/swg/ - All About That Bass, No Rebels Edition

>>54667265 #
No, but acting like a moment that lasts under 10 seconds is indicative of the quality of the film is stupid.
You don't judge the Luke and Vader stuff differently in RotJ because of the Ewoks, do you?

>>54666944
I’m looking for help with this fan-made FAQ/Erratta and was wondering if you anons would be able to provide comments and criticism.
The goal of this FAQ is to do two things-
1. Reduce the power level of the strongest types of lists to level the playing field and decrease the power level gap between a casual and a competitive list from a purely list-building perspective. The health of a community is going to be strongly dependent on not having internal fractures in the community, and the casual/comp divide is the one that is currently rearing its face in X-wing. One only needs to look at 7th edition 40k for an example of just how bad this can get for a community.
2. Reduce the amount of Negative Play Experiences (NPE), Single-player interactions, or un-fun factors in the game.
I focused mostly on nerfs, but the few buffs are the ones that I have heard the most complaining about, or are iconic ships that are not currently viable to use without effectively handicapping yourself.
Proposed balance changes-
Nerfs-
- Biggs now reads “When another friendly ship at range 1 of you is defending, it may roll an additional defense die.”
Biggs needs to go for 2 reasons. Firstly, the current Four-Ship-Rebel/Fair-ship-rebel/Rebel-Hug/Stage-4-Rebels builds are massively OP (see MajorJuggler). Then, Biggs takes away player agency- He forces you to shoot him. Now you shoot biggs because it is a good idea, not because the card says you have to.
- Sabine now reads “Your upgrade bar gains the bomb upgrade icon. Once per round at the end of the activation phase before a friendly bomb token is removed, you may choose 1 enemy ship at Range 1 of that token. That ship suffers 1 damage.”
This is mostly to keep consistency with wording, and make it so that her bombs only work with other AoE bombs to stop some really stupid shit. It also resolves Sabine’s current confusion with missed effects.

Con't below, sorry for the spam.

>>54667879
- Advanced Slam now reads “After performing a SLAM action, if you did not overlap an obstacle or another ship, you may perform an action listed on your action bar as a free action”

SLAM Bombs need to go away- it’s a purely single-player experience at that point, and it pushes any traditional ace and even some non-traditional aces entirely out of the meta. There are other similar suggestions involving having SLAM assigning the WD token before the SLAM and having dropping bombs be considered an attack, but that’s a lot of cards to change in significant ways to be able to use Lando after you SLAM.

- Twin Laser Turret now reads “ATTACK (Target Lock): Perform this attack twice (even against a ship outside your firing arc). Each time this attack hits, the defender suffers 1 damage. Then cancel all dice results.”

TLT is by far the strongest turret in the game, standing head and shoulders above the rest. It’s also not exactly fun to play against. This is a well deserved nerf.

- Guidance Chips now reads “Once per round, when attacking with a Torpedo or Missile secondary weapon, you may change 1 die result to a focus result”

First-turn-engage alpha-strikes are not healthy for a game of any kind, and they aren’t fun to be on the receiving end of. This change would make it so that you would need to have a focus when you fire your ordinance, meaning that you would have to target lock a turn in advance, allowing for more counterplay. It also brings up LRS to more common levels of usage.

>>54667892
- Bomblet Generator now reads “If you are not stressed when you reveal your maneuver, you may drop 1 bomblet token and receive 1 stress token. This token detonates at the end of the Activation phase.”

I’m proposing a change to this one for three reasons. Firstly, it’s strong as fuck. It’s effectively Seismic charges forever, doing constant damage to anything that gets near you. Secondly, it has no real decision making. While normally bombs require resource management to figure out how to best use them, and the bomblet generator encourages just saying “I’ll drop a bomb this round, and next round and the round after that too”. Lastly, Scum Nym has an even bigger no-go zone than Miranda did with Adv. Slam, and that’s a single-player experience. This makes his no-go zone not cover a literal third of the board since he can do it less often/effectively. I was debating something with ion tokens as well.

- Attani Mindlink is now a 2-dot unique card (restricted to two ships per list)

Honestly, I don’t super like this one, but it’s in the leaked FAQ and it’s not horrible. The nerf needs to not make it just a scum-only better version of PTL, and it cannot do that by making it more stress-vulnerable. That would just make Asajj, Rebel Captive, and the Stresshog mandatory.

-Contracted Scout, Manaroo, Tel Trevura, and Dengar- Remove one Torpedo, the Salvaged Astromech, and Illicit upgrade slots from your upgrade bar.

- Punishing one now reads “JumpMaster 5000 Only. Title. Increase your primary weapon value by 1. Add the Salvaged Astromech and Illicit symbols to your upgrade bar. Remove 1 Torpedo symbol from your upgrade bar.”

These were the leaked FAQ’s changes with one change of my own, and I don’t like them either. If it were up to me, I would strip the EPT from the scout, and add to the rules text on each jumpmaster pilot that gives them stress tokens for going right.

>>54667907
- Lok Revenant- Remove the Elite Pilot talent upgrade slot from your upgrade bar.

Deadeye Scurrgs can alpha strike harder and more consistently than Deadeye Jumps could, and they are capable of destroying the natural predator to alpha-strike lists (aces). Massive Alphas with a reasonable late-game (it’s 3 b-wings with some sort of added upgrades) is not a list one wants to see in a healthy and fun meta.

- Cruise Missiles now read “ATTACK (TARGET LOCK): Spend your target lock and discard this card to perform this attack. You may roll additional attack dice equal to the speed of the maneuver you executed this round, to a maximum of 4 additional dice.”

A 5 dice attack that lets you keep the target lock is blatant power creep. I initially had it keep the TL and just cap at 4 dice, but that removed the gimmick the missile had. This change would make it easier to interact with when flying against it, as well as allowing it to have a distinct mechanic.

- R3-A2 now reads “When you declare the target of your attack, if the defender is inside your firing arc and you are not stressed, you may receive 1 stress token to cause the defender to receive 1 stress token.”

The Stresshog is why this change is being suggested. Stress was intended to be a strong negative deterrent, but it hoards stress tokens like Dengaroo. This allows clever use of the card (nien numb, etc) and prevents people from just using it as a “that ship never gets actions again” platform.

- K4 Security Droid now reads “After executing a green maneuver, if you did not overlap a ship or an obstacle, you may acquire a target lock.”

K4 encourages first-turn-engagement alpha strikes, and is generally one of the stronger cards in the game. This is being nerfed as Scum Alpha (Dengar-Tel, etc) is one of the stronger list archetypes.

>>54667928
- R2-D2 (Astromech) now reads “After executing a green maneuver, if you have no shields, you may recover 1 shield.
- R5-P9 now reads “At the end of the Combat phase, if you have no shields, you may spend 1 of your focus tokens to recover 1 shield”
- Miranda Doni now reads “Once per round when attacking, you may either spend 1 shield to roll 1 additional attack die or if you have no shields, roll 1 fewer attack die to recover 1 shield.”

Honestly, this is not a change I’m super confident on. The issue is that if the list archetypes weakened earlier are brought down to a more reasonable power level, then Rebel Regen comes out in force, and the tallest blade of grass needs to get cut. It’s something to discourage just running away for massive swathes of the game. Short of only allowing a ship to regen X times per game or addressing Regen with the MoV system, I’m not sure what to do.

- Cad Bane- Add “Small Ship Only” to this card.

This is to stop the Sloop-N-Poop Bomb-carrying JumpMaster. A white sloop, barrel roll, Extra Munitions and Cad Bane with a Cluster mine (and possible droid and illicit for Scav Crane) are a horrible recipe for disaster.

- Kylo Ren (crew) now reads “ACTION: Assign the "I'll Show You the Dark Side" Condition card to an enemy ship at Range 1-3. Then receive one stress token”

I don’t like this change either. This does not address Kylo’s being a massive NPE, even if he is not currently overpowered (but would be if power levels were lowered). The best way to do this would be to entirely re-write the ISYTDS condition card, but it would need a new mechanic.

Stealth Device now reads “Once per turn when defending, you may roll an additional die. If you are hit by an attack, discard this card.”

This is to discourage hyper-defensive Soontir, as if the current level of power is brought down, he will likely come back to mirror rebel regen.

>>54667967
Buffs-

New cards-

- Flexible Fighter- Title- Rebel Alliance only. X-wing only. When defending, you may change one blank result to a focus result. You may equip an additional modification upgrade card. 0 points.

This gives X-wings some measure of reliable defense, synergizes with flying T-65’s alongside biggs, and makes Luke into a much more capable ship. It also gives them build flexibility with their mod slot, no longer being glued to Integrated Astromech.

- Interceptor Training- Title- TIE Interceptor Only. You may equip one “Push the Limit” upgrade card, decreasing its point cost by 3. You may equip an additional title upgrade. 0 points.

I am unsure on the cost of this one. Currently, the only usable Interceptors are Soontir and Carnor, and Carnor is only in edge cases. The Interceptor needs PTL to function, and half of them don’t have an EPT slot. This would give them that slot they need to function, and allow build flexibility for those that do have EPT slots already.

- Expanded Munitions Banks- Title- TIE Punisher Only. When you equip this card, place 1 Munitions token on one of your equipped Torpedo or Missile Upgrade cards. When you are instructed to discard an Upgrade card with a Munitions token on it, do not discard it. 4 points.

To clarify how this works since multiple people have misread this- This is Ordinance Tubes, but for a Punisher. It will not interact with Extra Muntions in any way. This is an attempt to avoid the piraling cost problem that the punisher has- A punisher can now take 1 munition and re-use it. I’m unsure of the cost. I’ve been told that it would be both Underpowered and Overpowered at 4 points. On one hand, it would only break even after 2 rounds of munitions fire, and be a good deal at 3. On the other hand, it now has no limited resource, and it’s fairly difficult to 2-round a punisher.

>>54667984
- Red Squadron Pilot- Add an Elite Pilot Talent symbol to your upgrade bar.
- Lieutenant Lorrir now reads “When performing a barrel roll action, you may use the [Bank Left 1] or [Bank Right 1] template instead of the [Straight 1] template”
- Storm Squadron Pilot- Add an Elite Pilot Talent symbol to your upgrade bar.
- Garven Dreis- Add an Elite Pilot Talent symbol to your upgrade bar.

Giving these pilots an EPT slot/fixing their abilitiy is long overdue.

- Onyx Squadron Escort- Add an Elite Pilot Talent symbol to your upgrade bar
- Horton Salm- Add an Elite Pilot Talent symbol to your upgrade bar.
- “Dutch” Vander- Add an Elite Pilot Talent symbol to your upgrade bar.

While giving EPT slots to primarily turret-carrying ships may be a bad idea, I’m confident that alongside a nerf to TLT this would be able to make these pilots not be actively worse than their equivalents.

- All Firespray-31 pilots- Add the Barrel Roll action to your action bar.

Currently, the Firespray is just a worse Lancer. This would give it the maneuverability that it sorely needs, and give it a useful distinction between it and the Lancer.

