Which Roman story would you like to see adapted into a big budget

Nero's

>>79682568
Gaius and Aulus.

The one where he gets shot by a Russian mobster, abducted by another and saved by his cousin

How it fell because they opened the borders to the barbarians and were culturally destroyed from within.

>>79682568
Alexander the Great

Battle of Carrhae

Caesar's campaigns in Gaul.

>>79682634
Every time I hear this horseshit I wish neo-fascists were capable of reading a book from start to finish.

>>79682568
Biggus Dickus, Monty Python Style.

>>79682634
/pol/ tier explanation

>>79682568
The three Punic wars in TV format or something about Justinians reconquest

>>79682568
wait

the Romans were black?

>>79682643
Colin Farrel did that slut

>>79682684
are you blind?

>>79682634
yes that is certainly what happened yes 100% good job /pol/ best fact there

Punic wars desu.

>>79682593
BROTHA NERO

>>79682634
Huns welcome

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>>79682568
>Arminius (German: Hermann; 18/17 BC – AD 19) was a chieftain of the Germanic Cherusci tribe and a former officer in the Roman military. An auxiliary lieutenant to the Roman general Publius Quinctilius Varus, Arminius used his knowledge of Roman tactics to lead an allied coalition of Germanic tribes to a decisive victory against three Roman legions and their auxiliaries in the historic Battle of the Teutoburg Forest, in 9 AD.
i'm so glad this doesn't happen anymore haha right guys
>>79682664
he should replace culturally destroyed with destroyed, i agree
>>79682680
>>79682705
they literally were destroyed by barbarian migrations, this is a fact

>>79682715
VANGAURD 1

>>79682568
the one where they fuck little boys

>>79682701
he's light skinned, but definitely black. He obviously has black traits.

you may as well say that Drake isn't black.

>>79682568
Would suck 10/10

>>79682568

the one where they allowed women to vote and GOTHED.COM was born

>>79682741
only if it's with grown women though.

>>79682643

Not Roman, though a movie about the exploration of the coast between the Indus River and Egypt by one of his captains that I can't remember the name of.

>>79682629
We technically already have one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pj8yq_urL5c

>>79682664
>>79682680
>>79682705
Nice damage control there shills. You convinced me, les just open up all borders, nothing can go wrong.

>>79682757
>he's light skinned, but definitely black. He obviously has black traits.
>every shitskin is black
fuck off and die

>>79682634
Say it loud say it clear! Germanics are welcome here!

A courtroom drama with Cicero

>>79682568
For some reason I always thought Caracalla had white hair/beard

>>79682684
>Thinking of Roman as a race or ethnicity

Read a book. Romans at the start were basically a culmination of many ethnicities across Italy, then when they started expanding as an empire they very quickly lost any especially defining genetic appearances. Romans fucked a lot of women from all corners of europe, asia minor and north africa so after hundreds of years they weren't 'white' as we think of it at all. Most whites were Visigoths, Vandals and other Germanic/Gaulish tribes.

>>79682568
the one where they kill all the jews

>>79682705
>>79682680
>>79682664

So eager to tell him he is wrong, but no explanation of what happened.

Enlighten us, we stand here ready to listen to you blessing us with your superior knowledge.

>>79682757
He has thin lips and medium sized forehead. Go outside and look at black people.

>>79682805
>implying they didn't get blacked by moors

learn some history baka

>>79682757
niggers don't look like this.

>>79682764
>GOTHED.COM
How would that work? Theatre?

>>79682757
>might as well say drake isn't black
That's crazy talk, might as well say Obama wasn't black.

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>>79682817
>tfw the reason Romans could build such a huge empire is cuz they embraced diversity, both ethnic and religious

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Justinian

>>79682832
if anything he looks like a mulatto
>>79682837
carvings

>>79682634
>opened the borders

more like they fucked themselves up so hard their borders got forced open and then they hired the invaders the hold off other invaders in a military/political ponzi scheme which eventually collapsed

>>79682802
The reason Rome fell because the Huns invading pushed every other tribe into the western roman empire, also the Roman Legion wasn't as effective as it previously was, and borders weren't things that could be conceivably maintained in a time where everyone had to walk everywhere.

>>79682884
> their borders got forced open

G E R M A N I C S

W E L C O M E

that grafitti where the roman soldier swears off women and vows to only fuck poipucci

>>79682568
>looks the same as what we would call a beautiful man today
Definitive proof beauty isn't subjective.

>>79682901
>The reason Rome fell because the Huns invading pushed every other tribe into the western roman empire
the reason Europe fell was because the Syrian civil war pushed every other 3rd world immigrant into western europe

>>79682870
That is a pretty good meme, my good friend. Do you mind if I save it and upload it elsewhere?

>>79682867
More like that they assimilated conquered peoples like the fucking Borg. They took what they needed from a conquered people and then ruthlessely subjugated and erased the rest from existence. Their failure to assimilate any more people was what led to their downfall since the tribes they paid with land started proto-kingdoms of their own, and their mercs were more loyal to their own tribe than to the Roman state.

>>79682929
Television and Film

>>79682664
Neo-fascism is pretty Roman

>>79682946
let's not pretend this isn't a stealth /his/ thread

>>79682867
>ethnic - yes
>religious - only if you didn't get in their way, if you got in their you get Masada
>diversity - making people a 'citizen' of rome then forcibly conscripting the people you just made your own is a pretty effective way of crushing any barriers

You make it sound gentle but the Romans were ruthless and stamped out any hint of rebellion pretty mercilessly.

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>>79682957
all fascism is roman

hitler despised germans

>>79682632
b o w l i n g

>>79682817
For like the better part of Roman history not even all Italians were citizens, most Latins who were allied with Rome only had limited citizenship.
It wasn't until the imperial period that citizenship was expanded to non-Romans.
People in Rome wouldn't even accept Julius's natural born son by Cleopatra because he wasn't a full Roman, Rome has a complicated love hate relationship with Greeks.

The anon was obviously joking, and "white" is a meaningless term term.
But fuck off with your multi-culturalism revisionist bullshit.

