>We don't want girls in our D&D group So I heard

>>54725879
Because they are otherwise problematic, generally.

A blanket ban is usually the result of a chain of shitty experiences, and generalizing those experiences to the rest of women in terms of their capacity for tabletop things.

Which isn't to say that the other gender isn't capable of incredibly foul things, either. But you can get some pretty goddamn obnoxious harpies.

>>54725879
>We don't want girls in our D&D group
I have heard that more from groups with a single Nerd Queen Bee than any other, and the Queen Bee allows no competition. Either that or they have had run ins with them before.

>>54725879
>according to my more-then-a-decade gaming experience
Possibly they've had a different set of experiences, and have decided that the initial awkwardness of simply omitting women from the start is preferable to any potential headaches caused by introducing them into the mix. Or it could just be because the guy running the games knows his players are thirsty-ass motherfuckers who will act like retards in mixed company.

RPG groups can be pretty niche and fragile, so there's all sorts of reasons why people'd limit who they accept.

>>54725921
>>54725964
>>54726020
OP here.

Interesting. I had TREMENDOUS problems, but always with male, immature egos that would erupt in fierce conflicts over rules and doing stupid shit like griefing other players.

>>54726042
I've seen "No women allowed" being the player's democratically enforced decision because they're tired of the GM's girlfriend hogging the spotlight, but they don't have the gumption to tell the GM off to his face. Or they think he's too fragile/the group dynamics are too fragile to handle it.

I've seen aforementioned queen bee scenarios, with groups kept in line through fuck fuck games.

I've seen more traditional destructive behavior - deliberately antagonism, passive aggressiveness, rules laywering, tantrums, all of that.

Certainly, not all women are shit players. But that doesn't mean shit players who are women aren't out there.

>>54725879
Because the guys will fawn over the girl and compete for her attention, and quickly develop into stalking. Then you'll be left short a player when she gets creeped out and leaves.
Then you ban women instead of kicking out the creepers.

>>54726141
To be fair if you kicked out the creepers you'd have half a group

>>54726099
It my experience girls tend to spend too much time RP on the mundane shit, that it eat into doing shit

>>54726042
Serious question, OP: are you gay or a serial beta orbiter or something? I can understand someone disagreeing with the NO G1RLS ALLOWED mindset, but I find it strange that a normal dude would be completely unable to comprehend it.

>>54726180
OP here.

I see that as a bonus.

>>54726188

I've played in maybe 10 groups in 10 years and in 1/3 there were girls. In practically all cases they did not dominate the game and were interested in stuff male players (Let's kill another orc Boss) were not. In one case, thing developed in a relationship, which was cool.
On the other hand, as I said - I'd rather DM for 4 girls then a group with autistic neckbeards that participate in constant pissing contests. But I can understand in the end its just about people, not their sex.

>>54726188
He's probably a normal, well adjust adult who plays with normal well adjusted adults. Which is an incredibly small subset of our community.

>>54726228
Given you ignored the (admittedly loaded) question and just reverted to restating your position in slightly different words, I'll take that as a yes.

>>54726246
And he can't even begin to understand a common social phenomenon? Unconvinced.

>>54726281
>a common social phenomenon?
Normies don't think about these things in their hobbies.

>>54726281
OP here.

You know what? I do understand this. But with experience over the years I came to realise I sometimes think I understand something, but I miss certain parts of it. Thatswhy I sometimes like to check the "obvious answers" here too.

It's more likely that females are at a game for non-gaming reasons, the most common/obvious reason being a players gf/wife. Since most people have more experience with male players, boyfriends/husbands are less likely.
Similarly, people of both genders have a tendency to be attracted to groups of the opposite sex, being the uncontested specimen. Since most /tg/ consumers are male, that, again, means you have a chance of females who only want male attention.

>>54726228
Well it is bad when you spend 2.5 hours on shopping and attempt to sing at s taven

>>54726311
I couldn't find the clip I was looking for, but I found this which is enough to prove it exists:

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100606205027AARmTse

This isn't /tg/-related, but it's the same underlying phenomenon: men sometimes feel they can relax more when women aren't present. And my point in linking this? It's mainstream enough that the Simpsons made a joke explicitly about it. So while normies may not consciously think about it, I don't accept that the phenomenon is restricted to misongynerds.

>>54726315
It's good that you have enough self-awareness to acknowledge this. I won't go into my opinions on the "obvious answers" because that would be far too long and autistic a diatribe for an internet forum about Mongolian flip-books. Suffice to say, hopefully you can understand that women might social spaces away from men, whether that be knitting clubs, literal mothers' meetings, or just gossiping. If so, I hope you can reverse the sexes to realise that men might also sometimes want social spaces away from women, even if you don't yet understand the reasons why.

>>54726495
OP here.

Interesting. I never saw D&D as specifically male social space. But thanks for answer.

I've played with one girl ever. She was alright but boy did she do a lot of raping.

>>54726164
You only have half creepers? Thats a lucky group!

>>54725879
We had a no girls rule. But more because it was guys night. Get away from our wife's and girl friends and just hangout with the lads. The tone would be different if ladies where there.
My current group is two girls and a femme boy (not gay or trans or trap. Just really femme) and me as the gm.

>>54726351
>"Females"
That's a great word for spotting r9k crossboarders who should get the fuck back to their cancerous hive.

>>54726877
>femme boy (not gay or trans or trap. Just really femme)
wat
You know femme means woman, right.

>>54725879
Wait a girl said this?

Like she wants no OTHER girls? Do the math here Pedro. She's an attention whore.

>>54725879
Some people have had bad experiences that they refuse to put down, or just have that "no girls allowed" attitude, either towards their game, the hobby as a whole, or just their entire life. Some women have bad habits at the table, but men have just as many, because it's a human thing rather than a gender thing.

A lot of people still have the idea that tabletop games are a boy's hobby and only for boys. Same goes for video games, actually, and that's probably a driving factor here. Is it dumb? Yes, very. Am I disappointed? Yes. But am I surprised? Not even slightly.

>>54726351
>means you have a chance of females who only want male attention.
This is a common male gaze missconception.
The truth is females want the attention of all genders. It's hard-coded socially that if you've got a vagina capable of producing children but you're not praised and loved by everyone, there's something wrong with you. Us guys don't have to put up with that shit and it makes sense we wouldn't want an element like that introduced in our gaming groups.
Women with masculine social standards are perfectly welcome.

>>54726915
I think OP is saying they heard from a friend, that was a woman, that she was told she couldn't join because the game was boys only.

>>54726533
D&D was spawned from wargaming. Wargaming was spawned from, well, actual war. In most places for most of the past few thousand years of Western culture, war was pretty much a male-only space.

Of course, D&D also owes much of its existance to horror and fantasy fiction, which has always had significant female fans and writers (although they were sometimes separated or marginalized).

So, from the start there's always been a lot of "no girls allowed" attitude in D&D, which was heavily influenced by the wargaming vs storytelling divide. Boys play D&D, girls play Murder Mystery Party.

D&D was also somewhat influenced by video gaming culture in 80s-90s, which was very heavily marketed towards boys and young men. This was, of course, a small part of a larger trend in toy/hobby marketing, where marketing became extremely gendered, toy stores were rigidly divided in blue/pink sections, etc. (To go back even further: In the early 80s, Reagan deregulated child advertising, and by the mid-80s advertisers had gone balls-deep with child-focused ad campaigns.)

By the time we get to the 90s, D&D is still mostly seen as a "boys club", but it's slowly improving. Some other scenes (Vampire, various LARPs, online RP) are more inclusive. But it's not until the 2000s that we really see significant change. But there's still quite a lot of lingering influence and grumpy grognards who are still around.

>>54726951
OP here.

Exactly. Not a native speaker, if this excuse has any value.

>>54727004
Oh, and this is all obviously from an American view, since the US is the origin and still the focal point for D&D. From what I've heard, mainland European RPG history is somewhat less male-focused, and somewhat less D&D-focused.

>>54725879
The mindset of girls being a problem in games stems slightly from the fact we're a niche hobby. Less niche now, but still far from mainstream stuff like video games are now. Part of the idea comes from the fact that back in the day, you just didn't see a lot of girls participating because it was a very niche hobby with a much smaller community, the majority of which were men, and so when a girl -did- show up to a game two things happened.

1.) You tend to pay more attention to what they do, because they're uncommon.
2.) Problems that occurred stuck in people's minds better. People do shitty stuff all the time, but when the person doing it is a rare sight in that hobby, stories spread and that gives the impression that they're all a problem.

