/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

>>54982929
>Is Wraith20 ever going to come out?
Sooner than Far West
http://www.mutedhorn.net/far-west-delivery-estimates

Guide to triggering magefags:
Remind them they can't even pick a Demon out of a crowd.

>>54982911
>DaveB BTFOing Changelings n' Demons

Yes, cry you pathetic demonfags

>>54982929
Best Genius Vamp crossover ever

>>54983021
>Magewankers start the thread with residual buttmad

>>54982998
>Magehaters start the thread with residual envy

>>54983040
>Genius
One, don't.
Two, PB is either a Promethean or a Changeling.

So, do we have any details on the announced third Mage supplement, Fallen Worlds (that likely will not be released until 2025)?

>>54983062
>One, don't.
Well I guess if you hate yourself that's something you should see a psychiatrist about

>>54982998
Does Mage Sight not work on Demons?

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>no concrete proof of Prime beating a Demon's Cover
>no concrete proof of Demon's Cover being impervious to Prime
>even DaveB doesn't know, or care

You really need to just agree to disagree.

>>54983104
I'd allow Unveiling, not maybe not Mage Sight.

These discussions are the reason why Dave doesn't visit us anymore. ;_;

>>54983125
>I'd allow Unveiling, not maybe not Mage Sight.

Mage Sight doesn't automatically detect explicit concealment powers like Obfuscate. I would certainly put Demon's lying powers in that category. However, such protection does not extend to Knowing and Unveiling spells.

>>54983104
Magesight works. It just wouldn't find anything unless the Demon's spoof fails.

If the spoof succeeds, then the Mage would only see signs of a normal human.

>>54983153
That's pretty tempting.

>>54983153
>These discussions are the reason why Dave doesn't visit us anymore. ;_;

Ironically, Dave's been unusually active here and in the OPP forums over the last week or two.

I think he's in a much better mood now that he's finished the Deviant outline, it's been approved by the Swedes, and he can again focus on Mage while he awaits Deviant first drafts.

Alright, I'm looking at making a changeling for the first time for a crossover game based on the advice of the last thread. How would I go about making as wizardly (Throwing fireballs, ritual magic, detecting supernatural stuff easily) a changeling as possible? The idea is that they got stuck playing the role of a wizard in the fey's games. Likely with the physical warping being rather a caricature of a wizard, with a serious case of uncanny valley.

I will freely admit: Changeling is something Iv'e got basically zero experience, so tell me if I'm doing stuff wrong.

I know this is 4chan, and that we can all afford to be retarded here, but can we all just drop the splat wars for once?

>>54983178
Wizened are the most like traditional witches and wizards. Very elongated, wrinkly, or otherwise oddly musty-smelling and that sort of thing. I'd obviously take a lot of dots in Occult for that sort of Changeling, and the Autumn Court tends to be the court of magic and secrets but Winter works as well depending on your Changeling's personality.

>>54983062
Genius is better than beast, promethean and mummy so kill yourself faggot. And PB is definitely a genius

>>54983197
As soon as this general submits too and respects mage SUPREMACY

>>54983205
Unfortunately, Wizened contracts are toward artifice, which won't give fireball chucking stuff.

Another option is to be an Elemental. You could do something very Radagast like with an Earth related elemental. Then your contracts let you do the element flinging, and the universal contracts could give you some of the other stuff they would want to seem wizardly.

Contracts of Hearth in particular.

>>54983178
Make an Acanthus you PUSSY

>>54983197
>can we all just drop the splat wars for once?

There will be peace in the Middle East and a cure for cancer before anyone yields in the Spat Wars.

>"We shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be, we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender."

>>54983213
Genius can be better than Beast and Mummy, no one cares.

But Prommie is actually pretty high tier, and Genius just ain't up there, sorry kid.

I was just about to ask you guys how to get into this setting, but them I saw OP's image. Please tell me that I won't have to deal with shitty Adventure Time-tier garbage.

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More wisdom from the Komodo King

>>54983286
You can show yourself out. We have enough players as is.

>>54983205
>>54983257

Right, thanks. How good are the changeling element flinging stuff? I'm not remotely opposed to being limited in the elements I can work with.

Personality-wise I was thinking of someone who's got serious conflict over it all. Loving the idea of being a wizard...but still horrified about being forced into it/what they did while a fey's toy. A dream come true in ways that leave them horrified and guilty over ever wanting that dream. Is there a court/group for changelings who are still working out how they feel about what happened to them? As iirc, the courts are each dominated by a particular emotion but a person can easily have multiple conflicting emotions about a particular thing.

Sorry if I'm messing stuff up, as I said, I've got basically zero changing experience.

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>>54983305
>more mages are privileged white people and the other splats are poor downtrodden minorities

>>54983332
Yep, that's how Dave Bootyshot intended it.

>>54983257
I still think a Wizened Oracle could be a really good wizardly archetype. It would be more expensive to buy Elements contracts, but fixing or breaking technology with a touch is something I'd expect from a modern-day Gandalf. Like Dumbledore's lighter that disables lamps.

There is actually an alternate rule that allows people to choose any Kith with any Seeming, and Changeling 2e looks to be making that the default, so maybe asking the GM to make an Elemental + Oracle combination might be a good idea.

>>54983332

While both of the political left, relish the differences between how Dave develops Awakening versus how Brucato develops (and almost exclusively writes) M20 Ascension.

>TFW I realize what Dave could have included in Mage 2e if he was given M20's word count

>>54983373
>what Dave could have included in Mage 2e if he was given M20's word count

>Mage Fan Tears

>>54983322
You might want to go ahead and read over the Contracts if you haven't already. Changelings aren't actually that good at elemental magic, but what they can do involves manipulating what's in the area around them. Think more like that one mutant from X-Men who uses the lighter rather than a D&D Wizard.

Who won the argument? Magefags or Demonfags?

>>54983416
Depends on the GM seems to be the consensus.

>>54983416
Depends if your gm can read.

>>54983418
They’re are more mage players. i.e, more Mage STs, meaning that Demons lose.

>>54983373
i.e., Legacies

>>54983416
>Who won the argument? Magefags or Demonfags?

>TFW there's no DaveB screencap to conclusively end the argument

>Sign of the apocalypse

>The End Is Night

>>54983416
Nobody wins these discussions.

Except for the Magefags. They seem to have a citation up their sleeve more often than not.
They effectively rule /wodg/ at this point.

>>54983447
>the end is night
>maybe vampires win?
>whatever, we take what we can get

>>54983447
There is no DaveB screencap. The closest we got was "i dunno lol, let me ask someone"

He never got back to us.

>>54983442
>i.e., Legacies

That and whole lot more.

Signs of Sorcery and all the antagonist material would likely have fit in a tome the size of M20.

>>54983453
DaveB is the only author that cares about 4chan, so it's not hard to see why people here like Mage so much.

>>54983475
I don't know. Dave's presence just makes me reluctant to run mage games.

Which sucks, because all my previous mage games were fun.

>>54983475

Chris Allen, one of the primary writers for Forsaken and other CofD material, also used to be prolific on /wodg/, (He's also a friend of Dave). Sadly, he seems to have mostly disappeared along with Dave, but still posts on the OPP and Discord forums.

>>54983475
>DaveB is the only author that cares about 4chan

"DaveB is the only developer that cares."