>>79682942
They did assimilate them, but not always in that ruthless a fashion. Some were even allowed to keep their religions as long as they paid whatever relevant taxes they needed to and pay lip service to the Roman gods.

Julian the Apostate

>talking about ancient history and modern politics as if they're 1:1 comparable
>blatant reductionism

I want /pol/ and /his/ to leave.

>>79682976
they were ruthless, absolutely, but at the same time they did embrace diversity (though like you said, they made sure to forcefully remove those barriers) because that's the only way you could construct that kind of empire.

>>79682568
That one emperor who feed Jews to lions and set them on fire.

>>79682982
fascism is Bulgarian https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fasces#Origin_and_symbolism

Caracalla actually wore blonde wigs and gaulish clothing to look more Barbarian.

>>79683022
Im talking about your average plebian sitting in italy at the begging of the republic, they were an absolute mutt of a people don't claim multi-culturalism revisionist bullshit on me.

Elagabalus would be right up /tv/s alley

>>79683073
Romans had a love affair with everyone they conquered make themselves even better about conquering them.

>>79682867
Imperialism and inevitable multiculturalism that goes with it is what ruined Rome.

Hero's journey of Octavian is the most likely film that Hollywood would ever make, but it would require a white male lead so it's a big no right now.

>>79683120
Rome only ever rose because they conquered all their neigbours and integrated them into their empire, thereby often adapting their cultural practices. They were extremely flexible in that regard, which was a huge strength.

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>>79682634

Opened the borders? Rome's borders were never closed. I know you probably have lots of assumptions from looking at maps or watching things in popular culture, but things like the Limes Germanicus were not to keep people or whole populations out, it was there just to regulate and record who exactly was coming and going. The relationship between the Romans and the German tribes was actually one with a lot of cross-cultural exchanges and a large degree of trade as well as migration that took place over the hundreds of years the Roman Empire existed there. In fact when you start to have larger scale Germanic migration from the 4th century onwards these tribes had been thoroughly Romanized already.

How Rome fell is a really complex issue and not one with one distinct answer, but the idea of it being culturally destroyed by foreign Germans is absurd. The centre was what was weak and rotten; the Italian peninsula, which had so long been the richest and most prosperous part of the old Republic and Empire became overly decadent, saw a massive fall in its GDP and was very isolated from the realities of Empire on the frontiers. The rich got richer, but the poor and middle classes got worse off, the Empire as a whole, despite controlling so much land, saw massive drops in revenue because of an utterly incompetent and inefficient tax system which couldn't cope with the costs of Empire. Even with all the land and resources it controlled, the Roman Empire itself really only produced and exported olive oil which meant it ran a gigantic trade deficit which only exacerbated it's economic problems.

>>79683120
I'd much rather live under the empire than the Republican period.
If you weren't a patrician you were fucked.

>>79682568
None

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>>79682634

What is their fucking problem?

>>79683158
Not really.
The Republic didn't make citizens of conquered people, during the Republic they only extended citizenship to really close allied states who were de facto annexed peacefully.

The Romans did integrate ideas of the people they conquered, But that isn't multi-culturalism. The Romans took on a lot of Greek customs and Greek slaves, the upper classes even spoke Greek, but its more like Japan adopting western ideas. No one would say Japan is multicultral despite the undeniable Western influences.
They just take what works in order to compete.

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>>79683158
>diversity is our strength

>>79683176
Shut the fuck up, Molyneux told me the Roman Empire fell because of SJWs, Women and foreigners.

IT'S THAT EASY!


Seriously thoough, it's a wasted effort to try to teach history to idiots.

>>79682757

Tell me again how Shakespeare was black.

>>79683303
He can't be black, the University of Pennsylvania took down his portrait in the English department to make it more diverse.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/answer-sheet/wp/2016/12/13/students-remove-shakespeare-portrait-from-english-department-at-ivy-league-school/?utm_term=.0e0337a8608b

>most plots and happenings and wars in the Byzantine Empire
>0(zero) movies about it

explain this

>>79683417
T!rks control Hollywood

>>79683417
People don't even know what that is, that's why.

>>79683417
the storylines are way too byzantine for the average viewer

>>79682568
A modern Caligula movie and a Nero one.

Gaius Marius and his rivalry with Sulla.

>>79683158
There was still a feeling of being a Roman however. They didn't lack a cultural identity. They took practices and technology from other cultures if it benefited them, but other practices that were deemed barbaric and uncouth were banned and persecuted, IE human sacrifice or wearing pants.

The idea was never to have a hundred different cultures living in Rome trying to get along. It was to have a mother culture that was superior to all. You could live in the Roman Empire and keep your culture, but Roman law, philosophy and practices were still the dominant force. Any personal cultural practice could be done by you in your own house so long as you paid taxes and acknowledge Roman superiority. It was not multiculturalism in the modern sense, IE expect opposite cultures to live in harmony without any tension or racism. It was however the only way of keeping such a huge empire together short of genocide.

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>>79682870
>Not Justinian II

Pleb

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A comedy about Alcibiades's silly antics during the Peloponnesian War

>>79683253

This.

>>79682757
>he's light skinned
>
"Light skinned" is an american thing, it has no relevance to Rome.

>>79682568
Caligula or Caesar

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>>79682634
Laughing at all the triggered leftcunts replying to this. Let me be abundantly clear, shit skins not welcome here!

>>79683751
Not welcome where? Romans were shitskins

>>79683216
At least /pol/tards are willing to admit the nazis were wrong now.
Thank god.

>>79682634
>rome
>borders

What.

>>79682731
>19 ad
The empire's golden age hadn't even begun yet.

>>79683141
>it would require a white male lead
romans weren't white fuck off

>>79682731
To say that is inaccurate. Yes the direct cause was Visigoths destroying Rome, but that only happened because the Romans were weakened by so many other factors.

>>79682824

>MY ONE ALL FULFILLING ANSWER THAT EXPLAINS EVERYTHING

No.

