/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

Golden Age of Science fiction better be Deviant and Promethean. I'm ready for some reanimator and crude science shit.

>54710921
Reposting my OP response from the.. other.. thread.
>What are some NPCs or Groups of NPCs that you put into your games that your players responded well to?
We had great success when our GM tossed in a group of hunters. But not Hunters, capital letter, just 'hunters'. We were the capital letter ones.

The other guys had seen a bit too much, but were basically mortals. Like, good old boys with a pick up truck, spot lights, rifles and all the liquor they could afford. The fuckers kept beating us to clues and scenes we were investigating, shooting things and setting it on fire, then blasting off into the distance with polka remixes of katy perry songs blaring (This being what the GM would put on over the stereo when it was one of 'their' scenes).

They died terribly when they beat us to a scene and found not the 'great tootin' boar' they were expecting, but a shapeshifter busy eating a derelict. We took all the credit for killing it with our associates, framed them for the murders with the standard authorities and stole all the stuff out of their houses.

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>>54710921
>.36 caliber

>>54710978
or Changeling and Beast

>>54711012
Fuck that shit, I'm with >>54710978

New stretch goal reached, we've got the SF era!

>>54711041
Oh thank god. Golden Era, MKUltra, spider monsters from mars. Here we go, boys.

>>54711041
are the three eras (one that can be added, two that can be resurrected) now standalone? I don't think that they can create a companion with three eras alone

>>54710978
I hope against hope there'd be a page on playing IN golden age science fiction. I'd add a good 100$ to my pledge to play rocketship vampires and hunt for werewolves through the jungles of Venus.

I'm sure I've seen an attribute dot example list for when things go above 5 dots - for strength (and what you can lift), for speed with dexterity, and breath holding for stamina. Does anyone have page numbers and a book?

>>54711012
Beast is better off buried and forgotten

Why is it fair that mages get easy access to aggravated damage by midgame? While other splats have to be near endgame assuming they get access to aggravated at all

>>54711165
I've not read the line, but don't werewolves get aggravated early?

>>54711110
Amen. That SJW garbage and the MacFarland name need to be blotted out from RPG history like the British-Norwegian War of 1955.

>>54711012
I mean by technicality I think Demon would probably be the third most fitting Era for Golden Age of Sci-Fi after Deviant and Promethean, but I'm not quite sure what to picture from Changeling & Beast for primarily sci-fi themes.

>>54711057
Not sure. One of the backers that is reviving an era is going with Mississippi Steam boat era as his primary choice and Jazz Era as his secondary though.

>>54711187
It's McFarland. Get it right please. I hate when people misspell names, even when they are properly vilifying SJW bigots.

>>54711184
No savage rending isn't in 2e. The reason why is be cause if you have access to aggravated damage what is the point in learning a spirit's bane? It's a balance and thematic decision

Why couldn't we keep this in the other thread you were all shitting up?

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>>54711264
Oh look, someone is whingeing about someone else's posts. Fucking prime, mate. Be proud of yourself.

Shit one hour to go and they just put in a new poll with Wild West as an option!

http://theonyxpath.com/dark-eras-poll/

>An interesting mystery
>A widely requested era
>A literally what
Guess which one is currently winning the poll.

Another Egypt and now this. What is it with backers always picking the most overdone or obscure eras?

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>>54711339
Hell Yeah! Vampire cowboys

>>54711534
I imagine Geist would probably be one of the eras for Wild West since it was in Dark Eras 1 even though it lost that poll. Would be cool to see it mixed with Vampire, Werewolf or Demon.

With Vampire we could have Vampire Cowboys and Ghost Bandits.

Werewolf would probably get into Native American culture and totems. Could get into Mementos and Fetishes with the two splats.

Demon could bring something West World-esque to the table.

>>54711466
Be honest, do you think that OPP won't turn the Wild West setting into a 30 page rant about racism and strong womyn homesteaders? I'm not taking that burn.

>>54711584
Man it must suck to be as bitter and jaded as you

>>54711630

He's right, though. After Mage 20, I'm not really holding out any hope. I'm willing to bet good money we'll see black sheriffs and stronk womyn gunslingers everywhere.

>>54711466

The Voynich Manuscript is a common weird mystery and it's winning the poll.

>>54711946
Is it? That's good. Maurya was winning like 30 minutes ago.

>>54711994
Given that it won't be added to the book unless we gather 300 more dollars in the next 8 minutes, I don't think it matters much.

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Which WoD books have the best artwork? Name 2 or 3 from each splat if you can.

Vampire: Just like a wine drunk. No sense of variety and you lose your shit at every party.

Werewolf: You watch boundaries. I violate them. Let’s be friends.

Mage: Met one once. His dreams smelled of old knowledge, ancient and true. So I ate him.

Promethean: I get being on the outside. Thing is, I like it here.

Changeling: You’re worried about being taken? I could watch you. Just to make sure.

Sin-Eater: You’re never quite alone now, are you? Doesn’t that get stifling?

Mummy: Of course I can kill it.

Demon: I like my prey to be multiple choice!

This is just a small example of how shit beast was before the rewrite

>>54711894
Why the fuck are you playing World of Darkness if the latter is a problem for you? Do you know how these games are?

Still say Mr Roboto is the perfect song for demons
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3cShYbLkhBc

>>54711894
You do realize that bad ass heroines have been a staple of horror/sci fi/fantasy forever, right?

>>54712093

>ate a mage

This sounds like bullshit.

>>54712164
That the idea that a character from a certain splat could be killed is by itself bullshit is a testament to how much they should get their own, separate game and stop pretending they fit with the horrorshow.

>>54712082
Bloodlines: The Hidden is pretty good.

>>54712164
Maybe it was an Archmaster using the Beast eating his projected form as a form of Quintessence gathering.

Alternatively:
"You can't just use Space to get through the entire digestive tract undamaged! You need Life too, bro!"
"Watch me."

>>54711579
How would vampire cowboys work? Having a gun duel at high moon?

>>54712314
Wouldn't that be more of a werewolf thing?

>>54712093
This has to be bait.

>>54711041
Oh boy, I can't wait to hear about how problematic the sexist overtones in the Barsoom saga were and how they're fixing it by making Not-John Carter a gay transgendered autistic gerbilkin

>>54712409
If it's any comfort to you, Ian just clarified you wouldn't actually be playing IN science fiction, you'd be playing in the era in which it was written. So no actual John Carter, but presumably you could meet with Edgar Rice Burroughs in Chicago and talk about his writing or something.

>>54712314
Oh god yes. Blood soaked desperados roaming on ghouled horses, itinerant nocturnal preachers screaming dark verses at the other shadows in the night and testing lone homesteads for piety. Witchdoctors feared by indian and american alike, drenched in gore and working inhuman rites. New world nobility, rail barons and industrial captains laying track and taint through the new world. Natural Philosophers, never seen by day, maintaining that creepy old laboratory on the edge of town that never seems to be quite there the same as the rest of the settlement.

Anyone hazard a guess when Dark Eras comes out?

>>54712478
Then what the fuck is even the point of that era?
>Yeah it's an Old West era, but you won't be doing any western shit, you'll be an accountant in England or something

>>54712665
Never swedish dracula is going to close down OPP next year and use the resources to open a line of WoD themed estrogen hormone pills

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>>54712244

You weren't fucking with me (which is kind of what I expected), this book has some great artwork. How come they don't hire the guy more often? Charge too much? Or only gotten him recently in their employ?