FIFY

>>54983492
You mean you don't have a shrine dedicated to The Komodo in your closet?

...why are you even here?

>>54983492
Why is that?

>>54983496
Dave has been here a lot recently, or at least it's seemed that way to me. I actually had a conversation with him in a thread a few weeks ago.

>>54983507
>"DaveB is the only developer that cares."

I don't know, the Komodo Exarch is a cruel and fickle god.

>>54983405
Don't forget Goblin Vows. A Goblin Vow is like a Pledge, but you can make the Pledge with an abstract concept, offering a service for a service. It would cover freeform (but not free) elemental magic, though you'd need to raise the merit for each additional element covered. Rites of Spring, p. 38

DaveB knows the Magefags have a powerful presence here. That's why he rarely steps down. He carefully sows the seeds of Mage Supremacy wherever it's needed most.

>>54983519
Evening quoted from him comes off as dismissive of the larger setting, and written from the point of view of the mage dev. Which is weird, because as he himself has said, he works on a ton of games at OP. There are only like two or three lines he doesnt work on in some way.

So he comes off as an asshole.

>>54983549
>comes off as dismissive of the larger setting

Yeaaaaahhhh, you can bugger off. He doesn't dismiss anything.

>>54983567
That was real persuasive anon, you changed my opinion!

Oh wait, no you didn't.

>>54983593
Why should I have to persuade a faggot like you?

>>54983602
You don't have to. I'm also not trying to persuade you. I guess you'll just have to deal with me thinking DaveB is an ass.

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Is there any evidence of a giovanni diablerizing a fellow clan member and getting away with it?
What about a childe diablerie on their sire or would the bond be too strong?

Is QB a Beast?

>>54983738
How would that work? Is he turning the girls into Heroes? Seems like a True Fae would be more able to grant powers.

I don't think anyone answered last time.

What happens to forsaken during a solar eclipse?

>>54984074
they yiff a mighty yiff

Does anyone have a pdf of the Rio book?

>>54984435
NO

>>54983062
This actually reminds me, why do people here seem to have such strong aversion if not outright hate for Genius?
Mad Scientists are huge staple of horror genre from good ol' Victor Frankenstein and Henry Jekyl to Herbert West and others.

>>54984490
Because its like a crappier version of Ascension

>>54984522
Frankly. I don't like the absurd amount of crunch mages comes in with and the whole 'condescending magic user' -cliche its following reeks of.

>>54984537
>master of eldritch forces beyond the understanding of mere men
>not condescending

pick one

>>54983496
These threads have really gone to shit since hardcore Mage Supremacy posting became the norm. It wouldn't suprise me if he stopped posting because of it.

I miss all the really recognizable shitposters acting as a hatesink. At least we had discussions in between shitty drama rather than every single topic being interupted by mageposting.

Legacy anon where have you gone? I need to exploit the fact you exist so I don't have to come up with the rules for the Cwn Annwn.

>>54984590
I take "being convinced that you have build flying car and try to take over Europe" any day over that. nWoD amd CofD seemed to be big on whole "blessed with /cursed with awesome" and mages just win lottery and proceed to berate everyone for not winning.

>>54984537
My biggest complaint about mage is the amount of system mastery even a 0 xp game requires from both players and story tellers. Highest reading and rules workload ever.

>>54984490 >>54984537
So, any non-Mage Supremacist who'd like to enlighten me or is it just noise and finding peeps to play Genius with should be easy?

>>54984621
I'll hash it out tomorrow morning.
I remember them being a total pain the first time I looked them over, what with their ludicrous Lower Depths familiar.

>>54984698
Fan splats are maximum hate around here, usually because they are poorly written mechanically and often very fan fiction feeling.

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hey guys! how's it going!

>>54984737
What is this travesty of faggots?

>>54982929
I want to fuck that bubblegum

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>>54984717
Right, did it early.

Version 1.26
Now with the Cwn Annwn.

These guys are confusing as fuck and really annoying, given they're a:
>Lower Depths
>Left Handed
>Prime Legacy
>Using 1e spells with no 2e equivalents
>Who don't really like Oblations, for some reason
>Who use their original Path's Ruling as their Ruling Arcanum
>Who don't really have any secondary Arcanum that makes sense
>Who rely on a familiar, that isn't really a familiar for their abilities, who exists in "Prime-Twilight"

So basically I just tried to as closely adapt 1e as I could, and left in a few things from 1e that aren't really sensible in 2e.

>>54985196
Not to mention they're lazy motherfuckers who don't want to put in the hard yards to Ascend.

Plus they have to leave their bodies unconscious while they spend a ludicrous amount of Mana to run off to their shitty home realm which isn't even an emanation realm.
Which according to the lore, bleeds Mana like crazy.

So they're essentially a Scientology-like cult of lazy motherfuckers who want to build up a massive store of mana just so they can have their 'Astral+' clubhouse, and never ultimately achieve anything, while risking detection and PURGING because they've got to constantly raid Hallows, because in 2e (bar the 5th Attainment) you can't just harvest Mana from solid objects any more.

>>54984744
Our overlord Dracula and his minions.

>>54985228
to be fair, they were written in 1e where archmages were seen a fairy tales by most mages. So finding a place where paradox doesn't exist and working to rebuild a new world their doesn't strike me as to bad of an idea. (always wondered what would happen if at the higher levels you made your hound eat you).

>>54984725
Okay, can't argue with tastes, but how hard would it be to find people interested to run/play Genius?

>>54985802
Who knows. None of the people in these threads actually play.

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>>54985834
>None of the people in these threads actually play.

I want to say you're wrong, but I'm not certain I can. I used to play myself, but my group's currently on a six-month break from WoD, and we're all playing Unhallowed Metropolis now, because we still wanna play games with dark themes.

>>54985802
I would personally wait for the fan made 2ed update to be finished. 1ed Genius is a mess, and I say this as a fan.

>>54985834
Speak for yourself
>>54985802
Look on roll 20 or rpg.net should not be too hard

>>54983110
Wont Prime just clash with a demons spoof or cover?

I see the truth vs im a lying cuntbag?

>>54983721
Um Giovanni and old Cappa is a example of childe diablerie on their sire fucknut?

Petty sure after then have stopped fucking each other Giovanni on Giovanni violence is common

>>54984737
Middle right looks like he sings for Ensiferum.

>>54982967

>All OPP and WW products are guaranteed to be out before Far West

This, at the very least, is a comfort.

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>>54983213
>Genius: The Old Mage Whining
>Better than anything besides Beast

The Judges do not approve

Planning a medieval fantasy game of sorts for my friends. Is there a general dark ages books I could use for mortals and general reference? Trying to have a 16th century sort of setting.

While I'm at it, how easily could i cobble together other storyteller systems, like Scion or Exalted, for the fantasy aspect?

Idea for a Horror: the Vermin Lord. A wizened, sickly looking vagrant dressed in rags and a trash cloak. Virtue is Kindly, Vices are Implacable/Watchful. Aspirations are Keep The City Safe, Help The Downtrodden and Punish The Haughty. Dread Powers include Beastmaster, Gremlin, Numen (Mixed Blessings, Mortal Mask, Entropic Decay. Curse: Deformity), Wall Climb, Toxic 2 (Sick) and Baleful Polymorphosis.

