>DM: After a good night's rest and a quick breakfast,

>>54543512
>player playing wizard is stupid enough not to have prepared his prepared lists.
You're playing with the wrong people, I see.

>>54543512
>Playing a caster
>Not having your shit together
These two elements should not be combined.

>>54543512
>I can't be bothered to prepare my prepared spell list
Well, I guess you can't be bothered to play a prepared faster. Roll a new character.

>>54543512
>You're traveling along the road when suddenly three wizards leap out from the bushes, out for blood

Do DMs actually think this makes any sense at all? Three wizards were hiding in a bush, because somehow despite being wizards they have absolutely no better way to hide, somehow no-one in the party noticed them huddled in the bushes wearing motherfucking wizard robes, and then jumped out to try and kill the party for no reason?

What's next, there's a Fighter in full platemail lying in the middle of the road, but we don't see him until he gets up and attacks us? An enemy Paladin attached branches to his armour and everyone believes he's a tree?

>>54543740
>Do DMs actually think this makes any sense at all? Three wizards were hiding in a bush, because somehow despite being wizards they have absolutely no better way to hide, somehow no-one in the party noticed them huddled in the bushes wearing motherfucking wizard robes, and then jumped out to try and kill the party for no reason?
That sounds like a comedy fantasy all right.

>>54543512
Anyone who can't do proper bookkeeping shouldn't be a wizard.

>>54543740
>>54544184
>Nobody expects the "Spanish Teleportation!"

>>54543740
> Do DMs actually think this makes any sense at all? Three wizards were hiding in a bush, because somehow despite being wizards they have absolutely no better way to hide, somehow no-one in the party noticed them huddled in the bushes wearing motherfucking wizard robes, and then jumped out to try and kill the party for no reason?

"Academic grants are a very cutthroat business. You may die, but the advances in the field of Polymorphic Hydra Botany will be your legacy!"

"Well, more our legacy. Harry's the one that came up with the-"

"Of course our legacy. We won't exactly be publishing this part now will we? I was trying to make them feel better about their involuntary contribution to our- did that man just fire an ARROW at us?"

"Of all the nerve!"

"If we hadn't cast Mage Armor ahead of time, that could have killed one of us!"

And then there is an awkward pause, followed by the Wizard in the back hastily casting Mage Armor.

>>54543740
That's right along the lines of an old DM of mine:
>we walk cautiously into the dragon's lair
>DM:You see nothing and then suddenly the party takes (rolls dice and doesn't look at them) 90HP damage, 2x that if you are vulnerable to cold
>so we don't get to save? We're fine enough with you not giving us a chance to spot an ambush by a dragon, we're fine if you want half the party to go down before the fight starts, but can we at least roll the saving throw on our sheet to at least pretend we have a chance?
>DM: ...that's fine I guess; but is a high Reflex save so good luck!
>Nat 20 for myself and two others
>2 Shot the dragon with Maximized Scorching ray and Maximized Fireball.

Apparently the adult white dragon was hiding just above the lip of the cave upside down on the ceiling (which at that point was barely large enough for my 7' tall half orc to walk through) and walked along the ceiling without being heard.

Seriously, if you want to flub an encounter, at least make it somewhat believable. One would think that the perception rolls we rolled would have given us a clue that there was a dragon tickling my head!

If it takes you more than a minute to decide what to do on your turn, the GM should rule that your character just stands there like an idiot and move on to the next person.

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>>54543740
>but we don't see him until he gets up and attacks us?
Yes.

>>54545004
"You think you can be the Player Characters because some nutter tossed ya a sack of gold to whack a bunch of goblins?"

I would also pay to see a /tg/ Monty Python movie.

>>54544184
Based on an actual published module btw

>>54546390

That humor is more Pratchett than Python, FYI.

>>54543512
>>Wizard: Wait, gimme a sec. Did I use this spell earlier today or not?
I think a simple deck would be an effective and fun method of keeping track of your spells. You write down the level, metamagic and name of a spell in each card. The deck is then submitted for dm approval and left on the table. Upon casting a spell, you give the corresponding card to the dm.

>what if you want to make a different spell selection
You make another deck, or at least the different cards you don't currently have. You can swap decks/cards every extended rest period, dm approval pending.

>but what if cheating
The dm can always keep track of spells used if he suspects cheating. Alternatively, the dm could keep the deck by him. The player can request to look up his spell list if his character is not under stress(combat, in the middle of rickety bridge that could fall down any minute, while being pursued by trolls) under the dm's supervision.

>>54547353
Sounds needlessly complicated and a whole new layer of work for a DM. I like it!
Also
>Fuck, I forgot bring my spell deck.

