/osrg/ Old School Revival In Particular

>>54708705
>What OSR system has the best stats for dragons?
It's not a system, but I always thought that this was an interesting take on dragon battles: http://www.latorra.org/2012/05/15/a-16-hp-dragon/
I wonder if it would be good in practice though.

>>54708705
>What OSR system has the best stats for dragons?
2e. Dragons need to be mighty and scary.

>>54708705
OD&D. As with coins, gold is the only metal. Also, they don't roll for breath damage.

sell me on Dungeon Crawl Classics, esteemed analons

>>54709900
Lethal as hell, takes some of the better functioning bits from 3.x, and all classes are awesome.

>>54709900
Its screwier light-weight d20 system. Few here like it.

If you're a WotC refugee who likes GRIT and NEEDLESS LETHALITY, it's for you.

>>54709959
>If you're a WotC refugee who likes GRIT and NEEDLESS LETHALITY, it's for you.

I might be. Different recommendations if not?

>>54709900
It's a mix between OD&D and 3e that operates purely on the rule of cool with a blatant disregard for balance.

>>54710121
ADVANCED DUNGEONS AND DRAGONS (the one in all caps)
Astonishing Swordsmen and Sorcerers of Hyberborea
Wolf-packs and Winter Snow

>>54708705
>What OSR system has the best stats for dragons?
OD&D, personally. It's the combination of there only being six types, the five chromatic being of uncertain Neutral/Chaotic alignment, AC being capped at 2, and dragon breath being based on MAXIMUM hit points.
I can see the appeal of Basic's "damage equal to CURRENT hit points" thing, but I prefer the OD&D one. Makes them more dangerous.

Also, no Claw/Claw/Bite routine. That's a plus.

>>54709711
OD&D has silver and copper coins, anon. Treasure Type C even gives everything BUT gold coins! Trash coins are important so you have to decide whether they're worth the weight, y'know.

And electrum and platinum are mentioned as an option, I guess, but aren't in any treasure tables so who gives a fuck.

How do you justify negative levels as game design?

>>54711015
It's a temporary setback.
It's also a blunt way of saying "barreling through this door will end badly", even to high level characters.

>>54711015
Against low-level characters, negative levels are mostly just equal to normal hits.

Against high-level characters, negative levels are terrifying but also less at the same time less terrifying than, say, poison or other instant death effects.

But yeah, what >>54711031 said except add in some stuff about geometric XP progression and a contrast with death starting you over from level 1.

Also, well, the whole thing where levels don't really give you as much as magic treasure does. Fuck, a +2 sword makes you hit better than a dude three levels higher than you. Five levels, in some cases. The damage probably still puts you above the guy six levels higher than you, I think, and definitely so for the +3 sword.

>>54711577
>negative levels are terrifying but also less at the same time less terrifying than, say, poison or other instant death effects
Apart from not allowing a saving throw?

>>54711702
The hit still needs to land
Your AC can get pretty spooky

>>54711702
Well, yeah, but negative levels at best cripple you temporarily while a single bad roll against a weak poisonous critter can instantly kill a 130th-level Fighter.

This is especially true in OD&D, where SUCCEEDING on the saving throw vs. poison still has it do half damage. Poison OP, pls nerf. (they nerfed it)

>>54711825
Yeah, but the level 130 fighter can just be brought back with a Raise Dead, which is a fifth level spell and doesn't harm the caster any. Restoration is a seventh level spell and ages the caster by several years. Barring Restoration, the only thing you can do is find ten other dungeons of your level to grind yourself back up on the level you were.

Literally dying is easier to manage than losing a level.

>>54711873
>Barring Restoration, the only thing you can do is find ten other dungeons of your level to grind yourself back up on the level you were.
Barring Raise Dead, the only thing you can do is rot.
>Literally dying is easier to manage than losing a level.
Losing a level is literally managed by normal play.

>>54711933
You're missing the point.

Death is fixed by a fifth level spell, with very little risk or drawback. Losing a level can be fixed either by a risky seventh level spell with a huge cost, or by many sessions and dungeon crawls.

Level loss is like taking away shit you already did and running off, and you'll never see it again unless you find some powerful cleric willing to shave years off his life for your benefit. It's way worse than just dying.

>>54712041
Levels don't actually matter much in OSR, though. That's the thing - much of character power is invested in magical items, wealth and hirelings: things that are entirely independent of level.

Also, again, if you die the standard thing is to restart as a FIRST-LEVEL CHARACTER. After Raise Dead this changes a bit, yes - but Raise Dead was designed with limitations in mind, like "you need to make a survival check for it to succeed or be forever unraisable" and "can't be raised more times than your CON score". (These were removed from Basic, true, but personally I'm not too fond of that. The game was originally designed with Raise Dead being risky, in any case.)

And then there's the whole thing with geometric progression: if you lose enough levels to knock you down to level 1, you'll be back at name level before the rest of the party has gained a single level.
Because level progression at name level is slow as fuck.

Also, well, you know how name-level Clerics BTFO any energy drainer who even looks at them? And how said energy drainers usually require actually hitting the enemy? Yeah.

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>>54712041
>taking away shit you already did and running off, and you'll never see it again
God forbid you meet a rust monster, or you'll never hold a sword again!

>>54711015
It can make 8th level characters run screaming from a ghost like Scooby and Shaggy.

That's about it. But nothing else quite does that, especially with easily available Raise Dead spells. Fear effects just mean the GM is controlling your character for a while. Level loss scares *players*.

It means they need a cleric who can turn undead, or some magic to go toe to toe. Otherwise, the ghost appearing means it's time to fuckin run.

If you wanted to soften it a little, you could have levels return after a period of convalescence. Sort of like in LotR, where characters touched by a wraith have to rest for weeks, and are never quite the same.

>>54712041
I've hated raise dead for a long time. It's not just that it lowers the stakes... it's that it makes so many events sort of ridiculous. Why are there assassins in a game where anyone with the means or connections can get raised?

I know there's a lot of necessary suspension of disbelief, but that's sort of where I draw the line.

Then again, I don't do insta-death poison either... nothing more dull than saying "Uhhh you feel a pin prick your finger through the keyhole, and you're dead". Instead, I have deadly poison do damage over a course of hours, and you either need an antidote or enough magical healing to keep you from succumbing.

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>>54712041
I thought >>54711015 wanted to discuss nechanics?
Why are you only going as far as
>it rubs me the wrong way
?

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>>54712041
>It's way worse than just dying.
You have a significant % chance of staying dead forever.
If you pass, you eat into a finite number of deaths.

You can relevel as many times as you'd like.

>>54712614
>You can relevel as many times as you'd like.
Also, you'd be doing that anyway and since you keep magic items and wealth and whatnot you would end up more powerful at the end of the releveling than before you ran into the Wraith or whateverthefuck.

Also, most XP coming from GP means that levels are mostly just an emergency fallback for the situations where you're stuck in a fight - and even then the odds are in your favor for escaping. You can totally go for the higher-level loot on the lower floors of the megadungeon as a lower-level character, you just need to be skittish about it.

>>54712614
>You can relevel as many times as you'd like.
There are only so many dungeons and big monsters in the world to do it.

>>54712853
>levels are mostly just an emergency fallback for the situations where you're stuck in a fight
Yeah? What about higher level spells then? What about better saving throws? It's not just hit points and shit.

If you think levels don't matter at all, why not just ditch experience points altogether and stick to level 1 forever?

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>>54711015
I prefer a mix of 3e's "negative levels" with a "save or ACTUALLY lose a level" mechanic in the vein of TSR D&D.

>>54712890
>There are only so many dungeons
That's bullshit and you know that's bullshit.

>>54712976
In other words, nothing the characters do in the game matter? There'll be infinite bad guys to beat and their plots to thwart, and infinite treasure to bring back from the depths to fuck up the economy with?

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>>54712853
Monsters give experience. Most of the treasure is for experience. Experience is the very word for growth, improvement, and great memories. It gets you mightier spells, better skills, castles and retainers, fame and renown. It's the main reward for most adventures: swords and other magical treasure are just there to help out.

Just having it all torn away without a warning or a saving throw is the worst punch in the gut. Getting told that it's not a big deal, that you should just go back to get some more, is moronic. Being said it's somehow *less* important than the +2 sword you picked up from the tomb floor is asinine: it's like saying the super suit is what makes Iron Man what he is, rather than the life experience and knowledge and knowing how to build that shit.

I fucking hate energy drain. There's no justification for it to be there, and anyone that argues it should be there, at least in its current kick-in-the-balls state, is a grognard of the worst order.

>>54713104
Go back to Dungeon World, storyfag.

>>54712890
>What about higher level spells then?
Only relevant for a few classes, and honestly you can get often get away with clever use of the ones you have to hit above your weight class?
>What about better saving throws?
An emergency fallback for a situation where you fucked up.

Basically, it's the OSR mantra of "if you need to roll, you fucked up". You got hit by a trap you could have avoided, got in a fight you shouldn't have, and got caught above your ears in shit.

>>54712993
If you're out of bad guys, plots and treasure, congratulation! You've now won D&D. You can now go home to your father and say say "Yes, I AM winning, Dad".
Rejoice, anon, for you have tasted the nectar of the gods!

>>54713104
>It's the main reward for most adventures: swords and other magical treasure are just there to help out.
What the fuck kind of number-munching games are you playing? The treasure is the reward in and of itself - experience is at best a tertiary concern, an added safety-net.

Levels don't get you castles and retainers, fame and renown - hard cash gets you the first two (remember, D&D has never "automatically given a castle at name level", despite what some may claim), and hard cash can also buy you some of the latter. Mostly fame and renown comes from actual actions rather than abstract "experience", though. If you're a famous dragon-slayer, it's because you slayed yourself some dragons. (Or spread false rumors about it, I guess.)

