So will the War in Heaven be retconned to fit the whole eternal

>>54696436
I would rather make Necron lords mock Chaos Gods and demons by calling them young kids. They are in fact younger than surviving Necrons.

>>54696436
GW's Chaos fetish means that the series is going to end in Chaos winning because it's eternal and all-powerful and fuck the fans.

>>54696436
I hope not, I like the Necrons and Old ones being the original galaxy spanning fuck you war, with chaos gods coalescing after that (even though theyre eternal and timeless or some shit)

But GW has a fucking rock hard cock for chaos, so itll probably turn out chaos influenced the war in heaven and birthed itself and chaos is 100% unbeatable no matter what. Even if EVERY race including nids teamed up, and increased their numbers 1000% and all went full anti chaos.

Nah chaos would kick their ass cause "so evil"

>>54697418
So a bunch of edgy 12 year Olds in man suits are running the show?

>>54697433
Pretty much, I don't dislike the idea of chaos, I just want it to be an enemy that the imperium has a chance to triumph over.

When they write it as "Khorne could destroy the entire universe if he swung he sword once" its a bit shit. Chaos is infinite and unbeatable and numberless and the most powerful and will always win. Just chaos wank

>>54697433
Yes. I mean have you looked at the setting? It's meant to pander to edgy babbys, and chaos is the edgiest babby of them all

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>mfw still holding out hope that newcrons get retconned back into oldcrons

>>54697474
Yeah. The constant power creep, the divorcing chaos from needing or being born from mortals, the everything is just as planned, and the fact that the warp always equals chaos, and chaos always equals the big 4, etc etc , just makes the setting a lot worse

>>54696436
can we just retcon chaos out of 40k? The whole thing would be much much better without chaos, or with chaos getting killed early

>>54696436
>So will the War in Heaven be retconned to fit the whole eternal chaos thing GW has been pushing?

No.

They added just a few minor details. The War in Heaven caused the walls of reality to be forever be shattered unleashing Chaos daemons who in junction with the Necrons caused the Old Ones to go into exile.

The Necrons banished the daemons and constructed the Pylon network. They are all what are holding the galaxy above the warp. Should they be completely destroyed, then the galaxy sinks into the Warp and goes bye bye. the Necrons turned on the C'tan and sharded them and put them inside boxes. Then came the Eldar other servants of the Old Ones to chase the Necrons away. The Necrons pylon network was left incomplete and not fully activated.

As time went, the pylon network slowly but surely started getting damaged by natural disasters or by intentional or unintentional action of agents of Chaos and alien races. When a set of pylons get destroyed, the work load of the destroyed pylons is transferred across the network to the other but that puts a lot pressure on the reminding networks and causes damage. according to the lore the guys who created the pylons did not foresee the bullshit that was the birth of the Eye of Terror but it was a stroke of luck that the Cadian pylons were in their place or the cascading wave of shit would have sundered the galaxy. Anyways, where was I? Ah yes. As more pylons were destroyed, the power of Chaos grew in the galaxy. Warpstorms became the norm, frequent daemonic activities, and now we got a cracked galaxy.

But there is a hope. The Cadian Pylons when fully activated not only pushed back the Eye of Terror but threatened to seal it up. Erase it from the fabric of reality. If the remaining few remaining pylons could be activated. If Cawls Imperial Pylons are perfect replicas of the Necron Pylons and used to fill the gabes in the network, then all will be well. Happy ending for all.

Does this make sense to you?

>>54697518
Why? I mean the fluff totally supports having basically an oldcron style mindless killer robot dynasty but doesn't necessarily require them to be that way.

>>54697479
the setting is very stupid epic, but i hate the fact that there are like 4 factions that are the "super duper mega evil guys who are ancient and evil and so evil" which fits and than you have fucking chaos which just has to one up everything. Chaos is the kid on the playground that keeps screaming "invincibility shield" every time he is about to louse or someone one ups him, and no one liked that kid

>>54697668
So could they just put a pylon on terra and fix the giant demon hole in the palace? Maybe take some strain off of Big E.

>>54697668
Continued....

Basically the Necron Pylons are to 40K what the Vortex was to WHFB.

tl;dr all of this is that the Necrons did nothing wrong.

>>54697648
Replace chaos with tau, and you'd be right.

>>54697723
No, that's stupid. An activated set of pylon would not only obscure the Golden Light, it would kill 99% of the psykers on Terra including the Choir that powers the Golden Light.

>>54697761
Tau make little seans but i can stomach them, fuck, i love playing my adeptus mechanicus agients tau because im feeling like im having a steampunk vs SF fight, chaos just sucks all the fun out of the whole universe

>>54697750
Necrons did a lot wrong, but they're doing the best they can, and that's why they're a great faction. Dead men have no need for grudges.

>>54696702
That's the gayest thing they could do

"Haha! We're just the tip of the iceberg cause the rest of the berg got BTFO by our own decisions!"

>>54697723
Or smother him...

>>54697761
Nah. Tau are okay, and basically inconsequential.

Chaos has to stick their greasy edgy fingers into every part of the setting, be responsible for literally everything that's ever happened, and still have to jack themselves off to how omnipotent and invincible the chaos gods are

>>54697648
Honestly I think it works best if chaos is caused by the Imperium's actions, and is in a sense dependent on it (or at least humanity). I get the idea of grimdark based around that there was never really a chance at all, and that chaos will eventually devour everything, but personally, I think it works better if humanity did have its chance and pissed it away. (Especially if said pissing away was done primarily by big E, because that makes the autistic screeching all the sweeter). I think it works best if Chaos is very powerful, but only in the warp, and has a sharply limited ability to affect anything in the real, material realm, and maybe while it can't be ultimately destroyed, could theoretically be sealed away forever, if not for the fact that the major powers in the milky way all have their heads up their collective asses.

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The Old Ones weren't idle. Before the War in Heaven by billions of years, Chaos daemons were a problem. So the Old Ones created Daemonic Cages. Planet sized devices created to be prisons for billions of daemons. With them the Old Ones kept the galaxy safe.

>>54697953
>The First Captain, initially angry at the Magos’ imperious summons, had become serious and engaged as Ivasnophon revealed the nature of the technology that he sought upon Amethal. It was an ancient prize, something made by those who ruled the galaxy long before the first Terran life forms emerged from the primordial ooze. Other examples of its sort had been found across the galaxy from time to time, hints at an incredibly potent weapon against the powers of Chaos. Ivasnophon specialised in the location, excavation and imitation of such archeotechnological treasures. For centuries he had been following a tenuous trail of clues towards this, his greatest find. Amethal was not a planet, he explained, but rather a skin of rock and biosphere stretched as camouflage over an ancient cage. Vast beyond belief, wreathed in arcane wards and dark technologies, it was a prison-eternal for daemonic entities. It was the Magos Dominus’ belief that the Amethal Cage contained hellish beings beyond count, trapped for millennia behind warded bars. Why the ancients had sought to isolate these creatures from the Warp was a mystery lost to the mists of time, but the Magos was certain they had succeeded. Captain Karlaen was horrified at this revelation, for if that were true, then the empyric inmates of this world represented a dreadful danger to the defences around the Cadian Gate. At the same time, he was not slow to grasp Ivasnophon’s purpose on this world. Building upon his countless decades of study and experimentation, the Magos Dominus was at last nearly able to replicate the technologies of the Daemon cage. He was weeks, months at most, from creating – and then mass producing-devices that could cage Daemons on a vast scale. Though not a permanent solution to the daemonic threat, such devices might end daemonic incursions as soon as they began, and thus turn the tide in the war for the Cadian Gate.

-Angel's Blade

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>>54696436
I sooner expect them to reintroduce the Old Ones as Space Dorfs.

>>54697919
but there is really no point in chaos, there are allredy like at least 3 great threats to the whole galaxy.
You have the tyranids who want to omn everything
The necrons who have thech that can erase whole solar systems with a touch of a button
the orks that want to turn everything into a non-stop brawl
And in this whole shitstorm you have chaos, which is always more powerfull, always more undefeated, always more edgy, always better than everything else and has allredy won. Why would you ever do this? Maybe the idea of "if we join forces we could do something about it" could work, but that still not only kills the threat of all the other evil factions because there is always the stronger chaos in the backround, but also makes the setting kind of pointless. Why would anyone do anything if chaos allredy won, why not just worship the chaos gods and get this shit over with

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Now that it's confirmed that Chaos Daemons were a thing at the time of the Necrontyr and Old Ones, how does that make you feel?

>>54698034
They were literally described as large and reptilian, lizardmen slaan are probably the closest thing we have

>>54698165
It's retarded. It makes no sense that Horny,Angry, Wizard, AIDS exist across all time when at least three of them are intimately, explicitly tied to mortal races for existence or sentience

>>54698170
Exactly. I sooner expect them to do that. It'd be Oldcrons & Newcrons all over again.

>>54698170
But consider: Frog Dwarves

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>>54696436
Remember in WHFB how the War of the Beard was enormous yet had nothing to do with Chaos?

>>54698205
Time has no meaning in the Warp.

>>54698225
Malekith caused the War in Beard. Everything that has happened to Malekith and everything he did was because of Chaos.

>>54698251
>Everything that has happened to Malekith and everything he did was because of Chaos
>muh phoenix king
>muh mother fucking

>>54698225
Didn't some campaigns in 40k feature no chaos at all? Like the imperium vs tau and eldar vs I don't remember?

>>54697953
>>54698016
Hang on, I thought the Immaterium was peaceful in those days?

