>Plot Synopsis Retirement aged man with no savings, investments,

>>80186748

Why didn't Ken Loach direct a film starring a homeless man dying of pneumonia as he waits for a council house while a carpenter lives in a council house for 30 years?

Because it wouldn't fit his bullshit world view

>win at Cannes
>not even nomination for oscar
fucking plebbes

also I don't like Loach's realism. Too much life, not enough movie.

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>>80186899

>realism

No. This scene

This awful, awful film and summed up by this one scene.

Two tramps start vandalising public property and the general public start cheering them on and start booing when he's arrested. Its meant to be a feel good, poignant moment but its so disconnected from reality. Does Ken Loach ever leave the house?

I'M URINATING IN YOUR MOUTH

>>80187194

This, so much


>I'm a carpenter that has managed to save no money in thirty years despite having no family and marketable skills

Unless he literally burns his money there is no reason he shouldn't be able to have enough to wait a few weeks until his pity-money is sorted out.

I, Daniel Blake is a fantastic film in that it shows you how completely retarded people on benefits are and how they're virtually incapable of planning for the future.

>>80187762
>earn nothing
>plan the future
are you ok, sir?

>>80187782

He was a carpenter for 30 years.

With that experience he would be earning the average for an experienced tradesman, £19 ph

http://www.payscale.com/research/UK/Job=Carpenter/Hourly_Rate

He constantly said he had worked hard all his life, assuming he worked 48 hours a week that's £912 a week, £3642 a month, or £43,776 a year.

He had no dependants, and yet despite earning nearly double the average national wage he managed to have nothing to show for it.

One can only assume Daniel Blake had a heavy coke habit, as that would explain why he has no money, no marketable skill, and a shitty heart.

What would have have done when he retired in a few years, live off dog food?

>>80187970

I know people like this irl.

I earn not much above minimum wage. Manage to scrape by.

I have friends who are tradesman, earning between 70-100k a year, live at home and don't pay rent, and are thousands of dollars in debt and spend all day whining about the government making it impossible for them to live.

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>>80188167

Remember, this gif is our protagonist.

>so I just had a heart attack and can't work because my fibromyalgia
>Oh and now my car doesn't work
>Oh would you look at that a tree fell through my home
>Oh man, my insurance check for both the house and the car didn't get mailed since the Tories cut $100k of funding to the Royal Mail and so now I'm totally uninsured!
>I sure wish I could work.. but...
maybe there's an office job!
>Oh wait I'm computer illiterate and all I've been doing the last 30 years is laying concrete and the remaining 16 hours a day I just fill time with whatever.
>Fucking Tory scum
>I can't believe this government agency is deciding my gibs on a questionnaire rather than just how pitiful I look!
>I'll show them
>die from shitty heart from working as a construction laborer for 45 years making no advancement in life or career
>RIP
>don't forget to vote Labour

>>80188167

I have nothing against plebs accepting state sponsored charity. I say charity as that's what it is. Benefits is a misnomer - it's not a benefit, as there is no benefit to anyone. The poor are encouraged to stay poor, at everyone else's expense.

What I object to is dole scum not feeling the appropriate amount of shame for accepting this charity. Daring to use it as a life style choice to engender their own laziness, rather than using it how it should be used, a stop gap between employment.

>>80186748

Also, his heart was fucked. He would have died even if the hospital didn't fuck up and didn't send his paper work across.

The system is difficult for good reason, when you're handing out state funds you need accountability and several checks to discourage fraud, as fraudsters will try to game the system.

Had his hearing gone ahead he would have got his money, the hearing would have cost the tax payer thousands and Daniel wouldn't have to pay it back.

Aside from the fact the film is very biased, it's shows the benefits system in this country works.

oh good another conservative thread

Watching it now. Wish me luck.

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>>80189086
>What I object to is dole scum not feeling the appropriate amount of shame for accepting this charity
>poor people should feel bad for being poor

>>80189712
15 minutes in. Fuck it's like Tyrannosaur all over again. Help.

>>80189857
which was a great film as is daniel blake

>>80189086

I don't even have anything against the dole or poor people using it.

But when I see m8's who, if they limited themselves SOMEWHAT, could own a studio flat by now, crying that they can't get any Bennies despite having 50,000 dollar cars that they write off on tax, I feel like some people really have no clue that the government isn't their (already generous) parents.

>>80188325

Is the character just being a difficult smart ass there or are we meant to believe an adult male couldn't figure out how to use a mouse?

>>80189912
>as is daniel blake
it features really bad comedy and unremarkable cinematography. so far, not impressed. at least it's not edgy as FUCK like Tyrannosaur.

>>80189977
I'm sorry but if you cant into ken you are a fucking undesirable

>>80190002
Whatever, it seems to be a hundred minutes of hideous British people shouting at government employees. Cannes is a joke.

>>80189972
most people over the age of 50 havent touched a computer in their life m8

>>80190079
kill yourself you utter pleb

i've been on benefits before and honestly having to deal with the people at the job center was so uncomfortable i never want to be unemployed again

>>80190105
Sorry I offended you mate. But Cannes is a total fucking joke. Dheepan could have been amazing, but it turned into a shitty crime thriller in the second half. Fahrenheit 9/11 is garbage. The White Ribbon is well-made but that's not why it won and you know it. In fact, I can't think of a single winner of the last 20 years that deserved it.

>>80190148
why are you talking to me like im some cannes representative or if i care about cannes at all?

>>80190197
Because I am pissing all over your face and it's salty and in your eyes.

>>80190143
>I've been on benefits before
Get some dignity if I was you I would rather kill myself or be myself

suck it up buttercup snowflake sjw

>>80190148
typical plebeusz

>>80190599
Why?

>>80190680
My favourite hollywood capekino never won anything booooo

Or

Any rightist propaganda never won anything boooo

>>80190779
Yeah leftist propaganda winning is soooooo much better.

Tree of Life is the only winner of the last 20 years that's good.

>>80190795
That is what I thought. Hollywood murrica must win. Go watch some ACADEMY awards

>>80190839
America has the most Palme wins out of any other country. We own you, we own the world.

>>80190851
You dont own me. All i have comes from china

>>80190875
And it'll be reduced to ash when we bomb the shit out of you.

>>80190890
T. Poland
We are friends and allies don't bomb pls

>>80190931
Then don't fucking defend Cannes to me you piece of shit.

>>80190947
Ok lets talk about Venice then

>>80190975
Ok. Fucking Jackie wins best screenplay. WHY?!

>>80191060
Revolutionary didascalia

>>80189972
>or are we meant to believe an adult male couldn't figure out how to use a mouse?
Yes, a good number of men who worked as cooks, machinists and labourers prior to the 80's and workplace safety overhauls now have hand tremors from RSI's or other workplace injuries and are incapable of ever competently operating a computer.

Tragedy is watching an old man reduced to tears trying to lodge a job application online because every time he painstakingly lines up the cursor tries to tick the disclaimer box his hand spasms and it gets thrown to the other side of the screen.

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ITT: Americans

>>80186748
what dull twit would actually consider this TV movie a masterpiece?

>>80191908
bafta.