Seriously, though, consider what magical shit gives you. Take an OD&D Fighter and give them +2 sword and plate, and you know what you get? A Fighter with the saves and hit rates of a Fighter three levels higher, with slightly less hit points but also way better AC. (AC0 is some shit in OD&D.)
If your high-level Fighter dies or is inconvenienced, congratulations! Your new guy has a significant head-start. It's more roguelite than roguelike, if that makes sense.

>>54713153
Storygames tend to care less about levels, this is WotC bullshit.

>>54713104
It's effective *because* it's a big deal.

It says "if you charge an undead creature that sucks the life out of you, you're an idiot". If you have enough levels to get butthurt about losing them, you have enough experience and magic to play it smart.

That said, I agree that the danger should be clear from the get-go. I don't think it's fair to have ghosts pop out of the walls and drain levels willy nilly. It should be a rare and terrifying possibility, telegraphed well in advance.

>>54713287
>What the fuck kind of number-munching games are you playing?
Me? Look at what you're saying lower down:
>Take an OD&D Fighter and give them +2 sword and plate, and you know what you get? A Fighter with the saves and hit rates of a Fighter three levels higher, with slightly less hit points but also way better AC.
That is number-crunching if I've ever seen any. You're equating life experience, scars of at least four or five battles to death, many deadly dungeon jaunts with a flickering torch on, to some fucking +2 gear. You're saying the exact thing I complained about: that some magic items make you the equal of a grizzled war veteran, because "the numbers say so". Experience gives you more than a bit higher numbers, you math-freak.

Besides, you're still just talking about fighters. What about the wizards? What do they get, when they lose all their best spells and can't even wield your precious +2 sword the right way?
>Only relevant for a few classes
Yeah, like the fucking Raise Dead and Resurrection talked about previously. Clerics and wizards aren't just "a few classes", they're half the fucking game.
>honestly you can get often get away with clever use of the ones you have to hit above your weight class?
Most of the once powerful first level spells become near worthless a few levels in. Sleep stops working, Charm Person won't do shit when you start to fight more undead, Magic Missile won't keep up because your level is too low. I'd rather just upgrade to a fucking Fireball and blow it all up.

>>54713392
>It's effective *because* it's a big deal.
According to assholes like >>54713287, no it isn't.

Just charge the fucking vampire, who cares about a couple lost levels and precious memories! You'll get those back soon anyway!

>>54713104

My personal favorite alternative to energy/level drain is artificial aging. Instead of losing levels, you get older (humans would age 1 year per level drained, dwarves 5, and elves 10 or something like that).

This allows it to be potentially reversed with some effort, but it's entirely possible to be killed by it as well if you don't flee.

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>>54713287
>Your new guy has a significant head-start.
Generously assuming your body is recoverable, the rest of the party (and their retainers) called dibs.

>>54713416
No, I'm suggesting that you should probably run away from the vampire... but also that level drain is generally still better than character death for the majority of the game (remember, it takes a long time to get Raise Dead), and isn't all too onerous to recover from.
Because you'd already be doing the exact same shit anyway.

>>54713454
So AD&D ghosts?

Also, that's kind of hella ineffective and nonthreatening. The dreaded vampire now drains two years from the character - in ten hits he might make them middle-aged! Oh no!

I'll be honest, I'd probably worry more about the actual damage from those ten hits than the aging. On the other hand, each hit the default one does is effectively three. There's a grave difference in threat there.

>>54713476
If you aren't playing with inheritance rules you're fucking over players that already got fucked and you're kind of an asshole.

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>>54713396
>they're half the fucking game.
>more than 1 MU/Cleric per 5 Fighters

>>54713526

I was spitballing numbers. You can always decide that a vampire drains an entire decade from humans, a quarter century from dwarves, and a half century from elves. Adjust up or down to taste.

It has the benefit of being deadly and an effect most players won't want on their character, with the upside of being potentially reversible with magic.

>>54713416
I don't think any edition includes memory loss. I describe it more like being shattered by contact with the dark forces from beyond death.

I don't know what to say to the other points. Of course it's a big deal for the character, but it's all just a game. Characters die and shit. Part of the draw of old school rules is that there are stakes.

And like others have said--if you're foolish enough to get knocked from name level back to level one, you'll regain most of that before your allies hit the next level.

There's really no reason to spend 6-10 rounds in melee with a goddamn ghost! Run away! Fight with magic and divine protection if you really have to! This is why player skill matters, and why it's rewarding to retire a character as one of the most powerful mortals in the setting.

>>54713672
So you admit that character levels are something more than a "safety-net"?

That's really all I'd want you to say.

>>54713721
It wasn't me who said that, so I can't refute it. Seems like a matter of opinion and playstyle. I'm just saying there's a gameplay rationale for level drain, and that it offers more than just meanie GM powertripping.

Certainly losing levels matters more to classes with a lot of scaling abilities (like spells or thief skills). Seems like yet another reason not to have your wizard charge at a ghost with a pointy stick.

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>>54713526
>playing with inheritance rules

>Obsessive Sperg Rampage

>>54714471
2hu has bouts of OSRfaggotry that end when he remembers how little opportunity there is to min-max, but he always keeps well away from /osrg/.

>>54714783
Who's 2hu?

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>>54714808
For your sake, never find out.

>>54714898
You're only making me more curious.

Hey guys, Comeliness Anon here. I just wanted to apologize for causing some confusion earlier by being vague, hope nobody got too angry.

To clarify, I actually didn't intend to imply using the UA rules; in fact, I would call the stat Appearance. I just went with Comeliness in the thread because that was the word the other anon used. I would have made up my own effects of it, but I was way too unclear about that.

Again, sorry for the confusion and kinda accidentally baiting you guys.

>>54715004

No problem. Assumptions were made, it happens. No one got angry. I was the anon who was asking you if you were using the UA version and what kinds of problems that would entails.

Consider me curious about what you come up with for Appearance.

>>54708705
>What OSR system has the best stats for dragons?
I'm a fan of how ACKS handles them, it's flavorful and varied without getting overly complicated

>>54711015
>How do you justify negative levels as game design?
don't use them myself, they're just more trouble than it's worth(but then I prefer to tone down OSR lethality in general anyways, as my liking for OSR isn't really in relation to it's playstyle, it's mostly for being a solid rules base that's easily modifiable to what I want to use)

>>54713287
>Basically, it's the OSR mantra of "if you need to roll, you fucked up". You got hit by a trap you could have avoided, got in a fight you shouldn't have, and got caught above your ears in shit.
I've never liked that aspect to the OSR, it basically means in an ideal game you never actually use any of the rules for anything

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>>54714929
Imagine the abstract nougatty ideals of /pfg/
But replace all the tit-foxes with touhou fanart.
That's basically the aspie known as 2hu.
Also, his posts are all 2000 characters.

>>54715004
Post mechanics?

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>>54715200
I'm not really sure when "combat is a failure state" became our catchphrase, but it's a really shitty one.
You should absolutely get into (carefully rigged (unless you've 2 or 3 HD up your enemies)) fights all the time.

>in an ideal game you never actually use any of the rules for anything
True, but not quite in the sense you're referring to.
You should only make/use rules for things you can't fairly and consistently arbitrate.

>>54715233

>>54715587
Those questions are very broad and he hasn't even read the books yet. I don't think he'll get a lot of replies.

>>54715587
He could probably bring his stuff here on /osrg/. It'll bring better traction here.

>>54715678
>Muh 2e isn't OSR
Anons would sperg and kick him out of here

>>54715724
Pretty sure it's just one particularly loud asshole, two at most.

>>54709900
Classes are fluffed well and the magic system rules.

>>54709900
Apart from what other anons have already said, the game also has a good design philosophy, with good thoughts on treasure and magic items and monsters.
>Keep treasure low, make sure you know where it all comes from
>Magic items are rare and powerful, magic weapons each have awesome special abilities
>Monsters are mysterious and scary, never just "a goblin"

Also, some of the coolest adventures I've seen anywhere. Purple Planet is the shit.

How do you manage cursed items? Most books say they're virtually identical to non-cursed ones and only reveal themselves at the worst possible moment, but I'd like to give them a chance to notice.

Related note: any good special abilities added to a cursed -2 sword?

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>>54709900
>sell me on Dungeon Crawl Classics, esteemed analons
Watch Slayers. It's basically DCC, up to and including the bell-bottoms and retarded puns. If you want your games to be like that, go for it.

What is an OSR with a more heroic gameplay, if i want to do a hack and slash without players dying(so fast but i still like challenge)

>>54715982
AD&D 2e is probably the closest you get. Even first level PCs have enough options, customization, and kits available to make your characters reasonably formidable from the get go, yet far from invincible.

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>>54715982

>>54716011
As much as i like AD&D 2e i always feel the need to streamline the rules

>>54715853
The poison ring from Skerples dungeon is a 10/10 cursed item.
It works fantastic. Riiiiiight up until it gets you.
At which point it inconvenient, but still possibly worth using.

>any good special abilities added to a cursed -2 sword?
"Always appears in your hand when you try to attack" has niches uses,

Speaking of which, it's good to put some variety into keeping cursed items.
The spearthatkeepsstabbingyourfoodgoddamnit is grafted to your wrist, but hey! Free hand...

>>54715982
try the BRUTAL rpg

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What do you guys do with acquiring new spells?

The idea of having magic users need to search for their spells in dungeons and or copy them from scrolls is super cool to me.

Anyone haves heroes & other worlds pdf?

>>54716571
Haven't run my first game yet but I was honestly just going to have them roll for a random spell from the chart to start and then have them find spells in dungeons

Maybe, MAYBE an occasional MU NPC sitting around willing to sell his spells.

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>>54716614
Not even the PDF Share Thread has that.

>>54716837
He's asking where in the dungeon they would be stashed, and what they'd look like.
Kind of boring if it's all just scrolls in chests.

