implying

>>81603927
why didn't Sauron put a door to block the entrance to Mount Doom?

>>81604142
>Parthian tactics emerged as a tool to counter more organized/heavily armored foe

No they didn't. Parthian or steppe tactics developed as a means for largely nomadic populations to effectively mitigate their losses and maintain manueverability. The Scythians, Parthians and other nomadic peoples were practicing this way or warfare against each other for years before they came into contact with more organized civilizations. That these tactics were effective against them too were just a nice bonus.

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>>81604152
Why didn't Norman tell Peter he too want to cleanse niggers, spics and other human impurities from the face of the earth in order to establish a white utopia?

>>81604344
That's what I'm talking about... or at least some armed guards. It's not like he had a personnel shortage.

>>81604344

Something about arrogance and pride or something.

Basically the very notion that someone could personally walk the ring right back through Morder, under his nose and then somehow resist it's charms enough to actually throw it into the magma is not just unfathomable it's actually an insult.

Which is why it happens.

>>81604363
You do realise the tactics worked because nobody had fought them before, right? By the time the Western forces (both the German tribes, ERE, WRE and so on) figured a proper counter-strategy, they got their asses kicked because they never worked out an alternative tactic. It was all or nothing. If it was really this super unbeatable tactic then everybody would have copied it and we'd have seen it a lot longer than we did.

>>81604377
He was arrogant. It's kind of a key point of the story that he was arrogant enough to assume the kind of threat he'd most have to fear was the combined armies off all Middle Earth instead of something as humble and quaint as a hobbit.

>>81604367
He didn't like Peter fascination with the SA and Ernst Röhm

>>81604436
That's what I was saying to that other anon. He inferred that those tactics were specifically developed to counter heavily armoured, organized foes. I explained that they developed on their own and, like you said, were effective largely because they hadn't been encountered before.

>>81604180
That's not true.

They are based on Anglo-Saxons but with horses.

Horses being the one thing that let down the AS in 1066.

The actual charge could be inspired by the siege of Vienna, Tolkien didn't like allegory so I kind of doubt it.

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Was Grima retarded?

>>81604105
>Why didn't Gandalf just put Frodo on an eagle and fly the ring to Mt Doom?

How many times has then been shown to be a bad idea?

>>81604706
how come it's a bad idea?

>>81604794
because sauron would have seen it and the ringwraiths would have torn their shit up

frodo and sam only barely succeeded because they were max stealthy and sauron was distracted by the whole battle of minas tirth thing

and the eagles dont like to bother themselves with the affairs of the ground, iirc. Gandalf had to pull some strings and call on them to do him a favour

>>81603927
They did. They didn't go full Mongol because they're based on Anglo-Saxons.

>>81605083
Well, why didn't Aragorn send the dead army into Mordor to clean up? When they were all like "you gave us your word", why wasn't he like "yeah, but do me this last solid real quick."

>>81604377
>at least some armed guards

It's a volcano in the dead middle of nothing. If guards were to be posted there, they'd need water and food, which would have to be transported there, not to mention the orcs would just run away or kill each other out of boredom.

>>81605185
>break oath
>oathbreakers kill you

That's why.

>>81605300
Well what idiot decided that their oath was fulfilled after just Pelennor fields? This army had been dead for thousands of years supposedly, they can't stick around for 5 more minutes? Gimli had the right idea, that's all I'm saying... Aragorn was clearly fatigued, and not thinking sensibly.

>>81605714
>anon in charge of understanding honor and oaths

>>81605714
>after just Pelennor fields?

Somebody didn't read the book.

Shock cavalry =/= hit and run tactics

They were tasked with breaking the siege. Not winning a slow battle of attrition.

>>81605714
>>81605948
i agree with sceptic anon. the oath should have been assisting in the war, not on a single battle. of course that it would have ruined the story but whatevs, it also ruined Pelennor fields battle, it made all the sacrifices of hte rohirim seem pointless.

horses can't fire bows, silly, they don't have hands

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>>81605989
Nah... I'm 9% through FOTR on my kindle after about 6 months. Been busy.

>>81603927

The Rohirim are supposed to be a copy of the Visigoths who settled France and Spain during the last years of the Roman Empire

crossbow > horse archers

>>81604180
What is it with Poles and wewuzzery? They're Anglo Saxons on horses.

>>81605714
>This army had been dead for thousands of years

Look at it this way, douchebag. What do you think a guy called the NECROMANCER could do against an army of dead guys on his own home turf? Beginning to see the problem, assmunch?

There's another issue too. What people who only watched the movies don't understand - aka assholes like you - is that Aragorn didn't use the Army of the Dead at Minas Tirith. That Hackson's invention.