>>54668000

Clarifications/unrelated-

- Constable Zuvio now reads “When you reveal a reverse maneuver, you may perform a Bomb Upgrade card action as a free action. When you reveal a reverse maneuver, when dropping a bomb, you may use the front guides of your ship.

Rules as written, Zuvio can drop a bomb without discarding it, as performing the action is what causes you to discard the card. Debatably, he can also be used to drop bombs that you don’t have equipped, but that’s another neither here nor there. This is not a nerf, it is the same ability, just worded correctly.

- For MoV calculation, if at the end of the game a ship has taken over half of its total health in damage, that ship gives half MoV to your opponent if it was worth more than 25 points (replacing the half-points rule on large ships)
The initial half-points rule was to discourage points fortressing, which was initially the issue with Fat Han builds. This would stop beating around the bush and actually get to the problem- it’s about the point cost of the ship, not the size of the base. Being able to be able to run away with more than a quarter of the total MoV encourages just running away, and that’s rewarding you for not interacting with your opponent. I’m debating making it also give quarter points on ships over 50 to avoid massive MoV chunks.

Also on MoV, rebel regen point fortresses (Corran, Poe, and Miranda) need to be addressed, but that’s a more difficult solution.

Thanks in advance for any C&C you guys care to give, and sorry for shitting up the thread with all this rules text.

>>54667733
This claim was made:
>TPM is at least as good as ANH. The direction is identical, as is the scripting.

Yet ANH had zero instances of juvenile bathroom humor. Identical scripting my ass.

I can't believe you're still arguing this.

>>54668316
Obviously they aren't physically the same script. But they are the same level of quality.

>>54668316
>>54668339
Again too, you wouldn't necessarily say that RotJ is worse than ANH because of the Teddy Bears, but you have said that TPM is worse because of a ten second scene.

>inb4 strawman
It is, and I'm asking you to refute it.

>>54668339
>Jar Jar steps in poop.
>Animal farts in Jar Jar's face.
>"Oh! My parts are showing!"
>"Now THIS is podracing!"
>"Let's try spinning! That's a good trick!"

No. They're not. Fuck, I even LIKE TPM but you're delusional if you think the script is the same quality as ANH.

>>54668377
>>"Oh! My parts are showing!"
>>"Now THIS is podracing!"
>>"Let's try spinning! That's a good trick!"
What the fuck is wrong with these let alone worse than the quips in ANH?

Even if the scripts ARE the same quality (an assertion I'm not sure we can discuss unless somebody has the whole of both handy we can all actually look at and compare from) that has nothing to do with the quality of the films in relation to each other.

ANH is a better movie not just because it does actually feel like it has better scripting (even though, yes, some of it's lines are kind of dated) also, y'know, the actors and direction of those actors deliver their lines way better a lot of the time. The presentation is smoother, the plot subjects are a lot better conveyed and more interesting to the audience. The slow bits in ANH are only slow if you're watching it a second time, when you know the droids are gonna wander in the desert for like 15 minutes. In a fresh showing this builds the tension and really shows you how desolate Tatooine is. Nor does ANH feel the need to do a big "as you know" dump between characters to tell you all the complex shit going on to set up an excuse of a plot in the first place. Shit's just happening and you can see the hows and whys for yourself.

That has nothing to do with comparing the "scripts" of the two films.

>>54668566
This seems like some subjective mumbo jumbo. Not only is TPM great, but no part of ANH is boring.

Can we talk about spaceships pls?
My question is: just how much piracy would a rogue ISD have to engage in on a monthly basis to keep it's crew fed and paid, let alone staying in good condition?

>>54668566
>and more interesting to the audience.
As an audience member I found the politics of TPM interesting.
Not just of the senate but of the Jedi.

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>>54668913
By actual, real world logistics? It probably wouldn't be possible, but we have no real way of knowing since we don't know how Imperial logistics actually work. By Star Wars logistics? Until a band of daring young heroes defeats them.

>>54668566
>actors and direction of those actors deliver their lines way better a lot of the time
The faster more intense story came from the ANH set though.

>>54668913
Depends on what they're hitting. I could see an ISD being able to prey on inner rim supply convoys, and she has enough ion cannons to theoretically knock out 2+ ships and steal them wholesale. that could get you quite a bit of funding. It would also cause a lot more problems in terms of anti piracy measures taken against. You'd need to be pulling a shitload of money if you've got a full complement of crew (something like 36,000 not including marines) but you could be making it. Hell you could probably have a legitimate side business where you act as an escort for one convoy who can afford your prices, and theoretically you could charge a large section of the outer rim a 'no raiding' cost if you think you can keep anyone who doesn't want to play ball down. Hard to judge, but depending on alternate sources of income you could theoretically get by. If you're trying to get by with pure raiding though I'd guesstimate about 80,000,000 credits a month if you want to keep your crew well paid enough not to try and backstab you without ludicrous profit dropping in their pockets. even then that's only about 2,000 creds a month. Its going to cost a lot to keep a crew for a ship that size, and the more handsomely you pay them to keep loyalty the more shit you're going to need to be doing. I feel like you'd need a shadowy group funding you and turn this into privateering instead of piracy, or you're going to be having to set up shop with a wide net to either catch a massive load of fish or catch a fair amount of huge fish.

>>54668913
The Wook lists the crew complements of an ISD-I at 9235 officers, 9700 infantry, and 27850 enlisted - those are the Legends numbers, but presumably it's similar enough in canon. That works out to just shy of 47,000 people.

In canon, the crew are encouraged to eat nutrient shakes instead of full meals, it saves both time and space on board the ship. I don't recall if that's the case in Legends, but I don't believe it was.

Legends also stated that ISD-Is were supplied with 6 years worth of consumables, so that takes care of rations for a while.

Meaning, raids will only be for spare parts and financial reasons, with rations being only the third-most important reason. Different captains might put different emphases on those rations, some might want to keep those for emergency usage only, others might rely on them until they have to switch to other food sources, and others might make monthly raids for different food sources to get some variety in their meals.

Regardless, that's a small city's worth of people that need supplies.

>>54669129
You gotta remember, logistics is more than just cash. Think of it like a U.S. aircraft carrier that goes rogue, becoming the enemy of every government on earth. Sure, it might be able to get cash from somewhere, but its not like you can just buy aircraft carrier parts from anywhere. In fact, you can likely only buy them from the U.S. government, or maybe from a backroom deal with Russia or China. So essentially, any part that breaks can't be replaced, and let me assure you things will break. This is precisely why "ship-war-lording" hasn't been a thing for centuries. And thats just one of the million other things that hurts rogue ships. But again, that's real world logistics, not Star Wars.

>>54668566
>Nor does ANH feel the need to do a big "as you know" dump between characters
What are you referring to here and how does it differ from Obi giving an infodump about the force to Luke.

Your entire post is extremely vague.

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>>54666944
>Why are we still here? Just for money?
>Disney sold us out - but we're whoring ourselves even harder - to take back the dignity our franchise lost
>R2, I'm already a cashcow.

>>54669709
I WAS BORN IN A LARGE SAND CRAWLER
WHEN I WAS A CHILD MY SAND CRAWLER WAS RAIDED BY STORMTROOPERS - IMPERIAL STORMTROOPERS

>>54668913
Assuming the imperial civil war, the only era where this sort of thing would be at all possible, you'd be talking getting on for forty million a month in wages, if the stormtrooper compliment is not aboard, maybe 50-60 if they are. Food would be an incidental expense, really. Spare parts would be absurdly variable in cost, so budgeting say ~10 million a month would probably be enough on average, especially considering the vast numbers of wrecked SDs (by ~11ABY, probably about ten for every active ship)

>>54669988
And that should also explain why the Rebellion didn't try to capture any ISDs of their own. The overhead for one of those would be beyond even what they could afford.

>>54669988
Not to mention personnel. After all, you might be able to buy those spare parts, but its not like just anyone can repair/maintain/operate them. And obviously, you can't simply buy skilled personnel, you need to train them at very select facilities. Of course, during the Imp. Civil War, you could probably hire deserters, but you have to be really careful, since if they weren't loyal to their last crew, they probably won't be loyal to you. No easy task, to be certain.

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>>54668913
Its a fairly exorbitant amount of money to keep an ISD at full battle readiness 24/7, those 35-36k crew do enable it to do that though and one of the reasons they're so ungodly dangerous. Really can't sneak up on one unless there's some extraneous circumstances as they're also something of a carrier (ISD-1) with some kind of air-cap buzzing around whenever they're static.

In saying that, the lower risk option of having an income coming in would be to make the most of its vast reserves of armoured vehicles, troops and fighter/bombers onboard to take over lightly defended cities on certain worlds and plunder the shit out of them. Going to toe-to-toe with other warships unless you absolutely have to, will cut into the ships profit margin as its taking hits, using fuel and taking casualties. Pirates and Privateers from the D6 era has some good info on running piracy type games, how to split the loot and what goes where. It wasn't really designed to handle stuff like battleships either, but with some jiggering it can be made to work as there is no 'set income' and anything going in is divvied up accordingly.
If I was running something like that, I'd probably take a bit from D6 P&P's and a bit from Rogue Trader.

>>54670302
>And that should also explain why the Rebellion didn't try to capture any ISDs of their own.
I mean, they DID, during the ICW. In fact they had quite a few ISDs and generally a lot of imperial leftover gear,

>>54670445
True, I was mostly speaking of the situation of a captain who had enough support structure left to not just immediately give up turning pirate, although it should be said that ISDs were supposed to have a lot of spare parts aboard, and crew trained to replace them in flight; six years of supplies doesn't just mean food, so it'd be more of a question of parking somewhere safe for a bootleg yard-less overhaul, in the rather unlikely event that somebody trying this play survived doing it for six years since the ship's last overhaul

>>54669747
Og lawdy, mah lawdy!

Where does /swg/ get it's upgrade cards for armada? If you needed duplicates, extra spinal armaments, that sort of thing

>>54671971
eBay, trading, or borrowing from a friend if you want the real deal. For casual non-tourney play, though, most people are perfectly fine with proxies.

Nucanon

>The only Y-Wing to survive the Battle of Yavin was Evaan from the Princess Leia comics. This means that she's the Y-Wing that Iden chases in Inferno Squad
>Droids have 5 Classes. Class 1: Biological Sciences (Medical droids) Class 2: Technical Sciences and Engineering (Astromech droids) Class 3: Sentient Being Interaction (Protocol droids) Class 4: Warfare (Battle droids) Class 5: Labour (Power droids)
>The Imperial Military is organized as follows: Legion > 4 Regiments each > 4 Battalions each > 4 Companies each > 4 Platoons each > 5 Squads each > 9 Stormtroopers each
>Starkiller Base and Ilum are both exactly 660 KM in size which all but confirms them to be the same planet.

There are 4 Jedi Councils:
>The Jedi High Council, the one we all know and love. It's led by the Master of the Order. It's composed of 12 members: 5 permanent, 4 long-term, and 3 short-term.
>The Council of Reassignment - Focuses on organization and personnel. It contains the Jedi Service Corps. It distributes Jedi padawans that were expelled.
>The Council of First Knowledge - Made up of 5 members; Manages the Academy, curriculum, and Jedi Archives. It's led by the Caretaker of First Knowledge.
>The Council of Reconciliation - Made up of 5 members; Focuses of the diplomatic and political side of the Order.