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Could someone look over these character sheets? I need some feedback on a new class I cobbled up in ACKs, and a few modifications of a previous one I did a while back.
https://pastebin.com/r0nWgfXa
https://pastebin.com/16TvLTv3

>>54716571
In DCG, Wizards only learn spells that they find in other wizard's spellbooks, otherwise when they level they roll random spells. This plus a couple other mechanics lead wizards to be covetous, backstabbing, murderous power gluttons constantly scheming to steal more scrolls and spellbooks. It really works well for the tone of the game

>>54716974
While I am curious about that, I just wanted to know what everybody did in particular.

>>54716943
>We hope he has gone to rest
I like the implication that he might not be at rest, and his ghost is out fucking up bears still. That seems like a neat random encounter.

>>54716571
>>54716974
>>54717166
Remember that "spellbooks" will vary from culture to culture! A dwarven spellbook might well be a 600-pound leaden slab. Elves might have an elaborate floral clock, where you have to view a glade at the right time of day to read the spells.

>>54717592
Of course, depending on setting. DCG is old school "dwarf is a class" so wizards are almost always human but your setting may vary.

One of my favorite spellbook alternatives was Warhammer where Bright Wizards, who manipulated fire, would have their spells tattooed on their arms or inscribed in metal jewelry so it wouldn't burn up.

>>54717592
eh, gay

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>>54717655
>so wizards are almost always human
Or cats piloting headless bodies through an elaborate series of levers and pulleys.
Or outcast dwarves with 3 knees (opposed to the standard 0), and legs to match.
Or funny looking elves from below the cliff at the end of the world.
Or betwitched rotten logs.
Or vat grown organless things wrought of bile.
Or braces of gnomes, one over the other, in trenchcoats.
Or industrial sewing machines, run off on the dreams of their now soulless laborers.
Or orangutans with spiders for fur.
Or stillborns, animate and stretched across frames (to non-baby proportions).

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I just want to say that this book is great and I'm sad that I never see anything written about it in these threads. It's a great tome and includes lots more other stuff than just the reprinted Grimtooth books.

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>>54718063
somehow you took >>54717592 post and got to a new level of dumb and gay!

>>54717592
>A dwarven spellbook might well be a 600-pound leaden slab
I mean, if you want dwarven magic users to not even be able to dungeon crawl, you might as well remove them from the game.

What is the OSR equivalent of tunnels and trolls? as in fun hack and slash

>>54718068
The traps here are built for antagonistic killer DMs, and games that really don't make for good playing and are just there to show your players how clever you are.

We don't talk about them for a reason.

>>54718213
I'd say you're just using it wrong. The illustrations and editing is great and the traps are very useful for ideas. I don't see why anyone would just them as-is, unless they're really mean. I think the books are at least worth a read.

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>>54718292
Woke

Rules cyclopedia, Basic Fantasy, Labyrinth Lord or BECMI? which haves the better rules?

also opions for barbarians of lemuria

>>54718428
LL, no contest. But why no Bx?

>>54718525
Whats so good about b/x?

>>54718428
BECMI is better than the Rules Cyclopedia, but B/X is better than BECMI. Both for its brevity and for dumb shit like BECMI's stretching out of progressions.

I've got no opinions on Basic Fantasy, Labyrinth Lord or Barbarians of Lemuria.

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>>54716205
>"Always appears in your hand when you try to attack" has niches uses,
Shit, in LotFP that -2 isn't even a problem for a Fighter once you hit level five or so. Especially if you're a defensive fighter to begin with. Having to keep your guns down to offhand pistols might suck, but I'd take always having a sword or knife when I need one over even more useless to-hit bonuses. Might make dealing with Undead harder, though, given that LotFP Undead ignore the bottom half of your damage dice.

>>54716571
Mages start with Summon, plus a couple-three random spells (rolled off the "full" spell chart..) and bonus ones equal to their Int bonus picked out of the core rulebook. They always get to pick one spell at starting regardless of Int. Each level the mage tells me what kind of spell he's working on researching for his next level, and chooses a new one when he levels up. In return I usually re-roll it or give him a bonus to learning it if it pops up in treasure.

Elves start off Reading Magic reflexively but with only a single spell and Summon plus their Int bonus, and don't get Human's Occultism skill.

In addition to scrolls and spellbooks, I'll also have "nuggets" of spell research left behind by other mages, or little bits of bound spells and shit you can use. Basically a bit like treasure maps, they make researching a particular spell or type of spell take less time and money but you still have to commit to them to get it. You can also get unique or more-flexible versions of spells by adapting other mages' research.

I also have fetal rules for Mages making a Wunderkammer instead of Carousing. Still working on those, but I'm gonna have at least one Elf and a couple Mages in my next game so that ought to be shaking out soon. Or they'll all die. Either way is good, really.

>>54716205
>"Always appears in your hand when you try to attack" has niches uses,
>>54718796
>I'd take always having a sword or knife when I need one over even more useless to-hit bonuses

But here's the thing - what kind of a curse would it even be if you could turn it to your advantage? Wouldn't it just become even nastier at this point?

>>54718428
ACKS™

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>>54716974
>He's asking where in the dungeon they would be stashed, and what they'd look like.
>Kind of boring if it's all just scrolls in chests.
I've done everything from scrimshawed legbones to an extremely specific menu of drugs and a painting.

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>>54718819
>and if they beat the invisible mummies... lichs pop out of the wrappings!

I have a game in three hours, what should i play?

>>54719012
If you're the referee, you shouldn't.
You owe your group more respect than coming unprepared.

If you're a player and can't decide on something, just dice for it.

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>>54719012

>>54719012
Find a one-page dungeon.

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>>54719072
>If you're the referee, you shouldn't.
>>54719012
Rather than calling it off, I guess you could grab a module.

>>54718819
Cursed items are only really a bad thing until you figure out how to use them. A Bag of Devouring is horrible when it eats all your stuff - it's great when you need a portable garbage disposal for getting rid of corpses and whatnot.

Even the really bad shit that just straight-up kills you - Scarab of Death, for example - can be used for assassination and other cheap kills. Albeit with extreme care, because the Scarab will claw its way into your heart if you so much as put it in a bag.

>>54719012
System? OD&D, perhaps. Something slim, for sure, if you're on such short notice - Moldvay Basic and B2, perhaps.
But yeah, what >>54719072 said about unprepared refs.

Class? Whatever works out with your rolls. Bad rolls mean either Thief (if you want to suicide) or Magic-User (you already don't want to get hit). Fighter's a good safe class to pick if nothing else stands out. If you're a Magic-User, treat your one spell as a hand-grenade and pay attention to when to use it for maximum effect.

Character? Go for whatever works well with the group without being disruptive. No stealing from the party or murdering other players, try to keep arguing on the down-low, shit like that. Try not to be annoying. Don't do voices unless you're good at them or your group finds it really funny, but don't overdo it if they do.

Role? Mapping's fun, if you're into that. Being the Caller's much more of a social thing and requires some skill, so I'm personally not big on it. Just being some dude is also fine, and not having so much responsibility on your shoulders can be refreshing.

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>>54716614
Just the freebie quickstart

>>54719072
we just want to have some crazy fun, we come from playing a big campaign, and want to rest a little dying like bitches in a dungeon

>>54718819
>But here's the thing - what kind of a curse would it even be if you could turn it to your advantage? Wouldn't it just become even nastier at this point?
I'm agreeing with you, really. I mean, for a Cleric who's dealing with the lower to-hit creep in LotFP a simple -2/-2 is pretty unpleasant. But for a Fighter who isn't a rifleman or something, having a magic weapon that always comes when you swing is.. well, actually pretty goddamned useful. Even if it's a bit shit on the damage. And especially since things that need a magic weapon to hit don't care about "pluses" in the system.

You better damned well believe it's going to interpret "attack" as loosely and gleefully as possible, of course. But that's the kind of thing I consider >treasure<, not "cursed".

My cursed items are things more along the lines of screwing with the character sheets/players/fundamental game rules. Like a sword that sometimesblocks incoming blows in combat, but also constantly gets in the way while you're moving and working so it counts as an Oversized Item or two. They're usually something useful or with an intended purpose. It's just that it happens to suck for you, or got fucked up somehow in item creation.

Real curses get MEAN. "You have made an enemy of wood" is still my favorite one that I pulled on a character, ex tempore.

>>54719172
>Cursed items are only really a bad thing until you figure out how to use them.
I don't know.

Neither Bag of Devouring nor Scarab of Death really advertise they're cursed: they're just really inconvenient, possibly lethal. But the sword -2 actually has the "Cursed" in its name, in the capital C - I feel like that should count a lot.

>>54718063
>DUDE WHAT IF D&D THING WAS ACTUALLY NOT D&D THING LMAO

Shit like this is why I dislike the "DIY D&D" subset of the OSR.

>>54719245
I bet your dwarf's skin isn't even engraved.

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>>54719245
>I can't handle people spitballing ideas in a niche general on a Malaysian tapestry collection

>>54719222
Well, the thing with the -2 sword is that if it's the possessive sort (newschool "can't put it down" or oldschool "will mind control you to ignore other weapons") it's more than a -2 - it's a -2 in addition to losing whatever plus you'd get from replacing it with a better weapon.

Say that you're in an OD&D game and you've got a cursed -2 sword - it's got a high Ego, so it fights you a bunch about the dumb sword shit it finds important. You find a +3 sword, but your cursed sword refuses to let you NTR it with that bullshit.
Congratulations! That -2 cursed sword is now effectively -5, because it screwed you out of a much better item.

Not only that, but much like how the +2 sword puts you ahead one bracket in hit rates, the -2 one puts you behind one. Your sixth-level Fighting-Man is no better than a first-level one at hitting enemies!

The -2 is also significant because it makes you that much less likely to defeat your most dangerous foes, which tend to have high ACs. At level 3-4 you jump from having a 20% chance to hit AC2 to 30% - that's a massive +50% increase!
That also means that against said dangerous enemies your cursed sword now has you doing 2/3rds the damage.
Or, if you're already in the level 1-3 bracket, you do half the damage.

The "-2" doesn't really tell you the entire picture - would you use a sword that had the tag "half the time you hit a dude in plate armor, you miss them instead"?

>>54719331
I'm for spitballing GOOD ideas not your SHIT ones.