Now of course, you've got the girls who were just there to play and made no trouble. But since at the time nerdy hobbies like tabletop were thought of as a dorky guy thing, girls who were there to actually participate were uncommon. While girls who couldn't find acceptance in more mainstream circles drifted towards the community in search of attention and acceptance, and girls who were dating players came along as well because they either wanted to understand their boyfriend's interests more, or they wanted to pretend they were also interested to try and force a closer bond with them. Sometimes, those girls also took a legitimate interest in the hobby. Other times, they just didn't care, and either brought the mood down by being there when they didn't want to, or they forced themselves to participate to keep the illusion up and end up dragging things down further.

(Cont)

>>54725879
She drank the memeaide on women at the table. Playing with a bunch of weird NEET's who can't stand womz probably rubbed off eventually.

>>54727029
>and somewhat less D&D-focused
that's an understatement.

semi understandable

my old WoW guild used to have the same rule:
no girls, only 18+, we did have 3 girls at some point but one was the GF of the GM - the other 2 were said to be very mature 15 year old boys

why'd we ban girls?
we had a huge drama involving 3 guys fawning over our first female member - she didn't want any of the attention, the 3 guys got into huge fights and we ended kicking all 3 - the girl left shortly after because some people blamed her for it

if the girl don't cause drama, the guys around her do

>>54727038
As for the girls seeking attention, because the hobby's original community (and to a somewhat lesser extent it's current community) weren't exactly the type that tended to be good with girls, some would try to impress them. This led to a nasty loop of the girls (who have no interest in the hobby, just attention) dragging things down as they treat the game as their way to sort of affirm themselves. Being rejected by mainstream circles feels less painful when you have dorks that fawn over you. This of course would bother the ones who have no interest in that bullshit and just want to play, causing trouble.

Word of mouth spreads. People talk about their shitty experiences more than their good experiences because the former makes for more interesting/shocking conversation. Because of the cultural factors that make women in the hobby uncommon, and women with a real interest in the hobby even less common, this leads to a perfect mix of external factors to form a common stereotype of girls being bad for games. This isn't done on purpose, it's just a natural defense we build up to defend our interests; If you'd heard several stories about people getting food poisoning at a certain restraunt chain, chances are you're going to give the one on your block a pass, even if you've never eaten there before and they might be one of the locations that actually bothers to handle their food properly. Someone might even tell you that's the case, but you'll still be skeptical. That's basically the case here.

2/3 cause I'm a wordy ass motherfucker and character limit sucks dick.

>>54727050
The hobby starts to expand a bit, more girls start coming in (although they're still the minority), and now you have a larger pool of people who now have to deal with that stereotype developed from when the community was smaller. And in some cases that's a deserved reputation; There's plenty of shitters out there that happen to also have boobs. There's also plenty of okay girls out there that just want to play like any other member of the community, and they still get a skeptical look by some.

And that's about the gist of it OP. Though there's some other details, like how SJW bullshit is bringing undesirables to the hobby too while others (including trolls) use that as a sign to just close the gates and rant about women being incapable of enjoying the hobby the way men do, but this post's long enough already and no one wants to read all that shit

because if players are 13-17 year old (sometimes it's also true for older players) they are immature and they will spend more time romancing another player of the opposite sex than trying to play the game seriously, in fact they will often unconsciously sacrifice the game well-being for "romancing".

the D&D session becomes a total shitshow and can destroy the group, the campaign and friendships in at least 10 different ways.

It's not the girls's fault anymore than the boys's fault:
they are both better with an all-girl and all-boys groups with an hard ban for the opposite sex to join.


while there are theorically sitautions where allowing someone of the opposite sex could be viable, it's just not worth the risk and the trouble of defining exactly what the exception should be.

All of that is better abandoned as everyone grows up and gains, hopefully, more maturity.

>>54727049
>we did have 3 girls at some point but one was the GF of the GM - the other 2 were said to be very mature 15 year old boys
Lol wut?

>>54725879
Some nerds aren't comfortable around girls. And it does change the dynamic, just like if I wanted to join in on a book club with a bunch of soccer moms. Grow a pair and quit whining about every god damn thing fuck

Underage/autism/both basically

I think there should always be some debate about who can join the game and who can't. When someone wants to join me and the DM always discuss if that would work or not. Problem is: when a dude wants to bring a girl into a game that he fancies this debate is mostly skipped, atleast by the guy who fancies the girl.

>>54726533
>I never saw D&D as specifically male social space.
D&D as a whole is not. But a specific group of male players can decide to make their group a male social space. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that, despite what the tumblrs of the world might tell you. Some women need women-only social spaces, likewise some men need men-only social spaces, that's just natural.

>>54726877 is a good example.

>>54726578
Wait... do you mean the girl or her character?

>>54726941
>The truth is females want the attention of all genders.
Kudos to you for not falling for the "women never do it for male attention, they only do it for themselves and other women" bullshit. Women do it for both male attention, and the attention of their female peers, which are two different kinds of attention. And kudos to you for acknowledging that not all women behave like that, too.

Btw, this has nothing to do with "male gaze". Please don't fall into the usual Tumblr trap of throwing around feminist terms without concern for their actual meaning.

>>54726246
I am this to an extent, I mean our group can be quite mature and has always been just under 50% female.

And yes, I too cannot understand a blanket band on such a large group of the population. It reeks of a blinkered outlook, a childish kind of broad exclusion based on one or two bad experiences.

>>54725879
Here's an example OP:
>Woman: Sorry, we want this group to be a female-only space
>OP: Why??? Men can be as fun as women!!! They can bring somehting new to the table!!!

OP, you are That Guy.

>>54725921
Here's the archetypes of female players

The Girlfriend
Mostly disinterested in the game itself. Impatient, fails at rp, and distracts person she came with most of the time.

The Harpy
In some cases weird and creepy. In many cases homosexual. Political academic papers and drawn conclusions thereof inform every choice on how to interact with someone, whether outside of the game, or ingame

The Dryad
Character/class choices in some cases similar to the girlfriend. Heavy focus on attracting attention. Either play campy protagonists, bards, other characters with ability to seduce, and often go into great detail to deliberately make as strange and unique a character they can to play - usually by dedicating their choice of race to that.

The Unicorn
A fun person to play with, actually reads the source material, will do well in the game and sometimes even come up with good ideas.


The names of the archetypes should give an indication on why there's groups that don't allow girls.

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>>54727632

>Women just want to spend a fun evening with the girls
It's a-okay, nothing to see here, move along

>Men just want to spend a fun evening with the boys
Why don't you accept women? Do you have anything against women huh bucko? You're probably immature autists, or rapey creeps. Don't you realize that women can bring new experiences to the table? It's so sad that this is still a thing in 2017...

>>54727815
Literally never heard of a girl-only RPG group. Also
>Men just want to spend a fun evening with the boys
No, "men" just want to cry about how shitty and "attention-seeking" women are at their precious boy-only games and exclude them. See >>54727739

>>54727887
>Literally never heard of a girl-only RPG group.
Women prefer other activities for their girl-only time. Don't tell me you haven't heard of "girls' nights out"

>No, "men" just want to cry about how shitty and "attention-seeking" women are at their precious boy-only games and exclude them.
Nice try generalizing all men. Probably comes from the same place as with those crying men, a shitty past experience that leads one to generalize a whole gender. But whatever, I'm not your shrink.

See >>54727627 and >>54726877 for examples of guys just wanting to spend time with the boys.

>>54727887
>implying women don't share similar horror stories about annoying men, just not D&D-related

>>54727887
You're a retard. He didn't mean girl only RPG groups but the actual shit girls do to get away from men. My gf for example invites her friends over to drink, listen to shitty music and stuff their faces with potato chips. Once in a while there is one male but he's gay and they all love to encourage him to twerk to Nikki Minaj music.

What I'm getting at is, it's not weird to sometimes exlude the opposite gender from your games. Especially if it's your gf or wife. People need space.

>>54727887
>No, "men" just want to cry about how shitty and "attention-seeking" women are at their precious boy-only games and exclude them.
Ask women why they don't let men join their "girl times", you'll probably hear something similar to this: they don't want drama, group dynamics are different, they can talk about stuff they can't with men being there, men can be annoying, etc etc.

>>54727962
Yes, and there's boy's nights as well. Those are generally one-off nights where normies can cut loose and get all sexist or whatever without their girlfriends/boyfriends judging them. Completely different to a long-term RPG campaign, which again I have never heard of a women's-only RPG group.