It was Civil Wars, a lack of bureaucracy, a terrible government, and a destruction of their own military.

A real Hannibal crossing the alps

Not technically Roman but you know

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>>79683977

Closest you are going to get is Sidig in that BBC documentary on Hannibal.

>>79683963
>>79683958
It was the musims you cucks.

>>79682824
There are literally hundreds of reasons as to why Rome fell; constant civil war, a conquest economy with nothing left to conquer, their opponents being as well equipped and trained as them, the shift of power from Rome and the Western Roman empire to Constantinople. To say they fell solely from migrations is disingenuous because there were so many other factors that made them weak enough for them to fall to be crippled by the Huns and finished off by the visigoths. Just delve into what the emperor did to Flavius Aetius and you'll find even more problems.

>>79684095
Fall to was a mistake btw

>>79684011

>Muslims

Are you retarded or are you subtly pulling a Byzantium = Rome?

>>79684128
I'm making fun of deluded rightists.

>>79683176
10/10 explanation but /pol/tards will ignore this because this does not fit their interpretation

Can I get a comedy about Alcibiades during the Peloponnesian War?

1. Story of general family set up in any age - about how we and romans are not so much different
2. GoT/Borgia type political drama from third/forth age - a lot of source material to pick and choose from.
3. Story about slow erosion of Rome in 5th century

If it was approached with consideration, it would be great.

>>79682568
The one where they cast niggers as important historical figures.

St. Augustine miniseries.

>>79683176
>Rome borders never closed
Read about limes and border armies in 1-3 century. The borders became open when there were no more strength to keep them closed, as you wrote yourself.
>>79683044
this
>>79682870
and this, one could make a really tragedy out of it about people with good intentions and talent ruining everything.
>>79683610
and this

Man, Rome has a lot of material for great kinos, too bad retarded Hollywood directors keep on fucking the same horse.

>>79684634
Who cares if Hollycrap makes it, they're artistically bankrupt anyway. I'd take independent film anyday over Hollywood production of Rome.

>>79683176
>Opened the borders? Rome's borders were never closed.
Caesar's gallic wars started with Caesar himself preventing a tribe of wandering gauls from trespassing in roman territory while moving westward.

>>79682634
No. it goes like this:

1. The Pax Romana (a century of peace) changes the mentality of the patrician from military to business
2. The patricians become more competitive amongst each other and more greedy
3. The economy power shifts to Costantinople
4. The patricians raise taxes
5. Plagues kill lots of Roman plebs and weaken the living
6. Armies are now made up from the stronger Barbarians
7. Patricians are so hateful towards each other they would deliberately not help each other against enemies (this would NEVER happen before the Pax Romana)
8. More barbarians, less Romans
9. the Emperors are getting weaker and weaker
10. Christianity rises because the patricians didn't kill it back in Judaea (because of 1.)
11. Christian-Pagan struggle all around the empire
12. Constantine becomes a Christian
13. the Now christian majorities no longer want war (Rome is sustained by blood thirst of the pagans who worshipped Mars)
14. It's been dying for two centuries, mate.
15. Barbarians get more courageous
16. Barbarians smell weakness
17. Barbarians sack Rome, thus ending the misery that's been going on for two centuries

>>79682568

Fucking hell I only realize now he's the spitting image of a friend of mine.

>>79682832
>moors
>black

>>79682832

>moors
>black

Why are americans so ignorant

>>79683525
>>79683671
>Caligula
No chance. Any film they make will pale in comparison to the Brass/Guccione version.

This thread just goes to show how fucking stupid /pol/ is

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>>79682634
Fuck off /pol/.

>>79684745
>1. The Pax Romana (a century of peace) changes the mentality of the patrician from military to business
>2. The patricians become more competitive amongst each other and more greedy
no
1. A century of civil wars
2. Enormous casualties, qualified military personal dead, military traditions are in ruins, civic traditions ripped apart, currency debased to nothing, economic connections broken
...

>>79682757
The Latins were white
"Roman" defined everybody in the Roman Empire from carthaginians to latins to britons to semites
That particular emperor in the OP was born in Africa

The story of the first fire brigade.
Apparently they bought the building of the owner before extinguishing the flames.

also nero, just to see an awesome burning rome
> inb4 he didnt do it

>>79684634
>The borders became open when there were no more strength to keep them closed, as you wrote yourself.

Rome did this to itself when the debased the Legions out of fear that someone else would use them against them. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

>>79685031

>Caracalla
>born in africa


Are you guys for real?

>>79685113
My bad, meant of African descent*

And Syrian if I'm not mistaken

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What is some essential Roman era literature or literature about Rome, pic related is what I've read.

>>79685219

He was a berber, basically.

>>79685282

Dude I don't see Cicero on that list, I hope that's because you read his books somewhere else.

>>79683417
The main characters wouldn't be white. No one wants to watch a film like that.

>>79685328
It's only what I've read from my phone or PC.

>>79685282
>>79685282
Tom Holland also has a book called Dynasty. It's good.

>>79685302
Berbers are North African tho

>>79682810
I agree. Just turn the Robert Harris novels into movies or a tv show.

>>79682568

THERE IS A FUCKING ACTOR THAT LOOKS EXACTLY LIKE THAT BUT I CAN'T FIND A PIC OR REMEMBER WHO IT IS!!

FUCKK!

Something with Marcus Aurelius

Romulus and Remus gangbanging that shewolf

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>>79682568
Wrong colorization, revisionist kebab

>>79686119
t. pol

>>79686119
>dem animu eyes
sugoi

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>>79682870
This. But you know Hollywood would just glorify Belisarius for 2-3 hours. Or like they've already done before 'True Rome.'
Orson Welles as Justinian would have been kino.
But it happened, he was wasted in Kampf um Rom garbage.
At least it had some qts.
I can count how many times I've seen him and Theodora on film on a single hand. The other examples being Dark Ages on History Channel and the Russian film Rus iznachalnaya. Most also make him a cuck which is not cool. That was General B who got cucked.