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>>54719753
>ideas are only allowed to be good for me when spitballing

is Dungeon Slayers good?

>>54719857
How do you kill a dungeon?

>>54719857
It looks a lot more like 3e than AD&D.
The icon spam and prose were bad really annoying while skimming it.
Sample adventure also seems meh.

is Advanced Fighting Fantasy OSR?

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>>54722241
It's Old School but not OSR.
OSR is just a big TSR D&D + homebrews circlejerk.

Lamentations of the flame princess, what is a good module?

>>54722405
Maze of the Blue Medusa

What is a good osr system to play without a grid?

>>54722405
Tower of the Stargazer

>>54722455
>What is a good osr system to play without a grid?
Any system?

>>54722405
Tower of the Stargazer

I'm looking for an extremely simplistic magic system. Like something you could describe in a few sentences, preferably without having to learn spells.

Any ideas?

>>54722776
"Tell me what you want to happen. Roll with a penalty I give you for how hard/unrealistic/etc. it is. If you succeed, it probably works. If you don't, it doesn't or Bad Things happen." And remember, if you actually use the rules, you've fucked up.

>>54722776
Pick a theme and a restriction, ref has veto rights.
You can do ANYTHING reasonably described by the theme, provided it's over the top.
No matter what you do, it'll be about as effective as a Fighting-Man of the same level.

You can't do anything that would contradict your restriction.
You also can't do anything mundane besides walking (no fast walking!), opening doors (slowly), or holding light objects in your hand.

You can also buy anything refluffed to match your theme, for twice normal price.
They may be handled differently when arbitrating outcomes.

At name level, you get an extra theme.

>>54722776
http://gloomtrain.blogspot.com/2017/07/hocus-pocus.html

You could maybe crib the turn undead chart instead of that WotC DC thing?
a la. https://9and30kingdoms.blogspot.com/2011/05/clerics-without-spells.html

Will I be disappointed if I play a thief in bx?

>>54723307
No, but you would be in BECMI.

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>>54722405

>>54722776
Yeah, it's called Mage: The Ascension.

>>54712207
>Why are there assassins in a game where anyone with the means or connections can get raised?
Something I saw in that one Japanese RPG Sword World was that dying and coming back fucked with your soul something fierce, so much so that it immediately has an impact on your appearance.

On top of that, the more you died and returned, the more deformed and twisted your shit became, until you were so physically and mentally corrupt and degraded you just became an NPC revenant out for revenge on the living.

That's also not discounting the monetary cost of such rituals to return to life, let alone any sort of religious impact it may have on the local clergy and faithful. Politics would be fairly fucked as well, such as dealing with various inheritances and whatnot.

Between the social stigma and the actual physical degradation, only the real bad-ass adventurers would even want to be resurrected, let alone often be put into the position where they would die from unnatural causes.

>>54713104
>being this assmad
That's *very* assmad.

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>>54717251
>I like the implication that he might not be at rest, and his ghost is out fucking up bears still.
Plus, his family or whoever else buried him is *worried* about that possibility. He habitually killed bears to the point where it was a problem, not because they were afraid for his safety but for *other people* or possibly on a large ecological scale.

>>54722812
>>54723065

I was honestly thinking about using a roll vs DC to do thing idea, it helps easily scale into higher levels of play and is simple enough. Giving it a random chance to fail helps to balance it.

>>54723147

I like both of these two but the Cleric one was more for Clerics, in my opinion. I still like it but am not sure how to use it in an actual game.

>>54723568

>MAGE anything
>Simple

nice meme

>>54718428
BECMI has slightly better rules (with the exception of the gay Mystic hit dice thing) due to editing problems with the Rules Cyclopedia, but the latter has them packaged much nicer (and fixes Mystic progression), so I prefer the RC anyway.

>>54722776
"You can't cast spells."

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>Combining the Cleric and Magic User.

I'm not asking CAN it be done, because I've seen a lot of ways it has been done. The question instead is SHOULD it be done?

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What's the best way to do armor?

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>>54716571

You can join a mystery cult to learn spells, but that means you have to follow their dumb rituals and give them arcane power and money up the chain in a great wizardly pyramid scheme. Obviously young and aspiring Wizards love to join these groups to pluck their secrets, then quit once they learn some useful stuff and go back to solo artistry again, naturally this is where the title of Warlock comes from, and all it entails. You think a Wizard coming into town makes them nervous? Imagine if you told them it was a WARLOCK.

Since PCs don't really like getting bogged down in political shit like that, maybe they only do it sometimes. Most of the time, they'll have to get creative with how to learn spells.

You can summon a creature like a dark spirit, demon, or ghost of an ancient wizard to learn their spells. This obviously comes with its own perils and difficulties.

You can create inspiration potions. It's like a potion of brilliance except it gives you wild and crazy new ideas for magic and helps you write down new spells. Its ingredients are hard to find, naturally. You probably need dragon semen.

You can also kill a lot of people. If you murder innocent people in a cold blooded and cruel ritual, like brick them into a wall or drown them in a swamp or impale them to their bed with the silver blade of torment you can create a devilish spell this method as well. Every time this spell is cast, it saps the life force and health of its caster, even if it isn't the one who did the murder rituals, as revenge from the murdered spirits. This is why casting Wish is so costly.

Every Wizard secretly has a 'spell' they can invent. It's why every spell ever created has a different creator; there are no exceptions to this rule. Even if a creator has more then one spell, it's not actually his spell, he probably stole it from his apprentice and took the credit.

If you can't do ANY of that shit, then you gotta find them in a dungeon or on a scroll.

>>54725394
It should be done if you know what you're doing, but most people don't

>>54726144
The way they're done now: the better your armor, the harder it is to hit you.

>>54726875

I meant like;
>Armor comes in sets, like leather, chain, scale, plate, etc. Gives flat bonuses for the full set
>Armor comes in pieces; each grants +1 and breastplate grants +2; if you have a pair of gauntlets and a helmet that's +2 AC, if you have leggings and a breastplate that's +3 AC, etc.
>Something else?

>>54717125
No biters?

>>54727060
>Armor comes in pieces
This method isn't great, since it doesn't let you differentiate between qualities of armor. I guess it works if you're playing an early-modern game so it's either plate or nothing at all in terms of armor type, and the variation is in how much of it you wear.

Otherwise I would only use it in conjunction with some sort of hit location system, but then that would probably require a different to-hit roll than the current simple one vs. AC, so...

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>>54727239

I don't know, I kind of like the idea of making all kinds of armor equally good, that way everyone doesn't just rush to platemail and instead uses armor they personally think looks cool, like splint mail or chain.

Maybe leather/cloth armor grants +1 for the breastplate and +1 for every 2 pieces of misc armor, but has no penalty for sneaking or movement. Then metal armor grants +2 for breastplate, +1 for each piece, and an equal penalty to stealth and movement.

>>54718428

BFRPG is a mostly a retroclone of BX with a few differences (e.g. ascending AC). It's freely available for download from the BF website and is well supported.

>>54722405

> Tower of the Stargazer
A good introductory, exploratory adventure for everyone to get their feet wet.

> Death Frost Doom
A low-level, slow-burn adventure that gets more foreboding as you get deeper into it. Will more than likely get a stupid party killed or initiate an end of the world scenario.

> Weird New World
Mid-level part adventure/setting book set in the borderland frontier of an inhospitable freezing cold.

>>54726832

What defines 'know what you're doing'?

It's about as pointless and vague of a statement as you can get. It's vapid to say "oh just do whatever as long as you do it well xd"

>>54727942
I'm saying that you shouldn't do it, unless you've come up with something really good and spent a lot of time making sure it works.

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>>54722405
I've never really looked into lamentations of the flame princess but I liked the art.
Can I get a quick rundown on the setting and system?

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>Dungeoneering First Aid

Whenever you take damage, write down its type. There are five types of damage; Sharp, Blunt, Elemental, Arcane and Poison.

Every turn you spend resting (not moving or exploring) you can have someone do first aid on you and heal 1 HP. You require items for each type of damage.

Sharp damage is from all slashing and piercing weapons, like arrows, swords, spears, and spike traps. You use bandages to heal these.

Blunt damage is from crushing traps, blunt weapons, ogre fists, and falling damage. You use splints to heal these.

Elemental damage is from fire, ice, lightning, and acid/corrosion attacks. You use ointment to heal these.

Arcane damage is from stuff like magic missile and death spells. Poison damage is its own category as well; these can't be healed with first aid. Instead, natural healing from sleep and bed rest heal poison damage first. Healing magic heals arcane magic first; but both these types of healing heal all types of damage.

The items you need to heal Sharp, Blunt, and Elemental damage are often available in shops and can be taken down into the dungeon. But once in the dungeon you can get a supply of these by salvaging around yourself. Clothes, flags, and bags can be ripped into shreds to make bandages. Anything hard and straight, like a rusted old sword or bones can be used to make a splint. Ointment can be made by boiling the fat of animals and monsters, and spread on the skin.

The idea behind this is a way to recover a few points of HP as you explore the dungeon, and players can be clever to salvage new ways of getting first aid supplies.

>Thoughts?

>>54728188

The system is an edgier retroclone of BX with some house rule stuff thrown in. Wouldn't recommend it for first time DMs until you get the core rules of BX down first.

There is no one setting for LotFP, but everything created for it fits within the edgy, weird, gothic, horrific, Cthulhu side of RPGs

>>54728310
Kinda pointlessly complicated for very little good in practice.

>>54728310

It's a good overview for those that want this level of detail. Too crunchy for my tastes, but just my opinion.

>>54708705
Is there any good material in TSR Ravenloft? Le tragic Dracula really doesn't do it for me.

>>54728490
Dark of the Moon is usually pretty recommended, although to my understanding none of Ravenloft is very OSR: there's little in terms of dungeons and stuff, and quite a bit of story.

>>54728356
>>54728395

>too complicated

What, bandages should heal every kind of injury instead? Or just be edgy and use no first aid healing? It's a little bit of crunchy fluff, I thought at least one person might like it.