>>54987298
Exalted would be harder than Scion given how you can take Scion's mythic hero style and plop that shit right down in 16th Century England, Imperial China, or an Arabian Nights middle-east. Exalted is so high power the world itself needs to shift to accomodate it more.

>>54987298
The book mirrors has a world of darkness fantasy medieval setting. Check it out.

>>54986466
>Recruit off roll20

What kind of asshole are you to give that advice?

Just had an idea.

A network zero style hunter game where they all play an mmo that is set in the fantasy setting for world of darkness.

>>54987322
I was just wondering how easily I could mash things like charms or whatever into a different storyteller system. The story is going to ramp up into a more Exalted-leveled one over time.

>>54987696
>I was just wondering how easily I could mash things like charms or whatever into a different storyteller system

Oh. Oh! Yeah no that is going to be shit, check yourself there. These games don't crossover mechanically well. Pick one then stick with it.

>>54985802
I know people who did run a whole campaign in it, so I can't imagine it would be that hard.

>>54987696
I would ask the exalted general about that honestly.

>>54987497
Where is one supposed to look? Don't say TG LFG.

>>54987739
>>54987834
Yeah Exalted I'm mostly borrowing setting elements from, and I was going to base the fantasy aspects more around Scion.

May as well ask about it here because nobody fucking plays Scion lmao

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How are the W5 write ups? What did you think of them?

Are you going to play W5?Or are you sticking to WtA 20th?

What is your favorite Tribe and Changing Breed?

>>54987298

Exalted does not play well outside of its own setting and its third edition is full of mechanical cruff that is more there to satisfy existing fanboys than it is making it a good game for new people to jump on board with.


If you are using old Scion, its like Exalted 2e but even more easy to break and ruin thanks to its shoddy system, so I would avoid it until the new one comes out.

My opinion? I would just run Dark Ages, its pretty tight enough for what you want though the time period is more 12th-13th century Europe.

>>54987872

RPG.net lul

Honest answer though? I've found some okay people to play WoD with over Mythweavers and GitP forums. They were all oWoD/cWoD folks however. All of my experiences anywhere recruiting nwod folks ended up with young-ish weirdos and flakes. The owod players and STs tend to be older and more reliable, if a little grognardy in a tolerable way, but that's my anecdotal experience.

>>54988072
I got started on myth-weavers with nwod and I didn't really have a problem. Though mythweaver games have a tendency to die in general so maybe I didn't notice.

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>>54987956
>May as well ask about it here because nobody fucking plays Scion lmao
I run a game of it

>>54988220

I've noticed most people who do play TTRPGs are either oblivious to how bad their game actually is, or they're way too tolerant of shitty games because they are desperate and too lazy to run their own game.

If a game died it died for a reason. The only really valid one is IRL stuff totally fucked the GM /everyone over and they can't schedule anything anymore.

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>>54988012
>Like Shadowlords
>Their write-up isn't even up yet
>Hope it never gets posted, it would be perfectly fitting

I'm pretty hopeful for W5. I'd love for more werewolf games to happen, since finding one is like finding a diamond in your backyard these days. Shadowlord/Ragabash all day.

>>54986575
I meant in a more general statement.
Things the antidilluvians and methusalahs did are kinda outside the norm. What's the overall occurance of diablerie on sires or on family members within the giovanni.
Also when did they stop fucking each other? I was meaning from oWoD.

Lol I just read http://theonyxpath.com/storytelling-changeling-the-lost/ and guess what again, there is the X card bullshit again. It will be in the book so that means CtL is officially kill.

>>54988738
Stop being such a baby. No one is forcing you to use the X Card.

>>54988738
Yeah just like how the 'zer' sidebar killed Promethean. Or the gender identity one killed werewolf. Or any of the other things you pansies complain about killed any of the other game lines.

Get over yourself.

>>54988922
Promethean was barely hurt by the "zer". It was gigantic shitshow as it was. No editing altogether, terrible and mismatched mechanics, tragic writing.

>>54988918
>No one is forcing you to use the X Card.
No one is forcing me to play it either. But I can still say it's crap.

>>54984618
We should really be posting more about gay werewolves to defuse the mageposters.

Idea for a Dread Power.

Chameleon Horror 2: The Horror is more than stealthy, it is one with the shadows and hidden corners of the world. Besides the effects of Chameleon Horror 1, It receives Rote Quality on Stealth rolls, may make Stealth rolls even when moving at full Speed, and any supernatural attempts to find them provoke a Clash Of Wills against their Dexterity + Stealth + Potency. By spending 1 Willpower, it can also add its Potency to Stealth rolls for the scene. Spending 3 Willpower points adds its Potency as bonus Successes on a Stealth roll for one turn.

>>54989074

It's in the Storytelling chapter AKA the chapter in every corebook that people read once and then forget about. It was true for Changeling 1e and it'll be true here. Changeling will live and die by the material outside of that chapter, and nothing else.

>>54989074
Are you really so immature that an optional rule meant to make things safer and more enjoyable for game groups ticks you off? Not everyone wants to deal with vivid description of cannibal rape parties or whatever.

>>54989106

Okay. Which Tribe is most likely to be the gayest? Which one has the most closet homos?

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>>54989293
Explain to me why can't the players just speak up and explain themselves?

>>54989378
>the book says it is mandatory
No it doesnt, because the book isn't out.

>>54989301
Get

>>54989533

Oh, you're right. I had my wires crossed with another RPG I read earlier today and I thought I read that on the blog post. Deleted the post, my bad.

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>>54989532
Cause nerds are notoriously passive aggressive assholes

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>>54989106
I'm not a fan of gay werewolves

Until I am

>>54989532
They can. The X Card is not meant to be a crutch that stiffles emotionally challenging moments. You should talk with your players BEFOREHAND about what bothers them. The X Card is meant to be a "just in case" sort of thing, not a recurring event that blocks anything remotely unpleasant.

>>54989532
That's what the x card is?

>>54989682

But Anon, my Dread Players will merely use the X-Card to being harassmement and harm to me, the Noble ST, for no reason whatsoever.

>>54989106
No Fuck off FAGGOT. And this is coming from a huge forsakenfag.

>>54989785
Not huge enough I guess.

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>>54989785
Are all faggots this territorial?

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>>54989656

I actually prefer them hetero and breaking the litany with cute werewolf girls.

>>54989803
>small penis syndrome
it's really very sad.

>>54989872
We will persevere

>>54989785

Forsaken is for weak ass bitches who want to act like thug niggers and not be proud warriors facing the apocalypse head on.

Go back to humping a trashcan you nutless fleabag.

>>54989909
>apocalypse
Well i guess if you just want to be domed by black furries that is your dollar

>>54989909
Apocalypse garou are the pointless thugs.
Forsaken are the police.

Stop resisting arrest or get a few warning shots to the chest.

Has there been any news about Deviant?

>>54990023
We got a blurb

>>54989956

>Furies irrelevant in Revised/W20
>get completely assblasted in W5 and made even more irrelevant

lol sure kid

>>54989965

Garou can actually prevent the apocalypse as of W20.

Garou in W5 survived the Apocalypse.

What can Forsaken do, besides being pussy-whipped by the Moon into being beta bitches who get raped by the Pure? lol buncha momma's boys. Weak.

>A Mage in the Shadow
>A Werewolf in the Shadow

Who fares better? I just came back from the OPP forums asking the same thing.