>>54712699
I dunno. Ask the developers.

>>54712665
Way, way, way, waaaaaay late. Like, if it comes out at all, that'd be a pleasant surprise. Never count on OPP actually releasing the shit they kickstart. I think people are still waiting on some stuff they backed back in like 2013.

>>54712665
2-3 years from now.

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Aight, for my World of Darkness webcomic I've settled on making the protagonists name Hector (based on Hector from the Iliad) and he will be a pirate from Greece/Mediterranean. I'm trying to settle if I will make him Lasombra or Angellis Ater and giving him DMC Devil Trigger as a power.

I'm still trying to master figure drawing but here's a little incomplete sketch I made

>>54710978
>Golden Age of Science fiction
Task Force VALKYRIE Ray guns please

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>>54712939
>>54712989

https://www.reddit.com/r/rpg/comments/6fua9m/exalted_a_history_of_exposure_3rd_edition_the/

Remember Kids never work off contract and verbal agreements don't mean jack shit

>>54712699
>Hazarding a guess.
You're playing monsters that are the impression for the golden age literature

In 1e Awakening, since a non Archmage could seek a final attainment, what happened if they failed the challenge? Death? Or erasure, ala failed Archmages?

>>54712112
Because Vampires, Werewolves, Mages and Geists and Demon Robots are cool as shit even if the identity politics, self indulgence, and bad virtue signalling are tedious as shit to filter out.

>>54713828
This anon gets it.

>>54713750
You can apparently seek it even in 2E, Dave mentioned it in one of the development blogs' discussion. As to what it entails beyond "confronting a guardian of the Legacy" (who may not necessarily even be a guardian in the typical sense of the word, but more symbolic), I think nobody has any idea. It would be nice to know the details, especially the level and type of abilities the Attainment grants, given that apparently not everyone with the Attainment actually Ascends and so there would be Master Mages with Gnosis 8+ in CofD with presumably ludicruously powerful Attainments. Dave did say that the only thing you need mechanically to achieve it is Mastery of an Arcanum and a Fifth Attainment in a Legacy (no additional higher level of Gnosis and such) + going on a mystery Quest. This may actually be the simple answer to your question: The mage simply doesn't Ascend, if he fails the Quest, and keeps the Attainment (perhaps to try later).

On another note: Dave, if you are here, would you be willing to part with some information from Geist 2E about the rules for playable Ghosts?

>>54713985
According to IM the attainment itself didn't cause Ascension. Just made it possible. So maybe it counts as a form of omen. Or provides the key. So you recreate Gouki v Gouken with the Dragon Manifest and then you have some seperate way to complete your road.

>>54712381
sadly, it's not.

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>>54712381
Forget it Anon, it's Beast.

>>54712093
>Implying a piece of shit beast can fuck with a super quantum computer android that can exploit the laws of physics.
Fuck beasts

>>54712904
God only knows. Probably charges too much. Honestly, the Bohagande/Khaibit are probably my favourite, but whoever drew them had actually read the 'suggested concepts' portion at the very least. And knew something about the game.

And now you know I'm not deliberately fucking with you: Scion is probably the best, but the early books are better. Mummy and Book of Spirits have some nice, but very stylised, artwork. Inferno is about 50/50. The Vampire clanbooks, check the suggested characters - they're usually good pieces of art.

>>54712082
Ancient Bloodlines.

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>>54714378

Also, great stuff to be found here. Keep 'em coming.

Idea for a mortal level antagonist: a college professor who is a Maniac Slasher. He loves his students dearly and wants to see them succeed academically and emotionally no matter what...even if he has to sabotage students from rival colleges and generate intrigue to "weed out the gifted from the mediocre". Virtue is Protective, Vice is Egotistical. His profession probably involves engineering, which he uses to build traps that seem like accidents and other people's fault. Dread Powers include Hypnotic Gaze, Madness And Terror, Know Soul, Surprise Entrance and Influence (Discipline 3).

>>54714613
Seems with the powers he wouldn't need the traps. Maybe change his profession to something more theoretical for flavour, and to let him actually get close to their students?

I've met engineers. Most of them sort of remember Uni as a haze of suffering.

>>54714662
You've got a point. I chose engineering because it is common for Maniac Slashers to kill victims through underhanded and complicated ways. What other profession could he have? Is the idea itself good?

>>54711184
>I've not read the line, but don't werewolves get aggravated early?
its a natural ability they get it at creation

So... http://www.storytellersvault.com/

Too bad this is WW and not OP. I would love to create content for OP games, but I'm not up to par to actually get hired by them.

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>>54711229

>>54714720
Oh, yeah, I really like it. I'm not sure as to profession. Maybe a class in the humanities - something that lets him really connect with his students.

>>54712164
I mean, if the kid was fresh from signing his watchtower, it wouldn't be that big of a surprise.

>>54713599
>want to get paid for words they didn't use
fuck of amy

>>54714817
I'm thinking either philosophy or psychology. Instead of traps, he could use his naturall charisma and cunning + Dread Powers to gaslight and brainwash people into killing themselves and each other.

Although we don't have much information about most of them, who are your favorite Aeons and why?

>>54714973
what?

>>54714973
We had? I thought we just had Mordred and Zahak.

>>54714995
Mordred, Dahhak and other Aeons from MtA.

So, do you guys use ambient music in your setting? I'm trying to create a playlist of songs for a crossover chronicle, for use on stuff like the radio and such, and trying to secretly seeds songs into it that relate to the group.
So far I got
Werewolf
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMc8naeeSS8&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF&index=6
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOg5VxrRTi0&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF&index=14
Geist
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wjlj0TZ8wb8&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF&index=7
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClQcUyhoxTg&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF&index=3
Promethean
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IuwxZSIS__4&index=16&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZuW6BH_Vak&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF&index=4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2X_2IdybTV0&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF&index=2
Beast
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBwS66EBUcY&index=8&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF
Changelings
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeMFqkcPYcg&index=9&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJ7NVjZ-Eyg&index=12&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF
Hunter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O52jAYa4Pm8&index=17&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF
Vampire
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPudE8nDog0&index=15&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1b8AhIsSYQ&index=13&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-O3kYrDPbI&index=10&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF
Demon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3cShYbLkhBc&index=1&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBecM3CQVD8&index=18&list=PLTDYoQExHasevErtC7x61SDPa7hZytxpF
Any suggestions?

>>54715000
You can always expand on them in your game, it was more of a question about the individual games than canon setting.

Mandatory (Obrimos) Mage songs:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Oe7Q8OCm5I
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L53gjP-TtGE

>>54715138
Holy shit, the first one was awesome.

Kanye? Fuck off

>>54715061
Hecq is great for ambience in 'strange places'. I like it for Astral/Dream areas.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_eBGipALCc8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUX3dXdJCAg&list=RD_eBGipALCc8

Try Tzolk'in for anything vaguely tribal or threatening.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRebiHdtoBg

If you want to turn things slightly ridiculous,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e_TIOfUEudo

>>54715098
In that case, I often thought of the Aeon of Matter as the supreme craftsman. He is the one you're really thinking of when you imagine gods like Hephaestus, Regin and Lugh. His role is to balance change and stasis within the inventions of mankind. I imagine him as a grease stained cyborg working the years away in a massive factory inside a clockwork, flying island. A bit of a grouch a natural perfectionist, but very knowledgeable and willing to teach those who work hard.