Not sure if we can do anything about poison though. Maybe getting piss drunk as a meme will heal 1 HP of poison damage?

>>54708705
>What OSR system has the best stats for dragons?
I actually like the way OD&D does them. Dragon types have a HD value, so any red dragon has 9-11 HD. If they're the youngest age category, Very Young, all of those HD are read as 1, while the oldest dragons, Very Old, have 6 HP per HD. This was back when HD were d6s, of course. They have a percentage chance of being able to talk, and a percentage chance of being able to cast some magic if they can talk.

Their breath weapons deal damage equal to their max HP. The example of combat included has a party ambushing a sleeping dragon, and dying horribly when it breathes fire on them.

You can also subdue dragons and sell them for 500-1000 GP per HP.

Gold dragons are lawful and can shapeshift and turn up as humans or whatever, the rest are neutral or chaotic.

they can also come in groups or families.

How should I use stats for monsters in systems with different base ACs? For example if I am using a module which assumes a base AC of 12 and wanted to use it in a system where the base AC is 10, should I subtract from the AC of the monster in the module? What if the syst had the high AC and the module had the low AC? If it wasn't obvious I am pretty new to this.

>>54728715

Some DMs just don't want to get to that level of crunchiness, that's all. I did compliment it for those that do want to get down to that level. It would make a good start for a supplement for those that wanted to pursue this. For others, CLW and healing potions will do the trick.

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>>54728916

This may help.

>>54728715
What's with you people getting so upset over your little ideas not being immediately praised?

>>54729169
Thanks for the tip anon. I can't believe that I forgot that LOTFP uses ascending AC rather than descending.

When is second edition of ASSH available?

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>>54728490
>>54728544
Adam's Wrath has a very neat dungeon segment.
Dark Awakening's climax is a literal dungeoncrawl.
Web of Illusions likewise culminates in a illusion-filled dungeoncrawl.
VR Guides are useful toolboxes.
Domain information can be refluffed for use in almost any setting.

Is there a good way to dis-incentivise wearing as much armour as you can afford/pile on? I'm the same anon who was asking about an exploration themed game last thread, and reading various systems it struck me that real life explorers (in the 18th century) didn't really wear armour. But most OSR games seem to make the assumption that everyone will be wearing as much as they can reasonably manage. Should I just embrace the letality, or try and fandangle up some wound tables so dipping below 0 hp isn't neccesarily death, just serious injury?

>>54730422
Real life explorers generally didn't face multiple deadly fights each day!

Conquistadors, however, marched around Mexico and Central America with breastplates and helmets on.

Environment matters a lot. If the players are frequently fording rivers, slipping through narrow cracks in a cave system, etc, they may recalculate the benefits of going everywhere with armor. Plate armor is also tiring to wear all day (not impossible, but certainly harder than going around in shirt sleeves).

Til then--I would guess that in your game, wearing lots of armor is a good choice, with more upside than downside.

Also note--LotFP says anybody can wear armor, but most classes lose their special abilities when doing so.

Re: Player-drawn maps of dungeons, can anyone give me advice on how to do player-driven mapping smoothly? How do you go through size/shapes of rooms quickly, whilst preserving the opportunity for player mistakes?
I find it a real drag to describe a room, and what's in a room, only to have the mapper just glare at me and ask for specific dimensions. Especially when the room is an odd shape.

>>54730422
Fatigue rules of some kind. Also make sure players know how loud and frankly god awful at dungeon delving plate and the like armors are (as far as armor is concerned).
I've explained the real world situation with plate mail armor was (used sparingly/cerimonialy) and they just ran with it. It's pretty neat

>>54730422
Veins in the Earth makes armour super dangerous to wear with 2 rules. First, due to the amount of climbing and squeezing through gaps the player is expected to do in a cave system, armour makes just moving around the place really dangerous. Second, due to armour being made of metal, it makes you really vulnerable to getting frostbite if you get wet. Obviously its hard to dry yourself out, caves not having a surplus of fuel to burn for this purpose.

You could change the first of those to be more about the volume of other stuff you need to carry to be able to explore. The weight of more than a breastplate and helmet is probably a bit of a luxury, if you have to carry up to 3 weeks rations. The other thing you could do is flip the second rule on its head, and make it a risk due to heatstroke or disease. Soldiers in Vietnam got all sorts of problems just wearing army uniform through jungle; make sure that you warn the players in and out of character, but once you have just be really vicious.

>>54724786
>but the Cleric one was more for Clerics
I didn't say "give MUs this verbatim", I said "if you don't like d20 DCs; instead of using DCs, use the Turn undead table. here's an example"

>>54725394
Higher level Clerics gain higher level spells by greasing enough palms to be indoctrinated into more mysteries.
Not all high level clerics are faithless, but they generally had more faith during lower levels.

>>54730524
I'm going for more of a northwest fur trader/explorer theme if that makes sense. So, in theory, less "This is our land now, fuck you if you disagree" and more "Excuse me, might we trade with your quaint tribal villiage and eventually buy your land out from under you?" Does that make any sense? In theory, most of the danger would be from the environment, ie river fordings, thunderstorms, or very rarely animal attacks.
>>54730554
Are there any elegant fatigue rules out there? Alternately, how does this sound: You can wear armour for 1/2 con hours without penalty. After that time elapses, you take a -1 penalty per hour to all rolls/checks/whatever as you tire more and more. These penalties can be removed with a good night's sleep (out of armour) and are reduced by 1 point per hour after armour is taken off.

>>54730550

Flow chart maps, or simple maps. Each room can be connected by lines (the tunnels/corridors).

>http://www.neuronphaser.com/fantasy-rpg-flowchart-mapping/

>>54730550
You could give relative dimensions, modified by the available light
>as you open the door, your torch reveals a room...
>about the size of a walk in closet
>the size of a living room, with tall ceilings
>the size of a lord's great hall. The far wall is almost unseen in the dark
>a yawning cavern. You can't see the ceiling or the opposite wall in the dark

This also creates more mystery. Saying "you enter a huge 100 foot x 70 foot chamber" doesn't make much sense when you're exploring by torchlight.

If they want, they could pace out the dimensions, at the cost of a few minutes in the exploration round.

If you're running in poor light, it's very difficult to gauge distances. If you're counting your steps with something like ranger beads, you can get pretty precise.

>>54730422
Oh hey, it's me the guy who gave you a pastebin last thread. >>54730524 and >>54730554 bring up some good points. I have two ideas: First, simply disincentive armor, either add ramifications like fatigue or (risk of heat stroke/hypothermia). Second would be just to remove the option to purchase heavier armor either by making them cost unrealistic to be purchased or simply by not having them in your game. Also >>54730649 recommends VotE which I forgot to recommend that you read as inspiration. >>54730737 great you made another post. I would recommend you check out LotFP module Wierd New World which is a hex crawl in search of the northwest passage. I don't know much about elegant rules for fatigue but I would look at what you're trying to incentive and work from that. Think about how it would come up in game and work from there. The rules you propose don't make much sense to me in regards to how they would play out in game. Lets say that after 5 hours of traveling through jungle you'd start taking penalties, would that be meaningful versus a character who would take penalties only after 6 hours of travel? Does that that make any sense?

>>54730550
Shout out to the anon who told me this: Describe what their torches illuminate and then after they have explored it describe it's dimensions. Maybe you just have an asshat mapper? What >>54730929 said is pretty good way to go about it.

>>54728188

It's basically BX with weird crap thrown in, some darker and more dangerous magic (Summon being the poster boy, a level 1 spell that can potentially destroy the continent you're on), streamlined rules for abilities and encumbrance and a levelling system that tries to discourage stat bloat.

It can work with your generic DnD setting but the flavour is in the "weird horror" tone of the adventures with permanent consequences for adventurers and the world.

The creator has said that he likes to use Renaissance Europe as the setting. It has lots of horror and brutality in itself (the Thirty Years' War), the theme of science and various religious groups in conflict, gunpowder along with melee weapons and armour and ample opportunity to add supernatural horrors. Plus you don't have to explain too much to newcomers to the game and have hundreds of sourcebooks to access if you so wish.

>>54730929
>If they want, they could pace out the dimensions, at the cost of a few minutes in the exploration round.
Pacing out distances for mapping is actually included in the standard exploration turn. It's one of the reasons why the move per turn is so slow and why running from pursuit explicitly disallows mapping.

You should still feel free to describe visuals first and give distances only after any combat has occurred, of course. That only seems like common sense.

>>54730422
Normal encumbrance rules should cover this desu.

>>54728188
Bx; but Fighters get +1 to-hit per level, no one else advances that at all, and enemy ACs tend to be a lot worse.

What are some decent low-level small dungeons? Recommendable one page dungeons would be appreciated as well.

>>54731952
Hommlet

>>54731952
There's a ton of cool mini adventures on https://www.dungeoncontest.com/
I would skim over those and pick one that sounds cool

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>>54730929
>they could pace out the dimensions, at the cost of a few minutes
They can pace out the dimensions exactly as fast as it takes to walk over, plus a few seconds at the end.

Note an object on the rising edge of what's illuminated whenever a noted object falls off the falling edge.
You know how far your light source casts.

You can pace out the last couple feet by the wall/cliff/whatever, or just make a close estimate.

>>54730550
You ever play a text based adventure game?
Those are faithful reproductions of old-timey dungeon crawling.

>the mapper just glare at me and ask for specific dimensions
If you have a really nasty room, you can always hand them a shitty sketch.

Apropos of nothing, your group is allowed as many mappers as they'd like.
Remember to confiscate maps from hard-to-recover dead players.

>>54731952

Holmes Sample Dungeon
JG113 The Book of Treasure Maps
JG750 The Illhiedrin Book
BF1 Morgansfort: The Western Lands Campaign
Shadowbrook Manor
Tower of the Stargazer

>>54730422
Honestly, if you want to run an American Frontier/Early Colonies game, just don't have any armor available and make guns bypass it in any case. AFAIK those are the real reasons they never wore any at the time, so they should be enough for your purposes. Nobody's going to be weirded out by Davy Crockett NOT wearing full plate.