>>54990191

Werewolf unless the Mage has proper arcana for it, in which case probably the Mage. The real question is; do they both know ahead of time that they are going into the Shadow or are they flung into it unexpectedly? Mages have issues if they don't have prep-time and aren't heavily geared for taking on that task. Werewolf would have the advantage then.

>>54990191
Mage.

Because Mage.

You know I'm right too.

>>54990082
>werewolf not furrie simulator
well someone is in denial

>>54990191
I wonder what the OPP Forums thinks of us.

>>54990164
Garou are boring shit with weak themes and mechanics and filled with shitty mechanics. Sure 1v1 Garou can wreck forsaken but who cares all oWoD splats are stronger than their CofD counterparts

>>54990281

Oh so you're just retarded and don't know how to spell. Good to know.

>>54990304
Pathetic Magefags

>>54990305

>MUH HUNT
>MUH HUNT
>MUH HUNT
>MUH TERRITORY
>MUH HUNT
>MUH FATHER WOLF
>also, MUH HUNT

You were saying?

>>54990191
Wouldn't Werewolves be better at spirit shit than Mages? It's kind of their deal.

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>>54990326

>>54989956
>furries
>>54990316
https://www.google.com/search?q=furries&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

well I guess you are anon

>>54990304

Sad.

Its a handful of posters at best, all regulars, who do nothing but circlejerk and bait with the same thing every single thread every single day for months on end.

At least talk about something actually stupid or controversial, like, does Ghouling someone count as rape or do contraceptives work on Garou.

>>54990386
vampire is sex
garou break condoms

Now back to shit posting

>>54990411

>can't fuck in Homid form for some reason
>thinks condoms are the only forms of contraceptives

You must be some brain dead pot smoking Eurotrash.

>>54990411

Vampire sex is rarely if ever consensual, especially with all the mindfuck powers they have.

Ghouling usually isn't done to someone who wants it. Its not until you've forced them to effectively become a drug addict that they start 'liking' it.

>>54990326
At this point anything potentially anti-Mage is "bait"
That's how far the tendrils of Mage Supremacy have spread in this vile repulsive place.

They've fucking won.

>>54990386
Ghouling someone is knowingly giving them an addiction, while feeding on unwilling vessels is either rape or assault depending on the specifics.

>>54989965
>Forsaken are the police.

So, does that make the local Thyrsus the mayor of Shadowtown?

>>54990463

Its disingenuous. Its a shitposter posting an obviously inflammatory post because they know it will upset someone else. All of this is shitposting. There is no true dyed in the wool magefag here because you guys have been so easily triggered over the topic that its become a meme, a sport, to circulate mindlessly in every thread.

At least its kept to this containment thread.

>>54990464

There has to be a precedence for why its bad to turn someone into an addict against their knowledge and consent. As an example, you can't legally get away with lacing someone's beverage with LSD. Ghouling is far worse in comparison because it carries the baggage of effectively becoming their mental slave afterward.

So at the very least its the equivalent of enslavement.

>>54990470
>So, does that make the local Thyrsus the mayor of Shadowtown?

Of course, and he's Making the Shadow Great Again!

If we find and kill the Magefag queen, will the infestation end?

>>54990633

You can only kill the magefag menace by talking about your favorite game in a positive way and tell everyone why you like it.

>>54990326
You would think but according to Mr. Brookshaw if the Shadow was Mt. Everest than Mages would be badass rich white guys with top of the line equipment and the best training while Werewolves would be sherpas.

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>>54990647
I like Awakening because it means I'm better than everyone else.

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>>54990680

>>54983305

Time to leave

>>54988738
Consider the following,

- You could use the X card to stop edgy faggots raping dead babies
- You could use the X card to stop edgy faggots whining about their emotional distress
- You could use the X card to stop edgy fetishists trying to rape your character.

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>>54990680
>>54990326
>Wouldn't Werewolves be better at spirit shit than Mages? It's kind of their deal.

It's not a matter of more or less powerful. Mages are not natives, and their presence is inherently disruptive. While many mages are quite powerful, they are effectively walking ecological disasters for the other realms

Mages are the rich and powerful privileged western imperialists of the CofD.

Even nice and conscientious mages are arrogant assholes. They just can't help it.

>>54990888

>Can we give MattMc an X Card, and bury Beast for good.

>>54990905
>mages aren't part of the ecology
Useless fluff that has zero relevance to the mechanics. A mage will always be better than a werewolf at spirit or a Geist at death plain and simple

>>54990888
Can we use the x card to stop using the x card? Cards trigger me.

What the fuck is this X Card bullshit

>>54990962

Luckily for you there is also a red/yellow/green light system.

>"the X card was designed by John Stavropolous"
>Stavropolous

I am ashamed to call myself a proud Greek

Fuck.
I am so sorry that my own kin did this to you people.

>>54990977

One of the things that'll rocket this thread to 300+ posts in about two hours, like all the other thread favourites.

>>54990948

First, and mage-bitter constantly exclaim, not every mage has every Arcana.

Second, reread Dave's comments. Mages are powerful, but they cause problems. The Arcana break or bypass the rules of the various realms, and cause problems.

Bullying spirits and ghosts often cause more problems than it solves.

>>54991003

So, how do we combine the X Card issue with non-binary pronouns to light the thread on fire, and hopefully start again.

>>54991034
I thought causing problems was a thing all Mages enjoyed doing?

So Signs of Sorcery isn't out, right?

Was there a preview or something, I remember people calling about spheres instead of paths?

>>54991078
>I thought causing problems was a thing all Mages enjoyed doing?

No, they are compulsive bastards who'll do anything in pursuit of Mysteries and arcane power, damned the consequence.

Mages enjoy power and magic, and the resulting problems are a nuisance.

>You can't make a mystical omelet with breaking a few dimensional eggs.

>>54991169

>Mage isn't a power fantasy for beta nerds I swear guise!

>>54991150

No, Signs of Sorcery isn't out yet, and probably will not be released before next year. The drafts are still with Dave in "development." Once he's done, it still needs nuWW approval, editing, art, layout, more approvals, etc.

However, Dave has released a few spoilers. They're listed in his open development blog.

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/mage-the-awakening/437565-second-edition-development-blogs

>>54991150
Spheres are the MtAs/oWoD name for Arcana

>>54991220
>Mage isn't a power fantasy for beta nerds I swear guise!

No, because actual mage adversaries are top tier, and mages routinely get their asses kicked. Mage is just not a "street-level" game.

Beast is a power fantasy.

>>54991246
Maybe I'm mixing issues, it was people talking about being able to pick majro/minor arcana instead of following a set Path

>>54991254
>Beast is a power fantasy

The power of revenge you mean.

Anyone get a look at the Gencon V5 playtest document yet?

>>54991254

>literally the best at everything because they accumulate worthless knowledge no one else would care to even ask about and pursue it mindlessly above any practical life skills

>zero reason at all to put anything in physical dots thanks to Arcana

>oppressed by their own Alpha-nerd elders to fulfill further fantasies of 'FUCK YOU, DAD!'

>get to rub it in the faces of hot popular people (vampires) and hot buff redneck Chads (werewolves) and embarrass the hated nigger gang analog (Geist) at the things they do best without even trying

Sure. Sure it isn't.