>Nice try generalizing all men
Wrong, I'm talking about the "men" who want male-only groups. Hence the quotation marks.

>>54727995
Yeah sure, and that's probably just as generalising and sexist. Also if it's not RPG-related why are you bringing that up in this thread?

>>54728000
It's not too weird if it's a one-off kinda thing as I stated above, an uncommon occurrence. It gets weird when you exclude a whole gender from your weekly RPG where the gender of a player doesn't fucking matter, only the attitude of the player and how they fit in the group as an individual.

>>54728033
Fucking last time, stop bring up this shitty strawman excuse. If it's not RPGs shut the fuck up in this discussion about RPGs. This shit is like food analogies.

>>54725879
Groups usually only have blanket bans on things that have a near-constant pattern (it has happened 7+ times) and would just rather the norm then take the chance.

One of my groups has a complete blanket ban on Humans and Half-races for D&D/Pathfinder because every time someone played a human or half-human, the game got ruined somehow. It happened so many times they considered those races cursed.

>>54726533
>I never saw D&D as specifically male social space.

Yeah I can so easily recount the droves of girls who flocked to our highschool basement to play D&D back in the 80s.
Oh wait.

>>54728046

>Those are generally one-off nights where normies can cut loose and get all sexist
>get all sexist
So you've basically outed yourself as either a male beta orbiter SJW or a woman.

Not a big suprise, but still.

>>54727887
>Literally never heard of a girl-only RPG group.
Women usually do other stuff at their girl-only gatherings. It doesn't matter much to the point anon is making though. Both genders like to spend some time with their peers of the same gender. But for some people, it's only a problem when men do it, for some reason.

>>54728095
>buzzwords buzzwords buzzwords

Such a great argument.

>>54728100
You did not read what I said properly at all.

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>>54728046
>stop using a generalization to contrast my own sweeping generalization

>It's not too weird if it's a one-off kinda thing as I stated above, an uncommon occurrence. It gets weird when you exclude a whole gender from your weekly RPG where the gender of a player doesn't fucking matter, only the attitude of the player and how they fit in the group as an individual.

Look, in my opinion this whole no girls allowed thing is meant to count for girlfriends and wives. Maybe you've never been in a long term relationship but it's common that people like to get away from the significant other from time to time. Also the others players can find it annoying if one of their bro's is with his GF because a bro can be pretty different when hi s gf is around.

>>54728126
What's my sweeping generalisation then?

>>54728134
>Maybe you've never been in a long term relationship
Good assumption m8, but no I was in a relationship for almost 3 years with a person who I played RPGs with before we dated, played RPGs all throughout our dating, and are still playing RPGs together as friends.

Also now that this whole gf/wife argument is cropping up I want to say that a ban on a gf/wife is an individual thing and different to a blanket ban on females.

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>>54728122
m80, you just claimed that guys want a male space because it gives them them the freedom to be sexist.

What, exactly, did you expect?

>>54728122

We read what you said, you decide to not read or understand what we're telling you. Your only retort is; 'stop using fitting analogies'

D&D is typically a male dominated hobby. Many guys do it as a 'guy's night', which is the equivalent of a 'girls night'. They don't want boys there, because they know it will affect the dynamic. The same applies to a D&D session. They are both social events.

Also, you're clearly biased as already mentioned by the other anon. Just saying 'buzzwords' does not make it less true. You imply that a 'boy's night out' will include sexism, like it's a standard thing. What the fuck of retarded generalisation is that?

I'm betting you're a female pretending to be a guy and are butthurt you cannot join a campaign. With the retarded statements and generalisations you made ITT, I can clearly see why they won't let you join.

Is it really that you don't understand their reasoning OP? Or that you don't agree with it? Because it looks more like you want us to prove the action is the right thing than actually explaining why some people do that. But since you are not actually arguing with the people whose actions you disagree with its pointless.

>>54728164
Yes? I've made it clear that I don't have a problem with gender-specific spaces in general.

I have a problem with it when it's an RPG, again something where gender should not matter.

>>54726188
Not him but I don't understand it at all. Seems stupid to say all women are shit roleplayers. I know it's the trendy thing to do here but it's just silly. Look at any of our 6 million "That Guy" threads and you'll see plenty of examples of bad and disruptive male players.
Everyone should be treated on a case-by-case basis. Just because my problem players have all been anime fans doesn't mean I should ban all anime fans.

>>54728046
>Those are generally one-off nights where normies can cut loose and get all sexist or whatever without their girlfriends/boyfriends judging them.
>get all sexist or whatever without their girlfriends/boyfriends judging them
You either have never been to a guy's night out or you got some shitty male friends.

>Completely different to a long-term RPG campaign
How is that "completely different"? A guy's night out is not a thing that happens once a year, those can be pretty regular. If those are regular, guys who are into D&D can play D&D there. I'm not sure how you don't get this.

>again I have never heard of a women's-only RPG group.
And again, as several people already explained to you, women usually prefer to do other activities at their girl's nights.

>Fucking last time, stop bring up this shitty strawman excuse. If it's not RPGs shut the fuck up in this discussion about RPGs.
Not my comment you're replying to, but couldn't help myself. We're talking about the reason people use to exclude people of the other gender from their gender-only nights times. It doesn't matter whether they play RPGs or twerk to Nikki Minaj, the reasons it has to be the same gender are usually pretty similar: people just want some space. And btw, that's not what a "strawman" means.

>>54728200
Oh but gender should matter when people are getting drunk, shopping or having night watching sports on the TV?
Why should it not matter for RPGs and matter for other activities?

>Good assumption m8

I said "maybe" which isn't a weird assumption on a board about traditional games on an anime focused website.

Also, not every has a cute nerdy tg loving gf. As I said, mine likes shitty pop music, netflix and cute animals.


>>54728163

>>54728100
In our gaming club there have been two during the ten years i've been a member.
The exist, but they're the gaming group equivalent of finding a unopened 1st edition M.tG booster pack, e.g. the rarest of Unicorns

check out missclicks if you want to see a all-girl gaming group in action
https://www.youtube.com/user/misscliks

>>54728046
>Yes, and there's boy's nights as well. Those are generally one-off nights where normies can cut loose and get all sexist or whatever without their girlfriends/boyfriends judging them.


So you already had an explanation before you decided to make this thread. Why the dishonesty?


And its not like a women's night out can't devolve into outright misandry about how all men are dogs and stuff. Why only care when men do it?

>>54728219
Not allowing girls is not the same as saying all girls are bad roleplayers.

>>54728200
>I don't have a problem with gender-specific spaces in general.
>HOWEVER
so you do have a problem with it, only not when it's something you don't care about?
D&D and going out are both social events. You can't pretend that it's logical for one social event to be gender-specific, but for the other it isn't.

>I have a problem with it when it's an RPG, again something where gender should not matter.
But it does matter. It's a social event more than it is an RPG. That's how D&D has always been. That's why people will tell you the main goal of D&D is to have fun, not to 'win'.

Also, you completely ignored what he was saying in the first place. You're making a swooping assumption that males are generally sexist when they can be. That's pretty demeaning, you stupid fuck.

>>54728163
>Good assumption m8, but no I was in a relationship for almost 3 years with a person who I played RPGs with before we dated, played RPGs all throughout our dating, and are still playing RPGs together as friends.
So now you're telling other couples how to couple. Marvelous. You and your SO liked playing RPGs with each other? Great. Some other person gives their SO some space to play RPGs on their own? Also great. Stop being such a judgemental prick, anon.

>>54727004
>le grognard bogeyman

>>54728221
>you got some shitty male friends
Ie. "You're having badwrongfun". No I'm Australian and I guess I do tend to forget how other cultures don't like to talk as much shit as we do.

Also I feel like beer and chips D&D is different to a more serious campaign, which is what I'm really talking about here. I do concede that yeah, boy's nights involving D&D are a thing sure, but I feel like those groups are already tight-knit and enclosed, and not the groups advertising for players with a "no girls" clause.

And no, I'm specifically talking about RPGs here. Again again, I understand the need for gender-specific spaces, I just don't understand making a serious RPG campaign gender-specific.

>>54728200
>I've made it clear that I don't have a problem with gender-specific spaces in general.
>I have a problem with it when it's an RPG
RPGs are just one of many possible activities that people can do together. Ask yourself, why do you consider it OK when people watch a movie in a gender-specific company, but not when people play an RPG in a gender-specific company?

>again something where gender should not matter.
Let me tell you a secret anon. Most activities people do at their girls' nights and boys' nights, are activities where gender doesn't matter. Like drinking alcohol, listening to music, eating food stuff, playing video games, watching movies, etc etc.