>>54698232
Which is just a handwave so chaosfags can always be relevant

>>54698270
Octarius used to.

>>54698268
>>muh phoenix king

Chaos whispered into the minds of the Elven council and made them refuse to have Malekith as their king

>muh mother fucking

Slaanesh whispers influenced the rise of the Pleasure Cults which Morathi led.

>>54698165
I van imagine some daemons existed in the time when the warp was the realm of souls, it's just that when the boldness weaponized it they made it a breeding ground for them, like pouring a bunch of chemicals into the clean drinking water and not expecting contamination

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>>54698165
Just another day.

>>54698279
Not really peaceful but contained. Better managed. The Old Ones kept the daemons under control until the War of Heaven happened and then everything went to shit and the daemons got out and ran loose over the galaxy until the Necrons built their pylons.

Once again I must repeat, the Necrons did nothing wrong.

>>54698305
No I meant the ones that had a bunch of books coming out as well

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>>54697518
I know, anon; me too.

>>54698308
It was jumping into the fire that does it. Malekith was actually alright with the previous guy & he was making contact with the Dwarfs. The flame they jump into makes all the difference. He couldn't sit there a second longer & thus he was kicked out.

Wasn't there some Elven goddess of pleasure she worshiped?

>>54698374
>It was jumping into the fire that does it. Malekith was actually alright with the previous guy & he was making contact with the Dwarfs. The flame they jump into makes all the difference. He couldn't sit there a second longer & thus he was kicked out.

You know why Malekith was in a hurry? Malekith in his adventures found his iconic Iron crown in the ruins of a race the predated the arrival of the Old Ones. The Iron Crown sent Malekith's soul to the Realm of Chaos. Malekith saw the endless armies of the Chaos Gods spread like a vast endless ocean. He saw the thrones of the Chaos Gods. He knew then what must be done. He knew that only he and he alone can stop Chaos. For that to happen he must be KING.

>Wasn't there some Elven goddess of pleasure she worshiped?

Yes, but it was the influence of Slaanesh that popularised the cult and made it go extremist mode.

Chaos was a mistake

>>54698453
>Malekith
Malekith was kicked out either because he was a backstabbing douche & the elf gods knew it or it was all a part of a millennia long trial, taking tons of lives & damages everywhere, by those same elf gods to make Malekith better. Malekith was the witch king because he didn't become phoenix king. He prioritized it so much that he allied with Chaos on a few accounts to try & become phoenix king. If he was made phoenix king by the elf gods then & there, he would be far less butthurt.

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>>54698225
Reminder that the Phoenix King fucked up when he didn't chill the fuck out & have some tea.

>>54698685
Dude, in the eyes of Asuryan, Malekith did nothing wrong except for pussying out from the flames before his transformation was complete. Everything Malekith did after that did no change Asuryan opinion about him being his chosen.

>>54697518
But you can do Your Dudes as Oldcrons already within the Newcrons framework, just be a tomb world dominated by a C'tan shard.

>>54698349
Except for fucking the benevolent precursor race that held the galaxy in balance and peace purely because of their own bitterness. They're basically the beta test of Perty and the Iron Warriors.

>>54698812
>just be a tomb world dominated by a C'tan shard.

Cite a single official instance of that happening in the lore. People can bullshit any amount of headcanon into existence. What people want are official stories featuring their favourite version of the Necrons. They are sick about reading about Trazyn's misadventures. They want the horror stories of the oldcrons.

>>54698905
>needs only official lore and uses none of the wiggle room granted
How does it feel to lack creativity

>>54698970
How does it feel to miss the point? I can craft any story I want and fluff my army in any direction I want. I can make Necron ponies if I desired.

But you know what I and others enjoy? Reading official stories and lore. That's why we buy the novels and background books. When our version of the Necrons, or any faction for that matter, is removed or sidelined to irrelevance we are pissed.

>>54699020
>or any faction for that matter, is removed or sidelined to irrelevance we are pissed
Well anyone playing any xeno race must be pissed at the amount of Imperium and Chaos wank that's going on.

>>54696436
Modern chaos is the dumbest thing ever.

>Powerful, but finite and limited beings
>created from the dreams, nightmares and desires of sentient beings
>countered by the equivalent power of the Emperor, preceeded by the C'tan and Necrons etc etc
>extremely dangerous and powerful, but could not win due to the constant sacrifices and effort being put forward by humanity and other species
>even if they did win it would be pointless since complete destruction of their enemies means their own destruction as well

Nu Chaos

>Literally gods, in that they eternal, all knowing and borderline unlimited power
>even the Emperor is no longer a counter as he simply got his power from them for some reason
>they cannot be defeated, and even their seeming defeats are actually victories due to their unlimited wisdom, knowledge, foresight and power
>endgame is not only achievable, but inevitable

Not only does NuChaos ruin Chaos itself, but it ruins the Emperor, the Imperium, all of humanity's sacrifices and struggles, and everything else in the setting is worse off as a result.

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>>54699052
You mean all the Space Marine and Chaos wank. My Admech have been nothing but shat on in the recent books, Guard lost their faction world OFFSCREEN, Forge Worlds are continuously conquered with a fraction of the forces they should actually require, Admech and Inquisition rules got completely shafted and generally anyone but Ultramarines and to a lesser extent regular Marines isn't seeing shit. Don't conflate Imperium with Ultrasues, we hate them almost as much as you do.

I hate Tau SLIGHTLY more, but at least they're a good opponent in stories when they aren't randomly asspulling wins from everywhere and projecting the Enemy Redardification Field like they've been doing without fail for the last few years.

>>54699155
I think you mean Space Marine and CSM w/some demons wank. I like traitor guard, and my life is suffering

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>>54699155
Yeah I forgot if it isn't a Space Marine then it doesn't matter, this is like retconning Ollanius Pius into a terminator marine.

>>54699192
Same here traitor guard are treated like dead animals by CSM both inside and outside or lore.

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>>54699128
>all of humanity's sacrifices and struggles

Who knew that fighting evil with evil is pointless and at worse counterproductive? Hmm, Gue'la?

>>54699128
I don't even know how chaos players are ok with this you'd think it get boring if you faction wins no matter what, makes basically any battle or hardship null and void because you'll win anyway.

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>>54699284
Within Chaos there is a struggle between Mortals (Abaddon) and the Immortals (Chaos Gods). The Chaos ending branches to two outcomes. The Dark Imperium and the Daemon Imperium. Chaos players can work forward to seeing Abaddon's ambition achieved or seeing the Chaos unmake the galaxy.

Winning the Long War is just the beginning for Chaos.

>>54699260
>no warp presence
>just as evil but in a more insidious way
>literally no way to actually fight chaos

Shhh child, the grown ups are busy deciding the fate of the galaxy. You go back to pretending you're relevant.

>>54699339
Where is that pic from? Does Talon of Horus have pictures?

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>>54700314
The limited edition version had beautiful art of the four main characters.

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>>54698836
If the old ones were so kind, benevolent, and all loving why did they refuse to help the Necrontyr, who were dying in droves to the hellish blasts of their sun? What exactly were the old ones up to when they decided that keeping the daemons around instead of banishing them was a good idea?

Why did they need to meddle with the Sea of Souls in the first place? Don't give me that bullshit about warp travel either, the Necrons prove non-warp FTL is possible.

The Necrons wanted to keep the Warp, and therefore Chaos, completely unable to manifest in the material real. This should be the overriding goal of all sentient races. Even the Emperor's end goal was the eradication of Chaos, the Great Crusade to unite humanity just a means to an end.

Necrons
Did
Nothing
Wrong

>>54696436
What is that overlord saying to the farseer?

>>54700710
>you will suckle upon my robo dong for as long as you breath, only then will your craftworld be spared

>>54700710
>Do you think this thing looks goofy? Everyone keeps telling me it looks goofy. I swear to god if that cryptek lied to me

>>54700666
digits confirm necrons = master race

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>>54700666
>tfw we'll never get BL shit about the Necrontyr empire in its heyday

It's a damn shame, there's so much to explore there about their culture and the geopolitics and the Realm of Souls in its (relatively) peaceful days. But there'd be no way to involve Space Marines so I guess it's probably not in the cards.

>>54696881
Why would GW ever do something that ends the story, meaning they stop making money.

>>54701629
I play imperial fists but I would give my left nut to have an eldar v necrons specialty game

>>54701629
40k's lore was much more ienjoyable when 2/3s of it was vague and mysterious. Now that we know that the Emps is simply a Nazi scientist who got literally all his power from the Chaos gods, Horus is actually the hero of the story, all the primarchs are either faggots or suffer from daddy issues (or both), that Chaos is winning, and all the rest why bother? They took away the mystery and replaced it with fan fiction level shit. They've ruined Chaos, mankind, and you want them to ruin the Necrons too?

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>>54701730
If everything's already been ruined, then there's nothing to lose, right? Worst case scenario is that more shit is added to a shit pile, but on the off chance it's good then we get an interesting story about the glory days of a tragically fallen empire, and the waning of the best hope for Chaos' defeat. There's no way for us to lose in this scenario.

That said, most of the bad things in the current lore have come about as the result of retcons. There's nothing stopping future writers from retconning those retcons and reverting to older, better lore, or introducing entirely new better lore.

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>>54699218
>ruining the best 40k story in the lore
what did GW mean by this?