Blaster colors based on gas used:
>Red - The most common blaster color because it's made from cheaper gas.
>Green - Made from a higher quality gas, which makes it more expensive.
>Blue - It's ion-based energy charges are more effective against droids and machines. A ring-shaped blue bolt can also signify a stun setting.
>Orange - Non-fatal, low power, used in training situations.

>>54668913
Once the Empire started to collapse, you wouldn't really need to be a conventional pirate. If you were out in the rim, you could force whole worlds to submit, essentially making a smattering of tributary states that have to offer up the things that you need or else they get bombed from orbit.

>>54672602
Sauce or are you just headcanoning the nucanon?
>No Keyan Farlander at Yavin
Lame as fuck either way.

>>54672656
He's headcanoning about half of that

>The Service Corps hasn't been mentioned yet.

>Ilum was 5,760 m in diameter in Legends

>Stormtroopers are only one branch of the Imperial military, not the only troopers

>Only one known Jedi High Council in canon.

>Droid classes are straight from Legends

Basically the only one that's actually canon is that blaster color one.

Spacebump

Were enough Jedi even reassigned or expelled to justify a council dedicated to that purpose?

I like the idea of decentralizing the power of the Jedi Knights a little more if they're presented as a cohesive organization constituted by several thousand Jedi and a labor force of several times that.

The different varieties of Tibanna gas for blasters is something I might incorporate into a plotline in the EotE campaign I'm developing. Hmm...

Ilum has the diameter of our Moon and Pluto put together, so it's fairly small. (Or a little less than half the diameter of Earth)

Huh, looks like I was wrong about the four councils - they exist, according to Complete Locations, but the Jedi Service Corps still does not - the Council of Reassignment just deals with Jedi acolytes not granted the status of padawan.

Even more oddly, even though the Jedi Service Corps as a whole isn't canon, nor are the MediCorps, the ExploriCorps, or EduCorps, the AgriCorps actually is canon also thanks to the Complete Locations, though it's not stated that it's made of failed Jedi like in Legends.

>>54675579
>Were enough Jedi even reassigned or expelled to justify a council dedicated to that purpose?

No. Very few were actually expelled. Dropouts and others who simply couldn't make the cut were relocated, but even they were relatively uncommon overall.

I think the highest number I've ever seen for the Jedi Service Corps as a whole was maybe 30,000. That's still triple the size of the actual Jedi Order itself, from Padawans to Masters, however.

>>54675854
>though it's not stated that it's made of failed Jedi like in Legends.
Not really a loss desu, that was always a little weird.

>>54667879
>Reduce the amount of Negative Play Experiences (NPE), Single-player interactions, or un-fun factors in the game.

git gud fgt
gg no re

>>54676150
It kinda was, but at the same time it was a decent explanation for what happened to people who didn't make the cut as Jedi, but at the same time didn't warrant true expulsion.

>>54668397
>IM A REBEL, I REBEL

>>54676215
>using a trailer-only quip

>>54676768
well it's hard to mock a movie you've never actually seen.

>>54668566
5 bucks says you think TFA is a better movie than TPM.

>>54677361
>TPM.
there is only one movie worse than TPM, and it's Attack of the Clones. And that's only because TPM hits that "so bad it's good" mark.

>>54677361
Not him, but it was.
Being better than TPM is not a high bar to overcome. Though Attack of the Clones managed to fail miserably at it.

>>54677455
>>54677484
wew
TFA is by far the worst Star Wars movie.

>>54677511

Dude, there are only six movies.
And only if you count spin-offs and specials, really.

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>>54677545
This type of meme is dumb. You know when Indy 5 comes out it'll be even cringier to do the le 3 movies thing.

>>54677615
Even if he pretends the PT didn't exist, he still got the count wrong.
>OT
>TFA
>R1
>TCW
>Caravan of Courage
>Battle for Endor
>Holiday Special
That's 9 films, unless I missed some other spin-offs.

>>54677511
Children who think the prequels have any merit have no opinions worth considering.

>>54677749
I guess Rian Johnson is a child.

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My players in AoR just stole 14 Roger Roger Battle Droids from a bandit in the Felucia bayou. They are contacting two possible buyers: a private collector of Clone Wars memorabilia and a Neimodian who wants to go back to "the glory days, hew hew hew."
The standard sell rate for 14 Rogers would be 45,500 credits. I think the private collector would offer the cash, but the well-connected Neimodian would give the equivalent of a Contribution point. The question is: Rogers are Rarity 5, so what Contribution Rarity could they reasonably get for 14 droids?

>>54677711

> TFA
> R1
> TCW

Sure, let's pretend they didn't stop making Movies in the 80s.

>>54677835
*70's
There's only one Star Wars.

I feel that with TFA they got sppoked by how badly the prequels were received and played it extra safe by pretty copying most of the plot from ANH. To me at least that made the film feel like a rehash. Not helped that they seemed to rush a lot of character developement (Rey unlocking the ability to use the Force being the prime example; it had to happen because the next movie is supposed to feature her training under Luke, but they clearly had no time to properly establish it so she just deus-ex-machinaes it at the point where plot says she needs to use the Force). Hopefully the next movie can actually be its own thing rather than them just going through a checklist of "classic Star Wars things".
TPM (and prequels in general) was bad for pretty much the opposite reason. They had a new plot and new characters, but the direction was terrible and most of the actors pretty bad. Plus it gave us not one but two really annoying supporting characters.

Also, I feel TPM is really extraneous even if it it was better made. Mor of a side story than the opening of a big film trilogy and one of the most anticipated movies ever. It doesn't really play a role in the overarching plot of the prequels (the Clone Wars and the rise of Palpatine's Empire) aside from introducing some characters and plot elements. And did we really need an entire movie to tell us that there's a trade federation that invaded some planet that ended up causing an incident that led to bunch of planet separating from the Republic, and that before becoming a jedi Anakin was an annoying little shit and also she's had a crush on the girl she love since he was like 12 years old? You could start the preguel trilogy from AOTC with only minor changes (mention few of the actually plot-relevant thing in TPM) and you wouldn't really lose anything, sparing us Kid Anakin, Jar-Jar, and a pointless podracing subplot. Maybe then Anakin's fall wouldn't have come across so rushed, as they'd have three movies to flesh him out.

>>54677455
>>54677484
>TPM had the best lore expansion and world building of any star wars movie
>TFA didn't add a single new idea or concept
How can you think the things you think?

>>54668369
I'm not the person you're responding to but: "RotJ is worse than ANH because of the Teddy Bears." And, you know, a lot of other stuff too. But the ewoks are a significant blow alone, and if you took ANH and replaced... uh... let's say the tuskin raiders and jawas... with ewoks, it'd definitely be worse than the original (and the ewoks would still have less screen time and be less important than they were in RotJ).

>>54667733
>You don't judge the Luke and Vader stuff differently in RotJ because of the Ewoks, do you?
Yes. It ruins the gravity of the movie. The Luke and Vader stuff is not an interlocking part of a masterpiece / solid movie. It's just one of the good bits of a flawed movie.

>>54667115
>the trash compactor scene is annoying and Hammy in a bad way all the way through.
The trash compactor scene is fine.

>>54658054
>The actor direction is identical to ANH.
The acting in ANH rather unpolished, but it still manages not to be cringy, and there are some cool characters in there. Neeson, Portman, and McGreggor all seem wooden in TPM, and it certainly isn't because none of them have acting talent. TPM has no soul.

And the story for ANH is much better than TPM. I really have no good analogy to properly convey the huge gulf in quality between the movies, because ANH vs. TPM is the analogy I normally use to convey such things. It should be obvious to everybody that ANH is a much, much, much better movie, and if it isn't to you, your point of view is so alien to me that I'm shocked we can communicate at all. It'd be like if somebody told me the live action Last Airbender movie was at least as good as the cartoon series. That person is so deep in crazy land that I'm not sure I'd see the point of trying to reason with them.

>>54677761
Literally who?

>>54677933
> best lore and world building
>in the film that bastardized the Force with Midichlorians
0/10
Terrible bait. See me after class.

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163KB, 720x640px

>>54677939
>Not liking Ewoks
Yub yub, Commander.

>>54677957
>it's magic, I don't have to explain shit
Fuck off.

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>>54677893
TPM is integral to Anakin's story though. Being ripped away from his mother at a young age is why he is vulnerable to Palpatine.

Recall Anakin speeding to the Tusken canp against the setting suns in AotC.
>you can't stop the change, any more than you can stop the suns from setting

>>54677939
>the huge gulf in quality between the movies
I will never understand this. TPM is beautiful and has all the soul in the world.
>he deserves better than a slave's life

>>54677971
The whole point was that the Force was faith. Liking the whole magical microbes is even worse than the Force just being magic itself. You go fuck yourself, kid.

>>54677957
You mean a litmus test or thermostat for measuring force sensitivity? Why wouldn't the Jedi have some way of measuring force?

>>54677957
>>in the film that bastardized the Force with Midichlorians
The force always had a biological component. Midichlorians are not the force.

>>54678013
I... nigger are you fucking serious? It was a disgusting mess of static shots and terrible 90s CGI.

>>54678026
>The whole point was that the Force was faith.
Then why was us passed through families, genius?

>>54678032
>>54678030
>defending midichlorians
Fucking hell. This site has gone to help if it allows underage shitcunts like this to post.

>>54678046
I'm totally serious. TPM is beautiful to me.
Even little moments like Amidala hanging her head as the Trade Fed matches on Theed.

>>54677511
In all honesty, I consider that film, it's production & political agenda to be outright awful. I say it's so bad, I prefer the Holiday Special over TFA. At least the Holiday Special didn't shit all over all of Star Wars for money & social justice.

Dark times are these.

>>54678062
cry me a river bby

>>54677893
>They had a new plot and new characters, but the direction was terrible and most of the actors pretty bad.
In general, the plot of the prequels felt like it was being made up on the spot. Yes, there was some brainstorming done ahead of time, and some themes had been established, but it's like the particulars were hurriedly written immediately prior to shooting the scenes, like some kid who gets to school and realizes he forgot to write his 6th period history paper and has to frantically scribble the thing out during every minute of free time he has that morning.

>You could start the preguel trilogy from AOTC with only minor changes (mention few of the actually plot-relevant thing in TPM) and you wouldn't really lose anything.
Agreed.

>Maybe then Anakin's fall wouldn't have come across so rushed, as they'd have three movies to flesh him out.
Yes. The entire point of the prequels was to cover Anakin's conversion to the dark side, and it was crammed into the middle of the third movie. Drop TPM and spend an extra movie developing the arc in RotS. Obviously quality control would still be an issue (especially in AotC), but at a certain point you're just saying "tear everything up and start over", and they could at least have given the proper things the proper focus.

>>54678062
Midichorians are an in-universe way of measuring force sensitivity. They're a ruler or using a dog to sniff out something. What did you think they are? Did you think that having a thermometer diminish the "magic" of temperature?