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>>54543512
>needing to remember what spells you prepared when you can just master the best one

>>54543740
>there's a Fighter in full platemail lying in the middle of the road, but we don't see him until he gets up and attacks us?
Sounds like he's beating the shit out of your perception.

Only retards can't handle preparing spells. I'm playing a wizard and I just keep a spellbook, easy.

>>54546738
Pratchett is not that meta.

>>54547482
If you're a GM and suspect players flubbing numbers that's always lots of extra work for you.
Specifically wizard can do it whether with the card deck idea or not. Hell the deck is even harder to cheat with than any other methods.

>>54543740
I see you've been outwitted by wizards. see, you'd LOOK for them behind dome kind of illusory wall or magic spell. The bushes were exactly the LAST place you'd go looking for bloodthirsty wizards.

>>54543512
>>54547353
>>54547482

I know this is gonna be an obligatory "have you tried not playing DND response", but yeah OP I don't like it either for various reasons. It does feel like the characters are just pulling out their preprepared "spell deck". Which may of been what they actually were intended.

I don't know I don't know if I'll chat with make the gameplay any better It just wouldn't come across as artificial.

Sorcerers for a step in a more interesting direction. But they half assed that.

>>54543512
Put a dot, circle, or check box next to the spell if you prepped it. Mark the check box or dot (with a check mark, X, dash, etc) upon casting to indicate that it has been cast. If you prepped it multiple times, use multiple dots or check boxes.

Also dnd-style vancian was a mistake. Even 5th edition dnd is starting to slowly distance itself from the old paradigm. Which is sad because video games overwhelmingly dumped it in favor of much better ideas like mana, cast time, unlimited-use reasonable effects, and cooldowns decades ago.

>>54543512
>You must have a 'standard spell list'
>If you forget to tell your GM about any changes, you must use that spell list
>No longer any problems, everyone is happy

>>54543512
Stop playing with retards, or stop being retarded yourself.

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My group got access to a laser cutter. We made custom poker chips for different spell levels.

Cast a spell, toss a chip to the DM. Take a rest, DM deals them back out. It's a fun way to keep track of resources. As the DM, especially, I like being able to tell at a glance how much I've ground down the PCs' abilities. Really helps me figure out how much I'm challenging them.

>>54543512
No a player who can't keep track of shit and wants to be a prepared caster is a mistake.

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>>54543570
>prepared faster

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>>54543570
>Prepared faster

>>54543740
>What's next, there's a Fighter in full platemail lying in the middle of the road, but we don't see him until he gets up and attacks us?
Made me think of that scene in The Stand where one of the protagonists was walking through a town full of corpses and got freaked out when one of them sits up, because it turned out to be a retarded guy who just got drunk and passed out in the middle of the street.

>>54543512
> Not having pre-prepared spell lists
> Not keeping track
> Not taking notes and using meticulous record-keeping
> Not having a list of per-day buffs cast just after waking

That is someone who should not be playing a wizard.

>>54543512
>>DM: After a good night's rest and a quick breakfast, you continue on your trip tow-
>>Fighter: Ok.

>>DM: You're traveling along the road when suddenly three wizards leap out from the bushes, out for blood! You can only fight or flee!
>>Fighter: I flee and take detour.

>>DM: You finally arrive in the dungeon, where a group of orcs surprises you! It seems you were expected, roll initiative!
>>Fighter: I roll initiative. I roll full attack.
>I roll initiative. I roll full attack.
>I roll initiative. I roll full attack.
>I roll initiative. I roll full attack.
>I roll initiative. I roll full attack.
>I roll initiative. I roll full attack.

>>54553614
>>54553728
There's nothing wrong with fasting every once in a while, it's healthy even.

>>54555978
I don't get it.

>>54543740
I think that was a subvert reference to the Spoony story where he TPKd a high level party with that same group that he was forced to run.

>>54556016
It's a D&D thing.

>>54547353
Just run the MP Variant. If they can't track their MP, that means they probably can't/aren't tracking their HP and should be kicked, not for bad personality, just for being too stupid to play a game.

>>54548910
>Make extra card.
>Flip through deck to see what spells you have left
>Palm card into deck
Wow. Hard.

>>54543512
What, would you rather the wizard have access to all of his spells at once? Want to fucking break D&D even more than it already is?
I bet you don't even make wizards keep track of spell components

>>54556272
sorcerers used to work but they dont no more, component pouch handles anything not GP'd. Even then, every other item is a spell focus. What is even the point anymore?

>>54555978
Fuck off with this nonsense bait.

You don't roll initiative every round.

>>54556443
I think the joke is that a lot of newbies are fighters and that this player was a newbie.
Or maybe it was just a poorly made joke and I was just seeing things that weren't intended in the original.

>>54556443
>You don't roll initiative every round.
Nice virgin walk ya got there

A true alpha chad would know that initiative is re-rolled every round on a D6 and only after actions are declared.