>>54701629
>spess muhreens get into a bad warp storm
>time traveled into the ancient past of Necrontyr Empire
>Necrontyr recognize they're not of this timeline and their presence is illogical
>EXTERMINATE
>Spess Mahreens see xenos
>EXTERMINATE

7/10 would read

>>54701819
Fair enough. My biggest fear is that, like the Primarchs, we have generally low level writers trying to tell stories about gods and demons and the like, and worse is that they're are trying to actually use them as if they were real characters with real motivations. It's impossible for them to create these characters because we can't step inside their frame of reference as readers, nor can they as authors, so it's all retarded. You are right that hopefully it will all be retconned back to the way it should be, or maybe they'll find a new direction that is actually cool and interesting again.

The worst thing about the current writing is that we have shit tier authors and thinkers trying to not only tell a story about gods, but they are then giving us lessons in fedora philosophy and morality and it's obnoxious as hell. If they are gonna do a Necron sub universe they need to get away from all that and just focus on making neat technologies, characters and races.

>>54699284
I don't like it at all. The endless struggle and ultimate pointlessness ultimately Chaos for me. The goal is war itself, not victory.

t.Black Legion Player

>>54700666
wtf i love necrons now

>>54701859
With how MoM portrays the Emperor odds are they are planning to retcon the entire story in general.

Why do chaos players whine so much when GW keeps trying to soothe their delicate egos?

>>54703115
Because Chaos never gets to win.

>>54703134
>literally won Fantasy in its entirety
>very recently blew up Cadia, a resounding loss for Imperials, Eldar and even Necrons
>now they've infested Ultramar

I honestly have no idea what you're talking about.

>>54703134

Here split the galaxy in half and blow up cadia
>wtf where are my chaos primaris, why didn't we get them first
no winning there

>>54698782
Holy fuck, THAT is what the End Times went with?
No wonder everyone I know thought it was shit.
Seriously, fuck Malekith.

>>54700666
>who were dying in droves to the hellish blasts of their sun?
Why is it the Necrontyr had the science to become an interstellar empire, but lacked the knowledge to cure their super cancer?

>>54706243
It was REALLY super.

>>54702792
Laurie Goldberg already said they are retconing the ending.

>>54706243
Wasn't it C'tan induced somehow?

>>54701669
So they can reboot the series and make even MOAR money.

>>54703134
Isn't the new shit just entirely chaos winning everything across the board?

>>54697433
>>54697474
Chaos was good back before 2009 or so in 40k, and before 2014 in Fantasy. After those years Chaos in their respective universes went from being this interesting Lovecraftian eldritch force of entropy and immorality that relied on fear, corrupted ignorance and vice to sustain itself, and instead became lol so evil lol so random we always win neener neener nothing personnel i hate my dad and preppy kids at school.

>>54703115
>>54703134
Every Warhammer fluff piece written after 2012 has been "Chaos wins and there's nothing you can do about it because they're evil exdee", I don't know where Chaos players get the idea that they always lose.

>>54699128
Well put

>>54699260
Kinda the point, my dude

>>54706981
You're joking right? Chaos '''''win''''' by achieving a side objective every time.

>>54707125

This.
Thousand Sons fan here. We wanted Fenris to burn. We wanted the Space Wolves home world destroyed and the yiffs fleeing with their tails between their legs.

NOPE. Once again, Thousand Sons are denied their vengeance. But we """"won"""" because BEE TEE DUBYAH GUISE WE JUST SUMMONED A DAEMON WORLD INTO REAL SPACE!"

>>54699128
>OldChaos: desperately trying to build their power in the warp so they can take over reality and live on, but inevitably too much Chaos destroys evetything and thus themselves, and they try to fight this, each god has a strong personality and their own goals

>NuChaos: infinite, omnipotent, neverending, unstoppable, evil and random for random evil's sake and they want to destroy all of reality because they rule it and are bored, too bad so sad

Fucking hell, I don't hate Chaos or the idea of it at all. I hate the bastardized and twisted shitheap that GW mutated them into in NuHammer. It's not even Chaos anymore, it's some edgy Sonic fanfiction shit.

>>54707184
It's certainly not chaotic anymore, as a necron/lizardmen fan, I much prefer the enemy having some compelling elements, a sense of stakes in the fight instead of a bitch GM fiating victory each time.

How did this even happen? What changed to make them like this?

>>54707450
Chaos was popular and became about as well-known as Space Marines to casual audiences (think of how many kids online you've heard type or say "BLUD FOR LE BLOOD GOD XD"), so they focused more on Chaos. It was profitable.

They also got a big staff change around the time Warhammer went to shit, 2008-2010, and many of the new staff were apparently avid Chaos fans.

There's also some level of fan hating in there, because even in the Storm of Chaos some fans complained that GW retconned the results to be more favorable to Chaos and kept shoving Archaon into everything.

Now, Chaos should be badass, strong, and scary, but some fans didn't like its new approach, even though it lost (an actual defeat and not just a "lol were just bored" loss like the shit NuHammer pulls).

GW responded to this by retconning it all and making Chaos stronger and Archaon more integral to the story; when fans complained more GW responded by retconning MORE lore and making Chaos even MORE strong and Archaon MORE integral to the story.

GW responded and still responds to nearly every complaint by making things worse. The more fans complained about Chaos being overpowered, the more overpowered they became. It happened in 40k first, but never picked up speed until Warhammer Fantasy was changed into Warhammer: The End Times (and later Age of Sigmar). when the Chaoswankery went to new levels.

40k players back then often said GW would never do such a thing to 40k and GW even said they wouldn't Age of Sigmar 40k back in 2015 or 16.

Now that Chaos is set to win unstoppably, the Emperor's getting some dumb storyline, and cartoony characters and casualized game mechanics are coming in, exactly like The End Times, it's looking like they lied, and we just didn't listen.

>>54697750
Necrons only fuck up was hating on a race letting them die from cancer.

The fuck ups are the Old Ones and their spawn.

Necrons unfucked all of their original mistakes like the C'tan and Chaos, but the Eldar are knuckle dragging retards who can't let shit go so we can't have nice things.

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>>54707176
Nothing is progressed in this universe it seems at this point by GW by either side really making any significant ground on one another in any event Its always the 'side objective' in the long run. And why? So that when 'significant events'(see dark imperium box set for more details) taken place they can profit from it with new models and novella, and of course even if chaos wins say something like FoK, do you really think that anything from this chain of events will change anything significantly fluff wise?

Maybe not unless that change can bring home the greenbacks

>>54698165
Comforting to know that they were irrelevant to the Titans that were walking around real space at the time and are cowed into world engines and labyrinths without any real effort.

Also puts a end mark on Chaos being a credible threat to anyone but weak Humans and reckless Eldar.

>>54697418
> "rock hard cock for chaos"
> Imperial codecs consistently more powerful than the Chaos ones

Top kek, mate

Man chaos is just annoying and whiny
As a faction and their fanbase

>>54707939
>Look Mom I posted it again!

>>54706850
Yep, the semisentient Nightbringer feasting on their star is what caused to be that way

>>54700666
>If the old ones were so kind, benevolent, and all loving why did they refuse to help the Necrontyr, who were dying in droves to the hellish blasts of their sun?
Because Necrontyr were violent assholes that kep constantly vaging wars among themselves (the main reason for declaring war on the Old Ones to unite the Necrontyr against a common enemy to keep them from killing eachother). They didn't feel they were deserving to be uplifted. Also, the Old Ones were kind of assholes, really.

>What exactly were the old ones up to when they decided that keeping the daemons around instead of banishing them was a good idea?
Where do you think daemons go when banished? Into the warp. Banishing them might get rid of them for a while, but they will inevitably come back. There's very few ways to permanently kill a daemon, and even if you do its essense simply returns to warp and may form into a new daemon. Trapping daemons into daemon-prisons in realspace on the other hand keeps them from manifesting again as long as they're trapped, and weakens Chaos as a whole. Grey Knigths do the same thing but on a smaller scale.

>Necrons prove non-warp FTL is possible
Yes, by making backdoors into the webway made by the Old Ones. Which is still sort-of warp-based. In new fluff Necrons used STL stasis ships to travel between planets until the War in Heavens when one of the C'tan showed them how to break into the webway.

At best Necrons managed to unfuck some of their own fuckups, but had they never started an interstellar war over their bitchfit the warp would not be nearly as huge problem and the Old Ones would've still have things under control.

>>54707184
>OldChaos: desperately trying to build their power in the warp so they can take over reality and live on, but inevitably too much Chaos destroys evetything and thus themselves, and they try to fight this, each god has a strong personality and their own goals
>something that literally never existed

>>54708388
>he thinks the Dolmen gates are the only way they can get round.
They had FTL drives in the fall of Orpheus, post newcron.

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What if the old ones created the Tyranids and are just butthurt they got wombo combo'd by Crons+C'tan's and space gribblies from beyond the veil.

65 million years later, still butthurt.

>>54707939

Here's your (You)

>>54708473
Near-light drives.

Are the Enslavers still a thing? Or was that retconned into just being Chaos?


>>54703227
They're eventually getting Primaris too, according to Codex fluff leaks. Bile's already working on it.

>>54707511
Had Storm of Chaos gone like it had on the Tabletop, Chaos wouldn't have even made it past Kislev. Compare that to Eye of Terror, where Chaos was pretty well organized and planned things out pretty well to start off.

>>54701859
>>54702792
>>54706782
My local blackshirt is convinced it's going to end with Horus actually on the throne.

>>54709144
>Are the Enslavers still a thing?

Still a thing. Mentioned in the rulebooks but not as important as they were in the Oldcron lore.