>>54678062
Nice adhom, big boy. Sure showed me how adult you are!

>>54678067
>social justice.
huh? is this because Rey is a girl? Because if that's all it takes to get your feather's ruffled then You've got serious problems.

>>54678064
Jesus you need to go learn how films are shot. The composition in TPM is fucking amateur. Which is typical of Lucas' work. He just managed to create enough spectacle the first time around to not make it look so bad. But with TPM, there was no excuse and no worthwhile spectacle to fill the frame. Just lame half set piece after lame half set piece and that god-awful CGI.

>>54678091
see
>>54677982

Anakin's seduction and pathology makes no sense without TPM.

>>54678105
Totally disagree. Lucas's shooting style is great.
He keeps the camera still a lot on purpose.

He has the abiltity to be a JJ tier madman (see the superfast pan to Amidala after Sheev's transmission is blocked by Gunray), but most of the time he chooses not to.

>>54678102
No, it's the emphasis on their political agenda. Star Wars always had diversity. They didn't have some diversity quota. Leia was a strong heroine. We had guys like Lando for minority's. In the prequels we had Windu for race diversity, & tons of female Jedi. For some reason, they decided that it wasn't enough.

Rey is a badly written character. The problem about having such a stream of success is that it diminishes the value of each win. In OT, Luke spent a shit ton of time getting his ass kicked & this lead to his success being the more meaningful. In the 1st Matrix movie, Neo encountered numerous failures until he started succeeding near the end. Their failures made their successes all the more meaningful. Where does Rey have to grow? Judging by TFA, she'd master anything in seconds.

>>54677511
TFA is at least professional. It's empty rehash, but it's well-executed empty rehash. Compared to it, TPM is like some shitty straight-to-dvd release (only one with an inexplicably high budget for special effects). TFA was disappointing in a lot of ways, but it wasn't the abomination TPM was. The only thing TPM has up on TFA is that it was a new story, but since that story was tripe, even that's a wash.

>>54678102
Rey being a girl isn't the problem. She's a shit heroine but that's not it.

>>54678177
Nah. TPM is put together way more competently.
TFA is a trainwreck that tried to cram every iconic thing from the OT into one movie.

>>54678177
It wasn't professional or well executed. What did it do that's good? The characters were uninteresting and badly characterized. The CGI was everywhere, stood out & were downright ugly. Even some of the practical effects were ugly. What's good about it?

>>54678113
It didn't need its own whole movie. 30 minutes is all it would take to establish him as from Tatooine(explains why Luke ends up there with relatives) and thst it was traumatic for him to be pulled away from his mother.
We didn't need the whole Trade Federation bullshit. The whole Naboo dogshit plot. The whole Midichlorians and immaculate birth and prophecy horseshit either.
Darth Maul was cool but needed a better death than dying while standing on the high ground.
Then you can spend time establishing his friendship with Obi-Wan. Something the movies completely failed to show. Only focusing on showing their differences and disputes then TELLING us that they're such good friends.
Oh and we didn't need George not allow g his actors to emote to the point that wooden planks with angry faces on them would have been acceptable substitutes.

>>54678218
I still don't get the mitochlorians. Do people really hate measurements that much? It's nothing but a way to see how force sensitive a person is. They're microscopic life who're attracted to the force & thus are used for measuring sensitivity

>>54677982
>TPM is integral to Anakin's story though. Being ripped away from his mother at a young age is why he is vulnerable to Palpatine.
But that really takes up very little of the movie. You could roll it up into another movie either just by having characters elude to it (it could scarcely be less evocative than the portrayal of... anything... in TPM), or by having a "back in the past" segment at the beginning (like how Jabba's palace is its own thing at the beginning of RotJ). Have you seen Up? The best part of that was the backstory clip at the start of the movie. And honestly, AotC might have been a better movie if it spanned a longer period of time.

>>54678218
But Maul didn't die in TPM.

>>54678218
>Only focusing on showing their differences and disputes then TELLING us that they're such good friends.
They are clearly very close in the films. They are a parent and child at odds.
RotS shows a more mature Anakin who has moved on from resenting Obi until Sheev pulls him back in.
>i've dissapointed you, I haven't been very appreciative of your training. I've been arrogant- and I apologize.

The whole point is that they are close but at odds because of Palpatine. When Anakin is away from his influence they are much more at ease.

>>54678254
>(it could scarcely be less evocative than the portrayal of... anything... in TPM)
I don't understand this mindset.

>>54678267
Anakin never acts like anything but a bratty teenager on screen.

Is any CGI in the prequels as ugly as the Rathtars? The Rathtars stuck out to me as excessively badly done.

>>54678218
>>54678254
Of course, TPM also shows how Palp ascends, and well as establishing why the galaxy would splinter into a Seperatist movement.
>It is clear to me now that the Republic no longer functions

>>54678250
It's stated that they are what allow people to use the Force. That without them, life and The Force could not exist. That's why they're bullshit.
Them being nothing but a measuring stick is just fanwank made up to justify them without acknowledging what bullshit they are stated to be in TPM.

>>54678326
>all the monsters ever established in legends
>let's just use a rolling ball of tentacles

>>54678321
Once again, very wrong.
He is lost, not bratty. He is torn between two fathers, but is good at heart.
He saves Obi from Dooku in AotC, he grows during the war
>this time we'll do it together
>I was about to say that

All his brattyness is Palpatine putting thoughts of glory and ego in his head

>>54678356
>The Force could not exist.
Wrong.

>>54678327
No, it really doesn't. Just that Malcom McDowell is a shit PM and somehow a senator from some backwater shithole that got conquered by droids in a day somehow got popular.
Even with the awful exposition dump scenes of people just sitting and explaining the plot, there's no development of the Republic ready to split in two. Or how the Trade Federation managed to go from Jews woth bad Jap accents to being the pawns of the Sith's whole Separatist movement.

>>54678356
It's not, they're nothing but a way of measuring that. Didn't people read?

The quotes are "Without the midi-chlorians, life could not exist, and we would have no knowledge of the Force. They continually speak to us, telling us the will of the Force. When you learn to quiet your mind, you'll hear them speaking to you."

They're like if someone discovered old scrolls about how to use the force or a tool like a microscope or X-ray. They didn't say no mitochlorions = no force, they said no knowledge of the force.

>>54678363
Those were downright fugly. They're an example of what TFA doesn't do right.

>>54678423
They were already pawns, dumbass.

>>54678423
>Jews woth bad Jap accent
They're Chinese, lad. Endless army of soulless drones.

>>54678426

So you quote something which literally says that without midichlorians, life wouldnt exist and people wouldnt know the force.

And you take this to be proof that midichlorians are just a way of measuring it?

Is English your second language my dude.

>>54678368
He starts acting like a brat to Obi-Wan in the elevator in the very first scene we see them in AotC. It is never shown what a bond they have. Not in the movies. Just told. That's the issue. You keep saying it and the quoting some bullshit like that justifies Anakin's bullshit but it doesn't excuse George's inability to show not tell.

>>54678174
That's more Rey being badly written than any political agenda.
Really, Luke in ANH also was way better pilot than he'd have any right to be (he's mentioned to have been very good a flying a light atmospheric craft, although we never see him do so, but that letting him immediately master flying a space-superiority fighter is still a stretch), and desu ex machnaes the ability to use the Force when the plot demands it. The difference is that they a) actually spent time showing him training to use the Force (even if it was one short scene, that scene being there implies that he probably also trained a lot more offscreen) and b) (and this is the important one) him being able to use the Force is the culmination of his character arc in the movie. Even if it does kind of just happen when the plot says it's convenient, it's something hiw whole character arc has been build to and now culminates in. Rey on the other hand just gets to use the Force because plot says she has to use the Force, and it doesn't really factor into her character arc other than to send her off to train to be a jedi in the next film.
In fact, I feel Rey doesn't really have a character arc, but rather we are just introduced the character and setting her up for the second film where she presumably will get an arc (namely her training under Luke and becoming a jedi).

It's definitely bad writing, but I'd say it has nothing to do with any kind of agenda and more with them rehashing a more succesful movie and trying to cram all required setup for a trilogy in the film at the same time, leaving them with practically no room to let the characters be actual characters rather than a checkbox of traits and plot-relevant skills.

>>54678464
Yeah, pawns in Jewing one world. The movies fail to show how it goes from one planet to half of the galaxy.

>>54678472
>It is never shown what a bond they have. Not in the movies
But it is. You can call it clunky, but it is. Take the opening act of RotS.

>>54678519
Not at all.
We see through Amidala that the Republic is corrupt and decaying and has abandoned the little guy.

>>54678511

I tghink the part that bugs me is that it wouldve been so easy to show it throughout.

Like, when she goes to get food of Unkar and he tries to stiff her and her response is "Yesterday they were two each" they couldve had her unconsciously mind trick him.
Just stuff that simple showing she's been using the force all along without really knowing it - especially since Maz tells her later that it's always been there.

Shit like that hinting from the start and then being clear later wouldve fixed it all.

>>54678511
In Lucas' original script, Luke was going to miss his first shot at the Death Star.
The have to circle around and take another shot. Just to establish how hard the shot was. But Han had come in and knocked Vader out of the fight before the first shot so there would have been no tension, just tedium as he lined up his second shot.

>>54678469
I'm pretty sure you're functionally illiterate. They flat out said that it's knowledge of the force. Without many of our tools for research, we don't have any knowledge of much of our knowledge. Without our observatories and telescopes and sending stuff to space , we'd have little knowledge of other planets. Does this mean the planets don't exist unless we observe them or if we have knowledge of them?

OH! question:

Due to financhial restrictions I have not kept up with the last 2 expansions for Armada. How has the Meta changed since then? Are Sniper-nebulons still a thing? are Interdictors still janky as shit?

>>54678562
But it's saying they're not just a measuring stick. That they are essential for communicating and accessing the Force. They're not a telescope for seeing things. They're the rocket ship you need to get there and that's the issue.

>>54678511
The movie mentions Luke as having great piloting skills many times,

Luke: No, my father didn't fight in the Clone Wars. He was a navigator on a spice freighter.
Obi-Wan: That's what your uncle told you. He didn't hold with your father's ideals; he felt he should've stayed here and not gotten involved.
Luke: You fought in the Clone Wars?
Obi-Wan: Yes. I was once a Jedi knight, the same as your father.
Luke: I wish I'd known him.
Obi-Wan: He was the best star pilot in the galaxy, and a cunning warrior. I understand that you've become quite a good pilot yourself. And he was a good friend.

Luke Skywalker: [shocked] Ten thousand!? We could almost buy our own ship for that!
Han Solo: But who's gonna fly it, kid? You?
Luke Skywalker: You bet I could! I'm not such a bad pilot myself. C'mon, we don't have to sit here and— [Ben calms down Luke]

I used to bullseye womp rats in my T-16 back home. They're not much bigger than two meters.

And in a deleted scene with Biggs, Luke's skill was complemented

>>54666944
Luke is my husbando.