>>79682568
Biopic of Cato the younger, played by Gary Oldman, where he acts like a curmudgeonly asshole to everyone and they love him for it.

>>79686063

John Rhys-Davies

>>79686119
Look at his fucking beard.
That is not a white man beard.
That is an italian beard.

>>79682776
Nearchus

>>79682634
why does everyone get triggered by this?

>>79686119
a black haired med? That's certainly revisionist lmao

>>79682648
won't happen

the reason they avoid anything related to the Roman-Persian wars is cause all the money they had to waste on making Cataphract armor to the men and horses, since Partyans and Sassynids mainly used heavy cavalry.
easier to work with germanic barbarians wearing nothing but animal skins and facepaint.

but then again, CGI is a thing

Nero and his war on Judaism

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I suppose I'd like to see when Caesar was captured by pirates. It's small, contained and wraps up in a satisfying conclusion.

>>79686208
He is making a point about modern politics comparing it to rome
That is the right's equivalent to comparing modern politics to harry potter or star wars.

>>79686253
That would be a great short film

>>79682731
The German vermin destroyed Rome, destroyed Europe twice, and are currently destroying 4chan

>>79686264
>comparing modern politics to history is equivalent to comparing it to pop culture

how the fuck do you figure that?

year of 4 emperors

>>79686285
>fucking nazis get out reeeeeeeeee

I like it

>>79682916

Of course, in rome it's not gay if you are the top

>>79686309
More like
>fucking socialists & commies reee.
Reminder that both national socialism & communism are just different versions of socialism and deserve to be purged for being terrible ideologies.

>>79686253
if you ransom me now, that will be the end of it. however if you don't, i will hunt you down,i will find you and i will crucify you.

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>>79686210
Southern italians have darker complexion than northern italian due to "recent" miscegenation with moors (way after the roman period).

His parents doesn't look kebabs to me.

>>79686383
Fair enough.

I am actually fine with all the German hate on 4chan now because it is getting rid of this fucking retarded alt-right nazi bullshit.

That was genuinely becoming a problem here.

>>79686208
Because it's factually wrong.

>>79684789

THis, it's absolute porno kino

>>79686309
say what you like about hitler at least he wasn't a filthy german

>>79686443
He was though.

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Reminder that Romans did not look like modern day Italians. Reminder that modern day Italians are moor rape children tainted with nigger blood. Romans were most likely fairer in skin and hair.

>>79686383
Retarded murrican "libertarian" detected. How fucking dumb can you be?
>>79686409
>Fair enough.
lmao

>>79686450
his granfather was a med gypsy who knocked up a german fraunlein

>>79686443
Hitler himself would fucking kill you for saying that.
He was all about German superiority.
And Austrians only didn't consider themselves german after denazification which you should be able to figure out came after Hitler

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scipio africanus vs Aníbal Barca
but if they do it, they will butcher the actual history. and instead of focusing in warfare and tactics as i would like the movie.
they will do some romance Bullshit. or they will make them gay or some shit.

>>79684095
So the Roman Empire had a lot of problems but would it still fall without the Huns and the great migrators? No, it wouldn't.

>>79686494
>He was all about German superiority.
you've never read hitler have you
>Why do we call the whole world's attention to the fact that we have no past? It isn't enough that the Romans were erecting great buildings when our forefathers were still living in mud huts; now Himmler is starting to dig up these villages of mud huts and enthusing over every potsherd and stone axe he finds. All we prove by that is that we were still throwing stone hatchets and crouching around open fires when Greece and Rome had already reached the highest stage of culture. We really should do our best to keep quiet about this past. Instead Himmler makes a great fuss about it all. The present-day Romans must be having a laugh at these relegations.

>>79686371
Just like today.

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>>79682568

>>79686530
That was about the religious aspect of Germanic culture and not race.

>>79682568
Quintus Sertorius

>>79686606
>tiny german brains trying to explain hitler's love for rome
lmao he hated the jews more than he liked you

>>79686643
I am actually half german half italian

Come at me

>>79686663
>half italian
Thanks for ruining Malta

>>79686470
Sounds like you could use a helicopter ride.

>>79683181
Moron, some of the most powerful Romans under the Republic weren't patricians or even wanted to be. Under the Empire if you weren't slobbing the Princeps's knob you weren't anyone or anything regardless of your family and more demonstrably the more powerful you got the more likely it was you were getting killed off when you couldn't blow the big man good enough to make him forget to suspect you of plotting an overthrow.

>>79686663
>I am actually half german half italian
are you at least a manlet

An entire movie about the time they brought hundreds of young blonde german girls into the colliseum and painted their genitals with honey, then let horny male baboons into the arena and rape them to death while Romans laughed and clapped.

Directed by Dan Schneider.

>>79684332
>muh all /pol/ browsers think the same meme
I wholly and fully acknowledge that there is absolutely no singular reason as to why Rome totally collapsed (though, in actuality they didn't really collapse, more they kinda faded over time or transformed indirectly into what would become Medieval Europe), despite retards and (((historians))) claiming it was THIS particular reason why they fell or THAT particular reason why they couldn't keep up.

Any historian worth his salt acknowledges that the fall of Rome is a massively complicated issue with no one particular reason being "it".

>>79686703
1,85.
Which kinda makes me a manlet in Northern Germany.

But I am head bigger than all the turks

>>79682757
>may as well say that Drake isn't black
Ill say that.

>>79686749
you're not a manlet you piece of shit

hitler would have used you as a gopher at best, the nazi party was for manlets and turbomanlets only

The rivalry between Marius and Sulla, many of their actions paved the way for many of Julius Caesar's shenanigans.

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>>79686119
WE
WUZ
ROMANS
UND SCHEISSE

>>79682568
None because hollywood would butcher it

>>79686798
>>you're not a manlet you piece of shit
Its not my fault all the northern germans are at least 1,90. They all probably fucked with the dutch and shit.
Even the slavs who live here are largely croats and those fuckers are even bigger.

Maybe I am not a manlet in whatever manlet country you are from but I am definitely a manlet here.
Just like I am white in america but essentially a black guy in Germany.