>>54727060
I like the armor pieces idea. I ripped it off a blog, but it was something to the effect of "leather jacket +1 AC, breastplate +2, helmet +1" etc. And the max combined bonus was +6 AC. If you're using locational critical hit charts, it's handy. Most of the results on mine can be softened if the PC has armor on in that spot.

>>54730422
Use one of those quick inventory systems where each item takes a slot, and armor takes up slots equal to it's AC bonus.

http://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/156178/Ghost-Ship-of-the-Desert-Dunes

Someone got this product?
I've been looking for it for weeks. Can someone share it? Thanks in advance

>>54716571
Spells are alive and can be negotiated with

All those awful magical tricks and traps interfering with dungeon exploration? Potentially hot new spells for the wizard.

What would a japanese style osr have? need some concepts i am going to try and do one

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>>54733166

>>54729169
uh. LL uses descending AC starting at 9 unarmored?

>>54733663
Can you tell me more about it?

>>54733166
There's also Kaigaku, which I kind of like. It's pretty solid. It's Not!Rokugan and has all this Not!Rokugan shit in it, but I'd still probably use it if I ever wanted to run a Japanese OSR game.

>>54733663
>>54733775
I think he was talking about JRPG like dragonquest or final fantasy

>>54733707
It's basically AD&D but with everything turned eastward rather than westward. Basically a bunch of specifically east-Asian cultural tropes turned into gameable ideas. New races, classes, monsters, combat procedures, setting notes, weapons, armor, etc etc

For more modern OSR stuff, check out Yoon-Suin and Qelong. Those are more China-India and Cambodia respectively, but probably still useful.

>>54733804
If that's the case, then I don't know what to say. Final Fantasy 1 is just AD&D but turned into a streamlined video game. Most JRPGs are directly descended from AD&D by way of Wizardry.

>>54733804

Is it possible to run a game like chrono trigger with OSR?

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>>54727106
In any case, moving on to another conundrum. How would you go about making a monk or pugilist type of class in ACKs? Nothing to fancy with ki or anything, just someone who could punch hard, kick fast, and jump good.

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>>54734296
Chrono Trigger? No, that's just regular heroic/high fantasy. You're better with just about any other system.

Now if you want to do something like the SaGa games, I could see OSR systems being more up its alley save for the skill systems.

OSR is more for treasure scraping dungeon crawls that eventually turn into wargames (in my experience) than it is for a group of friends to go and save the world.

>>54733903
FFI being AD&D does refute me on this, though.

It's all a little hazy, I'll just post some Amano art to make up for this garbage/self-contradictory post.

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>>54728188
>I've never really looked into LotFP but I liked the art.
>Can I get a quick rundown on the setting and system?
There's a fourfold split in the settings

>Crazy freakout prog metal artsy shit
This is your Zak Sabbath, Patrick Stuart/Scrap Princess, and Chris Kutaliak. High Melniboniean strangeness with a side of David Bowie. Old dead gods, Clark Ashton Smith cosmic horror, weird sketchy art but Jesus FUCK is it inspirational. It uses things like that crazy-ass Danish Alice in Wonderland with all the stop-motion as inspiration and texture. There's a loosely-sketched setting Zak and Patrick work in, stitched through Veins of the Earth, Fire on the Velvet Horizon, Vornhiem, Blue Medusa, and Red and Pleasant Land. Lots of vampires and things porn stars think are funny.

>Doom metal with tits and explosions
Jim Raggi and the "core" line. Leans more historical-apocalyptic, usually with at least one apocalypse-in-progress that the PCs can make even worse, or supplant. Tongue usually but not always in cheek and lots of acknowledgement that PCs are the shittiest people in the setting. Explicitly horror-oriented, in a Hammer Horror/Blood on Satan's Claw/Solomon Kane/Witchfinder General way. Grungy Witcher-esque Wars of Religion setting with a lot of class politics and casual brutality.

>Black Metal
Logan Knight and Zzarchov Kowalski. Much, much darker. As strange as the Zak stuff but more nihilistic and deliberately offensive. He's the one who put the masturbating black goat-god into Petty Gods OSR, for example, and wroth Sleeping Place of the Feathered Swine. This is more "Hostel"-style horror than slasher-flicks. Deeply uncomfortable in an interesting but squicky way. Logan's setting's as fucked up as Zak's but with more rape.

>Dad-rock "I just like how his mechanics work" stuff
This is your Jeff Reints area. Mostly D&D but with a nod to the way Raggi handles monsters and using the (excellent) add-on LotFP rules for things like retainers and encumbrance.

>>54734296
Why would it not be? Use Stars Without Number for mecha and robot future, there's dinosaur rules everywhere, I'm sure there's at least one "gun" ruleset somewhere that can be adapted for modern-esque citycrawls, there's plenty of blackpowder rules if you want to go renaissance, and medieval is just generic fantasy.

Hell there's probably other good sources for robots and shit, too. The only thing this requires is the slightest bit of creativity and a decent understanding of the various sub-rulesets you're smashing together.

The bigger problem would be getting a party that was from a host of different time periods together without some serious contrivance or an in medias res start.

>>54734485
and make everyone a warrior/mage?

>>54732188
I hadn't thought of that one! So many reasons to make players map themselves. Good, good reasons.

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>>54728188
>Can I get a quick rundown on the setting and system?

>>54734477
(continued)
(by "he" up in the last post I meant Logan, not Zzarchov.)


System:
It's basically B/X or OD&D but with a shitload of tweaks for playability. Encumbrance is simple and usable. Overland travel and exploration rules take it into account without making everything a game of line item per-ounce weight management. The domain game and manor management systems are excellent, and work even without giving NPCs any character levels.
Thieves and the Skill system are completely changed: now you can pretty much start out a Specialist as an expert in any one thing, instead of barely-competent in any of them. It's also easy to make a wilderness guide or jaeger or a second-storey man instead of the generic "ninja" thief that most D&D runs with.

Combat magic is mostly curses and environment manipulation, not blowing shit up. There isn't much of it, either. Mages are more about getting other people to solve their problems and then playing with minds and souls.
Did I mention potions and scrolls are extremely easy to make in LotFP, as compared to most systems?

Clerics go full Paladin; they gain more - and more powerful - anti-magic than wizards, and the iconic Cleric in Lamentations is Alice here. Magical healing is dangerous but useful. Turning is now a spell, but does a Hell of a lot more than it used to (including fucking up Elves..)

Fighters are the only class to get better to-hit numbers as they level, and top-tier armor is much harder to get. That, and guns ignoring armor, helps keep power creep under control. A properly-supported fighter (especially with Army of One) becomes a goddamned Cuisinart at higher levels - but a militia platoon with a couple musketeers is still a serious threat to a mid-level party.

Basically it's worth looking at the rules just for the mechanics, and if you like one of the setting styles I sketched out above take a look at some of the modules.

>>54734296
I feel like people need to give more information when they ask questions like "can I run (thing) with OSR?" seeing as OSR means different things to different people. What exactly is it about OSR games that gave you the idea in the first place to run a Chrono Trigger-like campaign with it?

>>54734540
I mean if you want?

You could alternatively do something like throw in Stars Without Number's Psychic skills and Martial Arts stuff, but only for non-Mages, and only in a limited amount.

That way you can have all the JRPG bullshit you want from your warriors with minimal real effort on your part; since they're skills from a system you're already partially using, it doesn't take much work to import them.

Now I personally don't care much for skills at all anymore, so if I was doing this I'd probably grab classes from a mix of systems that allowed me to do the things I wanted, like some of Kaigaku's neat and more supernatural schools, SWN's psychic powers, and some homebrew left over from my attempt to bring more modern (like, 5+) Final Fantasies into OSR (rather than just "run B/X for FF1"), and then rejigger those psychic powers a bit to be passed out when people level up like special moves.

That's a shitload more work, though, and I'm not sure it's worth it.

I might also just ban Mages outright and replace them with the Psychic class refluffed as Wizards. Vancian Magic hasn't really been JRPG-esque since FF1, since, you know, FF1 was literally a D&D game.

>>54734847
Colorfull characters with colorfull abilities but still challenge the players

>>54734714
How deadly is it compared to the other systems?

>>54735222
>Colorfull characters
That seems like more of an aesthetic/player/DM/campaign thing

>with colorfull abilities but still challenge the players
2E perhaps? By colorful abilities, do you mean limit breaks like Omnislash? That doesn't seem very OSR to me personally.

>>54735244
Similar to B/X, although some of the new spells will fuck you up and the LotFP-specific modules are pretty hardcore. One thing of note is that only the fighter advances his attack bonus, everyone else is stuck at +1.

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Hit point idea: HD aren't rolled at all.

First level characters gain half their full HD on first level, plus half constitution bonus rounded up. He gets the rest incrementally as he gains experience. For instance, if an elf has d6 HD, then an average-CON starting elf has 3 hit points. If he needs 4000 experience points to reach level 2, then he will have 4 hit points on 1333 experience, 5 on 2666, and so forth. So any character of the same level and same constitution would always have more or less the same number of hit points.

Monster hit dice are still rolled as normal, but the dice explode: for any 8s rolled, throw a new die. Once there are no more 8s, count the hit points together and divide by 8, rounding up. The result will be the monster's actual HD. For instance, a bugbear has HD 3+1, so I roll three dice and gain 7, 6, and 8. For that 8 I get a new roll, which is 6. Adding the +1, the total hit points for this bugbear are 28. His effective HD becomes 3+4. His friend only rolls 2, 7, and 6, which (with the +1) comes down as 16, making him precisely a HD 2 creature.

So everyone has more hit points across the board, but that's all right - damage dice explode as well.