>>54678598
And without telescopes and stuff we have no ways of properly viewing things beyond Earth beyond eyeballing. We could blindly guess about other planets but I'd be nothing but blind guessing. They're a tool, an important tool, for examining something they otherwise have little ways of doing.

>>54678630
You mean the one where Biggs is telling Red Leader how good a pilot the already flightsuit-clad Luke is?
Wasn't that restored for the Special Edition?
Or was that the Toshi Station scene that deserved to be cut because it had to place and showing it any time before the droids end up with Luke shatters the image of Tatooine that's developed as hostile and harsh and desolate until the droid buying scene.

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>>54678511
>letting him immediately master flying a space-superiority fighter is still a stretch
The visual dictionaries say that the X-wing's control scheme is similar to the one found in Luke's Skyhopper (makes sense, since they both come from the same manufacturer). And given the WW2 influences in Star Wars, the transition wouldn't have really been that hard. It would be like switching from a Cessna to a Wildcat rather than Cessna to F-15. And judging by what is seen on-screen at Yavin, Luke hadn't mastered the X-wing. He gets one TIE kill during the entire battle and owes his survival more to Biggs, Wedge, and Han than to his dogfighting prowess. He's a good pilot but it's obvious that he still has a lot to learn.

>>54678562

>"life would not exist and we would have no knowledge of the force"
>it's a measure!

I mean obviously, without a thermometer, life would not exist and we would have no knowledge of temperature.

>>54678677
The flaw in them is they they are more than an observation tool. That's the problem with them that you don't seem to grasp or admit that there's more to them than that.

>>54678511
The problem about Rey, in comparison with others, is that she doesn't have enough failings. The writers explicitly said "strong female lead" and explicitly had her mention she doesn't need her hand held and have her save so many. Instead of creating a balanced character, they definitely aimed for strong, independent woman with consequences be damned.

>>54677830
I'd do a Contribution 4 for a Rarity 7 payout form that Neimodian, but cap the size of allowed vehicles.

>>54678250
> The way you interact and interface with this larger energy field [the Force] is through the midi-chlorians, which are sensitive to the energy. They are at the core of your life, which is the cell, the living cell. They are in a symbiotic relationship with the cell. And then, because they’re all interconnected as one, they can communicate with the larger Force field. That’s how you deal with the Force.
-George Lucas

>>54678713
They're a damn important tool. Eyes and ears are an important tool for observation. I doubt I can do experiments on thoughts alone. How are they more? They don't make the force, they're helpful in examining, studying and more. There's just no other tools as useful in this field. It'd be like if we only had a telescope. It's a tool of absolute importance yet it doesn't create what it observes.

>>54678783

Except the whole 'obervation tool' argument was because the guy was claiming that midichlorians were just a way to measure a person's innate force sensitivity.
Which they arent, at all.

>>54678783
>They don't make the force
Np, but they are the only way anyone can ever interact with the force.
>>54678775

>>54678775
>The way you interact and interface with this larger energy field
That kinda proves >>54678093 correct. It's how we interact with it. We interact with our senses or like that post said, through objects like thermometers. Having working senses doesn't diminish the magic about anything.

>>54678783
You keep ignoring the issue and pretending like they're only an observation tool. That's not the issue with them, you fucking idiot. The issue is that they ruin the Force being being a necessary bridge between the user and the Force. Rather than the user just having their own ability.

>>54678696
Neither of those scenes were restored for the special edition, the first is still in the deleted scenes features of most releases but I think the station scene with Luke's friends was only in a one or two of the releases total. Not sure if it's the latest Blu-Ray release or not, I haven't gone through the deleted scenes for that.

>>54678472
>He starts acting like a brat to Obi-Wan in the elevator in the very first scene we see them in AotC.
No?

>>54678849
Are you literally retarded? No, it doesn't make you right because it's not JUST an observation tool.

>>54678862
Err, that's pretty stupid dude. I see what>>54678783 says. Being the gateway doesn't mean much. It's the difference between I eat a part of an apple or I use a fork to eat it.

>>54678863
The Toshi Station scene is out, but I could have sworn the hangar scene was. Because it's important in reinforcing Luke's piloting skill and actually showing the audience Luke's friendship woth Biggs, rather than leaving him a single name in one sentence an hour and a half go. And explains why Luke is so stunned when his longtime friend is killed. Rather than making him look just slightly constipated.

>>54678917
No, it's
>I use my teeth to eat an apple
or
>my optics nerves allow me to see

>>54678814
>>54678847
>>54678849
>>54678862
>>54678886
Reading through this exchange, it appears one side thinks that those mitochondria are minor and only a passage to the Force & the other side is arguing that they're more important and that no mitochondria = no Force. I don't get it, the Force exists even if no one uses it.

>>54678917
Yep. You're functionally retarded.

>>54678963
That's any different? It's "I eat my food & shit" or "I chew my food and swallow, does through digestive tract, and I shit". Who cares how the intermediate level works? It's the in & the out. They could use the Force via electromagnetic fields or brain waves and I wouldn't care.

>>54678966
It's one retard who keeps saying the midichlorians we're nothing but a way to measure someone's sensitivity to the Force and was BTFO by his own quote from the movie and has now moved the goalposts to say they're the tool for people to USE the Force, not realizing that was the entire reason why they are hated in the first place.

>>54678966
I'm not arguing that the force wouldn't exist without them, but that without them, no one could use the force.

My headcanon is that they are just a measurement, a lifeform that flocks to cells of people who are very sensitive and/or powerful, but actual canon shits all over that.

>>54678814
Interact and interface, you ever do a study? That's how we observe shit. We do experiments in the lab like that. You think that we just view things at a distance? Observation of shit sometimes needs interaction. Did anyone here ever do a science experiment in their lives?

>>54679036
I'm thinking you people are even more retarded. The reason they were hated was because people think it makes the Force a biological function or that the mitochondria were a non-magical explanation of the Force. It's that it seems to make the Force a material or biological thing, not a magical thing anymore which gets the hate.

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After reviewing pic.'s stats from Lead By Example, I have to say this ship is cartoonishly over-gunned, at the cost of despite being a silhouette 7 is somehow less durable than the smaller nebulon-b.

So why do I want so badly to fly one of these coffins?

>>54679039
I'm rereading through this exchange and I agree with the conclusion that you guys are illiterate. >>54678562
Said that the Force would still exist without them, >>54678598 responded that it's needed to access the Force. These points are separate.

Even in the earlier points, >>54678356 flat out said The Force could not exist without them,

Consider this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOkqHkVqvzs

>Midi Chlorians were a good indicator, but not the end all be all, Qui-Gon's reliance on them reflects on the Jedi of that time becoming complacent

>>54679109
It's not that suprising that it's less durable, considering the CIS ships are practically skeletal, having large sections that are completely unarmoured. So it might be larger in size than CR90 but its lack of armour makes it not very durable.

CIS ships design looks cool as hell, though. I wish the prequel stuff wasn't considered so toxic by fans, as I'd love them doing Republic and CIS fleets for Armada (considering X-Wing includes TFA stuff despite their being thrity-odd years between it and the OT, it's hardly impossible). I think the ship aesthetic from that era is actually superior, as you still got the classic wed-shaped star destroyers everybody loves (now in colour other than unpainted plastic grey), but replace the not very appealing to me Rebel ships with the much sexier CIS ones.

>>54679166
>I'm not arguing

My only posts are >>54678775 and >>54678963, well, and >>54679039 of course.

>>54679004
Yeah, I think it's different, and forks are completely unnecessary to eating the apple, whereas your mouth and digestive tract are integral to the process.

>>54679267
I think >>54679041 responded that interaction is something done in observation all the time. It's true. We have to isolate factors, do tests and often some degree of interaction to study the response while hopefully not screwing with the original hard enough to ruin the sample. Force is for knowledge and defence I guess.

>>54679259

I think it's mostly a balance thing which keeps FFG from jumping full bore into CW era ships - most people actually really like that stuff out of the PT. They have a hard enough time managing 2-3 factions for some of their minis games - making it difficult to countenance adding 2 more (without getting into the realistic political cluster fuck of - well, the Jedi/Republic are ideologically allied with a lot of the Rebels, but the Empire uses their old tech while the Rebels are filled with CIS surplus even though their organization was run by Sith stooges).

Armada would probably handle it best - though atm FFG has not introduced other eras of ships to that game. We know they're not wholly opposed to the "cross all eras" element either, but Destiny has a very simple "faction" mechanic.

>>54679293
Then the analogy could need some fixing. The point was, does it matter more about doing something or how many middlemen there are? If it jumps from person directly to the force or through some middleman then to the force, does it matter? The force is still magical. It's just they don't just go from person to force, they need some bridge between.

>>54679330
I'm not sure George was considering the scientific ramifications of the word interact.
I'm not good with analogies, but I'll try anyways.

>I have a PS4, a fantastic piece of technology
>The only way to interact in any useful way is through the controller
>Without the controller to interact with it, it's just a useless plastic box

>>54678960
I know for a fact it's not in the 2006 version. I couldn't tell you off the top of my head if it's in the 2011 version, and the 2015 version is identical to the 2011 version save for it being digital release only.

I don't recall it being in the 2011/2015 version, but I've got my Blu-Rays here about five feet away from me if I really wanted to go check.

>>54679400
But the game console still exists and even if we can't observe it, it & all it's secrets are still there.

>>54679400
>PS4, a fantastic piece of technology
"No."

>Without the controller to interact with it, it's just a useless plastic box
But that's still wrong. You could also use M+KB, which is a lot like the conclusion derived here. >>54679167

>>54679387
I don't really have fault with that, but people were going on about it just being a measuring tool despite evidence to the contrary and it was tickling my autism.

and your analogy sucked

>>54679370
They could include some of those ships in Rebel/Empire factions, at least. In fact, they've already did include the Arquintes-class (I think) light cruiser as an Imperial ship in Armada and the ARC-130 as a Rebel ship in X-Wing. You also see CIS capital ships being used by the Rebellion in the art of one of X-Wing's upgrade cards.

>>54679449
Like I said, I'm not good with analogies, let me correct it
>without a controller, M+KB or some other such set up it's just a useless plastic box

>>54679448
I've never said anything different, shit I don't even know how you extrapolated that from my post. Still useless though.

>>54679458
But as some mentioned, the hate towards those mitochondrion are for demystifying Force or seemingly creating Force. It doesn't actually do that & at best is another middleman.

>>54679523
But it's not just a plastic box, you nigger. Watch the video.

>>54679527
I was just chiming in to satisfy my autism in regards to the measuring tool crowd.

>>54679523
The other posts seems to be arguing that the mitochondria aren't as important to the existence of the Force as people say.

>>54678218
>Then you can spend time establishing his friendship with Obi-Wan. Something the movies completely failed to show
What?
He confides in him about his dreams, he confides in him about his romantic feelings, and Obi even says things like
>she was pleased to see us
Which isn't Jedi kosher given what Anakin is feeling, but is something he knows Anakin needs to hear to feel better.

>>54679559
Without Midichlorians to interact with the force, the force would be useless, and no one could interact with it, where at in the video does it refute that.