>>54727004
>RPG's were always this cool male space where women were not allowed.

Yeah no. Its only recently that rpgs and video games are seen as something other than no life geeks, nerds, and one step away from being satanist freaks do.

>>54728298

>I just don't understand making a serious RPG campaign gender-specific.
Because they don't want girls there.
All the reason you need.

>>54726399
I find it bizarre and for a board that spends so much time ranting about "safespaces" to be advocating for doing exactly that.
If you literally cannot relax if a woman is present, that's on you. Better yet, use this as an opportunity for some exposure therapy. It's stupid to ban a player not because of anything they did, but solely because of gender.

>>54728298
>Again again, I understand the need for gender-specific spaces, I just don't understand making a serious RPG campaign gender-specific.
Seems like you're the only going all "badwrongfun" here.

>>54728250
Not the OP.

>>54728255
>That's pretty demeaning, you stupid fuck
Holy kek.

>>54728264
>So now you're telling other couples how to couple
No? I literally just stated my own experience. Also, giving a SO space is again an individual case and not a gender-wide ban.

>>54728311
People watching a movie is a one-off activity and you're not stopping anyone coming to see the same movie and just sit in a different spot. Excluding a whole gender from your RPG is exactly that, exclusion from your game based on a shallow feature of that person, and you're potentially missing out on a good player all because of a blanket ban.

>>54728328
Not really, I just don't understand it, and I'm just trying to explain why I don't understand it.

>>54728374
>Not really, I just don't understand it, and I'm just trying to explain why I don't understand it.
Then you're literally the dumbest cunt alive, because there are tons of reasons why people would blanket ban based on gender in this very thread that you keep ignoring.

>>54727004
>D&D was spawned from wargaming.

Alongside creative storytelling. It's a hybrid and a departure from both, and considering that D&D is the roleplaying game that spawned all the rest, you might as well try to say all roleplaying games spawned from wargaming.

It's been decades since it's left it's wargaming roots.

>>54728398
And I have yet to be given one reason I understand, as my arguments should show.

>>54728326
>I find it bizarre and for a board that spends so much time ranting about "safespaces" to be advocating for doing exactly that.
We're not /pol/, you're on the wrong board anon

>If you literally cannot relax if a woman is present, that's on you. Better yet, use this as an opportunity for some exposure therapy.
Go to a soccer mom book club and tell them that. Don't worry, I'll arrange your funeral

>>54728374
>People watching a movie is a one-off activity and you're not stopping anyone coming to see the same movie and just sit in a different spot.
They could, you know, watch different movies every time. Or maybe they watch the new episode of a series together when it airs.

>>54728374
>People watching a movie is a one-off activity and you're not stopping anyone coming to see the same movie and just sit in a different spot.
Do you have a reading problem? I was specifically talking about different activities people do on their girls' and boys' nights. Go ask a girl why they're "excluding a whole gender based on a shallow feature" from their girls' nights, will ya?

>>54728417
No, you're being given reasons you disagree with. If you actually cannot understand then, that guy is right. You are the dumbest cunt alive.

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>>54725879
I think most peoples bad experiences come from a players girlfriend not caring about the game, but only attending to be with their boyfriend.

Just personal experience, ive not had a single positive experience with female players, the two ive had play in my group were disinterested and never read rules or even remember any of them no matter how many times I explain them.

Not bad people, I just assume they are there for the wrong reasons.

I dont have a ban either, I just warn players about the possible problem.

>>54728436
Okay? It's still a bad analogy, and I hate analogies in general.

>>54728450
Okay, give me a quick recap of the reasons you believe in.

>>54728374
>I just don't understand it, and I'm just trying to explain why I don't understand it.
People already told you a million times.

It's one of the following:
>A group had bad problems with female players, and they don't want to risk the existing group's dynamics, so they issue a sweeping ban
>Guys just want to have a night out with the boys

What else do you want?

>>54728454
>I think most peoples bad experiences come from a players girlfriend not caring about the game, but only attending to be with their boyfriend.
Pretty much this. Only girls who bother trying to join are just there to hang out with their boyfriends. They've always wound up just being distractions for otherwise established party members with little-to-no interest in anything actually happening on the board.

Don't have a ban on women, but girlfriends in a game are something I am absolutely wary of.

>>54728462
Holy shit man. Not any of the ones you replied to but you need to take your fingers out of your ears and learn to listen to counter-points. There are plenty of legit reasons covered in this thread. Why are you purposely ignoring them?

>>54726892
What the fuck are you on about you autistic spergburger

>>54728473
>A group had bad problems with female players
Try to understand what you didn't like about those people as individuals, and try to more closely review new players then?

>Guys just want to have a night out with the boys
This is the only one I can understand, although again I feel that beer & chips D&D is different to the more involved campaigns I'm referring to where I feel a player's gender does not matter.

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>>54728473
I'm like 75% sure this guy is baiting.

I certainly hope he's baiting. Otherwise he might be too dumb to live.

>>54725879
Because D&D is a patriarchal construct that reinforces toxic masculinity and D&D players are problematic sexist misogynerds.

Did I guess the right answer? Do I win something?

>>54728497
>Try to understand what you didn't like about those people as individuals, and try to more closely review new players then?
I'm not one of the people doing it. I'm just explaining that this reasoning exists and why it exists.

>I feel that beer & chips D&D is different to the more involved campaigns I'm referring to where I feel a player's gender does not matter.
How is it different? Why does a player's gender matter for a beer & chips D&D?

>>54728497
Okay, so a girls-/men only group is only allowed to run "beer and chips" types of campaigns and not "involved campaigns"? Got it!

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>>54727887
You seem like you're the one upset, not your example. Besides women exclude guys for the same reasons as guys exclude women.

If anything its more reasonable to assume dominantly male groups include females in them much more often than the opposite.

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>>54728454
>Alright all four of us have gone it's your turn now
>ummm what can I do?!

>>54725879
For my groups it's more of an unspoken rule than a legit rule, and it's mostly because D&D is our "guys night" thing. I love hanging out with my girlfriend but sometimes you just need to have that guy-time.

>>54728526
>I'm just explaining that this reasoning exists
And I'm just explaining how I don't understand it. It's a real weird leap of logic to me to blanket ban an entire gender just because you coincidentally had bad experiences with multiple people of that gender. If it's something like attention-seeking for example, than to me the next logical step is learning to recognising attention-seekers when looking for new players, rather than jumping to "females are attention seekers ban them".

>Why does a player's gender matter for a beer & chips D&D?
It doesn't, but if your boy's/girl's only night has some casual D&D as the activity then sure.

I guess that's my problem, in a proper RPG I feel like you should be creating characters that really are separate to yourself, and in this way the gender, appearance and all that of a player doesn't matter to me. Again as I've stated, only the person's attitude and how they fit into the group matters in my eyes. That's why I can't understand caring about gender and banning/excluding someone based on that.

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>>54728046
IRRATIONAL POSTER DETECTED, BAIT SIGNALS GONE HAYWIRE, REQUIRE ASSISTANCE FROM PROFESSIONAL (you) POSTERS. REPEAT, REQUESTING BACKUP.

>>54728605
You're assuming that even a "serious" campaign is 100% IC all the time, which is obviously not true. We're not discussing a problem with women IC, we're discussing OOC issues that affect the IC aspects of the game.

>>54728605
It's easier to ban a common trait shared by problem players than it is to bother filtering everyone. Same reason people ban certain races from being played in D&D, because they can attract particular types of people.

OP, let's say that your best friend that you've known for years is cool in almost every way but he just absolutely hates pizza for some inexplicable reason, and he gets angry and irrational and bitchy if you bring pizza into the room.

It's stupid, but he's your bro and you're not going to purposefully show up with pizza knowing it will ruin his day.

Is it fair to pizza? No. Is it stupid? Absolutely. If every group had a guy like this, people who like pizza or at least didn't mind it would have serious grounds to complain.

The trouble from women's perspective is that there can seem to be a LOT of groups that have a guy that doesn't get along well with them, and given that the opportunities for game selection are low, gaming can seem very hard for them to break into. That's the boat my wife was in for a long time before I met her. She always wanted to play but couldn't find a group that could cope with a young woman playing.

On the other hand, it would be absurd to ask an established group of friends to change their preferences and style to admit a player.