>>54715000
They're detailed, just not thoroughly.
>>54714973
The Old Man. Partially because: Voormas! Partially because he honestly seems like he'd be an alright person to sit down with. I imagine there's a community of a few dreamwalkers who just sit around the fire all day and never enter the hut.

>>54715265
>Kanye? Fuck off
I fully understand, but even Dave acknowledged that it fits the theme.

>>54715352
>I imagine there's a community of a few dreamwalkers who just sit around the fire all day and never enter the hut.
Ouch! They probably won't stay sane for long anyway.

>>54715510
Eh. Call it a few 'lifers' who don't go crazy, while anyone new gets watched very carefully for a month or two to see if they go insane or not.

>>54715061
Mage:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1wt5_lO6rA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PL6jwxw9T3c

>>54715138
>>54715697
Pretty much the Hieromagus and Obrimos Path (many of the lyrics, duality of saidin and saidar and the image is basically the Watchtower of the Golden Key):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCLsqg05boo

Dragon Reborn indeed.

>>54715138
http://weebls-stuff.com/toons/magical-trevor-episode-01-animated-music-video-mrweebl/

>>54715061
Oh, and Vampire:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=582HLGSQBc4

>>54716433
Settle this argument on kinetic shielding please

>>54716433
>>54716658
Don't do it Dave, its much funnier that way.

>>54716433

Dave is there an Emanation Realm that's just full of beans this is vital to my campaign

>>54716658
What hasn't been settled?

So are there like a potentially infinite number of emanation realms? Just like there are a potentially infinite number of Supernal "realms"?

>>54718103
Neither of those statements are true

>>54718497
There actually are potentially an infinite number of Supernal Realms. Or rather, theoretically an infinite number. Just like theoretically it's all one Realm and the divisions come from how we perceive it. Page 19.

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"The reason I'm no longer allowed in the Chantry"

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>>54719953

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>>54719953

>>54719953
The anti-paradox pills I was selling to my fellow Chantry members were just Qualudes.

>>54711012
Fuck off with that.

>>54715851
Didn't it turn out that all the dragon talk was because the Tremere were just *really* prominent for their soul-knowledge? And not just 'which goes with which wine'?

>>54720710
Oh god. I can see it now. An entire network of nameless and apostates, hooked on qualudes by one clever/ruthless guardian.

Are there any movies that have the same feel as V:tM?

>>54721656
Twilight.

>>54721656
Underworld.

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>>54721689
>>54721690

>>54721656
A film called "what we do in the dark"

>>54721792
What we do in the shadows even

>>54721656
depends. What facet of VTM? Sabbat raids? Camarilla politicking? Sticking it up to the Man? Fighting foreigners into your territory? Wierd archeological shit?

lol
http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Conrad_Hubbard

>>54721832
>Poems of Pain
When the future folds into a thousand origami beasts
it bends my heart along with it
and the shadows of my soul reflect within their menagerie
and illuminate the movie screen of our lives
where some god watches us play out this drama
yet does nothing to relieve the pain
that consumes the set where our world is captured
and threatens to crush the love of many years.

Dude. What the fuck.

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High Satiety: The Collector must hunt for rare, very specific examples of his desire. He can’t settle for any blonde man as a lover; he needs a blonde virgin with a large birthmark on his ass, a soprano voice, a boyish stutter, and who would be outraged by the Beast’s seduction.

Dude what the fuck is wrong with Beast?

>>54722081
>Dude what the fuck is wrong with Beast?

A lot

>>54722081
Better question: What ISN'T wrong with Beast?
Lairs. That's about it.

>>54722962
I don't want to make my eyes bleed by reading Beast. Tell me about Lairs.

>>54723141
You have your very own Barbie's Dream House in the Astral Sea of the collective unconscious. All the rooms in the house are very spooky, so spooky that each room has its own specific environmental tilts associated with it. Whenever you're in a real world location that has a similar tilt, you can superimpose your Lair on top of it and now suddenly everyone but you is getting shit wrecked in a hellish dreamscape while you're soaking up Satiety. You can add rooms to your nightmare mansion to get more and more chances to Silent Hill people, and to make it more difficult for intruders to get to your dungeon heart and kill you.

>>54711894
>stronk womyn gunslingers

Triggered???

>>54721656
If you can find a copy, check out Near Dark. There would have been no V:tM and it's basically Sabbat: The Movie.

https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL71UW1R0KBMJ8-AMd1TY0LKDyPLOFEo9y

Also check out Only Lovers Left Alive AKA Clan Toreador: The Movie
https://youtu.be/pkeWhokaPPs

>>54723633
Evening, matey.

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>>54712082
>Which WoD books have the best artwork?

>Just kidding<

>>54715138
>Mandatory (Obrimos) Mage songs:

Obrimos Awakening

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JRfuAukYTKg&index=28&list=WL

>>54723141
>Tell me about Lairs

The section was written by DaveB.

It still wasn't nearly enough to save the abomination that is Beast.

However, check out Dave's short story in the Beast fiction anthology, "Premeditation." It's a crossover story among a Beast, Mage and Changing Breed and, unsurprisingly, the mage totally steals the show.

>>54716433

So, what Path is Trevor the Wizard?

>>54716658
>Settle this argument on kinetic shielding please

Heh. I expect Dave to answer that type of question shortly after the release of Mage 3: Return of Mage Supremacy

>>54716746
>ave is there an Emanation Realm that's just full of beans this is vital to my campaign

The Bean Realm is a Lower Depth.

It is truly horrible.

>>54723930
which arcana is it missing?

>>54723954
Mind.

>>54723761
A shit song from a shit DJ with a shit singer with a video that is somewhat relevant.

https://youtu.be/TKYALsp-sIg

Could an Archmage best a True Fae within Arcadia?

>>54724993
Two different arcadias. The archmage wins in his, the fae in theirs.

>>54725096
I don't think a Fae could be in the Archmage's Arcadia, could they? And at that point wouldn't he be an Ascended Mage?

>>54725109
Basically. It's not a question with a good answer, and there's a big old pile of bullshit in previous threads that arrived at that singular line of text I posted. It's not even a good line of text, but it's the best you'll get.

>>54725096
Supernal Arcadia isn't a place.

>>54725109
Archmage's don't view the Supernal through 'Arcadia'.
They're no longer connected to its respective Watchtower.

>>54725140
>Supernal Arcadia isn't a place.
The Fallen world is not a place. It's a Lie

Oh for fucks sakes, we all know what everyone else meant. Do we have to play semantics games?

>>54725109
Does someone have, like, a flow chart of Tokyo relations in 2e?

Here's what I've got: The Cuckold Syndicate are Hunters with at least one wizard in there, they've got fingers in vampire pies and they're bullying the local werewolves. Everyone else hates them. They stopped bothering with Hunting and decided that it'd be funny if they just became a knockoff Cheiron group instead.