>>79686846
You couldn't figure that out from the way the Nazi called themselves the Third Reich?

>>79686399
Yes. They were white as the driven snow down south into the scorching sun.

>>79686863
>Maybe I am not a manlet in whatever manlet country you are from but I am definitely a manlet here.
manlet is an absolute term you autist

it is 5' 6"-5' 9" or 168cm-175cm
>>79686874
they were talking about other german empires you autist

>>79682568
Trajan

>>79686968
>manlet is an absolute term you autist
False, as its range alters over time, making it not an absolute.

>>79686968
Then soon nobody will be a manlet.
And back in history everyone was a manlet

No man. Manlet means being smaller than the men around you.
The cutoff point will rise because people get bigger.

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>>79686119
Talk smack after you actually remove them.

>Roman empire thread.

>couple of neets arguing about skin complexion and height, both features of no virtue nor merit of any kind.

neck yourselves

>>79687042
/pol/ was a mistake

>>79687012
>False, as its range alters over time, making it not an absolute.
wrong, the range of human heights throughout history hasn't changed

you still had tall people back then, there were just fewer of them
>>79687013
>And back in history everyone was a manlet
germans weren't my barbarian friend
>No man. Manlet means being smaller than the men around you.
no manlet means of middle height, by that logic napoleon and hitler weren't manlets
>>79687042
manlet history means a lot to me faggot

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battle of alesia with modern blockbuster production standards

laughed out loud the first time i read about it and i think it could be made into a real jaw-dropper on the big screen

>>79683176

>t. G.E.M. De Ste. Croix

>yfw a new Historia Civilis video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOCBWh5Iwm4

>>79686158
Justinian did a lot of important things, but Belisarius' campaigns would be much more watchable. Plus "we need to retake rome" is a great plot.

>>79686733
What do you mean "(((historians)))"? There are historians from all over the former Roman Empire who have arrived at the same conclusions in regards to why to fell. They include everybody from British, German, Libyan, Egypt and Syria.

>>79687680
Just like in any field of study, there's always bad ones who leap to conclusions based on faulty premises and injecting a lot of their opinions into their work trying to tout their explanation as the definitive one. That's what I mean by (((historians))).

>>79685282
What program is that?

>>79687764
FL Studio

> hannibal
> belisarius
> 2nd punic war
> septimus severus

>>79687764
Calibre. It's fantastic as it can sync my readings on phone+PC.

>>79686874
No? Because Reich means realm and I don't see how that is a particulary Roman concept. Oh wait, you're a retard who thinks third Reich means third Rome ... gee

>>79687743
If that's what you mean, why didn't you say that from the start? Why do the ((()))?

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>>79682634
DELETE THIS YOU CAN'T FUCKING SAY THIS YOU FUCKING CUNT REFUGEES AND IMAGRINTS ARE NOT LIKE THAT YOU FUCKING /POL/ PIECE OF SHIT RASSIST TRUMP CUNT GRABING MISOGNISTIC PIG

>>79687959
It places emphasis.

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>>79682634
I SAID DELETE THIS YOU FUCKING CUNT! MODS NEED TO DO THEIR JOB ON T HIS SITE! FUCK YOU!!!

>>79687995
>>79688025
>look mommy, I'm building a strawman all on my own

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>>79682634
DELETE THIS!!! REPORT THIS EVERYONE!!!! TEAR THIS FUCKER CUNT DOWN NOW!!!! UNITE!!!!!

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XX79688067
XX79688025
XX79687995
nigga so buttplasted after his laughable history understanding got btfo on a fucking television board

>>79687995
>>79688025
>>79688067
/pol/acks really are triggered niggers.

>>79682634
RRFHDVOJNTRFDVIOHJNIHU!!!!!!!!!!!!

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>>79682634
SRTHEYRVSUTRFJBYTRJB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>austistic /pol/ack spergout because someone is challenging his infantile understanding of history
>literally reduced to incoherent screeching

>>79683176
The Germans were, for the most part, only Romanized in the sense that they were introduced to Roman ideals, technology, and concepts. Towards the end of the empire, nearly every able-bodied man North of the Empire's European borders had served as foederati in the Roman army. They were familiar with Roman schools of thought, military strategy, and the inner-workings of the Empire because they had been brought in to actually be a party of it. The Romans became entirely dependent on foederati troops to fight their wars, and this eventually turned towards Germans assuming positions of power such as generals or politicians with actual sway in Roman government.

This was the problem, the influx of Germans taking on what were once Roman roles is what exacerbated many of Rome's problems. Specifically the precedent set hundreds of years before when Sulla marched on Rome and assumed power by direct force. Naturally you can see how this would be worse if you replace Sulla, a proud Roman, with a German following his example. Case in point being individuals such as Stilicho or Ricimer, "Romanized" Germans who gained power within the Empire and subsequently used that power to subvert Rome. The latter being responsible for murdering Majorian, who was Rome's last competent emperor who actually was making a promising and well-concerted effort at restoring the Empire.

>>79682568
Cato the Younger.

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>>79682870
>>79683610

>>79688001
Why not make it apparent by using your words instead of seeming like a /pol/tarded person?

>>79688354
Why do you care so much?

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>>79688205
>>79688176
>>79688025
>>79687995

>>79688246
But it's opposite.

>>79688439
No.

>>79682568
if we are including greek myths
The great tale of Oedipus

>>79688365
Because I wanted to know why you used a word that is used by anti-Semites to try and discredit people who have differing opinions. The ((())) I've seen is used by people who try to push narratives, very similar to what you said in >>79687743 , most notably people who deny the Holocaust.

>>79682867

The initial wave of immigrants were assimilated almost forcibly. Their offspring identified as Roman and they had patriotism and a sense of national pride.