>>80186748

>Had a full time job
>Lived in a council house his entire life
>didn't purchase a property in Newcastle with a full time job in the 70s
>A chippy with 30 years experience couldn't find work in 30 minutes for some reason

:^)

One of two things explains this film

1. He spent every single penny he earned in the bookies and in the pub

or

2. He burnt his money whenever he received it

>>80189453

This.

The fault in the system is that he didn't have any savings, investments, assets or pension. I mean I'm 25 and I'm saving money for a rainy day, shit happens. Our hero Daniel Blake was what 55 and still living in a council house despite the fact he worked all his life? That's the real fault

That is ultimately his fault and the question should be how do we incentivise behaviours which would lead to the things I wrote above.


Basic economics

>>80190143

Don't call them benefits. Call them charity.

See

>>80189086

I was on unemployment benefits for 6 weeks over the summer. Shit was horrible and I made sure I sent out 12 applications a day, going on any interview I could get until I was employed. I didn't even need to because I have a lot of savings.

Being unemployed and on benefits sucks.

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The Official 'what should you do in Daniel Blakes position' Tier Rankings

Partrician Tier
Live off investments, Early retirement, Alternative source of income

Responsible Member of Society Tier
Live off savings, Remortgage House, Rent out room

Acceptable Tier
Sell car, Sell luxury goods

Medically Retarded Tier (The 'Ken Loach/Daniel Blake' Special'
Do nothing for 30 years, Throw money out the window, Vote Corbyn, Die

>>80192244
Not meant to be enjoyable it's meant to be a safety net. The point of benefits is to get off benefits

>>80192264

This. People on benefits are living at the expense of all of us. It is our duty to make sure they understand this.

>>80192264
what about people with on arms, no legs or down syndrome people?

>>80192325
They can work part time. I see downsies ripping movie tickets all the time.

>>80192325

Most employers have a quota of disabled people. If you're missing a limb you're almost certain to get a decent paying office job if you put a tiny amount of effort in.

If you've got Down syndrome you should get assistance, but don't call it a benefit, its charity.

>>80192325
Two points

1. If they cannot be productive members of society then they should be viewed as charity cases and should be treated as such. Not in a derogatory way they are literally charity.

2. Many disabled people and their families are desperate for work because it gives them self worth and autonomy. Downs Syndrome in particular parents are DESPERATE for their kids to go out and do something. If you change the system it makes it even less likely employers will hire disabled people.

>>80192334
and you're honestly telling me that down syndrome type people can live off their part time job ripping movie tickets?

Why does this movie trigger conservashits so much?

>>80192373
no. that's why the majority of them live with their parents. that's why their parents collect a social security check every week on their behalf.

>>80192381
because poor people don't deserve dignity and the movie preaches the opposite.

>>80192375
hatred of the poor and the empathy gap

>>80192400
>americans

Why do you hate poor people ? And why do you live to work ?

>>80190143
>having to deal with the people at the job center was so uncomfortable i never want to be unemployed again

This is not a coincidence.

t. used dole for 18 months, never again

>>80192402
> carpenter for 30 years
> poor

>/tv/ NEETs boiling down political and social situations that they've only witnessed through the lens of /pol/

I love these episodes. It's like watching monkeys discuss economics.

>>80192436
>/tv/ NEETs boiling down political and social situations that they've only witnessed through the lens of /pol/
I don't know what this means
talk like a normal person

>>80192402
But I'm poor and have lived off of public welfare before and I think this movie was fucking retarded.

When I was on welfare I was 19 years old and didn't have a career.

Daniel Blake worked for decades as a tradesman living in a council house. Others in this thread have pointed out exactly why he is the only one responsible for his situation.

>>80192418
>Why do you hate poor people
Because they are a blight on society. Dirty unwashed beggars hanging around transit hubs begging me for money for "food" (heroin, alcohol, etc). Sick of smelling the urine in Penn Station, the shit, the cracked faces and sleeping urchins. Disgusting subway cars. Hopeless washed out eyes.

>>80192418
>Why do you hate poor people ?
why do you love them?

people in this thread should become Christians it would make them better people

>>80192430

Again, you can't use logic with these people

My Aunt's fella has been a chippy all his life and is fucking minted, he lives in Manchester, which is about as crap as Newcastle.

I want one of the bleeding hearts in this thread to answer.

1. After 30 years of non stop hard work as a well paid tradesmen did Daniel Blake, literally, not have a penny to his name?

>>80187970
I'm sure you work 9.5 hours a day. Get fucked, loser.

>>80192375
Because they are temporarily embarrassed millionaires and they can't comprehend the plot of the movie.

He isn't retired. He had a heart attack at work and his doctor told him he isn't allowed to go to work or he might die. So he tries to navigate the benefits system until that time he is able to work again. The system, however, is fucked and doesn't have a protocol in place for hos situation, he doesn't fit neatly into any of the categories. This is compounded by the fact that almost everything is digital now so someone who hasn't used a computer in their life (yes, people like that exist) needs help, but can't get it because the job centres are understaffed due to budget cuts.

This situation wouldn't happen in Norway or Denmark. If you lose your job in Norway, or somehow can't work, your job will pay you a lump sum of 9 to 12 months worth of salaries. If you haven't found a job in that time, the government will pay you 75% of your previous salary a month for up to two years. In Denmark the situation is similar, except the government will pay your full salary for a year.

Americucks don't know how bad they have it because they can't afford to travel to actual first world countries but go to shitholes like Mexico and then feel proud their country is barely not the third world.

And what is required for you to get all these benefits in Norway and Denmark? A tax number and a years worth of employment so that you have actually paid something into the system before you start getting benefits from it. That's it.

Enjoy the third world, cucks, I'm going snowboarding because I only work four days a week. Living in the first world sure is nice.

>>80186748
This is the best film of the decade so far, and maybe even Loach's best ever (big call). His anger at the injustice of it all is evident in every frame, as is his tenderness toward his characters, and in several scenes, the characters' kindness toward each other. I was in tears at the end.

To those who dismiss it as 'lefty crap' or something similar, you need to understand that this is what it is like. Government employees are expected to take the attitudes depicted in the film towards people. Human Beings. This world is of your making. It is what you wished for. I hope you are all pleased with yourselves, and I hope you never find yourself in Daniel Blake's position.

I, Daniel Blake should be required viewing for all elected officials and government employees.

>no yelling Polish people at job centre

LOL

>>80192507
>After 30 years of non stop hard work as a well paid tradesmen did Daniel Blake, literally, not have a penny to his name?
LITERALLY NOBODY KNOWS
B'CUS HES NOT REAL

jesus christ you dumbass

>>80186748

This film is based in reality as much as Lord of the Rings or Star Wars.

Please stop trying to use logic to explain it or break it down as you can't because it's a fantasy created by a multi millionaire wanting to look good to the luvvies.

>>80192457
According the US governement, 45 million of american are poor

>>80192500
It's not about religion, i'm an atheist or non believer and this thread repulses me

>>80192526

>B'CUS HES NOT REAL

Lads, we need to close down /tv/ this guy has just pointed out TV and Movies aren't real and we shouldn't talk about them or their characters because they're not real.

>>80192518
How much is income taxed in Norway and Denmark? Let me look that up.
>55%
Ahhhh so this is the power of the "first world".