>>54679591
The Force will still exist, you just can't use it.

>>54679680
You wouldn't be able to use the force, but the force still affects non-force sensitives.

>>54679723
Ah, I should have used the word unusable instead of useless. My bad.

>>54679680
The Force still existing would still have influence. Even if not directly people, there are objects who respond to The Force.

>>54679775
>>54679680
Also, watch from here. https://youtu.be/dOkqHkVqvzs?t=152

>>54679809
I've watched it several times through already. It's saying that even though the soulless computer readout of a midichlorian count is a very accurate method of measuring how much *potential power* a force user has, it's not the best model for selecting future jedi.
At one point it even says
>even someone with a midichlorian count of 2 could become a jedi
It does not say someone with 0 midichlorians could become a jedi.

>>54680040
>someone with 0 midichlorians
Would be dead.

>>54680040
>hanging on a generic example and not getting the point that midi chlorian count doesn't matter if you believe

>>54680060
Where at in the video does it say that?

>>54680054
Or cut off from the force.

>>54680122
>Or cut off from the force.

>without the midichlorians, life could not exist

>>54680122
>Where at in the video does it say that?
Do you have autism?
>even someone with a midichlorian count of 2 could become a jedi
This is what we call a "generic example" Generic examples are used to illustrate a point.

>>54680135
In-material spoken exposition is only useful to determine what the character believes or wants other characters to believe. They should never be taken as read.

>>54680135
Touche.

>>54680151
Give me a quote from that youtube link that says that midichlorians are not required for force interaction, please.

>>54680205
You don't need a verbatim quote. The video tells you that midi chlorian count is a good indicator for potential, but does not actually determine whether someone will be competent with the force. As long as a person can connect with the universe they can use force, regardless of their midi chlorian count.

>>54678067
>social justice.
LOL

>>54680266
I didn't get that at all, I got that a clinical measurement of pure power potential is not a good metric for training someone in the force, as they could be a bloody psychopath or megalomaniac, or just lazy, or unable to cope with the loss of their mother.

And we might need a verbatim quote considering we have a verbatim quote from George Lucas saying that yes you do need them to interact with the force.

>>54680363
>clinical measurement of pure power potential is not a good metric for training someone in the force because they could turn out to be evil
But that's not what it said at all. It said that midi chlorians could be helpful in determining force potential, but high midi chlorian count was irrelevant. Otherwise, how could a person with a midi chlorian count of only two become a "great jedi master?" Obviously, there must be other ways to tap into the force.

>>54680436
Even someone with a weak natural connection to the force can hone their abilities through practice and focus. And maybe someone with great insight and wisdom but little in the way of force power can be a great jedi master.

>>54680650
In canon, all life is actually "Force sensitive" - that is, the Force is a part of their lives, even if they don't consciously control it.

Force "sensitive" is different from "Force user."

The Guardians of the Whills book, about Baze and Chirrut, has Chirrut explicitly state that he is not a Force user, and that even through extensive training and meditation, the most he can actually "feel" the Force is basically akin to feeling grains of sand blowing through someone's hand.

>>54680784
>Chirrut explicitly state that he is not a Force user, and that even through extensive training and meditation, the most he can actually "feel" the Force is basically akin to feeling grains of sand blowing through someone's hand.
>this is evidently enough to be Toph avatar
Nah, fuck off. You can't walk back from that by contradicting a movie in a book.

>>54680874
>contradicting
????

>>54680892
>can see everything around him clearly, even objects, well enough to fight better than someone who can see physical tells
>dude grains of sand lmao

>>54680923
Oh, well that's somewhat reasonable. Just pump up grains of sand to changes in the wind and practice.

>>54680955
That's rubbish and you know it. Droids and other non-living, non-force things should be completely invisible to him, then.

>inb4 R4 comic

>>54680991
I always figured it was the force stuff combined with actual blind people echolocation, via the cane and stuff.

>>54680991
Whatever dude, works for me.

>>54680923
Except he can't?

He can "see" people, and objects that are strong in the Force, but that's about it. He basically was only able to get to the console at the end of the film, and had to feel around before finding the right part to enable.

>>54681089
>He can "see" people, and objects that are strong in the Force, but that's about it.
That TIE pilot he shot down must have been the second coming of Exar Kun, in that case.

>>54681209
Did you miss my comma, anon?

People, comma, and objects strong in the Force.

Even the former isn't a guarantee that he "sees" them through the Force, and not just a blind person's senses like >>54681024 said.

The Force gives him some insight when he chants his mantra (I don't recall off the top of my head if he said it before he set up his laser crossbow), but pretty much all interactions beyond the TIE Fighter and the general location of the terminal at the end of the film can either be explained by feeling things in the Force (like the kyber crystal, when Cassian goes to kill Galen, and the location of the terminal) or through the extra-sensitive senses that blind people tend to get.

>>54681089
>>54681299
Is he seeing clear as fucking day or is is "grains of sand blowing through someone hand?" The shots he takes at that and other moments require either immense precision or ungodly force guidance.

>>54678218
>>54679593
SO AM I~
STILL WAITING~

https://my.mixtape.moe/fhispg.webm

>not using his stick to guide him across uneven terrain
>but definitely not using the force to guide the blaster bolts off target even though there's literally no reason for them to be missing and it's been established that death troopers don't have shit aim like normal stormtroopers

>H-he can only see people and shit like kyber crystals, that's his only power!
>He's definitely not only there because Disney was terrified that a star wars movie wouldn't be able to stand on its own legs without dumb force mumbo jumbo!

>>54681299

Considering the way the TIE not only gets rekt but then crashes into the turbolaser turret, the whole thing screamed 'force perception'.

Like, he didnt necessarily know "I fire here, I'll kill a TIE and destroy a turret", but he knew "fire here, now".

>>54680991
Yoda explicitly gave rocks and luke's x-wing as examples of things that were part of the force

>>54681657
Even still. That's not dust in the wind. That's superhuman visual perception.

>>54681620
This is how I kind of see it.

He doesn't have "force vision" so much as he has faith. This jives pretty well with the themes of his character.

So when Luke is training against the remote, and gives in to the Force and the Force shows him where to move his lightsaber, Chirrut is doing that all the time. He can't necessarily perceive what it is he's doing, striking, or interacting with, he just knows that the Force is giving him guidance and he knows better than to question it.

>>54681696
I'm just saying, droids shouldn't be invisible if ships and rocks aren't invisible.

>>54681756
black dixk

>>54681738

Yeah, that's the standard thing as far as I've always understood it at least

He cant see what he's doing but the force 'says' "sit here, do this, aim just so and fire...now" and he obeys.

>>54679109
That's always been the IGBC theme, heck the theme for most non-Lucrehulk CIS ships.

Presumably they were originally designed that way partly for budget and partly for some sort of legal requirements, like interwar Treaty Battleships.

On the other hand, Kanan can hear in space while blind, so who the fuck knows.

>>54682138
Kanan is a real force user, though.

Also,
>star wars space
>following the rules of real world space
>all that delta V with engines only pointing one way
Go watch the start of ep 3 again and you'll catch cancer watching the buzz droids fly back as soon as they "die" instead of continuing at their current velocity until the're acted on.

>>54682246
I thought that just meant that the fighters were still accelerating.

>>54682483
Possibly, but they don't seem to be gaining speed in relation to other objects around them.

>>54682499
But they would be accelerating to reach the Chancellor.

>>54682246

Buzz droids ruined that sequence for me.
The initial bit with the two of them flying down over the Venator, with the drums playing had me hype as hell.

And then in a huge battle, they get menaced by tiny droids with saws.
Fucking disappointing.

>>54682977
I loved the buzz droids. Very unusual little things.
Plus IIRC they are based on something from history.

>>54683148

Oh dont get me wrong, I appreciate the concept.
It's just that they're in this enormous space battle, and the thing they're fighting are buzz droids.

It's just anticlimactic as fuck.

>>54683209
Well it's not really the climax, now is it?

>>54683290
Oi now u cheeky fuk you know what I mean.

What I mean was that I was fapping upon seeing the space battle and the buzz droid fight being there instead of a cool dogfight ruined my climax.

>>54683328
Eh, we see a lot of dogfights. Something novel can be fun too.

>>54683364

Not so many in the films with jedi interceptors though.

>>54683404
Watch TCW.

>>54683449

Sure.
But i said 'film'.

>>54683456
Well AotC, RotS and Rogue One aren't film.

>>54683598
You're not film, fucker

>>54682246
Pretty sure the dogfight at the start of 3 is still in-atmos

OK, challenge time faggots
In less than five sentences, write a cheesy romance story that fits the themes and general feeling of Star Wars

>>54685178
Lost Stars

Hard mode: Imp Officer on backwater planet, decent at heart and trying to do his best in a corrupt system.
Lays the imp smackdown on Twi'Lek/Those Hoof People/Whatever Ayy You Fap Too whore/dancer/waitress/whathaveyou, feels bad after.
Pulls her out of Sheev Palpatine Memorial Gulag.
Bonding and then they defect to join the rebellion as an espionage power couple.

>>54684981
It's above the planet, and close enough for gravity to act on the big ships, but it never looked close enough for air friction to matter to me.

>>54685178
>Gentleman Savage ends up joining the imperial navy, in past swore traditional oath that he wouldn't so much as look at any woman who wasn't a true warrior
>assigned to experimental canned Interceptor variant with Ion Cannons instead of lasers, becomes squadron leader quickly, refuses all promotion past that
>spends years in the late rebellion and warlord era facing off against the same Y-wing squadron, freak luck and ion cannon leads to nobody actually being killed in these fights
>11 ABY, both squadrons are drinking on a conspicuously neutral world
>He and his opposite counterpart, an Amazonian princess from an obscure world recognize each other by voice from years of radio taunts
>they square off, and a brawl seems impending until both pull out rings at the same moment, and the impending brawl instead becomes an impromptu stag do

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>>54685178
A bankrupt Mandalorian falls in love with an expensive rifle at his friendly local gun store and conspires to acquire it by any means necessary. His constant attempts at flattery, barter, bargaining, and haggling, however, are mistaken for courting by the woman at the counter, who confuses his behavior for an awkward but endearing attempt at courting by a lost soul who is looking for more than a miserable life of endless war. The Mandalorian, hoping to acquire a tool with which to wage glorious endless war, has no choice but to accept her offer of a dinner date. He initially attempts to gently let her down during the date, but as their conversation becomes a discussion about firearms, her enthusiasm and passion for blasters spark a strange new feeling in his cold, beskar heart.

The Waifu and the Raifu: A Star Wars Musi/k/al

>>54685769
>Gentleman Savage
but anon he died before the empire even formed

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>>54685178
Be a lonely agromech droid
None of the vaporators will talk to you
Except #3407
She lets you plug in and tells you about her day
<3

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>>54686563
>her enthusiasm and passion for blasters spark a strange new feeling in his cold, beskar heart.

This sentence fragment alone earns my undying devotion. AND MY DARKSABER.