Immediate consequences:
A) All characters are equally tough. No more begging for a reroll when your new level HD comes up as 1.
B) Game start is slightly tougher, but any characters that make through that will be slightly tougher overall, and as such can take a few more risks and not end up killed by some sudden surprise.
C) A bit steadier character progression, with tiny incremental advancements rather than more rare but big ones.
D) Combat is more to be avoided: a regular 1d4 dagger has its damage explode 25% of the time, which could get nasty if it keeps going.
E) More variety to monsters and their abilities, in other ways than just hit points, with weaker runts and the occasional real tough bugger.

Good idea, bad idea? Would there be more drawbacks that I haven't considered?

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>>54734847
Uh, in my case?
Frogman Paladin, a vicious cavegirl, and a time-displaced mad scientist/wizard with a wand of Magic Missile dicking over an Elvish archlich with Generic Fantasy Hero #45 sounds pretty damned gonzo-early D&D to me.

>>54735244
>How deadly is it compared to the other systems?
I've run twelve sessions with around thirty different characters. Only three have died from things other than "idiots wandering into traps without checking them" and "let's go kick a town guard in the nuts and call him a faggot" syndrome. One caught a bullet to the face in a melee, another fell in a pit trap while pulling some crazy-awesome heroics (she sacrificed her mail to avoid the killshot), and the third got caught in the blast fumbling some Gunpowder Plot shenannigans. If your players are careful and tactical they'll have pretty good odds of living, but it's rare to just chimp them out of existence. Unless they start fucking with magic.

>>54708705
Best dragons are found in True AD&D® since this encompasses all forms of BD&D, OD&D, 1E, and 2E with everything therein included.

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>>54735690
Wait, I forgot the Persian merc who decided to go fuck the spider-girl in Dunnsmouth, that's four. He didn't die >on-screen< but yeah, he dead as hell.

>>54735601
i give my PCs full HP off their first HD, if their class has 2 starting HD they roll the second.

i never cared for exploding dice; VtM uses something similar on rolling 10s and it gets out of hand quite fast

>>54735690
>Frogman Paladin, a vicious cavegirl, and a time-displaced mad scientist/wizard with a wand of Magic Missile dicking over an Elvish archlich with Generic Fantasy Hero #45 sounds pretty damned gonzo-early D&D to me.
Then I'd say you should try to run it.

>>54735222
Pretty much the same amount of deadly, but lower level stuff doesn't get much safer as you advance.

>>54715982
True AD&D® with no subset—in other words, 2 from summer of 2000 on down. What some would call "2E". But the key here is the FORGOTTEN REALMS® campaign setting.

Things in the Realms are more high-powered, high-magic. An introductory adventure will see the characters discover untold treasure, from magical weapons to transportable valuables to magical items of all sorts. In exchange for these riches, they will have to overcome myriad foes of various types.

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>>54733804

I'm already planning on doing something like this. Make the game more fantasy video game RPG style, a bit more lighthearted.

The way to do it is to have healing magic and potions be more common, if not ubiquitous. Magic item shops that sell wands are pretty common. Wizards should either have battle cantrips or weapons like rods that can spam elemental blasts every turn, adding their intelligence modifier to the damage roll.

You could make all currency GP or maybe just 'coins' which is kind of what I'm doing.

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>>54735880
>dokapon kingdom

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>>54735729
Rope ought to be an inventory staple.

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>>54735880
>lighthearted
I've never had that game end well.

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If you run a game with ritual magic/folk magic, should everyone be able to do it? Magic users just do it best?

>>54736071
Don't see why not. Even the fighter or thief could join in and help out if the wizard tells them exactly where to stand and what to say. Otherwise, probably not.

>>54736071
If you need magic affinity to do it, then no.
If any sentient creature can do it, then yes.

>>54736071
Folk magic leeches off nearby MUs, probably willingly.
There's 2 or 3 in every village.

>>54736071
I've thought about this.
>rituals are almost impossible to use in combat
>casting time is an hour or more
>requires more material components that standard spellcasting

Or you can go the High Magic route and give everyone cantrips.

>>54735721
I see you've finally found these threads.

>>54735721
>OD&D
>any iteration of Basic/Classic
>parts of True AD&D™

Away with thee, peasant.

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>>54736187
There are plenty of ways to fluff vancian casting, but you've basically described the main one.

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>>54736369

This fluff is fucking abysmal.

>>54736691
Way better than all the living spells bullshit at least.

>>54736369
god it must suck being an extremely learned MU who for "reasons" can't remember something you've studied extensively throughout your career even with a fucking refresher every morning, because you're a retard or something

>>54736950
it's like holding in a shit dude

>>54737012
I'm not sure I follow the analogy lol

>>54737135
Preparing a spell = taking a tonne of laxatives
Holding a spell = holding a shit
Casting a spell = taking a big fat ogre shit

>>54736950
>>54737165
But in this case, isn't "preparing" and "holding" the spell the exact same thing?

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>>54737135
What's not to get?

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>>54737135
It desperately wants out. It's fucking hard to remember all of the individual intonations and cadences required for each syllable of a spell that's basically like reciting Beowulf in the original Old English without really knowing Old English.

You have a fucking migraine going over the spells over and over again as you also need to pay attention to all of the typical dungeoneering stuff. Imagine the stress of lugging around ANY armor with all that.

>>54737165
>>54737176
>>54737213
>>54737233
yall need to use the restroom more regularly if you're holding in your grumpies like that

>>54737233
as an aside: people who existed in the real world memorized their peoples' entire history without any of it being written down. not to mention musicians memorizing hours of music for things like marching bands.

i hate to beg the question but is it really that much of a stretch to play pretend that a person who has access to the powers that bind reality together can't do so reliably and without impedance?

>>54736950
My interpretation is that 'knowing' and 'preparing' a spell are the same, so the memory of the spell is consumed in the casting.

>>54737337
i meant impediment, obviously

>>54737337
Except this is less just Beowulf and more like memorizing equations that are the length of Beowulf and done with roman numerals and other non standard forms of mathematical notation. It doesn't have any helpful alliteration or other sorts of verse like Beowulf either. It's basically gibberish that makes things happen if you can do it right. That's why it takes a good degree of training and apprenticeship to even remember one (1) spell.

>>54737337
is it really that much of a stretch to play pretend that a person who has access to the powers that bind reality together can't do so reliably and without impediment?
is it really that much of a stretch to play pretend that a person who rolled a boulder up a hill can't will other boulder up hill reliably and without impediment?

>i hate to beg the question
You aren't begging the question
http://philosophy.lander.edu/logic/circular.html

>>54737383
To address your actual point though, our frame of reference are too far out of alignment for productive discussion.
D&D uses the term memorize because Gary mistook his thesaurus for a highschool diploma. Nobody here likes or literally interprets that phrasing.

I guess >>54737353 does, but he's a faggot.

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>Quick and Easy weapon damage size rules

For each of the following that is true, increase the die size by one category. All weapons start at d2, then go to d4, then d6, etc.

>Is the weapon sharp or penetrating?
>Is the weapon heavy enough to crack bone?
>Is the weapon at least as long as your arm or could be held with both hands for a big swing?

Knives, bricks and quarterstaves are d4
Swords, spears, flails, and Morning stars are d6
Halberds, Battleaxes, and War Picks are d8

Any questions?

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>>54737524
It's just a different fluff interpretation, you fucking autist. Instead of spending time just "memorizing" the spells or whatever, the wizard casts them pre-emptively and then leaves them in his head almost but not completely done, like a premade package meal you just need to heat up when you need to eat.

Why could it not work that way?

>>54737590
>Why could it not work that way?
Because that's not what you're describing

>so the memory of the spell is consumed in the casting.

>>54737572
>d2
"No."

>>54737572
>any questions?
what about ranged weapons like crossbows and stuff?
I like this though.

>>54737353
Do you not allow memorizing multiple copies of the same spell, then?

>>54737827
If I was designing my own hack of Vancian magic, I would not. If I'm running a system that does allow it, I would.
Of course, I've never actually GMed anything and have no plans to, so it's kind of a moot point.

>>54735601
>Would there be more drawbacks that I haven't considered?
A great deal more bookkeeping, what with having to keep up about three different attack roll counts even in the same pack of goblins.

>>54736188
You mean you finally found them? You seem confused.

>>54736239
Face it churl—excluding things from the canon of literature is for false editions. The spirit of True AD&D® is inclusive. 2E sources constantly refer to all manner of helpful resources, from forms of BD&D to OD&D to 1E to CHAINMAIL.

How long does a normal combat session take for any of your games of B/X and its clones?

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>>54737824

For ranged;
>Does the projectile fire faster then a human could throw it?
>Is the projectile or weapon as long as you arm?
>Is it sharp or penetrating?
>Is it hard enough to break castle walls?

Slings, darts, bolas deal 1d4 damage.
Javelins, crossbows, hunting bows, and hurled boulders deal 1d6 damage.
Longbow, ballista, and black powder weapons would deal 1d8 damage.

The last one only applies to shit like cannonballs and and trebuchet. That way you can have stationary siege weapons that deal 1d10 damage.

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>Oriental Adventures designs the monk from the ground up for martial arts combat
>everyone can use martial arts
>presents us with only 3 different kinds of martial arts
For what purpose? It's a good thing that True AD&D® contains more information. In addition to the Complete Book of Ninjas, we have this.

>>54738200
>For what purpose?
ZEB THE DESTROYER

rolling for stats is stupid

>>54738200
The three martial arts the book presents are just the examples: really you're supposed to build yours from the ground up.

>>54738268 has only played false editions.

>>54738268
heretic

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>>54738268

The opposite is the case. Not rolling for stats is stupid.

If you use point buy, rarely will players ever gimp themselves with shitty stats and make sure they have 10s across the board OR they will minmax, having annoying specialized characters.

If you use an array, every character is the same.

Only with randomly rolled stats do you have people who have to build a useful character out of shit. Yes sometimes it isn't fair and sometimes your stats are shit, but you can either push on or if they're so bad they're useless they won't live too long anyway.