>>54709162
That's a pity. The Enslaver plague used to be one of the more interesting fluff pieces.

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>>54698225
>war of the beard
Lmao no, they retconned it to where the changeling/some tzeentch daemon was pulling strings to make sure the war ended up being as severe as it was. Literally everything is chaos now. It would be like if we had a purely xenos conflict for once and then chaos just had to show up for no reason with a bunch of their major char-

>>54696436
I doubt it.
On another note who would love to see a sub-game like 30k about the War in Heaven where you could play as Necrons/Ctan, Krorks (Orks), Eldar, or maybe even the Old Ones .

>>54697518
Not a necron expert so what's the difference between old and new crons?

>>54698905
There is one Tomb world where the Tomb world computer dumped everyones memories and turned them into mindless slaves and goes about doing the same to other Tomb worlds and fucks over living things in the process.

>>54709424
Newcrons are better in everyway except oldfags hate change so they're bad.

>>54709401
>hey retconned it to where the changeling/some tzeentch daemon was pulling strings to make sure the war ended up being as severe as it was.

Source zis.

>>54709436
That's not a C'tan. It's an AI pretending to be huma---Necrontyr.


>Message reads:
>Ignoble scion of a forgotten dynasty, your awakening disturbs the quiet of space, that stillness to which the necrontyr aspire. Your world will be calmed, your minds quieted, your bodies restored to order. The Tesseract Vault and its transcendent shard shall return to Sarkon, that the c’tan may again purge the stars of disquiet. As it was after the Wars of Secession, so it shall again be. Thus decrees the Emperor of the Severed.
>Message ends.
-Cold Steel

>>54709424
Newcrons are way more powerful now, but they gave them personalities and backstories and other stupid shit. They were better when they were soulless, unthinking killing machines.

>>54696436
Everything will be retconned so that chaos had something to do with it

>the changeling messed with the imperials during the Damocles crusade which explains their pants on head strategic retardation. Chaos wanted that war to drag on and drain the imperium
>Armageddon is only a focal point of war because it's secretly claimed by Khorne, not ullanor
>the tyranids are actually fleeing from other galaxies that were destroyed by chaos
>Iyanden only survived because a slaanesh warpstorm appeared and wiped out most of the fleet before they even reached Yriels corsair fleet
>The Rangdan xenocides and the pale wasting were just massive daemon incursions
>Farsight enclaves are actually being manipulated by chaos
>the flayer curse is actually a nurgle disease
>the war for Armageddon become a 4 way as tzeentch and Khorne transform it into a half daemon world to fight on
>the devastation of Baal only ends because a Khorne warp storm appears and wiped out most of the fleet before it even reaches Baal

>>54709424
Oldcrons were mindless automatons basically, the Lords had their minds more or less intact unless something went wrong during the sleep (99% of the time it did) and they woke up with a bad hangover. Fall of Damnos had Immortals with some sense of self but the majority of the fluff most of their troops were mindless.
They served the C'tan, at the time there was only 4 confirmed, The Deceiver, The Nightbringer, the Void Dragon and the Outsider
Their fluff was they lived on a planet which orbited a sun which gave them cancer, so much that even when they got off the world they still died at a early age compared to their "natural" life span. They met the Old ones and asked them for immortality or a long life, Old ones told them to fuck off so they started a war.
Old ones curbed stomped them and pushed them back to their shithole of a planet. The Necrontry being desperate started looking at anything that they could use as a weapon, even the dirt of their planet. Eventually they found a space vampire eating their star. They spoke to it and gave it a metal body so it could properly commincate on their "plain of existence" The C'tan was the Nightbringer and hated the Old ones, they then went off to find more and found the Deceiver. He offered them metal bodies of immortality. Them being fucked by cancer said yes. And so the Necrons were born and they went on to curbstomp the old ones with the C'tan.
Old ones shit themselves and started throwing out all kind of new races to stop them, Orks, Eldar, Space orangutans, etc which fucked the warp up and made the place we love today.

>>54709536
>They met the Old ones and asked them for immortality or a long life, Old Ones told them to fuck off so they started a war.

No, the oldcron Necrontyr did not ask the Old ones for anything. The Oldcron codex says that the Necrontyr when they met the Old Ones were enraged at the unfairness of their short lived suffering compared to the Old Ones blissful immortality. The Necrontyr threw everything they had to the Old Ones out of jealousy and bitterness.

>>54709536
Carrying on.
Newcrons werent dying of space aids, they just had a bad case of fighting amongst themselves, they had an empire but there was always infighting, imagine the Dune universe with its houses and the emperor and all the squabbling.
To stop themselves from tearing themselves apart they decided to try to fuck the old ones for a single cause, that back fired. They also at one point asked the old ones for immortality and got told no. Old ones curbed them to the edge of what was left of their empire.
They found the C'tan like before and the same thing happened, they lost their flesh and became metal.
They fucked the Old ones hard like before but afterwards they turned on the C'tan who betrayed them and made most of their race automatons. They broke the C'tan into pieces (they did manage to outright destroy one but it's apparently hard) 2 wars had crippled their race so they slept while the old ones other races came and went (orikan foresaw the fall of the Eldar)
When they woke up they still had their Dynasty system and lust for conquest so now they're tomb kings in space with good and bad intentions.

Also to add to my post the reason Oldcrons went to sleep was they had pretty much extinguished the majority of life in the galaxy at the time, the enslavers were killing off races too so the C'tan decided to sleep to let their feeding grounds return.

Old ones were space terminators which just showed up and fucked shit up, New crons are tomb kings in space. I like both, New crons allow for old crons to still be played but some people hate them.
I prefer oldcron fluff though.

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>>54709579
It's been a while since I even picked up a Necron codex, old or new so my mistake if that's the case.

>>54709619
Your post had a few minor mistakes other than it you did well.

>>54708473
Even if the old inertialess drives are canon, the newcron codex stated that pre-WiH they used STL "torch ships" for interstellar travel. So the inertialess drives would have been developed after the war started, and probably another example of the physics-breaking stuff the c'tan could do and out of reach of regular mortals (which would also explain why they still use the webway if they have inertialess drives; the latter is based on c'tan space-magic that even the necrons have a hard time producing so using webway is a lot easier than fitting inertialess drives on every ship).

>>54707511
So GW is... throwing a hissy fit and damages be damned?

>>54709581
Even newcronfans like adding the key elements of oldcron fluff to the backstory, the space cancer etc.

>>54709532
>Armageddon is only a focal point of war because it's secretly claimed by Khorne, not ullanor
Armageddon IS Ullanor.

>>54697953
>planet sized demon prisons
What other crazy shit did the old ones have all I recall is warp bone, psyker power, and biomancy.

>>54707511
I'd say in WHFB Chaos has always been THE big bad faction, much more than in 40k (where they've usually been "just" another galaxy-threathening doomsday scenario, along with Nids and Necrons). Chaos almost destroyed the world once already, and it was only the elves creating the big magical vortex in Ulthuan that kept the Realm of Chaos from flooding the world in an endless tide of daemonic incursions. Plus WHFB didn't have other factions that really matched Chaos in the scale of threat to the entire world (O&G if united would wipe the floor with everybody, but just like 40k Orks their very nature keeps that from ever happening, Skaven could also potentially take over the world but are also way too backstabby the keep their shit together logn enough). Even early rulebooks mentioned that Chaos was just being held back by other factions rather than being truly beaten, and given enough time something would go wrong and they'd flood everything with daemons again, since the Chaos Gods can just keep trying forever (being immortal and all) and just need the "good guys" to screw up badly enough once.

>>54710862
Most newcron fans like myself like some of those points so it's nice to add them in, even if it causes some issue's like how they got a giant galaxy spanning empire with super cancer.

>>54707740
>Chaos being a credible threat to anyone but weak Humans and reckless Eldar.

Pretty much this^
Nids and Orks have a hivemind or gestalt, Tau don't have big enough souls to care and the rest of the galaxy seems to get along well for millions of years until humans and Eldar fuck it up for everyone.

Alpha Legion and the Cabal are right, we are the problem not the solution. The Emperor is an idiot to double down on the warp and Nulls should be the future humanity cultivates while learning more about Necron Tech and inertia-less drives.

>>54710062
Mars incident is still canon too.
They literally phase until they have zero mass energy and their signals are undetectable until they slow down.

SOL defenses were caught totally off gaurd as they detect a phantom signal at the edge of the system only to find out the invaders were already in martian orbit and clipped by Terra. They only knew they were there because they physically saw them by chance.

>>54698165
The Warp existed so Warp entities would also exist, I bet they just keep popping up and then getting destroyed and them forming again, with similar motivations but different names.

>>54706981
> I don't know where Chaos players get the idea that they always lose
Chaos players lose at life and use 40k to vent. They're not talking about the lore when they complain they're useless.

>>54711370
I like to think it's partly because they were that determined to leave a legacy, the thing that bugged me is why the life of their world never evolved any resistances to the radiation via natural selection in the years leading to the evolution of the necrontyr?

>>54711390
>nulls
>wanting life without souls

Is the only reason they got rid of Pariahs because they possed too much of a threat to chaos?

>>54710062
>they used STL "torch ships" for interstellar travel

I don't think they were neccesary STL, if I remember correctly, just slower than warp/webway travel. On a galactic scale, you could have FTL which allows you to travel many hundreds of times the speed of light and it'd still be militarily useless against an enemy that can cross the galaxy in a couple of weeks or months via the webway.