The Roman Empire fell because:

1. They over taxed their citizens
2. They debased their currency by converting it from pure silver to something below 1% and then just made more of it.
3. When their poor citizens could no longer afford the taxation, they created welfare programs.
4. They imported foreigners to increase their tax revenue. They enticed the foreigners with GIBSMEDATS.
5. Later waves of foreigners didn't assimilate and therefore felt no national pride. The ones that got conscripted into the Roman Legions were therefore more prone to abandonment and retreated.
6. Eventually their armies started to lose against the Germanic tribes because of the lack of passion from their largely foreign conscripts...
7. Pride in Rome died due to the multicultural dilution.

And that is how empires fall.

>>79682901

Basically, the large influx of non-assimilating immigrants diluted the Roman populous ... they consumed social entitlements and bankrupted the government. Then they were conscripted and fought poorly due to lack of money as well as lack of loyalty to Rome...

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>>79685282
Depends on what you're looking for.

For contemporary sources; I highly recommend Caesar and Cicero. There's nothing like reading the words of some of the greatest figures in world history (though Caesar's is notably biased, his Comentarii De Bello Gallico is still excellent). If you want to go further in history, you can get copies of Procopius' Secret History (it's mostly overexaggerated slander and bullshit, but still entertaining) and Anna Komnene's Alexiad for some based Alexios I.

For general history, you've already got some of the best, Gibbon among them.Haven't tried Tom Hollands new book on the Caesars though I've heard it's good. Peter Heather, Tom Holland and Adrian Goldsworthy are some of the best best modern historians covering ancient Roman history. For the later Empire/Byzantine Empire, John Jules Norwich's three book on the Byzantines are second to none.

If you want something different like historical fiction, I really enjoyed Collen McCullough's Masters of Rome series, they're novels covering the lives of Marius, Sulla and the Social War all the way through to Caesar, Octavian and the Fall of the Republic. Robert Harris' series' on Cicero's life is also a good read.

>>79688571
>>79688624

Shut the fuck up Molyneux.

>>79688571
lmao you doing so well too until 3, then you abandon any and all subtlety

>>79688571
t. armchair historian

>>79688627
>really enjoyed Collen McCullough's Masters of Rome series, they're novels covering the lives of Marius, Sulla and the Social War all the way through to Caesar, Octavian and the Fall of the Republic. Robert Harris' series' on Cicero's life is also a good read.

Does the book series follow the lives of regular Romans then? Sounds good if so.

Thanks for the recs.

>>79683511
Youre a fucking piece of shit cunt you arsefucker

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Can any of you guys comment on this series?

I read that it is pretty influential since it relies heavily on the use of primary sources, but if it has been debunked in the past 250 years it won't do anyone any good apart from looking great on a bookshelf.

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>inb4 triggered catholics

>>79688804

it's ok anon, I won't judge you for enjoying the thought of your wife getting fucked by a high test brown person

>>79688880
Painfully dry. Painfully, painfully dry.

>>79688880
>tfw fell for the Gibbon meme
>tfw too late to return them

Oh well, at least I have others to make up for it.

>>79688880
>(((debunked)))

>>79682593
>the barbarians look like Arabs and the Romans are portrayed as racist assholes

>>79688880
Great.

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>>79688808
Not really, they just follow the lives of the "main players" and their spouses/friends; through campaigns and political intrigues. However, she takes historical characters that we know nothing about personality-wise and turns them into human characters. Sulla, for instance, is much more humanized than we can glean from rigid historical sources that are over two millennia old. There's a lot of small details in plots that tie stuff together (like, for instance, Marius and Sulla were related by marriage - in one of the books Sulla marries a Julia Minor, sister to Marius' wife Julia, Julius Caesar's aunt; we know that Sulla's first wife historically was possibly a Julia). It's just small details like that which make the series really engaging).

My only wish is that we have a similar series set in the Eastern Empire after the fall of the West. McCullough's books actually reminded me of the Rome HBO series; they take historical events and build a plausible fiction around them which turns it into a story.

A movie focusing on how Christianity ruined the Roman empire and thus causing its downfall.

>>79689355
Sounds dumbed down enough for a hollywood narrative

>>79682684
>straight nose
>thin lips
>angular eyes
>light skin
He's clearly white, tf are you talking about

>>79682568
>starring Bam Margera

I want some Byzantine action

>>79682568

>Marius
>Sertorius
>Sulla
>Young Pompey

ITT: Americans cant comprehend the fact that curly haired whites exist

Curly hair appears in Europeans naturally, as do natrual afro's. They aren't black specific.

>>79682634
>imperialism
>empire comes home
>empire falls
Fuck, you only need to look at the last century to see that being a cunt and invading other countries does that.

>>79689859
>dark eyes.
>dark complexion
>black, thin, curly body hair.
>black, thin, hair.

not-white

white is blonde body hair, white skin, blue eyes.

>>79689789
This would have potential.

You get the Marius vs. Sulla rivalry and the first civil war, with Pompey as a commander under Sulla.
Then Sulla marches on Rome and kills all his political enemies, but spares a young Caesar.

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this is what we get

good grief this was terrible

muh vulgar auteurism

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>>79682568

>>79682634
Yeah up until they 'opened the borders' invading armies would refuse to pass into Roman territory

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>>79689265
>qt roman
>posting an egyptian from the fayum portraits
what kind of wewuzing it's this?

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>>79682634
>Being this retarded

Sure, it had nothing to do with;

>Having too large an army
>Printing too much money to pay army, resulting in inflation
>Slave owners undercutting farmers and forcing them to sell land or starve
>War on all fronts constantly
>Relying on slave labour so much that your average Roman was undercut to the point of no return
>political instability
>Patricians undercutting and killing eachother to gain an upperhand
>Plebians gaining far too much control for their level of education
>Christian and religious struggles around the Empire
>Caesar's land reforms being thrown away
>Populists elected because Plebians vote for what they liked to hear
>Constantinople is better suited for trade so the power shifts from Rome
>The rest of the world started to rise up and learn from the Romans
>Rome desperately handing out citizenship to everyone for taxes
>Roman farmers who were undercut by slavers forced to move to city
>The Empire completely relies on slavers food as barely anyone can afford food because inflation
>Military was able to completely dictate to the Patricians
>Political violence as plebians started to vote populist after populist
>Economy in shambles corruption takes place on an incredible scale
>Empire was too big, military was too big, too much land to protect, war on all fronts, not enough money to fund Empire, land reforms failed
>Eastern Empire started to separate as it became clear the West wasn't capable to defend itself and was overeliant on slave labour
>civil war as plebians gained too much of a foothold into politics.
>The Hunnic invasion
>People weren't willing to fight for a failing Empire, so Rome relied on mercenaries who blackmailed Patricians

Please, /pol/ tell me how it fell because it underwent a cultural change...

