So tell me, if Dwarves are so great, why are there no good

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>>55078669

>One halfling gets tricked by a wizard into joining Thorin Oakenshield's quest
>Spends the whole time getting high off a magic ring and sleeping through the Battle of Five Armies
>Writes a book about the DWARVES' quest for the DWARVEN homeland and calls it The Hobbit

Fucking hobbits.

>>55078776
Wasn't the book Bilbo wrote in universe called there and back again though?

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>>55078669
Wrong.

>>55078669
Gotrek and Felix springs to mind.

>>55078669
>there are good books about elves
>there are good books about orcs
>there are good books about hobbits

No.

>>55079271
Wait where the main character or protagonist is an orc? I mean there are plenty of books where the others are main protagonists at least grouped with the main character sure but orcs?

>>55079271
>there are good books

>>55079052
There and back again a Hobbits tale

>>55079348
Orcs: First Blood by Stan Nicholls?

>>55079350
>there is good

>>55079348
Green Honour by Geoffry Harris?

>>55079348
Lord of the Clans, the only half-decent Warcraft novel.

>>55079372
>>55079438
>>55079523
Thanks I'll have to check these out. I really only recently got into fantasy novels. I've always liked the genre but never really read much. Just got through ring world and started on discworld

>>55079426
>is

>>55079620
Anon, "there are good" isn't a sentence.

>>55079363
But it is a hobbit's tale. If the dwarves wrote it it would be a dwarf's tale.

>>55079620
>

>>55079710

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>>55078669

>>55078776
>Thirteen dwarves would've been eaten by trolls without a wizard
>Thirteen dwarves would've been murdered by goblins without a wizard
>Thirteen dwarves would've been eaten by spiders without a hobbit
>Thirteen dwarves would've been p0wned by fucking Elves without a hobbit
>Thirteen dwarves would've sat around a mountaintop for weeks looking like morons without a hobbit
>Thirteen dwarves would've been roasted alive by an angry dragon without a hobbit

Fuck your fucking battle.

>>55079865
There are only two dwarves with lots of lines, and only one of them is a PoV character.

>>55079927
Exactly.
Like a million characters in the series, and the only one worth a single fuck is a dwarf.
Ergo, they're books about dwarves.
Checkmate, elves.

Racism.The so called 'master race' has white washed us from history.

>>55078669
http://www.mediafire.com/file/rqf8ie55z4zozoi/Deep_Sounding_-_Brandon_Carbaugh.epub

I guess you missed way back when this dude came to /tg/ and gave us his dwarf bookfor free. It's pretty good and I'll stick by the original deal and say go buy it on amazon if you liked it for free.

>>55079348
Grunts! by Mary Gentle, but it is pretty much a joke story about orcs with modern weapons being cursed into being action movie style marines

>>55080558
>Mary Gentle
Well, yes, any writing by her is definitely a 'joke' in a certain sense.

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Young, mild mannered sage dwarf raised by a human wizard leaves his secluded home to see the world.

He runs into real mercenary dwarves who wear chain mail, fight with axes etc, and solve their problems with blood shed.

Excellent series

I never actually finished it because my favorite side character died... But I won't let the death of my waifu define an entire series.

>Main character heard about a pond of reanimation after their death.
>Me: Oh good they're going to revive [my favorite character] their best fighter!
>No no... My mistake, they're stripping off his awesome armor.
>Well, maybe they'll bury them and say a few words of gratitude.
>Oh, nope, they are leaving their naked corpse in the mud.
>Excellent.

>Maybe they had gotten too cold to morn their death after so many battles?
>Nope, soon after they all attend the birth of a baby
>The baby is the fucking child of the murderer of their friend. It wasn't brought up and didn't even phase them.
> the most grizzled, stoic dwarf wipes away a single tear.
>Close book

It ticked me off so much the author treated them like a tool that was now through being useful.

>>55080490
Thanks, I love being recommended books especially if it will support a new author.

>>55080598
I've read the entire series and I'm trying to figure out who the hell you are talking about. There are 3 main side character deaths I can think of and you've described none of them. Book 1 or 2, I'm trying to figure this out because it's annoying me who.

Also, the 3rd book is reallllly different but still really good

>>55078710
>>55079147
>>55080049
>Terry Pratshit
>good
You have to be 18 to post here.

>>55080737
Can't remember which book they died in, but it was
Djerun, bodyguard of Andokai, the last surviving maga. The badass who loomed over everyone in sweet armor. Glowing eyes. Showed he wasn't fully bound to the evil bitch and liked main guy when he used a loophole in her orders, to not kill the main dwarf.

In a massive fight against zombie orcs, he went out of his way to wade through combat to help save two characters. He struggled received nasty damage, but barely made it across the battlefield to have their back. Then betrayer bitch elf girl shot him in the back with a arrow. He had been ordered to kill her love interest months before.