>>54738324
>I need randomized bullshit to get my stunted imagination going!
Fuck you, no one's stopping you from just putting your stats however they "fit the character" if you so wish.

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>>54738268
It really isn't. It's a good way to get players to think more openly about what they're willing to play and maybe try something new.

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What's a really cool, evocative name for a fantasy heartbreaker / OSR homebrew game that hasn't been taken yet?

>>54738367
Doomrift.

>>54738350
>no one's stopping you
The referee is.
>fit the character
Almost nothing inspires as well as constraint.

>>54738367
>>54738388
the Eternal Age of Doomed Rifts

>>54738268
nah m8.
Random character gen has a few things to recommend it.
>much harder for the twink in the group to minmax when the numbers are random. The focus is on doing well with what you rolled, rather than assigning values efficiently. So it shifts the skillful portion of the game from character-gen to actually in play.
>in high-lethality games, much quicker than assigning points. It's not much of a thing, but it can make a difference.
>renders each character rolled up somewhat unique, since the dice rolls are out of your control. Dying sucks, because you lose that set of attributes. Think of it as like playing a roguelike.
>rolling dice is fun. Seeing what the RNJesus gives you for a character is fun, as is looking at your rolled stats and working out what they mean about your character.

See, non-random cgen also has its selling points, but rolled stats continue to be used because people see some value in them.
I mean, fuck, I managed to baffle my last 5e GM by asking if I could roll 3d6 in order for stats and then pick my class with a d12. Fenni the Dwarf was mechanically sub optimal (well, she was a bard, so not THAT sub-optimal), but felt much more like a real character than something I'd put together with complete control.

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>>54735880
>Dokapon Kingdom
Myman.jpg. I've yet to find a game as fun as thiz with the same mechanics. I know these sorts of party RPG games were a thing in Japan, but most either don't have the same charm as Dokapon Kingdom or are a different genre altogether.

>>54738270
Then why wouldn't everyone choose 3 attacks per round, d8+ base damage, and base AC 2 or whatever the best is?

The above PDF contains detailed information about how to build a martial arts style within actual guidelines rather than cheats one simply assigns to one's imaginary system.

>>54738367
what's your project's USP?

>>54738437
I haven't read Oriental Adventures recently, but I'm fairly certain there were limitations to it.

>>54738388
>>54738408
>>54738388
>rift
>Rifts

*blocks your path*

>>54738283
I imagine that if he'd played True editions such as those encompassed by True AD&D® then he would be aware of the various point-assignment methods available to DMs. Even the "Living City" method must be respected as valid. FACT!

>>54738459
>RPGA
>valid

>>54738367
I've dibs on the best I know.

>>54738411
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oppin

>>54738453
Naw, just the examples and then "do whatever you want". Only the "how to actually create your own style in a fair manner" article within the collection above has limitations.

>>54738473
What makes it an invalid example of a TSR-published point-buy system?

>>54738456
*teleprots behind u*
*unzips dick*

>>54738200
>>54738270
>>54738437
>>54738453
>>54738566
Do you think this would be good for stuff like what I'm doing here >>54734460?

>>54738671
my monk PC can describe whatever backflipping nonsense he wants but he's still rolling unarmed damage. i personally wouldn't want to try making martial abilities with spell-like flavor (one-inch punch, "chakra" healing, etc...)

hey lads, what's the WORST osr product (module, system, etc) you've ever seen?

>>54738947
Seclusium of Orphone.

>>54738947
N2

>>54738367
Forge of Chaos: The Darkness Wars

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>>54738947
>hey lads, what's the WORST osr product (module, system, etc) you've ever seen?
The Druid's Lament, FRPG day module for C&C about three years ago.
• Druid is rape
• She's a blatant Mary Sue Half-elf half-angel horseshit character
• Summons monster which goes out of control, drags off kid from local village
Here's where shit goes off the reservation, though. Follow along and tell me where your parties would hand the bitch over to the 5-0 and/or hang her themselves..
The party is explicitly hired to hunt down the person or creature responsible. She is found at the end of the tracks leading out of the village and IMMEDIATELY confesses to the party that she's responsible. But it's okay because Rape as Backstory and what hero would drag a CLEARLY INNOCENT Chaotic half-elf back to justice when they could follow her to fix her fuck-up?
She then immediately leads the party into a completely unavoidable deathtrap (a Hanging Tree) which explicitly states the party cannot notice it no matter how many precautions they take.
So the NPC can "save" them and put them into a dungeon that's literally full of funhouse undead, an utter bullshit Rot Grub level trap, and a selection of shitty cursed/+1 items and a sack of coins, plus a dead kid.


But it's cool because she totally owes you now, man, and she'd be happy to show you how to get back out of the trackless wilderness she just dragged you through for three days. So you can explain to the villagers that she's totally innocent of summoning the thing you just killed that murdered a literal baby.

>>54735601
I like the idea of exploding monster HP, but I'm not so sure about the numbers. Specifically:

A (normally) 3 HD creature has an average HP of 13.5 (sd=2.29) with the standard system. With this system, the average HP is going to be 15.43 (sd=3.56*). A 15.43 HP creature, by your system, has a little less than 2 HD.

That is, by your system, a 3 HD creature typically has less than 2 HD.

The chance of it having 3 or more effective HD looks to be about 10% at a glance*. And some of that is more than 3 HD. I don't know if you care that there's not even a 10% chance of having effective HD equal to the written HD. Try it yourself --- I just did to test, and I only got 1 fully 3HD creature in 30 rolls.

Personally, I'd suggest having HD = number of dice rolled. Then, a 3HD creature is 7/8 going to be 3HD, but has an 11% chance of being 4HD, a 1% chance of 5HD, etc. Keep the bonus HP the same. So a 3+1 written HD creature has a 7/8 chance of 3+1, 11% of 4+1, etc.

That said, the idea of not rolling HD at all for players is gross in my opinion. Apparently people like it though. And honestly it just sounds like a huge tedium to track the partial levels' HP.

(*I'm not 100% sure about these, but they should be accurate enough.)

>>54738947
I think Castle Spulzeer is up there.

>In fact, the doors are wizard locked, and an illusion creates the image of the open door. The doors themselves, however, are rotted. Like the residents of this decomposing castle, they have only decay at their cores.

oh sweet jesus I might have fucked up the twopage spreads for Wolfpacks 2e so now I need to stick an extra blank page at the beginning (so the odd-numbered pages become even and visa versa, meaning it prints right) and then go through and add 1 to all the page numbers.
this is as bad as the time I discovered that drivethrurpg doesn't print hardbacks in a4 so I had to change all the page sizes and then manually re-arange the layout to fit.
It is 5am and I have the sleepymadness, why do these things happen D:

>>54740520
You can finish it later, no need to hurry

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>>54740520
>and then go through and add 1 to all the page numbers.
M a r k u p L a n g u a g e s
Or even, like, any software.

Hell, even raw Postscript can do that.
Are you hand-coding the pdf? y tho.

>>54740775
>Are you hand-coding the pdf? y tho.
it's being done pixel-by-pixel in MS paint.
(actually, I'm using microsoft publisher because it came for free on my laptop and I was 75% of the way in before I realised there were better options.) (I am not good with computers.)
But ehh, it's basically just a matter of ctr-f-ing 'page' and going through it. Shouldn't take more than 20 minutes or so once I have my brain back from the caffeine monster.

>>54741142
https://youtu.be/zKN9T7RaY9A

http://summon.totalpartykill.ca/

>Collective Unconscious Desire for Suicide

>You fucked up. You have summoned Collective Unconscious Desire for Suicide. That's not going to be good.

>>54741219
omg yes this is amazing
I shall sleep now
anon has saved what's left of my sanity

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3MB, 1360x4823px

>>54741274
>

>>54741290
Fax me what's left of your redbull.

>>54741398
>9 fucking pages for a summon spell

wew

>>54741578
Needs more tables.

>>54741699
And more purple prose.

>captcha: ciras Wormshill

>>54742115
Nah. It's got about the right amount of that.
Maybe too much.

>>54738947
This: >>54739000
It's so hollow and useless it's barely even a product. The maps are so terrible that they're genuinely worse than having no maps at all. Repetitious, vast amounts of effectively empty pages, I could go on. It boils down to a hardcover book with MAYBE three good magic devices in it.

>>54739719
Maybe give the monsters full HD apart from the last one, so in the case of the bugbear it'd have 17+1d8 hit points? And if that last roll goes to an 8 as well, then give him an extra HD and roll again.

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So why do you guys REALLY hate armor as damage reduction?

>>54745247
It adds several layers of complexity for very little practical gain.

>>54745247
Because it's a shit rule? What?

>>54740520
Most word processing software has features for automatic page numbering in the footer, automatic updating table of contents, etc.

>>54745247
I'm ok with it in Into the Odd. In that game, attackers deal damage automatically, so Armor Class is removed entirely.

Otherwise, yeah, it's another node on the combat flowchart.

Is there a more OSR film than Princess Mononoke?
>negotiating with multiple human and monster factions
>leader of Iron Town is probably a name level fighter
>Enemy mooks fail their morale check several times

>>54745547
Die Hard.
>Party enters an urban dungeon crawl
>Everything's planned, everyone has a role (i.e. a class)
>Many floors of gunning shit down
>Random encounters
>Pissing off a high-level enemy, gradually suffering a TPK

>>54728356
>specifying distinct means of healing distinct types of damage is too crunchy
>calculating the individual AC bonus from a gorget and one sabaton is not

u wot

>>54745547
The Descent
>party of spelunkers trapped in a cave system desperately fending off subteranean monsters as they try to escape. It goes badly, the only survivor is thoroughly fucked up.

>>54746023
Big Trouble in Little China
>a knife-specialized Rogue and a Monk fight a gang to rescue a girl and treasure, get captured, escape from a dungeon, recruit a local wizard and gangsters for another dungeoncrawl, and the Rogue kills a lich

>>54745247
Because it doesn't contribute to the theme of dungeon-crawling.

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>>54745547
Is this bait?