The Werewolves are a bunch of neets, except instead of 'regular' neetdom they're all packless wonders who refuse to meet up except when the local firebrands hold them at social gunpoint. And there's one super pack spread over the country who hate each other so much they try not to be in the same city. Everyone else walks all over them, except the Strix who cheerfully teach them what they know in exchange for a bit of help with the local vampire populace, re, beating them into torpor.

The local pentacle wizards are basically a nice little polish democracy mixed with a touch of inter-order fascism, who do nothing while the Ansho swallow the city.

The Seers are all secretly responsible for J-POP and pushing the Yakuza. AND they interact with the non-cuckold vampire syndicate to help oppress the business and salariman culture at one remove, attacking from two angles.

What have I missed?

>>54725224
>What have I missed?
Changelings being J-POP. The Seers are their agents.

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>>54725177
>Serving the Lie by denying the mind space as a place.
Classic Seer propaganda

>>54725224
>The Cuckold Syndicate
The what ???

>>54725255
Damnit, we haven't played any changeling and so I don't have the books. Mega it is. Featured in the 2e core?
>>54725286
They're named after a cuckoo, and I can't spell the moon runes name for it.

>>54724993
If the Archmage is prepped, for sure.

>>54725170
Except you can walk around in the Fallen.

Not the Supernal.

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>>54725317
>walk
Is that what believe happens in the Lie? Or does your Consciousness desperately grasp upon things it believes are within 'eye sight'? And how is that any different than the great passage during awakening and upon waking?

So, in 2e, is the Abyss still widening and everyone is doomed? Or is that just a Guardian belief now?

>>54725686
It's stated as being true, but only under the Guardian's section. Make of that what you will.

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>>54710921
From a staffing standpoint, the first Mummy has a single writeher than real things so there's no way to tell what if anything they did to help out the project. Except the editor, who of course was one of the designers of Werewolf: the Apocalypse and is thanked for taking time off from that project to polish this turd edit the book. Mummy: 2nd Edition has two writers, a developer and an editor – so the primary staff is basically doubled. It also has only ten people to deliver incomprehensible joking special thanks to (but which still includes Robert Hatch, now acting as the developer and apparently “not killer” of one of the authors).

Mummy: the Resurrected isn't so much a book as a continuation of an institution. It credits fourteen people with “initial concept and design” (including the authors of the first two Mummy versions, one of our of the authors and additional writers are also credited with initial concept and design, and the three authors of previous books are apparently just in there because they copy pastaed some shit from the old books, but that's still sixteen fucking people working on this project.

What's surprising is that even though the original Mummy was basically an auteur's work, the third version was a clusterfuck of people talking and writing past one another, and the 2nd edition was just a small work team, that the works aren't that different. Yes, as more cooks got involved the word count increased tremendously (almost proportionately), but they remained incoherent in prething produced by a committee that needs four fucking cars to carpool might stay truer to “the design specs” or something. But I'm pretty sure you'd be wrong. I certainly can't detect any such tendencies in any of the three works. They all kind of read like a word salad of untested and unsourced game mechanics and world elements.

what would be a better way to recreate this in the current edition?

>>54725869
You walk away from it and realize that no one has given a shit about mummies for fifty years if we're being generous.

Seriously. I would have completely forgotten that mummies were a thing in both iterations of WoD if it wasn't for these threads.

>>54726419
They make an interesting splat, but you either need to stretch it over a long period or have a single intense campaign set in a few weeks at best, against the backdrop of some countdown. Otherwise they might well decide to wait it out.

>>54726694

Curse isn't a bad attempt at leaning into what makes Mummies different. The learning curve is steeper than other games and a lot of its systems should be made more elegant, but "you're the pulp horror monster with secrets not even you know about" is a direction worth a second try.

Other than Mages, can any other supernatural match a Werewolf in physical combat?

>>54726823
We've not run a nMummy game yet - we flit between WoD, Shadowrun and Alpha Omega - but a read through suggested it might be more suited to the 'events stretched over a long period' style of gameplay. It's a nice take on it. I mean, oMummies were superheroes. You had to go looking at the side splats to get any sort of ambiguity.

>>54726957
Promethean maybe

Beast for sure

>>54726957
Demons, Mummies and Geists.

Werewolfs are shit.

>>54726957
Warform demon, maybe a well built promethean. A really cleverly built vampire ancilla might, and an Elder built for combat is going to murder the face off of anything that isn't about as old.

Depends how old the werewolf is. They've got a lot of 'free and reflexive in kuruth' gifts that turn their melee attacks into something really nasty. An old enough one could curb stomp a full blown demon, but he'd have to be *old* - a demon who got themselves Burnt is pretty much the king high motherfucker of any physical altercation from here to forever.

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>>54727148
Bullshit here is an appropriately core end-game build for a Rahu that is a total blender. I dread to think how much Experience this would require, but it's still fairly 'bare-bones' as I haven't drawn on Fighting Styles or a lot of other Facets that can boost it further.
5s in various appropriate attributes and skills, the appropriate specialty with Area of Expertise, etc.
Glory 5 and Purity 5.
Full dots in Living Weapon, Favoured Form and Fortified Form.
The Berserker's Might and Slaughterer Facets from the Rage Gift.
The Primal Strength Facet from the Strength Gift.
The Shield-Breaker Facet from the Shaping Gift.
Add enough Primal Urge to actually be able to activate enough things as required.

This chap, in Gauru, has a base dice pool of 22 dice with 8-again, going to 25 with Willpower and 27 with All-Out Attack. He can roll the dice pool twice and choose the better result. On a hit, his claws deal 8L and have Armour Pierching 7, ignoring non-magical armour entirely. He has 19 Health levels, 10 Defence, Armour 2/2 and can reduce the damage from a single source per turn by 5 (or throw off a Tilt instead). If you're not his primary prey and are just in his way he's now got a base of 27 dice before WP and AOA. I'm probably missing some other easy sources of extra dice. Grappling him doesn't help because this is all natural weaponry & Brawl in the first place.

Then you get to active his final form with Crimson Spasm, and things get really stupid.

Add Honour for, ex, Crushing Blow and Honed Rage, or Cunning for Unchained, and so on and so forth, and it gets even worse. Werewolves aren't to be fucked with

>>54727129
Geists are still in 1e which is horribly imbalanced and broken and really shouldn't be brought up or used until 2e geist comes out

>>54727289
It could never happen in game, that's how much experience it would require.

>>54727289
Woof fag asks who is better at fighting.

gets told just about everybody


REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>54727289
So an old one with a pile of gifts, then?

>>54727289
Is that a claw attack, its all woofs do.

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>>54727298
Experience in 2e is so much better than 1e.

But it's still pretty fucking stupid.

>>54727289
>Werewolves aren't to be fucked with

Not unless you're a Mage, Demon or Mummy. :^)

>>54727333
Most mummies/demons even in war form is not beating that werewolf. Mummy just gets wreked and a demon war form won't be able to outlast Guaru regen

>>54727333
Original poster excluded Mages. Demons and Mummies should be treated similarly.

>>54727348
Fresh Mummy kills the Uratha, short and simple.
Loud Demon goes full DBZ, ain't no way around it


Mage... Let's not discuss Mage....