Gulag forrrrrr *scans thread* 20 please?

>>80192536
Many of these "poor" are on dozens of different socialized benefits that are burdened by the 250 million who actually work. They are incentivized to never leave the safety net because it pays to have kids without a father. The state is the parent.

>>80192562
What you pay in taxes in those countries (Scandinavia, France, ...) you would have to pay it to private companies in the US

>>80192507

When you leave home you'll realise just how easy it is to work hard and break even.

The film is about the lie of 'work hard and you'll be OK'. Lots of people work hard and die in the gutter, the world just isn't that simple. Everyone is out to fuck you, and old folk like this still live in a world where honesty prevailed.

Deal with an insurance company over a damaged car, or a court over criminal damage. See how far honesty and hard work gets you in the face of profit.

>>80192518
>Norway and Denmark
>50% income tax + 25% VAT

I love how you think your government is providing you with all those nice things when in fact it just takes money away from people and give it back to those who are incapable of planning their own finances.

>>80192518
> If you haven't found a job in that time, the government will pay you 75% of your previous salary a month for up to two years.
>Think this is a good thing

Gigantic fucking left utopian retard detected

>>80192594
>you would have to pay it to private companies in the US
Or I could just not pay private companies at all.

>>80192610
>Deal with an insurance company over a damaged car
PROTIP: If you get a police report on file for your damaged car insurance always pays out.

>>80192562
>>80192611
Yeah, but the roads are well maintained, the water is cheap, electricity isn't expensive, I have 100/100mbps fiber internet, university and masters is free, healthcare is ~200e for the year, after thay completely free even if you need open heart surgery.

Yes, you pay a lot of taxes but you get a lot of shit back too.

Fucking Americucks have been memed into believeing taxes = bad. America was most prosperous in the 50s when the top tax rate was 90%.

You idiots get everything you deserve. Have fun cutting out coupons, shopping at Wal-Mart and eating value meals at Burger Fast Food Place #256.

>>80192518

>If you lose your job in Norway, or somehow can't work, your job will pay you a lump sum of 9 to 12 months worth of salaries. If you haven't found a job in that time, the government will pay you 75% of your previous salary a month for up to two years.

That would be a contributory welfare system, and one I would gladly sign up for in place of the shitshow we currently have. In the UK benefits and council houses are handed out to people who have never worked, or do a little work, so that their lifestyle can be brought up to the same level as people who work full time and struggle to make ends meet. If the full time worker then falls on hard times they'll end up spending all of their savings and going through real hardship before they get any help. Really, the welfare state should help people who pay in, and let those who don't go and hang.

Oh, and if we had what you suggest then you can bet that Ken Loach's next film would be all about how unfair it is that the unemployed single mum of three kids by three different men gets less in handouts than people who just lost their well-paid job.

>>80192627
Like college and hospitals.

You think people are equal by giving them the freedom to do whatever they want and to care only for them and their family.
I think people are on free if some superior authority (the state) is here to ensure that everyone has an equal chance in life, especially on the matter of education and health

>>80192672
>but the roads are well maintained
same with here
>the water is cheap,
$5 a month
>electricity isn't expensive
$15 a month
>I have 100/100mbps fiber internet
$50 a month
>university and masters is free
Community college is a few grand a semester. Transferred to a state school for free after two years.
>healthcare is ~200e for the year, after thay completely free even if you need open heart surgery.
Yeah my employer's insurance plan is better than that.

You sound a little mad you have to have all your income taken away lol

>>80192672
Wait hol' up?

You have to pay an insurance company for healthcare on top of your taxes? Some socialist paradise

Ken Loach is vomiting as we speak

>>80192672
>having more of your own money to spend as you choose is bad

>>80192672
>>80192518
Why is it that more people emigrate to the UK rather than Denmark? Why is it that far, far more people emigrate to the USA rather than Denmark?

One thing America does very well is integrating new immigrants

>>80192610
>When you leave home you'll realise just how easy it is to work hard and break even.

I'm not going to get into a pissing match about where I am in my life but I left home many years ago. And I seem to be doing alright thank you very much.

Unlike the fictional Mr Loache. I live within my means, I save money, I have investments and am 2 years away from paying off my mortgage. I have other shit going on but I cba to go over it.

>Deal with an insurance company over a damaged car,
Yes? And? Some silly cow swerved up against me and the entire thing was sorted within 20 days? What's the problem?

>or a court over criminal damage
No frame of reference for this

This film is a fucking fallacy and it seems to be fooling reasonably well educated people...

>>80192735
>a few grand a semester

I think a masters degree (so 5 years of education) isn't even 800€ in my country

>>80192800
Bravissimo

>>80192783
>Why is it that more people emigrate to the UK rather than Denmark? Why is it that far, far more people emigrate to the USA rather than Denmark?
yeah really why is that? I thought Norway and Denmark were paradises.

>>80192863

Hard to get a foothold one supposes...

I was once in a relationship with an achingly beautiful Norwegian girl who lived near a Fjord and everything, even spoke about moving there etc... then life happened, fuck.

haha, off to kill myself.

>>80192430

See

>>80187970

>>80192747
>American assumes insurance companies MUST be involved the moment someone says they pay a sum for healthcare

>>80192672
>but the roads are well maintained
What roads? Have you seen America's interstate system? Europe's road network is laughable compared to what they have over there. Middle class Americans don't know what bus or trains are because unlike Eurocucks they commute by car because their road network is built to accommodate that lifestyle. Fuck, American kids commute on their own cars to High School and park there whereas European cities are catered for 30yr old nu males who don't have a licence and cycle everywhere. Go fuck yourself, you have no idea what a road network looks like, faggot.

>the water is cheap
You mean like anywhere that isn't Somalia?

>electricity isn't expensive
Bullshit. Europe has one of the most expensive energy bills in the world thanks to leftist environmental regulations which have also crippled industrial output and manufacturing. And the fuel tax paid in most European countries is a fucking rip off.

>I have 100/100mbps fiber internet
so what?

>university and masters is free,
Nothing relevant has come out of European universities for the last 40 years. If you take Britain out of the equation and count only universities in the continent the landscape is even more depressing. Thanks to their expensive and well-funded universities the US has a monopoly in the digital economy, autonomous aircraft and are about to have a monopoly on driverless and electric cars too. What have Norwegian and Danish university research ever accomplished?

>America was most prosperous in the 50s when the top tax rate was 90%.
Because Europe, Russia, China and Japan were completely destroyed and there was no competition out there. They could afford to have high taxes and still offer high living standards at the time because there was nobody to compete with them in that specific decade. Times have changed and they adapted. Europe hasn't.

>Conservatives seething

>>80192680

This.

Social housing is a failed system, and its mainly because of the 1977 housing act, which specifically reserves it for the 'neediest'. That means, in areas of high demand at least, that anybody with a job is automatically disqualified. Instead of a virtuous cycle where the state builds housing to help meet demand, and uses the rental income to fund maintenance and more building, we have a system where the least deserving chunk of the population is gifted a home for life at a steep discount (most of whom have their rent paid by housing benefit anyway), and the rental income can't even cover basic upkeep because it's so low. Meanwhile, working people pay an arm and a leg for substandard accommodation. When my girlfriend moved to London, she and her flatmates were paying £30-40 grand a year between them for a home that their neighbours got for £6 grand of housing benefit a year. I know a couple who work full time trying to raise their child, one of whom is in a pretty senior position in a massive international company, and they live next door to a man and his son who sit around smoking weed and listening to music all day in an identical flat owned by the council. Social housing is the primary symbol of how utterly broken our system is, because it hands a better life to people who don't work than those who do.