So they could still have Inertialess Drives equivilent to Star Trek's warp drives and have rings run round them by Old Ones using the webway.

>>54713364
I think it got too much in the way of the divinity of humanity, especially given the Emprah now having a corp of nulls equivilent in rank to the Custodes, can't have HUMANITY'S SAVIOUR using what is essentially a xeno fifth column as bodyguards/enforcers.

Basically the idea was too good to let some xeno NPC race have the credit for it.

>>54698308
>Chaos whispered into the minds of the Elven council and made them refuse to have Malekith as their king
Not even close. They had heard horror stories about the court in Nagarythe, and knew any kid raised at it was going to be fucked up. Plus, the Everqueen was his half-sister, and they weren't down for that.

Malekith agreed with it. That isn't "I got screwed out of my throne", that's pussying out in the first place.

>>54713439
Well now I want to run some counts as sisters of silence as pariahs, and in lore explicitly made from them

>>54713326
Them living as long as they did, even if shorter than human lifespan, would probably be result of evolving resistance to radiation. Without some form of resistance they'd probably all be born horribly deformed and die before reaching adulthood.
Given the way natural selection works, it only matters how will individuals are able to reproduce. If necrontyr had an effective lifespan of, say, 30 years due to dying of cancer, but reproduced before that point, then it's good enough for natural selection and there's little evolutionary rpessure to evolve increased protection from radiation, given that such a thing would be quite difficult and likely have other drawbacks.
As a real example, elephants in the wild will never die of old age. Their teeth get worn out long before that and they die of starvation. But since they've already had several decades to reproduce before that pint, there's no evolutionary pressure to eliminate this "problem".

Alternatively, since the instability of their star was caused by the c'tan draining energy from it, it could have been a relatively recent issue, evolutionarily speaking, and life on the planet simply hadn't had time to evolve proper means of coping with it.

>>54713473
Dude, it was Chaos that fed their fear and doubts of Malekith and stoked their desire for peace.

And that council was before the Everqueen was revealed to be alive. Malekith accepted the ruling but changed his mind after he found and used the Iron Crown.

>>54707683
Orks literally did nothing wrong

>>54713412
They were STL. Imotekh's royal fleet drives were said to near-light. Furthermore, it's said that Necrons without the Webway would be doomed to isolation.

>>54713642
If we could travel at the speed of light it would still take us a year or 2 to get to the nearest star.

Their inertia-less drives used to get them from 1 side of the galaxy to the other side in a few seconds. That's been removed since it's overpowered but they still have FTL

>>54713591
"There were also those who remembered Caledor's words concerning the curse on the line of Aenarion, who thought it was wise to remind others. Still others desired a marriage between the two thrones to symbolize the renewal of the Elf Kings and the unity between the old rulers and the new. It was pointed out the Malekith was hardly suitable for this."

>>54713642
Man that sucks. Crons still have god-like tech but they couldn't invent ANY form of FTL? I understand not wanting to unseat warp travel as the only practical method of interstellar travel but they could have still had slow FTL.

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>>54713699
And you talk about things that you know nothing about. The council took place BEFORE the Everqueen and her wimpy brother showed themselves. Their arrival squished any support Malekith could have had and gave the weak willed idiots who fell prey to the whispers of Chaos what they wanted.

Read this.

>>54713766
The Necron own drives might be STL but if a Necron arrive on a world they can deploy portals and teleport beacons that will allow Necron legions to be transported from far away to the world they are invading. It balances out.

>>54713766
For some reason GW seemes to have retconned a lot of xenos FTL. The status of Tau warp-skimmind drives is questionable (the codex mentions only that they used generation ships in the first sphere expansion, near-FTL in 2nd sphere, and considerably faster but unspecified drives in 3rd sphere, but a WD article mentioned them skimming the warp for FTL travel), Nids used to use the warp to travel but now use some weird stuff to use the planet's gravity to pull them over interstellar distances (and according to a codex entry is actually slower than the 2nd sphere era Tau drives). Necrons used to have their inertialess non-warp-based FTL but newcron codex had them just use the webway.
Orks still use the warp, and Eldar being able to us it (but very rarely doing so because they have the webway) is probably still canon since they haven't contradicted it.

>>54713900
Warp skimming makes sense, my headcanon is that it's how Imperial intersystem traders can operate with Navigators. Fine if you just want to cross to the next inhabited star system and have months to do it but useless for military purposes which you need Navigators to dive deep into the warp.

>>54713928
*without Navigators

>>54713900
>Without psykers, the tau could not make translations into the warp, but they had learnt to make short hops through the edge of the immaterial and real space, sticking to pre-ordained ‘stepping stones’. This particular transit point, deep in the Cannis gas cloud, was known to connect to the Sexton Sector. It was what the tau thought was a safe transit route, but its location had been known to the Deathwatch for some time.

-Storm of Damocles (2016)

The Tau still have skim drives as we know from BFG the Tau ships do not touch the Warp. The Tau skim the void between reality and the Warp.

>>54709401
>Skarbrand
>Doombreed
>Ka'Bandha
>Kharn

Still got beat the fuck out by combined might of orks and nids, its one of the very few "wins" xenos have had this edition, im taking it

>>54709581
>>54710862
The whole space cancer thing is still canon. From the 8e Index:

>Short-lived thanks to the radiation of their home world’s star, belligerent and arrogant in their martial might, the Necrontry began a war with the Old Ones for their secrets of eternal life.

>>54713928
According to TR RPG, you can make short-distance warp jumps "blind", just by calculating at what point you've got to cut the drive. It reguires knowing the route well enough to reliably calculate the time, and the margin of error is huge but if you're just jumping between two nearby systems that hardly matters (you'll still end in the same system even if you exit the warp a few million miles from where you calculated). Since chartist ships fly a specific route within a single sector that works fine for them.
For long distance travel without a Navigator you'd need DAoT super-cogitators that the Navigators will kill you for owning.

The Emperor in collected visions said that the Old Ones were older than the Sol system's sun.

This raises two question. One, how old does that make them? How was it possible for life to evolve back then?

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>>54714134
>DAoT super-cogitators

Man, DAoT had all the cool stuff...

I'd love a DAoT remnant to be a new faction, like the Interex or Technocracy from the Horus Heresy novels, but I guess it'd be stepping on the Tau's toes too much and

>>54714297
Aren't they the first life to show up in the galaxy?

>>54714297
Well Sol is only about 5 billion years old and the Milky Way has existed in one form or another for about 13 billion so it's not impossible.

>>54714331
Yes, if you don't count the C'tan as a form of life.

>>54714297
>How was it possible for life to evolve back then?

You seriously underestimate how fucking old the universe is and seriously overestimate how old our solar system is.

>>54714435
Universe is only five thousand years old tho.

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>>54714329

>>54711316
The thing is in Fantasy and even moreso 40k both Chaos relied on worshipers to sustain its power. It was always said that without mass worship the Chaos Gods, who were "activated" by Men and Eldar, would wither up into powerless husks if they lost everything, and that was their motivation for invasions. No matter how badly their Black Crusades failed, they'd still gain millions of corrupted worshipers and spread fear throughout the galaxy, heightening their power wihle they sat in the Warp and couldn't be touched. They didn't care about military victories, because all they needed to live were cults and followers. With them secure they could just zerg rush everyone else, and if they lost 1000 to 1 they'd still come out on top so long as they still had a large base of religious followers.

This is why as has been said before the Nids scared Chaos so much in Oldhammer, because you can't corrupt or scare Nids and Nids devour everything. A total Nid victory would mean the Chaos Gods would cease to exist.

In Fantasy where they were just strong spirits in the Warp that came out of the Warpgates when the Old Ones took off, they still needed worship to manifest their powers, and in Fantasy especially other gods could counter them. Sigmar, Asuryan, Khaine, even the mostly mundane gods of the Dwarves. And in even older supplements you had the Gods of Law who also were powerful Warp spirits that countered Chaos directly, though their victory wouldn't be much better than a Chaos one, and you had Malal who the Chaos Gods feared greatly. Fantasy Chaos's goal was a lot simpler though, just world domination and rulership over the planet to grow their power.

Then GW fucked up, made Chaos endless and eternal and omnipotent, connected the universes, said Chaos controls thousands of realities, and no one can stop them ever because they're just that evil nothing-fucking-personnel.

>>54714535
Head cannon at its finest

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>Beyond Raukos was the smallest part of the Cicatrix Maledictum. The Great Rift was a broad band of energies stretched across space from one side of the galaxy to the other. It divided the Imperium neatly in two, shrouding the dense yolk of stars at the heart of the galaxy completely. The light was painful to observe. Though it appeared to be a natural stellar phenomenon, to look into it for any length of time showed a man things that he would rather not see.

>What Guilliman saw was a tragedy, the latest play in a war millions of years in the fighting. The last ten millennia, though an age in the lifetime of mankind, was a heartbeat of time, a single summer’s campaign. The magnitude of the war against Chaos, the empires lost and the peoples damned, awed the primarch. He had learned these things from the aeldari, though they were unwilling to tell him the complete story. But he knew far more than he had, of the War in Heaven, and of the conflicts between the ancient races.

>Against this all-devouring cosmic evil that had consumed species after species and brought man’s first stellar empire low, Guilliman’s father had set Himself. The scale of His self-appointed task was yet another thing the Emperor had not deigned to share with His sons.

>We constantly battle the sins of the fathers, thought Guilliman. That is no less true on an eternal scale than it is within the history of a single world. We suffer because of those that have gone before.