>>54727353
You haven't played any of these games obviously. Show me how an average loud demon can beat my werewolf build with our YOU just saying so. I want some math to back it up. "Full DBZ mode" doesn't cut it.

God Tier
>Archmage

Semi-God Tier
>True Fae
>Incarnate Beast

Overpowered Tier
>Prep Mage
>Loud Demon
>Fresh Mummy

Higher Tier
>Mage
>Demon
>Sin-Eater
>Mummy
>Werewolf
>Beast
>Changeling

Lower Tier
>Promethean
>Vampire
>Surprised Mage
>Prep Hunter
>Hunter

Its about now that werewolf fans go ape and shit the place up. They hate being told they are low tier shitlers.

>>54726957
Even a well build Vampire can do that. Claws of the Unholy and Coil of the Wyrm (Beast’s Power) are main ingredients to success.

>>54727396
>"You haven't played any of these games obviously"
Mhmm

>"average loud demon"
The irony of your accusation is just enriched with inadequacy.

>>54727396
Anon you asked a question and you got told the answer which you didnt like so you made some pretty bullshit max exp werewolf and then expect others to take it on in white room shit? denouncing everybody else as not knowing what the fuck they are talking about.

Hilarious.

>>54727434
We might as well throw out some bull shit max exp Demon at it. Mage/Mummy even.

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>>54727422
>>54727434
So I just supposed to take your word for It? Nice debate skills have a (You)

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>>54727450
I do love me some morning bias.

>>54727289

This is bait.

>>54727450
Go through the mega, find the demon book. Just glance over the 'loud' part of a demon.
>>54727467
It's wodg. Everything is bait.

>>54727467
>Posts a legit if exp heavy build that would shit on any splat that isn't built on fucking over kinetic damage buy still gets called bait
>Everyone just says I am wrong without any real arguments or facts to back up

This thread is fucking garbage

>>54727508
Okay. A demon going loud gets a power stat of 10, a full powerpool, every exploit and embed they're eligible for by type and a pile of special 'fuck you' abilities. This is why people are saying your max-exp werewolf is probably going to die. Demon abilities tend to be a bit nastier than standard werewolf abilities too.

>>54727508
Not that it isn't garbage. It's just that we're tired of evangelical anons like you.

We've had so many "demons beats this, mummy beats that. mage craps on them all!" arguments that we're getting exhausted of exemplifying what we already know as a consensus.

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Beasts are strong as fuck and completely underrated. I've discovered a combination of starting powers at mid-level ability that could utterly break a game. So a beast with the atavisms Cyclopen Strength and Looming Presence, spending a point of satiety on the Presence, and with a Lair rating of 5, can bench an object of size 90. Size of Beast becomes 5+(2Lair) with Presence, and Strength allows him to deadlift size(Lair+1), so 15*6=90 a size 90 object is statue of liberty size

>>54727536
Yes, beasts are stupid, we know.

>>54727508
By asking the question you obviously dont know what a Demon or Mummy is capable off. Yet you screech like a fucking banshee and demand people take the time to build a character ignoring xp costs just to shut you the fuck up?

hahahahahaha

>>54727536
Beasts are only good in gyms then? Bench pressing uber weights only impresses gymfags

>>54727549
I admit I don't know what a mummy can do but I do know what a loud demon can. Loud form won't be able to deal enough damage to kill my werewolf before lvl 5 hunter angels come and kill the demon

>>54727563
Keep talking shit but your dumb splat won't like it when I casually drop a building on top of them

>>54727566
>he thinks dishing out damage is a priority when dealing with werewolves

>>54727566
SO you admit to kill a loud demon requires a rank 5 angel AND a werewolf?

Okay, I'm going to peg werewolf and beast guy as the same bloke here.

>>54727572
I think my mage is pretty safe. I'll take that bet.

>>54727575
Actually, given what he said, it takes a werewolf, and SEVERAL Rank 5 Angels.

>>54727572
Keep talking shit and your beast will end up on the fucking moon with a dildo up its ass.

>>54727400

Switch Werewolf and Beast

>>54727400
Surprised Mage should be above Vampire. Mage Armor is a reflexive Attainment, you know, and being surprised doesn't mean not being prepared for a fight, just not prepared for that specific threat. They could still have a day long Shielding spell, or hung spells, or imbued items and artifacts, etc.

>>54727598
Without much effort a beast can shit out aggravated damage and some of their nightmares are flat out broken such as Behold My True Form, You Brought This Upon Yourself

>>54727563
>Beasts are only good in gyms then? Bench pressing uber weights only impresses gymfags

>Obviously needs to learn a Lesson about roid rage

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>>54727448
>We might as well throw out some bull shit max exp Demon at it. Mage/Mummy even.

>Hypothetical "max experience" mage...

> > > shudder < < <

> > > cry < < <

> 'Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds'

>Pop-Tart Supremacy!
.

>>54727566
Just Bruised = lol what damage
Knockout punch = lol KO'd 1 punch in.
Murder by improbability = +10 weapon damage, possible -10 defense
Swarm = 10 bashing/turn
Swift resolution = I win the roll, i win the fight fuck face.

Afew of the things your fucking furry pup has to worry about...

Just 2 things your Woof should worry about..

>>54728390
#i found more than 2 and i just skimmed demon

>>54728390
>>54728423
CLASH OF WILLS dumbass also Wolves hunt in packs

>>54728913
woah there fucknit, there was no mention of packs involved.

Those wont clash as there is nothing directly opposing them asshole, Do werewolfs have a "i cant be knocked out" power to clash with Knock out punch? NOPE

How do you clash vs a swarm?

Go fuck yourself puppy.

>>54728913
Clash of Wills only happens when two powers oppose each other. Also to the extent of my knowledge, all the splats have groups that they work together in. Motleys, Cabals, Coteries, Cells, Krews, etc.

I get the distinct feeling Werewolf players have no idea how clash of wills actually work.

They have been correct exactly 0 times whenever they mention it.

>>54729045
Are woof players the new leech players?

>>54729045
I get the distinct feeling it's just the two trolls again.

>>54725869
Mummy: The Resurrection also had this weird tie to the Middle East, which really limited how well you could use them (plus the usual virtue signaling about Islam and muslim mummies were a real turn-off)

>>54729224
You really think that it's just two trolls?

>>54729224
>trolls
Changeling a shit.Does 2ed fix them?

>>54729584
its not even out yet but looks unlikely.

>>54710978
Deviant and Demon

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>>54727536
>demon
Going loud is a trapoption. The more power you use the more likely the ST get tofuck you with bullshit GM Angels. yeah you can be god for like a minute and then the reality popo comes in and takes your character away. Loud is the suicide jihad option

>pic the robot popo coming to get you

>>54729763
Don't ever reply to me again

>>54729501
There's two who always type the same way. Maybe more, but two primary.

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>>54730014
And I just bet you are a paragon of righteousness that never shitposts right?

>>54730071

Absolutely. Would you like to talk about the social ramifications and sweeping changes WW will engender with their trans-positive agenda?

>>54727289
>needing all this experience to deal some damage
>not just playing as the world's most min-maxed bloodbather, without spending any experience at all
I mean, this assumes your ST is completely retarded and lets you get away with anything, but the whole "who would win" thing is dumb to begin with.