>>80192863
Lot of reasons some interesting but most really boring

Interesting one is that the Scandinavian countries combined don't take in as much as the USA does BY CHOICE. 'Progressive' Scandinavia takes in less and will do so even after 4 years of big, nasty Trump.

The obvious explanation to that is either Scandinavia do not integrate the immigrants well (true, but they're in denial) or immigrants create a strain on public resources and housing (also true, but racist apparently).

>>80192909
Its harder to get a foothold because of the over expansion of the state

>>80192929
Lefties are so thick that they think anyone with a northern accent and a manual job is automatically poor

>>80192945
Im British, so what is that sum?

>>80192946
>Nothing relevant has come out of European universities for the last 40 years. If you take Britain out of the equation and count only universities in the continent the landscape is even more depressing. Thanks to their expensive and well-funded universities the US has a monopoly in the digital economy, autonomous aircraft and are about to have a monopoly on driverless and electric cars too. What have Norwegian and Danish university research ever accomplished?


Again, he wasn't talking about the top universities and what they produce, but the quality of education they provide to the students.

It's not like you have provided to the developpements of the things you listed, so why are you proud of that ?

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>>80192955

>Labour imploding

http://ukpollingreport.co.uk

Hope you're looking forward to 20 years Tory. Sorry that you might have to get a job you lazy cunt.

>>80192987
I think his point is that if education was free and that anyone could get a degree without paying, it would saturate the job market and therefore those wonderful innovations would be far less likely to happen. Not everyone should be in college.

>>80193048
I'd rather have them free and harder to get, via numerus clausus or just harder degree, than have to take a loan $50K just to get into college

>>80192518
>Norway

oil rich country with small population

every citizen receives a check from oil sales

its really not comparable to other countries, fuck off Commie.

>>80192987
>Again, he wasn't talking about the top universities and what they produce, but the quality of education they provide to the students.
But the whole point of higher education is research and innovation. Free university usually means higher ed has been reduced to an extension of basic education. A university diploma isn't something that should be available to everyone and anyone. I know people who moved straight from a degree to a master's without gaining any real world experience in the subject they allegedly studied.

>It's not like you have provided to the developpements of the things you listed, so why are you proud of that ?
It's not about being proud of something, I'm not even American. What I'm saying is US academia has produced some extremely innovative stuff over the last years that have put them at the forefront of the global economy while Europe has stagnated. Part of the reason why the average American has a better home, a better car, more disposable income and more material comfort than their European counterparts is because of economic innovation which wouldn't be possible if their universities weren't so well funded. Yes, university may be free in Europe but to what end? You will never see anything like MIT or Caltech anywhere over here because everything is underfunded and basic in order to appease the retards who think they're entitled to adult education.

>>80192956

Kek, I'm the one who wrote that in the first place. Not sure the copypasta works quite as well if they're not your girlfriend and friends.

>>80192783
>>80192863

Denmark and Norway have ultra-hardcore immigration policies. That's something they've got right, because they've realised that you can't sustain a generous welfare state if you import poor people by the boatload. Sweden has not followed that sensible approach, and look at them now.

>>80192992
>Labour imploding
lol, the Tories have just become New Labour m8. You will never see a significant reduction of our bloated welfare state because at this point every party including UKIP has become some economic left wing hybrid.

Philip Hammond is about to announce tax hikes to fund more welfare. That's the """"conservative"""" party for you.

>>80193117
The average american income isn't better off than the average european, however it's a lot better for upper class and a lot worse for the lower class.

>>80193266
>The average american income isn't better off than the average european
It is. The American middle class not only earns more but also pays far less taxes.
The poor in America are worse off than the poor in Europe, but that is ironically a result of the European middle classes being taxed into near poverty.

>>80193187

Social care and the NHS aren't exactly welfare.

>>80192507
>My Aunt's fella has been a chippy all his life and is fucking minted

what the fuck does that mean

t. american

>>80193388
they are
the nhs is pretty much charity. either get a job or fucking die you don't deserve healthcare its not a right you KEK loser

>>80193408

>My Aunt's fella has been a chippy all his life and is fucking minted

My Aunt's partner has been a Carpenter his entire life and is very wealthy.

t. bong

>>80193513

Are you implying I, Daniel Blake is somehow dishonest you Tory/Blarite class traitor?

>>80190197
You just spent several posts whining about it.

>>80193452

>all public spending is welfare

Kek, you need to get out of the house more often. I don't like the overbearing statist control in the NHS compared to more continental systems, but publicly funded healthcare is just more efficient.

>>80191206
This isn't a man suffering from tremors that make using a mouse difficult. This is a man who somehow has absolutely no idea how a mouse is operated despite them being in common use even among the working class for two decades.

>>80193571
Go cry about your old granny dying because the UK nanny state wouldn't force people to perform an operation on her

>>80190247
Are you having a stroke?

>>80192695
Positive liberty is the biggest bunch of bullshit that ever passed through the head of a man.

>>80193683

My granny just had an operation on the NHS. Got pretty good care. I don't know what you're so salty about, but publicly funded universal healthcare is better on just about every available metric. The problems with the NHS are a product of an overcentralised system (having a taxpayer-funded privately provided system like most of the rest of Europe would be better, not least for employees), and underfunding (we're spending way less on healthcare than most of the rest of the developed world).

>>80186748
A film about benefit scum

>tfw own small business and have a monetised website that requires no maintenance bringing in 6k a year

Tfw I will never end up like Daniel Blake

>>80194090
>being a poorfag
Fuck your nan and every chav scum on the NHS commie payroll

I mind I had a breakdown in teh job centre once.

I've faced a lot of stressors in my life, but I would never go back there again. If I were on it 6 months and I'd probably kill myself.

>>80194176
Idiot falseflagger.

>>80194193
Whatever makes you feel better, I guess

>>80194090
> publicly funded universal healthcare is better on just about every available metric

Not even remotely true

m8 Im British but you have picked the worst possible example. We have huge waiting times for operations, particularly the elderly and I dont know if youve been reading the news but theres horrendous conditions in some of our hospitals with people being left on trolleys and pregnant women in labour being shifted huge distances because theres not enough space

The NHS is good at giving a raw baseline for everyone so everyone has something. Describing the care as good is being deceptive. Its something and for most care needs thats enough.

Why do poor people get into debt knowing full well they can't pay it off and expect other people to make their problems go away?

>>80194465
You tell me, beggar.

y'know, if were within the ability of one (1) person to upset so many Tory effetes like this I'd want it to be me but I don't grudge how it's Ken Loach

saw it last night. it was boring. shot boring, performed boring, everything boring. it wasn't even realistic because nobody in their right fucking existence strikes up a friendship at a ob centre. You don't go there to make friends. I didn't buy the father/daughter aspect at all and their one scene where he finds her turning tricks was so utterly forced, as well as the "pauper's funeral". This shit was TV movie-tier.