>>54685178
Toll strok farmboy and his lifelong smoll twi'lek tomboy best friend restore granddaddy's Ghtroc 540 together and set out for the stars
> try and fly legit, but end up smuggling became of imperial fuckery
>don't so much fall for each other as recognize that they're effectively already together and are quite happy about that.
>get mislead into a slave transportation job
>aren't down for that, end up bodyslamming their would-be employers to death and defeating to the rebellion alongside a bunch of mad wooks
>end up flying a bulk freighter together and disgusting other rebels with their wholesomeness

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>>54685178
Adam Sandler plays an Imperial officer just trying to do his job.
>*jump cut noise, scene of Sandler in office scene talking to supervisor*
>"Yeaaaah, I'm gonna need you to work Life Day this year." - supervisor
>"WHAT!? Life Day?!" - Sandler
>"Glad you're fine with it! See you then." - supervisor slaps Sandler on the shoulder and walks away*
>*Sandler turns to the camera and makes a desparaging facial expression as Don't Bring Me Down by ELO starts playing*
>"I just wish life was more exciting, more fun." - Sandler as he looks at images of starfighters and star destroyers juxtaposed with him boredly clicking on an office screen.
>*This - everyone is - our - new employee. She's here - to - help your - efficiency." supervisor (dashes represent dialogue cuts)
>*Sandler turns and shows a shocked face, music has a DJ stop-scratch and the camera shows a curvacious and busty twi'lek with a skimpy uniform enter in slow motion while a saxophone plays.*
>*she walks up to Sandler* "Greetings, I am officer veras." music is silent, Sandler stutters "Daaah uhhhhhhhh" she gives him a funny look and ELO starts playing again*
>"What do I do? I have to impress her, but I'm just an office lackey!" *Sandler narrates while shots of him striking handsome poses and practicing his looks in a mirror are shown, he then sprays cologne on himself then gets some in his eyes. The music stops and he screams comedically.*
>*cut to an Imperial astromech droid beeping, jump cut sound to new scene and ELO satarts playing*
>Adam Sandler
>"I've got to - become a - TIE pilot." *scene cuts, Sandler is inside a TIE fighter* "Alright, now hit her in reverse." - instructor. *Sandler nervously flips the wrong switch then flies backwards and smashes into a wall comedically screaming. The instructor, who is an actor from Saturday Night Live, facepalms. Music skips to ELO chorus.*
>Katie Holmes
>*scenes of Sandler flying around in space during battles and looking nervous plays*

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>>54688429
>*jump to romantic-looking scene with Sandler and the twilek, played by Katie Holmes*
>"You know, I love a man in uniform." - Holmes. Sandler in a pilot uniform looks to the camera and comedically cocks an eyebrow, giving a knowing expression.*
>Love At First Flight
>*jump to Sandler talking to someone.* "Yeah I probably took out twenty rebels in that battle." *cut to scene of a dogfight with Sandler spinning around randomly and comedically screaming in panic and saying he doesn't know what he's doing.*
>*cut back to previous scene with a woosh noise, ELO stops, Sandler looks away in thought, bites his tongue, then says "Okay, maybe not." *pause* "It was more like a hundred." *ELO picks back up.*
>*cut to movie titles and information, release date*

>>54685178

>Two kids grow up together on a backwater farm world which rarely sees any contact with the republic, until one day a Jedi ship visits the world looking for sensitives.
>Both of them are found to be force sensitive and are shipped off to Coruscant: they try their best to live up to the Jedi detachment and stoicism, but eventually 'best friends' becomes something more - something they both want to admit, but cant.
>Eventually it comes to the fore, and both are to be removed from the order; they are both given the choice of how they'd like to proceed with their lives.
>Told that if they choose to leave, the other could probably stay and become a Knight, both independantly choose to go into the agricorps and go home, building their own farm and living together happily ever after.
>They keep the jedi stuff quiet through the Imperial years, and hold a quiet candlelit celebration to themselves when they feel the reverberations in the force of the Emperor's death in memory of friends lost.

They have a child, raise them as a jedi, and their kid joins Luke's school years later.

>>54671971
I proxy

If I need them for a tournament I either borrow or do without

>>54678581
Last two expansions being Waves V and VI?

Wave V intorudced an Imperial red dice broadsider and a Rebel carrier with fleet wide buffs, plus four new squads per faction. Wave VI gave Rebels a sort of mostly useless cheap ship and the Empire the best carrier in game bar none.

In addition, alongside the Wave VI release they nerfed Rieekan, TRCs, Ryhmer, flotillas, and Demolisher via an errata, which broke the established meta pretty hard.

So people are still feeling out the meta.

Right now, Avenger ISD-1 with Boarding Troopers and Raiders with External Racks is the Imperial hotness, as is a Quasar with flight controllers pushing Howlrunner and some Interceptors.

I don't think anybody knows what the Rebel meta is anymore since the previous Rebel meta is dead and Rebel's Wave VI ship wasn't a game-changer.

The game is pretty open right now, though. The old Rebel squadron build is dead and buried, so lots of fleets are viable (as always) but the list to beat is Avenger BTs, rather than Rieekan bombers.

Hey teeg, its been a while. im supposed to GM Force and Destiny but there has been a lot going on in my life lately, and Im not totally prepared. I used to know this system, and im downloading FaD at work right now. Anyone wanna crash course me real quick through the rules? Mostly about how the force works. I remember how the dice work, how to level up, destiny points. all that jazz.

>>54692504
First 30 or so pages of the book are mostly about the rules and it'll come back to you.
Otherwise, some of the old O66 podcasts are fairly useful- http://feeds2.feedburner.com/order66

What are the strongest builds in FaD?

>>54693169
depends are you trying to do a one trick pony gimmick build or a cover all bases build?

The lightsaber styles are all fairly competent, but Ataru Striker is widely considered the best DPS and Soresu Defender the bulkiest.

>>54693976
How do you build Ataru Striker and Soresu Defender? Which talents and stats?

>>54694021
Assuming a 4/3/3 build you'll want your primary stat to be Agility or Intelligence. You'll want Willpower to be a secondary stat, as it's vital to all force users. If you're going solely for combat potential, Brawn is probably your best bet, the increase to soak and WT is key. However I'd suggest picking up a stat for fluff reasons or to fill a gap in party capabilities.

Pretty much all the talents in the trees are solid. Ataru wants to rush to saber swarm and hawk-bat swoop and Soresu wants a more gradual spread. Picking your secondary spec and force powers really depends on how you want to build your character.

Hey, what books do I need if I want to play the punchiest man to ever punch in the FFG system?

>>54694378
Something with the Enhance power in, EotE core for Marauder, and No Disintegrations for the Martial Artist spec. Enjoy breaking stormtroopers with your bare hands.

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>>54694396
Additionally, is there a way to mechanically do "punching at range"

One of my PCs really wants to play this chucklehead and I want to see if there is a way to handle the extndo-arms

Either way, many thanks Anon

>>54694378
>>54694396
Warden also is a brawl class.

Surprisingly, Gadgeteer and Archaeologist both have a number of options for brawling.

>>54694337
This is pretty vague advice. Talent choices and force power choices are like the most important things about this. Also, it's better to go 4/4 than 4/3/3.

>>54694436
There isn't off the top of my head, but you can have wrist-mounted blaster pistols.

>>54694440
Can't remember whether Warden gets Feral Strength and/or Natural Brawler, which you really should look into getting hold of as a punchmaster.

>>54694378
>not wearing shock boots and being the kickiest man
>not wearing a shock boot on one foot and a rocket boot on the other

>>54694495

>not combining them into shocket boots

>>54694528
That would take some bargaining with your GM, though. You could build your lightsaber into your rocket boots a la Endless Vigil, though.

>>54694445
It's vague advice for a vague question. I asked for clarification on his build and he didn't respond. Also we don't know what experience level they're aiming for. Just a generic make the strongest. And rushing saber swarm/HB swoop is pretty par the course for all Ataru builds.

>Also, it's better to go 4/4 than 4/3/3
I've found that 4/4 is only better for one shots and short campaigns, while 4/3/3 allows you to do more over an extended campaign and possible branch out into a skill set with another spec.

>>54694573
Or use the cybernetic construction rules from Special Modifications, have your lightsaber built into a swole cyberarm. Worked for my Hutt.

>>54694700
No, the question wasn't vague in the slightest. You just don't know what you're talking about.

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>>54694729
Sure thing, friend-o

>>54669269
this is a great point, but it also depends on two other factors: what is the time period, and what fo you consider cannon.

the first matters for various reasons because shortly after yavin4 the empire starts almost exclusivley producing ISD2, which while very similar, almost 80% the same, held significant changes in a single grav well generator, long range turbo and ion batteries, and more and more advanced grav and tractor beams for both intercept and launching purposes, because TIES require them to fly, similar to how a nimitz requires the steam catapult to engage in flight ops. all of these delicate instruments are very well made and rugged, but parts will be needed probably every ~100 hours of use. the parts for isd1 dropped off almost exclusivley and had to be special ordered from kuat or rothanna or billbringgi which is why booster terrik has as much trouble as he does holding the venture together, especially after RotJ

the second applies because if you take thrawn trilogy and the corresponding duology then we learn a lot about the storage areas and capabilities of the Chimera ISD2 under command of Paelleon. when luke and mara infiltrate to save Karde they go through some of the cargo hangars. and they are huge. assuming the ISD is fresh out of shipyards or a naval re/supply station it will easily have enough food and parts for a year or more of operations, which means day2day running. if we deploy on a combat cruise, then we will have less food, but more than double the parts required to rebuild or replace up to 2/3 of the weapons on the ISD and at least half the Tractor beam projectors once over. it will also carry enough fuel and spare parts for another squadron of TIEs in compliment. so if you snatch a ready to fly early voyage ISD then you have about a year of whatever you need, or about 6months of fighting time, because combat forces through supplies.

>>54695679
these numbers change if you are on a special deployment, such as Daala's maw fleet away from resupply, or an unknown region picket. i figure if you pack the ISD2 (larger than a mk1) to the gunnells with parts/food/meds, and convert to a tector class (no ties, saves space) then why not about 5 years alone? 10 if you have a planet to supply from, even if its wild game and forraging.

>>54678062
Go read Darth Plagueis. It'll redpill you on midichlorians

>>54669709
>GEORGE LUCAS
>A VISIONARY DEPRIVED OF HIS POETRY

"In Kreia’s eyes, the greatest symbiotic parasite the galaxy has ever known isn't mynocks. It's midichlorians. Midichlorians are what keeps civilization, our galaxy, alive. Free the galaxy, not by taking men's lives but by taking away jedi."

Yo, What class would a Vaapaad or Juyo user be?

>>54695793
That's a pretty horrid book.

Going to my first store tournament tomorrow and i can't decide what list to use
I have gotten it down to either IonRexpert,CrackEdge & Cheapdraft or TractoRexpert, TLTCrackEdge & Cheapdraft

https://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v4!s!71:220,22,-1:34:17:;260:140,230,-1,-1:-1:31:;209:170,186,-1,-1:42:31:&sn=IonRexpert%20CrackEdge%20CheapDraft&obs=

https://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v4!s!71:220,144,-1:34:17:;260:140,135,-1,-1:-1:31:;209:170,186,-1,-1:42:31:&sn=TractoRexpert%20TLTCrackEdge%20CheapDraft&obs=

Since it's my first store tournament i'm just going to go there to have fun and if i rank high that will be a bonus.