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>>54729899
Your robotaphobia is showing. The drones are coming for you

>>54730101
What are you even trying to say?

>>54730201
Primarily I'm trying to write.

>>54730214
Careful that level of intellect turns people off on 4chan. Better to slam your keyboard in order to attempt guttural expletives

My favourite splat can beat up your favourite splat.

>>54712152
There's badass heroines and then there's Tumblr self-inserts, anon.

>>54730409
That very well may be true and I respect the differences between the splats enough to recognize that this is not an issue.

>>54730537
It is when your favorite splat is beast which is the crossover splat and you are weaker than every other splat bar Vampire and changeling

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>>54730571
>thread calming down?

>>54730669
Fuck off you can't deny that Beasts are mechanically weak. Thematically they are great and really fit into the WoD well what with them being the ancestor for most of the other splat

http://aggrogamer.com/article/5841/E3-2017-Interview--Werewolf-The-Apocalypse

what do you think, /wodg?

>>54712152
bad ass heroines, yes. Not strong, independent genderqueer womyn of color who majored in Gender Studies

>>54730571
But Beast isn't my favorite splat
My favorite splat is Demon

>>54730954
Look, this is extremely powerful trolling, but there's no art to this, you understand? It's too straightforward.

>>54731080
>Black bull lesbians scare me
Maybe turn off the porn? You're confusing your argument a bit

>>54730409
But do they know why kids love Cinnamon Toast Crunch?

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>>54731150
Maybe read the response to someone claiming the same thing as you?

>>54731549
It is a supernal Truth

>>54731549
>But do they know why kids love Cinnamon Toast Crunch?

That is indeed a powerful Mysteries

God help anyone stands between me and the solution.

>>54731901
Seal it as a one dot earthly omen. The cereal gives children magic powers in the mind arcanum - it makes them spread the glory of the cereal without even knowing it.

Speaking of Mage stuff...
Anyone have a 2e write up for
Devourers of the Flesh?

Would the Doctor from Doctor Who work better as a True Fae, an Archmage or an Unchained Demon?

>>54732500
Probably a Demon.

Does anyone have a link to the Mage 2e developer diaries?

>>54732500
True Fae
All those "Companions" come out of their journeys Changed by them. None ever goes back to just their boring old life. I think it's safe to assume he's turned them into Changelings.

>>54732500
Lawnchair

>>54732500
Demon, no doubt

>>54732693
>Mage 2e developer diaries

Links to each Open Development blog post are part of a sticky thread on OPP's Awakening forum.

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/mage-the-awakening/437565-second-edition-development-blogs

>>54732780
Thanks. I'm afraid of the OPP.

>>54731671
Dude no one wants to hear about you fucking a bull. get your bestiality back to /d

>>54732808
see
>>54731124

>>54732821
No one cares about Changing Breeds stop bringing it up. It was a shit book by a shit writer

>>54732854
You need to try something that isn't obviously trolling. Something that inspires discussion, preferably something that'll lead to a shitfight about ten posts in rather than immediately. Just 'lol u fuck dogs' to the post isn't going to piss him off.

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Beast the Primordial was a complete failure! You have been hired to fix 2e. How do you do it? What writers do you hire? The fate of an entire splat is in your hands.

>>54733013
I would probably just let it die. To me it doesn't really offer anything unique or cool enough conceptually to justify taking the time and resources to fix. Ideally I would divert them towards books for the actually good splats, if I couldn't do that I would take ideas for a new splat, and if I absolutely had to work on Beast I would kick Matt and his wife from the project and just hope for the best.

>>54733013
Make Heroes more ambigious instead of republican caricatures

>>54731150
how can they be bulls if they are lesbians?

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>>54733423
Omg, Shut up about the Changing Breeds Beast Cross over. Catfolk are shit

>>54733013
>You have been hired to fix 2e. How do you do it?

Euthanasia is a mercy.

Haven't you seen Old Yeller?

>>54733546

While I totally agree that Changing Breeds is vile excrement, DaveB actually managed to write a viable Mage, Beast and Changing Breed crossover in his short story, "Premeditation," in the Beast fiction anthology.

>>54733691
You mean the story wear the Mage steals all the spot light and focus and leaves the other characters to be shitty supporters?

>>54733832

>Literary Supremacy!

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After reading these threads and watching the never ending dick-measuring contest, I cannot wait until paradox pulls the chronicles of darkness license from OPP.

Don't worry. Maybe you'll get your own 20th anniversary edition.

Maybe.

In cWoD, how much progress have (non-supernatural) human/sleepers achieved on their own? Without direct supernalturals' intervention.

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>>54734153
Hahaha and maybe Paradox will release a good game for once.

Oh god these threads are terrible

Any info on 2e geist?

>>54734539
Not coming into after the new bright eras supplements

>>54734003
The otherkin committee will not tolerate this!

So as someone who liked both oWoD and nWoD for different reasons, is there any reason I should step up to CofD or 2e for the core and splats? I have 1e for everything up to Geist, and nWoD 1e.

What is different enough in CofD to justify either upgrading or ignoring?

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>>54734246
That day's coming. They won't put up with their business practices and slipshod production longer than they have to. I also very much doubt that they'll want to self-compete.

But Think about it. You'd be at your absolute best. Everyone giving their favorite game line a send off, telling tabletop war stories. Wouldn't that be so much better?

>>54735133
There isn't a single 2e splat that is worst than their 1e counterpart

>>54735247
Changelings

>>54735326
2e isn't out yet dumbass

>>54735346
Its pretty clear its fucked if you've been following anything about it you fucking retard.

>>54735372
No it isn't you piss-chugger

>>54735180
Classic is shit the only people that have fond memories are of the people. The system was buggy and the modules overbearing fuckery. The villains were either Saturday morning tier dumb, or degenerate rapist freaks.

Classic was not missed and 20series were a memorial to the foolishness of the 90s era.

>oldfags will fight this

>>54735457
Its just a random hodge podge of effects with no cohesive vision turd-burgler. Under Rose's direction it lacks a cohesive vision and is a downgrade from 1e.

>>54736027
How in the ever fucking hell, can you tell that without a cohesive look at the content. All we have is a random spattering of content that has no clear beginning and no clear end. It's worse than spaghetti logic because that at least has beginning and end points. What we have is random chunks of middle with no beginning or end.

>>54733013
>Ive been thinking about this way to much.
>Ive been thinking about writing a fan fix for this stupid splat
To fix beast narratively you need to understand how to make an asshole sympathetic.

Doing wrong things for a greater good or for reasonable reasons can make people sympathetic. Also antagonists, you know, real ones help.

Like, take beasts causing emotional damage to feed. What if instead you made beasts instead of coping vampire and changeling's thing you made them do something original? Like, theres the hive, the big nest for monsters were the beasts lairs are, right? Well what if the beast's horrors were predators in said hive and the reason they cause all the fear and trauma is because it allows their horror to leave the lair.?

Suddenly, beasts have nuance, they cause fear and hurt people to summon forth their horror, not just by sitting in the corner eating chips. They can pick their hunting grounds, their powers can be gated based on the environment, they can spare people and places they care about and a whole new world of opportunities opens based on a small change.

Now throw in an antagonist. Something that escaped the hive already and is making a ghost story, like a rival horror. Give it some cool themes like how it could be a ghost story monster growing in stability until it can leave the story and be real, or it could be like a claimed version of a beast that can spread like a plague.