>>80194863

It's literally commie propaganda.

>>80195152
Do you also think that the NHS and maternity leave are LITERALLY COMMUNISM?

>>80192562
actually, up to a certain level, you only pay around 30% tax, and then you get taxed 50% on the sum exceeding that. And most people don't earn that much, and if they do, it's not much. I think it's the equivalent to earning around 60k a year where the cutoff is.

Basically, most people can earn a good middle class wage.

>>80195559
>I think it's the equivalent to earning around 60k a year where the cutoff is.
and you're fine with that? my mother makes north of 100k. why should half her income be taxed?

>>80195601
Hey man, how much money do you need?
Also, people who earn a lot always know of jewish tricks to keep the taxman at bay.

>>80195633
>Hey man, how much money do you need?
You're asking me how much my future is worth.

>>80195679
I don't understand, are you mad at the thought of you not getting a big enough inheritance?

>>80189086
>a few years ago, living in an apartment with a few friends
>realize that somehow one of us was eligible for food stamps
>four degenerate drunken stoners had the self respect and restraint to not pursue that
>millions able bodied people still do

It's pathetic, my story is just a little anecdote but I can't imagine people could just live off charity and be able to respect themselves

>>80189715
>didn't even read the rest of his post

>>80195817
There's no reason not to, it'll only get wasted somewhere else

>>80195679
That is not your money though is it

>>80195815
No I'm speaking generally. I might work a job north of that amount someday and I don't want even the prospect of having half of that taxed make its way to America.

I want to provide for multiple kids like my mom and dad were able to.

>>80195915
Ehh that's a shitty mindset to have. Even if the system handles it, it would be good for my own self to not rely on the government teat.

Of course, I wouldn't be content with being a NEET my entire life unlike many around here

>>80195931
I'm not talking about her money.

>>80195942
This is a cuck's way of thinking my friend. You can either be the guy who leeches off a shitty system, or you can be the guy who pays for it.

>>80195992
Not all of us receive autismbux or are a lazy nigger

>>80187194
>in the end he dies of a heart attack because the government is too slow
>the government literally killed him
What a dumb movie.

>>80196120
And not all of us are cucks

>>80195601
What kills me is that if I were to get married it would reduce my taxes by half, essentially.

I enjoyed this movie.

>>80186748
>Be amazed at his fight against publicly funded services while using publicly funded services to protest against them.

Yes it's almost like taxes shouldn't be wasted on endless bureaucracy when they could be used to actually help people

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Loach is a hack.
Labour is dead.

>>80196479
Bureacracy is in place to prevent fraud.

>get 800 a month for disability
>live in a small house on the end of a long streety
>only have to pay 10% of mortgage
>get 200 in food stamps
>government utility credits pay for electricity and internet
>able to save 300 a month most months
>treat myself to a vacation every year going to a new country or taking a cruise


living the life boys

no friends though so it's a lonely existence

>>80196514

It goes too far.

>>80196407
Keep sucking that government cock, schlomo

>>80196544
It's better than the alternative.

>>80196546
Keep paying your taxes, goy

>>80196557

No it isn't, because it's dehumanizing.

>>80196576
There's a certain inhumanity in the poor. You see it in their eyes. They aren't human anymore.

>>80196479

That bureaucracy is needed when the outcome of the process is giving tax payer money to someone for mearly existing.

>>80196607

That sounds better than the alternative, which is giving tax payer money to public servants who are utterly useless and waste everyone's time by talking in circles.

>>80194176

My family is a lot better off than yours ever will be, matey. We packed her off to a private hospital/care home to recuperate for a couple of weeks after the operation, but the fact of the matter is that the surgery was safer and better on the NHS than it would have been privately.

>>80194233

It's not that the NHS is miles better than the alternatives, it's that, worldwide, public funding of healthcare works out cheaper and better. The problems with the NHS are to do with overcentralised control and lack of funding. The UK government spends the same per capita on healthcare as the US government does, but instead of giving shitty cover to about a quarter of the population, we provide ok healthcare to everyone. Fund it at the levels that they do in places like Germany and France and you'd be increasing the budget by nearly half, while still spending far, far less as a proportion of GDP than they do in the US.

Anyway, like I said, I think a system of taxpayer-funded insurance and not-for-profit healthcare closer to what they have across most of Europe would be better for both patients and doctors, but the left in this country is obsessed with the idea that you either have total state control, down to the level of individual banded wages and the hours that NHS employees work being dictated to them by central government, or you have full-retard American model private healthcare. They refuse to recognise that there's a better way to do it.

it's obviously biased polemic, but much like a lot of other of loach's work it doesn't stop it from being pretty good, poor people tend to make bad decisions and not be that bright, it doesn't stop them from deserving basic humanity

i'm sorry your political views prevent you from trying to appreciate a film that might challenge you even a little bit, the amount of right wing journos who've had a hissyfit over it is pretty funny but also depressing when you see the stats of the amount of people who've had their disability benefits cut and then committed suicide

i can def see how plenty of people would find it boring though

>>80196607
>tax payer money to someone for mearly existing.
Then suicide should be "legal" and poor people shouldn't have kids. Until then fuck off because no one asks to be born into shit.

>>80196717

i don't think it's just the left desu (of course you tend to only find people willing to say it should be changed on the right, though i am a 'lefty' and accept this so it's possible...), you'll even see the likes of the mail, the sun and so on bang on about it as well

the nhs is practically religion here, but while it could be better structured the main problem currently (as you say) is simply the low level of funding

>>80196750
Don't the people he stole council housing from deserve "basic humanity" too?
Just how much idiocy must other people fund?

>>80187194
Do you?

>>80196909
Dude, just give them what they want.

You wouldn't want to be an intolerant bigot, would you?

>>80196576

The receipt of government charity shouldn't be an enriching human experience. It should be difficult and should instil the claimant with a moderate degree of shame. This discourages (some) of the feckless from claiming.

When you remove this sense of shame you have the situation where people can work but choose not too.

>>80196909

stole?

>>80196827

You make the best of life and it's no ones fault but yours in you're a failure.

>>80197080

He made above national average for 30 years and lived through an era of insanely cheap house prices. He could have bought several houses.

Instead he did this.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2513521/Bob-Crow-says-moral-duty-leave-council-house-despite-generous-salary.html

>>80197079

Making it 'difficult' can lead to more negative situations. People not having money when they're living hand to mouth can lead to crime and other negative consequences for people other than them.

There is a pretty broad and accepted social stigma against people who aren't working, the negative psychological impacts on people who don't work is well documented. Making it needlessly difficult just causes more problems, when more effort could be put into trying to make them into people who might actually be able to contribute to society in a sustainable manner.

This is not to say people should be getting paid handsomely for not working, there should be a clear cliff between being in work and out of work to make it unenticing. But putting a ton of bureaucratic hoops in the way (with little evidence there is much in the way of costly fraud, a few anecdotes aside the rate is 0.7%) seems like a waste of effort and does more harm than good.