Aragorn used the Dead to wipe out the invasion of southern Gondor by the Umbar corsairs and seize their ships. With the invaders all killed off, he then packed all the regular troops from southern Gondor aboard the captured ships and sailed for Minas Tirith arriving at the height of the battle there.

So, the Dead didn't fight in just one battle. Instead, Aragorn led them on a 5 day sweep across south Gondor killing off all the invaders and eventually capturing their fleet at Pelargir. Knowing he couldn't bring a dead army to fight an army controlled by a dead guy, the Witch King, and owned by Sauron the Necromancer, Aragorn announced that the oath had been fulfilled and let the ghost depart.

Things usually make sense when you know what REALLY happened instead of relying on the Hollywood version.

>>81606132
No they're not. Why don't people look into things before posting an opinion?

The Rohirrim were designed to be the Anglo-Saxons if they hadn't been invaded by Normans and developed horsemanship.

LOTR was written to be an English mythology because ours got lost.

>>81606432

why don't you look thinks up before spouting we wuz shit

>>81606432
so today's london is mordor`? makes sense

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>>81603927
They did use bows. But for those who didn't, sometimes you just can't expect people to take the right decisions. See 18th century line formations not using any kind of cover what so ever

>>81604147
L I N D Y B E I G E

>>81603927
They're not mongols

>>81606487
AHAAAAA

>>81606476

Cover was only useful to fend out cav attacks in a pre-flintlock world, once people got rid of the matchlock guns that were protected by a pike wall or barricades the formations became much more mobile

>>81606476
Because after the first volley you couldn't see shit anywy. That's why they had such bright uniforms, that you could tell friend from foe.

>>81606476
>spread out: cavalry fucks you up
>tight formation: cannons rip you to shreds
what a time to be alive.

>>81606419
OK. But, just to be clear, was the Witch King not killed on Pelennor fields? By Eowyn? Was that not accurate to the book?

>>81606460
http://www.councilofelrond.com/litarticle/the-rohirrim-and-the-anglo-saxons-an-overview/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rohan_(Middle-earth)

You do realise Tolkien said LOTR is filling in the gap of English mythology himself? How is that WE WUZ? If you didn't know this then please leave and go back to your capeshit you basement dweller.

I cringe at supposed LOTR fans not knowing what the Rohirrim were based on. These faggots also think the Shire is based on Ireland and Sean Astin did an Irish accent lmao

>>81606487
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcrxNBlqrbM

>>81606419

This essentially.

Return of the King jumped the shark when the dead showed up at Pelennor.

I want to see real african nignogs like those nigerians make a 3 hour blacks only super low budget Nollywood LotR movie so bad. Complete with crazy action scenes. I would probably buy it if they made it available for purchase.

>>81606579
Cannons weren't that effective in field battles until Napoleon.

>>81606741
Why?

>>81603927
In books, every single Rohirrim outside of royal guard carried a bow. Mumakils were no problem for them.

>>81606759
Because I want to watch such a movie, that's why.

>>81606606
>OK. But, just to be clear, was the Witch King not killed on Pelennor fields? By Eowyn? Was that not accurate to the book?

The Witch King was killed before Aragorn arrived but, because no one has any FUCKING RADIOS, Aragorn doesn't know that until he lands with his troops, fights in the battle, and talks with Gandalf, Eomer, etc. afterward.

Furthermore, Aragorn loaded his troops aboard the captured corsair fleet TWO DAYS BEFORE the battle of Pelennor Fields began. It takes time to sail and/or row up the Anduin.

Aragorn had to plan according to what he knew at the time.

>Tolkien rendered Rohirric as the Mercian dialect of Old English. Even words and phrases that were printed in modern English showed a strong Old English influence. Old English was supposed to render an archaic form of Westron, which was supposedly rendered by Modern English.
>The names and many details of their culture are in fact based on Germanic-derived cultures, particularly that of the Anglo-Saxons and their Old English language, towards which Tolkien felt a strong affinity. Ultimately Anglo-Saxon England was defeated by the cavalry of the Normans at the Battle of Hastings, and some Tolkien scholars have speculated that the Rohirrim are Tolkien's wishful version of an Anglo-Saxon society that retained a "rider culture", and would have been able to resist such an invasion.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rohan_(Middle-earth)

The Rohirrim aren't based o Mongols or Hussars so stop that shit right now.

t. Mercian who lives in a region that literally had a monarch called Eomer

>>81606744
>Cannons weren't that effective in field battles until Napoleon.

You simply cannot be that stupid.

Tell you what, pop over to the /hwg/ thread here on the board, tell the historical wargamers that, and say goodbye to your anus.