>>54991294
It is best served cold

>>54991294
>Beast
>Powers that make other supernaturals like them

>Social Maladept power fantasy

>>54991034
Once again it is useless fluff. Nobody cares that mages cause problems for the environment because it isn't reflected in the rules. That's like saying one of a vampire's weaknesses is that they expell greenhouse gases

>>54990593
When the Shadow sends its spirits, they're not sending their best. They're sending spirits that have lots of problems. They're bringing Verges, they're bringing bad Resonance. They're magaths. And some, I assume, are suitable pack totems.

I will greatly, greatly increase the Gauntlet on our Shadow border, and I will use hunted spirit Essence to pay for it.

>>54991254

Mage's chief antagonists are other Mages. Even when they 'lose', it still fulfills the nerd power fantasy narrative of Superior Enlightened Intellectual With God Powers Wins Forever.

Mages are like the worst aspects of Exalted's 'Solar Supremacy' advocates but somehow even worse. Its quite astounding, really.

>>54991348
>Mage's chief antagonists are other Mages

Have you forgotten about that whole Abyss thing?

>>54991380

No one ACTUALLY gives a fuck about the Abyss you toolshed.

>>54991379
Solars are supposed to be the best at everything, it's the foundation of the setting. You don't have to like it but you do have to live with it.

The worlds of darkness aren't supposed to focus around Mages, but they do because Mages are the best at everything.

>>54991341
>Once again it is useless fluff. Nobody cares that mages cause problems for the environment because it isn't reflected in the rules.

For people who actually play the games, everything is not defined by who would win a white room battle. Narrative elements matter.

If you choose to have crossover, and ignore these themes, you get what you deserve.

>>54991380
>Abyss

lol I bet you think Paradox is an efective counter-balance too

>>54991408

Which is bad writing that crept in with 2e, aka the edition everyone hates. That they've continued that narrative only shows how bad the writers and fans alike are.

Also its extremely retarded to out and out say 'this is the best, deal with it' because then it devalues ever playing anything else. It denies any interesting comparisons like what you get with Versus discussions. And its flat out delusional in the face of real life for there is always an equalizer. There is always a bigger fish. Nothing lasts forever. Etc.

>>54991394
>No one ACTUALLY gives a fuck about the Abyss you toolshed.

People who actually play Mage most certainly do.

Mage is designed as a self-contained game with appropriate antagonists and challenges. If you insist on RAW crossover, "cosmic-tier" pc's like mages and demons are going to run roughshod over everyone else. That's your problem, not a defect in Mage.

>>54991315
People keep mentioning W5 too, where are those details located?

>>54991449
>There is always a bigger fish

And that fish is invariably another, older Mage or a Supernal entity

>>54991394
>What are the guardians? What are the Mysterium?
Are you even trying? Because if you're not even going to read the book

>>54991450

That'd be great if the posters could also keep their Mage shitposting self-contained to Mage when people try to talk about anything else.

>>54991459

Irrelevant. I wasn't talking about Mage.

>>54991449
Except there's nothing wrong with it?

Why? Oh, I don't know... Probably because nothing is forcing you to even use Mages in your game?

You're just being a pissy little bitch of a whiner.

>>54991408
It's an easy setting hack to say all the Solar Essences got converted, and are now Abyssals or Infernals. You want to be a Solar? Earn that shit with a personal redemption. Until then, you benefit from easier plot seeds and more distinctive powers.

>will never use mage in game
>still complains that they're overpowered

yahhhh

>>54991449
>'this is the best, deal with it' because then it devalues ever playing anything else. It denies any interesting comparisons like what you get with Versus discussions

Mage has no effect on any other game line. Each line is self-contained, and with the second editions, their expressly not balances against one another. Rather, each line's mechanics are designed to emphasizes the lines particular setting and themes.

Also, "versus" discussions are juvenile "white room" penis measuring nonsense that has little to do with actual play. It's only "interesting" to the intellectually lazy and uncreative.

>>54991465
Butt hurt wolf fag detected. Post more gay wolfies

>>54991513
I've learned recently that people only hate Mage because they're stronger than their favorite splat.

Not because of imbalance. It's all bias.

>>54991450
>People who actually play Mage most certainly do.
No they don't, they only care about turning vampires into lawn-chairs.

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>>54991523
>tfw too intelligent for crossover games

>>54991523
Butt hurt vamp fag detected. I think I'm two for two right now

>>54991523

Anon was talking about Exalted, not Mage.

>>54991513
>will never use mage in game
>still complains that they're overpowered
>yahhh

Special Snowflake Mage-Ency Syndrome is a terrible affliction.

>>54991533
Butt Hurt Changeling Fag. OH the triple

>>54991567
What? I'm a proud fucking Magefaggot. I am easily the worst offender here.

>>54991566
Butt Hurt Promethean fag Out of no where

You're all fags

>>54991585
>Admitting mage is shit
Fuck you turncoat

>>54991538
>No they don't, they only care about turning vampires into lawn-chairs

Only if said vampire interferes with a Mage's pursuit of a Mystery,

>>54991613
Mage is THE shit

Will never turn my back on the Mage Imperium

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>when the Moros has had enough of your shit

>>54991616
>Only if said vampire exists
ftfy

>>54991595
>Butt Hurt Promethean fag Out of no where

Hah! Games about trannies with Pinocchio Syndrome are definitely not my speed.

>>54991641
>when the Moros has had enough of your shit

That's not how you spell "Obrimos."

>>54989710
The X Card rule specifies that you never have to explain why something can't be used.

>>54991699
This is why the use of the X Card would bother me more than anything I could ever X Card myself.

>>54991699
Yeah, but do you expect a long explanation of why someone doesn't want something in the game?

What you're going to get, if an X-card needs to be used, is 'I just can't, I'm sorry. I'm not comfortable with it.'

Which is summed up with the X-card.

So what? Would you plan on grinding your game to a halt to try to talk the person out of it?

'Sorry betty, I know you said you're uncomfortable with the rape dungeon, but would it be better if it was a rape suite? Or a rape flat?'

>>54982967
Just play Deadlands. We all know it's better than what Far West will be.

>>54991761
As the ST I'd like to know why they don't like something so I can know what to exclude in the future.

>>54991862
That's easy then, the thing to exclude is the overly sensitive player who can't handle imaginary games because they aren't functional human beings.

>>54991879

Easy..., you've just triggered all the socially maladjusted, gender-nebulous, special snowflakes and autists on rpg.net.

If someone at your table isn't comfortable with something they should tell their ST, and that's it. No need to exclude the "special snowflakes" nor use something like a X-card, though ideally the ST you warn the players that what sort of disturbing thing might show up before the game.

>>54991862
If you need to know specifically what is being X-carded, you can ask.

But you don't need to know why, you just need to know what. You don't have a person who is traumatized by rape and then think 'well, I better check and see if there are different types of rape I can include'.

Just don't do the rape thing, at all. Cut that completely out of the program.

But honestly, the point isn't to completely stop discussion. After the game, see if they want to talk about it. Whatever.

The point is to NOT grind the game to a halt, draw attention to it, cause undue conversation toward the subject, and pull the person into the spotlight for that story.

This is what the X-card is meant to avoid. Using a non-rape example because I'm sure you're tired of it.