After the battle the dwarves then went "well that sucks", and stripped off his magical armor. They didn't ask elf girl why she shanked their ally or morn him. Poor big guy had been magically controlled his entire life, called a monster, and a selfish sociopath. His first act of free will was taking a ton of stabs to put others before himself, and prove himself to his Allies.
Just to die face down in the mud for ungrateful asses.

I like underdogs, anti heroes, and misunderstood characters ok...

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>>55078669
Narrator is a dwarf in a world where adventuring is run by venture capitalists where the bubble is on the verge of bursting to send the realm into economic ruin.

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>>55080744

"Stories of imagination tend to upset those without one."

Not them, but I was 20 when I picked up one of his books for the first time. I've now almost read every single one.

I need books with a variety of emotions that make me think. I can't stand stoic high fantasies because everyone has a stick up their ass.

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>>55080744

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>>55078669
ive read a series of graphic novels called LES NAINS (the dwarves) that is AMAZING.

>>55081396
Ok, gotta read this now.

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>>55078669
Because often the most fun archetypes work better as supporting characters, and flop when presented as protagonists. A good protagonist requires a certain amount of blank-slate-ness to be a good self-insert for the audience. The supporting characters get to be more off-the-wall and/or well-characterized.

The "Kramer" of the cast doesn't work as a protagonist, but is still usually the most interesting. Pic-Related: this is the reason the first 3 PoTC movies worked, while the rest didn't.

>>55078669
The Hobbit, you pleb

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>>55080744

>>55080490
Appreciate the link.

>>55079523
I thought Illidan was pretty good.

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>>55080744

>>55080744
I don't know how you can live with yourself having such shit taste.

>>55080744
get the fuck out

>>55078669
So tell me, if Fantasy is so great, why are there no good books about Fantasy?

>>55080598
these books were fucking aweful drek, couldn't get through the first one. Really just the most generic shit

>>55085483
Books about fantasy, as in books about the fantasy genre?

>>55080598
>Excellent series
No, generic and mediocre as fuck series, driizzling out into aweful as it goes on.

It got published because fantasy was hot after LotR hit, just like all the other shovelware.

>>55080744
We all hate you

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>>55080744
excellent bait my friend.

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>>55079348
The Goblin Corps by Ari Marmell is OK. It's supposed to be an alignment swap of a traditional adventuring party, so the main group is a bunch of monsters like an ogre and goblin and kobold, etc. with an orc basically playing as the Sokka of the group. The characterization in general is pretty shallow but it was entertaining while I was reading it.

>>55079372
>ORCS series
>good
Not really. Stan couldn't into subtlety if his life depended on it and he tries to work in shades of gray while also having factions that are Dick Dastardly levels of Stupid Evil. It's also weird that he just straight lifted Paganism and Catholicism and then just made Catholicism more evil for laughs. Like the primary human antagonists are just Pilgrims on crusade, it's pretty fucking weird even in the context of the series.

>>55080558
Seconding Grunts as decent as long as you ignore Gentle's shitty politicking. It's a nice laugh whenever the orcs get stuck in combat but she fails pretty hard at most everything else in the novel.

The trap halfling bit was funny though.

>>55078669
Because they're all drinking songs, and not written down.

I mean, if we're being completely honest 99.99% of fantasy novels are dogshit. Tolkien gets a pass for practically inventing the genre, but otherwise there are *maybe* 10 genre fiction novels since 1940 that have some semblance of literary merit.

>>55079865
Damn. Never even thought of him.

Good call

>>55080028
>implying the Targaryens aren't elves

Long hair, thin bodies, magical connection to the world, Viserys being a total bitch bottom... It all checks out.

>>55079271
>>there are good books about orcs
Name one.

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>>55080744

>>55086513
I admit I was just answering about books with orcs main protagonists, I forgot about the good part.
To be honest it has been a while and couldn't say if it was good or bad.
Though I'm pretty sure humans were right in the end and inherited the world, not that evil pilgrims would bother me either.

>>55078669
You are literally posting a picture from the Hobbit.

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>>55087610
https://www. amazon.com/Grunts-Mary-Gentle/dp/0451454537

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>>55087610
Also, the hradani aren't completely traditional orcs (More like a orc/ogre hybrid) but Oath of Swords is pretty damn close.

>>55086907
>Hates fantasy.
>Loves the Model T of fantasy.
>Posts on /tg/
Go and take your shit opinions somewhere else.

>>5507974

>>55088447
LoTR

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>>55080744
That's going in the book

>>55087048
True.
And Daenerys is a shit character.
The only reason anybody cares about her is that she has dragons, which are apparently cute, the way they roast insufferable straw-men characters (especially when they're brown people in foreign lands, but hey, we apparently like Westeros people being burned alive too).
And now, she has the aforementioned Best Character on her side, which is a reason for everyone who doesn't have shit taste to care about her.
Checkmate again, Elves. Go drink some fire.