-Dark Imperium

The war against Chaos is ageless. Humanity's war with it is but a small chapter in saga that stretches back to the beginning of time. This truth should humble anyone who learns of it and end the HFY. Humanity is no more special than the races that Chaos usher to extinction and it many ways inferior. Struggle as they might, humanity would be just a footnote in this eternal war. Another race that stood against Chaos for a time and then....

>>54715752
This is incredibly shitty writing.

>>54715752
>chaosboogeyman
GW needs to stop this bullshit, Chaos has always been a pain in the ass for most races but the biggest chance Chaos got was with the HH, before that they were just a small pain and now they're a small pain. They blew it with the HH.

>>54715752
I've seen better writing on toilet paper I've used to wipe my ass.

>>54715752
So what plan does chaos have for dealing with the necrons? They can't subvert them with corruption and they have technology to literally cut off the warp, not to mention the C'tan shards.

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>>54715808
>>54715934
I implore you two to tell us of your own endeavors to write and design your own universe and stories.

>>54715972
>you have to be a chef to tell someone their food is shit

>>54715875
>The daemon soared, free of its iron bindings. Black Sky had grown unsustainable as a host, with its crew slain and its damage going untended, leading to the spread of noisome madness within Enkir’s broken mind. The creature had abandoned the Titan and its princeps with the metamorphic release of casting aside a shed husk. On regrown wings it took to the air.

>And so it soared, watching the hordes of the Four Choirs, each one the scarcest shard of something greater, overrunning the city. No mortal legionaries, here. No god-machines or battle tanks or other corporeal toys. The hosts of the warp marched, spilling from a multitude of tunnels. The city was theirs, though in their triumph they cared not at all. Pursuit of the Golden and the Soulless was all that mattered. The immense, fanged willpowers that drove each shard pressed them onwards, ever onwards. The Golden and the Soulless were almost extinct, the last gate almost defenceless. These creatures and their masters were utterly indifferent to the galaxy burning. Here was the true war, and the hour of its end had come. The Anathema’s throat was bared.

-Master of Mankind

The Chaos Gods and daemons gave ZERO fucks about Horus and his little war to rule the galaxy. Horus was just the distraction, the Chaos Gods main objective was the Webway. And they got their victory. The Emperor was defeated and Chaos overran the Imperial Webway forever dooming mankind.

Everything else after that was just the bonus round. Why do you have a fetish for Chaos losing? It's unhealthy.

>>54715972
>if you don't write your own story so you can't criticize bad writing
Chaosfags everyone

>>54715942
Nigga I'll give you a clue.
ANY vulnerability chaos had, ANY failing it ever showed, probably is no longer the case. Chaoswank is reaching maximum power- Necrons ain't shit, Tyranids ain't shit, Orks ain't shit. If Chaos goes up against the big Necron shit it will win because LOL ETERNAL DARKNESS TROLOLOLOL.
I mean, these days they even won the Heresy. It's a tenuous and stupid justification for victory, but apparently they won the goddam heresy.

>>54716002
>Horus was just the distraction, the Chaos Gods main objective was the Webway.
And Cadia wasn't the main objective of black crusades 1-12. Don't you love that the only way chaos can win is for their failures to be painted as distractions.

>>54716023
How long until shadow in the warp gets changed as the final nail in the coffin for any hope nid players had for being relevant again.

>>54715942
>919.M41 THE DAEMON’S TOMB

>The Daemon Prince Shukketh Voidmaw infects the tomb world of Vorketh with the taint of Chaos. Vorketh’s regent awakens to find his crypts transformed, and his legions already locked in battle.

Wreck their metal shit much like they do with everything else. Necron anti-warp technology is either damaged from the ages (pylons) or takes too much energy to function (Null matrices). The Necron efforts would be akin to a guy trying to plug the holes of a crumbling dam with mud.

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>>54716002
>Why do you have a fetish for Chaos losing? It's unhealthy.

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>>54716002
>>54716023
>>54716065
>quit 40k long time ago because shit like this was on the horizon
>i was 100% right and by now ive become so detached that i can sit back and passively watch the dumpster fire burn

>>54716065
The outsider was right. All the necrons should just leave and find another galaxy.

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>>54715808
>>54715934
>>54716009
>It's bad writing because I say so

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>>54716009
I don't even the play the damn game you autistic sperg. I'm merely calling you out for the fact that you are criticizing the writing of the book when you haven't even bothered to try and write your own shit, you mouth breathing twat.

>>54716088
I can't detatch, I'm incapable of not caring...

>>54716110
>it's good writing because I say so
Of course you'd also be posting molyjew memes.

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>>54716110
Notice how none of it have "The daughter-hater disgracefully never once loved his daughters properly"? It is because no one can deny that none of his children have ever had a proper family sexual relation with him

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>>54716126
>calls others autistic spergs
>freaking out because some guy on a mongolian finger pupped forum said a book was bad
Really gets the old neurons a firing

>>54716126
>I'm merely calling you out for the fact that you are criticizing the writing of the book when you haven't even bothered to try and write your own shit, you mouth breathing twat.
And that's exactly the point you autist; you have no grounds or reason to do so.

I don't need to be an artist, or even attempt to be so, in order to call out someone for slinging shit onto a canvas and trying to sell it.
I don't need to be a chef, or even cook my own damn food, to tell someone that their food is terrible and unpalatable.
I don't need to be a carpenter, or even pick up a saw in my life, to tell someone that the house their building is structurally unsound and is going to fall down if a mouse farts.

TL;DR: Few people can do stuff right, but almost everyone can tell when you're doing it wrong.

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I came here hoping for home bees about a war in heaven spinoff game, not bitching about black library shit that doesn't even matter or the need less divides on Dark Imperium, hell I came here to get away from that debate

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>>54716187
I'm not freaking out for one. I was merely calling the fag out for claiming to know that writing is terrible when he can't even be asked to write his own shit. If he really doesn't like the direction GW is taking their work, then he can either quit whilst he's ahead because it's certainly not getting any better, or st go and make his own content. What's so hard for 40kids to understand?

>>54716248
Don't bother, he's already written off anything you have to say, he's just here to be mad because that's how he feels "right" about things

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>>54716173
This. To have a daughter you do not bang is to grow crops you never harvest. Not only is it horrible parenting to allow a complete stranger to defile your flesh & blood, bringing STDs & shit to her, but just think of what it means.

Your little girl, composed of your genes, your wife's genes & many years of caring, funding & more is now another man's bitch. For your daughter to suck off another man isn't just your flesh doing so, it's your wife & all your ancestors doing so. You literally spent years training your genes mixed with your wife's genes to suck off another man. This goes beyond having another bird's eggs in your nest.

>>54716002
>The Chaos Gods and daemons gave ZERO fucks about Horus and his little war to rule the galaxy.
That's pretty much always been the case. What Chaos cared about was the Emperor and getting him out of the picture, which is why they corrupted Horus in the first place. Whatever Horus was planning to do with the galaxy if he won was secondary to getting rid of the Emperor.

>>54716237
That debate follows chaos around, Xenofags are pissed about being sidelined, non-marine imperialfags are pissed about being sidelined, chaosfags are mad that even with them being pushed by Bl a fuck ton. The only people not mad a marinefags who are too busy arguing about chads and manlets. In the end this is the true endgame for chaos butthurt for everyone.

>>54716248
>dude just go write your own 40k stuff lmao
You really are autistic, aren't you?
Fanon is fanon, no matter how well written or well liked, and what ultimately matters is the CANON.

>>54716237
>home brews
Ftfy

>>54716319
Shut up, Carnac.

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>>54716290
I agree. In fact, I'll add. Think of the poor little girl with those strangers. They could beat her, abuse her, drug her, etc. Why not let her first time be in the comfort & security of family? Such a sensitive topic & people have the gall to not ensure their loving child has it better? Those daughter-haters have no morals.

>>54716353
Niggerfaggot

>>54716317
So how about we try some before this thread stops bumping? How would the full force necrons divide themselves from the modern necrons? How does one make the krorks look orky but not stupid? What did the original eldar look like? What other forces did the old ones employ?

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>>54716173
>>54716290
>>54716356
Okay, who the fuck let a Slaanesh cultist in here? Was it Carnac?

>>54716383
I think it's someone sick of the retarded arguments here and deciding to have fun in a now disposable thread

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>>54716319
Get prostate cancer and die, Carnac.

>>54716404
For some reason, the Tomaru poster seems to have a fuckton against most parents for not engaging in sexual relations with their kids. I don't know if it's ironic or not.

>>54716376
With necrons add in some of those fluff only heavy hitters like the crypt stalker, and maybe add some titan sized models. Krorks should seem like orks but more organized less ramshackle but still with that distinct orky style. And I imagine Eldar would be pretty similar they are big on tradition. The real question is should they add a Old One faction to play as?

>>54716405
I bet if the canon somehow switched to not be endless Chaoswank Carnac would complain, call it fake or "not true" lore, and headcanon back into his own masturbatory Chaos fantasy.

>>54716405
>holding GW and BL accountable for actually having good lore for their game means I'm Carnac
I have no problem with fan content, it's great stuff and several times better than what the canon is, but it's ultimately subordinate to the canon.
Saying "It's okay for BL to put out shitty writing and for them to be immune to criticism because fans can just write better stuff on their own" is only an invitation for BL to continue being shit and for the lore to continue being shit.

>>54716465
>I say the chaoswank is fucking shit, and that the canon lore should be better
>apparently I'm Carnac

>>54716489
Shit, I'm sorry anon. I think we misunderstood your post.