>>54728605
>If it's something like attention-seeking for example, than to me the next logical step is learning to recognising attention-seekers when looking for new players, rather than jumping to "females are attention seekers ban them".
Women are much more likely to be attention-seekers in a male-only space than men

>>54728632
Why didn't she ever start a group then? That way she can control who is there and you can present it to others straight-up as a group with a female

>>54728626
I don't believe OOC should affect IC, no. If it does you need to assess the individuals in your group, and as I've stated I don't understand a gender ban being the result of that assessment as I feel it's quite a strong leap in logic.

>>54728629
Women make up 50% of the population. Sure, women make a much lower percentage of tabletop players, but that's still such a large chunk to exclude. I also don't feel you can draw a common trait between 50% of the population.

I never really understood banning races either, but hey you do you.

>>54728658
Cool generalisation.

>>54728665
Lack of experience and confidence. Now that she knows the game, she HAS started her own group. She runs a game for her sister and best friend on nights that I'm out of town. I'll join in every now and then but it's basically just for them.

There's several reasons I can think off, at least
a) many girls just want to be the center of the attention, and don't actually care about the game. This usually invites a shit ton of drama.
b) many men get weird around women if they're single and horny. This isn't the womans fault, but it still fucks up the sessions
c) women often see themselves as the moral arbiter, and will call out things they don't agree with, making everyone uncomfortable and reluctant to speak their mind. If a guy makes a joke in bad taste, other guys will go "dude, fucking gross" or (oh man wtf) and then move on, a woman will make a scene of it and potentially try to ruin that guys life for making dead baby jokes or whatever. tl;dr men can't relax around women
d) GM's gf situations, don't have to go into more details on that one
e) the worst players I've met are women. They'll either play some barbarian and go full rape, genocide and jaywalking in excruciating detail, or make characters without any agency who just kinda wants to roleplay elven princesses spending 10 minutes choosing a dress. Insufferable, really.

girls are gross dawg, they have cooties.

>>54728692
>Women make up 50% of the population. Sure, women make a much lower percentage of tabletop players, but that's still such a large chunk to exclude.
No it isn't. A far larger amount of men play /tg/ than women. You're filtering out very little from your player pool if you ban a small minority. That's basic math.

>>54728632
>food analogy

If your friend gets irrational at women I think you need to sit down and have a serious talk to your friend. I'm not saying you need to force him to get used to women, but there are some real underlying issues there.

>>54728724
>small minority
I dunno, they're a minority here but not that small. Like I said our group's been just under 50% female for a long while.

>>54728692
>I don't believe OOC should affect IC

Well, good for you, but that doesn't stop the fact that it does and it always does. The only reason there is ever a continuing IC between a group is because they don't hate each other enough OOC to stop doing it.

>>54728605
>I guess that's my problem, in a proper RPG I feel like you should be creating characters that really are separate to yourself, and in this way the gender, appearance and all that of a player doesn't matter to me. Again as I've stated, only the person's attitude and how they fit into the group matters in my eyes. That's why I can't understand caring about gender and banning/excluding someone based on that.
Well, here we are then.

I wouldn't say it's a problem, rather than you just have a different perception of RPGs than some other people. You seem to get into the role and perceive the whole game from an IC perspective. Other people see it more as an activity they can play while socializing OOC with their peers. I can't say one is wrong and one is right, those are just two different ways to perceive it.

I'd just advise you not to be quick to judge other people, just because they treat and perceive the gaming activity different from you.

>>54728046
So now you're denying the existence of routine, scheduled, "dude nights"?

That's a pretty flimsy argument.

Men can want to have male-only spaces without it being about "getting their sexism out". Are you seriously trying to imply that a regular "girls night" is completely fine and normal and beneficial for women's social health, but a regular "guys night" is a nefarious outlet to hate women?

Why do you hate men so much dude?

>>54728744
You also live in Aus and have no frame of reference for other gaming scenes.

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The fact that this arument is still happening is fucking retarded. Dude, you do know that understanding and agreeing are two different things, right?

>>54728692
>I don't believe OOC should affect IC, no.
You misunderstand. We're not talking about OOC affecting IC. We're talking about OOC affecting OOC. Basically, guys want to spend time with fellow men. True, IC they can be men, women or whatever. But OOC they're still socializing with their male buddies.

>>54728700
>c) women often see themselves as the moral arbiter, and will call out things they don't agree with, making everyone uncomfortable and reluctant to speak their mind. If a guy makes a joke in bad taste, other guys will go "dude, fucking gross" or (oh man wtf) and then move on, a woman will make a scene of it and potentially try to ruin that guys life for making dead baby jokes or whatever. tl;dr men can't relax around women
Fucking this.

>>54728700
upvoted

>>54728753
>they don't hate each other enough OOC to stop doing it
Well good, I feel like that's exactly the kind of group you should be playing with. I dunno, I guess if you have someone who hates an entire gender then maybe a blanket ban is needed but again, it's just something I don't understand.

>>54728758
True, although I'm trying not to judge people here, more just trying to explain why I don't understand and people seem to be perceiving me as judging them.

Like this guy.
>>54728763
No, you're replying to an old post I've since further clarified on, and you're making bad assumptions.

>>54728787
Sure, I guess. I've just never felt the need to have a social group entirely made of my gender before, it's happened by pure coincidence sure but we've never put up a "no women" sign. Also I recognise RPGs as social but as I said, they're more about the story and characters to me.

My group does this to stop catfishers and general drama. We had an issue when a player invited his girlfriend to the group. Needless to say ever since we started doing this we have had no issues.

>>54728795
I assume this is why women love working in HR as well.

>>54728832
>I'm trying not to judge people here, more just trying to explain why I don't understand and people seem to be perceiving me as judging them.
>I don't understand and people seem to be perceiving me as judging them.
Well lets look back at your first post and see if we can detect anything hostile or judgemental in it
>>54727887
>No, "men" just want to cry about how shitty and "attention-seeking" women are at their precious boy-only games and exclude them.

>>54728864
And in nerd hobby journalism

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>>54728864
HR people are fucking vindictive.

>>54728887
Well yes, that is something that has literally been happening in this very thread.

>>54728832
>although I'm trying not to judge people here
lol

>>54728701
Cool generalisation.

>>54728700
>c) women often see themselves as the moral arbiter, and will call out things they don't agree with, making everyone uncomfortable and reluctant to speak their mind. If a guy makes a joke in bad taste, other guys will go "dude, fucking gross" or (oh man wtf) and then move on, a woman will make a scene of it and potentially try to ruin that guys life for making dead baby jokes or whatever. tl;dr men can't relax around women
>d) GM's gf situations, don't have to go into more details on that one

This shit so hard. these two things are what i think of when women get involved with anything /tg/

>>54728900
And yet you applied that to all men that "just want to spend a fun evening with the boys".
That was a very cool generalization back then. Proud of ya!

>>54729075
No? I applied it to the specific type of "men" who want to just cry about their bad experiences with people who just happen to be women.

>54729041
'men'
Let me guess, only fedora-tippers-nice-guy-finish-last are real men, and the others are misogynist pig barbarians?

>>54729041
Hey man, >>54729132 is talking about you.

>>54729103
>there's a difference between decent black folks and niggers, amirite
That's how you sound, anon

>54729145
That was for >54729103, obviously.

>>54729158
There isn't?

>>54729158
There is a difference between black folks and niggers though.

>>54727887
Found the chick. Tits or GTFO

>>54729145
>>54729103
Hey fellas, >>54729166 is talking about you.

>>54728744
I would agree that the dude has issues. That's not the point. You asked "why" not "justify".

>>54725879

Women bring in a lot of drama that can absolutely ruin a group, and they like to be the center of attention. This isn't bad, but remember that most gamers are sweaty virgins. You don't want everyone to censor their speech to white knight for that one girl.

Seriously, you guys are the thirstiest motherfuckers I've ever seen. I'm a married man, and my faith in humanity plummets a little each time I game with my group. I love you fuckers, but you have to admit to yourselves that you have a problem.

Like, I do this to unwind. I'm running a beer-and-pretzels game with a lot of ribald humor. I don't want to have to tone that down.

Why are women so fucking judgemental, god
Just live and let live, is that so fucking hard

>>54729103
okay, lets look back at it.

>>Men just want to spend a fun evening with the boys
>No, "men" just want to cry about how shitty and "attention-seeking" women are at their precious boy-only games and exclude them. See >>54727739

Somebody said: men just want to spend a fun evening with the boys.
And you said 'No'. End of line.
You said that men don't want to spend a fun evening with the boys. You didn't say, "Well, maybe. But a few want to xyz". You put men in quotes, and had you not been called out on it, everybody would have been left guessing as to what exactly you meant with that. It was just a way to easily cop out of it when being called out.
You applied it to all men that want to have "precious boy-only games".