>>55086513
My main problem with Orcs is that it's far too formulaic.
90% of the books can be summed up by
>Orcs are doing Thing
>Get their plans derailed
>Run into enemy of the day
>beat the shit out of them with practically no losses
>get back to doing Thing
The other 10% is just events leading to the Thing getting changed

>>55079744

>>55080598
Can't say much about the books, but the game that's based on them is super fucking charming, if a little janky.

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>>55088747
>defending terry pratchet
INTO THE BOOK

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>>55079348
Dunno about books, but Orc Stain is a good comic... What little there is of it.

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>>55089323

>>55089443
I have never seen this beauty before; but this was certainly the most appropriate time to use it.

>>55078776
dont'cha know short boi, we wuz dorfs n shiet

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>>55089323
If you wanted Grudge related reaction images, you could have just asked

>>55089424
Is that the one with the page about how orc money is literally petrified orc dicks cut into coins?

>>55088785
I like (book) Daenerys because she tries to be a good person and ruler. She's just not very good at it since practicality trumps idealism in her world.
In a way, I see her as Martin's way of showing how little sense it makes to give characters in medieval-style settings modern morality. Just trying to stop one rape got her husband killed and herself broke and sort-of exiled. Trying to end slavery has been causing nothing but problems for her. Trying to be nice nearly gets her killed every time.
Her only real success stories come from her being sneaky and ruthless.

I like her because she's doomed to either become what she hates, or doomed to fail.

>>55089574
Indeed.

>>55089642
This is entirely fair, honestly.
Ice and Fire is one of the few 'commentary/deconstruction' works that seems like it can work on its own, devoid of the original context. Like, you're always aware that Watchmen is Alan Moore frothing at the mouth about superheroes, but it's less obvious with Martin. Sadly, the tv show tosses a lot of this nuance out the window and replaces it with stock HBO tropes that were stale by season four of the Sopranos. (Really hope that Martin manages to finish the books, so that the show doesn't become the more important/only complete work canonically.)

>>55087681
Hey, Buck Danny! Can it get an honourable mention as a Dwarf series since Sonny Tuckson, the shortest of the three, ends up getting most of the stories revolving around him?

I wish that the Silver Call duology had been focused on the Dwarves and not the totally not-Hobbits guides they hired.

>>55089562
those are angry dwarves, faggot

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>>55090117

>>55080744
Only guy who agree with you.

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>>55088502
We've already been over this. The Orcs themselves are fine but Mary's politicking is a bad joke and it really brings down the book. Of course when she isn't talking out of her ass the book is fine.

It's also got a trap, so novelty points there.

>>55080744
I'm sorry for how bad your taste is anon.

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These were pretty good

>>55097322
The King books are fun, but the guy who took over after he left was mediocre, at best.

>>55097543
Ah. I didn't know someone had taken over. The King books were the only ones I've read.

Dragonlance book the Last Thane was excellent read.

Civil War, completely mental dwarves from a clan which city collapsed and they had to kill own to ave enough ait to breath. Demons released from infernal prison killing dwarves during civil war, city build underground like hive turned upside down, hanging over lake...

Last but not least demons whose killing touch erases you from existance so father looks as his daughter gets maimed and then wonders who was that poor sod who got just killed. Cant even mourn the dead.

>>55079620
>Darkseid

>>55097322
The dumbass Dwarf staking a vampire via chandelier was a high point

>>55097543
Nathan Long was better than Kings later books. Any of the stories that don't use the -slayer naming scheme are trash, though.

>>55089642
>>55089897

No, its an example of leadership by ideals instead of leadership by policymaking. A fantasy world reformed into not raping as much or not slaving as much is possible with the right policymaking and administration. The whole deal with Daenerys is she isn't some gifted dude who spent his youth gathering talent around him and arming himself with the wisdom and power necessary to change the world, shes just a pretty young girl who stumbles into fate constantly and isn't adequately equipped with the tools necessary to carry out her decisions effectively.

If her saga makes fun of anything, its Hollywood revolution memes i.e. get rid of all the slavers suddenly grorious utopian freedom world etc.

>>55080744
Leave.

>>55087610
He's implying there aren't you nignog

>>55079523
I liked The Last Guardian a bit more, it had this air of mystery about the world that I really loved, like the whole world was shrouded in mist.

>>55083785
I mean the King's a pretty great author, but he was still following Blizzard's general Illidindu Chosen One Angel plotline. Much like Golden is stuck writing in other people's general outlines, I got bummed out when they revealed Inferno Squad was going to be a prequel/midquel to the First Order Campaign in EAfront 2 instead of her own thing.

>>55080744
Skin yourself alive my friend.

>>55080744
I'm also feeding you all the (You)'s you wanted.

>>55086429
Too obvious, though.