People just get on edge in these discussions, because Carnac has some kind of /tg/ search tool that lets him hone in immediately on any post that has the word "chaos" in it.

He's probably lurking right now.

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Unless your race fought in the War in Heaven, get out of this thread.
Fucking Chaos ruins everything.

>>54697518

t. non necron player

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>>54716548
>It drifted through the void, broken, scarred and shattered. A single shard of Acheron’s superstructure, the only piece to have returned to real space when the planet was annihilated. Its creators, deathless and eternal, were already aware of the fate that had befallen it. They had looked on, in silent, cold fury, as the lesser races had tampered with their carefully wrought designs.

>The cage was broken. The work of aeons was shattered.

>Someone would pay.

-Dawn of War 3

Dawn of War 3 takes place on what was revealed to be a Necron constructed daemon cage. This cage was built by the Necrons during the War in Heaven to imprison this pesky daemon. Picture related.

They are now pissed that their cage was destroyed and their prisoner was punished to the Warp. This basically confirms that daemons were a thing during the War in Heaven.

>>54716618
>This basically confirms that daemons were a thing during the War in Heaven.

And it basically confirms that Warhammer 40,000 fluff is dead.

>>54716618
>dawn of war
>canon

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So what armor should Space Dorfs wear?

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>>54716659
Spacesuit/mining suit Hybrid.

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>>54716640
Why though? What do you have against Necrons putting daemons in literal cold storage?

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>Necron warriors are as tall as Marines
>Immortals the Size of Terminators
>In Damnos an immortal lifts an ultrasmurf veteranby his throat off the ground so he is eye level with the Immortal as it strangles him
>Marinefags claim marines aren't truescale because some other factions are as tall or taller than marines
>GW gives them Chadmarines
>Chaos codex confirms Chaos Chadmarines incoming
>Necrons now manlets because fuck non marine players
>Rewriting cron fluff so LOL XD IT WAS CHAOS ALL ALONG GUISE!

Why fucking bother at this point, it's all downhill from here unless your play CSM or Loyalists.

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What weapons should Space Dorfs have? I think some heat or forge weaponry should work. Something like a Zaku's Heat Hawk.

I just realized, 40k already has Chain-Weapons, Power-Weapons & shit but have we had any Heat-based cutting weapons?

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>>54716489
I apologize Anon, it seems that I had misunderstood what you were trying to say. As my fellow Anon has already stated, most people in any thread involving Chaos and its strength proportionate to the rest of the setting are constantly on edge because Carnac is almost certain to make his presence known. I would not be surprised if he is in this thread at this very moment.

>>54716702
>it's all downhill from here unless your play CSM or Space Marines
ftfy

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>>54716702
The World Engine annoyed me with it's depiction of Necrons and how they're apparently flimsy and made out of butter.
I don't care how many marines rush it, chainswords shouldn't be able to tear apart a Necron Lord.with ease.

Damnos atleast had Voidbringer shitting over Tigurius.

>>54716735
They should be made out of Unobtanium.

Now get out of this Necron thread,

>>54716458
I say yes, but stats should emphasize they ate too big for modern 40k,the war in heaven should make the Horus heresy look like 2 toddlers slap fighting, I'd imagine the old ones as a coilition of different species, ancestors of the slaan, umbra, snotlings and other races united in cause, along with their closest servents

>>54703204
I play Chaos Warriors in Fantasy. And i hate the hold End Times debacle. I might also hate it because GW killed Fantasy for Age of Shitmar

>>54717064
I guess have an actual old one be a large point cost lord of war?

>>54717102
Yeah, their answere to a c'tan incarnation or whatever you do to justify them not dwarfing the table

>>54717079
Speaking as the freak of nature who somehow likes AoS I still hate how end times was handled

>>54717102
>C'tan the points cost of a large titan

Speaking of which, reakon the Old ones were able to outright destory a C'tan? considering the crons had such an effort to break them into pieces you'd think they would have been pretty much invinicible to anything the Old ones could shit out.

>>54717173
It's implyed the necrons damaged reality on a base level to do it and Any who remember how they did it don't want to risk a repeat of it,v the old ones may have know how to do it but refused for fear of doing exactly that, the necrons being less carfule with their own and possibly stolen old ones tech, had fewer compunctions

shit sux

I remember when I got into WHFB around 5th edition and chaos was just one army of many.

Twenty years later, it's just chaos chaos chaos.

>>54717212
This actually made me think that if they did this it would be a good time to expand upon the C'tan and finally add more than the 6 we have fluff on.

>>54717241
Just hope there is still 1 intact C'tan that got away, maybe even the Outsider.

>>54696702
God I fucking hate necronfags

>>54717272
I would just like to see more C'tan models like the Deceiver and the Nightbringer got, imagine ones for the Flayer or the Void Dragon.

>>54717287
It's mutual you scum sucking mary sue.

>>54717241
Oh that would be the big pull for the necrons, more c'tan modles, could use them in 40k as shards easily.

I'd offer necrontyr factions too, could be used to play out the following
The wars of succession
The first conflict with the old ones
The rebellions against transfurance
The last hold outs surviving into the climax of the war, ultimately to wither away against the passing of time

>>54717339
>necrons
>calling other factions the Mary sue

>>54717309
>Void Dragon
Welp, my army is one model and is as big as the store

>>54707781
That only proves they're bad at writing AND balance

Okay, so, Necron-related lore question.
After the change to Newcron, why did the Crons hibernate? I assumed that in the old setup, the C'tan put them to sleep until there were more civilizations to eat (I might be wrong about that, but since it's not canon any more, it doesn't matter as much.) But in the new version, once they'd 'won', why bother hibernating? It's not like they need other sentient life to survive or anything. So why bother to go to sleep in the first place, and why wake up now, of all times?

>>54717467
Because the Silent King told them too. He then went out on a lone pilgrimage outside of the known galaxy. Only to return and start the waking process after seeing the Tyranids. He wants to find a host to transfer his people back into, but the Tyranids will eat and destroy all hopes of that happening.

>>54717526
The Silent King is another character that needs a model.

>>54717467
Honestly, shitty writing since as you say, they should have been on top of everything.

The offical reason was they feared the Eldar, Orikan foresaw that the Eldar empire would come but also go. (A non psykar predicted something that would happen 65 million years in the future with a 10,000 year difference of the actual result)

So following Orikans prediction, they set about hibernating. Keep in mind they didn't have to be picky about their tomb world so for all the lived on tombworlds of the 40k universe there is probably 9 times that many in dead systems.

I remember hearing that the Eldar being created by the old ones might have been retconned and rather they worked along side the Old ones with the war in heaven. It's confusing since despite the Old ones creating them, they still have a homeworld and weren't spread out like Humanity after the Long night.

>>54717598
Isn't it funny how there is now a "new"cron and "old"cron but no one talks about the "mid"cron? This is new to me and I posted this (>>54717526) from the 5e codex.

>>54717137
I'd have been more happy to accept Nagash winning End Times than that incompetent manchild Archaon

>>54717636
As far as I can remember the Silent king was disgusted with himself for allowing what happen to his people, happen.

He left the galazy in exile along with a bunch of Triarch only to come across the Tyranids and he did a 180.
He's actively waking tomb worlds but so is Anrakyr. Trazyn woke up in 30k and did his fair share of looting the HH, apparently having bantz with gorillaman.

I think the Silent king wanted his people to find a way to go back to flesh but as said, he pretty much failed them so thought he had fucked them up enough.

>>54717598
If I'm right Orikan also predicted the Tyranids and the Horus Heresy, Farseers should feel humbled by his abilities.

>>54717374
It's pretty much accepted by all sane adults that Chaos will win, because it has already made itself win, or something equally asinine.

Neurons are just crotchety old bastards that want these kids off their lawns. Way more relatable and sympathetic than current Chaos

>>54717747
Building on this, even the Tyranids seem like plucky and relatable underdogs in comparison to Chaos.

They just want to feed their families. They come off as really human compared to what is ostensibly meant to be an aggregate of the human consciousness.

>>54718031
It doesn't help that the nids get shit on all the time in both fluff and rules, the universe ending threat doesn't seem to show through.

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Just throwing it out there newcrons are more than just tomb kings in space and even if you say they are not thats still good enough for me.
I mean comon this is /tg/ I know we love our skeletons around here.

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>>54718277

>>54718071
I really admire the C'Tan. Unlike the Chaos Gods, they've at least been vaguely fallible. They even fought against the Old Ones without their victory being foreordained, and that takes some serious courage. Even after suffering some knocks, they get back up and keep fighting to devour our souls!

>The C'Tan have more in common with the Imperial Guard than the Chaos Gods.

>>54718358
>Bottom, 4th from left
What is that supposed to be? A Flayed One?

Top, 4th from left
I need this model for a Catacomb Command Barge.

>>54718808
Looks like one or atleast a concept. Might have just been something Blanche did on the side though.

>>54698905
>They are sick about reading about Trazyn's misadventures
Yeah, I can get wanting Necrons to have more character than a bunch of Terminator knock-offs, but they went full retard with Trazyn the Memelord. Anrakyr and Imotekh are far more interesting.

>>54699128
>>54699284
>>54707184
There is nothing more pathetic than you retards whining about how a strawman that never existed was better than a strawman that doesn't exist.

>>54717747
I always hated how the chaos gods really don't follow any formula and absorb elements 100% completely counter to them because fuck you.