>>81606419
the BOOK version would have been way more epic

>And then wonder took him, and a great joy; and he cast his sword up in the sunlight and sang as he caught it. And all eyes followed his gaze, and behold! upon the foremost ship a great standard broke, and the wind displayed it as she turned towards the Harlond. There flowered a White Tree, and that was for Gondor; but Seven Stars were about it, and a high crown above it, the signs of Elendil that no lord had borne for years beyond count. And the stars flamed in the sunlight, for they were wrought of gems by Arwen daughter of Elrond; and the crown was bright in the morning, for it was wrought of mithril and gold.

>>81606937

>Thus came Aragorn son of Arathorn, Elessar, Isildur's heir, out of the Paths of the Dead, borne upon a wind from the Sea to the kingdom of Gondor; and the mirth of the Rohirrim was a torrent of laughter and a flashing of swords, and the joy and wonder of the City was a music of trumpets and a ringing of bells. But the hosts of Mordor were seized with bewilderment, and a great wizardry it seemed to them that their own ships should be filled with their foes; and a black dread fell on them, knowing that the tides of fate had turned against them and their doom was at hand.

>>81606976

>East rode the knights of Dol Amroth driving the enemy before them: troll-men and Variags and orcs that hated the sunlight. South strode Éomer and men fled before his face, and they were caught between the hammer and the anvil. For now men leaped from the ships to the quays of the Harlond and swept north like a storm. There came Legolas, and Gimli wielding his axe, and Halbarad with the standard, and Elladan and Elrohir with stars on their brow, and the dour-handed Dúnedain, Rangers of the North, leading a great valour of the folk of Lebennin and Lamedon and the fiefs of the South. But before all went Aragorn with the Flame of the West, Andúril like a new fire kindled, Narsil reforged as deadly as of old: and upon his brow was the Star of Elendil....

>>81606881
>my source of information about historical events are LARPers

-you

>>81603927
the banished rohirrim used bows atop horses in two towers

>>81607010
>>my source of information about historical events are LARPers

No. My source of information is serving as a redleg for 20+ years.

You know NOTHING about the history of artillery or it's historical uses. NOTHING.

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>>81604428
>Which is why it happens
Yup.. That's exactly what happens.

>>81607084
its*

>>81604377
What use would guards be if they were carrying a ring that made the wearer invisible

>>81604706
0 because it's a good idea

>>81606744
Napoleon was formally trained in field artillery for a reason.

>>81604428
>Which is why it happens.
Not exactly. Even Frodo succumbed in the end, but Smeagol fucked everything up.
You are right, but also a series of unfortunate events is what fucked up Sauron too.
Going off Hackson's "vision" as it is fresher in my mind, but I think the book is basically the same in that regard.

>>81604436
>>81604526
what was the counter-tactic?

>>81605245
should have just made one of those magic words that needed a password to open

I know it's not in the books but in the movie Isildur and Elrond walk straight into it and almost throw the ring so there's precedence, and if you consider the videogames as part of the """"extended canon""" there was also people that sneaked in and forged another ring

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>>81603927
>Horse archers are the most powerful pre-gunpowder warriors in history, after all

>>81604180
t. Vladislaw

>>81603927
I would really like to see Genghis Khan's midget horse riders face massed steel assault of Carolingian cavalry

with you in the middle of the battlefield

>>81609830
It happened with the Teutonic Knights.
Teutonic Knights got fucked into oblivion.
The only reason we don't speak gook is because Genghis died of old age and Kublai was a culture-cuck.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Legnica

>>81607002
Im still buttmad they didnt include the arrival of all the fiefdoms shortly before the siege began.
And I'm even more mad that they didnt include the fucking Grey Company.

>>81608181
>Fortifications to deny foraging and ensure area control
>Massed foot archers to ensure a greater volume of fire in a more concentrated area than what horse archers could achieve
>Light cavalry to chase them off/harry them
>Horse archers of your own

>>81609830
The only country in history that the great Khanate didn't manage to conquer after an invasion was, ironically enough, Vietnam.
They employed early guerrilla tactics, led them to completely empty fortresses and then ambushed them on their way back, faked retreats, the works.

The only to win against the Golden Horde was to outsmart them, all the battles of Hungary, Poland and the Russian nobles against them in open field were massive defeats for the Yuropoors.
Also you talk about midget, ancient Romans were shorter than Gauls and Germans and Britons but they still won the important battles because TACTICS, a man is more than the sum of his lifts.

>>81609922
>Infantry, Polish conscripts, mercenaries, Bavarian miners, mounted knights

basically peasants with few knights in armour

also it's a minuscule battle, barely 10k on either side.

there is a reason mongol invasions happened at the time when western europe was still in dark ages

why didn't they go after byzantium? kinda unusual for mongols to keep them in their good graces, right?