'So the plane starts to shake with turbulence'
'Can we not do turbulence? I just can't deal with that.'
'What? Why can't there be turbulence?'
"I just, I had a real bad experience, I don't want to talk about it."
"But it is in the encounter, is it so bad? Can we just hurry past it?"
"I would rather not."
"What the hell could have happened where you care that much about plane turbulence?"
"I said I don't want to talk about it!"
"Fine, whatever, ass. So there is no turbulence. I guess."

So cool, now your 'discussion' to learn why you can't include the problem has made the person focus on the thing they were trying to avoid focusing on, made everyone curious of what their trauma is, and possibly created a rift between you and your player.

All because you are afraid of a little note card with an X on it.

Faggot.

Anyone ever seen any rules for creating devotions?

>>54991965
There is always the possibility of stuff coming up that is unexpected. Like say, someone who doesn't like pitbulls.

I had a teacher once who literally had her face eaten off by a pitbull when she was a kid. She would probably be fine with them being in a game, but if you make it an enemy that is attacking her, that might suck.

But, how many times have you been attacked by a pitbull while playing world of darkness. I've ran a ton of games, I've never even thought of having a pitbull attack someone I've had other dogs, and wolves, of course).

>>54991970
I WANT TO COMMAND HOW YOU RUN THE GAME, X CARD. Hard pass. If anyone brought it up for a game I was playing in, i'd probably not play. It just sounds like a shitty way for shitty players to fuck up the game.

>>54992015
If that was the case, your game was going to suck anyway. The X-card isn't going to make that worse. Why are you playing with sucky players?

>>54991970
This guy has a good point, but he is awfully mad about it.

>>54992038
I'm not, which is why I don't need things like the X card. Any one who would is probably incompetent or dealing with incompetents that aren't likely to be fun to be around anyway.

>>54991970
You really think the x card is going to prevent the other players from wondering what their 'trauma' is? Or how much of a pussy the player is?

Faggot

Don't use the X card. Grow some fucking balls.

>>54992075
*taps the X card*

I'm sorry, but transgenesis is a trigger for me

Boy, I'm certain all these Anons who are against the X Card must be very considerate and decent people who do not act like passive aggressive and arrogant douchebags at all. 100% certain. Everyone must love being around them.

>>54992116
I'm also sure they get to play in lots of games, that never collapse. Because they are so pleasant to play with, and everyone enjoys their company.

>>54992116
Insufferable faggots sure don't like being around me, which seems to be the only examples people have come up with for X card usage.

X Cards are part of the attempt to convert ttrpgs into therapy sessions.

If you have issues, tell the ST before the game. However, if you're oversensitive, do not be surprised if the ST and other players just want to keep the triggering material and continue without you.

If you actually need an X Card, I would suggest that you might reconsider playing a horror RPG. Maybe try that other talking dog game from OPP.

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>X Card whining

The last line is fortunately multi-purpose

What if one player uses an X Card to protest another player who repeatedly uses the X Card?

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>>54992145
>X Cards are part of the attempt to convert ttrpgs into therapy sessions.

>>54992173
Trial by combat

>>54992174

If you posted that on rpg.net, you'd stand a good chance of being banned (probably by MattMc)..

>>54992075
>>54992058

>I'm so terrified that my players will steal ST agency that I need to complain about a rule my group does not use or need, because I know it exists.

That's all these arguments ever seem to boil down to.

>>54992187
>Trial by combat

*X Card*

Physical violence is triggering.

>>54992215
Well do I have the perfect solution for you - trial by wombat

>>54992173
>What if one player uses an X Card to protest another player who repeatedly uses the X Card?

I believe the remaining players need to who on which player belongs to the group that's most oppressed, and they win.

>Privilege always breaks a tie.

>>54992223
That's not even fair. Wombats aren't actually able to die. I've written off cars on the fat little bastards - they just waddle away, looking pissed that someone interrupted their nice nap in the middle of the road.

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>>54992223
>trial by wombat

Sorry, marsupials are also triggering.

>X-Card, not winning or getting my way is triggering

So what is it that makes Obtenebration so ludicrously overpowered v, say, Celerity?

>>54992201
Yeah I agree. And I never see any of the other ttrpg generals complain about it. Only CofD cries like little girls about x card

>>54992284
Sir, we're discussing X Cards right now

Wait a minute. Having empathy for the players is now a bad decision? Why? If someone is using the X Card in a non legitimate way, kick them out. Otherwise, why bitch so much about this?

>>54992265
>X-Card, not winning or getting my way is triggering

And that, fellow Anons, is the reason why we can't have nice things.

>>54992290
Who are you to decide what triggers someone else?

>>54992290
Because some people need to grow some fucking BALLS instead of whining about fucking fantasy.

>>54992289
Then pretend that there are two tumblrites holding up x cards, both identical in every way. Almost every way - one actually is an advocate of Celerity, the other, Obtenebration. Which is the greater faggot, and why?

>>54992300

It doesn't matter what triggers some people. The point is that no group is obligated to adjust to a particular player unless they choose to. Sometime an overly sensitive player needs to go rather than everyone else change.

>>54992265

And there it is. "Well this is a horror game" and "don't be a pussy" is ultimately just cover for "they'll tell me no" or "they're cheating and trying to get one over me"

>>54992290

Because for people like >>54992316, it's actually because someone's telling them "no."

>>54992335
Celerity, because people constantly overwank Flash

>>54992345
So your solution to people suffering is to punish them by booting them from the game?

wow, you're such a great guy

>>54992372
The suffering of others only fuels my strenght

Legit curious about crossover: How can God-Machine and True Fae exist in parallel without having one force weaker than another in comparison? This kind of seems like Immovable Object and Unstoppable Force dilemma to me. That said I would imagine Changeling Demon game have surprisingly working mood with whole "I escaped from inhumane cruel creatively sterile master that lives off of humans and now just want to have a normal life" -angle.

I believe hte Anons in this thread who are discussin the X Card are coming from opposite, unhealthy extremes. "No limits" is just as bad as "treat everything with kiddie gloves". The idea of the X Card is positive on paper, but in practice it allows room for stopping the game over trivial nonsense. It is a poor substitute for real discussion about the players' limits. You either discuss this at length before the game starts as a respectful person would, or don't play. The X Card is a crutch, don't use it if you can walk normally.

>>54992363
Celerity's easier to get, how many games will you even play as a Lasombra?

>>54992263
That's why Trial by Wombat was developed. You place a wombat between the two contestants, and whoever it goes to first is the victor, as they now have its blessing in the argument. However, should someone choose to dispute the verdict, they may challenge the wombat to combat.

>>54992288
The only other game I can think of that includes a mention of them at all is a game that gets maybe 1 thread a month and puts it in the variant rules chapter. So, the reason noone else complains is because noone else has a reason to complain.

That's not to say this discussion isn't dumb on all sides, but there's a reason it's here rather than anywhere else.

>>54992422
Well, the God Machine is supposed to be a half aborted stump that used to run the world pre-Atlantis fuckery. True Fae are sitting pretty outside it, in about 8 different universal timelines, and one or two that aren't universal at all.

Basically, go find someone to give you the finger. That is the True Fae timeline/origin/explanation for anything you need - it always boils down to "Fuck you".