>>80197079
>people can work but choose not too.

jesus christ how absolutely horrifying

>>80196710
this

>>80197184

do you have daniel blake's tax returns?

what is an insanely cheap house price? what is a normal house price? what moral imperative does someone have to buy a house?

>>80197200

Being poor doesn't lead to crime. Being unintelligent leads to crime.

The average criminal IQ is 87. That's demonstrably lower than average.

http://scholarlycommons.law.northwestern.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=2123&context=jclc

Poor people tend to be stupid, and stupid people tend to be criminals, but it's a real stretch of the imagination to assume that charity cases not receiving their dole money somehow leads to crime.

>>801972

>what moral impartive does a person have to buy a house

None, you could argue, but then again what moral imperative does the state have to give some faggot who achieved nothing over his life time special treatment?

>>80197340

For

>>80197256

>>80192522

get a job cunt

>>80192518

>temporarily embarrassed millionaires

Stopped reading right there.

Use of this phrase is a litmus-test for angry economically-illiterate socialist teenagers.

>>80187970

The real question is what did he waste his money on?

>>80197305

Poor people generally being less intelligent and less intelligent people being more likely to commit crime does not preclude the concept that poverty leads to crime. I'm not assuming a person not getting a benefit payment will necessarily cause crime, but it's not difficult to imagine what someone who has no legal means of income and no legal way to feed their self may end up doing.

>>80197340
>>80197355

So we can probably agree he didn't steal his council house?

Personally I think there's a strong moral argument, but since normative beliefs are nearly always impossible to change I'd go for a more economic/utilitarian angle. The negative externality from these people having no money and having much more difficulty in attaining it will also affect the society around them. i.e. it affects me and you, especially with the current numbers of people struggling for work or requiring some sort of benefits (e.g. tax credits) to get by. The lfpr for men over 25 has declined considerably and isn't showing signs of increasing.

In the case of Daniel Blake and for instance many men over the age of 50 who had worked most of their life, they find the world has shifted around them without being asked. Most of these men (or women, but statistically more likely it's men) have a lot of difficulty retraining and adjusting to the more technologically advanced society around them, where automation has removed their job prospect (and globalisation). Do we let them rot and die?

Of course I guess we can call them faggots and forget about them. I'm sure we can pick holes in their individual life choices, but when the number of them are in the millions it tends to make this nitpicking seem fairly pointless and hint to broader effects outside of an individual's control.

>>80197601

No. Let's pick holes in his individual life choices and use him as an example of how not to live.

Better one moron, who would have died anyway, martyr himself so that everyone else can look at his situation and plan accordingly.

Having his extra charity wouldn't have helped Daniel. He wasted his earnings and would have found himself sitting around his council house drinking Tennants super or whatever he did with his earnings. Not getting his money could well have extended his life.

Besides, it's a moot point, had his (state sponsored) benefits review gone ahead he would have got his charity, back dated as well, and the system would have worked.

Loche chose to have Blake die before that to prove a point.

>>80192672

>Yeah, but the roads are well maintained

Every fucking time with you soicialist cucks. "Muh roads, muh roads, muh roads."

Why is this always the first thing out of a Statist's/Socialist's mouth?
Do they literally worship roads?

>>80197784

This doesn't change anything I've said. I haven't argued for extra charity, I've argued for some (i would stick at a similar level as the uk has now), but I would argue for a less convoluted system, which also goes along with what Loach's main point is.

>He wasted his earnings and would have found himself sitting around his council house drinking Tennants super or whatever he did with his earnings.

We don't know what he did or how much he earned, silly unverifiable claim.

>Not getting his money could well have extended his life.

Another silly unverifiable claim based upon nothing, aside from your gut.

>Besides, it's a moot point, had his (state sponsored) benefits review gone ahead he would have got his charity, back dated as well, and the system would have worked.

Good. But there are many cases where people have wrongly had benefits docked.

None of this goes against my post which was merely making the case for some benefits even existing.

>Better one moron, who would have died anyway, martyr himself so that everyone else can look at his situation and plan accordingly.

Better a system that doesn't needlessly push people into a dire situation.

>>80197919

It's not needless. Benefits should be difficult to put people off.

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>>80186748
>this thread

>>80198219
why

>>80193452
Kill yourself please
T. Working in hospital discharge >>80195601
That would be 1/4 taxed, ie about the same as in the US. Don't get involved in this kind of conversation if you can't into maths

This is my favourite eugenics thread

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>>80197870
I prefer the roads owned by private industry and used by private industry.

>>80197870
why are wage slaves so obsessed with "MUH HUMAN NATURE!!"

>>80198821
>ie about the same as in the US
The highest bracket in the US is 400,000 at 39%. It doesn't even compare to European brackets where 100k-150k is usually the highest. Someone earning 100k/year is considered "too rich" by commie europoor governments.

And this not taking into account the fact eurocucks have an insane 20%+ sales tax, which is in the single digits in most US states. The British government had to negotiate with the EU to have VAT cut on sanitary products because they too were taxed. Paying sales tax on fucking hygiene products, let that sink in for a moment. And you're trying to argue Europe's system is better? Kill yourself.

Also for all the nanny state goodies, the difference between life expectancy in America and Switzerland - the highest in Europe - is only 4 years. If that isn't a rip-off and a monumentally wasteful system I don't know what is.

>>80199160
bravissimo

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>>80186886
first post lul post

Shan't be replying to bait threads trying to spark an argument over deserving and undeserving poor. We laid that to rest in 1906.

>>80199160
If only we were all as tough and self-reliant as this lumberjack over here. You don't need anything from society until you do, then your whining will make Daniel Blake seem like a paragon of stoicism.

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The fact that he was a carpenter completely destroys any aspect of realism. Skilled manual labour is highly lucrative.

The film is made by and aimed at champagne socialists who assume that all manual labour is poorly paid and that you need a BA in African Studies to make something of yourself.

Maybe I'm just privileged and don't understand how this shit works, but he's worked a trade for 30 years and doesn't have any money saved?

Why are we supposed to feel sorry for someone who makes poor life decisions?

>>80199160
>"only" 4 years
that's more than the difference between the US and vietnam

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>>80200463
>If only we were all as tough and self-reliant as this lumberjack over here
Self reliant Europeans have all moved to the New World. The few that remained got killed in WW2. That's why nothing in your house that was invented less than 50 years ago was designed or manufactured in Europe. Enjoy your irrelevance and Filipino doctors because every white person with high earning potential and an IQ above retarded has already left.

>>80200809
So you agree a bloated welfare state has no significant impact on longevity?

Cost of welfare fraud including uncollected payments around £1bn, cost of tax avoidance and evasion between £30 and £100bn respectivelt. Cost of poorly educated retarded British tabloid reading scumbags: lots of unecessary dead people and smug neoliberal politicians and bankers who fucked the economy getting away with blaming a financial crisis on the poor and migrants. Brainwashed tory UK voters are like Moby Dick going after one plankton and thinking its a whale

>>80198945

>wage slaves

Is this what Welfare Queens call people with jobs?

What was he spending his money on, bros?