>>54729250
>Seriously, you guys are the thirstiest motherfuckers I've ever seen. I'm a married man, and my faith in humanity plummets a little each time I game with my group. I love you fuckers, but you have to admit to yourselves that you have a problem.
Find a better group.

And get rid of the habit to generalize all /tg/ nerds, too.

>>54729281

No. Why should I compromise my own enjoyment for the sake of a diversity quota? If I don't enjoy DM'ing, I won't run a game: the enjoyment of six people is more important than meeting some Leftist social standard. As the forever DM, it's my table, my rules.

Let's be fair, DMs are hard to come by. No-one else wants to run, and I enjoy the role. I haven't met many who like it.

>>54725879

Depends on the group, and depends on the player in question. One of my most successful groups had multiple girls in it (we were teenagers at the time), and it was actually one of the guys and a long time player of mine who was the problem.

Another old group of mine on the other hand, imploded because of drama instigated by a female player who was the fiance of another player.

My current group is fine with female players. We'd play more often with one of them, but her work schedule interferes.

I can't speak for all groups, but in my experience, it comes down to individuals. Occasionally I'd also just like to hang out with my male friends, which I find important to my mental and emotional well being.

Women either refuse to learn the rules of the game, or will just kinda freeform and want to do stuff that's not supported by the game, i've noticed. If a girl makes a druid in dnd she will try to use her powers as if she can affect nature directly without using actual spells. Something more fitting for freeform or a less rigid magic system e.g. "i want to make the trees form a pathway with their branches so i can sneak into the ensammen!" "ok, what spell are you using?" "uuh, i just kind of commune with nature and stuff..." that kind of thing.

>>54729674
>I had this experience with maybe 1 or 2 women so therefore all women

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>>54725964
This, too bee quiet honing witch you, phamb.

>Queen Bee DM
>Commands a legion of white knight beta orbiters
>Orders me to play a character she made
>Okay, fine
>Orders me to play with a personality she invented
>Uh...okay
>Orders me to do as she wants me to do
>Dude, that's not even "roleplay" anymore. That's literally just "I'm playing, but you're just rolling the dice for me"
>Everyone else just thought I was being a troublemaker
>She commanded everyone to be hostile to me IRL
>Hanging outside game shop, eating some chips
>Some beta white knight orbiters try to pick a fight with me (lmao)
>Ask them why they're being so harsh on me
>"Uh, because you keep fucking with Ashley, and she's the boss and everything she says, goes."
>Literally just stare at the leader of the beta orbiters until he looks away in shame and they all walk away

How does someone like that even exist? I thought real life wasn't supposed to be like a shitty Highschool made-for-TV drama...

We ban woman for one reason. Our oldest member is a pervert. He makes woman uncomfortable, will make the entire session about them and changes their characters into sex objects. Agreeing not to allow bring girlfriends and wives is easier than getting a man in his 60's to change.

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>>54729770
>Banning all women from the table just because some oldfag can't keep it in his pants.

>>54729281
>stop having fun and play my way
this fucking guy

>>54729828
Why should they kick out a guy they like if the problem can be avoided by not allowing women?

>>54725879
Women can be fine players. It's what they (unintentionally) do to virginal/socially retarded male players that becomes an issue.

>>54729942
If the dude was an outspoken KKK member who made minorities feel uncomfortable, made the entire session about them, and changed their characters into racial stereotypes, we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

Even then, if he's unwilling to at least try and change his ways so that I, as the GM, don't have to filter a sizable chunk of the population from my games, then he's getting the boot.

>>54725879
She's bullshitting you for sympathy, or to break the ice
I know this because I too am a compulsive liar

>>54730116
Yeah, we would. Why do I give a shit about some potential player if the guy is otherwise a good friend and player?

>>54730116
>gaming with minorities in the first place
see, this is where you goofed

>>54730116
If you gamed with HP Lovecraft, would you boot him?

>>54726892
>t. riggered roasty cunt

>>54730160
>Yeah, we would.
No, we wouldn't.
>Why do I give a shit about some potential player if the guy is otherwise a good friend and player?
Because shutting out the world to protect an otherwise shitty person won't make them better people in the long run, it just makes you an enabler to their behavior and once the ride's over, you'll realize that you basically cut hundreds of thousands of people out of your life just to make some jackass feel comfortable in his behavior.
>>54730167
>see, this is where you goofed
How so? Everyone's a minority if you break down ethnicities far enough.

Besides, nowadays white people are minorities.
>>54730209
>If you gamed with HP Lovecraft, would you boot him?
If his presence was making other people uncomfortable, absolutely.

Besides, people only like H.P. Lovecraft for his works and the fact that they didn't have to be around him back when he was alive. If he was born nowadays, he'd probably be writing SCP entries.

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>>54730215
>riggered

>>54730291
>hundreds of thousands
I live in a town with a population of 40,000 people. I doubt more than 0.5% of them have ever even considered playing tabletop.

>>54730318
> I doubt more than 0.5% of them have ever even considered playing tabletop.
How do you know though? Most of the people in my current group are people who never played tabletop before in their lives and ended up enjoying it.

Also, you probably interacted with hundreds of thousands of people over your lifetime, you just never noticed.

>>54730344
>How do you know though? Most of the people in my current group are people who never played tabletop before in their lives and ended up enjoying it.
I have no reason to seek out more players if I'm satisfied with my current group.

>Also, you probably interacted with hundreds of thousands of people over your lifetime, you just never noticed.
But that's irrelevant in the context of cutting people out of my life to make some jackass feel comfortable with his behavior. The black girl checking me out at Walmart doesn't know I wouldn't let her play tabletop with our group because of my friend. She hasn't been cut out of my life.

>>54730291
>If his presence was making other people uncomfortable, absolutely.
That's the thing, Lovecraft is already in your group, while all those other people aren't. Would you lose Lovecraft for those hypothetical future members?

Btw, just to clarify, I've never been in a situation like that, and I probably wouldn't have let a guy like that join my group in the first place. I'm treating this as a purely philosophical dilemma

>>54728462
Are you illiterate bud? Can you not read all the responses or are you just autistic.

>>54730406
>She hasn't been cut out of my life.
You're cutting her potential inclusion into your group because your friend is unwilling to be less of a creep.
>>54730426
>Would you lose Lovecraft for those hypothetical future members?
I wouldn't want ANYONE in my group who would force me to choose who I can allow at my table before I've even met them personally.

If I decide I want to invite people for whatever reason, I'm not going to discount an entire population of people just because I knew H.P. Lovecraft for a long time.

And I say this as someone who had to kick his former best friend for over a decade out of the group because he was such a negative influence two players outright refused to show up if they knew that he was planning on coming that day.

>>54728067

But the extra feat! Why would you ban the source of that delicious extra feat?

>>54730540
No, I'm cutting her potential inclusion because she's some random person I'm interacting with for three minutes and then not going to recognize if I ever see her again.

>>54725879
I have no problem with women in my games. What I have a problem with is relationships between players, or between one player and the DM.
The 'beta orbiting'/'DM's GF' problem should stop when everyone knows nobody's gonna get poon as part of sitting down at the table.

>>54730606
Your best friend was a random person that you interacted with until you decided to hang out together.

If you put yourself out there, who knows what she could've been a week, a month, or even a year down the line.

>>54730406
You know you can just have multiple groups of friends right?

>>54728489
>>54730474
I'm not him, but can you summarize or link the responses? I don't want to do it myself.
Besides, as much as recapping is tedious, he might interpret this as us going for the "it's not my job to educate you" cop-out.

>samefag
I'm poster number 59 and disagree with more of his points than most of the other anons'.

>>54730540
What did you try to do prior to kicking him out?

>>54725879
If it's a private group, with guys that want their own "guys night" like what everyone else in the thread has said, then they're allowed to do it. It's exclusive, sure, but they might be the type of group that is stringent about letting new players join in general, or not let in new people at all. Maybe past experiences soured them to the whole thing or maybe their members just don't "mesh" with girl players. Either way, its their choice. It might just be the group's attempt at cutting out drama or other bullshit that might ruin what they're doing, not the typical "ew females can't rp"
>joining my group
Now this is the part where you can call them out. If they're joining up and start shit with your group and your members (which I presume have girls) then it's a heyday for you. What they do in private can't carry over. If they all end up being a group of "that guy" then you can just move on with your day and not pay attention to dumb asses. People have motives for everything, and things that seem exclusive or fucked-up might just be a way of preserving a game. In my opinion, its only if this shit goes down in a public space that this shit can get called out. If someone ran a session at a Game Shop, advertise it online, and then pull a "no Girls Allowed" then fuck 'em and hope they get shit on for it. If its guys on a Sunday night drinking beer and wanting to get away from girlfriends, then that's not something infringing on anyone.