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>>54991761
>>54991970
why is it always rape used as the example? can snowflakes literally not think of anything else?
what kind of game even features actual rape, or any of the ridiculous examples of it used to justify their stupid card?

i've only ever heard of weird rape dungeons and shit in those scant few horrible 'that DM' greentexts, which are usually complete clusterfucks of campaigns and i doubt anybody participating in those would actually care about an x card anyway.
they're not forcing their horrible fetishes on people because they're decent human beings, after all.

second, the example you showed is going to happen whether the x-card is a thing or not.
if something happens in a game and the only indication you get that it's a bad thing is a piddly little piece of cardboard being lifted into the air, then your first thought is likely going to be 'wait what caused that?' because you're not psychic.
so if you can't have even a short discussion about what was so horrible then you're left basically having to throw darts at a scene and see what random feature has to drop from it to make it all okay.
sometimes that feature will be pretty clear, yes, if you're describing the weird furniture shit a tzmisce's done to a bunch of ghouls then you'd have a good idea what's wrong, but what if it's in the middle of combat and the last turn was to your entire knowledge completely normal?
on top of that, what if it's part of a character or even a gameline's SOP - vampires are again a good example, with mind control and their weird intimate, ecstasy-causing bites.
fuck do you do then, just quit the game? rewrite the system? why are they even playing vampire?

ultimately if you can't open up to your DM and say 'hey don't include this stuff please' when playing a game series based on dark things going on in the modern world, you probably shouldn't be playing at all - not until you've gotten over that shit.
play or run something lighter at the very least, for fuck's sakes.

>>54992422
True Fae are only stronger in Arcadia which is a separate dimension that God Machine doesn't deal with

>>54992422
God-Machine seems to mostly operate in the material. True Fae are god-like in the Hedge and Arcadia, which is outside of the material.

Honestly, they would rarely interact with each other, and considering how alien the logic of both parties are, they probably don't even realize the other exists.

On top of that, their 'strength' is relative for both. So stronger and weaker really has no meaning in the discussion. A True Fae is nearly a god in their own space in Arcadia, weaker in the Hedge, and very weak in the fallen world. Meanwhile the GM is less a concentrated strength, and more a system of strange logic computers that just happen to be able to rewire reality.

>>54992422
You're forgetting the Dark Mother and the Principle and the Exarchs, all god-like super creatures with a suspicious interest in our little world.

We do not know how they interact and couldn't comprehend it if we did.

>>54992481
Don't forget Capital F Fate, which is LIKE lower-case fate and arcanum fate, but also absolutely not like it at all..

>>54992372
Them making others suffer for their inadequacies is more victimizing than kicking them out of the game. Almost like Beast was an accurate metaphor.

The Principle was referred to as a God-Machine in one book.

Is it THE God-Machine? Who knows

>>54992422
The various godly beings in the CofD work in ways that prevent them from properly interacting with their peers.

God-Machine is all material
True Fae are on the 'other' side
The Exarchs are the living code of shit

They don't really interfere or touch, but some are evidently more powerful in the long run.

>>54992535
In which book?

Daddy Principle is pretty different from the GM. Though there have been theories that the principle might be what came before, and now its power has faded as the GM has taken over.

Which is why now there are only a few Prometheans created, because it doesn't have enough divine spark. Also why it only keeps a limited number of angels around, and doesn't do big stuff with them except guide Prometheans.

>>54992372

Read again.

First, I play ttrpgs as a casual and relaxing escape. It is not a therapy session.

I've been playing all sorts of rpg's for about 34 years and I cannot even remember a time when someone was so "triggered" by something they made everyone stop, no less without explanation, and demanded material not be included. What the heck is wrong with players today (and also, get off my lawn).

Look, I understand that it might be insensitive to include explicit rape scenes in a game with a rape survivor. However, sometimes such setting elements are appropriate for certain games. When this happens, it's hardly egregious to suggest that the rape survivor is not be included in the group playing the horror game.

Players today far too often expect or demand that others adjust to their neuroses, which sometimes amount to little more than intolerance for anything they don't like. These types of players more often than not ruin things for everyone else. As another Anon indicated, if you have problems, don't play games that have a likelihood of "triggering" those problems. If you have a very specific and rare issues (e.g., the earlier pitbull example), just tell the ST before the game, or if necessary, mention it if it comes up.

However, creating devices like X Cards makes it far too easy to demand others conform to your wishes, and thus encourages such demands, in a vicious cycle.

How many normal people do you believe really want to play with someone who's ready to use X Cards. Raising the topic sadly tells you quite a lot about the prospective player. I have enough crap in real life. I don't need it at my gaming table.

>>54992422
A better comparison would be the God-Machine and the Exarchs.

>>54992554
>The Principle is a quasi-intelligent agency, a God-Machine that maintains universal balance. Without the existence of Prometheans and other supernatural creatures, the Principle would constantly, invisibly tweak reality, tuning it like a complex, near-perpetual machine.

Pandora's Book from nWoD

>>54992541
I still don't understand how the Exarchs are supposed to work.

On one hand they are given like super sorcerer kings.

Then people like DaveB call them the supernal symbols of different oppressive concepts.

Being both seems a tad impossible.

>>54992554
The Principle might be the 'Empyrean', AKA the overseer of raw Supernal truth.

It's just one theory.

>>54992576
The Exarchs are living concepts of oppression and the Arcana they represent.
The Eye represents the concept of 'paranoia', for instance. It IS paranoia, the living expression of it.

They're trippy fuckers.

So what all did I miss important from gen con?

>>54992576
They were the evil bastards who wanted power

They got it, but don't use it as such. they don't actively cast epic spells to make the world shit, by touching the Supernal, they were changed and now merely their existence makes the world shit

>>54992576
The Exarchs were the former wizard kings of Atlantis, supposedly.

They're now the living expressions of everything bad in the world.

>>54992558
>First, I play
Calling bullshit right there. no one plays these games. we all just like to shit post over them

>>54992573
Interesting.

Pandora's Book came out before the God-Machine chronicle I assume? Which makes me wonder if they would use that same language now.

>>54992579
Ah, like it is from a sort of heaven above the supernal realm.

It would make sense in a 'god works in mysterious ways' sort of way.

Like, the Principle always makes small but powerful pushes in one direction or another.

It doesn't have massive groups doing massive stuff. It has individual agents that it gives one specific mission, and the hope seems to be to cause massive consequences with those actions.

'Hey, you go here, and burn down this village'.
But quashmalim (sp) are clearly super strong, and COULD do a lot more if the principle had actual 'plans'. It doesn't seem to have a huge scheme. Just a sort of track it wants to keep the world on.

File: DaveB Exarchs v God Machine.png (43KB, 1554x250px) Image search: [Google]

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>>54992567
>God-Machine and the Exarch

>>54992625
I played a session of CofD mortals once. Guess that makes me the resident expert

>>54992608
Nothing. Just announcements of stuff that won't release for another year or two.

File: DaveB God Machine 3.png (13KB, 863x114px) Image search: [Google]

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>>54992567
>God-Machine and the Exarchs

>>54992640
It's not a 'heaven'(the Supernal isn't a place), it's just the raw unfiltered Supernal.

>>54992647
>I played a session of CofD mortals once.

Were you vivisected by a Mystagogue?

All the cool humans are vivisected,

>>54992668
So we're just using Empyrean incorrectly then. I mean, I'm not surprised since it is Mage stuff and they just love to throw words around if they sound good.