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>>80200879
What you think about poor people, those people think the same of you


>>80199160
Spend more and have a worse healthcare

>>80200920
I agree that the US is an obese white minority shithole

>>80200959
>Cost of welfare fraud
You seem to be under the impression only welfare fraud is unfair. Generous welfare is unfair on principle. A family of leeches living for free in Kensington while a hard working one has to commute for 2 hours because they can't afford rent within London doesn't count as fraud but it doesn't mean it isn't unfair as fuck.

>cost of tax avoidance and evasion between £30 and £100bn respectivelt
PROTIP: tax evasion and avoidance are non-issues in places where tax is slow and the size of the state is reasonable. Really makes u think huh.

>smug neoliberal politicians and bankers who fucked the economy
The economy got fucked when banks were told to lend money to people who clearly couldn't pay back. The idea in the late 90s and early 00s that every illiterate fuck on a minimum wage was entitled to being a homeowner is what got us into this mess in the first place. Now the irony is nobody can afford to be a homeowner any-more.

>migrants
Hardly an economic issue. The real reason why we don't want more migrants is because minorities tend to be unpleasant neighbours, commit more crime and are a blight on national cohesion. The economic argument is brought up simply because if we dare to mention the real reasons why we don't want Muhammad Al-Britanni living next door we get slapped with a criminal record thanks to the draconian limitations to free speech lefty faggots like yourself brought about.

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>>80201030
>Spend more and have a worse healthcare
No. They spend more because of a higher disposable income and as a result have better healthcare. Try again sweetie.

>>80201030

>worse healthcare

If Americans have worse healthcare, why do they have significantly and measurably higher survival-rates for cancer and other life-threatening ailments, sometimes 10% higher and upward, than Europeans of any nation?

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>>80201313
>>80201571
Because health care is only for cancer and life threatening conditions
http://www.who.int/gho/publications/world_health_statistics/2016/EN_WHS2016_AnnexB.pdf

>>80200879
I'd be interested to know what you actually do for a living when you're not promoting short-sighted selfishness via carefully-selected image macros. I'm actually in a European hospital right now, surrounded by proof that you're a faggot.

>>80201313
>healthcare should be paid for out of a persons disposable income like canoes and CDs and string cheese

>>80201030

>the US spends more per capita on public healthcare than almost any European nation

Wew.

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Why do socialists love poverty porn so much?

Why are they obsessed with dreary suburban housing estates and tired weary people?

I go to the cinema to escape this hellhole, not to experience more of it.

>>80201624
Cancer is a good way of measuring healthcare quality because it involves 3 things:

1- Complex surgeries to remove tumours that have a significant rate of failure or damage to nearby organs

2- Expensive equipment for radiotherapy

3- The need for highly qualified doctors when calculating the correct dosage of chemotherapy: too much chemo and the patient's lifespan is reduced, too little chemo and the cancer cells aren't fully eliminated.

Your table on the other hand doesn't provide any methodology. It's just a rank with some apparently arbitrary "efficiency" index and no reference to survivability or success. The pdf document you linked doesn't have that particular table and in fact the words "index" and "uncertainty interval" don't appear anywhere in the document.

>>80202371

>Why do socialists love poverty porn
Like asking why do poor people fetishize the rich life style though it's incredibly ironic how both groups idolize the other in horrible, vain ways.

>>80201666
>I'm actually in a European hospital right now
Sorry about that. Enjoy your lower survival rates. If you hadn't been taxed into poverty all your life maybe you would've been able to afford a decent treatment with state of the art techniques.

>>80202371
They think they know how these people live like.

>>80202427
Being rich is fun and there are lots of opportunities to write good stories about.

Being poor is miserable.

>>80202526
>being rich is fun
Wew not until I retire.
I work 50-60 hour weeks until then.

>>80202371
>Why do socialists love poverty porn so much
Are you retarded or something?

>>80202436
I work here, retard. Ironically the main problem the site experiences is due to cuts in social care making people's conditions worsen in the community and making it difficult to discharge them. This is because of selfish morons like you. Also

>doesn't say what he does for a living

You haven't got a job have you anon

>>80202601
People working now will never be able to retire. I am all but certain that by the time I reach 65 which is the retirement age now, people will be living well into their hundreds and we will all be working until the day we drop dead. Pensions wont exist unless you're rich enough to save up one yourself.

Tory war on the people through austerity and general antipathy of the working class has tapped into the worst side of human nature and has cucked people like the OP into fighting their war for them.

>>80201313

Cherrypicked as all fuck. Lung cancer kills more than all those combined, and on that the US is well behind Europe, as it is on many other cancers:

>https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/cancer-spending-higher-in-u-s-than-in-europe-and-so-is-cancer-mortality/

Furthermore, the reason that the US outperforms on those cancers is nothing to do with better treatment, and actually primarily because more agressive (and profitable) screening picks up cases earlier, though they die at the same age that they would have in Europe:

>https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/cancer-care-in-the-u-s-versus-europe/

The latter article is particularly instructive, and explains why the 5-year survival statistics mean jack-shit. It's mortality that actually matters, and on that measure the US does no better than Europe, but spends a shitload more money anyway.

>>80202436
Let's hear where you're from then

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>>80202664
>doesn't say what he does for a living
Didn't know you were so keen on knowing this. I run a small business. We supply gluten-free products made from cassava flour to restaurants. Started 2 years ago, got a decent customer base but little room for expansion because taxes eat out a fairly large chunk of what we earn. I was recently looking at the possibility of buying a van and hiring someone to do our deliveries instead of paying a third party courier but lo and behold business rates go up depending on how many parking spaces your business has even if it is a fucking warehouse in the middle of nowhere. There's also an obligation by employers to pay for staff retirement coming into force in April. This means I as the director of an insignificant business will be personally liable for the old age provision of a van driver when he retires because apparently the government thinks he is too incompetent to manage his own savings and planning his own life.

Nothing glamorous but this is the reality of a nanny state micromanaging everything and suffocating everyone trying to make it on their own. No room for anyone but bankers and the leeches who use your services for free then refuse to fuck off home because the taxpayer is funding his diseased arse in a hospital.

>>80203075
>it's the governments fault my business is shit

I knew it

I fucking hate left wing parasites.

>>80203297
>small businesses thrive under a high tax burden, you just gotta believe in yourself
This is what people who never ran a business actually believe.

>>80203307
I hope you get sick once and see how fucked your system is.

>>80203338
>small businesses thrive without roads, fire departments, education, healthcare, policing, pensions and other infrastructure
Start a company at the North Pole then anon
>I started a business so it's in society's best interests that I succeed
Only if you contribute to society by paying your taxes and looking after your employees, which you hate doing.

>>80201253
>>80200959

Hope shit good thing we have free health care because that leftist requires a trip to the burns unit.

I have MS and welfare is essential to me even being able to exist since I can't work and barely even hobble to the paki shop to buy a tin of bins most days.

Yes there are robbing cunts who pretend to be ill or dodge work in order to stay on benefits, but the majority is made up of people like me who actually need a safety net. They should remove people from jobseekers after 2 months and give the money to disabled people instead.

>>80203366

>implying I don't have a decent job and first class health insurance

Sorry pleb.

>>80203366
>how fucked your system is.
So that NHS really works wonders then doesn't it?

>>80192325
Are special benefits for people with disabilities not a thing?