Suddenly beasts have a foe and therefore a cause, both SOMETHING TO DO and something for people to latch onto.

Throw in Inheritance, make it a tangible thing you can move to like New Dawn or Arc mastery and suddenly you have an end game.

Its honestly easier to fix beasts narratively then mechanically.

>>54736127
wow I need to work on my punctuation. I can barely read this.

>>54724993
Aren't the True Fae effectively omnipotent within Arcadia? Wouldn't the Archmage be fucked?

>>54736200
>Aren't the True Fae effectively omnipotent within Arcadia
Not really, they are super stuck in their stories pretty much no matter what. It leaves them very 'limited' despite the immense power.

>>54736200
Kinda. Kinda not. They're only as 'omnipotent' as their story related purviews.

>>54732500
Demon.
Though personally I like to think of him as being best represented as a God-Machine experiment.

A cryptid, that it pulls out of temporal storage every now and then to 'solve' certain problems that require a lighter, more 'benevolent' seeming touch.

>>54736200
Gentry have imperial magic. they can cast supernal magic better than archmages can

>>54736127
You can't get rid of heroes though. That idea is good but Matt shit the bed with their execution. Honestly the only thing that beast needs to be good is make beasts the unapologetic monsters they are and make heroes the actual good guys.

>>54736150
That said...Isn't some of that already in there?
The Antagonist "The Hero" who is in just about every way actually worse than the beast. They come in to save people but afterwords, the eat, drink, and rape everyone in sight. They steel the children, and in general leave the people eager to have the monster back.

Beast I think would be better helped by giving them a place in the ecology of the night. The writers were on the right track I think, the beasts are the truest form of the monsters from Grimm's tales. The Wolf that Raped the Girl in the Red hood, the destroyer of innocence, He did it to teach little girls everywhere not to talk to strangers. I think what would have helped the beast more is if they played up being the moral of the story. Not just the feed on trauma, ignore that, feed from the mind words you plant in people's minds. Feed on your legend as it grows, and then as your lair expands and you lesson grows broader feast upon the lessons not just of the girl in the hood that you keep teaching over and over again till little girls finally get it right, but...also the three brothers. The two lazy brothers who built homes of ease and sloth. The Third though touch him not for his home is one of safety.

Play up that doing it for people's benefit, being the one who culls the herd of humanity. That I think would have worked just as well.

>>54736336
>Gentry have imperial magic

No, they fucking don't.

>>54736406
YES THEY FUCKING DO READ THE GOD DAMN BOOK

>>54736336
You're a fucking moron, no they don't.
Even in Imperial Practices, they were casually referred to as the "Old Gods of the Thorn", however even there it was mentioned they were no longer a part of the Supernal, if they had ever been.

>>54736475
6+ Influences can emulate Imperial Magic, but they're not actually of the same source.

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Tokyo Ghoul is a better beast story than actual beast prove me wrong. Ghouls are beasts but better and the CCG are heroes done right.

>>54736597
It really doesn't have anything substantial in common with Beast, though.

>>54736380
The key word is Antagonists with a little s at the back.

Ever wonder why vampire got those silly little owls? Because facing the same thing every time, even if well crafted, can get a tiny bit stale. Heck most splats are getting a new antagonist because facing 'powerful spirit teamed up with pure' event number 17 and facing an idigam are two very different encounters.

In my opinion, Heroes need to be allowed to start off heroic, and be an inspiration to not only the people around them, but the creatures they fight. Let them make the world a better place, and be single minded in their efforts to do this(like give them an obsession that works like an addiction, it gives them shit so they want it, but if they relent they go through a withdrawal that makes them want to go back to doing the hero thing). Let them be a light in the darkness that attracts people like moths to the flame.

But as this is 'world of darkness' and not 'world of supermen who always save the world and no one dies the end' they run into shit they can't handle. How can a normal man, even one with some magic gear and superhuman willpower deal with a mad one? A pack of pure sacrificing towns to a plague spirit? A war angel of the god machine? Being a hero might help them survive but sometimes you don't want to survive that shit.

They wear down, they make sacrifices and become more and more monstrous, inside and out, as they do so. But unlike beast as it is now you can TURN THEM BACK into heroes, they can be reasonable people and they can and should have NUANCE. They should be more then just superman or 'oh look im like you but human and MOAR EVIL' they could be so much more.

Just my opinion though. Grain of salt and all that.

>>54736791
Monsters prey on humanity and heroes hunt them. Seems pretty spot on to me.

>>54736858
Could also be Vampire, or any other kind of monster story where hunters are antagonists.

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>>54736802
Someone say OWLTIME?

>>54736802
Oh I thought you were axing the idea of heroes. I agree adding new enemies is a good idea.

>>54735887
Context. Please. Back in the day, Storyteller was considered a rules-lite system. RPG design has changed a lot in 25 years and we've come a long way but assessments like that are useless unless placed properly in time. Systems can be updated and wonk can be retconned.

And this changes the fact after the V:tR core book, the nWoD/CofD became a niche game that can only compete with one that they're trying to give a AAA relaunch... how exactly?

>>54737692
Because CofD sucks just as bad as WoD. I only come here because I like the lore and too shitpost

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I just had the most insane argument with Zak Smith about why the butthurt nerd rage of upset existing fans was a bad thing, why death threats were a bad thing, and why that Exalted fan shitting on a WW desk in Stone Mountain couldn't be chalked up as a "financial issue", all because I suggested WW try and provide products the fanbase were actually interested in.

He is a pedantic, argumentative, reductionist little cunt with all the signs of extensive Aspergers. He was also oddly cool about the prospect of White Wolf failing and going bankrupt, stating that TSR's dissolution hadn't affected D&D 2e players, adding "ebay is a thing, you know".

Mage 20th, the Exalted Developer Fiasco, David Hill quitting over Zak S being hired, the release timetable tanking because the Layout team for every single line is one guy, and now Zak Scrotum utterly indifferent to the death of the franchise...

Does anyone else get the impression that the wheels are falling off for OPP and WW?

>>54737784
Enjoy Mage: the Awakening 20th anniversary edition

>>54737798
>Does anyone else get the impression that the wheels are falling off for OPP and WW?
No because plenty of people outside of the webforums far outnumber anyone on them, allowing both companies to keep making money. The Zak Smith think with whitewolf and/or david hill is too complex with no real compelling evidence to the average consumer. LIterally nothing that they've 'fucked up' will actually end up mattering in the long run because the US isn't their target audience anymore for tabletops.

>>54737798
WoD has been dead a long while now, we can only hope it doesn't drag CofD down with it in its death spasms.

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>>54737692
>4 versions of the same rules and setting
>They're all shit
You really think they're going to get it right the 5th time around? When are you going to stop defending your abuser Anon?

>>54737947
They'll make bank monetizing fan content.

>>54737798
Zak seems to be clinging to it as well because he claims he was at GenCon, repping the franchise but no one can recall him being there.

>>54737909
You seem awfully hostile to a game line that your preferred one wouldn't exist without.
See >>54734153 and >>54735180 as well as >>54737692

>>54737897
Zak acted like he didn't care whether NuWW went bankrupt or not. That doesn't strike you as odd?