>>54556541
The joke was that fighters get to do even less shit than what was stated in the example.

>>54556757
This mainigga knows whats up.

>tfw sometimes I feel like I'm the only person who really really loves 2e's prepared casting

You have space on your character sheet for that very reason.
>b-but keeping lists of shit is hard
>I don't know how to strikethrough or make checkmarks

>>54557304
>erasing or striking spells and rewriting them whenever you use them
Confirmed for never actually using paper in pen and paper games.

>>54556021
>>54543740
Yeeep. The leaping wizards story. He DMed a game of official D&D and the encounter was 3 leaping wizards with quarterstaves and a single magic missile each. It was a fucking cakewalk for everything ever so Spoony had them all have sleep if I recall.

>>54557414
One had sleep, at least. Can't remember if the other wizards had different spells, but the sleep spell just happened to get lucky and hit them all. I think maybe another one had hold person? But that might be level 2...

>>54557472
I think their rogue or fighter got charmed or something.

>>54543740
>What are Hedge Wizards

>>54556021
Is that some namefag? Sounds like a moron.

>>54557583
Newfag? I'll find the video for you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9G5PjlCMlGw

>>54556021

Not TPKd, but the players whose character died were furious. They complained to the community manager and he got kicked for killing their characters. Apparently, they ran very danger-free adventures where characters never die for people who don't play much anyway. Spoony being a oldschool guy...

>>54557646
it was basically a pay-subscription game system, you don't keep customers by murderizing them at tiny random encounters.

>>54557548
>tfw after a near party wipe the GM forces you on a bullshit sidequest for Shrubbery.

>>54557629
Oh, it's some dumb youtube grognard.

>>54544184
How awesome would it be if there was an anime about this? What would the first episode be about? Who would animate it? With a premise like that, could it possibly be even better than Kinosuba?

>>54557876
Pretty much, but if you wanna have more interesting discussion, you should watch an episode or two. It comes up every now and then.

>>54557972
I really don't think I can take 30 minutes of this shit. I grew out of my grognard phase a long time ago.

>>54557980
I don't see what you being a grognard or not has to do with it, but if it really bothers you, you can think of it as a story of caution.

>>54557980
>>54558108
pre-meltdown spoony was good shit, counter monkey is like 100% goodness

>>54545004

I don't know why I laughed so hard at this.

>>54557349
did you miss the part where he said checkmarks?
put one next to the spells you're preparing, erase the checkmark when it's cast
if you have a multiple casts of a spell prepared put a mark for each cast

>>54547654
YOU'LL NEVER SEE IT COMING~

>>54558373
This isn't /v/, anon. Take that shit elsewhere.

YOU'LL SEE! THAT MY MIND IS, TOO FAST FOR EYES~

>>54558197
I don't know why 3.5e people pretend like post-D&Dnext meltdown was rare, tons of people hated the direction 5e took and basically quit the hobby.

>>54556114
That's what I liked most about 3.5s psionics. You had a pool of pp per day and used them in any combination to cast your shit. And you had to pay to scale powers, unlike wizards who got free bonuses to spells just for being a higher level.

>>54558665
>You had a pool of pp per day and used them in any combination to cast your shit. And you had to pay to scale powers
This is also why they were broken as fuck, they only attracted two kinds of players: the novaer and the guy who calculated the most efficient damage-to-cc.

This is a problem with all scaling mana based systems though.

>>54558658
well spoony's meltdown was unrelated to any content, just chronic patreon sickness

>>54543512
Someone needs some index cards

>>54558705
Nah, you could only expend pp up to your manifester level. So a level 15 psion can spend a maximum of 15 points on any one power. There were some feats to bump that up a bit, but you couldn't blow 60pp to do 60d6 damage or anything

>>54558786
>you could only expend pp up to your manifester level
That depends which Psionic system you used, 3.5 had two, one of them didn't have this rule and was broken as fuck.

>>54543567
>>Playing a caster
>>Not having your shit together
>These two elements should not be combined.
/thread

>>54558840
Ah fair enough then. I just remember using the book with all the brains on it. Expanded Psionics, I think?

>>54558770

Everyone. Everyone needs index cards.

>>54558926
No, 3.5 only had the one psionic system, the guy doesn't know what he's talking about. The Wilder class had a limited ability to boost powers by a specific, small amount beyond the norm, for a price, and there was a feat called Overchannel that did the same, but these had downsides and were very limited. At level 7 the most you could boost was +3, and by 15 you'd get +5 levels. In this single class, which had only 11 powers TOTAL that you gained throughout your career, so you were greatly limited in a way the more flexible psion class wasn't. Basically, it ended up being a better version of sorcerer, where you sacrifice a huge amount of versatility for a modest increase in power.