Pick up a book, then read it, then come back and post.

>>79689859
Only Jews have curly hair.

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Make this a tv series.

>>79684523
Its been a meme for a long time that Trump = Julius Caesar and both wanted to make their respective country 'great again', pissed off most of the Senators, had enemies undermining him throughout his time and used populism to destroy them, was eventually assassinated (?) but made a pretty great run of it, which it seems like is happening now.

Pretty easy movie to make.

>>79686526
No, no it wouldn't have. The whole idea that Rome collapsed solely because of barbarian hordes crossing the borders armed is wrong, but it was certainly the straw that broke the camels back.

>>79690680
This all weakened the empire, some of it is disingenuous though.
>>Plebians gaining far too much control for their level of education
The whole divide between patrician and plebeian had been degraded for a long time and arguably this was a good thing, not a bad thing. Also, level of education? Most roman education was fucking shit tier unless you could afford a private tutor.
Massive inflation had been going on for hundreds of years, mints fucking everywhere, it all contributes to a weakening empire. But again, not the decisive blow by any stretch of the imagination.

>>79688571
Gee, this post is in no way political.

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>>79686119
>Mediterranean with pasty white skin and light brown hair

>>79692035
Plenty of romans had pasty white skin my historical revisionist friend.

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>tfw just got rubicon today

what am I in for, /lit/?

>>79683253
thread

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>>79686409
>muh alt right boogeyman

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>>79682568
The sequel to 'I, Claudius'.

http://www.robertgraves.org/issues/15/4293_article_220.pdf

>>79682832
Moors werent black and occupied Sicily for such a short time it wouldve been impossible for their to have been any racial changes.

>>79688560
Shut up you whiny jew.

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>>79683107
Literally everything else is wrong.
Elagabalus 100%

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The African population was relatively small until this past century. There's no reason to suspect they were more numerous in the ancient world, it's far more likely that they were smaller in population.

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>>79688880
>pretty influential

That's an understatement. It is arguably the first modern history book in western literature.

Don't bother if you haven't got a copy with Gibbon's snarky 'footnotes' since they're half of what make it great.

You have to take everything it says with a pinch of salt since it relies on /pol/-esque theories of degeneracy, religion being evil and an idealised perception of the Roman Empire prior to the Crisis of the Third Century. Just because many of his ideas have been debunked doesn't mean it isn't still a seminal work that is still as a rule referred to in pretty much every work on the later Roman Empire. Be aware that due to its age it doesn't use much (or any, really) archaeological sources which are like 70% of what modern historiography is based on and some of the primary texts it uses are outright fakes, such as Ossian.

It's a great read. Very lofty and beautiful written, a lot like Winston Churchill in that sense. Not necessarily great as a secondary text anymore, but it's still relatively authoritative. Just think of it as being no less useful a source than a modern popular history book (i.e. pleb-bait) like Tom Holland or something like that.

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>>79692797
Don't know why some people insist with this "Moors = black" meme. They were Berbers and islamized Iberians.

>>79690811
Curly hair is a Phoenician trait generally, and it's found in many groups.

>>79692737
I actually stopped reading that about half way through. Gets so fucking dry after Herod Agrippa dies.

>>79688946
>Painfully dry.
What? No modern historian can get away with shit like this:


>Such was the state of the Roman frontiers, and such the maxims of Imperial policy, from the death of Augustus to the accession of Trajan. That virtuous and active prince had received the education of a soldier, and possessed the talents of a general. The peaceful system of his predecessors was interrupted by scenes of war and conquest; and the legions, after a long interval, beheld a military emperor at their head.

>Trajan was ambitious of fame; and as long as mankind shall continue to bestow more liberal applause on their destroyers than on their benefactors, the thirst of military glory will ever be the vice of the most exalted characters. The praises of Alexander, transmitted by a succession of poets and historians, had kindled a dangerous emulation in the mind of Trajan. Like him, the Roman emperor undertook an expedition against the nations of the east, but he lamented with a sigh that his advanced age scarcely left him any hopes of equaling the renown of the son of Philip. Yet the success of Trajan, however transient, was rapid and specious. The degenerate Parthians, broken by intestine discord, fled before his arms. He descended the river Tigris in triumph, from the mountains of Armenia to the Persian Gulf. He enjoyed the honour of being the first, as he was the last, of the Roman generals, who ever navigated that remote sea.

>>79686208
hard lefties are mentally ill

/pol/tards are fucking parasites
Purge when ?

>>79693302
when you go back home

>>79682568
Scaevola

>>79693346
After you
>>>/pol/
>>>/reddit/

>>79693365
aright done, now you.

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>>79690811
>implying curly hair is not objectively more attractive than boring dead straight hair

>>79691709
>Most roman education was fucking shit tier unless you could afford a private tutor.
That is the point. Plebians voting was a bad thing. They had no education and voted for populists, much like USA today.

>Massive inflation had been going on for hundreds of years, mints fucking everywhere, it all contributes to a weakening empire. But again, not the decisive blow by any stretch of the imagination.

Massive inflation followed by war on all fronts and being forced to hire mercenaries instead of legions was an absolutely a decisive blow.

Are you under the impression that one single thing caused Rome to fall? Rome was in decline for decades, arguably centuries. There is no one single thing that caused Rome to fall, and a change in culture certainly played no part.

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>>79692237
It can be dramatized as a screenplay if one is clever enough.

>>79682568
A tv show based on belisarius would actually be pretty good.