>>81610109
romans got humiliated by hannibal and the germans though. they overcame these defeats through having much more legions at their disposal.

>>81603927

it's a cowardly mongoloid tactic

>>81610109
what about battle of mohi? it was a large battle, mongols won but barely had any troops left after that. how would they conquer europe without troops? that's just the western europe vanguard they slammed against, mind you.

>>81610110
dark ages meme i love it

>>81610139
nice try kraut, germans can only win with subterfuges

>>81610139
>germans
An ambush, of course they'd lose and they didn't bother conquering Germany outback because what were they supposed to do with useless territory?
>Hannibal
A brilliant tactician that got the drop on them because no one thought you could cross the Alps with such an army, again the element of surprise.
Still, my point is that thinking that muscles or personal strenght even matter in organized warfare is just foolish, it's all about logistics and organizaton.

>>81610110
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Kalka_River
80,000 Rus nobles vs 20,000 Mongols
Complete Mongol victory.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Mohi
Main forces were Templar Knights and light cavalry
80,000 vs 70,000
They still lost.

Again, the only way to win against these goblin fuckers was to bunker up and let them starve, the problem with this tactic being that their empire was as big as a fucking continent and their logistics were almost flawless if it weren't for cousins fighting over the throne.

>>81610375
here, let me educate you.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Mongol_invasion_of_Hungary#Military_reforms

now look at the result.

>>81605083
>be stupid stuck up eagle
>don't do shit for ground people
>Sauron likely to win
>orcs fuck up nest

Was Manwe retarded?

>>81610256
let me educate you as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6qYjisp51M

>>81604671
>Tolkien didn't like allegory
Tolkien was infamous for lying in interviews. After his letters came out, it was revealed that he lied constantly in interviews and even bragged to CS Lewis about it. (Source: My english professor who is a Tolkien scholar and has his name in the book about it)
Of course he likes allegory. The Lord of the Rings is a heavy-handed allegory for Jesus Christ, as well as many other things like industrialization and real world historical events.

>>81610405
Because Hungary learnt from the first time when they got completely ass ravaged and built a shitton of castles, further proving what I said here >>81610375
>Again, the only way to win against these goblin fuckers was to bunker up and let them starve
They turtled which is the only way to win against Nomadic armies.

>>81606850

My impression from the films was that the ringwraiths could be temporarily defeated ("killed") by humans, but then would simply respawn somewhere in Mordor.

Didn't Aragorn burn them in the book, like he did in Fellowship?

>>81610598
That's just a bunch of "he said, she said" bullshit. He doesn't like faggots of his day who asked if the One Ring is an allegory for atomic bombs, or if Mordor is Nazi Germany or Soviet Union.

>>81603927
Because arrows aren't that useful against armour. Harassing an enemy that has no reason to chase you or flee is also not going to work.

>>81610615
i guess you missed the part where they got routed in a pitched battle

also, again let's go back to battle of mohi. it was an equal strength battle, mongols were led by subotai and lost so much men they couldn't invade germany afterwards, retreated, then got annihilated when they came back.

i don't see any evidence of horse archers not being figured out completely by european armies at that point.

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>>81603927
>Horse archers are the most powerful pre-gunpowder warriors in history

>>81606559
>That's why they had such bright uniforms, that you could tell friend from foe.

This has to be a burger saying this.

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>>81606487
There's literally and unironically absolutely no reason not to use based Lindy as your primary source of history.

>>81604436
Also the tactics heavily relied on big, open plains and having plenty of horses, more horses than men actually, so they could switch any time a horse got wounded, died or just got exhausted. That's why they could move so fast and surprise the enemy. Anywhere outside steppe terrain where horses didn't have enough grass to eat it wasn't that viable, let alone once their tactics was figured out.

>>81604794
>Huge fuck off eagle flies right at fully garrisoned Black Gate which can probably put out several hundred arrows every volley
>Plus all 7 Ringwraiths
Seems like a fantastic idea

>>81603927
>Horse archers are the most powerful pre-gunpowder warriors in history, after all.
this is what retards who dont understand logistics actually believe

>>81605083
Also, those "eagles" were like eagle-shaped angels. That means that is not a good idea rub the ring on their face (see how Gandalf and Galadriel reacted).

>>81604428
But that didn't happen, what happened was that Frodo took the Ring to the heart of Sauron's kingdom, announced that he had it, and he would have been torn to shreds by the Nazgul if God himself hadn't pushed Gollum to a lava pit.

>>81611119
There are huge stretches of unguarded mountains to either side of the black gate you mong.

And the Ringwraiths weren't ready for rapid deployment at any time. During the council of Elrond they were specifically known to be out of commission temporarily.