>>54696373
> A book that the majority of the star wars community praises.
> Horrid

How do I become so smart, cool and contrary like you anon?

>>54696514
The majority of the Star Wars community also loves The Force Awakens and Rogue One.
minority opinion =/= wrong opinion

>>54696514
>argumentum ad populum
You can start by learning how to form a legitimate argument.

>>54696528
Hahahaha no they don't

>>54696759
>Deflection

You didn't read it did you?

>>54696947
Not him but I won't read it if a shitfuck says to get "redpilled" on a dogshit concept like midi-chlorians.
They are a terrible concept and should never have existed.

>>54697031
>I won't read it if a shitfuck says to get "redpilled" on a dogshit concept like midi-chlorians.

Are you sure YOU understand midi-chlorians? At least in canon, its not really a big deal.

>>54697031
>waaaah!

>>54696349
Maybe a Warrior->Aggressor?

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>>54696467
I think you should take the ion to fuck with the low agility bomb carriers out there, drop double edge down to like a 20 point ship and give backdraft FCS and Pattern analyzer. As is I don't see you carrying enough with him, since he'll probably end up being your endgame ship.

You could also free up the two points by dropping Rexlar down to Maarek, take the FCS that way, and then take trickshot or Score to Settle on backdraft.


I beat the new Rebel hotness yesterday with ion torpedoes. Shit was cash. Still went to time, but the control on the joust utterly fucked with the wookie ship in particular, and let me get behind it.

>>54697058
By creating an unnecessary biological component to the Force, it destroys its original mystical connotation.

>>54697185
>its original mystical connotation
>Thank the maker I, a random internet chucklefuck on a Stewjon Nerf-Shaving Holonet Channel, know more about the REAL inner workings of this universe than the guy that made it

>>54697185
>Force User -> Force
>Force User -> Midi Chlorian -> Force
Woah dude, slow down! The mysticism is ruined! How dare Lucas include a way to Jedi to find out if the babies they were stealing actually had force potential?

>>54697185
There was already a biological component to the Force.

Just because George gave an additional one doesn't mean it's any less mystical. It's still the same "energy field created by living things, surrounding and binding the galaxy together."

>>54697185
I disagree. That was my gut reaction too, but if you just think about them as little beings that are attracted to the force, and help facilitate the conversion between the cosmic force to the living force.

Granted, i think this all could have gone unexplained, but its as good as any.

And The force has always had a biological component. Luke was strong in the force because his father was a jedi knight. thats from the very start. Its cool to not like midi-chlorians, but your reaction is like it offends you in a personal way.

>>54697268
>14:58:44
>>54697269
>14:58:45

Damn, prequel defense force in sync today.

>>54697304
>say dumb thing
>people tell you what you said was dumb
>posts are to close to cry samefag
>decide to cry about something else
Hmm...

>>54697333
too*
;^)

>>54697031
Suit yourself, friendo

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>>54697347
Sometimes I a letter or a word, just like anyone else.

>>54697392
>Sometimes I a letter or a word, just like anyone else.

N-N-NANI? I already started to shitpost about how he forgot the word forgot... I almost fell into his trap.

Canon question (a Legends is fine too)
What does the galaxy know about Alderaan and the Battle of Yavin? What's the Empire's "official" story, and how much of the truth is the Alliance able to spread?

I'd prefer something that isn't headcanon, if an answer exists

>>54696528
>>54696759
This is a shitty argument when you're talking about something subjective, like art. Though there are certain objective qualities you can argue (mostly cinematography) at the end of the day it boils down to what people "like" or "don't like" and there's no objective, factual ground to stand on other than a majority/minority opinion.

>>54694470
They don't get either.
>>54694378
You want EoTE core for Marauder and Gadgeteer, as Deadly Accuracy and Armor Master is pretty fantastic, No Disintegrations for Martial Artist, and some shit with Enhance.

>>54697551
The Empire tries to spin it as a mining accident, with the Death Star's "official" name being the "DS-1 Orbital Mining Station."

The Rebellion was able to get the truth out and enough people believed it that their numbers started swelling before the Empire started cracking back down on them.

That crackdown is supposedly going to be a major part of the next author's run on Marvel's main Star Wars comic, starting at issue 38 I think.

Also look into Repulsor Fists for falcon punches

>>54697659
>you can't have objectivity when it comes to art because art is subjective unless it's the art of making motion pictures
Wow, you really convinced me!

My combat-heavy players are doing bodyguard duty in a situation where the main threats are low-key spies and assassins. The problem is that even if they took off their armor, their soak is so high that pistols do nothing. What's a good way around this? Just stack up on Pierce?

>>54697752
The fuck? That's not what I said at all. I said certain elements can be objective (if, say, the dialogue is desynchronized) but barring that, it's all a matter of personal preference.

Go be a gay homo somewhere else.

Hi guys, you've helped me with advice before, I need some more advice now...

One of my players is a Jedi, who has a lost sister who now works for the Empire alongside an Inquisitor. The player wants to, eventually, turn her sister from the Empire - and her sister is Force sensitive.

I'm wondering how I should handle it when the player (inevitably) helps her sister realize she's working for the wrong side and that the Jedi weren't traitors. What would her sister even do at that point? Her sister is providing for their family, so she couldn't become a Rebel - not enough pay there. Become a scoundrel of some kind, I guess? She'll also need a way to help her family escape the clutches of the Empire, too...

Any ideas of what an ex-Imperial Force Sensitive could do after they turn away from the Empire, and betray the Inquisitorious?

>>54666944
Where is the treble bass?

>>54697810
>herkily jerkily is okay because I like it and it's art so you can't tell me I'm not allowed to like it

>>54697830
>her sister is Force sensitive... who now works for the Empire alongside an Inquisitor
Senpai, what? The odds that the inquisitor doesn't know the sister is force sensitive are minuscule.

>Her sister is providing for their family, so she couldn't become a Rebel
Best chance is to be a double agent, I guess. Become an inquisitor herself and try to funnel force sensitive children toward the rebels for safekeeping.

>>54697900
Nice straw man. I haven't read any Wendig and don't feel the need to argue about it.

>>54697952
The Inquisitor knows she's Force sensitive - it's the sister who doesn't realize it. As a part of an earlier iteration of Project Harvester, the Inquisitor was detecting for Force sensitivity among Imperial recruits. The player's sister was desperately trying to get into the Academy at the time (as a female Mirialan she was facing resistance and specism), and the Inquisitor detected her Force sensivity, pulled some strings, and got her into the Imperial program.

It's a test to see whether they can create loyal and useful Inquisitors that aren't broken Jedi or Padawans, as most of the other Inquisitors (canonically) are. They're trying to groom her as an Inquisitor much like they made loyal Stormtroopers and the like.

Luckily, the sister hates Jedi, blaming them for the kidnapping and 'death' of her sister. Still figuring out how Imperial propaganda explained away the younglings and padawans, but I figured they'd say 'suicide pact' or 'they were forced into fighting and refused to do anything but die for the Jedi Order'.

>>54697952
>>54698023

Oh, and the idea of her becoming a double-agent Inquisitor is badass. I think that might very well be what I'll do with her! Thank you so much for the suggestion.

>>54669269

This is fair true, but I think you're forgetting a relatively important point with regards to your aircraft carrier analog.

You're entirely spot on with it, but you'e losing out the context around it.

For it to accurately represent trying to run an ISD, rogue, in the star wars universe you'd need to also factor in the 'war' part of it.
US Navy carriers are relatively rare.
ISDs are not.

ISDs have been in constant warfare with the rebellion, pirates, any others for years - a lot have been destroyed, and their remains picked apart.
Parts wont be quite so scarce as in your example - the US is the only place that makes them, and there arent any ruined hulks of carriers lying around.
Add to that, an aircraft carrier is hulled and sinks.
If its in deep ocean, good fucking luck pulling salvage off it to repair yourself, its gone.
If its in shallow water - great! You can start pulling salvage!
I hope the parts you wanted werent internals that could be damaged by water, because you're fucked if so.

Space obviously has vacuum, but most things in Star Wars seem to be hardened against it.
Chances of an ISD being in deep space between systems and thus unrecoverable are minimal - why would they be there, if there's nothing to fight over?

I mean shit, the opening of TFA has Rey pulling salvage off a downed ISD and parts seem to be in decent repair, and that's an ISD that's crashed into a goddamn planet.
Even if you dont like TFA very much, TCW also has a Venator (mostly) surviving impact with a planet from orbit.

And in fact, that's another point - tech doesnt move on much in Star Wars.
Where an aircraft carrier from 50 years ago would be missing 90% of the interesting parts of an aicraft carrier from today, a Venator wreck from the clone wars would have much the same stuff as an ISD would need. Same for other large ships - it might take some work to get it fitting, but you could probably take parts from other large ship wrecks and repourpose then.

>>54696528
I don't like TFA either but I thought Rogue One was pretty great. Not to mention it was a pretty ballsy move to make a Disney film like that, which is something I don't think gets enough recognition.

>>54697551
Rebel Alliance literally spreads REMEMBER THE SIX GORILLION-tier posters according to the propaganda book

Not really Star Wars related but definitely /swg/ related anybody got that picture with all the black lagoon girls, where they might be threatening to shoot/stab/murder the 1st person perspective's dick? I need it to prove a point

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>>54694573
Lightsabres into your fist!

New thread?

>>54678067
>social justice
Your kidding right? Star Wars was always about social justice. Do you think a Princess who saves the men who are trying to save her wasn't revolutionary in 1977 hollywood? ...and fuck man rebels on a jungle moon taking on the most powerfull military in the galaxy doesn't say protest against the vetnam war to you.

>>54697797

Have the low-key spies or assassins engage them with poison, either applied to their food or via gas.

Alternatively, they hire some thugs to attack the place, to distract the players, allowing them to go about their business.

>>54706758
Lad, until recently 99% of powerful women were sex fantasies. Leia is no different than wonder woman.

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>>54704237
>Lightsaber fist
YOU CAN BE CRUELER THAN THAT, JACK

>>54708309
Not him, but at the time that was revolutionary. Sexuality in general used to be taboo, but female sexuality even moreso. Portraying women as both sexy AND in control was socially progressive.

Granted Star Wars was far from being at the forefront of the sexual revolution, but those were still the values it presented.

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>one of these ships is large base

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>>54708513
Fine, gunna call a guy and make a lightsabre so fucking big it can stab a planet!

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>>54708664
We need to go deeper. Let's take Ilum and turn the entire planet into a giant lightsaber.

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>>54708726
>When you make a solar panel so fuckhuge it soaks up the whole sun

>>54708664

Of all the things for Rogue 1 to reference, it had to be this didn't it?

>>54708602

Yeah, it's annoying.
U-wing dies so goddamn easily because of it, its so easy to get in arc.