>>79686208
The truth hurts.

>>79693594
But that is false

>>79693590
Ohh I second this big time. "Vanity of vanities" would be a pretty chilling scene if edited right

>>79693665
phase 1: denial

>>79682634
Rome wasn't destroyed by outside forces: it collapsed from corruption, special interests, dead-end slave economy, and bad management.

>>79686119
holy shit this looks just like my co worker

>>79693720
Why are you describing what you are going through ?

>>79693829
>n-no u

>>79693864
not an argument :')

>>79693731
That's an interesting point, since it's hard to conceive of such low population numbers.
>300 million people on the planet in 1 A.D.
>4 million people throughout the entire Roman Empire
>60 thousand people in Rome during the 6th century A.D.
A much more personal society than we can imagine.

Year of the Five Emperors

>>79682568
Me getting fucked by whoever the guy in that drawing was.

>>79693948
>>4 million people throughout the entire Roman Empire
Utter nonsense.

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>>79682664 >>79682680 >>79682705 >>79682721 >>79682807 >>79682884 >>79683176 >>79683216 >>79683751 >>79683872 >>79684745 >>79684831 >>79686208 >>79687995 >>79688025 >>79688067 >>79688176 >>79688205 >>79689903 >>79690466 >>79690680 >>79693731

Wow, look at all these Jews trying to redirect what they are doing to America and Europe right now.

>>79693989
No, it's not because we have Roman censuses which have survived. It wasn't a democratic empire-of-the-mass, as ours is.

http://www.livescience.com/9732-ancient-rome-real-population-revealed.html

>>79686208
It's a particularly shitty interpretation of history that is supported by ethno-nationalist (read: racist) ideology rather than hard facts and sources.


Look. No one who has ever studied history at a university level would ever support this garbage -- even if they wanted to. There simply aren't any facts to back it up.

>>79693720
It is literally false and ridiculous to claim Rome fell because the culture change that came with Germanic migration.

Do some research, read a book, and stop being an idiot.
>Rome was overstretched
>Rome was suffering from inflation and shitty economy to the point where taxmen refused to accept payment in silver, as it was not worth its weight
>Rome heavily relied on agricultural slave plantations, and average Romans were undercut, unemployed, and forced to move into the city for free food
>had war on all fronts
>Constantinople started to rise as the better city
>Plebians elected populists
>Patricians lost power over Plebians completely and inexperienced populists controlled Rome
>Religious violence and struggles all over the country
>Rome's economy was in tatters, but they still relied on their military to protect their overstretched Empire.
>War on all fronts.
>People refused to fight for Rome, and Rome was forced to hire mercenaries who then blackmailed and controlled the Patricians, who had no army to protect them
>Mercenaries demanded gold instead of silver as it was worthless due to inflation
>"""Barbarians""" sensed the superpower of the world was weak, and started to invade on all fronts
>Civil wars and political instability. There was a new Emperor every other week
>Patricians murder eachother and lie to the populace in an attempt to get elected
>Caesar's land reforms had failed
>Corruption was at an all time high
>The East had distanced itself
>Rome could not afford a mercenary military to defend its vast borders
>Uprisings in all of Rome's colonies

>>79694026
Nice argument. How about you try and refute any of what I said instead of relying on a false Stefan Molymeme video and "muh jews"?

Life of heraclius

>>79694080
>livescience.com
Last post you get you fucking troll.

https://www.princeton.edu/~pswpc/pdfs/scheidel/040604.pdf

>>79682568
>he will never manhandle you under the hot sun of Rome while sweating

Why live?

>>79694080
Also keep in mind that the entire population of England in 1600 was 4 million people. So in population terms, this was the Roman Empire distilled into a country.

>>79694136
That's not an argument, kid.

>>79694136
What the fuck are you blabbering on about? No one was electing anything that mattered in the Roman Empire, and talking about a Plebian/Patrican divide would be anachronistic for the late Republic, never mind the Empire!

>>79693948
>>4 million people throughout the entire Roman Empire
That's not even remotely true. Rome had an army of 700k to fight the Carthaginians during the Second Punic War.
Recent studies suggest that there was 70-100 million people living under Roman rule at the height of the Roman Empire. Remember that Antioch, Alexandra, Constantinople, and Rome were all more populated than any European city at the start of the 17th century.

>>79694026
>you will never be this butthurt and out of arguments

Feels good desu

>>79694186
Except it is. Use your eyes and look. /pol/acks are honestly the worst. You see one Stefan Molymeme video and think you're experts, but in actual fact you're idiots who aren't capable of a simple fact check.

>>79682568
>Open thread expecting an interesting discussion about ancient western history and art
>It's /pol/ shit

Goddamnit.
Also for the record, I'd like to see a film adaptation of Ovid's Metamorphoses.

Did Romans love gay sex? Or was it just Greek people?

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>>79694242
The population of Roman citizens (4M) has to be differentiated from people who were just living within the bounds of the empire (45-75M).

If you weren't part of the census you wouldn't have been on very solid ground.

>>79694331
>The population of Roman citizens (4M)
You dishonest motherfucker, don't even TRY and change your argument. You said NOTHING about citizens only, you just said "people throughout the entire Roman Empire"

>>79694395
The Egyptians and Romans didn't treat outsiders as people. A Roman citizen could treat the vast majority of those around him like machine parts, so it's a important distinction.

>>79694278
still no argument presented :)

>>79694465
>literally the line before says "300 million people on the planet"
>I-I-I clearly meant people=Roman citizens

If your response to this post isn't "please forgive me for my horrible lying' DO NOT BOTHER TO RESPOND.

I wan't /pol/shits, and nazi trumpfags to fucking leave.

>>79694608
umm can you stop being a bigot? we were born this way...

>>79694136
>People refused to fight for Rome
>"""Barbarians""" sensed the superpower of the world was weak
>Plebians elected populists
>Rome heavily relied on agricultural slave plantations, and average Romans were undercut, unemployed
All sounds pretty familiar to me....

>>79682634
>proto-German "master race" were barbarians