I find it foolish at the least, an actual waste of time at worst.
My own group is incredibly varied, has 2 couples in it out of 8 people (some dip in and out as job situation dictates), and there has been no issues because we have long talked out any exigent concerns.
Sure, it's "easier" to blanket ban people, but I think that is weak cuck shit to do by people who lack the guts to confront problems. I maintain an open door policy to my group, and if there is an issue, it will be brought up. If it isn't resolved, you are kicked out, period. My current group has been together for 6 years now.

>>54730724
>What did you try to do prior to kicking him out?
We talked to him about his behavior, he said that he was sorry and that he realized the error of his ways, then progressively got worse and worse until we couldn't justify bringing him in as a player anymore.

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shut up stupid boys,we play with the best

>>54726355

Not if it's interesting and you have fun with it. Some of my favourite sessions have been rp heavy/no combat.

>>54730724
>Besides, as much as recapping is tedious, he might interpret this as us going for the "it's not my job to educate you" cop-out.
Read the thread. We have literally already recapped the main reasons for him earlier.

>>54730957
Who are these women?

A few months back I was dming for 3 separate groups:
1: All guys, the group consists of several extremely nerdy guys with all kinds of social anxieties, they're working on it but dnd is how they relax the game mostly just consists of dungeon crawling and fighting and we're happy with that because everyone knows we're just there to chill out from the work week.

2. Mixed group of guys and girls, everyone has been friends with eachother for so so long that nobody has any shame I find this group loves pushing social boundaries

3. All girls group: they heard about dnd and wanted to try it, they're worried about how guys will act with them so they wanted a group where they could learn how to play and just be themselves. They take the roleplay very seriously and I have to flesh out the worlds alot more for them

My point is none of these styles is wrong. It doesn't matter what gender you are sometimes you just don't want to deal with the other one. Sometimes you're comfortable in mixed company and sometimes you're not. There's places to work on your issues and at the end of the day maybe you just need a break not to work on them some more.

Different strokes for different folks man

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>>54731250
this anon nailed it

>>54731250
No anon you're only aloud one group, how dare you not introduce all of your friends to each other even though it's obviously a terrible idea

>>54731318
*allowed

>>54730308
>t. riggered
>t riggered
>triggered

>>54731318

Heh actually tried introducing a few of group 1 to group 3, the autism was palpable (from both sides)

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>>54731405
>He thinks he's clever

>>54725879
Because I deal with my loving wife everyday and some times I just need to play a gray guard with my buddies in peace.

If the idea of "guys night" makes you uncomfortable, you're clearly a teenager or college student

>>54731250
Wait. How did you manage to DM both a group of guys who weren't comfortable around girls, and a group of girls who weren't comfortable around guys? Did you put on a female disguise, or are you some sort of cloaked masked shrouded figure?

>>54731318
>introduce all of your friends to each other
not that guy but hell no, I want to keep my precious nerds pure and autistic, they don't need the drama of dealing with my normalfag friends. They also reflect extremely bad on me, but that's more of a sidenote.

>>54731558
The secret is to just make shit up, who's gonna know what's true or not on a cantonese earscratching bbs?

>>54731121
Normie trash judging by the picture. I'm all for all girl games because that keeps them out of my game. If you're not smuggling a hot dog and two plums dong-style don't show up at my game.

>>54731596
So traps are allowed at your games?

>>54731558
chances are he's friends with the girls, who know he's into RPG shit for whatever reason and asked him to DM for them

>>54731613
They're only allowed under the table~

>>54731619
Or he's gay. Most girls feel they can act naturally around gay guys

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>>54731482
>he thinks anyone cares
Beta orbiter numale cuccboi

>>54731558

Honestly I'm not sure, I off hand mentioned at a party that I dm alot for dnd and one of the chicks approached me about dming for them.

They must have decided that I was okay but it still took a couple sessions before they really got comfortable around me.

>>54731716
You know you gotta turn this into a harem somehow, anon

>>54731716 <- is me

>>54731619
And yeah I knew the one girl who approached me

>>54731745

Heh fuck that they're all like annoying little sisters to me now

>>54731716
>Honestly I'm not sure, I off hand mentioned at a party that I dm alot for dnd and one of the chicks approached me about dming for them.
She wanted the D... and D

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>>54725879
>I mean, according to my more-then-a-decade gaming experience women are as fun players as men and they can bring in the game aspects that men do not.
I don't believe you.
Your claim that you played over a decade and never head any bad experiences with female players is pure bullshittery.

Women are drama-magnets. All of them. Whether intentional or unintentional they are natural group-wreckers.
I'm not saying that grognards cant be terrible too, but here is the thing: They do not cause drama.
Kicking them out when they behave to badly doesn't cause drama.
No one at the table treats them differently because he wants in their pants.
You do not have to give them preferential treatment.
You do not have to change your humour or watch how you act around them.

Its literally that simple, I do not understand why this is hard to grasp for goony nu-male beardmen and Male Feminists like you.
Women are not men, no matter how much your gender studies prof told you otherwise.

>>54731745
Honestly, I could see Japs making a harem anime or doujinshi about a guy DM'ing an all-female group

>>54725879

I've played with a fair number of men and women. Generally, if a man is a problem, you can boot him out and that's that. Usually the problem is that he's a sperg and he's making everyone uncomfortable. "I have no social skills, so I'm going to argue over every bad dice roll and I'm going to sit uncomfortably close to the girls and talk too loud!"

If a girl is a problem, booting her out causes a shitstorm while beta males defend her and other girls scramble to become the center of attention in the chaos. Usually the problem is she's trying to pull the story off the rails to enact some unrelated fantasy, and takes it personally as a player when her character stops being the center of attention. "Stop trying to get to the end of the dungeon and fight the bad guy, I want to RP a scene for three hours where I'm all by myself in a locked room angsting over NPCs from my backstory! No we can't cut back and forth between me and the rest of the party, we have to do the whole scene at once!"

If everything's good, then everything's good, but it's generally harder to manage women than men when problems start. I'm a man, so that might have something to do with it - maybe girl GMs would have a hard time kicking out a problem guy. But that's just my experience.

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>>54731660
>I don't care
>That's why I'm replying to you
>To let you know how much I don't care right now.
You're not fooling anyone fucko.

>>54725879
this isnt a popular opinion on tg because all these motherfuckers are too socially inept to get laid and take it out on girls as a concept/hating women is m33m3s. Sorry op.

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>>54728240
Don't they occasionally play with that Hearthstone Trump guy? I remember tuning in to a stream and seeing him on there.

>>54731884
I've slept with a couple of girls from my roleplaying club, doesn't mean I want to have them in my group, they're shitty people.

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>>54731844
>he thinks it takes more than an iota of my time and energy to shitpost back

>>54731961
>>54731844
You're both faggots

Because when girls are in the group the game is less relaxing

>>54731624
That's lewd, you slut

>>54726892
I've seen things like this posted before and it always baffles me. It's always posted by the same type of people who complain about the male gaze and don't see the hypocrisy.

>>54732268
It always baffles me when an anon appearing like an /r9k/ poster parrots the same "women are only in it for attention" meme without implying that it isn't all of them or that they aren't doing it solely for attention.
Though I'm surprised >>54726892 quoted "Females" rather than the "attention-seeking".

Never had any problems with female players. Male players that don't know how behave around women are usually the problem.

>>54726164
And thus, we have our problem.

How do you screen for creeps?

>>54732465

Look for the CN/CE edgelord that it's looking for excuses to rape female npcs/pc.

Can't girls just make their own group with no guys and one of the girls can GM and do all the work that goes alo- HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Oh man I almost got all the way through it, too.

Women get into /tg/ for the male attention, they can't complain that they get too much of it or that they get excluded because guys don't want to deal with the drama and bullshit.

>>54732515
They don't need to complain because white knights will protect their honor everytiem.

>>54726911
No, it means womanly.

>>54725879
>>We don't want girls in our D&D group
>So I heard this from a female player
You answered your own question. Women hate other women more than men ever will.

>>54725879
More than one woman and shit goes to hell.

>>54731624
Pretty much, yes.

>>54732600
This man speaks the truth.