>>54992672
No, we got into a shootout with drug dealers and my Unseen Sense triggered, meaning thar be ghosts. And that was as far as we got because the ST got bored and we played Pendragon the next week instead

>>54992680
>So we're just using Empyrean incorrectly then

I'm not sure what you're getting at

>>54992641
>>54992661
This really makes the Exarchs less intimidating than they usually sound.

They became concepts. They are barely active agents then. Outside of whispering in the ear of Seers.

>>54992688
The word Empyrean means:
belonging to or coming from heaven
or
the highest parts of heaven

Because of that I thought it was supposed to be the name for some sort of beyond supernal thing that feeds the supernal juice down to the supernal, so it can then reach the material.

You know, trickle down supernatural economics.

>>54992700
Well all the hyper-cosmic powers have to act through intermediaries, primarily intangible entities or part human monsters.

Maybe they're in a state of cold war, maybe there's some property of our world that literally prevents the exarchs from acting directly on it?

>>54992700
>less intimidating
Define 'intimidating' for me

Fighting living concepts is fruitless. You're fighting against something you can't win. This isn't intimidation more so than hopelessness.

The ancient Atlantean bastard sorcerers won. That's kind of the point.

>>54992725
The Empyrean is the proposed highest layer of the Supernal. That's al it isl. The word itself is just a title.

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>>54992452
>sees a tl;dr post in a game I'm only tangentially aware of/interested in
>confused by the subject being talked
>look it up
>mfw

I had heard exalted was one of the worst games for attracting special snowflakes....and boy howdy, this doesn't help any. I mean I've certainly been in games, where something like this could have been useful, sure....like the GM trying to RP a hooker in his uncomfortable voice, but you can just, ya know, talk about that in your game of pretend played by talking...

This being pushed as a NEEDED thing? Woof....maybe the people or system just need to be avoided.

>>54992700
>This really makes the Exarchs less intimidating than they usually sound.

Let your pc say that after they've met an Ochemata of an Exarch.

Those fuckers are terrifying even by Mage standards.

>Mage has way too many special capitalized proper nouns

>>54992725
>trickle down supernatural economics

>The Chancellor approves this message.

>>54992668
>the Supernal isn't a place

If the supernal is not a place, where do mages summons supernal entities from, and where do they go afterward?

Also, where do mages travel to in order to sign their name on their Watchtower?

>>54992815
>where do mages summons supernal entities from
Supernal symbols given form

>where do mages travel to in order to sign their name on their Watchtower?
They interpret the Supernal in various ways

>>54991379
It does a better job of presenting it I think. I mean, the past what 1000+ years the solars have spent doing nothing but getting their shit wrecked by groups of DB's. That sends a pretty strong message of 'no you don't just get to win at everything because of your giant glowing dick'
>>54991449
There was a line right in first edition saying that solars were the mightiest of the exalts my lad, on top of you know, the whole solar charmset being better than the others. I don't know where you're getting the idea that it was some second edition invention.

>>54992608
The only important things that come to mind are that mummy second edition is confirmed happening and crossover chronicle got renamed contagion chronicle.

>>54992815
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ItWasWithYouAllAlong

There are a lot of nameless Orders that say the lost island myth is crap. Should stand to reason lots of mages think the supernal is more an idea than a place.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFYLO-wcKkw
Where were you when they decided that heaven wasn't really a place and you couldn't really get there?

>>54992608
Copied and pasted from several posts and only about CofD
New books announced at GenCon:

>Requiem alt-setting where the Masquerade is down (didn't catch the title)
>Werewolf the Forsaken - Night Horrors: Shunned by the Moon
>Mage the Awakening - Fallen Worlds
>Promethean the Created - Night Horrors : The Tormented
>Changeling the Lost - Kith and Kin
>Changeling 2e KS probably in October
>Hunter the Vigil - Fiction Anthology and Eternal Flame
>Geist the Sin-Eaters - might get a KS in 2018 if Changeling KS does well
>Mummy: The Curse - focusing on smoothing out the game's rough edges for 2e, lead dev unknown at this time
>Demon: The Descent - Night Horrors: Cryptids
>Deviant has a 40 page writer's bible, the most elaborate writer's bible ever written

>OPP will now always have a text written BEFORE doing a KS, learning from Dark Eras 2.

>Matthew Dawkins is developing The Contagion Chronicle, formerly The Crossover Chronicle
>heavily influenced by Crisis on Infinite Earths, He-Man Christmas Special
>Contagion is a breakdown of the CofD universe
>Corrupts Infrastructure, creates strange monsters
>Infects splats, Contagion mutated templates are a thing
>Interstitial Territory from Horror Recognition Guide is seeping through due to the Contagion
>Not a default crossover setting

To recap all the CofD Gen Con news:

>Mummy and Innocents are getting 2e updates
>Vampire is getting a book about lost clans, weird bloodlines, and non-Kindred vamps, and another one about what happens when the Masquerade is broken that's meany to be a full chronicle
>Werewolf is getting a Night Horrors books about Ghost Wolves, Bale Hounds, and The Pure
>Mage is getting a book called Fallen Worlds about the Shadow, Underworld, and Lower Depths
>Changeling is getting a book about new Kiths and building your own
>Demon is getting a Night Horrors book about Cryptids
>Dark Shards is going to be a thing, like Dark Eras but for alternate settings -"vampires in space" got mentioned a lot

>>54992891

Anything about 20th or V5?

>>54992868
>>54992891

The Contagion Chronicle doesn't fill me with optimism as a guide to crossover.

Is Matthew Dawkins more MattMc or DaveB, and can he be trusted as a developer for such a potentially problematic series of books?

>>54992995
I'm sure there is, I've seen people posting about W5 as well, but I have none of that information. Other than that there is a new playtest pdf somewhere for v5

>>54992838
>where do mages travel to in order to sign their name on their Watchtower?
>They interpret the Supernal in various ways

That's not much of an answer.

>>54993033
>Crossover Chronicle
The devs probably took one look at this place and said "we shouldn't fucking do this"

Can you imagine the backlash?

>>54993033
I can write you a one-word crossover guide right now: don't. Every splat plays better with itself than others.

>>54993033
Eh, its a 'single' story arc, aligning the various splats goals toward a single end, there isn't really a whole lot that will be addressed for general cross over so it will probably just be like any other SAS with a bit more text to it.

>>54993048
They don't travel anywhere. They have a mystery play or astral awakening, neither of which really involves leaving the fallen world. Just getting a magical signal across while you are delusional.

The Supernal is in my pants.

If you reach in my pocket, you can find enlightenment.

>That Guy in the Consilium

>Sad Swole Jawa because he has no pants

>>54993048
You really need to read the 2e core, Anon. All your answers are in there. There's two types of Awakenings.

>>54993095

I thought a mage's soul travels to the Supernal or he travels to the Supernal through his soul. Either way, there's still some sort of destination. Also, mages can summon actual entities from somewhere.

>>54993147
You can 'go' to the Supernal. In a certain sense of the word. Interpretation and all. But it's not actually a destination physically speaking.

Archmages can go there, but they have to form a Lustrum to process everything. It's still not a 'place', though.

>>54993175

So, the supernal is a place that's not really a place. You can travel there, but it's not really a destination.

>I hate DaveB

>>54993225