>>80203433
>fire departments, education, healthcare, policing, pensions and other infrastructure
Isn't it funny that low tax places like Texas, Singapore and S. Korea still manage to have those things? Must be magic.

>>80203583
I looked up one of your examples out of curiosity. Top tax rate in South Korea starts at £56,000. Your business is failing because you're not very smart.

>>80192946
>they commute by car because their road network is built to accommodate that lifestyle
You're forced to spend hours every single day on a car because people can't plan cities and somehow this is a positive?

I can never respect a left wingers opinion just because all left wing men are super feminine and beta

>>80203726
>You're forced to spend hours every single day on a car because people can't plan cities and somehow this is a positive?
You know that America is more than LA, San Fran, and New York right?

>>80203865
>You know that America is more than LA, San Fran, and New York right?
Technically those are a perfectly representative sample given how many people live in those areas. Even then, I'm talking about the average american.

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>>80203720
http://www.korea4expats.com/article-income-taxes.html
>tax Rate is W90,100,000 + 38% fo the amount over W300 million
300 mil won is £200k you fucking mong

Also S. Korea has one of the lowest tax to GDP ratio in the world.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_revenue_as_percentage_of_GDP

No wonder you work for the NHS. A "doctor" like yourself would have his application thrown in the rubbish by any private hospital. Good thing in the public sector you're allowed to mishandle patients with no consequence. Now don't forget to turn up to the next Jeremy Corbyn rally asking for a pay rise.

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>>80186748
sounds like yet another mumble-porn philistine effort

>>80192735
>a few grand a semester

You realise "grand" means thousand, right? And there are two semesters per year, you're aware of that too?

>>80203943
>if I kiss my master's boots just enough, I'm going to become like him!
Holy shit you're sad.

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>>80203726
>hours every single day on a car
Because hours on overcrowded public transport going to/from a hobbit-sized shoebox of a home is so much better, right? Wow European town planning is so enlightened.

>>80203502

That's fine, but don't for a second think you receive anything other than charity. I don't want you to starve, but you are lower than even the lowest employed person. If you feel entitled to money just by virtue of being ill you should be thankful you were born in this era, because at any other point in history you would have been drowned in a fucking river or left to beg until you died. You are not entitled to tax payer money by simply existing, you love by the virtue and kindness of other, better men. And I hope you thank your superiors every fucking day.

>>80204056
>Because hours on overcrowded public transport
Barely anyone does that lol
also
>unironically defending american urban planning

>>80189595
you know arguing is something you can do
but that would mean you'd actually have to use your brain instead of labeling people as conservatives

>>80204073
You are not entitled to money just because you work anon, in past eras you would have probably been a slave and you would have been killed for being so annoying, so I hope you're thankful to your bosses for not enslaving you, you living garbage.

>>80204262

>Spastic with MS who lives on charity is equal to a tax paying member of society

And the left wonder why they're constantly 18-20 points behind the tories.

>>80189086
As someone who is on the dole, I agree with you. I hate doing it. I'm doing it so I can get my shit together while looking for jobs and going back to school, as that should be the purpose for anyone who chooses to use state allowances, but that's obviously hopelessly idealistic. I'm 19, but If you're above the age of 30 and on benefits, you've been doing it wrong.

>>80204329
>Spastic with MS who lives on charity is equal to a tax paying member of society
Anon, I didn't say that, I understand conservatives are pretty dumb but you can at least try to reason, you know? I was using the same argument you made to make it obvious that it's pretty stupid to say "WELL IN THE PAST X WAS THE CASE THEREFORE THAT'S A REASONABLE STANDARD TO HAVE, BE THANKFUL".

>a fruitful, engaging and energetic discussion on /tv/ with 265 replies and barely any shitposting

I'm surprised janitors haven't deleted this thread.

why do ken loach threads always get /tv/'s panties in a knot?

>>80204407

>entitled faggot feels no shame at sponging tax payer money

God I hate leftists.

>>80204364
>I'm 19, but If you're above the age of 30 and on benefits, you've been doing it wrong.
what if that person unexpectedly and unprecedentedly lost their job? what about then?

>>80204438

because this is the only place they can espouse their hateful views

>>80204526

for some reason the children on 4chan still in their teens think their call centre jobs will afford them the ability to invest because some rich alt right douchebag told them to

>>80203992
>labour fag calling someone a boot kisser

>>80204526
Look for another one. There's no reason to live from benefits at that age, but temporary jobseekers is fine, as long as you're actually looking for a job.

>>80204567
What the fuck are you even on about? Stop posting, you fucking clown.

>>80204501
I don't sponge any money, you retard, I'm not that guy, I'm just someone pointing out how stupid your "argument" is.
also
>leftist
lmao

>>80204610
>if you criticize retarded ultra-capitalist rhetoric you must be a leftist!
lmao, conservative "thinking" at its best.

>>80204641

how exactly do you live off 70 quid a week anon

>>80204676
>I can only think by using arbitrary labels that make me think less
Not him but you need to fucking stop.

>>80204641
>There's no reason to live from benefits at that age
yeah, but benefits exist as a social safety or a net and is often reformed so that it's the last resort for anyone who falls on hardship.

if the government spends so much on benefits, then why do homeless people exist? i say this as a guy who's almost non-committal to politics or political parties?

>>80192457
PARKLIFE

>>80204692
>Don't label me, I'm a special snowflake!
I'm sorry anon, but only retarded conservatives spout that kind of rhetoric.

>>80204690
What's the point of the question?

>>80204703
>yeah, but benefits exist as a social safety or a net and is often reformed so that it's the last resort for anyone who falls on hardship.
It's also easily abused and is a crutch for people instead of healing process to become able bodied and useful again.

>if the government spends so much on benefits, then why do homeless people exist? i say this as a guy who's almost non-committal to politics or political parties?
Homeless people exist because they have nothing. They don't have a crutch or a means to heal.

>>80204773
You're a straight bonehead, dude.

>>80204829

im just asking how you live off 70 quid a week since you said people do it

>>80204916
People live off way more than 70...

>this thread again
>people literally copypasting their arguments from the last threads

yeah, we get it: you hate poor people
now fuck off back to /pol/ with your backwards quasi-libertarian thinking

>>80205215
You're reducing things to labels so you can think less. You view people through interactions on the internet. How the fuck can you sit there thinking "I have a sensible outlook on society". Are you really this deluded and comfortable?
Take one moment of your time think properly and critically of yourself and everyone ITT and create a logical narrative you fucking illegitimate peon.

>>80205455
>this level of projection
you're literally accusing me of what the low iq hordes itt do

>>80205683
Dude, you're no different than than any other idiot who thinks they know something about politics on this site. You're all the same idiot just using different slogans. You're not important to anyone. You're opinion doesn't have any importance because illegitimate. Stick to shitposting.

>>80204703

I live next door to a homeless hostel. Every person in there has drink or drugs problems, and is fundamentally incapable of functioning in civilised society. In truth, the average amount of state and charities spend shitloads per homeless person, well over the average wage. By international standards we actually have a really low proportion of rough sleepers, throwing money at the problem won't really reduce that much further.

Also, something like 60% of London's rough sleepers at least are foreign nationals who can't claim for most benefits or housing.