Why is disease happiness? A disease has nothing to do with happiness. It's one of the baseline counter related things. Diseases kill slowly, painfully whilst shutting off your senses. Misery would be more like a common thing. Happiness is almost always the literal OPPOSITE of disease.

Its like the Lantern core of nonsensical emotions. Hope, Will, Fear, Love...What? Those are all different types of emotional origins.

Just all over the place.
And why are there no "Positive" chaos gods? Like why is ALL emotion all the time this miserable fuckery?

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>>54698905
It's called "Your Dudes" not "desperately hope BL puts out something that isn't shit" because they almost never will.

>>54720613
>And why are there no "Positive" chaos gods?
Because it's Warhammer 40,000. You might as well ask why the Christian God doesn't just smite them all.
>Why is disease happiness?
I've always pictured "happy" mortal Nurgle followers as having a manic, stressed-past-the-breaking-point sort of happiness. They're happy because otherwise they would be crushed under all the despair that they feel. Plus, they're spreading their diseases, and misery loves company.

Nurgle and his daemons being jolly is, at least partly, to set them apart from Tzeentch. Tzeentch is supposed to be a massive dick, even to his faithful.

>>54696436
no

"the whole eternal chaos thing GW has been pushing" has been explicit in the fluff since 1987 (and before it was fleshed out in the Realm of Chaos books, it was present in fluff used to flesh out the original WarHammer FB and FRP systems) and discussed at length in the early novels (such as the Orfeo books) which dealt with Chaos as a subject

Chaos is and always has been eternal; the Warp is another realm, where the laws of reality (including time itself) do not apply, but the power of the creatures and gods of the Warp to affect reality may be thought of as a linear progression; during the War in Heaven, Chaos first becomes a threat because the Warp becomes charged by the psychic turmoil of conflicts between the emotional, Warp-tapping servant races like Orks and Eldar, making it dangerous for the first time (if the Old Ones had not found it dangerous after that time, their power would have been without limit)

but before that, going back into the primordial times, the influence of Chaos and the Warp on reality, the ability of the gods to affect the materium, is neglible, because while time is not part of the Warp, it is part of reality, and so there must have been a time when Chaos was weak; moreover, the future is uncertain even to the gods who are not subject to time, so it must be the case that the Warp is constrained by reality

this would be a large part of the Chaos gods wanting to destroy reality and rule an unending Chaos; like those shitty aliens from Enterprise, they're trying to make our universe into theirs

but yeah tl;dr go find the Realm of Chaos books and read 'em

better yet go read some old-school GW novels

at the very least treat yourself to Drachenfels, it's fuck all to do with Chaos but it's a fun old ride

>>54715752
So now the war between the Old One's, and the Necrons, is now about Chaos. Gotta love it. Chaos is now the Anakin Skywalker of the setting, events that once were interesting and stood apart now all revolve around the same thing because the creators think it should. Painful to watch.

>>54716036
Well let's not forget that Cadia was once the bastion of humanity, a rock that had stood solid against Chaos incursions for 10 thousand years, where brave men fought and died for the Imperium, never breaking nor yielding. Now it's that little planet that Chaos didn't feel like taking because it wasn't their main objective, until they decided it was.

And it's even contradictory to the lore.
>chaos needs to take Cadia because even their forces cannot move through the Eye of Terror and the Cadian Gate is just as important to them as to humanity
is a far cry from
>we can spread the Eye of Terror all the way across the galaxy, get rekt scrubs, nothing stops Chaos.

>>54716233
It's important to know that the same fire inspector who says your house isn't safe, is not the same engineer or architect who designed it. Often times the ability to spot a fault is in no way related to the ability to produce an object.

>>54716290
>people who have such shitty morals and senses of self that their children are merely projections of their own efforts and not people unto themselves

Only degenerates think this way, normal parents are aware their kids will one day have sex and hope they are responsible about it.

>>54720557
Trazyn is really better in smaller doses, even in terms of comedic necrons zandrekeh is being under utilized and has a much more thematic quirk

I feel like I'm missing something. I've been out of the loop for about two years, and now when I pop back in I see people arguing that something which never existed was better than something which doesn't seem to exist. Is there some joke here or are people genuinely upset about nothing?

>>54721065
It's what I dubbed forerunner syndrome, where in attempts to make a setting focused on what the authors think is the most key element, and to make it feel larger in scope, they shackle anything interesting to it, failing to see they don't make the thing bigger, they just make everything else smaller

My take on the whole Newcron vs Oldcron thing is that both are pretty much fine in terms of fluff.

However I've really come to hate the newcron aesthetic; it has too much curves and silliness. Only newcron thing that I think kinda works is the barge, outside that you've lost the terminator aesthetic for some crappy, gaudy and silly Egyptian robots thing.

Necron Warriors are fucking awesome looking but if they were made with newcrons in mind they'd be piece of shit robots with over designed Egyptian motifs.

>>54721390
Sorry, I jack off to Egyptian imagery, though I'd have personally blended it into sumerian, mezo american, and qin motifes as well to make it more unique, like the eldar

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What has your local store done special for the Konor campaign? We had an apocalypse match with all the fluff and cool bits we could drag in in a huge 16 person match at 65 power each, Lords of War and large vics free. The final score was Chaos 105 Imperium 113 Store Manager recorded 1 victory for every 10 victory points a side earned and everyone had a great time. Ill dump a few more pictures from it.

The moment when they reveal lore on Nids where their galaxy collapsed under chaos wank and now are fleeing away in hope of to survive will be amazing. And the reason for their demise was that hivemind kept their galaxy up and floating until it was too much because you know, chaos is super powerful 'n stuff.

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>>54721488

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>>54721488
This one just shows a bit mroe of the back line that wasnt visible in the first one

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>>54721488
This was the imperium team

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>>54721488
This was our teams Warlord and it took a big fat beating before finally dying in the last turn.

>>54721228
>people who do not properly care for their children & allows your children to walk the wrong way

>>54721504

>sides that make no sense
>torrents of unpainted and poorly painted figures

I love my local store but god damnit, I have to always come up with excuses for why I'm busy on event days.

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>>54721488
Armorcast resin Phantom Titan

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>>54721579
>Xenos working to fuck over imperium
>Xenos actually wanting to play the game
seems fine to me
>Sides that make no sense
oh please, its easy to invent reasons.

>>54721504
>Chaos Team
>Chaos!
>and Eldar!
>and Necrons!
That's absolutely ridiculous and awesome

>>54720961
That's wrong and dumb

Chaos =/= the Warp, especially not in older works. In the oldest lore, all the gods except Slaanesh came into full existence only after humanity's history.

>>54696436
They won't retcon it entirely. They'll just say that the Old Ones were actually the 3 Chaos Gods.

>>54707450
>>54707184
Andy Chambers.

>>54707184
>>54707511
ADB.

>>54702043
I wonder how many of the writers are atheists who never attended church

>>54721678
At this point I wish to see Old Chaos fighting against Team Daddy Issues, it's only natural for Chaos to do that

>>54706243
It was never "cancer." It was just that as a species their genes were fucked by the radiation they evolved in.

>>54711225
Retconned, what do you think Angron was doing on it in the First War?

>>54721643
Quit being wrong.

>>54716684
>>54716659
>not huge mecha exoskeleton suits with plasma drills and pile drivers as hands

>>54721822
Armageddon was retconned into being Ullanor all along during The Beast Arises. Which is a more recent retcon.

>>54713696
If we could travel at light speed it would take over 4 years to get to the nearest star.

>>54724305

Are the beast novels worth reading?

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>>54721390
Aztec Necrons are best Necrons

>>54720961
>realm of chaos

You mean the book that tried to say 40k and Fantasy were in the same universe?

The book everyone ignored because they said "Hey, that's incredibly stupid"?

>>54725700
I liked them, mainly for the Vangorich storyline. The ending is terrible - there's a hundred year timeskip and then a totally unearned ending to fit in with prior fluff - but other than that, it's pretty good.

>>54726441
One of the first Chaos sourcebooks from the 80s, you fucking newfag.

>>54714009
>Still got beat the fuck out by combined might of orks and nids
It wasn't even 'combined might' so much as "the Khorne morons were stupid enough to think sticking their bare hand (Blood Crusade) between a giant green hammer (Ghaz and the Orks) and a massive chitin anvil (Swarmy and what's left of Hive Fleet Leviathan) was going to end with that hand NOT getting crushed to a pulp.

The daemons had to quit because the warp storm moved on (read: Khorne got impatient), and the rest of the Khornate mortals ended up as Ork lunch. Except Kharn (and his World Eaters?), that guy's currently on a quest to find St. Celestine and give her a big, backbreaking hug like the nice guy that he is!

>>54720613
>>54720678
The emotion Nurgle gets power from is actually despair, even if he and his daemons tend to be very jolly. I'd say Nurglite concept of despair is veyr much like how the cardinal sin of sloth was originally envisioned as. It's not "my life sucks and I'm going to cry about it and commit suicide" but "why should I bother to do anything when everything is shit forever and nothing ever changes. Crying about it is pointless waste of time and the afterlife is probably even worse". Nurgle's followers are happy because they've given up all hope of improving their situation and are just content to wallow in their own filth. Nurgle himself appears loving and caring because he tells his followers that it's ok that their lives suck because there's nothing that could be done to change that, and if they should do anything they should show other people Nurgle's love by freeing them from their pointless struggle by dragging them down to their level.

This is in contrast to Tzeetch whose followers are always plotting and striving to improve their own situation, with Tzeentch building up their ambitions just to dash them so he can watch them scramble back up to try again.