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>>54727049
>if the girl don't cause drama, the guys around her do

Wisdom.

>>54732515
>tips fedora

>>54732515
>do work
Top kek. You almost had me too

>>54732465
25 consecutive pushups. Screens all sorts other problem players too.

>>54732676
>t. reddit

>>54732646
>sexist
>cooties
>no girl touched you
>little boy
I like how most of the angry replies are passive-aggressive non-replies like that. Only 2 girls actually managed to offer sensible counterarguments

>>5473244

This desu. I'm in exceptionally poor health and I can manage 25 in a minute. There is no excuse for people who can't do that unless you're in a wheelchair

>>54732744
Our DM is a jolly fat guy, and he's the best and most imaginative DM I've ever played with. Fuck off Chad.

>>54726892

t. hew-mon female

>>54732897
>t. fatass

>>54733182
Not me, but my DM sure is

>>54732847
How do you fuck up quoting someone? Just click on the number and begin typing.

Because women, in general, are not as fun as guys to play with.

>>54732846
>the guy who says cooties literally plays the meme panda race

reality is stranger than fiction

>>54725879
>Be me
>Have large DnD group of 7 people
>Group is mostly women with three dudes
>Never have any problems whatsoever
What are you guys talking about? Is this the state of tabletop gaming?

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>>54732846
Arguing with women is just like arguing with liberals.
All they do is try to emotionally shame and batter you. They offer no real arguments, no facts, no information at all, they just try to rally popular dislike against you and try to make you feel like you've alienated yourself from people by drawing obvious conclusions from facts. They'll insult your masculinity, your sex appeal, your intelligence, and they'll apply negative buzzwords to you, but not once will they ever make an actual point or offer contrary information.
They try to "out-group" you, for lack of a better term.
The worst part is, it works against a lot of spineless men who end up beta-orbiting a group of people who intrinsically despise them.

>>54733872
Arguing with men is just like arguing with conservatives.
All they do is try appeal to emotion and batter you. They offer no real arguments, no facts, no information at all, they just try to rally popular dislike against you and try to make you feel like you've alienated yourself from people by making emotional appeals without facts. They'll insult your race, your sex, your intelligence, and they'll apply negative buzzwords to you, but not once will they ever make an actual point or offer contrary information.
They try to "out-group" you, for lack of a better term.
The worst part is, it works against a lot of spineless men who end up beta-orbiting a group of people who intrinsically despise them.

>>54733926
Exhibit A
No arguments, no points, just "cleverly" turning what I said around so it seems like I'm the person who does this in an attempt to rally popular dislike against me.
At least try, anon.

>>54733997
>I can't beat someone's argument
>therefore their arguments are all invalid
>I'm smurtest evar!

t. avg alt-shit

>>54734033
You didn't make an argument, you just changed some of the words in my post in an effort to act smugly superior without having to do anything.
You did the exact thing I said you do.

>>54733872
Nah, those passive-aggressives were both men and women. Herd mentality can apply to both genders. And did you miss the part where I said the only 2 people who offered actual counterpoints were 2 women?

>>54733926
And you're a dum-dum as well.

>>54734074
ok prove that men never do this >>54733926
You can't because everyone fucking does that you dumbshit

Why are people shitting on "boys' night"? The inclusion of women in a group will almost always change the dynamic of it, for better or worse, there will be a noticable difference. It's not impossible to find "bro-tier" women, it's just rare, and even then the rest of your male players need to be of the sort that genuinely don't give a shit (which is rare aswell). I've played in both male and mixed groups and have never really had any issue with female players personally (Luck? I dunno), but I can sympathise with the people who have because I know how some people change the second a person of the other sex is present, and that goes for both sides.

>>54734074
Actually, it wasn't that anon, but me. The point was how your argument works just as well reversed. You aren't providing any concrete argument, you are just making an emotional appeal, no better than the women and liberals you say try and batter you.

Your experience may show that women don't argue with facts, they argue with emotions, while my experience shows that conservatives don't argue with facts, they argue with emotions as well.

I would it's because both sides have a wide range of people who believe in those things, but the vast majority of people who argue on the internet (and in real life), and don't do it for a living aren't that good at it.
And appeal to emotion is really fuckin' easy.

>>54725879
>from a female player regarding some other group
The amount of attention a female receives is inversely proportional to the amount of other females in the surrounding area.

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I've been a GM for over 17 years. Have had tons of female players. In my experiece theycan cause.drama and be annoying, but just as muvh as male players can. Booting them is even easier because they stop comming as soon as they feel unwanted.

The only problem I've had more with female players than male is that they are boring to play with. Normaly they can't separate OOC with IC, they actually get mad at things that happen in the game and their characters mostly have the same personality as the player. Which is to say men also have this problems, but women do it more in my personal experience.

Been DMing for the same group most of my years and everyone is wellcome to join no mater howchad or grognard.

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>>54725879
I hope you're proud OP, you've somehow managed to create the worst thread currently on /tg/

>>54734558
You haven't been to >>54718210

>>54730291
>won't make them better people in the long run
Roleplaying groups are not re-education camps, comrade.

Maybe they were attention whoring like you anon

>>54728326
The difference is that this is a private group of people, rather than taxpayer funded

>>54728509
>wanting to be able to relax with the guys is retarded
Tits or gtfo

>>54734179
>Muh based centrism
Neck yourself

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>>54735239
The guy I'm responding to isn't baiting, you dipshit. I meant the faggot who has been blatantly baiting for this entire fucking thread about how sexist boy's clubs are.

>>54735398
Oh gods no, I'm rather a rather hardcore leftist. I'd argue I was a technocrat, but I'm American, so anything that isn't middle of the road democrat or right leaning republican doesn't count.

>>54735533
Oh I get it. You're insane. This thread makes much more sense now.

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>>54735574

>>54732384
Your post makes no sense in reply to mine. Are you alright, Anon?

>>54730646
>What I have a problem with is relationships between players, or between one player and the DM
^ nailed it

Also applies to creeper oldfags and mouth-breathing pervs. So long as everyone gets that you're not getting laid from being at the table it should hopefully go OK.

>>54727004

enough of this meme

Grognards are just neckbeards that only play ODnD/OSRIC/ADnD1e and thought that having to pay for rules was retarded and that modules that cost money were retarded. If you want to see true grognardism see the Knights and Knaves forum. Those people are grognards. Hell, I see "grognards" for 3.5 and thats just not how it is. there are only basic and 1e grognards. everything else, is just a toy

>>54727004
>horror and fantasy fiction, which has always had significant female fans and writers (although they were sometimes separated or marginalized).
Fuck. Off.

>>54727265
>because if players are 13-17 year old (sometimes it's also true for older players) they are immature and they will spend more time romancing another player of the opposite sex than trying to play the game seriously, i
It's only "immature" to you because you know you're too ugly and autistic to get someone that way.
>t. have fucked 3 girls I played D&D with

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In my experience GMing women can get immersed in playing games like Call of Cthulhu but games like D&D have ended up a fucking mess every time

Have had moderate success with female players in Dark Heresy

If the game has any sort of competitive elements or elements which could BECOME competitive between players in a sort of pissing contest conflicts will emerge quickly

>>54730651

It's really not worth the effort.

>>54736976
The most telling thing about a friendship with a woman is that if you sit down and actually supress that tiny tiny little voice at the back of your mind that's telling you that you might, just might, be able to hit that ass somewhere down the line, and then consider how the relationship is between you and the girl, you will overwhelmingly reach the conclusion that it's not worth hanging out with her. Mostly because it's a skewed relationship where you're supposed to entertain her, she's not actually funny or interesting and probably not even ready to help you out in a pinch.

>>54737171
The hell?
I'm friends with plenty of women I don't want to fuck. I will admit, it's because I am not or was not attracted to them physically, but the was not is because I wouldn't want to have sex with them now that they are in better shape because I'm a romantic at heart.
I also want to fuck a number of my female acquaintances, because of course.

>>54737171
>>54737273
I am and have been friends with three women in my life. Ironically enough, two of them I'm pretty sure wanted to bone me or at least weren't against the idea, while I was fine with the relationship staying as it is. The third one is a relative, and it's the best friendship out of all three.

>inb4 lol you're just bullshitting
I wish I was. It's ironic because I don't pretend to be some kind of playboy, my sex life is pretty shit. I just have the questionable luck of attracting women I'm not interested in romantically.

>>54735682
What I'm saying is that not all women are in on these male-dominated groups for attention, and most of those that are genuinely enjoy the hobby along with the attention.
Aside from a cold I'm doing pretty well.