And yes, all this intrigue with D. Hill and everyone else Zak has fucked over might not have any bearing on sales, but declining quality might, and reviews of the V5 intro module outside of OPP echo chambers are... critical, is a kind way to put it. "People fucking hate it" is more accurate, even if it is more coarse.

>>54737798
>Zak Smith
Yeah he's a little shit with inflated self importance. Any screenshots?

>>54737983
Hes not an investor in the company, why would the success of the company matter to him? All it means is he gets his writing pay check from someone else. He has nothing to lose, so why would he care?

>>54737947
>He thinks DSotBH and the Samuel Haight affair are all that there is in the line.

My sides.

>>54737983
>>54738007
Additional note. RPG writers typically don't get royalties as far as I know. Unless his contract has a bonus for sales numbers, shitting on the company has no negative impact on yourself.

>>54737983
Isn't that the one where fuck stupid anarchs plow a truck into Elysium while the new Inquisition is in the city and the werewolves are on action fuck fang duty?

>>54738015
Ravnos was shit too.
Technocrats was a confused mess
the wolfs fuck up their own chance at redemption at the drop of the hat

>>54738007
OPP is obsessed with it's writers being "ambassadors of the game at all times", even if they're only subcontractors. Even if NuWW doesn't have that policy, the success of NuWW potentially means more writing jobs for Zak S on account of nepotism, which means more cash.

His other jobs are mediocre porn star and bland / uninspired graphic artist. The first involves a lot of work, and he acts like it's a chore in his vids. The second... jesus, look at his fucking art and tell me that's going to pay rent in NYC. There is literally better art in OWOD books, including Lief Jones. I said it.

https://fineartamerica.com/profiles/zak-smith.html

>>54738099
But he was already known before NuWW. Missing out on a resume slot isn't really going to cost him job offers, they're probably still coming in just fine. There's a reason that he was hired on at nuWW to begin with. Its not his talent at writing but his reputation is far better than his actual skill and will continue to carry him forward regardless if nuWW folds, which will be easily excused by any number of factors that aren't his fault (he seems good at shunting blame).

>>54738043
Yes, and the government KNOWS about kindred because none of the kindred ever heard of encrypted apps! The Tremere are a Noddist cult! Cain (dropped the 'e') isn't the first vampire, it was actually God the whole time! Vampires are now subject to random compulsions designed to disrupt sessions and derail the players!

But whatever you do, don't call that one vampire who sucks on children a pedophile! She's a child murderer, and that's so much better from Ericsson's moral stand point!

>>54738033
>shitting on the company has no negative impact on yourself.

You don't think it would harm future employment prospects?

I took his behaviour to indicate he didn't have any....

>>54738099
>OPP is obsessed with it's writers being "ambassadors of the game at all times", even if they're only subcontractors
Well yeah, that's just good marketing. You don't want to buy stuff from jackasses. the product is as much the writer as the rules and setting. It's their rep. Consider the cases of Hill and DaveB. 4chan has strong views about both of these writers

>>54738154
He also has all the personality of a creepy guy that won't leave you alone on public transport.

By "job offers", I meant jobs writing for NuWW.

>>54738091
>Ravnos
Agreed. At least we don't have beast.

>Technocrats.
A slow evolution, from pure antagonists to alternate protagonists.

>wolfs
Like Achilles? Do you even Iliad, bro?

>>54738091
Every WW / OPP book I ever bought needed some paint before assembly, pal. Didn't you ever hand-wave your way through a badly written ruleset?

>>54738204
Swedracula pretty much seems to have given him a pass to do whatever, probably because just like most RPG writers, hes not a real employee, and controlling contractors lives outside of work is fucking disgusting behavior.

>>54738159
>typical fa/tg/uy hyperbole: The Post!

>>54738237
Sure sounds like nuWW's direction.

>>54738237
>thinks I'm making it up

hahaha, retard.

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>>54738205
>Technocrats.
A slow evolution, from pure antagonists to alternate protagonists.
Don't tell phil that. He still believes in magic circles and pizza being the devil

>>wolfs
>Like Achilles? Do you even Iliad, bro?
noone plays it that way. they play it like furry yiffing pic related. Half the game is breeding. BREEDING. As in wolf fucking. Degenerates

>>54738272

>>54738222
The fact that it has to be hand waved proves it is bad.

>>54738274
Join the Technocracy.
Eat Thai Takeaway.
Fast, efficient, enjoyable.

>>54734236
Depends, in the very first editions, humanity was merely a pawn in it's own history (the trouble in Ireland were mostly perpetuated by rival Fianna clans, Rasputin was not human, much of the European middle age was outright ruled by vampires etc....) But in later editions, White Wolf realised this was retarded and mildly racist. The only exception to this would be the Punic wars (Carthaginian vampires trying to recreate Enoch) and the disappearance of the Roanoke Colony (the Eater of Souls killed everybody). There are still a handful of historical people who were revealed to be supernatural. But for Vampire at least, this happens after they die. (Heinrich Himmler became a Tremere Antitribu)

>>54738274
Umm what does Phil have to do with anything?

That was the evolution of their character arc From first edition to revised.

As for Apocalypse? No. Just no. Certainly that was touched upon because they were losing population due to attrition but only slightly more than other game lines. Additionally, if the fur fags picked it up and used it for those purposes, well that wasn't the intent of the devs.

And last I checked, there were no pregnant male werewolves in Apocalypse.

>>54736127
To fix beast, you have to rewrite it from the ground up. The tumblrina/left wing virtue signalling garbage revenge fantasy has to be thrown out completely, and an entirely new basis for the whole fucking core written. Period. Purge it with fire.

>>54736380
No, it's a mediocre idea. It really is.

>>54737983
There was "intrigue" Dave Hill? I thought the little faggot had a hissy fit and quit, tried to stage a drama with his fan base presenting it as a persecution story, and no one took him seriously. Is there any evidence whatsoever to the contrary? I mean Hill's history speaks for itself, the man has so little credibility he came off looking like the unprofessional one in a dispute with a tool who calls himself Zak Sabbath.

>>54738015
Montreal, how can anyone ever forget that fact based work of art. Much less its art.

>>54734153
I'm not a hundred percent sure anyone would notice.

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>>54737798
>shitting on a desk

Please tell me you've got some proof, or a link. Something. Anything, I want this to be true so much.

>>54734153
Why would paradox pull a free money train for themselves?

>>54739080
Explain I'll wait

>>54739850
Seems no one feels its worth the breath to defend. Perhaps he's right.

>>54740221
No he is a retarded mouth breathing sheep that can't form his own opinions. He just goes with the consensus and that's why he refuses to formulate an argument because he has none

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>>54740712
>people won't take the bait!

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>>54740712
put up, or shut up.

What's so good about heroes that justifies not scrapping them along with so much of the rest of the terrible drek, save perhaps the lairs idea, from that piss poor splat.

>>54741339
All right I'll humor your shitposting ass. Heroes are humanities antibodies. Their purpose is too protect humanity from the nightmarish beasts that hunt them. Their belief and confidence is so strong they can actually give a weakness to the beast that they can exploit. Heroes are Humanity Fuck Yeah at it's best.

>>54741590
Sound like Hunters. Already have them.